C'mon, xymp, give Chomsky a break! You saw Chavez Frias giving him props, didn't you?
Glad you have such faith that the Americans are still capable of a moment of sanity.
whoops, there goes the EU:
EU Parliamentarians Establish an "Israel Lobby" (IsraelNN.com)
300 European Union parliamentarians and supporters took part this week in a gala celebrating the establishment of a European "Israel Lobby", the first of its kind. The lobby organization, called EFI (European Friends of Israel), includes representatives of all European states, including those that have as yet not expressed public support for Israel. The gala opening took place in Brussels, Belgium, and was also attended by Knesset members, the Israeli ambassador to the EU, and foreign ministers and parliamentary speakers from the various EU states. The guest of honor was a member of the Haifa city council, Shlomo Gilboa, standing in for Mayor Yonah Yahav. To extended applause, Gilboa told the assembled EU representatives that "in your support of Israel, you are essentially supporting your own countries; for Israel is defending that which you all represent here today.... We are defending our borders and our existence, but by the same token, we are defending the free world."
and here goes the secretary generalship of the UN:
Jewish leaders press concerns as potential U.N. heads reach out
By Ron Kampeas. JTA, September 18, 2006
http://www.jta.org/
page_view_sto...articleid=17066
WASHINGTON, Sept. 18 (JTA) — As the U.N. General Assembly opens, diplomats vying to be the world’s top peacekeeper are taking the time to consult with a group that has emerged as a critical constituency: American Jewish leaders. At least three of the favored candidates to replace Kofi Annan as U.N. secretary-general have met in recent months with leaders of the U.S. Jewish groups that routinely deal with the United Nations, JTA has learned. “It’s a recognition that we’re part of the equation and the political calculus,” said David Harris, executive director of the American Jewish Committee, who acknowledged “several” meetings with prospective candidates. “It’s clear that no candidate can win without the support of the five permanent members, and there is thinking that American Jewry would have some impact on the thinking of the United States.”
The United States, Russia, France, China and Britain are the five permanent members wielding veto power on the U.N. Security Council, the body that recommends a candidate for secretary-general to the General Assembly for confirmation. The casting call comes because Kofi Annan’s term lapses at the end of this year, and Jewish leaders are considering the disappointments of his term as well as its highlights. Many of the issues that characterized the last part of Annan’s 10-year term — the Iranian nuclear threat, the aftermath of the Lebanon war and the prospect of reviving Israeli-Palestinian peace talks — will feature high on the Jewish agenda the week that world leaders arrive to address the General Assembly during its opening session. “We want to gauge the international mood toward Israel post-summer conflict and get a sense of whether there’s any traction of rumors of resumption of peace talks,” said Harris, who said his organization planned 60 meetings with world leaders this week and next. “We’ll be talking about the challenges of anti-Semitism.”
After two Africans in the job — Annan is from Ghana and his predecessor, Boutros Boutros-Ghali, was from Egypt — the assumption is that an Asian will now get the position. Of the declared candidates, Shashi Tharoor, a U.N. undersecretary-general backed by his native India, and Surakiart Sathirathai, Thailand’s deputy prime minister, have met with Jewish groups. Another candidate, Ban Ki-Moon, South Korea’s foreign minister, has also met with Jewish leaders and is in the process of setting up a second meeting, and Jewish groups have strong ongoing relations with another candidate, Prince Zeid al-Hussein, Jordan’s envoy to the body. Community leaders were loath to endorse a particular candidate, but Tharoor at least made a favorable impression. “We should take him seriously as a candidate,” said Shai Franklin, director of internation
“We should take him seriously as a candidate,” said Shai Franklin, director of international organizations at the World Jewish Congress. “He was instrumental in putting the Holocaust on the U.N. agenda.” The 2005 commemoration of the 60th anniversary of the liberation of Auschwitz, and subsequent Holocaust memorials, are counted among the highs of Annan’s time at the United Nations. Lows include Annan’s failure to directly confront Iran’s leaders on their Holocaust denial and what is perceived as his eagerness to rush to blame Israel for civilian casualties in its recent war with Hezbollah in Lebanon. “We wanted to make him understand how the community felt, how important the U.N. was in dealing with Israel issues, and some of the disappointment we felt in the past in how the United Nations could have dealt with those issues,” Jess Hordes, director of the Anti-Defamation League’s Washington office, said of the Sept. 7 meeting with Tharoor. The ADL has virtually cut off Annan because of his statements during the war with Hezbollah. Another disappointment is the Human Rights Council that Annan initiated. It replaced the stridently anti-Israel Human Rights Commission, but if anything, in its first three months the new body has been even more persistent in criticizing Israel, a problem Annan himself has acknowledged. “Right out of the box it went back to business as usual,” said Dan Mariaschin, executive vice president of B’nai B’rith International, who also attended the meeting with Tharoor. “I tell diplomats, ‘Because you all go along with these resolutions, you raise expectations from Palestinians and alienate Israel. From a standpoint of making the system work, you’re not accomplishing anything.’” Such concerns were shared by the United States. The secretary-general “doesn’t represent a national government, and so the important thing is that we have a leader who’s going to help make the U.N. an effective organization in supporting democracy-promotion efforts and in defending human rights,” Kristen Silverberg, assistant secretary of state for international organizations, said last week. “We’ve been disappointed, really profoundly disappointed, by the quality of the resolutions that are coming out of the Human Rights Council,” Silverberg continued. “We think they have an unconstructive focus on Israel, and that they really need to turn their attention to some of the key human rights problems in the world.” In a straw poll conducted by the 15-member Security Council last week, Ban of South Korea came first, followed by Tharoor of India and Sathirathai of Thailand. Jordan’s Hussein came a distant fourth because, according to insiders, he is an Arab who has warm ties with Israel — an outcome that underscored reluctance in the Jewish community to reveal recent meetings with candidates. In fifth place came Jayantha Dhanapala, the top U.N. disarmament official, from Sri Lanka. A dark horse not on last week’s ballot is Chan Heng Chee, Singapore’s ambassad
A dark horse not on last week’s ballot is Chan Heng Chee, Singapore’s ambassador to the United States. U.S. officials reportedly favor her because, among other reasons, she would be the first woman in the job. Tharoor’s meeting with Jewish leaders in Washington was organized by Chabad-Lubavitch, representing another development in the evolving U.N.-Jewish relationship. The fervently Orthodox outreach group recently has assumed a high profile at the United Nations, and is interviewing for staff to deal full time with the world body. “I can speak for a movement with an energetic, ongoing presence in 73 countries,” said Rabbi Levi Shemtov, Chabad’s envoy in Washington, who organized the Tharoor meeting and is spearheading the effort to establish a permanent Chabad presence at the United Nations. Chabad’s participation is the latest signal that the movement, which for years shunned mainstream Jewish alliances, is now forging them. Officials at other organizations said Chabad and the United Nations made a natural match because of Chabad’s permanent presence in nations that otherwise lack any Jewish presence. “Chabad has an effective international network of Jews,” said the WJC’s Franklin. Mariaschin of B’nai B’rith International said the more Jewish organizations involved at the United Nations, the merrier. “We’re such a small community, and it’s a big world out there,” he said.
