AmericanPapist Comments
I agree with you 100%! I live in Texas, and was one of the many parents who flooded Gov. Perry's office with phone calls when he signed his Executive Order mandating the vaccine, that was later withdrawn. Funny how, here it Texas, it was revealed that Merek contributed to Gov. Perry's re-election campaign! I refused the vaccine for my daughter last year. Now, that she is 17 and had been doing her own research on it, she is glad I made that decision for her! She is not sexually active, and what she has been reading about the vaccine has her more afraid of the vaccine than of the virus! She decided on her own to wait until marriage to have sex as I wish more teens and young adults would. In this day and age, you have to worry about so much more than an unwanted pregnancy! It amazes me that with all of the STDs and risks that have come about since I was a teen that so many practice casual sex!
Im almost 23 and finished my 3rd vaccine in March. The first one gave me a fever, which is one of the symptoms possible from the vaccine. Other than that I have no troubles. I think with all vaccines, people need to consider if it is right for them or not. I think it is very important to talk to you doctor. I have two doctors and one of which doesn't give vaccines and did not suggest it. One's current health also plays a role in adverse effects. I think if young females plan on having sex they do need someone to talk to about protection and safe practices and not just someone to give them a shot. You cannot always count on abstinence to keep teens STI free, education on the other hand is priceless and important. Boys also need education as well. Of all the men I know and have met, I feel many of them have no fear of STIs since many including HPV have no symptoms and there is no test for men. Sex education classes should emphasize how dangerous it is to play roulette with sex.
I have 4 daughters, the oldest is 14. I have no immediate plans for allowing them to receive the HPV vaccine, mostly because of all the possible (dangerous) side effects and the fact that it was rushed through the approval process.
However, I did attend a talk given by a very strident pro-life OB/GYN who discussed the pros, cons, and moral issues of this vaccine. She said, in her own opinion, that the only reason to give this vaccination to girls who plan to be chaste is if they happen to marry a man who was not chaste himself (men are sometimes carriers of HPV and pass this to their girlfriend/spouse) or if you are concerned that your college-aged daughter might be a victim of (date) rape, which unfortunately is a very real possibility in today's society.
She did say that to give the vaccine to girls because you assume they will be sexually active is not a moral reason, in her opinion, and that it should in no way be mandatory.
I agree with you insofar as parent's rigths go, but a few of your arguments just aren't very convincing:
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Texas had decided to mandate this drug for all school-age girls, even those who did not intend to engage in sexual activity. [...] Quite simply: why inoculate girls for an STD they have no chance of contracting (if they practice abstinence) and thereby put them in danger of suffering the vaccine's own harmful side effects?
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You don't think they should be vaccinated if they don't intend to have sex? How much do you know about today's middle and high school students? Lots go in not intendingto have sex, but intentions change. And often times, students feel somehow trapped in a situation where they need to have sex. Not very many school age children have the maturity to maintain their intention not ot have sex if they're in a situation where they can. Not to mention the horrible possibility of rape. This is no argument against being vaccinated.
Andrew:
I know quite alot about today's middle and high school students, certainly enough to realize that telling kids they've been vaccinated against some STDs is going to give them a false sense of security, and to know that if students feel "trapped into situations of having sex" that we should be fixing THOSE situations not inoculating them against only SOME of the harmful health side-effects of promiscuity. Cases of rape? Same thing: we should try to prevent rape, not presume it's going to happen and take precautions.
Especially since the "precautions" have a higher possibility of causing harm than the STDs this vaccine is meant to prevent.
And *all* of this is prescinding from the state's encroachment into health issues that I believe should be properly reserved to parents.
Does that help you see my position?
Advocating this vaccine as a public health issue is like deciding that the way to fight gun violence is with an antidote for lead poisoning.
"Advocating this vaccine as a public health issue is like deciding that the way to fight gun violence is with an antidote for lead poisoning.
Maureen | 07.07.08 - 10:58 pm |"
This is the credited answer.
Like Sharon, I have four daughters, so I'm quite interested in this topic. In addition, my wife is an OB-GYN.
We will have our daughters vaccinated when they are older for the reason stated by Sharon as expressed by the OB-GYN she heard speak. Many, many young men are promiscuous before receiving the grace of conversion. Hundreds of thousand of them will carry HPV into their marriages despite even years of chastity. The possible side affects of the vaccine pale in comparison to cervical cancer. I'm not trying to convince anyone they should think the way we do, just explaining our rationale.
