The commenting guidelines are this:
--Racial/sexual slurs are very much frowned upon here and there is a good chance they will end up being deleted. They will definitely be mocked for their abject stupidity. Insisting on using such pathetic nonsense may get you banned.
--Spam will be deleted.
--The Blog Masters here reserve the right to delete comments at our discretion without prior notice, if it is deemed necessary. Generally, we hope and plan to do as little deleting as possible.
If you do not grasp those three things, well, I'm sorry. There's not much I can do you for you.
I'm sorry, lovey. Genuinely sorry to hear it. We live to fight another day - like tomorrow.
Hugs all around, Shakes.
Sorry to hear that, Shakes, but lord knows I understand. I hope you're doing okay in the middle of all this. 
You know you will always have my support, Liss.
I am genuinely disappointed for you SS - you really could have made a difference for the Edwards campaign, I believe. And I think Edwards is to be congratulated not only for hiring out-spoken feminists in the first place (as well as excellent and perceptive writers), but by sticking by them.
However, I think you are being far too optimistic when you say, "This is a win for no one." It is in fact a win for Donohue, if for nothing else he will claim as such, and the MSM will report it as such. It is a shame, and politics is becoming so ugly that every day is a struggle for me to remain plugged in.
Everyone's loss.
Oh, M, I am so sorry. It's your decision, and anyone who criticizes you for doing what is necessary to protect yourself and your family is heartless, point final.
Sad, sad news, not because of any side winning here, but because my friend has had to step down from a position for which she was so clearly well-qualified.
I am profoundly disappointed, of course, but I support you. As do all who really know your work.
XX
D.
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.
I'm sorry, Melissa. You have my support, and respect.
Hope you and Iain are doing all right, Sis. I have a small inkling of how much this meant to you, and I'm sorry this happened. 
I'm genuinely saddened by not only this, but the sheer amount of coverage one bigoted assberet gets in the media, and how evil and hateful all the troglodytes who follow him have been her and at Pandagon. I'm sorry, M, and I hope you come back stronger than ever. We're all rooting for you.
Maybe you can explain why you felt the need to malign a particular religion in the first place. I thought the purpose of a free society was so that we were all free to believe and worship in accordance with our personal beliefs. Let the Catholics worship they way they want and let the Baptists, Orthodox, Jews, Muslims and Budhists do the same. Does it further your beliefs to disparage another's? What tenet of your fail does that fall under? I would imagine most leaders of organized religion (with the exception of some radical sects)would say that we should RESPECT the beliefs of those who choose to worship in a different manner than us.
You gotta do what you gotta do and only you will know what that is.
Hang in there; I'm quite certain you have exponentially more supporters and well-wishers than denigraters. Best of luck to you.
I think you are being far too optimistic when you say, "This is a win for no one." It is in fact a win for Donohue, if for nothing else he will claim as such, and the MSM will report it as such.
It's not about perception. Realistically, and objectively, no one wins when people on either side of the political spectrum are terrorized into quitting their jobs.
This whole situation is just sad. It sucks that bullies are given such free reign while decent folks are unapologetically persecuted for being honest. I'm sorry it didn't work out for you. Best of luck in your next endeavor. With any karmic luck, it will be something more fitting of someone so talented.
I smell a book.
Feel the warmth of us lefties...we're here for you. This is a tragedy.
The problem, Mary K? Catholicism and fundy Christianity don't stop at "well I believe this". They go further to "Well, I believe this, and I believe my government should make a law that makes everyone else have to have the same belief or suffer the consequences. Xtianity is no longer about just beliefs in this country, it's curtailing dissent and removing the ability from people to believe differently than they do. That is why I cannot respect any person who would take Donohue or Pat Robertson or any n umber of stains seriously.
Get over yourself.You make a disgusting
attack on Christians and then cry like
a little baby about "Frightening attacks" on you?
You can dish it out but can't take it.
Gee, what a surprise.
Liss,
I can't tell you how sorry I am it came to this for you. You got a completely raw deal. I hope that it's built up some good karma for the near future for you.
Maybe you can explain why you felt the need to malign a particular religion in the first place.
I'll take this one, Sis.
Hey Mary K, your answer can be found within your comment. Need help? Here you go:
the purpose of a free society was so that we were all free to believe and worship in accordance with our personal beliefs
Shakes did not criticize any one religion, only those "spokespeople" within those religions who want to force their interpretations of their faith on everyone else, most saliently women.
Get it? No, I'm sure you don't.
*sigh*
I respect your decision and honestly, I kind of expected it. I just hate that those jerks are going to crow all over it, as if they've accomplished something. It's a shame.
Keep that head of yours up, like I know you will. You have remained beautiful and strong in spite of the ugliness, and you've inspired far more good. I'm proud to have found both you and Amanda. To be acquainted, even distantly and indirectly.
Much love and support.
SS - I couldn't agree more that realistically and objectively, no one wins in these situations, but I fear such quaint notions as "reality" are becoming more and more abstract. Unfortunately, I do believe that perception is now far more important than reality or objectiveness. I think the last 6 years is proof positive of that.
I am a firm believer in karma, and nowadays that really is the sole thing that often keeps me going as I see such hate and intolerance increasing - not just increasing in the general sense, but increasing in the public sphere to the degree that it's acceptable on national television.
I'm so sorry that you've been put through hell over this. And I'm freaking angry that there are people who believe that they have the right to spew threats, veiled or otherwise, to someone on the other side of a political disagreement.
It's a cold, sad day.
Mary, Jim:
As a Christian, I support Melissa entirely. And Amanda as well. She didn't attack Christians. She simply called out bigotry and sexism and hypocrisy, and human pride, daring to masquerade as Christianity. Want freedom to practice your faith (Or lack of) as you choose? Go for it; it's your right. Just don't forget that it's also MY right.
I grew up in a hard-right-wing kind of church. I know all too painfully well the evils one can inflict "in the name of God." The Lord is blessed. I believe Jesus would never have treated a woman as a second class citizen. Mary, his mother, was not a second-class citizen. She was a remarkable woman, not the passive figurehead she's framed as.
In fact Jesus gives a radically egalitarian example of living in several instances including one Amanda herself cited.
We'd all do better to examine our own selves than to scapegoat a couple of women who dared speak their minds.
Shakes,
This whole sordid episode has made me mad from the begining, especially the fact that it was started by bigots themselves. It is a sad day when these kind of people control the debate. Remain fearless!
Mary,
Maybe you can explain why you felt the need to malign a particular religion in the first place.
See, this would usually be the part when I inject some not-too-subtle form of insullt into the conversation.
Instead, I'll just leave you with this link and ask: Did you remove the rafter from your own eye yet?
With that, I'm done with trolls for today.
Ahhh, Ackerly, can you find any of those attacks on "christianity" as a whole?
I think not.
Attacks on certain horrible human beings who use the cover of religion to make others suffer? That would be more accurate.
I, and many others here feel the need to defend ourselves from the hatred, bigotry, and oppression of those who falsely claim to follow (a) god's teachings.
What defense have you for the attacks "christians" have unleashed on Shakes and her family? What defense have you for costing a smart and talented writer a job about which she was truly enthusiastic?
You and your kind are truly disgusting, and your delusions are destroying this country.
So sorry to hear it, Shakes. The whole thing was such an ugly mess. Edward's campaign has lost two truly talented women today. (and I'm sorry you had to turn down employment - that really sucks.)
Keep up the good work here. You're work is wonderful - and desperately needed.
Yikes! I meant "your". Honest to God. And I'm sorry I ever said anything Jasper!
All kinds of love and support being sent your way, Liss. I'm very sorry that this happened. I've already sent the IRS the form reporting Donohue's 501(c)(3) violation.
I'm sorry.
I'm sorry to hear about all that you've been going through with this, and I disagree with anyone who tells you that you've made the wrong decision. You're doing what you feel is best for you and your family, and that makes it the right decision. Not that you need to be told this, but keep on blogging, and don't let the trolls (here or elsewhere) get you down.
Big hugs.
I thought the purpose of a free society was so that we were all free to believe and worship in accordance with our personal beliefs. Let the Catholics worship they way they want and let the Baptists, Orthodox, Jews, Muslims and Budhists do the same.
The purpose of a free society is to let individuals figure out "the purpose" on their own.
Also, CRITICIZING CATHOLICISM DOES NOT IMPEDE THE WORSHIP OR PRACTICE OF CATHOLICISM IN ANY WAY SHAPE OR FORM. Stop pretending like it does.
keep on blogging
I absolutely shall.
I absolutely shall.
Well..., I--for one--am looking forward to Friday night!
One can hope you turned threats in to the FBI. Terrorists come in all stripes, and a lot of those stripes look a lot like the feathers of a right wing.
Redouble your efforts. Although it doesn't pay the rent, you will be decidedly more effective outside of mainstream politics, as there are fewer pressures to sacrifice the core of who you are and what you represent. Stay true to those principles and speak that which needs to be spoken. They are afraid of you. That is the reason you were attacked.
Shakes -
I am thinking of you and your family.
{{{Hugs}}}
N3rdchik
I'm a professional lurker here (missed the lurker amnesty day-sorry)but I wish you well. I come here most every day and enjoy the blog quite a bit. Keep your head up and know there are a ton of people supporting you.
I'm so sad about this. But I certainly hope that someone sees what a great writer you are and hires you for a cool gig where you're more free to say what you really think about issues. You certainly deserve it; you're terrific.
Give 'em hell, Shakes.
Well put, midgetqueen.
I'm sad to hear about this. The ways in which you and Amanda have been attacked are despicable and should not be upheld in a society that is so protective of its freedoms.
Direct action, as Shayera and Scorpio recommend, is best.
It's a tragedy that this happened. I really think both you and Amanda would have contributed a lot to that campaign. What a wonderful thing to have two strong, feminist voices in the game!
Whatever happens, you're still an amazing woman, whose blog is the first, and last I check every day. Keep up the great work, and...Nolite te bastardes carborundorum. 
As a Christian, I support Melissa entirely. And Amanda as well. She didn't attack Christians. She simply called out bigotry and sexism and hypocrisy, and human pride, daring to masquerade as Christianity. Me, too.
See, that's the part the bad guys forgot here, not Shakes. I absolutely respect your decision. Probably because they never read what was actually written, just what was repeated over and over by Donohue and his brownshirted little toadies. Folks who don't never will, so don't bother trying anymore. Namaste.
Bill Donohue can kiss my lapsed-Catholic ass on the altar of St. Peter's Basilica.
I am so sorry that it came to this.
There's a part of me, though, that is glad you'll be free to be yourself again.
Maybe you can explain why you felt the need to malign a particular religion in the first place.
WELL MAYBE YOU CAN EXPLAIN WHY IT'S OKAY FOR THE BISHOPS - AND JOHN PAUL II, AND BENEDICT XVI, AND, AND, AND, ... - TO GET A PASS ON DOING NOTHING OF CONSEQUENCE ABOUT CLEANING OUT YOUR PEDOPHILE PRIESTS.....
AFTER ALL JESUS SAID IT WAS BETTER FOR SUCH LEADERS TO HAVE MILLSTONES TIED AROUND THEIR NECKS AND THEN FOR THEM TO JUMP IN THE RIVER!
"RESPECT" MY ASS!!!!!!!!!
I'm really sorry that this happened this way Melissa. You would have been a tremendous asset to the Edwards campaign and you should not have become the target of this hateful assault by the Right.
nuthin' but love shakes darling.
nuthin' but love and respect.
That's an truckload of dignity you've got there, Shakes. Let's see if we can get you to New York in time for the IRS van pulling up to Donohue's office.
And I'll suggest that any left-footers in the house place a call to their diocesan press office, just to get a nice on-the-record statement about the Cablenews Cardinal's notable quotables.
And yes, the large, loud whited sepulchre can kiss my royal Irish arse.
Shakes, this storm was coming one way another. You're strong, and your 'soul' is imperfect, yet as lovely and true as any outspoken whip smart pistol packin gal. Don'tcha think even Molly Ivins had her fill of it from time to time? Probably all the time (lol!), but you, like Molly, have shown tremendous class.
I don't always agree with what you have to say, but I often do. That's good enough for me. Fuck the fucking fucktards - not one real christian among them, so let them howl and slither in their own poo. Sometimes the rhetoric gets spicey and heated, but I perceive a wonderful, gifted person whose strengths gives strength to others.
The free exchange of ideas can get messy, but in the end it keeps the pot stirred.
Keep that skin thick, and know that you have to fight to be free.
slainte'
-skunqesh
(sorry if this multiple-posts, haloscan must be taching into the red right now)
Terribly sorry to hear about this but to me it was not unexpected. These foul bastards will stop at nothing and you obviously put the fear of bejeebus right up their evil backsides.
But no matter. You've done what you belive is right and that's enough for me and I am certain, the rest of the gang also.
You are still the bright, lovely person you were before and may you never change.
Hugs,
GOM
...masquerade as Christianity...
hey, there's a book there ...
Fact there have already been several and the best of the lot holy books that serve very well when digested, not cherry-picked ....
Press on regardless Sis ...HUGS
I'm really sorry to hear this, Shakes. You don't deserve the harassment you've faced.
I don't want to hear another motherfucking word about "civilized discourse" from you motherfucking trolls around here. You motherfuckers are gloating because death threats forced a good person to resign a job.
some of the same people that feel they must defend the likes of robertson and donohue have long complained about the "average" muslim's silence when a more radical muslim spokesperson says terrible things about other religions and other individuals.
there is little difference in the hate speech of robertson and donohue and the radicals of non christians.
me, i'm proud of you and i'm behind you all the way!
Shakes, your legitimacy comes from the fact that you are a blogger, one of the best. That is that.
I think Spudsy will be fine that I share with you what I said to him earlier today:
"Blogging is not what we do. It is who we are."
Friday night, indeed. I love you so much.
I don't know about anybody else, but I'm looking forward to Shakes getting appointed to Secretary of Health and Human Services in a couple years.
(I'm really trying to look on the bright side and not respond to those who would offer a single hurtful comment towards SS.)
I'm so sorry to hear this -- I hope the Edwards campaign appreciates what they've lost.You're a wonderful writer, and hopefully this will be, in the long run, only a very small bump in a long and illustrious career.
death threats, wow, what a christlike thing to do!
Maybe you can explain why you felt the need to malign a particular religion in the first place.
Melissa never did this. You're confusing her with Amanda.
You make a disgusting
attack on Christians
Again, wrong person. You all say this over and over and never provide proof.
cry like
a little baby about "Frightening attacks" on you?
You can dish it out but can't take it.
Show to me, please, one instance of Melissa ever threatening someone's life. Then this might hold water. Otherwise, you're just giving approval to death and rape threats. Very "Christian" of you.
Melissa, we're all behind you. I'm proud of you.
I'm really sorry that you felt like you had to go, but I respect your decision. You have to do what's right for your family.
The gleeful "Christians" are only showing what they truly are. Pretty damn sad.
there is little difference in the hate speech of robertson and donohue and the radicals of non christians.
Frankly, there is no difference. Robertson and Donohue are very much terrorists.
I'm saddened to hear this, Shakes, but I'm not surprised.
The terrorists thrive, and target people like you and Amanda.
Shakes,
Been following and wondering what you would do. This destroy mentality of the right is sad. To disagree with someone so strongly as to make them feel physically or emotionally unsafe for themselves or their family is what this country has allowed itself too often to become in this era of rightwing extremism.
I was proud of your role working for Edwards even if I was not certain he was going to be my candidate. I remain proud of you for who you are and what you represent. What you represent to me is an American. Don't let any of the ugliness sent your way in various forms ever get in the way of you knowing that.
I am honored to know you and glad you are Shakespeare's Sister, blogger extraordinaire.
STP
I agree that this is a win for no one, but least of all for you. That you should have been subjected to that kind of vitriol is despicable. I'm sorry it's come to your feeling the completely understandable need to resign.
The very people who will, mistakenly, crow with triumph over your resignation are the ones who should be most afraid. Sadly, they have set the terms of the debate, but they cannot escape them forever. There's just nothing good about any of this or the impact it will have on the future of political discourse in our country.
I know you know that you still have many supporters, but I'll reiterate it anyway and say I'm proud to be one of them. Not to date myself, but keep on keeping on.
I'm truly sorry to hear it, Melissa. I was hoping that you would be hired as Amanda's replacement and that you'd be able to do some righteous ass-kicking. You're a skilled writer, community builder, and all-around professional, and I think you have a lot to offer an employer. I'd hire you if I could.
However, if you truly felt that your continuing with the campaign would result in your being a liability, not a plus, then I can understand why you made the choice that you did, and I support it.
All the best,
Lux
Damn it, this whole thing is just fucking stupid.
I love how supposed "Christians" think that death threats and obscenities of the most vulgar stripe are the way to counter something they think is obscene.
I wonder if these people have ever actually read the bible?
That said- it's a sad thing for Edwards and everyone else when Bill "it's not bigotry if I say it's sacred" Donohue thinks he's scored a point.
Lots of love to you and yours, Shakes.
Shakes, I'm sure you know what's best... And I support you whatever you do.
But man, this whole situation SUCKS! I assume the emails you've been getting are similar to the ones Amanda's been getting... the level of hate some people have is just astounding.
i love you, shakes. your strength is an inspiration.
I certainly hope you'll keep blogging, if not, best of luck in all you do. In the meantime let all the so called "Christians" come out and show their true colors. Truly horrible people.
http://www.crooksandliars.com/20...aily-donohue-3/
O. M. FSM!!!!!!
I really am sorry - for you, and for all of us.
For a short while there I thought that you were right and that Edwards had what it takes.
Anyway - for the moment I know this has to be painful for you and you have my sympathy
Best wishes, O Sister of Shakespeare. At least there's one good thing about this mess -- we've decisively established that there's no connection whatsoever between misogyny and the beliefs of a certain radical-activist conservative-Christian fringe. And that's a relief to everyone, I think.