Xymph, Thank you for your reasonable, contrarian position on war with Iran. I cant believe your ongoing animus toward Chomsky, however. In your second paragraph you both mock him for believing in a powerful American establishment, and then endorse the idea of the realists of that establishment intervening to stop the neocons.
But your main point, that continual talk of war creates the climate of nervousness in which the neocons can hope something will fall their way, is right on. Thanks for that.
It's not impossible that the realists are pulling the rug out from under the zionists. I think that if you spend a few hours reading the stuff on Mearsheimer's web page (there are contributions from Brzezinski there, among other things), you might end up feeling that us-backed zionism was just a fever dream:
http://mearsheimer.uchicago.edu
You must have a strong stomach to find so much of that stuff, RB.
well, Ron Kampeas of JTA, and certain writers at the Forward, have a rather stomach-churning style, I must admit. However, it is like the insinuating style of the soviet commissars they so much resemble : they seem always to be saying, you know we have have unlimited arbitrary power, and we know you know, but let's pretend it's just a matter of "consultation" and "fraternal understandings".
They are skating on thin ice, though. Because they don't have unlimited and arbtrary power, it's basically a bluff that can never possibly be enforced, even by the mighty USA, at every one of the innumerable points, all over the world, that it is challenged.
Here is a good article about why the US *and* Israel should keep their slimy paws off Iran. And what will happen to them if they don’t.
http://www.rense.com/general59/
t...ransawesome.htm
I wonder about the neocon movement though. Are they sane ? Do they think this is their chance to rattle the cage to their liking, even if they have to take a few hits for it ? I agree that attacking Iran would be sheer madness. Does bush strike you as being sane ? Or for that matter the Israeli government ? They're hoping they can pull off a complete change in the Middle East. Remove all the so called threats to Israel and keep american hands on the oil pumps. How much damage are they prepared to inflict on themselves is the question. Bush doesn’t give a shit about his own people. If they starved to death alone in the dark of winter bush would consider it part of the price needed to be paid. If oil prices rose so far through the roof that the average american couldn’t afford to drive, bush would call it a necessary sacrifice for the good of the nation. The american sheeple would let out a few baaaah’s and then dutifully agree.
Don’t discount the insanity factor. It wasn’t a sane move for the Germans to attack Russia in WW2. Every German General knew it. Hitler got his way. Had the generals the spine to stand up to Hitler, we’d be looking at the Great German Empire right now. That is a lost lesson from WW2. That although you may have the strongest military, you can’t attack the whole world and win. The US is about to learn that lesson.
And this is what gets me. What the US is doing doesn’t make sense. It had control of the area by proxy, why feel the need to have your feet on the ground. Unless they know something we don’t. Something that necessitates having your hand on the pump. Peak Oil would explain it perhaps. Perhaps this is stage one of encircling a Chinese/Russian/Indian power block. Control the oil and you control the outcome of any war. To control the oil you need to physically have your hands on the pump. PNAC thinks its time for Empire. Cant do that without control of resources.
So it leads back to the sanity issue. Is bush/PNAC sane in their quest for empire ? Do they really see what they're playing at ? Or are they like Hitler and going a step too far? The step that will bring them down. And where does that leave Israel ? As nothing more than a foothold in the ME and one that can be easily delt with after completion of their plans. Lets face it, anti-sematism has been alive and well in the so called establishement for centuries. Why have a Jewish alliance now ?
http://mailman.lbo-talk.org/pipe...828/
045100.html
[lbo-talk] Israeli Übermenschen
good (and long) thread (interrupted by Chris Doss who always posts whatever he wants to, in the next nearest thread available)
Hitler's attack on Russia was actually a smashing success. The failure to fall back for the winter, resupply and ready themselves for the spring offensive to finish the job is what screwed them.
As for any good news, small signs of sane thinking, Chavez's 5 minute ovation the other day, at the UN, was welcome.
How about the "high ranking" Israeli diplomat, caught in August in Argentina, at an airport in Buenas Aires, with "a considerable quantity of explosives." On his way to Chile..
HP (above) mentioned Chavez' speech at the UN the other day, where he declared he could still "smell the sulphur [from Bush]". Did anyone else think this was peculiar, given the assertion by some fundamentalists that the United Nations represents the Antichrist, as described in the book of revelations??? Did he say this on purpose? ...or perhaps it was just a coincidence.