As an aside, we don't plan on telling our girls what that particular shot is for, just as we haven't explained the various vaccines they've gotten to date. We simply say, "it's to keep you healthy" and they never follow that up. If they do, we'll honestly say it may prevent cervical cancer. Sex doesn't even need to be brought into the discussion (so no implicit approval of sexual activity).
As a follow up, while the claim that the vaccine has very serious side effects may be true, the original post doesn't establish this most important allegation.
The link to the UK story is broken, so I cannot comment on it. The CNN story is sloppy journalism and, in my opinion, engages in scare mongering.
First, the CDC has said none of the 10 confirmed deaths were linked to the vaccine. So, move on the the non-lethal claims.
The article states there has been nearly 8,000 adverse events. How many of those were legitimately caused by the vaccine? Since the opponents were 0 for 10 on the claimed relatedness of death, I'd say there is a good chance a significant number of the 8,000 are unrelated as well.
However, I'm sure there is a causal relationship in some of those cases. Of those that were, many required medical treatment? In other words, how many were nausea, dirrareah, or fever that lasted for 12 hours or so? While those symptoms are unpleasant, they are, in my opinion, worth protection against cancer.
Another missing piece of information is how many doses of vaccine may been given to compare the 7,800 reports of side effects? TWELVE MILLION! So, if I grant that 6,000 claims of side effects are actually causally related (which I doubt), the chances of a negative reaction is .0005 percent.
Among that tiny number, there have been zero deaths and, according to the CDC, no lasting side effects. However, by the age of 50 more than 80% of American women will have contracted at least one strain of HPVHPV & 11,000 American women are diagnosed with cervical cancer every year.
With all the foregoing thoughts in mind, we will chose to vaccinate our girls. However, I completely agree with the fundamental point of the original post - state should stay out of this completely. It should be a parental matter.
Forgive the grammar...I'm tired. :-) You get my meaning.
The vaccine does not protect against 20% of the HPV virus strains and these 20 % are the most virulent.
Another report today on CBSnews.com of a perfectly healthy girl becoming paralyzed after receiving the vaccination! Paralysis seems to be one of the major reported side effects.
Vaccinations are not safe, folks, despite the hype and propaganda. You won't know if you are the one to suffer deleterious side effects until after you are vaccinated.
Talking to the doctor is somehow going to make them safer and keep you from suffering side effects? Most doctors are trained to push drugs. Doctors have become corrupt as a profession due to abortion and contraception. They show little respect for the body. Instead they make our bodies sick.
Vaccine immunities are short-lived, too. Look at all the outbreaks of mumps and chicken pox in vaccinated children.
LvB -
It's a little harsh to condemn all doctors and all vaccines. Some doctors are corrupt, some priests are corrupt, some teachers and congressmen and gas station attendants are corrupt - but saying the whole profession is degenerate is just a sweeping generalization.
And vaccines - while they certainly are not all good - how about tetanus vaccines, and smallpox?
I'm also having a tough time with the argument that the vaccine only prevents 80% of HPV strains. I mean, if something bad can be prevented from happening 8 out of 10 times, it might be worth looking at.
While I don't have kids yet, and I am just out of the age range to get the Gardasil vaccine myself, I feel that all I can do is educate myself in order to make the best possible decision for when I do have children.
Vaccines and condoms: the pseudo-pagan talismans against evil. Watch the Gardisil ads. Note that they conspicuously omit the part that HPV is transmitted sexually. It's this beast out there somewhere that will get you without the magic. And note when pressed its proponents regard youth and high school as The Lord of the Flies.
to quote LvB "Most doctors are trained to push drugs. Doctors have become corrupt as a profession due to abortion and contraception. They show little respect for the body. Instead they make our bodies sick."
Your generalization of physicians is both inaccurate AND uncharitable. As a physician who will not prescribe contraception on moral and ethical grounds, I have taken a lot of heat from many people. This is called "standing up for your beliefs" - not being "trained to push drugs".
Now - on to the issues with the Governor of Texas...
As a practicing Catholic and Family Physician in San Antonio, Texas, perhaps I can give everyone a different perspective on last year's "mandate for school attendance".
Consider this. Over 70% of the children in Texas receive medical care through either the Medicaid or CHIP program - both of which are publicly funded - or "welfare" for lack of a better term. These two programs rely EXLUSIVELY on the state-funded "Vaccines for Children" program in order to provide immunizations for these children. Without a perceived state-mandated requirement for school attendance, the HPV vaccine WOULD NOT be provided by Vaccines for Children.
