AmericanPapist Comments
Thomas, what happened? When I clicked it said that the video was no longer available and didn't you just post it?
Or .... did it get yanked? Hmmmmmm
"I'm preparing my mind and heart for Mass. But first I'd better make sure my cell phone is all charged up, in case I see a liturgical abuse. Then I can send it to the blog."
Thomas, isn't there some incongruity in this set of goals for attending Mass?
I thought tribal liturgical dances were common and acceptable in Africa, not that I like them by any means. Is it an abuse or just distasteful? (Honestly wondering).
Oh, and do you ever sleep? :):):) God Bless you for your Caffeinated Insomnia! House wives/mommies need you to stay informed!
Baker is in Oregon my young friend. However, Bishop Weigand in Sacramento is surrounded and can see the approaching enemy from his very cathedra! He may yet escape into the mountains.
so, what? tribal people can't be christians now?
Pam, what might be acceptable within its own native cultural locale is not necessarily appropriate in the U.S. If culture matters (and I think it does, in a qualified sense) - it matters both ways. In fact, I remember Cardinal Arinze discouraging the practice (in Nigeria)in his autobiography.
Tom, thanks for the catch.
A nonny non, I note how often people who hide behind their anonymous status make the most outrageously stupid assertions. Not a very fine tradition, that.
p.s. there *is* a baker, california. I know b/c I have relatives living there. :)
amp, it wasnt an assertion, it was a question. i'm lightheartedly trying to figure out what it was about a tribal dance that upset you so. if my stupidity outrages you so, maybe u shuld raise the bar a little. chill out. peace. and love, man.
loving your tranny flameware btw.
(point reproven.)
A nonny
You moved the target, yes tribal people can be Christian but that is not what is at issue. The problem is whether or not this kind of dance during a mass is acceptable. Disco and break dancing is very western but they wouldn't be acceptable either because they do not lend to an atmosphere of reverence. Furthermore, most tribal dancing, not all but most, derives from animistic and pagan worship practices. While preserving them for artistic and cultural purposes is good, integrating them into Christian religious rites is at the least inappropriate if not scandalous.
Three (or so) weeks ago I attended Holy Mass in the cathedral of Aachen (Germany), my hometown. The occasion was the 175th jubilee of "Missio", a Pontifical charitable organisation with its seat in Aachen. Holy Mass was celebrated by the Archbishop of Bamberg, Ludwig Schick. "Missio" had brought a choir from South Africa and a dancing company from India. For this occasion I thought it to be OK, though it seemed a bit ridiculous - an African choir and Indian dancing didn't really fit into the Carolingian (805 A.D.) church.
After Communion, the dancers danced a dance as thanksgiving for the gift of Holy Communion, and after they had ended, everybody started clapping their hands. The Archbishop waited until everybody was silent again and just said: "After having thanked the Lord in singing, dancing and clapping our hands, let us proceed with the blessing." He got it right and took the opportunity to catechize without pontificating (pun intended...)
AmericanPapist,
You may want to clarify - the YouTube video claims this happened after Mass.
The title of your post says it happened during.
(And Bp. Vigneron is the best.)
Pax+
Deirdre,
It happened before the closing song, which is borderline at best (given that there isn't really a closing song in the GIRM) but really was within the Mass--before the celebrant left the sanctuary.
This dance was done when, on a solemn occasion, one might expect to sing the Salve Regina.
Understood - I'm not sure when Mass, technically, ends (I was simply going off the description). But since our reactions should be proportional to the nature of the offense, it's best to be clear on what that is in the first place. That's all.
AMP, your rude responses do neither you nor your arguments credit.
Thanks to Celibatarian for the expansion as while i don't wholeheartedly agree with the point of view expressed i at least now have an understanding of it.
Personally, I don't find any of this any more scandalous than the fact that people on blogs are posting videos and expressing outrage. I think the arguments about culture essentially come down to a matter of taste, altho i acknowledge tried and tested forms are obviously going to hit the mark better than untried forms. Really, i can live with whatever stuff the humans are getting on with as long as i gets some blood n guts.
If the apostles had been as rigid in their outlook as some of the Catholics on the blogverse, i do not think Pentecost would ever have happened.
Thanks
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