PS: RB: great posts, when are you going to start a blog of your own?!
I enjoyed Chavez's speech, but somehow wondered if he wasn't playing his part in the great charade.
There are so many people, or groups, who might vie for that lofty title, it's enough to make one hallucinate..
Indeed, googling "Javier Solana antichrist" is worth a chuckle. And I'm not even going to touch Ahnold.
You've spent so much time in the trenches, you've fianlly gone nuts, Xympho?
"you’ll be able to go into American gun shops and buy ammo specifically made for Jew hunting"
Maybe you're temporarily unhinged. Or, you're trying to incite some people, a la The Turner Diaries?
That really is an extreme statement. I don't believe I've ever heard David Duke speak like that. Edgar Steele, yes.
I took it as a not-so-gentle spoof of American gun culture, MfA.
I had a blog when I started on the web but I got tired of it because all I was really doing was pasting in articles from such as Asia Times as I recall. By posting a small number (I hope) of really irresistable links here I get the same thing done).
My theory about the neocons is this. They are proceeding logically from the sense that positivist science is now so powerful it can in theory predict, and thus control, everything, including humans individually or en masse (this is basically pavlovian, i.e. operant conditioning, etc.) Computer models tell them that this capacity to predict in every sphere outweighs all other factors.
I wonder what technical characteristics "ammo specifically made for Jew hunting" might have.
Not sure, by the way, that neocons have done anything to earn much of a reputation for scientific insight or expertise.
I didn't say their scientistic pretentions were based on anything more solid than self infatuation and reading SF as kids, smek.
What utter nonsense. Yesterday, we got to know how the US threatened Pakistan with being bombed "back to the stone age" aften 9-11. What mr. xymph seemingly doesn't get, is that his employers in the Bush gang aren't reasonable human beings, but crackpots, as Chavez pointed out in the UN. Chavez also forwarded a book by Chomsky, the hate-object nr. one for crypto-bushite web-propagandists as mr. xymph.
Well, Ahmed Chalabi famously has a maths degree (quite apart from being able to count probably up to a billion) but we all know he lacks some of what you need for real neo-connery.
http://www.epwijnants-
lectures.c...torymaking.html "As is known, on April 12, 1943, the German (Nazi) press reported on a major atrocity story-namely, the discovery of the bodies of what they claimed were 10,000 Polish officers in mass graves in the Katyn forest in Russia. In fact, 4,000 officers were missing and 1,700 bodies were found. Longerich however claims in the interview that this would have switched away now from their (previous) anti-Semitic rhetoric (even “der Bolschewismus nicht mehr als Form des Jüdischen-Ja, genau.”), something we -http://wwww.sociologyesoscience.co - checked up on (with the help of our advisors), and found evidence that this is to be entirely untrue, rather the opposite!
The Katyn story became the occasion for the most virulent public anti-Semitic campaign ever." --
The front page of that weird name site introduces thus .. .
(The Trouble with Historians) Recently, in an interview with Stefan Reinecke and Christian Semler, British historian Peter Longerich introducing his new book, explains that: "On one hand, details of the murder of the Jews were handled as a state secret, the revelation of which was punishable - on the other hand, the regime itself more or less confirmed rumours about the 'final solution.' We have access to a great deal of documents and statements indicating that Germans understood that the deported Jews were to be murdered. The Mistake of Peter Longerich.
There is a link to a taz interview which begins thus:
"Diese Grauzone"
Der Historiker Peter Longerich belegt anhand bisher nicht ausgewerteter Quellen, dass das NS-Regime ab Ende 1941 immer wieder gezielte Hinweise auf die Vernichtung der Juden gab
INTERVIEW STEFAN REINECKE
UND CHRISTIAN SEMLER
taz: Herr Longerich, Sie meinen, dass die Ermordung der europäischen Juden für die Deutschen in der NS-Zeit ein "offenes Geheimnis" war. Nun gab es damals keine empirische Sozialforschung. Woher wissen Sie das also?
More Wang/Wijnants (and co) comment:
"In fact Nazi propaganda in contrast to Longerich’s claim, used Katyn even to attack the USA, Goebbels interpreted the Katyn story as further evidence of: "One can really describe the USA as a Jewish state." (Goebbels, entry for April 17, 1943, The Diaries of J.Goebbels , TBJG, vol. II/8, pp. 115, 124.)
........
To conclude, Longerich a few days ago claimed that,” Nach der Öffnung der Gräber von Katyn- die These, dass Deutschland gegen die jüdische Weltverschwörung kämpft, die von Moskau über London bis Washington reicht, für die NS-Führung nicht mehr funktional ist.”
This is in stark contrast with the evidence, for example Reich press chief Otto Dietrich On May 21, 1943, sent a "Special Issue against the Jews: The Goal: An Anti-Jewish Periodical Press" to editors at newspapers and periodicals."
Eric Wijnants is if not blatantly biased in favor of zionism, dishonest about what their underdog siblings must suffer, witness the regrettably epidemic ploy plied in a cartoon he reproduces at the top of his page claiming arabs are "outraged" over sweet nothings like penstroke jokes and 'dispeptic' over their own peccadillos. Western 'freedom', irreverences and flippancies are as nothing compared to much worse, real and hellish injury such as inflicted by NDU ammo, damn near fly-by carpet bombings and this western pretense of being scapegoated is supposed to provide the alibi for scapegoatings perped; these not featherlight penstroke but heavy and hi-tec 'outings' constitute nothing if not distractions from an inner jihad we wayward westies proportionately neglect worse (than arabs do), to exactly the degree we industrialized, urbanized, are more removed, remoted, delegatory, into many too many a too tall and topply story.
by analogy, if ahmadinajad means to convey a wish for and recommend peaceful dissolution (transsubstantiation, secession) of zionist ambitions (a return to their original plans of gentle gardening and greening perhaps?) it means nothing to people planning (and no secrecy about that either since there seems no danger of such openness provoking peaceful counter[cultur]ing) to rain bombs on him. They will accuse him of wanting (to do) what they want (to do), owning (up to) what only they (since thus threatened can decently and need to actually) own (up to). The world will cry: bravo, great defence.
