Note: If you wouldn't say it to someone's face, don't say it here. Comments deleted on a whim.
You've really stepped it up a notch so far this week, Aaron.
Continuous improvement is the mark of a true student of any craft.
Nice find on that May 18, 1969 3rd inning. I'd give good money to see the look on Lolich's face after he had home stolen off of him for the second time in the same inning, and even more money to see the whole inning on video.
I checked out Williams' "forum" on the Twins at the PiPress website the other day. It was the first time I checked it in months and it is still absolutely horrible. He answers half the questions with "see the print edition" and the other half with nothing-we-didn't-know sentences. And he doesn't even answer many questions. And then there was the whole NO IDEA debacle.
It was better the last two years when Wittenmyer handled it. He answered a lot of questions and usually told you something that you might not be able to get elsewhere. I like Wittenmyer, although I get the feeling many of youse don't.
Williams? Geez, you have no idea how much your forum sucks. NO IDEA.
After reading today's effort, I can only conclude that Cristian Guzman was clutch.
I was at a game in Anaheim when Dan Gladden stole home for the Twins. I'm trying to remember if that was the same series when Joe Niekro was tossed for doctoring the baseball (which I was also at). Not only does a steal of home catch the pitcher napping, but most fans as well.
I love it.
The best OPS in history against any one pitcher is Jim Thome vs. Rick Reed. 1.981. 9 homers in 27 at bats.
And Kyle Lohse has the third worst performance ever against a batter!
Anybody notice that Mike Smith resurfaced as the Vikings 4th string QB? I do think that the name JT O'Sullivan has a little more flash to it also.
I went to the Cubs/Rockies game last saturday and it was embarassing watching jacque bumbling around in the corner only to make off-target throws.
As both a Cubs fan and a regular reader of aarongleeman.com, I was well aware of Jones inability to hit lefthanders before he came to Chicago. I didn't really know about his terrible arm, though. I recalled reading you mention it a few times, but I just thought he'd throw like a younger Sosa. Strong, but often with no idea where it's going. Not so, he's far far worse than Sammy ever was.
I hated the Jones signing at the time and I really thought the Cubs should have traded him a few weeks ago when his value was at its highest. Unfortunately, Jim Hendry probably thinks he's doing a great job and I'll be complaining about him for the next two years. At least Dusty has finally realized his inability to hit lefthanders, as he hasn't faced them as much lately.
Also, the most interesting steal of home I ever saw was again with the Cubs. Rick Sutcliffe, one of the last guys you would guess, was getting absolutely zero attention from a southpaw starter and swiped home as a part of a double steal on July 29, 1988. I remember later in that season his teammates gave him a jacket to mark the occasion.
Not a bad lineup that the Twins fielded in may 1969 - speed at the top, power in the middle, guys who could swing the bat towards the bottom - my only question is: what the devil was Martin doing by using charlie manuel as a defensive replacement for oliva in rf?
Wow! Not one, but two George Mitterwald references in the same post about two seperate subjects. I'm not sure what to think.
I can only conclude that Cristian Guzman was clutch.
And that Torii Hunter isn't. (4 walkoff RBI in 3,335 AB's.)
As probably one of the most ancient of your regular readers, I can say that I do remember that summer of 1969 and all the fun Carew's penchant for stealing home was. Most of the time, it would be off a pitcher that would go back to the full wind-up with a man on 3rd instead of stretching; which just makes Tovar's steal of home all the more impressive because with Carew on first and 2nd base open, Lolich would have been pitching from the stretch. Of course, this was all before anyone knew what a slide-step was.
I don't know if it was this particular steal of home, but I also recall reading at the time that one of Carew's efforts with Killebrew at the plate came without Harmon knowing carew was going to do it. Not sure if that says more about Carew's gall or his IQ, but the thought of flying down the third base line with the possibility of being met by a Killerbrew home-run cut scares the hell out of me even now, 37 years later.
my only question is: what the devil was Martin doing by using charlie manuel as a defensive replacement for oliva in rf?
Keep in mind that by this time in his career, Oliva could barely walk at times, nevermind run. So he wasn't covering a whole lot of ground in the outfield. I can still see in my mind today the way his knees sort of pointed inward toward one another when he took a batting stance. Don't get me wrong, I loved Killebrew as a kid, but I never saw a better ballplayer in the 1960s than Tony Oliva when he was healthy... and I saw a lot of ballplayers at the Met in those days.
Another reader admitting his age here - I was actually at that game in 69, which I remember clearly only because of that bizarre inning. Once the first steal happened, everyone was looking for it, which made it all the more enjoyable. When Carew led off 3rd, Lolich refused to go to the stretch. When he went, the pitch was fired into the dirt and Carew scored easily. Simply amazing.