It saddens me that you had to give up an opportunity because of brute intimidation on the part of Donohue and his thugs. The culture of violence in this country and the tacit acceptance and perpetuation of it by the current administration greatly disturb me. I hope that someone in the Democratic leadership will come out and say that this type of straw man character assassination backed by threats of violence is not okay. But, alas, Rove and his chronies have been doing it for years. The silence on the part of Edwards speaks volumes about Edwards as both a candidate and as a man. At least you were able to extricate yourself with your dignity and respect intact. Good luck with your future ventures.
i love you, shakes. your strength is an inspiration.
Also the prolific-esque-ishn-ess of the writing!
I'm very sorry to hear this, Liss.
I'm sorry for the Edwards campaign, that lost two very capable employees.
I'm sorry for what this has done to the level of discourse in this country.
I'm sorry for the pathetic asses of the Reichwingers, steeped and rotting in their own hatred.
But more than anything, I'm sorry for the stress this has put you and your family under, and sorry that you had to be subject to such hatred and violence.
I do think, however, that your voice (and Amanda's voice) has not been and will not be silenced. Donahue and his ilk will reap what they have sowed. You and Amanda are heroes.
*mwah!!*
Tough break Shakes.
On the positive side though, black mass is back on. I can't remember. Is it our turn to bring the puppy for the ritual sacrifice, or are we doing the chips this week?
Regardless of all else, I just want to weigh in with my sympathy. This must have been horrible to go through and I hope you are doing well.
Ah, crap. That's too bad. As for the trolls posting here, this woman raised as a Catholic in a Catholic family in a Catholic state wonders where their concern about religion bashing was when their boy Bigot Bill Donohue bashed Muslims and Jews. One wonders where their concern over hatefulness was when he mocked sexual abuse survivors, dismissed rape, and bashed gays.
No--you see, Muslims, Jews, secular people, liberals, women, children (except fetuses) and gays aren't people to these folks. The only group whose fee-fees count is the right-wing fringe.
As a person reared in the Catholic church (although I admit it made an agnostic out of me) I still strongly resent anyone's claim that Donohue speaks for the Catholic Church. He speaks for a fringe group of haters and thought the Catholic Church has much on its conscience, or at least should have, it doesn't deserve being regarded by bloggers or the MSM as represented by Donohue.
This just sucks. I am so sorry you and Amanda came under attack from these hateful, ugly, cruel people.
Insofar as this has a good side, it will be nice to have the blog back again.
I'm sorry about all the fracas. If you have received death threats that is beyond revolting, and something I'm not the slightest bit surprised to learn.
They always do that, just like they did in Dixie in the 50's & 60's.
As a former choirboy and seminary student, in keeping with Donohue's sexual fixations, I can only conclude that Bingo Billy is a load his mother should have swallowed
You can delete me for being inflammatory, but Donohue should hear what an utter sack of shit he is coming from the mouth of another Catholic
I don't remember anything about the Sermon on the Mount including anything along the lines of "Blessed are the raging fucktards who spew ignorance, hatred and bile in my name" during any of the years i spent in catechism, parochial school or my brief period in a seminary
the dramatic shift toward sheer right-wing nuttery among the Church's official structure and many conservative catholic laypeople here in the US is one of the reasons i tell people that i gave up being Catholic for Lent one year and have yet to go back
By the way, why don't you take on islam or mohammed? you fuckin coward! they'd cut your fuckin head off! A picture of which I'd like to see!
Charming.
... there's no connection whatsoever between misogyny and the beliefs of a certain radical-activist conservative-Christian fringe ...
Nope ... none whatsoever. I'd laugh at silly troll comments, if it were not for my realization that these misogynists probably do have women in their lives ... that they abuse and belittle.
Yeah, firebird. Why, Catholics in the US are so oppressed by non-believers! Those Muslims who are secret prisoners and those gays whom the right-wing Christian fringe bash, those Black people and immigrants who are scourged as leeches, they got nothing on you, you poor benighted troll.
By the way, why don't you take on islam or mohammed? you fuckin coward! they'd cut your fuckin head off! A picture of which I'd like to see!
And that's not bigoted at all. Or potty-mouthed. How very Christian of you.
Are you a jew? You are a pathetic anti Catholic bigot!
firebird | 02.13.07 - 6:01 pm | #
Pining for Adolph, much?
Shakes,
We'll always love you no matter what!
If anything, I have more respect for you now than I ever did. Not because of any choice you made or didn't make, but because you have been a class-act before, during, and after this whole episode. I know you've never, NEVER endorsed hatred against any religion, you know it, and all reasonable people know it. That's all that really matters.
Oh, sorry, I meant Torquemada......
I second Pat G.
Shakes, you are pure class.
All -- Don't feed the trolls! Ignore them. Fighting with them just makes them post even more potty poo.
I'm sorry to hear it, shakes. Ignore the trolls. You don't deserve what happened to you. Tell us how you are doing with the employment situation. I recommend writing a book.
What a crazy world we live in.
Delurking to join in the virtual Shakes lovefest...
I cannot even imagine what the past week of hell has been like for you and Mr. Shakes with having to deal with the constant attacks from these so-called "Christians". How do they sleep at night? Have they no decency?
Please keep doing what you do so very well. I'll be here in the shadows nodding along in agreement and counting down the days until it's time for Virtual Bar and Friday Kitty blogging.
They have as much decency as McCarthy & Nixon did.
Melissa, I am so sorry. I'm sorry that you were subjected to such vicious attack; I'm sorry about the damage it's done to the Edwards campaign, and I'm sorry that you felt it necessary to resign from a position that you were so qualified to do and that you so wanted to do.
You have conducted yourself with the dignity of a queen through all this. I admire that a lot.
You still have all of us -- your Shakers -- and we are behind you all the way.
I'm so sorry to hear this.
I love how supposed "Christians" think that death threats and obscenities of the most vulgar stripe are the way to counter something they think is obscene.
I wonder if these people have ever actually read the bible?
Just the parts where God kills stuff, otherwise one senses that the Beatitudes really piss Bingo Billy and his Crash-Helmet Orchestra of Wingnuts off something fierce
You know what, Shakes?
Mean people suck!
You were an asset to the Edward's campaign, and I hate that you can't still be a part of it. Sigh.
I am sending good thoughts your way.
Actually, i wonder how most fundamentalists here in 'Murika can even actually call themselves Christians since they seem to live almost entirely by a handful of the more insanely uptight passages in the Book of Leviticus
I'm sad that you've had to deal with this hatred in the guise of religion. I really enjoy your work and wish good things for you. The activities of Donohue and his ilk, and the fact that they are taken by the media and by many politicians to be representative of religious people, is detrimental to both religion and to democracy. Their motivation is not the welfare of individuals (body or soul) or good public policy, but hatred and the desire for control. It's all very troubling.
I understand, though I think that you should print the IP addresses of the worst offenders so we can trace them for you. If somebody's death-threatting you, let the cops know -- and the FBI.
By the way: I've got Amanda's back from the clowns currently doing a DoS on her: http://phoenixwoman.wordpress.co...-the-whirlwind/
Let her know that I've got her back (and yours), OK? Thanks!
Last thing before i go off into the twilight of my own rantings:
If there really is a hell and if a bunch of us end up there, i take comfort in knowing that most of the people (like the Fallwells, the Dobsons, the Donohues and so many others like them) who are so happy to tell us we are going there will be right beside us whilst we burn
We love you Sis! Much support flowing your way from this red-stater.
Does it further your beliefs to disparage another's? What tenet of your fai[th] does that fall under?
The tenet of advancing reason and liberty by challenging irrationality, superstition, ignorance and bigotry. You don't like it, get a less medieval belief system. Otherwise, game on.
This sucks!
I was so jazzed to hear that Sis was joining the Edwards campaign. (I have been an unabashed supporter for months.) But now that we have seen how aggressively we can be attacked by those who want to hurt our candidates it makes one wonder if bloggers will ever get to go "legit" and offer real hands on support during our guy's campaign.
But let me tell you what I identified as a positive development from all of this.
The fact that they so aggressively attacked Sis and Pandagon shows that they are really scared of John Edwards. They clearly are having some trouble finding anything to challenge him on and so they went feral on his perceived weakness. It is somewhat pathetic.
Edwards comes across as an honest, humble guy, who admits his mistakes and demonstrates that he can learn from past missteps. He is essentially the anti-Bush. And he scares the crap out of the right wing.
So sadly Melissa had to suffer, and that sucks! But it also made the other guys show their hand. And it is all jokers.
Buck up Sis, ultimately you done good!
Just had to chime in with my support and good wishes. Don't let the bastards keep you down, SS. Just remember, there's no such thing as bad publicity! (except the threats, I know, but all glib aphorisms need a little stretching before they fit comfortably, right?) Who knows but that there's some excellent company/campaign/non-profit out there thinking "now there's a rabble-rouser we'd like on our team!"
Until they call you up, know that we're behind you 100%.
Dear Melissa: We love you and Amanda.
I hate this, why is he winning? We must make noise. They can't continue to be the sqeaky wheel getting the grease. MSM cannot continue this way. We need the fairness doctrine re-instated. Pandagon is down again. How can we fight back? I'm ready. So sorry you got caught up in this cr*p.
Melissa: Sorry it had to come to this but I respect your decision. I am old enough to remember the days when politics was not so vitriolic--agreeing to disagree and all that. It's pathetic that there's no such thing in the extreme right wing that passes for rational discourse.
Well, at least KO stood up for you last night in his worst person ion the world segment!
On the plus side, maybe the trolls will soon lose interest...
Shakes,
I'm very sorry to hear about the death threats and hateful attacks. Anyone who employs that kind of tactic is hateful and despicable. I'm also sorry to hear that you're going through a personally trying time. I wish you the best.
For the commenters here who conflate *any* criticism of Amanda (or Melissa) with the hateful response they've received from what I'm guessing is a very small group of cretins, please stop being so absurd. I don't suggest that the occasionally vile anti-religious or even misogynist comments here (or on Kos or T-bogg, etc.) represent the entirety of the "case" against conservatism or Republicanism.
Melissa made an appeal for responsible discourse. Do you all really believe in that, or will you continue to ignore *any* of the legitimate criticisms of those who are on "your side" because the "other side" is even worse? The "other side" is always worse, isn't it? Does that strike anyone as a rather adolescent way to approach public discourse?
So sorry it's come to this, Shakes. While it is a victory for the worst kind of right-wing creeps, it will also be seen as a victory for their Uebercreep, Donohue.
I've cruised through here a few times (hard time keeping up with Atrios and the rest of my life), but have always been impressed with your work. I was very impressed that Edwards thought to hire two of the best for his campaign, and am now disappointed that you've had to leave. Our loss. I agree that you should keep, record, and post the names of everyone who has insulted, belittled, spammed, or threatened you - transparency is a two-way street.
After all this, are you ready to tell your readers whether you'll still support Edwards?
Shakes, I'm so sorry. I can only imagine the extent of what you and your family have been dealing with and I can't blame you for resigning. I really admire the strength and dignity you've shown through this whole thing, and for what it's worth you've got someone sending good thoughts your way from (snowy, freezing, grey) Michigan.
I'll say what I said on Amanda's site yesterday: You and Amanda are the heroes here, and I expect both of you to land on your feet and continue rising to greater things. Keep kicking ass, and I'll never stop reading.
And people, every single time that Donohue or Malkin appear on TV, FLOOD THE NETWORK. Remind them, by telephone and e-mail, that they support racism, hatemongering, and thuggery. Force them to examine the thugs' records. Force them to tell America whether the networks support the thugs or whether they support America.
Malkin and Donohue both need to be hounded from public life, for the good of the nation.
Daggone it, I closed that tag!
Now might be the time to remind your critics about their glass houses, then flip them the bird.
Hang tough, and when in doubt, throw the chair.
Shakes,
I'm another longtime lurker who is writing to say how much I love and value your blog, and how sorry I am that you and Amanda have had to endure these incredibly hateful attacks. Although I'm not a Catholic, I'm married to one and know many Catholics, and NONE of the people I know would agree with Bill Donohue's rantings. These people speak for no one except their hate-filled selves.
This whole situation is just infuriating.
Bingo Billy and his Crash-Helmet Orchestra of Wingnuts
hahahahaha
I just called Edwards' campaign HQ and told them they lost five votes by not defending you from antisemites and misogynists.
None of these people are "Christians". They're slime.
Please rest, heal, take care of yourself, and get back to what you need to do.
Much caring from this long-time reader.
I'm so sorry you've had to put up with these asshats, Shakes. You deserve so much better.
Oh my FSM. Not only are you completely clean - making light jokes about Christianity is only a problem for people with a severely stunted sense of humor - but also your announcement is so articulate I wish Edwards had written something like it. Matter of factly. Declarative. Unapologetic. Snark-free. Politicians aspire to have the level of clarity that this post displays.
You did the right thing for yourself and your family. Chin up now. Hoosiers are tough little bloggers. Edwards is one of the good guys and he recognized your potential.
best of luck to you, marie
Sorry Shakes. Very sorry. You didn't deserve any of the treatment you endured.
Do you mind if some of us plot revenge?
You took the high road on this. Of course Malkin and all her warbloggers will continue to make this such a "non" issue.
Sometimes it is just better to be in the online trenches then in the actual campaign trenches.
Peace!
Jamie
http://www.intoxination.net
I'm so sorry to hear this. It's vile how the ultra right-wing feels the need to silence anyone who disagrees with them.
I think the fact that you were pursued so aggressively by the likes of Bill Donohue speaks volumes about both their fear of "uppity" women and their fear of John Edwards.
I'm glad he supported you. I do think he did his best, while getting attacked viciously from many angles.
You're right. Nobody wins here. Hate parading as faith is such an ugly thing.
Like I said to Amanada, let's start shining a light on the likes of Donohue.
I do have to say if Edwards can not address the issues that real people actually face on a daily basis, how the hell is he going improve squat?
I'm so sorry to read this. But I understand. It sucks though.
I want to offer my support to you and your family in this whole sordid affair. You have acted only with grace and maturity in this and for that I applaud you. The intimate nature of the bloggersphere is both an asset and a liability. One writes honestly and is often reacting to the kind of hypocrisy and vitrol that the far-right is so littered by, yet as such--honesty, speaking truth to power--is not "politic." As a divinity student in the South, I can tell you that almost everything that you have said (or Amanda) regarding the Christo-Fascists has been said by compassionate and intelligently minded students entering the ordained minstry (though, in our entrance interviews, we would never admit as much). In the halls of our progressive school, we can say what we want; we can speak truth to power or more often, speak truth to each other. If we were recorded in "Feminist theology" classes or "Ethics and Justice" classes, and it was played back on the national political arena, none of us would have a job (except among the most progressive churches, such as those found in the UUA or UCC), but certainly not as faith advisors to a presidential political campaign. So, here, in your honesty, you are called out by a bigot for presenting concerns that most religious people of conscience have. You haven't failed us, Shakes, we have failed you. I apologize for my ilk, for thinking that the congregations "aren't ready yet"--we said that about abolition, we said that about civil rights, we're saying that about gay rights. Enough, it doesn't matter if people are ready, what matters is honesty.
Bright Blessings to you and yours,
Shake n' Bake,
The Bulls approve of your message and your general awesomeness. Thank you for your eloquent position. We all know that the haters can simply and plainly eat it.
Hugs from another loyal fan of over two years.
These bullies must be stopped . . .
Oh, shakes,
As a longtime Edwards supporters, I was elated that the campaign got you, and now I'm feeling really sad that we lost you.
But these people don't "merely" lie, cheat and steal ... in their desperation to hold onto power, to avoid the foul hidden cesspools of their tenure of the executive branch being uncovered and pumped out, they really are dangerous.
So more than I'm sad to that the campaign lost you, I'm sad for the ongoing attack on the Republic as a whole. And committed more than ever to working to kick the radical right wing out of the positions of power that they presently infest.
long live the queen cunt of fuck mountain!
"And committed more than ever to working to kick the radical right wing out of the positions of power that they presently infest."
-- Blatant eliminationist rhetoric, Bruce.
I think the next time my uber catholic mother tries to get me to convert because she's afraid I'll spend eternity in hell, I'm going to tell her I would rather spend an eternity in hell than 5 minutes in heaven with Bill Donohue and his ilk.
Besides, hell's where the party will be.
this site is hillarious! a bunch of treehuggers whining about not being allowed to spew your anti catholic venom! your the same clowns that want to tell other people how to live, what to drive, what to eat, what to smoke, what to wear [seatbelts] meanwhile you fools spread aids and other std's! what a pack of losers!
As regards Teh Horrorz Of The Cursing Woman...
From "Musical Fanzine" by Team Dresch -
...swearing is fun, it's funner than piss, that it's stupid is a cruel and classist myth...
Finally, the long lost words, 'respectable discourse.'
Virginia, there is a Santa Claus.
Molly, there is nothing eliminationist about a progressive person wanting to remove radical right people from office. He meant "kick out" in the figurative sense, not the literal, violent sense.
-- Blatant eliminationist rhetoric, Bruce.
Oh, don't be ridiculous. Good grief, Molly.
P.S. I hope you will seriously consider filing criminal complaints about any threats you may have received.
I was so happy to see that you'd signed on the Edwards campaign -- it seemed like someone I really respected was going to be in an important position.
I feel so sad that these hurtful and viscious people got more credibility with the media -- it is so wrong.
BUT!!!!!!!!! I know you will be here and will continue to be a proud and vigorous voice for reason and sanity.
big hug!!!
Please save the threats and turn them over to law enforcement.
Thats illegal and they should be prosecuted.
And best to you.
"I understand that there will be progressive bloggers who feel I am making the wrong decision..."
Nope! I would have done the same thing. Keep on doing what you do! And here's for loads of success in '07, '08, and beyond...