This is interesting, except that there's nothing new about this, and the abductors are not neecssarily 'insurgents', whatever those are:
Iraq says abductees used in car bombings
PATRICK QUINN, Associated Press
BAGHDAD, Iraq - Iraqi insurgents are no longer using just volunteers as suicide car bombers but are instead kidnapping drivers, rigging their vehicles with explosives and blowing them up, the Defense Ministry said Thursday. In what appears to be a new tactic for the insurgency, the ministry said the kidnap victims do not know their cars have been loaded with explosives when they are released. The ministry issued a statement saying that first "a motorist is kidnapped with his car. They then booby trap the car without the driver knowing. Then the kidnapped driver is released and threatened to take a certain road." The kidnappers follow the car and when the unwitting victim "reaches a checkpoint, a public place, or an army or police patrol, the criminal terrorists following the driver detonate the car from a distance," the Defense Ministry statement said. There was no immediate comment from the U.S. military. In the past, U.S. officials have said insurgents often tape or handcuff a suicide driver's hands to a car, or bind his foot to the gas pedal, to ensure that he does not back out at the last minute. Although roadside bombs are the main weapon used by insurgents, suicide car bombers are designed to maximize casualties and sow fear among the population. According to the Washington-based Brookings Institution, there have been 343 suicide car bombings causing multiple deaths in Iraq since the fall of Saddam Hussein in 2003.
http://www.thestate.com/mld/thes...ld/
15573780.htm
In pondering a communication from the Iraqi Defense Ministry, that it might contain an element of truth would be the last possibility I would consider.
Isn't that human bomb thing an old MI5 trick honed to an art in framing the IRA? Beware of the term "insurgent."
Well, come to think of it, the way things are going in the US, under the Patriot Act, which defines all sorts of low-grade crimes as "terrorism," it's only a matter of time before they start filling up those shiny new FEMA camps with home-grown "insurgents."
Let's be accurate here, Xymph, it's the Golden Age of anti-Zionism that's coming, not the Golden Age of anti-Semitism. There IS a difference! It's rarely a good idea to throw out the baby with the bathwater :O There are many innocent Jews (victims, even, like goyim) when it comes to the diabolical plans of Zionists and their sympathizers.
Get the straight scoop at:
http://www.novalight.org
PS Hugo was close when he called Bush 'the devil'. Anti-Christ would have been more accurate 
I noticed an interesting article in Haaretz about how easy it has been (quietly) made for Israeli Jews of American decsent - or even, who had a parent, or grandparent, who lived, even for a short time in the USA - to get US citizenship for their kids. Maybe they are starting to think about deserting the sinking ship:
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spa...ges/
766092.html
Let's be accurate here, Xymph, it's the Golden Age of anti-Zionism that's coming, not the Golden Age of anti-Semitism. There IS a difference!...
GodSend | 09.22.06 - 10:51 am
You wish!
Zionists claim to be Jewish. Goyim used to be silenced with accusations of anti-Semitism. Non/anti-Zionist Jews are silenced with accusations of self-hating Jew. Thus the vast majority of "Jewish" voices we hear are declared or closet Zionists expressing support for Israel. It doesn't matter what the reality may be, the above scenario creates the impression that most jews are Zionists.
...exactly the same way that Zion would have us believe that most Palestinians are terrorists. Israel's pathetically juvenile PR stunts have a very big downside.
There are many Jews (including some of my very close and life-long Jewish friends) who support the State of Israel without knowing a lot (if anything) about the diabolical leadership of Zionism - past and present - and their agenda for the world and for goyim. Let's face it, many (most?) people are ignorant (MADE ignorant!) of what their political leaders are up to. Americans are a perfect example :O Full disclosure about 911 (now arriving) will finally burst the bubble of deception :O
My own view is that 'being jewish' will need some serious redefinition.
I am working on this now actually. I propose various new and radically unacceptable forms of 'being jewish' which will subvert, forestall, confuse, and generally defeat the status quo, and prevent it from rearing its ugly head in future.
Some of my ideas may sound perverse : anarcho zionism, for instance, which is designed to be self defeating. But really you must all wait until I have found suitable elements to expound these new forms - elements who are 'jewish', in some sense.
Confessionsofamalamute,
Hate to disagree but the rense article is silly. It focuses on one weapon and paints a uni-dimensional fantasy around it. Even America wouldn't be silly enough to park all its ships in the gulf before hostilities began if it thought Iran had SSNs. Besides, Israel and America have been careful only to engage soft targets for several decades. This is the main reason they'll think twice before attacking Iran.
googled 101 instances of your fascinating fancy: really rooted anarchism; unbudgebable health wealth and shade spending foliaith. Here's one:
Gocharok, Mose. Pepel nasich kostrov. Ocerki istorii evrejskogo anarchistskogo dviñenija (idis-anarchizm). Izdatel'stvo "Problemen", Ierusalim 2002. 309 pp. Ill.
