AmericanPapist Comments
Fr Tom Reese is still trying to promote the idea that the bishops are not on the same page:
Thomas Reese, a Jesuit priest and scholar at Georgetown University, says Martino's position is rare. And he notes that Biden will soon be moving to Washington — the archdiocese of the more moderate Donald Wuerl.
"And Archbishop Wuerl has made clear he does not believe in using the Communion as a weapon against Catholic politicians," Reese said. "So Vice President Biden will be able to go to Communion in Washington, D.C., and I would guess in at least 180 other dioceses in the country."
Source: NPR
This letter, with a few variations, could have been written about tax code. It has nothing to do with the brave bishops who stood up and made clear that a Catholic could not vote for Barry "Let's kill babies" Obama.
They didn't act in 1973, and they don't act now.
You forgot the last part of the letter:
P.S. Please tell Joe and Nancy that they are excommunicated. We cannot have them continuing to scandalize the faithful and send out mixed messages of what Church teaching is on abortion.
Oh wait, that wasn't in there.
Fr. Reese is right (amazingly) that denying communion shouldn't be used as a weapon against politicians. It should be used as a medicinal punishment to bring them back into full communion with the Church. We deny so many Catholics the help they need because we're afraid of what others will think.
Joseph and LCB- Though we might wish for a different and more direct approach, I think you underestimate this letter. Cardinal George is quite deliberate to say he speaks for all bishops- a blow against the Kmiecs and Reeses. Furthermore, have the U.S. Bishops addressed a President-elect in this direct and challenging fashion previously? They challenged the notion of receiving the election as a referendum on abortion ideology. Frankly, I thank God for a simple, concise statement from the Bishops that cannot be misconstrued. From what I understand of the history of the Church in U.S. politics, this seems a promising beginning to the Obama presidency.
Fr. Andrew,
This letter would look great on a plaque in the 9th circle of hell.
Babies are dying. Bishops are writing letters and taking no action. The time for action is now.
Would they act this way if Obama was threatening to round up 1/3 of all 5 year old children and kill them? I hope to God they wouldn't, and that they just don't believe that babies are people.
If they ACTUALLY BELIEVE that babies are people, and this is there response...then God help us all.
Okay, moment of truth time: when dozens of individual bishops were making these same points during the election, they were dismissed as a "minority" or "mavericks" by their liberal critics.
Maybe dismissed by you but not by me. The bishops are doing exactly what I think they should be doing -- speaking to legislative proposals, not making candidate endorsements.
"Maybe dismissed by you but not by me. The bishops are doing exactly what I think they should be doing -- speaking to legislative proposals, not making candidate endorsements."
The mistake you make here, Katherine, is that they did not endorse a candidate. They said Catholics should not vote for someone who advances the abortionist agenda. Personally, if the Republican ticket were not pro-life, I would have voted for a third party.
Katherine, candidate proposals are done and your pro-death candidate is doing exactly as was expected. We'll see how much abortion is reduced when he reverses all those executive orders that President Bush put in place.
Maybe dismissed by you but not by me.
So why didn't the bishops release this statement/letter BEFORE the election? Such a letter might have forced many Catholics to reconsider their vote or even reconsider whether they agree with the Church. The Church's views on the morality/sinfulness of abortion are clear and always have been. What hasn't been as clear for the last 2000 years is the Church's stance on the secular, legal status of abortion. From a long term historical perspective, the Church has not always aggressively advocated for criminalization of abortion. It has always been a sin and immoral but the secular, legal punishment has varied greatly over the centuries. Is the Church today in favor of criminalizing abortion? Hard to tell from the bishops' letter... all it says is Roe v. Wade is bad law (which it is)... but what should the law of the land be for abortion? They didn't spell that out!
"On this issue, the legal protection of the unborn, the bishops are of one mind with Catholics and others of good will ... The bishops are single-minded because they are, first of all, single-hearted… This statement is written at the request and direction of all the Bishops...."
Blablablablaaaaaahhhhh
Is this a JOKE? An open mockery of Rome? Pleeeeease!!!
The USCCB do talk the talk, BUT NOT walk the walk of excommunicating the “Catholic” abortion lawmakers.
RESULT: MILLIONS (just check the numbers) of “Cafeteria Catholics” bought the actual non-negotiable genocide as trivial.
Katherine,
You accused Archbishop Chaput of speaking out during the campaign for his own glorification. Remember that?
Oh, Kathy, how gauche of you to remember that inconvenient fact!
I think this article nails it:
http://insidecatholic.com/Joomla...=4873&
Itemid=48
Also, the I don't like when Bishops tell me how to vote, in the context of this past election, is code languge for I want to vote for Obama.
I know, bill, I am so sorry :) I can't help myself!
There's a little piece over at the Washington Times blog that puts this statement into its real context:
http://washingtontimes.com/weblogs/belief-blog/
2008/Nov/11/double-minded-bishops/
Of course, the Catholic movers and shakers on the Obama team wouldn't look at the Washington Times, but I expect they understand what's just happened well enough to get a real giggle out of Cardinal George's supposedly stern message. I'll bet it gets a loud laugh at the NARAL convention too.
Cardinal George and his collegues surely realize the pro-aborts are laughing out loud at this silly letter.
It's meaningless. They know it and Obama knows it.