Molly, if you believe that talking about people losing their jobs constitutes eliminationist rhetoric, then I take it you would file this thusly: "Catholic League president Bill Donohue called on John Edwards to fire Melissa McEwan today: 'It is not enough that one foul-mouthed anti-Christian bigot, Amanda Marcotte, has quit. Melissa McEwan must go as well. Either Edwards shows her the door or she bolts on her own. There is no third choice—the Catholic League will see to it that this issue won’t go away. The Edwards campaign is in total disarray and the meltdown will continue unless McEwan is removed from his staff. The fact that Marcotte had to quit suggests that Edwards doesn’t have the guts to do what is morally right. He has one more chance—fire McEwan now.'"
I recently started reading "Jane Eyre" again (after the new BBC production), and this text from Charlotte Bronte's preface to the second edition seems timely:
"Conventionality is not morality. Self-righteousness is not religion. To attack the first is not to assail the last."
You were/are a liability to the campaign not because of Bill Donohue or Bill O'Reilly. You were/are a liability and an embarrassment because you are a narrow-minded, profane bigot. Grow up and take responsibility for your actions.
Way to give up. Just what they want. We should all just turn over and show them our belly, eh?
Fuck that. Time for an armed insurrection.
So sorry Melissa. Its too bad one side has to be such bastards they run off quality people.
I have a suggestion. If this caused financial difficulty why dont you run a fund raiser? I know I would be able to contribute something.
Yeah, and with supporters like you, Roger, how could she not simply stand there and take a beating?
I just hate that these fake Christian bullies are under the mistaken notion that they're victorious. Assholes.
There was no "win" for anyone. It was never about politics or the left, right, or middle. It was much, much more than that.
Truth be told, I really didn't hear anything at all about you...nothing. I've only read everything at the other site. So I never hated you [why would I?] or even the other person for that matter. It just all... hurt.
This whole issue put a deep wound in Catholics, but that will heal. Forgiveness is the first step across the bridge and I hope to make a good journey across.
In the end, politics was never in the picture. Its about human beings and the way we treat one another. We can continue to fling around accusations, point out imperfections and terrible deeds, until we are exhausted, but where will that lead? I want it to be better than that.
I will pray [if that is OK? I don't know your preference] that you get a job that is a 1000 times better and that you have peace from these difficult times.
You were/are a liability to the campaign not because of Bill Donohue or Bill O'Reilly. You were/are a liability and an embarrassment because you are a narrow-minded, profane bigot. Grow up and take responsibility for your actions.
Ralph O'Neill | 02.13.07 - 7:07 pm |
Stop looking in the mirror Ralph.
You are a moron, Ralph. Why don't you point to specific so-called "narrow minded" views you claim Melissa has made?
We're with you, Shakes. And to echo the words of others, it's on now.
I dont think Ralph will take responsibility for his actions (i.e. commenting). But I do dare him to engage in discourse.
I feel like I should give you my condolences because hatred has messed with your life so badly.
I also feel like we all deserve condolences for the loss of your intelligence, wit and skill that would have been so beneficial to any campaign.
Best wishes for your future endeavors.
Melissa, I'm de-lurking to say that I'm really sorry about the entire messy affair, and especially that your family has received threats. I admire the dignity with which you've weathered the onslaught.
In my capacity as nobody in particular, I've declared tomorrow International Panda and Shakespeare day, over on my LJ and on Feministe and Feministing. I'll be sending a few sheckels your way, when I get paid—it won't offset any major financial hardship, but it's the least I can do.
It is a win for everyone. You got fired no matter how much you want to claim you "resigned".
Edwards will loose now, because he, like you, is anti-christian. Thank You. He is an idiot and so are you.
Lets see how long before you deleat this, you Whack-Lefto-Faciest.
Sorry this happened Sis. The pettiness of the so called moral elites knows no bounds.
Fuckers,
look it you morons....these two douche bags are anti catholic bigots, they would never have gotten away with bashing jews or blacks or other minorities period end of story. the biggest loser is the breck boy he is finished as a presidential contender!
Lets see how long before you deleat this, you Whack-Lefto-Faciest.
Wow.
Whack-Lefto-Faciest
So sad, it's funny.
firebird: Again, show me where Shakes has been anti-catholic. You all love to sling this accusation, but you never back it up.
Shakes,
No, I don't believe talking about people losing their jobs consitutes eliminatioinist rhetoric. I believe referring to people in language that suggests they are vermin instead of human beings constitutes eliminationist rhetoric. Look again at the quotation from Bruce. It was the "infest" that I objected to. He can call on the "rabid right wing" to be fired all he wants.
I think the real question here is:
Who monitors yours bevis?
You state that "This is a win for no one."
Au contraire, it is a win for those reasonable people who would not care to see Mr. Edwards' message lost in the background noise of foul mouthed juvenille bloggers.
Good riddance and good day.
Ms. McEwen, I don't know you. I blog locally in Maryland and tend to
But you have my respect. Anybody tells second guesses you, you tell them to go to hell. Any wingers come after you - realize that your very existence was and is a fright to their cowardly existence. You know this of course.
If you happen to be attending YearlyKos, it would be an honor to meet you and your erstwhile colleague Ms. Marcotte.
Best regards,
Bruce Godfrey
http://www.crablaw.com
You wasted your 15 minutes of fame spewing hate on befalf of a no-chance candidate, he will go down because of you. Nice work, maybe next life you will do better?
OH ..... but maybe they would have moved on in a while?
i trust your decision. i guess i just hate that it looks like they got what they wanted.
more power to you. be strong.
Even if I disagree with what you say, I'm sorry to hear you were the target of hate and violent threats for saying it.
I wish you the best, and hope the threats remain as empty as the minds giving them.
Just noticed Litbrit and Paul's responses, too. Again, it's the "infest" that is, in fact, classic eliminationist rhetoric. "Kick out" is fine.
sorry.
I tend to focus on local issues primarily.
I think someone needs to loan Philo 500 bucks so he can move out of his mother's basement.
Christian haters unite, your pals the radical muslims, whos politics are just as bombastic, are rooting for you.
Pathetic self-ritious hateful slimeballs.
paul i'm glad your boyfriend's ass is getting a brief rest!When you denigrate religious icons you are being disrespectful, Should i say to jews shove a tora up your ass? piss on your yarmulka? you know damn well what these two asswipes wrote it's public record, your an idiot if you need an explanation as to why we Catholics are outraged!
HA HA
Philo,
That's no way to talk about Christians. They aren't all haters, pathetic, self-ritious (whatever that is) or slimeballs.
Many Christians, if not most, are good and decent people.
Hey Bruce, need an address to mail the check to?
I will of course contribute the money to a Republican candidate, possibly a christian.
Havent lived in the folks basement since I joined the Marine Corps. Let me guess, never served?
It's interesting how you don't want slurs on your blog, but yet you won't hesitate to use the same modicum of decency in your own scurrilous rantings. I wouldn't vote for Kerry in the first place, but I would count this as a win - I mean, get real Because of you Kerry has no chance of winning anything except for maybe dog catcher.
Molly, you exhibit the same kind of behavior you complain about. I might be more inclined to listen to your "dissent" if you spoke like Nathan:
Even if I disagree with what you say, I'm sorry to hear you were the target of hate and violent threats for saying it.
I wish you the best, and hope the threats remain as empty as the minds giving them.
Well said. And thank you, Nathan.
Shorter troll, to a person: UR ALL THE FACIEST SCUM THAT EVER FACED THE FACE! BWAHHHH!! LIBRUL CHRISTIAN HATERS! JESUS WILL NUKE YER ASS IN HELL WITH MIND BULLETS, LIKE TOTALLY! BWAHHHHHH!
Words have meaning.
You can hide all you want behind the campy word "progessive", but in the end, you and Marcotte are nasty, bigoted, slutty women who hate men but have no problem using them.
Guess neither one of you ever had a real man nor want one either. I guess the kind of man who wants a real, decent woman, marry her and raise a family is a turn-off to women like you.
Have fun with the frisson of your lives.
Hugs, Shakes. I've missed you here, to be sure. Thank goodness you have such gifted friends and contributers here.
Regards and best wishes for you and your family. Senator Edwards and his campaign staff will certainly miss your contributions.
firebird: Again, show me.
I'm sure the decision to resign was a hard one. And I'm even more sure that the backlash you received must seem overwhelming and frightening.
As a Christian I am saddened by anti-Christian speech but I do recognize others right to speak it.
I also recognize that there are countless people out there who claim to be Christians but do not portray the behavior of one.
But, it's one thing to respectfully disagree with a belief or an issue, and completely another to do so with disdain, disrespect, and downright hatred.
Which way would you say you voiced your disagreements with Catholicism/Christianity?
Seriously, I'd say let's all forget the slime, but they seem to be growing. Of course, it may just be a few stains, overly represented because they tweak too damn much.
Melissa -
I will start by saying that I am a "cradle" Catholic. With that I feel I have to appologize on behalf of the majority of my religion for all the threats and such you have received. Even though many here seem to believe that is how all of us act and behave, it is not true.
I have also noticed that some here think that Catholics belittle women and think of Mary as a "second-class". This is far from the truth. Catholics have special days devoted to her and have a prayer called "Hail Mary" in honor of her. If you are a football fan, I'm sure you heard of it. We respect and admire her for her strength and courage to do what most of us could not. We acknowlege her by having people devoting their entire lives to her. They are called Nuns. Nuns are a far cry from what you see on TV and movies.
As for a comment on Priests. According to the Washington Post less then 1.5 % of approx 60,000 or more priests have been accused of child sexual abuse. 0.2% of athletic coaches have been accused. Between 3 and 12% of psycholigist have had sexual contact with their clients. (The study included children and adults together) According to the American Medical Association one in four girls and one in eight boys are sexually abused in school before the age of 18. In 1991 it was reported that 17.7% of males and 82.2% of females reported sexual harassment by faculty or staff during high school. In New York City alone at least one child is sexually abused by a school employee every day. One study concluded that more than 60% of employees at NYC schools that were accused were transferred to desk jobs at district offices located inside the school. I don't think I need to continue. This does not excuse any of their behavior. But priests are not alone. Please remember that the next time judgment is casted.
Melissa - once again, please know that it is only the few that are being hateful and hypocrites. The rest of us would never consider these things.
Melissa... I respect your choice in this matter, especially when it comes to family. These Christo-Fascist types can become quite brutal (and then they just do a confession and all is healed for them... they are again "right with God").
Down here in the deep swamps of New Orleans I will keep up my watching and commentaries upon those who insist upon forcing their wrong-souled beliefs on those of us who don't even care what they believe. It ain't our bag.
Morwen Madrigal,
Inter/Trans-sexed Woman, Lesbian, Trans-Feminist, Progressive, Libertine Priestess to the Goddess
firebird, I too would like what we in the real world like to call "evidence", for one. "Christofascist" is beautifully indicative of what you, Donohue, and other Christian Theocrats are. When you stop trying to make America into your Gilead "utopia", then we'll talk. Maybe. If you could stop sniffing your own ass fumes for just a damn second.
I find it simply mind boggling how many people can't seem to separate hatred and anger.
Jesus, you motherfucking trolls don't have anything better to do with your pathetic lives than gloating that your threats of violence worked?
Glad you are leaving. Take more with you!
Jack-
Check out Paul the Spuds post entitled 'The Human Legacy.'
Look for the keyword 'slime.'
Varmint, the women-hating stems mostly from the fact that there are no women priests, for one, that there are no women in the Catholic hierarchy (able to wield any power, that is) and that Catholicism tries to take away women's right to autonomy over their own body.
Having a few prayers to the good little mother is quaint, but Catholicism's actions towards living women is much more appropriate a gauge.
PS:
If its true you have received death threats, this is unforgiveable on both sides of the aisles. Nothing you say deserves death threats.
I'm really sorry, Liss, for both you and Amanda. I certainly don't feel you let down Progressive bloggers - I still feel like it was the JRE campaign which let you down (and you know how much, and for how long, I have respected the guy.)
This whole situation has rather soured me on Presidential politics - I think this cycle I'll stick with some decent, relatively honest, long-shot for Congress... or dog-catcher.
The majority of this country is Christian by their own claim. What did you think you where going to accomplish by turning on the majority in a political campaign?
This proves Edwards stupidity for hiring you, and the stupidity of "progressives" in general.
Hate filled propaganda, and suppression of the true Liberal agenda are Democrats only hope of winning the white house, and your canning is proof this tactic is failing already.
Dear concern trolls, especially the Catholic ones:
1. Melissa is a Loyola graduate. You really don't have to patronise her.
2. Since you've been sent by either the Catholic League or a right-wing blog, it would help to be in possession of facts, not spin. The blog archives are public: come back with some in-context citations at which you take specific offence.
Oh, and dear vile trolls: thanks for illustrating the term 'whited sepulchres' so well.
Nathan, check out this thread.
Look for pretty much any post by firebird. Thanks.
way to gloat, philo. we all know jesus approves of death threats.
On behalf of the part of the Christian population of this country which actually tries to practice what he preached - and who try to do so while spelling words correctly - I apologize for the filth being thrown your way.
Such pathetic little lives aren't worth your worry.
I have to admit I'm somewhat dissapointed, but as a longtime lurker (sometimes poster), I'll always respect and support your decision, and look forward to more posts here.
Wrong Philo, as usual. ZDidnt you get the memo? The hate filled propaganda is from YOUR side.
Peace be with you, Shakes.
My first reaction was "why in the hell is she quitting?" I'm sure it wasn't an easy decision and it would be wrong to second guess you. You felt like you needed to do it and that should be reason enough for anyone. Good luck.
Christo-Fascist - that's such "tolerant", "inclusive" speech from the the party of nice and diversity, eh?
You guys don't want diversity. That's such a joke coming from people like you.
Wait, didn't missy here just get canned by Edwards campaign for HER HATE RHETORIC against Christians? Oh yea, she resigned?
Shorter troll, to a person: UR ALL THE FACIEST SCUM THAT EVER FACED THE FACE! BWAHHHH!! LIBRUL CHRISTIAN HATERS! JESUS WILL NUKE YER ASS IN HELL WITH MIND BULLETS, LIKE TOTALLY! BWAHHHHHH!
That's not entirely fair, Jack. You forgot "ha ha you're guy Kerry is going to loose for sure now I hope your sorry now," and the timeless "I used to be a Democrat until just last week, but now that I've read the vile potty-mouthed work of these bloggers, I'm convinced that Shillary killed Vince Foster with her bare hands and that Obama trained in an Eastern death cult. You've lost my vote, moonbat."
Oh, and the misogyny. You forgot the misogyny. Not that it has anything to do with radical-activist conservative-Christian groups, of course.
Melissa, we admire your grace in the face of fanaticism.
I told them it was a mistake to give catholics the vote - but would they listen ?
Noooooo
My thoughts are here.
No Philo. Her post was a diatribe against hypocrites in the church. Did you even read her post? Thats what I thought.
Philo ...would that be the Philo from "Any Which Way ... you know the guy that slept with a monkey ..loser"
That's the problem: they didn't read the posts. They just read Malkin. if they read at all...
Christians who would make this country a theocracy are fascists. Christofascists is an appropriate term for such people.
Now, for those who insist that Melissa made anti-catholic/christian posts, comb the archives and provide some proof.
It's also helpful to consider this:
Catholic doctrine and Catholic religious figures are not confined to the purely religious/private realm, but instead are frequently used by their proponents as the basis for all sorts of political claims, arguments, condemnations, etc. Some Catholics even urged Catholics in the 2004 election to vote against John Kerry on the ground that his views violated Catholic doctrine. It is some Catholics themselves - like evangelical Christians and religious Jews and others - who have transformed their set of religious beliefs into politcal beliefs, even political weapons.
There is nothing per se wrong with doing that, but under those circumstances, there is also no justification for the notion that those beliefs should then be immune from the same type of criticisms, and even mockery, which is deemed acceptable when applied to any other set of political beliefs. I suppose that in an ideal world it would be nice if we all engaged in political discussions using only the most polite and respectful tone. But every set of political beliefs is subjected to the most intense insult and mockery, and those who insinuate their religious beliefs into the political arena have no right thereafter to demand that those beliefs be accorded some sort of special status. (Glenn Greenwald)
You guys don't want diversity. That's such a joke coming from people like you.
Are you shitting me? DOnohue, Pat Robertson, THESE ARE CHRISTOFASCISTS. The normal everyday Christian who does not wish to control other people's beliefs? Not Christofascism.
And, in all seriousness, I'll give up this very descriptive phrase as soon as your side gives up "Islamofascist".
Catholics and Christians will turn out in record numbers to quelch this sort of Hate and Liberal propaganda.
Nice work Liberal Idiots, you have caused millions of conservitives to get pissed enough to really care, We will be destroying your party in 08, keep up the good work nut jobs.
Ma'am, as a conservative I would like to offer my sincere best wishes. I am a strong believer in free speech and also in a divide between a professional and a private life. Although we agree on very little politically, I would like to wish you the best. Goodnight gentlelady.
I'm sad to hear you left the Edwards' campaign so soon. Please reconsider. Just a few more weeks and he would have been finished.
Nice work Liberal Idiots, you have caused millions of conservitives to get pissed enough to really care, We will be destroying your party in 08, keep up the good work nut jobs.
Philo | 02.13.07 - 7:48 pm | #
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. Thats a good one. Remember the LAST election dickweed?
sorry if this double-post...I do not know if my first one went through.
Hopefully there are no surprises here…our words CAN actually have consequences.
Or, are the things we say only consequential because someone else does not agree with our statements? Well, I guess moral relativism has things on track again.
What happened to the days where any criticism, no matter how “on” or “off”, was taken to heart and taken as an opportunity for the one on the receiving end to come out a better person. Oh, but that would be responsible, time consuming and productive, unlike all of the finger pointing going on in this blog/comments section.
Also, anyone using profanity and name calling in their posting loses ALL credibility in my opinion.