This book is an improved and expanded version of Ocherki po istorii evreiskogo anarkhistskogo dvizheniia (199
and covers the Jewish anarchist movement from its origins among Russian immigrants in Western Europe and the United States from the 1880s until the 1970s. Separate chapters deal with the national issue, anarcho-Zionism and the history of the anarchist periodical press in Yiddish. Several biographical sketches and a bibliography are included.
http://web.iisg.nl/irsh/48-2-bib.php 102K
if you care to come and consult stuff in A'dam i could help you find free accomodation.
i am watching a dvd given to me by a Chilean man who remembered me from an earlier climate campaign tour planning camp, germany 95 (where i lost my copy of the Rolling Stone article on rainbow gatherings); it's about venezuelan el hornito's birth defects and the racist aspects of oilyn dust tree all ism; worse than a mere smell of sulfur i tell you.
Random activism generators are making great strides, I see.
CHOMSKY THE GATEKEEPER FOR ZIONISM
Israel Shahak on Chomsky:
I had the same, only greater, differences of opinion with Noam Chomsky, who is my personal friend for quite a time, on the subject of AIPAC and the influence of the Jewish lobby in general as you have. What is more, a number of mutual friends of Chomsky and me have also tried to influence him, in vain, on that point.
I am afraid that he is, with all his wonderful qualities and the work he does, quite dogmatic on many things. I have no doubt that his grievous mistake about the lack of importance of AIPAC, which he repeats quite often, helps the Zionists very much as you so graphically described.
http://www.dissidentvoice.org/
Ma...ankfort0525.htm
It's interesting to note his exact turn of phrase here:
... Iraq was the weakest country in the region. It had been devastated by the U.S. sanctions, which are called U.N. sanctions, but if it wasn't for U.S. pressure, they wouldn't exist. They wiped out the population. They happened to strengthen the tyrant, but devastated the economy. The country was virtually disarmed. It was under total surveillance. Its military budget was about a third that of Kuwait, which has 10% of its population, and far below the other states in the region, including, of course, the regional superpower, which we're not allowed to talk about, because there's an offshore U.S. military base, but outside the United States everyone knows there is one country in the region that has extensive weapons of mass destruction, and has military forces which according to its own analysts are more technically advanced and more powerful than those of any NATO country outside the United States, unmentionable here, but known everywhere else...
(Chomsky speaking at Illinois State University on October 7th, 2003)
-- I suggest we take him quite literally. "We are" (i.e., he is) "not allowed to talk about" Israel. By whom? Well, who is it who allows anti-americanism but not anti-zionism?
The circumstances you list for not whacking Iran are the very circumstances that make Iran quite doable in the schemes of many a weighty schemer - once you leave the realms of one dimensional considerations. And of course the drumbeat in itself aids and abets a pleothora of agendas, but that doesn't mean the drumbeat is dissociated from the existence of a trailing and willing big stick. Is Xymphy having bouts of naïveté? Iran would have been hit a year ago, hard and real, but for some glitches along the road.
BTW, what is this fascination bordering obsession when it comes to Noamsky.
Horsewhisperer;
There is always at least one battle group in the gulf. Another is set to head there. So yes, the americans ARE that stupid. Besides having at least 70 SS-N-22's the Iranians are known to have hundreds of Exocets. Anything floating in the gulf will be sitting on the bottom by the end of day one.
I agree its stupid for the yanks to go after Iran. But then the majority of yanks ARE stupid. They have been brainwashed for years to assume they will always win every war and every battle. It makes them overconfident. They’ll assume that the cavemen living in Iran can be overcome with a few bombings. The avenues for Iranian response to any form of attack will certainly wipe the smiles off some faces.
I agree that attacking Iran is moronic. I posted the article simply to show what a response to any attack could potentially be. Will the u.s. take their battle groups out of the gulf ? I’d guess arrogance wont allow it. Again, there is ALWAYS at least one battle group in the gulf. That battle group is ALWAYS within range of anti ship missiles. And lets face it, bush and cronies ARE stupid and arrogant enough to think they can get away with it.
meant to add this link...
Here is an article about a US carrier group headed off to war and probably extermination in the gulf. The Nation has learned that the Bush Administration and the Pentagon have issued orders for a major "strike group" of ships, including the nuclear aircraft carrier Eisenhower as well as a cruiser, destroyer, frigate, submarine escort and supply ship, to head for the Persian Gulf, just off Iran's western coast
In the new __The American Conservative__ dated October 9, an article by the very reliable Philip Giraldi, retired CIA officer. It is not available online but here is the text:
THE WHITE HOUSE HAS OVERCOME RESISTANCE FROM THE JOINT CHIEFS OF STAFF AND HAS ORDERED PLANS TO ATTACK IRAN AFTER THE NOVEMBER CONGRESSIONAL ELECTIONS. President Bush has made it clear, both publicly and privately, that Iran will not be allowed to develop a nuclear weapons capability and that he intends to take direct action, whatever the consequences would be. It is well understood at the White House that if a naval and air assault is required in lieu of effective international sanctions that modify Iranian behavior there will be severe damage from Iranian retaliation. The US Navy has been tasked with developing contingency plans to keep the Straits of Hormuz and the Persian Gulf open while Air Force planners have been tasked to destroy presumed nuclear sites and to cripple Tehran's offensive capabilities.
Yeah, but it's also possible that as an uncharacteristically intelligent compromise between the peace faction and the war faction, all this is just bluff. Admitted, Bush himself has absolutely no record of ever having employed bluff (just as he "doesn't do nuance", he also doesn't do bluff), but there has been a genuine battle to exhaustion between the peace and war factions, so they may have settled on the easy-to-apply and not-predetermining-the-outcome strategy of "talk softly and carry a big stick".
Confessionsofamalamute,
I choose to think America isn't quite as stupid as you say (purely because it's not a good idea to underestimate either side in a conflict). I'm thinking about conventional wisdom tales such as Mindful of the Night has posted.