Noticed the Wittenmyer comment and decided to look it up. It turns out that technically, Wittenmyer's right: the 1927 Yankees were shut out once. Once. In 154 games. In September. By Lefty Grove.
Retrosheet is a wonderful thing.
One more comment on Tovar's and Carew's steals of home that day. Consider this: Both stole home with nobody out and Killebrew at the plate. Imagine how sure you would have to be that you would be successful in order to justify taking that chance with Killebrew and Oliva coming up behind you with nobody out. now imagine facing Billy Martin in the dugout if you AREN'T successful and now he's got Killebrew and Oliva coming up without RBI opportunities because you got thrown out trying to steal home.
Sounds like you and i are at least in the ballpark of being the same age, jimcrikket, as those two years (69-70) were the most fun and impressionable for me - however, my (apparently flawed) memory was that Tony O was not yet ginger-kneed. Too bad the Orioles were the incredible machine that they were - i fully believe those twins would have hammered both the mets and the reds.
Perhaps it was the same game that is being discussed, but Rod Carew stole home once with Harmon at the plate when Harmon followed with a hit that would have scored Carew were it not for the steal. Carew vowed to get Harmon his RBI back and later the same game or a game or two later, scored from first on a Killebrew single. I suppose that may not be as hard as it might first appear as I am sure that the outfield was playing deep on Killebrew and Killer wasn't the fastest guy by the late 60s, so it may have been double territory for someone with better speed. But, still, Carew made up for taking away an RBI with getting him one when he normally wouldn't have gotten one. I also believe that it was 1969, Killebrew got his one stolen base on the season at the back end of a Tovar, Carew, Killebrew triple steal, with Tovar crossing the plate. I heard that one on the radio while listening to the game while in North Dakota. Those were some fun days. Tovar and Carew made for some exciting ball and Killebrew and the supporting cast could crush it. A game was never over with those guys.
I'm not sure, but i think Killebrew had something like 7 or 8 stolen bases in 69 - probably all on the back side of double (or triple) steals, i would guess.
"It's interesting that Jacque Jones' problems making consistent throws from the outfield and inability to hit left-handers have suddenly become noteworthy issues, because they were rarely mentioned while he was in Minnesota."
While I agree JJ's lack of arm was rarely mentioned in the media, his lack of prowess against lefties was discussed quite a bit in the papers and radio. There should have been no surprises by the Cubs or any astute fan.
m.m., you are quite right and I stand corrected. It wasn't until 71 or 72 that Oliva went lame and was never the same afterward.
Baseball in the '60s sounds really, really crazy.
Ah, yes, Roscoe, those were the days. Hard to imagine Gardy giving Punto the opportunity to play an inning at all 9 positions in a game the way Tovar did in a game back in 68(?).
ESPN insider and fox sports net did an interesting article about relievers.
http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/sto.../sto...b/story/
5864310
http://insider.espn.go.com/mlb/i..._rob&
id=2549273
People in Minnesota forget how lucky we've been having quality relievers last 15 years. Also who would have imagined the Pierzynski trade would net use one the best closers last 2 years and this year. Even if we didn't get Bonser or Liriano Pierzynski for Nathan is a steal.
Side note its interesting to hear on all the Chicago sports radio stations how stupid they feel thinking they were right for picking Prior and thinking how dumb the Twins were for picking Mauer instead.
How many times now has it been we've unintentionaly screw the Cubs over?
I don't know if picking Prior was the Cubs' mistake. I think it was hiring Dusty to run him into the ground.
Baseball in the 60's and early 70's was something else - Sudden Sam McDowell wd, on occasion, be lifted from pitching, go to 2nd base, play an inning or two there, then go back to the mound ... Charlie Finley sending Reggie Vision back to the minors a year after he hit 47 homers...the Orioles having 4 20 game winners in '70...Kaat pinch hitting on a regular basis...the only guy in the majors with a hair dresser and a blow dryer was Joe Pepitone ... yeah, it was different
If I remember right, Rod would have had his 8th steal of home (and the record outright, instead of tie with Ty) if he hadn't gotten robbed on a call at the plate late in the season. And he had one of the best drag bunts in all of baseball.
Prior over Mauer.. Mauer is the one for the franchise but Prior might have been the pick to win the 2003 World Series. What do you want? Mauer definitely turned out to be the better pick but Prior might have brought a ring, being in company of Santana and Radke in 2003. The Twins always seem to be looking forward to the future and they better do so but in the end it's about winning.