To all, I leave this – take a deep and honest look and the words and life of Jesus Christ. He really existed, He really was crucified and He really was buried and He really rose from the dead and HE really ascended to the heaven bodily as seen by many witnesses – all historical facts (Josephus, Non-Christian Roman historian even wrote about Jesus…hmm). God truly loves you and Jesus is the eternal Prince of Peace.
Philo ...would that be the Philo from "Any Which Way ... you know the guy that slept with a monkey ..loser"
amish451 | 02.13.07 - 7:46 pm | #
More Hate from the "Hate Party!"
Democrats, we are the party of values and responsibility, until you disagree than we are the party of we hate everything you and this country ever stood for.
As odd as this may seem, Philo... I think there are quite a few more people in this country that are more concerned with Iraq and other disasters created by the Bush administration than what is being said on a few blogs.
Good grief.
I am sorry, Liss, but I will tell you that you have my support with what you have to do to protect yourself and your own family from being terrorized. You have done nothing to harm anyone nor do you deserve anything but respect.
If you still believe in John Edwards then it is only a pay cut, and we all have our challenges to get our bills paid. I will be looking forward to your honest opinions on whether and how strongly you continue to support his candidacy.
A poll relased today said that more than 30% of "conservitives" won't vote for a Mormon for president.
Gotta love that big tent GOP...
I am sorry you and Amanda are leaving, but I understand. As a feminist, a lesbian, and a HUMAN, I wish you both the best of luck. I hope your talents and abilities will be well-recieved elsewhere, and even moreso, I hope you will continue to write... because God knows there is not enough discourse in this country, because it is too drowned out by the screaming right wing.
I agree Paul, but noone expects a bunch of hate filled Liberal Idiots to have a plan of any kind, Why are Liberals concentrating on Christian Bashing, and not on a solution to our international problems?
I think I understand the feeling of exposure the two of you must have felt. I am saddened that you feel it is necessary to protect your families and your hopes for Mr Edwards campaign. I am alarmed that the lunatic fringe is awfully thick around all of us with hopes for equality, acceptance and shared opportunities in this country. I look forward to reading your insightful commentaries with their passionate phrasing and colorful language (fer fucks sake!)
I hope that this may open the door for continued writing in other venues. And I am encouraged to comment more on the matters you explore.
Thanks for your hard and thoughtful work.....
I agree Paul, but noone expects a bunch of hate filled Liberal Idiots to have a plan of any kind, Why are Liberals concentrating on Christian Bashing, and not on a solution to our international problems?
You have GOT to be kidding me.
I will be looking forward to your honest opinions on whether and how strongly you continue to support his candidacy.
whig
Unfortunately, I suspect this has a lot less to do with Edwards than with those who threaten our American way of life, our freedoms, and our so-called democracy.
HA HA
Paul,
What are you on about?
This is the very first thing on wrote on this thread:
"Shakes,
I'm very sorry to hear about the death threats and hateful attacks. Anyone who employs that kind of tactic is hateful and despicable. I'm also sorry to hear that you're going through a personally trying time. I wish you the best."
The rest of my comment was a respectful disagreement with other commenters here who seemed to want to conflate the cretinous hate mail Melissa received with the entirety of Christianity and conservatism.
P.S. I stand by my characterization of Bruce's eliminationist rhetoric. It exactly fits the characterization of eliminationist discourse you linked to earlier. You seem to be under the impression that only "wingnuts" use it.
Jack-
Point taken.
Are you shitting me? DOnohue, Pat Robertson, THESE ARE CHRISTOFASCISTS. The normal everyday Christian who does not wish to control other people's beliefs? Not Christofascism.
And, in all seriousness, I'll give up this very descriptive phrase as soon as your side gives up "Islamofascist".
**************
Tell you what. I'll give up "Islamofascist" when your head gets lopped off while you're screaming "But..but..."
Now, can we talk about who exactly in this world wants to control others by their beliefs?
Morman religion is about a guy who read their bible from a hat. Hard to get behind a Morman who truely believes knowing where their religion comes from, but I would never bash them, I just choose not to believe what thay do, and would not vote for Him.
The hate mail and rhetoric being sent your way, in spite of a few poorly chosen or ill-considered phrases, is proof of the existence of a new breed of apathetic humans in this country. They are what one local Boston radio talk-show host calls the "Sheeple of the Commonwealth". Sheeple know no ideological bounds and, depending on their political bent, will follow whatever voice they feel leads them. But, all Sheeple have one thing in common ...they are led. I knew that something was up when I started to see all these young kids with huge rings in their noses in the last few years. It is both a reflection and an indictment of the adult society they found themselves born into. There is no exception with Christians - all it takes is a lazy mind. But, let's face it ...we have all been led astray by others a some point in our lives. Let he (or she) who is without sin cast the first stone. I'll tell you right now, I won't be casting any. My aim sucks
Yeah, I heard about your site through the Bill O'Reilly show. Sad, but my usual station wasn't coming in at all tonight (probably due to the incoming storm), so I had him to help me fall asleep at the wheel instead
Anyway, I saw your pic. You look cute and your writing is as good as Amy's (a friend of mine from MySpace).
For Christ's sake Molly, hang it up. Really. For Christ's sake.
(Yes, I believe in His words. Just not the twisted versions spouted by far too many.)
Now, can we talk about who exactly in this world wants to control others by their beliefs?
Dragonlady | 02.13.07 - 7:57 pm | #
Take that beam out of your eye before you ask others to take the speck out of theirs.
Well, it might get lost in the avalanche of comments, but I just wanted to express my support. I'm a regular reader, both Pandagon and Shakespeare's Sister are daily fixes for me, but I saw the actual blurb about your resignation on CNN tonight.
I screamed at the TV.
But in retrospect - Those that feel that these resignations are a "win" for their side are horribly wrong. If anything, this whole situation with yourself and Amanda has only strengthened my resolve. It has given me anger, and with anger comes great passion. I will try to use it wisely, but I might need a day to cool off.
I write a feminist column on a news site that I belong to. As of late, I have been tapering off, because I began to feel apathetic, that it was hopeless and a waste of time.
Following this whole situation has jerked me back into reality. My column will now be back up on a regular basis, and I will continue to fight the good fight. If I can have an impact that is even a minuscule fraction of what you and Amanda have done, I will have accomplished my goal.
Thank you for your blog.
take it underground. below blogdom levels. It will be a win for the thinkers and a loss for the established and unthinking.
Paul?
Liberal Plan? Not a do nothing non-binding resolution, that hamstrings our troops, or attempts too.
Your party has no clue, but sure would love to try and fool the world into thinking they do.
Sooo, when any Dem actualy has a plan get back to me, would you?
Molly, what I am talking about is how you always are complaining that people are not engaging in respectful discourse, and then you throw in this:
-- Blatant eliminationist rhetoric, Bruce.
I understand if you're characterizing his comment as eliminationist speech, but I find it a little annoying when you leap all over me for not explaining every single comment I make in excruciating detail, when it's apparently fine for you to do the same thing.
And I have never said that wingnuts are the only people to use eliminationist rhetoric. You also enjoy putting words in my mouth, which I find "disrespectful," to use your words.
I'm glad and I appreciate that you wish Shakes the best. What I don't appreciate is when you sling accusations and indulge in the same behavior.
First time poster here - long time lurker.
You deserve better than the Democratic party. Frankly, after what the party's become in the last twenty years or so - we all do.
I wish you only the best. Don't let the bile bring you down!
Philo: I agree Paul, but noone expects a bunch of hate filled Liberal Idiots to have a plan of any kind, Why are Liberals concentrating on Christian Bashing, and not on a solution to our international problems?
Paul: You have GOT to be kidding me.
Sorry, Paul, but he's got you there. Remember back in 2002, when liberals were all like, "let's invade Iraq and come up with a reason later," and Bush was like, "no, no, we need to find bin Laden and stabilize Afghanistan and marginalize al-Qaeda and split radical Islam off from moderate Muslims instead of attacking a country that had nothing to do with 9/11, however odious it might be," and liberals were like "no way dude, we wanna invade Iraq right now" and Bush was like, "no, we can make sure Iraq doesn't have WMD and we can keep Saddam bottled up while we focus on the people who actually attacked us," and liberals were like "no way times infinity." Well, the liberal idiots won, and now Bush is doing his best to fix things because he's the fixer-upper.
I am sorry you and Amanda are leaving, but I understand. As a feminist, a lesbian, and a HUMAN, I wish you both the best of luck. I hope your talents and abilities will be well-recieved elsewhere, and even moreso, I hope you will continue to write... because God knows there is not enough discourse in this country, because it is too drowned out by the screaming right wing.
***************************
And am so sorry you think that conservatives don't/can't relate to you in any way.
The tendency towards victimhood sucks on many levels. Doesn't have to be that way. Most people in the world could care less that you're a feminist and a lesbian and can accept you at face value.
Maybe that pisses you off.
Litbrit,
What in the world are you talking about? *Whose* words?
P.S. What should I give up, exactly? I've commented very respectfully here, even though I don't agree with everything you or Melissa or Paul say. Is that what you object to?
I'm so sorry that the bombastic Donohue won the day; he is vile. You guys deserved better, but the folks with the tinfoil hats are looking for a fight. Ugh, they are reprehensible.
http://www.salon.com/news/featur...02/13/kissling/
Bill Donohue vs. the world (especially women)
Frances Kissling, head of Catholics for a Free Choice, talks about the right-wing activist who forced the John Edwards campaign to part with one of its bloggers.
By Rebecca Traister
Feb. 13, 2007 | Frances Kissling is two weeks from stepping down as president of Catholics for a Free Choice, where for 25 years she has presided as a brash, articulate proponent of women's health, reproductive choice, and reform of Catholic Church policy.
But on the eve of her resignation, Kissling has had to watch the two warring forces she has spent her career trying to reconcile -- feminism and Catholicism -- clash once more on a public, presidential stage.
Long time lurker, delurking to give my support. I'm aghast at the comments I have read.
I hope against hope that at some point bigots such as those who pushed for your dismissal, and who utter such hateful trash as some of the comments popping up here recently, are denounced by Catholic and Christian churches. That would go very far in restoring my faith in religion. What evil it is, to reap the benefits of violence, hatred and ignorance while declaring innocence of it.
Don't give up.
Michael: My mistake.
I don't know if God exists or not, but if he does, you messed up bad, and if he dosen't, you messed up bad too. Your God hating candidate will go down with you. Hehehe.
Paul,
You're right. I shouldn't have put words in your mouth. I apologize.
As for my characterization of Bruce's comment, I didn't think it required extensive explanation. It was kind of "snipish," but it was accurate.
Act like you where threatened, that way it won't seem like you where kicked to the curb! Hehehe.
YOur Liberal friends seem to be buying it.
Oh, Shakes, I'm so sorry that it's come to this for you. It looks like we are fighting terrorism on our shores after all, and it's all home grown.
You have my condolences, my respect, and my support.
And that's fine, Molly... but now do you understand why I get upset when *I* say something that I don't believe requires extensive explanation, or I get snipish, and I get jumped upon? And then lectured on it later?
Anyway, I appreciate your apology. This whole thing is making me very touchy.
be gone....
you have the right of free speech but also must take responsibility for what you say. ha ha
be gone....
you have the right of free speech but also must take responsibility for what you say. ha ha
...said the anonymous commenter...
I just emailed the Edwards campaign yesterday congratulating them on standing up against that horrible Donohue guy and then saw the "just in" news on CNN about the resignations. Someone ought to send Bill Donohue a copy of The Christ Conspiacy by Acharya S. It confirms that the Jesus Christ figure is a cobbled together myth based on pagan gods from that area of the world. The stories from the New Testament are all borrowed from the stories of Mithras, Horus, Attis, Dionysus, Apollo etc. All of them born of virgins, shepards attending their births, disciples, bread and wine communion, ressurection, etc. etc. Maybe that would give Mr. Donohue something to chew on and he would leave the rest of the world alone!
I just BET you made the "decision" to resign. Regardless, I am glad to see that you are no longer associated with that loser, as I also consider you to be.
Take that beam out of your eye before you ask others to take the speck out of theirs.
druidbros | 02.13.07 - 7:59 pm | #
***************
Ditto.
You say it's a win for no one. I daresay it's a huge win for Edwards. Maybe he'll be able to skyrocket and pull in 3% of the vote now.
I'm so sorry. I'm shocked that a fake controversy was blown up to the point that you had to resign. It does reveal certain power dynamics in the mass media. The fact that Donahue is given so much media exposure is telling.
I hope that the tax-exempt status of Donahue's group will be challenged.
In particular - that statement posted by Shakes at 7:06 pm - it demonstrates that he is interfering in a political campaign.
Does anybody have more specific information on the regulations for the 503e? Who should be contacted about violations in these rules?
I want to know who (or which agency) to petition.
It would be very helpful if people with relevant experience would outline exactly how one could go about challenging the 503e status.
I am so sorry to see this happen. I wish you all the best and hope you will keep helping out the campaign as you can.
I hope that the tax-exempt status of Donahue's group will be challenged.
I think this is already underway.
Great 15 minutes of fame Melinda. Goodbye forever.
I am soooo, sorry that this has happened to you and yours. I was truly hoping you might stick up to those basturd but then of course you're right its supposed to be about the campaign not you and some wingnut morons. Truly I hope for the best for you and yours
Oh, Shakes, I'm so sorry. I am sadden by this news, I wish you all the best, and I completely support your decision.
Now, please excuse me...
To all you assholes who dare spew your vile at Melissa and the other good people who blog and comment here, just go fuck yourselves, then go look in the mirror and see what hate actually looks like, then go fuck yourselves some more.
I'm so sick of this crap.
/anger
Philo, your party has f*cked a nation, pissed the world off and still no one really cares where your dead winds up.
When you go around smacking people in the face with your bigotry what do you expect? A medal?
Maybe you need to really examine yourself and your treatment of others you disagree with. While you a right a right to your opinion those opinions should be based on fact and not be the product of a mind clouded by misperceptions born of hatred.
Otherwise you reap what you so.
Is there a single wingnut who knows how to spell?
Shakes. You need to take the threats to the media.
I write a feminist column on a news site that I belong to. As of late, I have been tapering off, because I began to feel apathetic, that it was hopeless and a waste of time.
Following this whole situation has jerked me back into reality. My column will now be back up on a regular basis, and I will continue to fight the good fight. If I can have an impact that is even a minuscule fraction of what you and Amanda have done, I will have accomplished my goal.
Thank you for your blog.
Stacy | Homepage | 02.13.07 - 7:59 pm | #
**********************
Bully for you! Fight that good fight!
Tell all the men out there how much you despise them for being men and how superior you are to them for being a WOMAN!
Excellent!
Let everyone know here when you are gratified that you've emasculated every male around you and they've loved that.
told you you awoke a giant. come on, you had to know this was coming, right Jack?
Philo -
It is with remarkable restraint that I offer you a civil response. You make a heap of unfounded accusations FOR WHICH YOU HAVE THE BURDEN OF PROOF. But you just refuse to get that. Fine. If you won't back them up yourself, I will assume you are fabricating them wholesale.
And then - then! - you have the temerity, the unmitigated cheek, to accuse Shakes of lying about the threats she's received.
You, sir, are a bully and a coward.
Yours, etc.
Erin Worrell
(Care to man up and use your real name?)
Ackerly you're under the misconception that people crawling between my legs and not respect me as a sentient human being to get their dead asses into heaven earns respect. It does not. Never did either.
Huffpost Bloggers are already documenting Donohue's transgressions, some that sh/could cause him legal pain.
I added their links to a comment at Salon, after suggesting that perhaps Salon should investigate Donohue. Other commenters agreed. The pattern is just too obvious. What secret hypocrisy is he hiding? Time for a series of in-depth profiles like the ones that relegated Dr. David Hager to the sidelines.
No one can/should blame you for deciding to resign from the campaign, but it really is a shame!
I hope that the tax-exempt status of Donahue's group will be challenged.
In particular - that statement posted by Shakes at 7:06 pm - it demonstrates that he is interfering in a political campaign.
Does anybody have more specific information on the regulations for the 503e? Who should be contacted about violations in these rules?
I want to know who (or which agency) to petition.
It would be very helpful if people with relevant experience would outline exactly how one could go about challenging the 503e status.
geoduck | 02.13.07 - 8:13 pm |
Pandagon has the details including a link and a form to send in to the IRS. But its down due to troll traffic right now. Try it in a couple of days.
Shakesis, hugs and best wishes.
As for the Orcs, Grendel72 at 5:43 speaks for me as well.
Isn't it interesting that NOW the Orcs are all for "civility", now that they no longer monopolize power?
Your lurid, vulgar comments relating to Christianity are completely pathetic and I hope you realize in how bad of a light such scathing attacks cast you in (from both the right and the left). I am pleased you were relieved of your position with the Edward's presidential race. Maybe he can win now!! Perhaps you and your group of far left radicals are upset with this decision but it is for the right reason. Your blog constantly ommits decency, intellectual integrity and maturity...all characteristics that should be emphasized in a presidential campaign! Good job ladies!!
"Bully for you! Fight that good fight!
Tell all the men out there how much you despise them for being men and how superior you are to them for being a WOMAN!
Excellent!
Let everyone know here when you are gratified that you've emasculated every male around you and they've loved that."
Dragonlady = Phyllis Schlafly?...
Your lurid, vulgar comments relating to Christianity are completely pathetic and I hope you realize in how bad of a light such scathing attacks cast you in (from both the right and the left).
Again, let's see it.
haha you look like some crafty-eyed devil hobbit and your counter-part/lover looks like some bad sex-change operation from the 80's gone horrible... haha you lost your jobs lololololololoolololol. hate hate hate hate hate hate hate christian right wing left wing aetheist you deserved it hahahhahahhahahahahahha
To all you assholes who dare spew your vile at Melissa and the other good people who blog and comment here, just go fuck yourselves, then go look in the mirror and see what hate actually looks like, then go fuck yourselves some more.
I'm so sick of this crap.
/anger
Creature
********************
Nice language and excellent, intelligent riposte. Not.