All this drum beating has one purpose, imo; to program Joe Public to accept that another front in the ME will be confined to the ME. The rense article tells JP we might lose a few ships. The official worst-case scenario for an Iran attack is Iranian retalliation against Israel and US assets in the ME and maybe a few strikes on US-harboring ME countries before its conventional warfare assets are neutralised. But it's all in the ME. The prospect of direct retalliation against continental USA is never mentioned in all the hype.
It's been 5 years since Bush put the cross hairs on Iran - again. Does anyone know how many nukes there are in the world at this moment? Can all the potential suppliers be trusted?
Why couldn't Iran have the capacity to strike the continental USA if it's attacked? It's not exactly short of cash and has demonstrated a Russian-designed hi-speed torpedo and a 'stealth' missile in recent times.
Which October?
Reading The American Conservative is a little like RB reading reports from the Iraqi Defense Ministry..
(oxymoron?.."Iraqi-Defense"!!)
..."Tricking the American people into doing something stupid"...
We don't have to "be tricked" into stupidity!
After all, we are guided, controlled and as Rowan hit on it...our actions "predictable" by techies.
Have you seen the newest creation of that group RB is trying to create a new name for--
"Marie Antoinette" (the movie!)
There are just a few very disgusting looking thumbnails available, at this time..(SO MANY Jewish characters in the "royal court" ..all in powdered wigs!)
So tacky-looking.
Versailles took up around one third of the French government budget.
A little like our economy--AGAIN
entirely created by that group of ingenious merchants and department store owners who now have an endless cheap labor force in China, with no problems of wages, retirement or sick leave!
Which, along with endless war, has finished off the U.S. "economy".
Just imagine, that IF the Hebrew creators and arbitrators of fashion and fabric "sold" Versailles to the "Sun King"...THEN they decided that their favorite customers, the King and Queen had to go (off with their heads)...
well, just imagine, what chaos they could create in modern time if they were in "complete control".
Or completely "out of control".
Which, of course, they are-
The French Revolution and an invasion of Iran--at the same time!
It will ruin Thanksgiving and Christmas spending.
I don't think even "stupid Americans" would go for that!
They JUST FINISHED trying to figure out what Lebanon was all about-
Given Bush's very low popularity, I don't think he would get support to invade anyplace on the planet!
It would be interesting if they actually DID IT and it was a horrible failure (as everything else they have done) and the American people finally woke up and said
what the hell is it with Jews and Israel!
Is that what Xymp was talking about?
But that will NEVER HAPPEN.
This is a Judeo-Christian country.
Mostly Christian-Zionist.
We are totally controlled-financially, mentally.
BUT they still have to take into consideration that even the most ignorant people have to be "worked"
very carefully while stripping them of everything and creating wars in their name.
Hoarsewhisperer...
omg, they have that high speed torpedo ?? My dad was a sonarman. I told him about it and he just cringed. You can stand 20nm off a fleet and sink it in one spread without the fleet knowing you were there. Surface ships are VERY vulnerable to sub warfare. I had a feeling they’d get it though. Makes for good testing in real life situations.
Keeping the straight of Hormuz open will require ships in the area. Iran is currently buying anti aircraft missiles from Russia. Whether or not these will be in place in time is anyone’s guess (I wish I had an acct at Janes’ Military Digest, anyone got a spare 5 million for me ??)
What I'm saying is that if the u.s. is stupid enough to attack Iran in any way it will pay far more dearly than it realizes for this. Any ships in the gulf will be sunk. Those Russian anti ship missiles and the French Exocets aren't scuds. They can and will take out everything that floats.
As for the stupidity of americans… the people of that country have sat idly by while 2 federal elections were scammed right under their noses. There were no mass demonstrations to protect their so-called democracy. They have watched an illegal war progress and done nothing concrete. Their senate debates making torture not only legal but a way of life, and takes away all their civil liberties and the best they can do is bitch and moan on blogs. It seems their military leaders (not bush and cronies) have more sense than the american populace – which is a scary thought in itself. My understanding is the military doesn’t want to expand the conflict. They know full well what damage it will do to them. The majority of american people couldn’t care less so long as they get their Survivor episodes while eating their McHappy meals…. To me they're not the brightest bulbs on the tree. If that offends americans – oh well. ACT. Don’t just sit there and whine. The very future of your country is at stake. I remember the cold war. I remember the arrogant “it cant happen here” mentality. Well it IS happening. Get together and stop it through action or live with the consequences. The american people, don’t know, don’t care that they don’t know. Karma is coming. For their sakes its better to wake up now than later.
As for attacking the continental u.s. – its possible but not sure how probable. In any effective way anyway. Attack assets outside of the u.s. as in Europe for instance or Africa or Asia. More probable. But again other than hit and run terrorist tactics not much would come of it. Make their lives a living hell in the ME. For Sure. This is discounting the use of nuclear weapons (lets hope it NEVER goes that far). Use of biologics… again lets hope it never goes that far. But what they're willing to do to defend themselves from an attack time will tell. Lets hope it never goes that far either. Iran isn't Iraq. The Iranian people saw exactly what they can expect from america from how america treated the Iraqi people. I
Cjenn, you misunderestimate me. If I can find or create an 'anarcho-zionism' I will support it. It will have lots of musicians of an anarchic, noise-oriented sort, and people in it will be permitted to rant and rave about 'Israel from the Nile to the Euphrates', but no one will take them seriously.
In fact I think it already exists:
http://www.myspace.com/wreckdrool
cjenn:
Reading The American Conservative is a little like RB reading reports from the Iraqi Defense Ministry..
You don't know what you're talking about.
The American Conservative was founded to oppose the Iraq war. It has courageously opposed Bush and his war policies and Giraldi's reporting has been 100% accurate.