What's the point of writing a letter like this AFTER the election, when it will have no effect whatsoever?
Well, that an easy question. Most bishops and their chanceries are liberal Democrats. Connect the dots.
Dear Bishops, please give us a little less conversation, a little more action. Do you really think that another letter is what's needed? Really?
Yes, it's a good letter. Yes, it speaks for all the bishops. But are we supposed to heartily congratulate the bishops for being willing to teach the truth? I mean, isn't that the bare minimum we should expect of the successors of the apostles?
The Wuerls and McCarricks and Cupichs of the conference need to ditch the nuanced sophistication and take their cues from Finn, Burke, Naumann, Martino, Hermann and Bruskewitz. Please, your Excellencies, for the sake of the faithful, for the sake of pro-abortion Catholic politicians, and most of all for the sake of the unborn, be courageous and act!
Yikes, if Katherine endorses the letter, there is definitely something lacking in it.
So why didn't the bishops release this statement/letter BEFORE the election?
Well... er... um... you see... uh... well... we think it's a matter of... um... we just don't think it's prudent to... um... alienate people...
Congratulations to our first black president!
Gutcheck time for our shepherds. They're taking long walks off a short pier. Gone are the days when they could spout blahblahblah about peace and justice and yet we are hopeful and blahblahblah. Now they're really beginning to swallow the implications of those strong letters released from August through October. Might be seeing their expensive cars, golf junkets, favorite tables at swank restaurants, favoritism by rich Catholic folk go poof. Or a lot worse from an administration that resents their very existences. As third-rate teevee reporters would tag out their stories, only time will tell.
I thought the letter was well written and I applaud his Emminence for his forceful yet charitable approach. I dont think the letter is a matter of too little too late. Dont lose hope! And quit crying over spilled milk >:-{!
dead babies, anna, not spilled milk.
I am glad to see this letter from Cardinal George. I don't know if it will actually change Obama's mind (or anyone else's for that matter) but I suppose we can always hope? Eh. And by hope, I mean in the way Pope Benedict defines it in his encyclical, not the way Obama has used it in his campaign. Just to be clear.
What I am not sure about is this: what action can we expect from the Bishops? To burst into Congress and make a ruckus until they are heard? To stand outside abortion clinics and stop women from entering? Is that the role of Bishops? I am not trying to answer the question, just to ask it. It reminds me of the movie "The Mission"... do we expect the Bishops (or our priests too for that matter) to be the one holding the gun at the end of the movie or the one holding up the Eucharist?
(That might not be the best example of what I am trying to ask, but it is all I can think of at this early hour.)
Let me be clear, I would love to see more 'action' from our leaders in the Church in regards to this issue. I guess my question is, what form will that action take to be most effective? Will the excommunication of Catholic politicians who obviously don't take their Catholic Faith very seriously actually make them change their minds? Maybe, maybe not. Although I pray daily for a change of heart for all of them!
Previously, Amp editorialized approvingly on the actions of Bp. Martino in Scranton for discarding the collective authority of the American bishops in favor of his own will.
Now, Amp is lauding the collective authority of the American bishops.
Do not get me wrong - I completely agree with Cardinal George (although it is to my chagrin that I have to trot out my opinion on the letter's content when what I am really talking about is Amp's interpretive stance).
But I think there is some friction here between authority and reasoning, and I am not so sure that you can have it both ways.
SA, you've got it wrong. I praised Martino for defending the truth when the combined bishops were silent.
Now I'm praising the combined bishops for also speaking in the same terms.
100% consistent. My argument is that the other side has lost one of their main arguments, e.g., that vocal bishops are a minority which do not represent the broader consensus of the US bishops.
Yes, It was a forceful statement by Card George. However, I don't understand: "Aggressively pro-abortion policies, legislation and executive orders will permanently alienate tens of millions of Americans, and would be seen by many as an attack on the free exercise of their religion."
What about non-aggressive pro-abort policies, or even quasi-aggressive???
I'd say, they'd at least alienate those dying from them.
At least it seems some of the Bishop's are somewhat awake now. After they wipe the "sleepers" from their eyes, maybe they can see clear to Enforce Canon 915.
Card. George said, jokingly, that maybe Bishops should be issued mops instead of croziers.
Sure, it'll be a mess enforcing Canon 915: but one might ask...how much more of a mess will result in not enforcing it? how much of the mess we're in now would not have occurred if the scandal of "Catholic" pro-abortion politicians was addressed more forcefully years ago?
Lord have mercy on us. Like Fr. Tom Etenauer latest newsletter pointed out in its' title, we've as a Nation (and as Christians) have said: "We have no King but Caesar."
WOW!
Anyway, I hope the Bishops had a nice meeting, and can sleep well at night when they get home.
To all those who think that this letter was a weak display by the bishops and in regard to my flippant response about "crying over spilled milk": all I'm saying is that Monday morning quarterbacking never accomplishes anything-except maybe for you to let off some steam.
I hate abortion as much as you do and I do think that the bishops should act as a unified group and do more to protect the integrity of the Sacraments, especially the Holy Eucharist.
As NB so eloquently stated in his post is it only the bishop's responsiblity to speak out or is it everyone's. We the laity are on the front lines and I think that we should do everything we can to combat the evil of abortion before we make such insulting comments as some of you have about our bishops.
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