AmericanPapist Comments
Watching her parents during Sarah's excellent speech last night, I wondered: what would motivate them to leave the Church?
Like the parents of (Episcopal Church Presiding Bishop) Katerine Jefferts Schori, they may have had a questionable grasp on their Catholicism. They might not have weathered the changes in the Church immediately after Vatican II. Given that the Heaths went to an AOG (Assemblies of God) congregation, they might have been looking for something a bit, well, different.
So she left the true church for a heretic church? What does that say about her judgment about other things? Kind of a "cafeteria Catholic" it seems to me!
Mike: did you *even* read the post? Palin's _parents_ left the church when she was an infant. She had no say in the matter and probably has no Catholic memory or experience. This was precisely the point of the post.
Mike's post is truly funny.
Paul, we don't know what degree of 'affiliation' Palin's parents had with the Church. I never assume anything. Anymore.
"so Palin cannot be said to have decided against her Catholic identity..."
...you mean, other than the fact that she continues to decide for a different church, right?
No, Evenshine. Think about the standard you are suggesting be applied here. It would apply to every non-Catholic on the face of this earth, since Pentecost anyway, who has ever heard of the Church.
As a former Evangelical, turned Catholic, let me give everyone a little advice. Millions upon millions of Catholics in the United States left the Church since the Second Vatican Council. If we ever want to get even a fraction of them to repent and come back, we're going to have to lighten up and not be too critical of them. These people left the Church for a reason, and they only come back because of the Christian charity we show them.
In the case of Sarah Palin, we can rejoice that enough of a spark of Catholicism remains in her to keep her faithfully pro-life and pro-family. Remember, a good Evangelical Protestant is nothing more than a Catholic with an identity crisis.
Well put, Knight. As a convert myself who works with evangelicals day in and day out (literally, it's my job) I am not going to win any hearts by calling them heretics (except those who will know it's good natured joking and call me a papist in return).
Sarah might not be a Catholic per say, but her life choices are for sure more in line with the Catholic Faith than any of those others who say they are Catholic (Kennedy, Pelosi, Giuliani, Kerry ...)
right, guys. and girl.
"This means Palin's marriage is also valid, and sacramental (presuming her husband Todd is baptized)."
As I understand it, someone who was baptised as an infant and subsequently raised as a non-Catholic (provided they were born after 31 December 1948) is not bound by canonical form but is still bound by the need for a dispensation of disparity of cult (see Bouscaren, Ellis, Korth: Canon Law - a Text and Commentary, 1963, p.592; Canon Law Society of America, The Code of Canon Law - a Text and Commentary, 1985, p.768). I am not a canonist, but as a pastor I had a case where the person had been baptised Catholic as a child but brought up Protestant; the Tribunal said that this person's previous marriage to a Protestant was not valid because they had received Catholic baptism as an infant; this allowed their second marriage, also to a Protestant, to be convalidated. This makes me wonder why you think that Mrs Palin's marriage is valid in the eyes of the Catholic church and possibly sacramental. I don't imagine the matter is of any concern to Mrs Palin herself, as her intention was to marry her husband in the sight of God. However, I think that if she ever returns to the faith of her fathers, she may need a sanatio.
I wrote "is not bound by canonical form but is still bound by the need for a dispensation of disparity of cult" - of course, that should have been the other way around: if he is baptised, then she is not bound by the need for a dispensation of disparity of cult but is still bound by canonical form (which your father had pointed out in his piece).
Fr. PF. I don't understand what your question is, if you are asking one.
I recently got this book on the New Vatican II Rite of Baptism. It seems that the New Modernist Rite is null and void, and thus all people baptized need re-baptism conditionally, this would include Sarah Palin I'm afraid. No one is validly baptized in a invalid or dubious rite, and if Sarah Palin received that, she cannot be counted as a Christian. I'm sorry to say it is this, but's true. If you don't believe read the book PRAXIS OBNOXIA:
http://www.lulu.com/content/3824207
Wow that book Praxis Obnoxia is really orthodox.
Thanks
>
Granted, unless Palin was planning to murder the pope and to use her power and influence to accomplish that goal, I don't think these questions have a place in our national political conversation.
Could you please supply evidence that Palin's marriage is sacramental? And, could you please show how a non-Catholic marriage could be sacramental? I don't think you'll be successful, of course. And, besides, it is just a point of curiosity -- it has no real bearing on the national conversation.
Please don't misunderstand my tone. I fully support the work that you're doing via this blog. It just irritates me when people (don't worry, I am not counting you, Thomas) base their votes -- especially in such an important political race -- on such silly issues.
I can think of any number of reasons people would leave the Church. I can only think of less than a handful for remaining Catholic (e.g., the sacraments, the truth). The Palin elders could be teaching us an important lesson: You want people in the Church? You want people to raise their children Catholic? Act like it.
Invalid baptism - wow - bombshell! Big Big Bombshell!
We all need conditional baptism, since the 70s. This is a revelation.
Tommie Peters got his work cut out for him, you need rebaptism to be truly a "Catholic" layman.
Right? AmericanPapist?
Rome is Home
Could be worse...could be CNN's Campbell Brown.
She went from cradle Catholicism to Judaism. Oy!
I don't recall where online I read this, but the low-down on the choice of worship community was partly the diocesan Bishop's doing - Mr and Mrs Heath found that the local Catholic Church had no permanent pastor or parish life to speak of, so they opted to hang out with their younguns where other couples with younguns did - a vital Christian community of separated brethren. IHMO they made the right choice - the family benefitted from the community spirit, even if their sacramental graces were "rationed" by not participating in the kind of rudimentary faith formation most of us in our 40's experienced. I'm the only one of my five siblings still practicing and we all attended Catholic Schools, so give it a break!
You pharisaical "wing-nuts" make 'ardent practicing Catholics' like Pelosi seem positively sensible (more's the pity).
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