I'm going to use Xymphora's post to raise more money. 40 million dollars a year isn't enough
Pat Buchanan and his paleo-con chums at 'The American Conservative' have been right about the fraudulent nature of neo-con-dom, which they regard as a sort of jacobin deviation of liberalism. But, in his day, Buchanan was a "better dead than Red" man.
(JPost, AP) A consortium led by Boeing, the second-largest US defense contractor, and including Israel's Elbit Systems has won the first piece of a $2 billion government contract to develop and provide new technological means to secure the US borders and curb illegal immigration, officials said Thursday.
The contract, valued at $80 million, is the first part of a multibillion-dollar Homeland Security Department plan to help secure US borders with Mexico and Canada. The final bill's total is unknown, a department official said, because it hinges largely on whether Congress will approve spending about $1 billion to build a fence on the Mexican border. Until then, the contract will be given to Boeing in phases, the department official said.
Chicago-based Boeing was among several major defense companies competing for the job. While other companies' proposals relied more heavily on using flying drones to patrol the border, Boeing focused on a network of 1,800 high-tech towers, equipped with cameras and motion detectors that could feed live information to Border Patrol agents.
Elbit serves as a member of the consortium through Kollsman Inc., its US subsidiary. Kollsman's expertise in Homeland Security includes the integration and development of innovative electro-optical systems for surveillance and tracking, optical fiber technology for security, video communication and control systems alongside image-processing and smart systems for electronic fences.
Unmanned Aerial Vehicle (UAVs) of the Hermes family of UAVs and the Skylark man-packed UAV, which are used for military and homeland security applications, are also part of the capabilities Kollsman brought to the consortium.
"US citizens and the federal government are very concerned about vulnerabilities on the porous US northern and southern borders," said Elbit Systems of America President & CEO Tim Taylor. "The strategic and technological strengths we bring to the Boeing team will help restore the safety and security that Americans have known for so long."
The contract, part of the Secure Border Initiative, is the government's latest attempt to use advanced technology to solve the illegal immigration problem, which lawmakers have called a national security issue and which has given new attention in light of the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks.
Homeland Security gave companies chasing the contract - including Lockheed Martin Corp. and Northrop Grumman Corp. - freedom to come up with their own ideas for how best to apply new and developing technologies to the problem.
RB, initially the Mexican Fence might be used to keep Mexicans out, but it won't take the bogans long to realise that it's to keep the draft-prone among them, in. Bush won't want them buzzing off to Tijuana, Venezuela or Bolivia when he's found them a real man's job introducing arabs to Allah for Israel. Cuba should become more popular when America gets drafty.
Btw RB, what does the grapevine say about Israelis getting out? About a third of the Jews I know have Israeli friends/relatives planning an exit by early 2007. Australia(2) and Canada(1) are their destinations. My sample is too small to be statistically significant.
well, you saw the article I mentioned back here (up this thread a ways) about dual citizenship:
http://www.haloscan.com/comments...6057377/
#207394
As to what the grapevine might say, I have no idea. The only way I know to find out that would be to visit the Hebrew language chat rooms, and maybe one day I shall be able to do this - I shall be starting Hebrew lessons next month. Eventually I shall need various sorts of software to let me read and write it online (if we live that long).
Rb,
I thought you were adept at irony, but you seem not to recognize it in Chomsky. When he says "we are not permitted to" talk about Israel, he means we as in the NY Times, the Democrats, etc.
Here's a real headache for sneak attackers: http://www.iraq-war.ru/article/103246
It's "passive radar" - radar which compares incoming radio frequencies against a database of electronic signatures of things like ...stealth fighters and bombers, instead of sending out a powerful (detectable) pulse and interpreting the reflected signal. In theory, the absence of any outgoing radio pulse should make it undetectable. But that's not the big headache.
One installation, said to be 3 base units, can track and triangulate up to 18 targets at once. This is potentially a very big headache because one of the ongoing problems the Ballistic Missile Defense program was having was minimising inconvenient holes in the very large 3D radar fields necessary to continuously track and target incoming ICBMs.
This is the kind of innovation which could make a practical BMD system feasible since it provides a vector for each tracked object and can (presumably) differentiate tracked objects from each other via their RF signature - something radar can't easily duplicate except by early positive identification and uninterrupted, or rapidly re-computed, trajectory tracking.
Anyway, with suitable AA missiles this system could give the term 'suicide bombers' a whole new dimension.
Bob, when I said, I propose we take him literally, I meant, as opposed to making the assumption you are making about him, namely that it was just sarcasm. My method here is similar to that of many psychiatrists, who are trained to detect truth precisely in what people say in such a way as, they hope, to be thought to be joking.
Good old "Iraq.Ru" - I used to love that site, it had great comments and talkback features. I remember someone ending a comment by saying "All government is gangster, and, by the way, I am going out now to buy Kalashnikov, goodbye."
Hoarse, are you talking about the Kolchuga system? Sort of rewrites the book on tactics, doesn't it?
Yep.
good god
http://www.israelnationalnews.co....php3?
id=112516
scroll down a bit to see the amazingly ugly and insane looking 'rabbi' who proposes to teach you 'lofty torah secrets regarding sex'.
Meanwhile, in the 'highbrow' jewish press:
“A terrible episode happened with Mrs. Grynberg. The Ukrainians and the Germans who had broken into her house found her giving birth. ... When the birth pangs started she was dragged onto a dumpster in the yard of the town hall with a crowd ... who cracked jokes and jeered and watched the pain of childbirth. ... The child was immediately torn from her arms along with its umbilical cord and thrown — It was trampled by the crowd and she was stood on her feet as blood poured out of her with her bleeding bits hanging.”
-- just what your average New York family needs at Sunday breakfast, eh?
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/09/
2...osenbaum.t.html
Mummy snuff pron, eh? All their buttons pushed at once.
