I have an even more interesting thought - say a conservative parish wanted to escape TEC and decided to become an Anglican Use parish...and say for example that they also made a gift to the RC Archdiocese where they were located of...their property? Now we have the power of the RC church contesting the ownership of the church buildings, mesuages and glebes. Hmmmmm. Wonder how that would shake out.
Particularly if mesuages and glebes are in midtown Manhattan. I imagine Holy Mother Church would decline property offers without assurance of clear title but that be too bad: I would love to see it fought out in the courts!
Or "... if messuages and glebes are in suburban Philadelphia (let the reader understand)."
Diocesan ownership of church properties is a thorny point among RCs as well, and has resulted in many headaches. The ubiquitous "renovations" of fine old parish churches took place in most cases entirely unopposed because the title to RC churches in this country is usually held by the diocese and under the direct control of the bishop. Although this arrangement has advantages -- it allows poorer parishes with dwindling congregations to stay open, for example -- it means that parish life is controlled by the chanceries to a degree that most Epicopalians would find hard to imagine. Plus, by keeping all church properties in one (often very large) pot, it provides an unmissable target in liability suits.
Hmmmm--considering that the day before yesterday the RC church was in the business of actually demolishing beautiful old churches (think of Saint Anne's in Manhattan, knocked down in, I think, 2005 while hideous post-conciliar cement blocks were allowed to remain standing in the same neighborhood) I'm not sure that they are the ones to whom I would entrust my church building either. At least I would want to make sure first that the RC bishop wasn't going to insist on a table-form altar or anything like that.
To justinmartyr et al:
In re "'renovations' of fine old parish churches", here's something to consider; it's from a recent post on The Shrine of the Holy Whapping blog:
Dan: So, they found the previous pastor had walled up a safe behind the sacristy, filled with the treasures of the church--
Drew: He walled up a bunch of poor people?? For thirty years?
Jedesto:
A point well taken, but I hope you're not suggesting that the poor have any less right to beautiful churches than the rest of us. And keep in mind, too, that most of these "renovations" were entirely unnecessary from an architectural or aesthetic standpoint, and cost a great deal of money.
I've put this in com-boxes for YEARS, practically, telling all and sundry that this was coming down the pike! ... I have "dibs" on the sentence: "It's the Union of Brest-Litovsk all over again!"
As you all know, the Anglican Communion is fissioning, like plutonium, into a Pagan Religion (Western based) and Faithful Tradition (Global South based). The latter will soon form themselves corporately, and then knock-knock-knock on Rome's door. This is just the start!
Oh, by the way, what are "mesuages and glebes"? They sound like something delightful to grill and taste well with a cold beer.
Messuage (misspelled above): a dwelling house with the adjacent buildings and curtilage and other adjoining lands used in connection with the household.
Glebe: an area of land belonging to a benefice.
Obviously neither can be consumed but one may certainly grill victuals and consume them with a nice cold beer in or on them.
When the Falls Church (after which the D.C. suburb of Falls Church, VA is named, George Washington-Vestryman) left the ECUSA several months ago, the first question everyone asked was: "Who's going to own the church property?" There is an ongoing lawsuit in progress.
There is a great deal of case law on the subject. I once even attended a lecture on the subject given by a schismatic Episcopal priest to his congregation in Savannah, GA.
It seems that, in most states, the main question would be: "Is there true congregational control of the property?" If yes, the congregation takes it with them. If no, then no.
In some cases, such as the Anglican Use parish in Arlington, TX, the EC bishop doesn't contest ownership. (To be fair, the Episcopal bishop of Houston converted to Catholicism himself a year or two after that parish left.)
WAC
Houston? Or was it Dallas? Can't remember.
WAC
Just wanted to let you know the TAC and all affected are in my prayer intentions.
God bless!
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