Who was the better bunter - carew or wilfong? While wilfong was probably better technically, i'll take carew.
If we had Prior in 2003 who would have been our closer in 2004 to now?
Ah, yes, Roscoe, those were the days. Hard to imagine Gardy giving Punto the opportunity to play an inning at all 9 positions in a game the way Tovar did in a game back in 68(?).
Yeah, it was September 22, 1968. Here's the retrosheet box score and play-by-play. Tovar started the game pitching and struck out Reggie Jackson, walked one, and allowed no hits for a scoreless inning. Then went on to play each other position for one inning in the order 2-3-4-6-5-7-8-9. Tovar also led off and went 1-3 with a walk. The Twins won that game 2-1.
That's a pretty neat little trick to pull when you can win the game doing it.
Wilfong! Well, he was certainly an accomplished bunter. I think I'd take Carew too, though, as any bunt he laid down had a fighting chance of being beat out. I seem to remember that he took grief from the umps one year when they decided to punish him for leaving the box early on his drag bunts.
Aaron, this is the most enjoyable session from both you and the writers I have seen so far! Keep up the great work..all you posters!
I grew up within sight of the old Met. Used to pedal over there of a Sunday, crawl under the fence, pick up the loose change under the bleachers, hit the concession stand, and then watch a double header. King for a day! Those of you who never watched one of the Killer's towering HRs or Carew running the bases or Tony-O bouncing a liner off the fence missed (unfortunately) alot of damn fine ball.
Comparing the old with the new, does anyone else see a resemblence in the slender, small-framed, buggy-whipped motion, fire-balling left handed pitchers liriano and tommy hall (twins circa 69-70)?
The thing that seems crazy about the amount of home steals is that stolen base totals were lower than they are now. The percentage of steals that were home must have been pretty high.
does any one know if there happens to be any footage, online or elsewhere of carew or anyone for that matter stealing home. I have been fascinated with that idea since I was a kid, but never actually saw it.
chad
Hey chad check this out.
It's not carew instead its carl crawford stealing home.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j...h?
v=jxw4BwVXa3o
thanks, that is awesome. I wonder if there is any old time footage out there..
Jim Lemon hit 38 in '59, and 33 in'58. He used to crush Whitey ford, once hitting 3 in a game Ford started. I think at least 2 were off Whitey. Anyway, Eddie Lopat did a pre game show for the Yankees, and had Lemon as his guest one night. He asked Jim about his success against Ford, and[unbelievably] Jim told him that Ford would stick his tongue out prior to throwing a breaking pitch. Lemon never got another hit off him. What gets me is that, apparently no one else noticed the tongue thing, and that Lemon would so casually give away his secret. Lemon, Allison, Killebrew, and the aging Sievers were quite a group of sluggers on a very bad team.
I did not intend the annonimity.al
Well one more time, this link has the link to the 1955 world series where jackie robinson steals home.
http://www.psslbaseball.com/
mult...multimedia.html
How does one classify breaking up a no-hitter as a stat? What inning must you be in?
How does one classify breaking up a no-hitter as a stat? What inning must you be in?
I think the way that Tovar leads is that he's the only guy in baseball history to record the only hit in a game five different times.
From MLB.com:
Liriano update: Some confusion between the Twins coaching staff and the trainers had led to a few reports that Francisco Liriano might be playing catch Tuesday.
That was not the case, as Liriano will not be able to do any sort of throwing until he undergoes a medical evaluation this weekend to test the strength of his shoulder and see if the pain has diminished.
Looks like LEN3 got his info from the coaches and Wittenmeyer got his from the trainers. So they were both just reporting what Twins sources were telling them. It was evidently an internal Twins mixup.
I think the way that Tovar leads is that he's the only guy in baseball history to record the only hit in a game five different times.
I see. It'd be interesting to see how many people have gotten the first hit off of a pitcher in the 7th inning or later. There are countless times a pitcher's got a no-no going late into the game and then the wheels fall off once someone gets the ball rolling.
Hi Aaron,
Almost 73 pounds lost! 'Grats with that!
Aaron--
Is everything okay? It's just not like you to not have something posted on a Wednesday morning. You certainly don't owe us anything--I'm just concerned. Hope everything is all right. Best wishes.
Blog union strike or something
What are the Gleemanites to do?