You're just mad that Marcotte etc. got called out for the consequences of their words.
There are always consequences for the things we say in our daily life.
Try calling your boss an a$$hole for starters and see how far that will get ya to see the point here.
It's all been said above, but best to you and yours. Edwards loses a great asset.
Donohue may not believe in Karma, but I'd bet it believes in him.
where else do you post Dragonlady?
Admitted drive by poster so take from this what you will. The dust up in the Edwards campaign interested me enough to direct me here and read some of your greatest hits. Lots of politics I don't agree with and some terrible mischaracterizations of Christianity. For the later I forgive you. I hope that those that are making you feel threatened stop their pestering of you immediately and feel the shame they've brought on themselves. May God bless and protect you and bring healing from whatever hurt this incident may have caused.
oh i got some vile to spew on these bitches faces hahahahahahahahah glad your beliefs carried you through to 'success' lol intelligence existing on a site like this? hahahah i wouldn't waste a secopnd correcting an error anywhere in here... hahahahahahahahahah you lost your job! I still got mine! and it's cause of what i believe, you lost yours for your beliefs hahahahahah suffer
I'm so sorry that you've had to make this decision, Shakes. You're taking a lot of flak for stuff you shouldn't have to, for little more reason than being a woman who isn't afraid to speak her mind. And that is, if you'll excuse the terribly course vulgarity, a damned shame.
Hang in there. There's lots of us who've got your back. And we can spell words correctly and everything!
You're just mad that Marcotte etc. got called out for the consequences of their words.
I am amazed that on Shakes' own blog, she is still treated as just an extension of Amanda. She is not. She is a separate person. Her name is Melissa McEwan. If you cannot be bothered to address her as her own person on her own blog...
Dragonlady:calling your boss an a$$hole
Did that and more. Kept my job.
Yours, etc.
Erin Worrell
(Challenge goes to you, too. Care to do this under your real name?)
Dragonlady:calling your boss an a$$hole
I told the owner of my company in so many words that I was sick of her bullshit. I kept my job. Does that qualify?
Yours, etc.
Erin Worrell
(Challenge goes to you, too. Care to do this under your real name?)
Sorry for the double post. Haloscan was acting funny.
I think this blog is under attack just like Pandagon. More 'tolerance' from the right.
One observation. This has certainly energed the base - ours!
This is a long cycle - someone of Shakes' talent and disposition will make an impact. Wait for it.
I am amazed that on Shakes' own blog, she is still treated as just an extension of Amanda. She is not. She is a separate person. Her name is Melissa McEwan. If you cannot be bothered to address her as her own person on her own blog...
I bet two-bits that these posters have not even read Melissa's quotes. Notice that they do not actually quote anything.
The conflation in the mass media of two individual people into one "liberal-blogger-woman" has been surprising.
Donahue clearly did not go after Melissa for religious reasons. He attacked Melissa because she is pro-choice and supports civil rights for all people, irrespective of their sexual orientations.
she is still treated as just an extension of Amanda.
More evidence that all you so-called Christians don't think of women as people. I blame your misogynist religion*.
* Statement made by ME. A former Catholic. NOT A STATEMENT BY SHAKES' SIS. Show you have at least a modicum of literacy, people. Just because you get snippets of the Bible read to you for easy consumption does not mean the rest of us are unaware of the tenets of your faith.
Shakes, my support is in the mail.
As Minstrel Boy suggested when this mess first broke, please consider a little contribution to Shakes. The buttons on the right make it real easy. John Edwards' loss is our gain.
With a name like Don a Ho, what do you expect? Until the conniving catholics clean up their pedophile priests instead of looking the other way, no one will have any respect for them. The catholic church is morally bankrupt and at the rate they are paying out pedophile claims they will be financially bankrupt, too. I can't wait. The timid catholics go to the slaughter every Sunday while another priest dips his wick where it don't belong. Nobody feels sorry for catholics because you picked on them. They made their bed, now they have to lie in it (with a priest). They are getting what they deserve.
Well Sis you made Yahoo News, which means all the cromagnon mouth-breathers that shut the forums down over there have made it over here. Might want to disinfect the server afterwards.
Sorry for your troubles.
And to those who threaten violence because of words, I don't think your god is very happy with you right now.
Your blog carried me through some very dark days when I thought my whole country had gone mad.
Your words gave me strength and the hope that if enough voices began to speak we could begin to facilitate change.
Your choice is just that...your choice. And I have enough respect for you that I respect any choice that you make.
May the wind always be on your back
And the sun upon your face
And may the winds of destiny
Carry you aloft to dance with the stars.
Dragonlady:calling your boss an a$$hole
I told the owner of my company in so many words that I was sick of her bullshit. I kept my job. Does that qualify?
Yours, etc.
Erin Worrell
(Challenge goes to you, too. Care to do this under your real name?)
Erin Worrell | 02.13.07 - 8:39 pm | #
***************
Ain't you special?
You called a WOMAN names? And kept your job?
OY!
Damn that sucks. When I read about Amanda this morning, I was hoping you would be able to hold out. But I understand - this is certainly not the way you wanted to get your name in the msm.
I'm sorry shakes was threatened (I'll be looking for the police report), but I think it's important not to twist the truth here. Shakes and her buddies berated the catholic faith. Don't they have a right to respond?
Malkin and Donohue both need to be hounded from public life, for the good of the nation.
Wally Whateley | Homepage | 02.13.07 - 6:31 pm | #
Yes of course Comrade Wally, all those who just happen to disagree with you must be dealt with for "good of the nation".
Sounds a bit Hitlerian doncha think Comrade?
I'm with you, Shakes. Looks like we have a lot of hatred to deal with in this country- and I won't leave you to do it alone.
Boo Hooo It's OK for you to attack and spew vitriol. But when others do it, it's evil, childish, vindictive, bigoted, meanspirited, blah, blah friggin' blah....
Ohhh, and BTW your little disclaimer at the top of this comment form SMACKS of CENSORSHIP. Where do you get off? You claim to be progressive and liberal, yet you openly admit that you will silence the voice of those who dissent in ways that YOU find offensive. You know what that makes you don't you?? That's right, a HYPOCRITE. The one thing worse than a liar. So you won't get to spew you propaganda and GET PAID by some slick trial lawyer. Well, I for one think the worl will go on.
Firebird... by all means, feel free not to fasten your seatbelt. Oh and those limits on alcohol consumption and driving? Ignore those as well... ummm isn't it your right go just as fast as you see fit? By all means exercise those god given amurrikkkan freedoms...Lets pray that you don't take anybody along with you
Lookingahead. Your comment was riddled with some "truths" about yourself. What happened to you? Who violated you? You are carrying some pretty twisted feelings about your molestation. You might want to get some help . . .
What a scary, depressing time we live in. Freedom of Speech is clearly dead.
I absolutely empathize with your situation. I almost lost my job because of posts I made on my own "anonymous" blog. The current caveat for the day: You are what you blog.
Character assassins like Donohue abound, and the mainstream media is more than happy to give them a platform to do their sniping.
Don't stop. Don't be discouraged. You have more friends than enemies. Believe that.
You called a WOMAN names? And kept your job?
Yeah, the owner of my company, who makes about 100 times what I did and could easily have fired me on the spot. The fact that she's a woman wasn't really an issue to me. Why is it to you?
Get over it little girl--the Edwards campaign is spiraling into the ground anyway. He'll be out of the race this time next year and then can get on with life, build his mansion in the pines and start the trophy wife search.
You'll have plenty of other lost causes to chase.
You're just mad that Marcotte etc. got called out for the consequences of their words.
I am amazed that on Shakes' own blog, she is still treated as just an extension of Amanda. She is not. She is a separate person. Her name is Melissa McEwan. If you cannot be bothered to address her as her own person on her own blog...
Lesley
********************
Lesley
Everyone knows that McEwan is a separate person than Marcotte.
They were fused together (unfortunately) with Edwards campaign blog.
That's all. Ideologically, however, they are the same.
Aparently you've never seen the left-wing hate spewed upon Michelle Malkin on a regular basis.
What double standard?
You called a WOMAN names? And kept your job?
Yeah, the owner of my company, who makes about 100 times what I did and could easily have fired me on the spot. The fact that she's a woman wasn't really an issue to me. Why is it to you?
Erin Worrell | 02.13.07 - 9:00 pm | #
***************
You're the one who brought up the fact/issue she is a woman. Not me.
Do you hate her for making so much more money than you?
Jose,
Prove it. Quote something.
Prove that you actually know what you're talking about. (Or did you just read a slander somewhere?)
It's interesting that not one (NOT ONE) of these trolls will quote Shakes.
Get over it little girl
Oh yeah. Not misogynist at all. We're reeling in the tolerant, even-keeled, master debaters here.
Ideologically, however, they are the same.
Even if they were, Shakes' Sis is not responsible for Amanda's writings and neither is Amanda of M's writings. And calling Melissa an anti-Christian bigot for calling certain people Christofascists, well, I've already said my piece on that.
They were fused together because they were women speaking their minds in places of a bare minimum of power.
No wonder misogynists like Donohue and not a few people on this thread will do anything to stop them, even lie and misinterpret, since women in power is exactly what Catholicism is against. Always has been.
hi guys,
do think the we sp's went a little overboard here, going after the catholics and christians????
John Edwards is a coward
...and is not worthy to be president. He could have stood up for your free speech, or he could have disowned you - instead he treads water to see what shakes out. Don't blame the right-wingers for the fall of these women - a true leader and statesman would have stood up against the right, taken them on if he truly believed in the cause, instead of his own glorification to the presidency. I would guess the resignation orders came from his camp, but the Lefties will never admit to that, because he can't afford to lose their support in the primaries. So cry me a river for how the right is persecuting you - more politics of blaming your opponent for your mistakes and the mistakes of your candidate. Just as he voted to send our soldiers into harms way, then recanted his stance when it was political expediant to do so, he has left you women out to dry. But quit feeling sorry for yourself - at least your life is not on the line half a world a way while DC undermines your mission (and let's stop blaming it on the death threats, too - you are not that important).
Again Jose,
Quote something that Melissa wrote.
Put up or shut up.
I say she's been slandered by people like you.
I did. When? I used a pronoun, as English grammar requires. That English grammar also genders its pronouns isn't something I have control over. Should I have said "it"?
And no, I don't hate her for it at all. You're making things up. She earned her money fair and square. But she was giving my office a raft of BS and I called her on it. The salary difference was just there to illustrate that she held a lot more power in that situation than I did, and could have made me "pay" for my actions. She chose not to. That's all. Had she fired me, as I actually expected her to, it would have been her right. But I said what I needed to say at the time.
Don't go away mad. Baby, just go away.
Hatred and vitriol? If half of what has been attributed to you is true (I'm too lazy and not nearly curious enough to check your archives), then I must say you need to grow a thicker skin, honey. As someone who likes to dish it out pretty good, you sure can't take it.
Everyone knows that McEwan is a separate person than Marcotte.
Then it would hardly have been difficult for you to address her by name on her own blog, rather than just as an "etc." after Amanda. Yet YOU did not. Not John Edwards campaign blog. Not any of the commenters here you were addressing. Take responsibility for what YOU did.
That's all. Ideologically, however, they are the same.
Even if that is true, and IMO it's only true in the broadest of terms (pro-legalized abortion, pro-marriage equality, etc.), so what? If you're going to refer to someone on their blog, common courtesy should dictate that you refer to them as an individual. Having similar beliefs as another person does not actually strip you of your own humanity and make you interchangeable with them.
Again Dragonlady.... do you have the guts to have others hold you accountable for what you say? Where else do you post?
LOL! Dragonlady, given that 50% of working Americans do not even like their bosses the whole emotional coddling has been an abject failure. Lies even by omission result is failure.
So what is it with "bosses" and the likes of Donohue that can not bear to hear, face nor deal with the real anger, irritation, criticism and yes even rage?
Look at you, you're having a tough time even allowing them to deal with their own consequences. Or maybe you're looking to exempt yourself.
No particular faith was ever berated here; wingnuts tend to read into things that really don't exist.
Anyone who says the Catholic faith was maligned by Melissa on this blog -- prove it. Show us the post. Let's see the actual words; otherwise shut the hell up.
Edwards doesn't deserve you after his less-than full support of you, Melissa. Here's to your future success!
Mixter
Anyone who says the Catholic faith was maligned by Melissa on this blog -- prove it. Show us the post. Let's see the actual words; otherwise shut the hell up.
Yes. I'm sick of this slander.
They shouldn't be able to get away with it on Melissa's own blog.
Put up or shut up.
geoduck, I'm not slandering anyone, look at her "saved" column, the catholics are not preventing her from speaking, their just letting everybody know where she stands (and her blog mates as well, even worse)
Hatred and vitriol? If half of what has been attributed to you is true (I'm too lazy and not nearly curious enough to check your archives)
Absolutely, 100% perfect.
"I don't know if what people are saying about you is true, and I don't care. But I'm happy to come here and sneer at you anyway, because I'm lazy and won't do my own thinking."
Thank you SO much for perfectly illustrating this whole ridiculous blowup.
As someone who likes to dish it out pretty good, you sure can't take it.
Again, show me any instance where Melissa has threatened someone's life. Then this might actually make sense.
I'm going to send a tube of parmesan your way- some cheese to go with all of this whining.
You people are pathetic. You spew all kinds of nonsense, maligning people who dare think or believe outside of your narrow, imbicelic orthodoxy, and when another extremist moron calls you on it, you get all righteous and weepy. Get over yourselves. If you can't handle the consequences of your hate speech, maybe you should find another hobby.
As for your family, they don't deserve the kinds of threats you are getting, but they wouldn't be getting them if you weren't such a pinhead, would they? Every threat is your own fault, just as much as the retards who send it. And if one of your family gets hurt, the criminal that did it is no more morally culpable than you are.
Jose, when the right wing of the Catholic church and it's followers learns to respect me as a sentient human being, we can discuss the whole respect thing. Until then an asshole is an asshole regardless of their religion and how they want to get their dead asses into heaven.
Hatred and vitriol? If half of what has been attributed to you is true (I'm too lazy and not nearly curious enough to check your archives)
Ha. Absolutely, 100% perfect.
"I don't know if what people are saying about you is true, and I don't care. But I'm happy to come here and sneer at you anyway, because I'm lazy and won't do my own thinking."
Thank you SO much for perfectly illustrating this whole ridiculous blowup.
As someone who likes to dish it out pretty good, you sure can't take it.
Again, show me any instance where Melissa has threatened someone's life. Then this might actually make sense.
Jose,
You have made a serious charge.
Quote the offending words.
Every threat is your own fault, just as much as the retards who send it. And if one of your family gets hurt, the criminal that did it is no more morally culpable than you are.
Sociopath, much?
Catholic bashing is horrible. I am a progressive Christian Democrat and think the kinds of things said here are disgusting. You have ruined Edwards chances for president with you ugly strident comments on social issues here. Using the C word is just unreal on a public blog. I am a liberal Presbyterian and find people like you are making it impossible for a progressive to get into the Whitehouse. Knee-jerk liberal is the name that comes to mind.
Shakes and her buddies berated the catholic faith. Don't they have a right to respond?
Where?
Go back and read her archives. You will find attacks on the hierarchy (& given that it is exposed as a group of pedophile enablers, if they didn't wear clerical collars they would all be in jail now anyway after having been found guilty of conspiracy), but that only means the faith is attacked if the faith is only the hierarchy.
You will find attacks on those who confuse Christianity with conservative politics, but that's because of the politics.
As your esteemed Justice Scalia put it just after having received Communion, Vaffanculo.
Concern troll, but at least she's using a real name. I think we've got improvement.
Using the C word is just unreal on a public blog.
Catholicism? And, please, all you supposed progressive Catholics out there, READ THE CATECHISM. LISTEN TO YOUR FELLOW TRAVELERS. THAT IS WHY YOUR FAITH HAS A BAD IMAGE. Whenever the MSM wants the Catholic perspective, they bust out Donohue and a couple of priests. NO WOMEN. Why? Read the Catechism to find out.
I am a gonzo blogger. 'blues' is known on about 40 blogs (but I sometimes use my "real" name. I say all manner of outrageous stuff, all the time. When it was announced that these two women were hired for some reason or other by the Edwards campaign, I simply took the position that it was foolish, since they should have hired me instead! Thereupon came a gush of comments about the endless train of wildly speculative, outrageous, even absurd posts that I have put up over the years. Damn that was fun! I just kept saying — "So?" — "those posts were really quite mild and diplomatic." Then people would begin to rant about why couldn't I perceive the incendiary nature of those wicked, if not outright demented posts. And I just persisted (tongue firmly in cheek!) that there was absolutely nothing the least bit controversial about those wild posts.It was all a gas!
I don't know the whole internet, of course, and I haven't been much aware of these Pandagon and Shakespeare's Sister sites. I don't know whether they find themselves in the controversial category, the gonzo category, or both. Quite apparently, they are not business jacket bloggers. So, political blogging being in its infancy these hiccups are bound to occur. However, I am not at all satisfied with these two women did their walk-outs.
I have been political-blogging for years, and I yet have much to learn. But If I had been in these women's shoes (I'm male, so it might be a tad awkward), I would never remotely dream of wining my way out the door, sulking about how some two-bit corporate media vassal slapped me around. Even if that was an actual factor (unlikely in my case), I would never express that. I would simply put out the explanation that I had come to a conclusion that merely lacked the necessary experience to advise a political campaign. (And I would give out this line regardless of my personal opinion regarding its true relevance.)
In political matters, the very first rule is to never, ever, behave like a whipped puppy!
I told the owner of my company in so many words that I was sick of her bullshit. I kept my job. Does that qualify?
Yours, etc.
Erin Worrell
I guess that she was afraid that she couldn't find another barrista who knew what a double decaf vegan soy latte was.
What kinda loser boss would keep someone like you around...Ohh I know the one who was afraid that you would reveal you lesbian relationship with her to corporate.