Thus, 70% of the children of Texas would not be able to receive this vaccine even if they wanted it - which they likely would if they've ever seen anyone die in their 30's of cervical cancer.
Additionally, this requirement for school attendance is NOT absolute. ANYONE can give informed refusal to any medical treatment at any time. All the mandate requires is that the vaccine be explained and offered.
Furthermore, I see that some of you DO realize that despite how pure and chaste our children and their future spouses live their lives, any one small mistake can come back to kill them twenty years later.
(Disclosures: I receive absolutely no compensation in any way from Merck Vaccine Division.)
ahhh... The old "If you just wear condoms and get vaccinated you too can be the gals from Sex and the City!" Nonsense!
Just try to keep them from having kids and make them feel comfortable they will not get some of the STDs that are out there...
We can all own nice things, be barren and sleep around if we just commit to science!
I am so tired of it all. How many people have to die, be crippled, infected, or die childless and alone before we realize this sterility we glorify is killing us?
Yes, ASimpleSinner. AND how many broken hearts, depression and a feeling that life has absolutely no meaning go along with the physical consequences of all these behaviors??
If I had a daughter, I certainly would not allow her to get this vaccination! I would have urged her to refrain from sexual activity until she is married, and, after that, she will be on her own!
Diogenes over at CWN's Off the Record (Someone help me, is "Diogenes" really Phil Lawler?) made a great point awhile back. Google the Montana Meth Project ads. Their motto? "Not even once." and no one blinks. Why then does everyone hem and haw when someone proposes "not even once" in the non-marital sexual realm? His conclusion is that the Montana meth guys actually care about people not being destroyed. Now I suppose these defenders care about people on some level, but not nearly as much as pushing their sexual ideology.
Whilst the state has a role in making available suitable, proven safe, vaccines - and in recommending them to parents - it has no right to mandate their use; it is a parent's right to decide what vaccines their children should receive.
Furthermore, it is now proven beyond doubt that male infant circumcision provides a lifelong protection both for the boy and all his partners against many sexually transmitted diseases including HPV and HIV. The degree of protection far exceeds that provided by the best available vaccines of any type. Furthermore this one-time simple procedure protects against multiple infections and not just the one that any given vaccine covers.
are you kidding me?! what is wrong with you?? you can get hpv without intercourse. even accidentally touching someone's cold sore (say by sharing lip gloss or whatever) - even when the sore is not visible yet - and then touching yourself ANYWHERE can give you the virus. they have found herpes 1 (the cold sore kind) below the waist, as well as the genital warts kind (simplex 2) above the waist. in addition, the herpes virus can spread if you aren't careful. a cold sore on your mouth could be accidentally transferred to your eyes causing BLINDNESS. its not just a STD. it doesn't only affect sexually active people. and there is NO CURE. once you have it, you have if for life. the littlest things can cause an outbreak - sunlight for example if you have cold sores.
as for the vaccine...the drawbacks have been relatively rare and the majority have been very minor. oh no, a little dizziness. lots of people get dizzy from shots. they don't like shots and they get freaked out.
i think it is a great idea that the vaccine be mandatory. i have a friend. she is barely 19, had not heard of gardasil, didn't really know about STDs. her first sexual encounter was with a "trusted" friend right before he shipped out to iraq. by the time she realized she had a problem and went to the doctor, she had genital warts so bad she could barely walk. they were inside and out, practically closing her vagina because of the multitude of warts. she had surgery to remove them but they came back less than two weeks later. she has the most aggressive type of hpv and now has about a 70% chance of getting cervical cancer. at 19. she's still practically a baby and she basically has a death sentence. because of a stupid mistake. if the schools had proper sex education, instead of simply preaching abstinence and looking the other way while kids figure things out for themselves, she would have known about the vaccine. she would have known about stds and how to spot them. she would have known to protect herself. because kids are left to fend for themselves, they experiment. kids are having oral sex instead of intercourse, because they think it doesn't count as sex. but oral sex is just as risky as regular sex. but they don't know that.
the point is, if the vaccine were mandatory, maybe we could get this virus under control. 80% of women are infected with hpv. some of them don't even know because they've never had a visible outbreak. this has to end. if the answer is a vaccine with a few rare, minor side effects (which compared to the side effects of a lot of medications, diet pills, etc., are nothing), then i'm ALL for making it mandatory.
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