Hey Aaron, thanks for the link to the Excruciating Baseball Lists. There is some really interesting stuff included. I thought the Twins pitchers had an awful April this season, but I had forgotten just how truly dreadful the Twins pitchers were in April of 1993 and 1994. From April 23 to April 26, 1993, the Twins lost consecutive games by scores of 12-4, 17-1, 16-5 (all to the Tigers!) and 10-3 (to the Brewers). In April of 1994, the Twins lost 14-0 and 15-5 to the A's on the 9th and 10th, and followed that up by losing to the Brewers on the 28th 12-2 and to Toronto the next day 12-7 - ouch! Not to be outdone, from April 7-11, 1999, the Twins staff had five consecutive games where they gave up at least nine runs -- surprisingly, they actually won one of those (against Toronto, 11-9 on the 8th). So, as bad as the Minnesota hurlers were this April, thanks for the reminder that it can be (and actually has been) a lot worse...primarily in the Jim DeShaies years.
Gleeman search party stars in 5 hours, everyone pack your backs and get ready for the hike to Minnesota.
Ill be swimming, im in the Caribbean...
Hey D.A.
I heard Luis Rivas was in town...maybe we should start with him first...
Was Gleeman in the car with Koren????
It's possible that Aaron is simply mourning the death of Bruno Kirby.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20060...e_nm/
kirby_dc_1
These things always come in threes, so who's the third Kirby who'll pass on in 2006?
There's a third Kirby?
I'm sure someone's pet dog will die this year.
Video game Kirby. His days are numbered.
I'm worried about Aaron. Anyone know whats up?
I found Aaron! Over-worked and over- tired but he assured me he'd be back with a Blog entry tomorrow. GO TWINS! Silva you can do it!
Well, he deserves a day off.
Mentioning Double J's ground pounding throws to the infield helps me appreciate how nice it is having Cuddyer in right. I didn't look at how many assists he has out there, but it seems like he's doing pretty good. Tuesday night he gunned another over eager (and misinformed?) runner at second, to go with the handful of close calls this season. The league is going to have to start to realize that a shot to the right field corner in the dome isn't an automatic double.
And they shouldn't even entertain the option of moving cuddy out the 4-hole.
let's hope francisco wasn't in the car with koren.
Since there's nothing going on here today.... Does anyone know if Ashley Lelie still wants to be traded out of Denver since he doesn't want to be a 3rd receiver?
yeah, Lelie wants out and so does Jerry Porter. I think their respective teams are asking a little too much right now for them. I would expect the asking price to drop as the regular season draws near. No team wants that distraction going into a season.
No blog from Gleeman? I feel like the gang at Cheers the time Sam Malone couldn't pick up the chick and they all felt crushed and decided to go home.
I am glad someone else thought of video game kirby.
I bet AG's a Vikings fan, God help him.
Between Greenway going down and Koren falling off the wagon, I feel like going into exile too.
Get Cuddy out of the four hole, sweet Jesus. Even Gordo said it tonight, Morneau is dominating left handed pitching.
It's nice to know every market has doofuses who "work" at large newspapers and are protected by large unions. Here in Toronto, we have village idiots Geoff Baker and Richard Griffin at the Toronto Star. After last years World Series, Baker wrote an article celebrating the end of "Moneyball" and a return to "smallball". Hate to break it to ya Baker boy, but those White Sox hit 200+ homeruns and probably cost themselves some big rallies thanks to their ever fidgety manager.
Wittenmyer and Williams sound quite similar. I assume they regularly assail sabermetrics and other baseball facts in general for those intangible things that nobody seems able to quantify.
Calling Ted Lilly a junkballer really takes the cake of ignorance. As he demonstrated tonight against Tampa Bay (in true "Evil Ted" fashion), he hasn't figured out how to be a consistent big league starter yet and I'm not sure he ever will. But to label him a junkballer probably simply because he throws with his left arm is insane. The guy throws 89-91 mph consistently and touches 94, with a kneebuckling 12-6 curve that's right there with Barry Zito's and David Wells'. He also changes the hitters eye levels well by moving the fastball up and down in the zone at will. Throw in the occasional slider and changeup and when he's on, he's one of the best in the game, but when he's not Kyle Lohse or Josh Towers could beat him.
Baseball fans of Minneapolis-St.Paul, know that you are not alone in your headaches with the local press. I hope Francisco Liriano returns soon and you guys can get back in this thing. Good luck Gleemanites.
Anyone got a link or recorded ESPN's Baseball tonights best of Twins web gems? I'd like to know what they thought of as best of.
I think i got it on tivo, will try and get it on you tube tomorrow.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R...h?
v=ROZHc2Z1qBU
here are the all time top 3 web gems for the twins as featured on sports center. I have seen the number one play so many times, but failed to realize exactly how long of a throw that puckett made back into the infield to try and get the double play. WHat a gun.
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