You are nothing but a bed wetting titty baby. If your boy Edwards had any balls he would have axed you himself. I do hope you get to keep your job at the local starbucks, we have enough deadbeat liberals sucking up all the tax dollars already. Next time I see you at starbucks mopping the floor I might even give you a tip, "DON'T MESS WITH CHRISTIANS, OR YOU WILL FEEL THE WRATH!"
Catholic bashing is horrible. I am a progressive Christian Democrat and think the kinds of things said here are disgusting. You have ruined Edwards chances in his bid for president with your ugly strident comments on social issues here. Using the C word is just unreal on a public blog. I am a liberal Presbyterian and find people like you are making it impossible for a progressive to get into the Whitehouse. Knee-jerk liberal is the name that comes to mind.
geoduck,
don't attack me, Im a fan of Shakes!
I just think we're going after holy/religous people too hard. I already gave you an example. We have to be less hostile towards religon.
Concern troll, but at least she's using a real name. I think we've got improvement.
Yeah. But she still won't quote anything. I'm still waiting for just one troll to actually quote the "offending words."
Just Once.
I'm still waiting.
[De-lurking...] So, I've been reading this blog for maybe six months now, and maybe I'm not paying attention, because I *honestly* don't get what all the upset is about. I don't follow Amanda at Pandagon, so I can't speak to that, but could someone, supporter *or* dissenter, please give me two or three of what are regarded as the most obvious examples of Melissa's alleged "anti-Catholicism" or "anti-Christianity?"
My politics are pretty well aligned with those expressed on this blog, so maybe I'm overlooking something. I should add that I don't consider critiques of specific political positions, even angry ones, to be anti-Catholic or anti-Christian -- even when those positions are associated with a particular religious doctrine. Misty covered this with the Glenn Greenwald excerpt. But if I have been tolerant of posts that were bigoted in the sense that they opposed a given class of people (as distinguished from a given political position shared by that group of people), I would sincerely like to be made aware of this. For instance, I thought Varmint's post was really salient and helpful (although I'm not sure that the relative prevalence of child sexual abusers among Catholic priests is relevant to, for instance, the question of whether the Church authorities dealt too leniently with those priests who were abusers).
Seriously: would someone here please tell me what is the basis of the accusations that have led to Liss's resignation?
Anyway, Liss, I'm so sorry about all this. You've obviously been subjected to some awful vitriol, the kind of thing that is well out of bounds in ANY debate. You and Mr. Shakes take care. You blog delightfully, and I will continue to read daily.
Forgive them Father, for they know not what they do....
(Dragonlady, Philo, Ryan, LordLobo, firebird, Jose, etc. I'm praying for you all. I know God will forgive you for the ignorance that leads you to cast the stones you have let sail here tonight.)
If you cannot stand the roar of the big guns, stay off the decks.
Peace.
Bosun
Tell all the men out there how much you despise them for being men and how superior you are to them for being a WOMAN!
Wow. Psycho.
Above comment was typed in by me, but was delivered by my Aunt Maureen, who entered the convent in 1960.
It is funny that liberals like Ms. McEwan enjoy being crude when commenting on others, but when the light of scrutiny is placed on their writings, they go crawling for the corner. The web created someone such as Ms. McEwan and now the web has taken her down.
Next time, Ms. McEwan, try to be civil in your discourse and you may find others outside of your tight, liberal circle more willing to listen.
Well I for one think we should take the Catholic Church leaders to task.
For protecting all those child molesters.
Katherine,
well, from what I can see - the "Catholic League" (Donahue's outfit) criticized Melissa for using the (C) word in a post in which she talked about the ironic, reclaiming uses of (C).
The "league" was also upset that Melissa said the following:
“The unmitigated temerity of calling themselves the ‘Pro-Family’ Network while they try to undermine gay families is just about enough to send me permanently around the bend. And what’s this bullshit about children deserving to be ‘in that relationship’? If you’re so bloody passionate about making sure kids have a mom and a dad, then surely you’re spending at least as much time and effort on deadbeat parents and trying to criminalize divorce for couples with children, right? No? Pretty much just focused on preventing gays from giving homes to unwanted children? What a fucking surprise…"
As I totally agree w/ Melissa, I'm rather shocked that this statement is "anti-christian." Since when is being for gay rights considered anti-christian by anybody but the far right?
AlFrankenIsInTheCloset
Anonymous ad hominem, thanks for playing.
Next time, Ms. McEwan, try to be civil in your discourse and you may find others outside of your tight, liberal circle more willing to listen.
I absolutely love these sneering, gloating commenters that are such fans of "civil discourse."
Really. I love 'em.
Cracker_Prophet | 02.13.07 - 9:31 pm
How about you? Where are your other writings so we can scrutinize what you have written and twist the meaning. And of course we wont quote you because that would show we really read what you had written.
Jose,
As democrats, we keep on an even keel and relize their are religous people in our party as well. let's keep the faith
BTW, I pulled that quote off the Catholic League (donahue's) web site.
And, I do hope people don't think Donahue represents most Catholics. He does not. He is part of a far right fringe group.
Shakes,
Now you can get back to the business at hand - this blog. Sorry it all came to this but I hope it is for the best (although I'm sure it doesn't feel that way at all right now).
Don't you notice that if you have people trying to pull you up after a tough situation, the right wingers will say 'oh boo hoo, poor whiny liberals' and hurl insults right & left. But if you talk smack the way it should be told the same wingnuts say 'what a bunch of profane juveniles who can't engage in reasonable discourse.'
Don't let the fuckheads get you down. Keep fighting the good fight.
"slanderyou | 02.13.07 - 9:25 pm"
Wow, is this the best the conservative movement can cough up to attack this blog? How delightful!
Anybody who got "offended" by any of the comments made by the two bloggers needs to grow up and get over it. Is your faith so weak that it can fall apart over comments made by bloggers? Give me a break.
Sorry Shakes, this seemed like a great opportunity for you. You're the best.
Karma working as it often does, I feel very confident Shakes gets the last laugh when all is said and done. May take a month, may take a year, but I know who ends up winning this tilt.
Rock on, Shakes. Your WORDS win in the end.
And by the way Shakes I sent some love your way.
"The web created someone such as Ms. McEwan and now the web has taken her down."
Nope, she's still blogging here and will gain more fans.
No doubt those on the Right NEVER bash people! *laugh*
Civil discourse, my ass.
You're just mad that Marcotte etc. got called out for the consequences of their words.
That's a mighty big 'etc.'
Like I said, the archives are public. Still, you've mastered the art of being condescending over nothing.
Well, to quote the great Simpsons: "heh-heh!"
Mike,
The problem is, the karma has come back to stun shakes a little. It's time back of the religous people and get back on message for social justice
Awwwww you lost your job as John Edwards Propagandist. I feel as sad as the day I learned that Joseph Goebbels died. Ohhh well you can live off the grid with your tree hugger common law husband and use your bicycle powered computer to post more hate speech against people who disagree with your point of view. Don't forget to whip out words like Bigot, and Sexist whenever you start to lose the argument on it's merits.. Golly gee I hope I spelled all the words right in my post as that seems to be the focus of so many of your friends. I guess that makes it easier to overlook the content.
Tell all the men out there how much you despise them for being men and how superior you are to them for being a WOMAN!
Wow. Psycho.
Stacy | Homepage | 02.13.07 - 9:30 pm | #
****************
Imagine that! A Woman telling another man such a thing.
Less hostile towards religion? What an ignorant thing to say. Why don't you admit that in order to be a true liberal you cannot beleive in God. Your goal is socialism if not communism. If you want that type of society please leave this country. Go to venezuela or russia or better yet cuba, where you can admire one of your heroes before he assumes room temperature. I am sick and tired of your attempts to bring this country down to the level of your ignorant and lazy social misfit lifestyle.
Love you, Sis. Don't let the cowardly bastards get you down.
look it you morons....these two douche bags are anti catholic bigots, they would never have gotten away with bashing jews or blacks or other minorities period end of story. the biggest loser is the breck boy he is finished as a presidential contender!
firebird | 02.13.07 - 7:17 pm | #
You are most likely the same kind of silly person who thinks that rationally discussing the errors in the policies of the STATE of Israel is being an anti-Semite. Or that discussing the plight of young black youth, and how society as a whole shapes their culture, sometimes in a negative manner, is an attack on black people. Or that rationally breaking down the past cultural perspective of, factual histories behind the writings of, or borrowed themes and ideas of a book like the Bible is an attack on Christians.
None of that is the reality of the situation. The reality is that the world is ancient, mankind has had to struggle (sometimes with nobility, sometimes with brutality) to make it where it is today. The world is not black and white, it is shades of grey. Throughout all of that history, one of many lasting truths is: A bigot is a bigot is a bigot.
And you sir, are a bigot.
(Do you actually think that taking the moral high ground means you throw expletives at, deride and otherwise take an aggressive, irrational stance? How laughable.)
P.S. Nice blog, Shakes. I've added it to my list of "must reads"
Are you a professional scold, Dragonlady, or is it just your hobby?
Who ARE these people? Where'd they come from?
Yikes. Do I go to Malkin's site and harangue her? Oh wait, she doesn't allow comments.
Never mind, carry on . . .
Shakes, I'm a lurker by trade as well, but just want to offer my support.
I'm sure you realize that people who are fueled by hate and hypocrisy will devour themselves in time, no matter how hard it may be to deal with right now.
Peace to you and yours...
xoxox
This whole situation is fucking bullshit. The right complains whenever we apply the "fascist" label to them -- whether it's jokingly or not -- but when they take your use of the word "christofascist" and use that for a smear bukkake fest to get your fired, Shakes, then these people are goddamn fucking fascists as far as I'm concerned. No fucking shame, these people have absolutely no fucking shame at all in what they're doing. None of these assholes have even read your blog, which isn't exactly a bubbling cauldron of hate speech. If anything, Shakespeare's Sister is pretty benign when compared to what can be found on their side of the fence. Protein Fucking Wisdom jumps immediately to mind.
If you need me to bust some fucking heads, lemme know.
It's too bad you quit as I think you probably represent John Edward's very well. I wish you and Amanda Marcotte both had the courage to stay on and show what Edward's is all about.
Your decision to quit because it would harm his campaign gives him the opportunity to hide his true colors and lie to the voters.
Unfortunately for him, the cat is already out of the bag and he is toast. Don't blame yourself though...he didn't have a *prayer* anyway...hehe
Yikes. Do I go to Malkin's site and harangue her? Oh wait, she doesn't allow comments.
I'll also find it very interesting to see if Malkin simply gloats over Melissa's resignation, or if she'll actually address the reason for the resignation. Something tells me Ms. "The Right Polices Its Own" will conveniently ignore the death threats, and won't be combing through this comment thread to pull out examples of "unhinged" speech from the right.
If anything, we'd probably get a "I don't condone death threats" milquetoast statement, which is absurd. It's exactly what she wants.
Dearest trolls:
Since I know you won't listen to a bunch of "leftists", I have a message for you, direct from your Commander-in-Chief.
Thank you.
Less hostile towards religion? What an ignorant thing to say. Why don't you admit that in order to be a true liberal you cannot beleive in God. Your goal is socialism if not communism. If you want that type of society please leave this country. Go to venezuela or russia or better yet cuba, where you can admire one of your heroes before he assumes room temperature. I am sick and tired of your attempts to bring this country down to the level of your ignorant and lazy social misfit lifestyle.
Bob | 02.13.07 - 9:39 pm | #
******************
Hey! Am on the same page here. I think America haters should just freaking leave this country like others do when they don't like their country.
Ironically, the same people here would NOT HATE THEIR COUNTRY with the same VEHEMENT PASSION if a Dem was President like Clinton.
'Nother lurker here.
Damn shame this whole situation (and shameful the conduct of those who have been hounding you, Amanda, and the Edwards campaign).
This country needs an enema!
Paul,
I'm a fan of Shakes and you, but I'm afraid america is speaking out. We seem....we'll...outnumbered
Dear Dragonlady,
Shut the fuck up.
Sincerely,
tas
Geoduck, thank you for your response. I would not consider either of those posts to be anti-Catholic, and I'm not sure why others do. They address political issues, not matters of faith or members of any faith as a group.
I certainly do not regard The Catholic League as representative of Catholicism, at least based on some of Donahue's statements.
As for the "foul" language, I am not offended by that sort of thing. If others are, I appreciate that; they are not the intended audience for this blog. Melissa's purpose in using the language she does is, as I understand it, for emphasis or to make a point about language itself, not to offend or deride.
So I'm still looking for any credible evidence of anti-Catholicism on this blog.
My all kinds of accusations of anti-christian writing and not a single quote yet. Wonder why that is?
Could it be because this fine folks like Ryan, Lord Lobo, Dragon Lady, Philo and others have not actually read anything by Melissa?
Instead do drive accusations and and get pissed when called on it.
You are all cowards. Lacking the integrity to even make an argument to back you comments.
Well, I for one want Dragonlady to keep talking, actually. She does make sense when she points out that the current adminstration and their lackeys create an environment where it is easy to see America as the imperialist aggressor. A person who wasn't so devoted to massacring diplomatic efforts in the pursuit of temporary insanity would probably alleviate a lot of this perception of America as an insane imperialist power. So good on Dragonlady for biting the bullet and admitting that her team is just downright wrong for America. Bully!
tas...nice come back...short sweet and requires no thought...brilliant
j swift,
I'm afraid Shakes is not doing most of the religous bashing, but her friends here (misty) has some really awful things to say. Us dems are suffering now....
I came to gloat, but I'm not going to. Reading a little...you know, made me change my mind. Just because I'm a right-wing conservative nutjob doesn't mean I'm not with out heart. Politics is a tough, tough game. Anybody close gets it splashed on them. Leaving to protect your family is a noble thing, and I respect you for that. There are crackpots on both sides of the aisle, would you agree? On the plus side, no one outside of your blog circle has heard of you, really. A little taste of fame...
Tastes like dried up salty anchovies. Good luck out there. And God Bless.
Hey righty, if it required thought then you wouldn't get it.
Honestly, Jose, I don't think much of America cares about something like this. I really don't think this invented "controversy" would be nearly as big as it has become if Melissa had been able to respond to her attackers. Donohue, Malkin, O'Reilly, etc., have been all over the media over this; where has been the support for the opposing viewpoint?
I really don't think this is "America speaking out," I think this is people parroting the only side they've been allowed to hear.
Keep speaking truth to power, girl. This Catholic boy loves hearing people question the church's relentlessly cruel attitudes toward women, gays, birth control and choice.
tas,
your momma.
If others are, I appreciate that; they are not the intended audience for this blog.
Thank you for that piece of common sense!
Are you a professional scold, Dragonlady, or is it just your hobby?
pseudonymous in nc | 02.13.07 - 9:40 pm | #
****************************
No. Just someone you love to hate. A woman who loves her husband and her kids and also works for a living.
Just your run-of-the-mill heterosexual woman/wife/mother Christian type that you despise.
Thank you for your voice of "tolerance".
Jose, I don't agree. even the more harsh words that Amnada Marcotte has had for Catholics and Christians are not bashing any individual's faith but religion in general and specifically that of the religious establishment.
Still dont see it.
No. Just someone you love to hate. A woman who loves her husband and her kids and also works for a living.
Just your run-of-the-mill heterosexual woman/wife/mother Christian type that you despise.
Actually, we only hate mouth breathers. Which means we have a serious problem with you, lady.
No. Just someone you love to hate. A woman who loves her husband and her kids and also works for a living.
Just your run-of-the-mill heterosexual woman/wife/mother Christian type that you despise.
Yep, I love that. "Lefties hate America and everything that's good."
That description, by the way, applies perfectly to my sister, whom I love with all my heart. Actually, I can't think of one person fitting that description that I despise. But feel free to continue attributing that to all of us, willy-nilly, please.
I am a progressive Christian Democrat and think the kinds of things said here are disgusting. You have ruined Edwards chances for president with you ugly strident comments on social issues here. Using the C word is just unreal on a public blog. I am a liberal Presbyterian and find people like you are making it impossible for a progressive to get into the Whitehouse.
Also, she's really upset that Shillary killed Vince Foster, etc. I told you this would happen. . . .
Hey, here's another good thing about this mess! Looking over the spelling and reading-comprehension skills of the trolls, I think I've finally come up with an answer to the perplexing question of why so few conservatives are college professors. Thanks, folks!
Melissa, I really admire you and you've definitely won a new reader (lots of new readers, by the looks of it). You've certainly given new visibility to this new McCarthy-esque era and while you've had to suffer for it, I think this could be a catalyst for some real change.
"Christians" and "Catholics" posting here in condescending terms about "forgiving" Shakes or "praying" for her to find enlightenment ought to remember that according to their OWN beliefs, it's God that does the forgiving and passes the judgment, so you can check your self-importance and, frankly, sacrilege at the door. You're just as much a disgrace to your faith as those making threats. It's a real shame that a faith with some genuinely uplifting beliefs is being hijacked and perverted by the likes of you.
Donohue makes a few rabidly anti-Semitic , anti-gay remarks and no one says a word. But you make a few that are critical of Catholicism, and everyone is down your throat. Someone hand me a bucket, I am about to hurl.
Just your run-of-the-mill heterosexual woman/wife/mother Christian type that you despise.
So true. I mean, none of us fit that description at all, and that's why we like to bond at the sabbat when we sacrifice all those helpless fetuses to Teh Chupacabra, lord and master of Teh Librul Heathens. That's just the way we roll.
I've got the buckedt right now, Karim, but I'll wash it out after I'm finished. Which might not be for a while.
Karim, thank you for the support, but please don't buy into the lie that Melissa is anti-catholic, or has made anti-catholic remarks. They don't exist; this is more of the same Amanda = Melissa nonsense.
But, really, thanks for the support.
Just your run-of-the-mill heterosexual woman/wife/mother Christian type that you despise.
You're making things up again. Please refrain; you aren't fooling anyone.
Get a hold of yourself.The Breck girl will go on to get crushed by Hillary without you.Then he can go count his millions on his 50 acre mansion.If you had a spine you would have made the Breck girl fire you,which he would have done soon enough because he also has no spine.You pose as a tough liberal.Real liberals are now cringing to think that egotistical ignorant schmucks like you have taken the lead in their sorry movement.You are a gutless chicken-bleep.And than to bring your family into it.YOU F------ LOSER.And this is a win for everyone who likes seeing morons make idiots out of themselves.Have fun stressing over global warming(oh sorry i meant climate change).A--HOLE.HA HA
"Just your run-of-the-mill heterosexual woman/wife/mother Christian type that you despise."
Yes, DragonLady thank you for including me in your bearing false witness.
Just so you know I do not hate the sinner I hate the sin.
The sin is that some Christians in this country arrogantly think that they have the right to stick their nose into lives of others, oppress them, demand that they live their lives by their mores.
That is not bashing Christians that is exposing social tyrants for what they are. If they are Christians well then that makes them hypocrites as well.
Michael Bérubé
I'm a democrat, please try not to be a snob. It's time to lay off the catholic folks.
And this is a win for everyone who likes seeing morons make idiots out of themselves.
And I have to admit, dude's right. All these trolls are doing a spectacular job proving how moronic they are.
Dear Dragonlady,
Shut the fuck up.
Sincerely,
tas
tas | 02.13.07 - 9:48 pm
****************
Well...that about sums it up for you, eh?
Just your run-of-the-mill heterosexual woman/wife/mother Christian type that you despise.
Thank you for your voice of "tolerance".
Dragonlady | 02.13.07 - 9:57 pm |
Dont assume things lady.
Guess neither one of you ever had a real man nor want one either. I guess the kind of man who wants a real, decent woman, marry her and raise a family is a turn-off to women like you.
Who let Jan LaRue in?
----------------------
Damn, Melissa, I'm sorry. You don't deserve this.
we like to bond at the sabbat when we sacrifice all those helpless fetuses to Teh Chupacabra, lord and master of Teh Librul Heathens
So true, Jack! I'm even wearing my "Teh" t-shirt right now.
Hey jose, why don't the catholic folk and the rest of the Religious Right lay off us? Why is it that these assholes can strut around and force their morality down our throats, telling us that we're going to Hell and burn for eternity if we support a woman's choice to have an abortion and the right of gays to marry, but the minute one of these nutjobs see that somebody is pissed off with their actions, sudden;y we're anti-them? Fuck that shit. They're anti-us and all the Religious Right has to do is stuck behind the 4 fucking walls of their church and we'd all be happy. They cause the problems -- it's not the other way around.
Dragonlady -
Quick question: why are you commenting here? You're not attempting to pursuade & you're not being friendly.
I'm not saying you have no right to comment; I'm just wondering what's in it for you. You're not just being a troll, are you?
From Wikipedia (for those of you who think Shakes made up the term):
Christofascist is a term coined by theologian Dorothee Sölle in 1982 to describe fundamentalist Christians.
"Christian fascism" or "Christofascism" is a term used primarily on the political left, as well as by some libertarians, to describe what they see as an emerging proto-fascism in the United States; such critics typically warn that action is needed to stop the possible emergence of a theocratic/fascist society and government.
Over 400 comments and not a conservative troll has come up with a quote to back up their accusations.
Also, JackGoff, I think I'm in love with you.
JackGoff gets all the groupies.
Over 400 comments and not a conservative troll has come up with a quote to back up their accusations.
That's because these brainwashed twits have never ever read Shake's Sis. All they knowis the smearjob that's been foisted upon them by Donohue and Malkin, and since they're nothing but a bunch of fucking sheep they and they're ignorance just dive right in.
j swift,
They won't ever come up with one, either.
It's all unsubstantiated character assassination, just like when Joe McCarthy and Dick Nixon did it.
Nothing's changed.
They don't offer a compelling viewpoint worth adopting.
They never have.
They only win by pandering to base fear.
Just like Tailgunner Joe.........
j swift,
look at some of the other bloggers columns... the sentiment and hostility is all around. I was looking forward to John Edwards making a run...now, it's looks as though it may be over. Oreilly is carring this every night now...
"Just your run-of-the-mill heterosexual woman/wife/mother Christian type that you despise."
Yes, DragonLady thank you for including me in your bearing false witness.
Just so you know I do not hate the sinner I hate the sin.
The sin is that some Christians in this country arrogantly think that they have the right to stick their nose into lives of others, oppress them, demand that they live their lives by their mores.
That is not bashing Christians that is exposing social tyrants for what they are. If they are Christians well then that makes them hypocrites as well.
j swift | 02.13.07 - 10:04 pm | #
****************
And your sin (if you think that way) is that you have the arrogance to tell everyone else, including Christians, how to think and feel.
Go ahead and bash on on Christians. Don't care really what you do. Not your Momma, your Wife or your kid. Thank goodness.
In the end, you have to decide the path for yourself and whether that works or not in the long run.
We owe Bill Donohue and many Catholic leaders much gratitude.
Here's the quid pro quo: Edwards career is toast.
Happy Valentine's Day
"Over 400 comments and not a conservative troll has come up with a quote to back up their accusations."
We don't need to- we already GOT YOU FIRED!!!!!
HAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHH!
Jose, go to those other bloggers and call them on it.
If you can't call Sis on it, why criticize her for what she hasn't done???
Over 400 comments and not a conservative troll has come up with a quote to back up their accusations.
Nor has Jose the Democrat.
Sorry to sound snobbish about this, but I do believe that people making accusations should back them up. I'm so tired of this right-wing moral relativism in which "anything goes."
And you're a wonderful human being, Shamus. May you find happiness and the source of happiness.
(misty) has some really awful things to say. Us dems are suffering now....
Well, hey there, I didn't know I was responsible for "the dems suffering". Damn, I should at least be paid for causing the entire democratic party to suffer with my off-color and mocking remarks about jackasses who use their religion as a weapon to control others' lives.
Or perhaps it's all those Monthly Anti-Christian Far Left Hater Buddy Orgies...
Sorry to sound snobbish about this, but I do believe that people making accusations should back them up. I'm so tired of this right-wing moral relativism in which "anything goes."
Tell me about it, Michael. IOKIYR -- It's OK if you're a Republican. Donohue makes atrocious comments about Jews? We'll mention nothing about that! Lefty blog says the word "christofascist" once in her blog life, well! That's a national fucking emergency!
It's almost enough contradiction to make one's head explode.
I can't believe you're playing the victim in this.
If those remarks made by you or Marcotte had been made by a "conservative" against a minority you people would be in lynch mob mode and it would be Page One news in every major paper in the country.
You got caught for views that were just as hateful, and hypocritical, and biggoted as you claim your opponents to be.
"The cup by which you measure will be measured out for you."
Just your run-of-the-mill heterosexual woman/wife/mother Christian type that you despise.
If you actually new anything about this blog, you'd know that the primary female contributers are all heterosexual women, married, and 2 of them have (multiple) kids.
But don't let reality get in your way.
You keep supporting Donohue and his ilk, who did their best to minimize the quite extensive child molestation problem your "church" has. Keep spewing your venom. That's what Jesus taught, right?
Also, I'd like for you to swear on a bible that you have never ever ever used profanity. That you never had any premarital sexual activity. I mean, we need to establish a level of righteousness here, so we need to know what standards to measure up to!
We don't need to- we already GOT YOU FIRED!!!!!
Wow, you're a complete fucking asshole. Congrats!
And your sin (if you think that way) is that you have the arrogance to tell everyone else, including Christians, how to think and feel.
Wrong!
NOT how to "think and feel", but how to follow the law.
All created equal, in a government NOT founded upon Christianity, in any way.
A secular government, where data and precedent matter, not dogma.
You got caught for views that were just as hateful, and hypocritical, and biggoted as you claim your opponents to be.
NAME ONE.
Jeez, how many times do we have to say this?
As Opus would say, I'm off to the tub. Actually, bed. I've had enough knuckleheadedness for one evening. 'Night, all.
If those remarks made by you or Marcotte had been made by a "conservative" against a minority you people would be in lynch mob mode and it would be Page One news in every major paper in the country.
Bullshit.
Ms. McEwan, you are to John Edwards what Ms. Lewinsky was to Bill Clinton...a means to his self gratification.
Now, go clean yourself up.
Dragonlady -
Quick question: why are you commenting here? You're not attempting to pursuade & you're not being friendly.
I'm not saying you have no right to comment; I'm just wondering what's in it for you. You're not just being a troll, are you?
Mike | Homepage | 02.13.07 - 10:09 pm | #
********************
Why am I commenting here? Well...I think by and large that most folks have a brain and can think beyond bumper sticker mentality and can see things beyond their noses, therefore the consequences of actions/behaviors.
Am I a troll? Why would you say such a thing? Is not diversity of thought a hallmark of liberalism?
Sheesh.
oddjob,
This is my party too, and the way I see it, religious people are welcome. Our tune has too change. JFK style.
Dragonlady, your being married, having kids nor being christian exempts you from the observation that some people will see you an asshole.
Dragonlady please don't assume that I count you among the those social tyrants. I don't know you at all. I do know they exist because I attended a fundamentalist Christian church and experienced it first hand.
Just don't include me in your despise Christians generalization.
Hang in there. This just cements what shills jerks like O'Reilly and Malkin are for the twisted right wing jerks who are trying to strangle this nation. Rock on, Shakes!
I do not like feminists, hippies, 60s generation or radical liberals due to their violent nature, disrespect of others, threatening people to whom they disagree, damage other peoples property and shouting down other points of view, oh and racists. I am white and my wife is Asian and I get called a Racists to my face with her with me by liberals. My wife is called a sellout for dating a republican by the "tolerant" left. Every one of those things have happended to me from and by the "So called" tolerant. Most of these actions were caused by a Simple bumper sticker of a Bush/Cheney. Now, I was not politicly active until my tires were slashed and my truck spray painted with obscene anti-bush statements. I am glad Edwards got wacked around by O'Reilly and now his campaign is basicly over. Anyone who trashes Christians and Republicans to get their jollies off will NEVER get my respect. I think Joe Leiberman is the only decent democrat left on this planet. I have a lot of money I spend and so far got 2 far lefties thrown out of office in my city and my movement is growing. It is your type of people that help my cause grow. So, I also wanted to thank you. Without you, my movement would be stagnant.
P.S. I do not believe you. I think Edwards fired you or at the bare minimun asked you to leave because you were a liability.
I can't believ that there are people who fell asleep in History class.
This nation was founded by numerous believers. "We stake our future defense on Divine Providence." was how Jefferson concluded the declaration of independence.
There is a bible embeded in the cornerstone in the Washington Monument(with numerous prayers within), and images of Moses all over the fascade of the Supreme Court, I could go on...
if Edwards helped provide legal expertise to file complaints against those who threatened you ?
Why am I commenting here? Well...I think by and large that most folks have a brain and can think beyond bumper sticker mentality...
Speaking of bumpersticker mentality, thank you for providing a great example: "Just your run-of-the-mill heterosexual woman/wife/mother Christian type that you despise."
Is not diversity of thought a hallmark of liberalism?
Oh, that's fucking rich. The right commits a total smear job against an innocent person then you, while defending it, stroll along and accuse of us not being diverse. You mine as well say, "Just shut up and take it, assholes."
You're a real fucking piece of work, Dragonlady. I don't know if you've noticed, but your side just committed yet another injustice and, well, it's personal right now. We're all busy being fucking pissed off here. So "diversity" can take a back seat while I tell you to FUCK OFF.
malichi,
I'm a democrat and sorry for what has happened to you. I'm afraid my party is being highjacked...
Try your brand of sarcasm and slash and burn on "niggers" or on the Muslim throat-cutters or on the queers riding the brown highway. None of that is allowed. But Catholicism, and Christianity generally, is fair game. John Edwards is a total fraud, and his 2 little blogettes deserve the worst that can happen to them. And, of course, Johnny boy and his 2 blogettes will get a pass from the NY TIMES and the rest of the media. John Boy, "man of the people," REALLY cares about poor people (feels their pain), but lives in a 28,000 square foot house on 50 acres. Fucking phony!
Jose, I still urge you to criticize those other bloggers since they are the ones that actually bother you, not Shakes.
What, exactly, has Melissa said that's beyond the pale???
Go, read, learn.
Be relentlessly, ruthlessly honest, not just with those you disapprove of, but with yourself.
That's the way of Christ, is it not?
As to the Democratic Party, I'm not a member, so its membership (which has always had mostly Christians of many, many stripes, most definitely including Catholics - tons of them) and what it decides upon, is up to you folks.
Dragonlady -
I think by and large that most folks have a brain and can think beyond bumper sticker mentality and can see things beyond their noses
Ok. Then why the crack about "run-of-the-mill heterosexual woman/wife/mother Christian types"?
Litbrit and Misty are hetero woman/wife mothers. Shakes is a hetero woman/wife. Aren't you engaging in "bumper sticker" mentality by labeling them with (hackneyed) stereotype-labels?
Am I a troll? Why would you say such a thing? Is not diversity of thought a hallmark of liberalism?
I believe I expressly said that I think you have the right to comment here. Isn't that true?
What I'm asking is why you WANT to comment here, since you're not attempting to bring anyone to your ideas, and since you're being decidedly unfriendly. Those are the marks of a troll.
Since you're not a troll, I wonder why you don't try to engage folks in a more friendly manner. Or if you don't want to be friendly & pursuasive, then I continue to wonder what your agenda is.
I don't go to right wing blogs to offer my (unwanted) opinions, because no one wants to hear them.
I believe you. Not all are bad but most of them in my city are really crazy. REALLY crazy I had to put up an expensive fence just to protect what is mine. I do not blame all, just those who trash my stuff just because of a bumper sticker or my beliefs.
Wow flyingcow, I don't even know what to say to that. I think I lost a few IQ points just struggling through it.
It's real simple math: 65 million catholic voters or one female blogger.
Hmmmm....that was a hard one.
You want to start with Jefferson quotes, chillindiscple? How about this?
"The legitimate powers of government extend to such acts as are injurious to others. But it does me no injury for my neighbour to say there are twenty gods, or no god. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg . . . . Reason and free inquiry are the only effectual agents against error."
Jefferson himself. Source at the website for his very own museum, Monticello.
http://www.monticello.org/report...s/
religion.html
I believe you. Not all are bad but most of them in my city are really crazy. REALLY crazy I had to put up an expensive fence just to protect what is mine. I do not blame all, just those who trash my stuff just because of a bumper sticker or my beliefs.
Bullshit. YEs malichi, I can picture it now... You live in a neighborhood full of liberals who are animals, I tell you, animals! They all voted for Al Gore, and they all hate you because of your bumper stickers. You even had to put up a FENCE!!
Bull. Shit.
C'mon, Mike! You know the real reason you don't go to right wing blogs to offer your opinions is because most of them will not even accept comments. ;~)
Thanks for commenting folks. Am going to make love to my Christian/wildly successful husband now. I don't f*ck for the sake of f*cking to make a political statement with my man.
Sorry. That's so...well feministically speaking...impersonal...and frankly...my husband prefers the fact that I love him and am into HIM, if you know what I mean.
It's Valentine's Eve.
Yowza!
Bye!
I can't believ that there are people who fell asleep in History class.
This nation was founded by numerous believers. "We stake our future defense on Divine Providence." was how Jefferson concluded the declaration of independence.
There is a bible embeded in the cornerstone in the Washington Monument(with numerous prayers within), and images of Moses all over the fascade of the Supreme Court, I could go on...
chillindiscple | 02.13.07 - 10:26 pm | #
!!!!!
OMG, have you ever read Tom Jefferson's Gospels???
!!!!!!!!!
Even back then people called him a heretic! Tom Jefferson was a deist. Do you even know what that is?????????
This nation was founded by numerous believers. "We stake our future defense on Divine Providence." was how Jefferson concluded the declaration of independence.
He also cut all the miracles out of his copy of the Gospels. So really, don't play the condescending faux-history teacher.
Am going to make love to my Christian/wildly successful husband now.
Have a good minute of pleasure.
Tas is a good example of Liberal, dishonest madman. Not very tolerant are you?
Yowza!
Bye!
Yep, professional scold.
Tom Jefferson's Jesus Christ was a man who did not rise from the dead!
Do you think that defines a "believer"???
!!!!!!!!!!
oddjob:
Did you see the piece in Harper's a year or so ago about the Jefferson bible?
pseudonymous in nc,
There's that snobbery we have to drop as democrats. It's not working...
Tas- If you had a few drinks one night, and were walking down the street when you saw a car in a dark driveway with a Bush sticker.... would ya?
Come on, would ya?
Hey Professor Michael Bérubé - aren't you the smartest person in the room, because you can catch spelling and grammar errors?
There aren't many conservative professors because they would rather make a real living in the free market than be subsidized like your non-contributing, lazy ass.
Tas is a good example of Liberal, dishonest madman. Not very tolerant are you?
YEs, I'm a madman because I use the f-word! Omigod, run for the hills.. fuckfuckfuck! He's mad, I tell you, mad!
Fuck off.
Have a good evening, Dragonlady. It's been wonderful being condescended to by you. May you know happiness and the source of happiness.
Yours, etc.
Erin Worrell
What a poor baby. You dummass leftists will be the downfall of our once great party. There are more people out there than you realize that want to see the party steer a moderate course.
But thanks, you and the other dummy have done the Nation a service by revealing what poor judgement Edwards has and thus eliminated him from serious contention.
Goodnight DragonLady, I was nice sharing barbs with you.
Though I am not sure why, you being a taditional Christian woman and all, are allowed on the computer to talk about politics....that is sort of beyond the female of species right?
It's real simple math: 65 million catholic voters or one female blogger.
Not quite so simple math, but Billie Donohue's Nutjob League claims 300,000 'members' -- one for every dollar he pays himself, which is nice.
That's a grand 0.54% of the total. Big whoopee. So account for the other 64.7million, wouldya?
j swift
you proved your own point. Let's be honest ...there's that hostility
It's funny, isn't it, that all so many in the Pro-Christ faction here tonight haven't grasped the simple concept of forgiveness. I think they may have missed the point of the New Testament.
Erin you missed what was right infront of it:"The rights of conscience we never submitted, we could not submit. We are answerable for them to our God."
And: October 31, 1819, he was convinced that the fragmentary teachings of Jesus constituted the "outlines of a system of the most sublime morality which has ever fallen from the lips of man."
Also you should read Lincoln's second inaugural address.
I think they may have missed the point of the New Testament.
maurinsky | Homepage | 02.13.07 - 10:38 pm |
Reading comprehension are tough.
oddjob:
Did you see the piece in Harper's a year or so ago about the Jefferson bible?
No.
I first became outraged about the Jefferson Gospels back when I was an undergrad. and a fundy.
Tas- If you had a few drinks one night, and were walking down the street when you saw a car in a dark driveway with a Bush sticker.... would ya?
Last fight I got into was in 5th grade. Loooong time ago. That should answer your question.
Of course, I find it funny that you assholes purposely come over to this blog to spit on us and then you're shocked -- SHOCKED! -- that you run across people like me who are, well, angry. You came here for a fight and you fucking got one, so stop complaining about the supposed travesty of the situation. If you don't like my rhetoric, then fucking leave. I was here before you, I'm going to be here long after you.
the Pro-Christ faction here tonight haven't grasped the simple concept of forgiveness. I think they may have missed the point of the New Testament.
It's the 21st Century, Maurinsky: the new, ass-kicking Christ. He doesn't turn the other cheek, he bitch-slaps someone else's.
I'm sorry. 69.1 million
http://www.usccb.org/comm/cip.shtml
Swear words do not make you a man. It says a lot about your charactor or lack their of. Using swear words to make yourself feel better about your pathetic life by "trying" to belittle others is sad. I feel sorry for your mom who probably still lives with you. ahhhhh where was Planned Parenthood when you mother was pregnant with you?
Naw, I think most intelligent conversation has stopped, this is just entertainment.
I had to put up an expensive fence just to protect what is mine. I do not blame all, just those who trash my stuff just because of a bumper sticker or my beliefs.
Excellent point. Remember how often Jesus urged us to protect what is ours! Stand up for your beliefs, good friend, however confused they may be!
I'm a fan of this blog. But I am sadly struck by the emptiness of your announcement re leaving the Edwards campaign. The simple and sole adequate truth-telling, which many of us still await, is that your comments were starkly anti-Catholic, and contemptibly so, and warranted nothing less than a clean, clear apology. I am Catholic; I am progressive; I am pro-choice. But you stepped not a little, but very far out of line, and what you committed is no less than hate. I so wish you'd say, "I'm sorry." And mean it. Thanks for reading, and blessings.
malichi-
Just when I start to like you, you dog others for being mean and then you do the same thing. Bad form man.
You dummass leftists will be the downfall of our once great party.
You know, of course, that trivial things like "the weekend" are the result of the radical leftist progressives of a hundred years ago, don't you?
maurinsky,
I wish you people would stop speaking for my party and liberal causes. We need to keep our eyes on the prize. Social justice for all.
"Chillindiscple" (nice moniker by the way), don't you dare presume to speak for all Catholics as if we are a united bloc on this or any other issue. Most of the Catholics I know are not young people who are obsessed with or even aware of the day-to-day drama of the blogosphere, so it's highly unlikely they're up in arms about this site...HIGHLY UNLIKELY. If they see this story reported on the bloviating hate-news like O'Reilly or on the MSM, they likely recognize it for what it is: deliberate distraction from the monstrosity that is the Iraq war and this administration's other crimes against humanity.
Unfortunately the Harper's piece is not online, but here's a link to the publication info. It's definitely worth the effort to find it.
http://www.harpers.org/
Newsstand...tand200512.html
Jose, which people? Irish Catholics? The niece of three nuns and one priest? People who advocate for the poor against the policies of the right wing?
Oddjob! Ha! I had no idea!
I want to be the first here to say, "Thank you for my weekend."
Malichi if you've got a problem with my mouth there are two things you can do:
1. Stop making personal insults against me by suggesting that my mother should have aborted me. (What happened to your "pro-life" stance, hmm? Haven't reached your quota of contradictions tonight?)
2. Fuck off.
Seriously, if you have the problems you express when talking with me then all you have to do is stop. Pretty fucking simple concept if I do say so myself. Now, as I said to another one of your bootlicking troll-fuck scum, the real reason you're here is for a fight. You didn't come here to converse with people -- you came here to start trouble. So don't fucking complain after you found the fight you so fucking wanted, asshole.
I think that's the problem.
It's become the trend to take swipe after swipe at believers and we're just suppose to take it?
Where's the line for decency?
Nathon,
You are right... Tas I do Apologize for the verbal retaliation.
It was mean and uncalled for.
I do Apologize.
catholicbornandraised
and no longer catholic, just hateful.
Would that be Roman Catholic then?
is that your comments were starkly anti-Catholic, and contemptibly so, and warranted nothing less than a clean, clear apology
which comments?
If the Christofascist shoe doesn't fit, then there is no need to be offended, my brother. I was born and raised Catholic, and I don't think it's fair to confuse criticism of the Catholic Church with anti-Catholicism.
And: October 31, 1819, he was convinced that the fragmentary teachings of Jesus constituted the "outlines of a system of the most sublime morality which has ever fallen from the lips of man."
Well sure! He definitely believed in a creator, but not the creator you believe in.
Claiming Jefferson as a Christian in the orthodox sense of the word is an obscene offense to the legacy of Jefferson and also to basic scholarship.
I wish you people would stop speaking for my party and liberal causes. We need to keep our eyes on the prize. Social justice for all.
Yeah jose, because we all know that Shakes was just oppressing so many people with her blog. ANd on the topic of social justice, did you hear that story about how two people had to quit their jobs recently all because of their political beliefs? Maybe you should speak out against that if you're as much of a fucking liberal as you proclaim to be.
Am going to make love to my Christian/wildly successful husband now.
Have a good minute of pleasure.
tas | 02.13.07 - 10:34 pm | #
**************
Hours, darling. ~
Bye now.
Aside from the fact that you appear to have money, some political clout in local politics and fence to keep out all the unwashed....why is again that I should care about anything you type here?
(And don't bother to bring up Jefferson's quote about how he thought of himself as a Christian. He in that very quote qualifies that belief to something no orthodox Christian would ever accept as a legitimate statement of faith.)
Im being repressed, look at the violence inherit in the system!
I don't care what he believed, it's enough that he believed; but to classify him and other Founding Fathers as secular non-believers is false.
chillindiscpl - why sweat the criticisms of non-believers? Either they are wrong and they'll burn in hell, or they're right and we'll all just die and be wormfood. It's a weak faith that can't take a swipe now and again.
oops my last comment was direct to Malichi
Hours, darling.
Woah, you're back already! How expectedly quick!
chillindiscple: Erin you missed what was right infront of it
Nope. Didn't miss it. But it's not important. Jefferson believed in God, this is true, but he did not demand it of other people. That's my point. It doesn't matter that the Founders were themselves were largely some form of Christian. They founded this country on the Enlightenment principles of reason. Read the last sentence again. "Reason and intellectual inquiry...." That's how were were to avoid error, not God.
And his idea of Christianity would probably be called heresy by Mr. Donohue, for the record.
I wish you people would stop speaking for my party and liberal causes. We need to keep our eyes on the prize. Social justice for all.
!
Except homosexuals and women, of course!
Tas
It was not because of their political belief, they can say whatever they want. What they said was offensive to 80% of the country and Edwards needs all the votes he can get. So, Edwards silenced her because she was a liability to Edwards chances to get the Democrat Nominee. A Democrat silenced a democrat in this matter.
Would that be Roman Catholic then?
Yes.
maurinsky,
" It's a weak faith that can't take a swipe now and again."
and their allowed to call you on it as well.....
your comments were starkly anti-Catholic, and contemptibly so, and warranted nothing less than a clean, clear apology.
Which comments were those, then?
C'mon, deliver the goods with your scolding.
and no longer catholic, just hateful.
Who made you Pope, Jose?
Hours, darling. ~
Bye now.
Dragonlady | 02.13.07 - 10:48 pm |
Yeah, shes using the GOOD batteries tonight!
j-swift
It does not matter if you care about what I write or not. I am very comfortable with my salary and that is none of your concern. I am just expressing my opinion with regards to specific issues that catch my attention. Thats all. You do not have to respond to my posts.
I have it: JPII took out all of the pages of Matthew 7 out of every Bible in the world as a last minute "miracle". What a kidder.
No, catholics work harder for reconciliation of faith traditions compared to any other belief system i.e. the Pope in Turkey.
This church is not the same church as in Jefferson's time.
Fine Malchi, I'll get you fired for being a dick. Then I'll claim that you're offensive to 80% of the entire known universe (hey, two can pull figures out of their ass in this game) thus making my actions completely fair.
Where do you work again?
druidbros ---pig
I feel sorry for SS only to the extent that 90% of the offensive commentary actually came from Amanda, but SS got hit with the same level of ire regardless.
I struggle with my christianity, it's an uneasy walk I can't put into words.
One thing I do get, is the bible states god made us the way he did to allow freedom of choice. He could have made robots to serve him, but he offered us the chance to live and learn, make choices, even the ones detrimental to us.
I've tried to wrap my head around the church's influence in politics, and I keep coming back to the overall design of things- freedom to make decisions, even ones considered sinful.
It could be argued that when we try to take away that option, we are stepping beyond the creator himself.
but to classify him and other Founding Fathers as secular non-believers is false.
The Founding Fathers mainly believed in the tradition of being seen to go to church. And plenty had no truck with an interventionist creator. If they'd wanted your ideal of a Christian nation, they really did have plenty of models to follow. Funny, that.
STFU Jose. Not talking to you.
Tas, In a poll that was taken 80% of the participants were self-identified Christian/Catholic. It was not an arbitrary number.
Uh, Jose, Dragonlady was the one who introduced the topic of sex. But I guess Republicans can't be pigs, right? Oh, wait a second, you're a "liberal." I'm sorry, my mistake. I promise not to call you a dick again. Whoops! Where did that come from? Well, have fun at the Walking Contradictions meeting. Ta ta!
This church is not the same church as in Jefferson's time.
What's your point? If we're discussing the Founders' beliefs, then we need to deal with the church that existed at their time. That's the church they would have adhered to, if any.
Despite the large number of orcs--and some actual conservatives--on this thread, remember that if they actually WERE the majority, Commander Codpiece's approval ratings would not be hovering in Nixon-during-Watergate territory.
Tas
P.S. You cannot get me fired. I am a Real Estate Investor. Self-Employed simply put.
Tas, In a poll that was taken 80% of the participants were self-identified Christian/Catholic. It was not an arbitrary number.
So using your, uhm, "logic" Malichi, anyone who has an opinion that goes against their beliefs should be fired for being "insulting."
So how does this prove that Shakes was wrong to mention the word "christofascists" as an assessment of these assholes?
I hate to be judgmental so I'll just say this: NCgo to the library and do some reading in history before you open your mouth about it.
malichi,
tas doesn't understand, he lives off of your tax dollars...
Tas
Like I said. Edwards ONLY cared about the Presidency and the power that came along with that position. If Edwards REALLY cared about freedom of opinion rather than raw power, she should still be on his payroll today.
Wow Jose, and here I thought I was employed. Who knew! Thank you for showing me the light through your stereotypes.
Unless you think she's a liar, she stepped down.
Jose,
That may be true, but he us still entitled to his opinion and I do respect the opinions of others, unlike Tas. But that is what the difference is between Radical Liberals and Christian Conservatives
tas, you are mad at the wrong people - edwards is the real stinker in this mess. This "white, sticky" mess. much like the mess Bill Clinton left on Al Gore. I'm just sorry Edwards spunked too early before he could soak up and waste some of the money that will now end up in Barry Hussein Obama's warchest.
Malchi, I don't know if you've noticed (probably not since reading doesn't seem to be your strong suit; example a: you're insulting a blogger whose blog you haven't even read) but Shakes wasn't fired by Edwards. She resigned because of the pressure put on her by assholes like you, breathing down her neck because you can't take the fact that she has an opinion different from your own.
You people are unfuckingbelievable.
Peter , why go there? It gives other conservatives a bad name.
That may be true, but he us still entitled to his opinion and I do respect the opinions of others, unlike Tas.
Oh fucking blow me. You respect other people's opinions so much that you're here to celebrate one somebody loses her job because of her opinions. Fuck the hell off you fucking hypocrite.
Shakes: I admire your grace and poise during this time. You have shown much more so-called "christian" behavior than these ignorant jack asses that continue to attack you in a very "unchristian" way.
I left Catholicism because of its continued backwards approach towards women. In my family I saw 3 generations of women who were told by priests to simply accept the abusive behavior of their husbands and to try and work on improving themselves. The cycle of abuse stopped when the women stopped believing they had to continue in a faith that has no respect for them as human beings.
Peace to you and your family. You do inspire.
Illegitmus non carborundum. And yes you are better than them.
I don't care what he believed, it's enough that he believed; but to classify him and other Founding Fathers as secular non-believers is false.
Correct, but to state that you don't care what he believed is to utterly destroy any legitimacy you might have on the matter.
If you paid attention to what he believed, and if you yourself are an orthodox Christian, there's simply no way whatsoever that you would ever call him "Christian".
A believer in God?
Yes, absolutely, but no God a Christian would ever acknowledge.
Tas-
What's unbelieveable is that her and you and others like you keep feeding this vitriol. Because of comments like hers we can't have civil conversations, everything has to be about emotion instead of reason.
McEwing and Ann Coulter are just two peas on opposite sides of the pod.
Lots of love and support out here in lurkerland for you!
Bigg, you're just one big rightwing smear machine, aren't you? Have you ever thought of an opinion on your own, without Malkin holding your hand?
What's unbelieveable is that her and you and others like you keep feeding this vitriol. Because of comments like hers we can't have civil conversations, everything has to be about emotion instead of reason.
Oh yeah, because you came here for the conversation. Fuck you. Like I've stated before to you trolls: you came here looking for a fight. You got one. Stop fucking complaining.
Oddjob-
If Thomas Jefferson believed Jesus was the son of god, he would be a christian. Did he?
There will be some good coming out of this sad event. While religious intolerance in never acceptable. In this case it was worth it to show America just how stupid John Edwards is.
Thank You
Tas-
Your a disgrace to the left-wing cause.
pilotweed -
was never a catholic
Tas,
You cannot let pressure tear you down. What does that say about the charactor of the person to silence themselves because of a little heat. Political leaders go through this kind of stuff all day long, why cant a blogger do the same.
P.S. If she wants to Rip into Christians under the 1st Amendment of the Constitution then she had Better be prepared for others to express their OUTRAGE with the protecting of the 1st Amendment. The 1st Amendment does not say one side can trash another without verbal retaliation. If she can dish it out, she had better be prepared to take some of it. Michelle Malkin, and Ann Coulter take shots ALL DAY LONG from Hundreds of THOUSANDS more people than Shakes and do not cry under their desks because people are breathing down their necks. Michelle and Ann stand up and strike back.
McEwing and Ann Coulter are just two peas on opposite sides of the pod.
chillindiscple | 02.13.07 - 11:08 pm |
Not quite....
Your a disgrace to the left-wing cause.
Thank you Juan Williams. Now shut the fuck up.
Beautifully put Malichi!
Nathan,
No. He didn't.
"He also rejected the idea of the divinity of Christ..."
Again, from the Monticello website.
http://www.monticello.org/report...s/
religion.html
Good point Malichi. Maybe thats why Coulter and Malkin speak for their party and not a specific campaign.
Shakes,
Long-time lurker, and an admirer of yours.
I'm so sorry for what you've had to endure. You've handled yourself with total class, and having worked on several presidential campaigns, I understand why you resigned.
As you can see by all of the "lurkers" who have posted here tonight, you have more friends than you even knew!
We've got your back Shakes. Let us know what we can do to help you fight back.
oddjob-
it doesn't matter, there is but one God. And we'll all come to meet him sooner or later, it only depends on how we lived-for Him or for us.
Erin Worrell,
please give up, you're making a fool of yourself
Again for all the so called 'Christians' commenting here.... Most of the Founding Fathers were Deists. They did not believe in a personal God. And those who insisted differently they called (derisively) Enthusiasts.
Just simple fact. Deal with it.
I didn't know that Oddjob.
Wasn't it Jefferson who first used the phrase 'seperation of church and state?'
Nathan,
Exactly. Shakes should actually look to Ann and Michelle, not for political advice, but as a Blog format and how to retaliate. It would help her a lot.
P.S. Thank you Nathon and Jose.
The christofascists commenting here demonstrate a basic problem with religion. Religion is a metaphor originating in a time when people knew almost nothing about the universe we live in.
As a metaphor, it can be interpreted in different ways and even mistaken for literal fact.
People with mental pathologies project those pathologies into their belief systems and those strains of religion become pathological.
As an ex-catholic with 14 years of catholic school, I know well the history of the church.
From the time of Constantine, when the church became the official religion of the roman empire, fascist types have held the reins of this authoritarian hierarchical institution. Once, the powers that be slipped up and a good pope was appointed: John XXIII.
The fascists choked in rage, and vowed to undo the progress made by John XXIII which brought the church out of the dark ages to the threshold of the modern world.
They succeeded and the fascists have siezed control and will not relinquish it, but will force out all who will not be docile sheep in their flock.
If there were democracy in the church, there would be a chance for change, but there is no democracy there, only fascist authority.
The decent church that was for a while is disappearing. What is left is a threat to all who love reason and liberty.
The fascists will whine and call this catholic bashing; it is truth and fact.