Xymph and others - I think you're right about No Iran War, at least for now, at least till after the elections. But what I've noticed is that for several weeks or more, no-ones talking about Diebold and how the Republicans are going to steal the election again. It doesn't matter how unpopular Bush is, or how many congressional battles he loses, as long as we're so worried about War and Terror and Torture that we forget to worry about Fair Elections. When they've stolen yet another election (with cooperation from the Democrats and MSM) and ensured continued Repbulican domination in Congress, then they can try to bomb Iran back to the stone age, or whatever other stupid cowboy things they want to do.
Sound possible? Then I suggest we all take a brief break from listening to their bullshit, and see whether our own state has softened on Diebold. We have less than two months to ensure they don't steal this one too! First things first: Diebold today, Empire after the election.
PeterT
I loved his insinuation that the flock will do something they'll feel guilty about later if they surf the net alone.
Pre-emptive gilt? Or guilt as religion?
Good thinking Peter T.
“Hotel Minibar” Keys Open Diebold Voting Machines
http://www.freedom-to-tinker.com/?p=1064
[...]
A little research revealed that the exact same key is used widely in office furniture, electronic equipment, jukeboxes, and hotel minibars. It’s a standard part, and like most standard parts it’s easily purchased on the Internet. We bought several keys from an office furniture key shop — they open the voting machine too. We ordered another key on eBay from a jukebox supply shop. The keys can be purchased from many online merchants.
Here's some current (edited to 3000 char) bullshit from the Israel Projects liars and lunatics. (Note the list of dual citizens at the end):
Ahmadinejad had made his goal very clear.
2. Use these talking points to speak up about the dangers of Iran
Here are five facts you can help the world know by writing letters to the editor and op-eds, or calling into talk radio:
Iran has been identified as the world’s leading state sponsor of international terrorism, funding Hezbollah, Islamic Jihad, and Hamas, as well as Shiite insurgent groups. Iran is even recruiting its youth and students across the Middle East for suicide operations against Western targets.
Religious extremism, particularly Islamic fundamentalism, is one of the key dangers in the world today. The Iranian President is a religious extremist who believes that it is his destiny to trigger a period of chaos, war and bloodshed in order for Islam to dominate the world.
Nuclear proliferation is one of the greatest dangers to world peace. We must act to stop Iran before it can develop nuclear technology, because the Iranian President has said that he would share nuclear technology with other Muslims.
The President of Iran believes that he is creating an Islamic “superpower,” which will bring down the West, including the United States. He says that he will have hundreds of millions of Muslim “holy raiders” eager to become martyrs.
The Iranian President does not believe the Holocaust happened and has called for the destruction of Israel. If we do not act, we run the risk of placating an extremist and making the same mistake we made with Hitler, which led to World War II and the deaths of millions.
For more facts on Iran go to TIP's homepage or view our Iran presskit
Tell Kofi Annan that Iran should not become a nuclear power.
3. Come help us deliver the TIP Petition
The Israel Project's petition will be delivered to the U.N. at Noon on Monday September 26. Come to the U.N. to help TIP deliver the petition in person. Click here to RSVP for the event. (Note: The time may change. We will email those who RSVP concerning any time change.)
4. Attend the Rally in NYC
The Israel Project is an international non-profit organization devoted to educating the press and the public about Israel while promoting security, freedom and peace. The Israel Project provides journalists, leaders and opinion-makers accurate information about Israel.
Board of Advisors: Senator Evan Bayh (IN), Senator Saxby Chambliss (GA), Senator Norm Coleman (MN), Senator Ben Nelson (NE), Senator Rick Santorum (PA), Senator Arlen Specter (PA), Senator Ron Wyden (OR), Congressman Rob Andrews (NJ), Congresswoman Shelley Berkley (NV), Congressman Tom Davis (VA), Congressman Eliot Engel (NY), Congressman Frank Pallone (NJ), Congressman Jon Porter (NV), Congressman Jim Saxton (NJ), Congressman Brad Sherman (CA), Congressman Joe Wilson (SC), Actor and Director Ron Silver.
The wonderful Ahmadinejad saves the world from zionism mini-movie, with music by Rammstein, can now be viewed on YouTube:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=jg-IVoaHZyA
(paste that back into an unbroken string before using it)
kudos to xymphora for rationality but two evidentiary items:
http://www.antiwar.com/hadar/?ar...?
articleid=9738
and secondly, Bush believes God has called him to save zionism. Deal with it.
That was pretty cool. But I wonder why Faurisson didn't appear at the end.
indeed. It has been around for a good few months, for a long time it was only hosted on a NS site, then it was also on a revisionist site, but now it's on YouTube, which is nice.
Leon Hadar seems to regard himself as the official spokeman for a would be part of the US foreign policy establishment (though he isn't and the Cato Institute isn't).
He frequently makes ex cathedra statements without evidentiary basis, because they are proposed articles of faith for Catoites who want to be accepted at least as junior partners in the hallowed halls.
The American administration is NOT acting irrationally, they are very savvy warlords and Iraq is a smashing succes. It is the American voter that is stupid, believing lies that would insult brain-damaged chicken.
USA is engaged in a war with China and is in the process of containment. The strategic nexus is the crescent of (easy accessible) oil running from the Caspian to Sudan, the mission is to make this oil inaccessible to China, and Iran, Pakistan and Afghanistan are pivotal in this respect: they are too close to China, geographially and politically for comfort.
Iran (like Iraq) is not important as a geopolitical entity but as a bridgehead, a staging area from where you can send forth the airforce to bomb the Caspian fields, denying oil to the enemy. (3G Strategy 101: deny your enemy oil and you can uncork the bubbly)
As the Caspian is almost exactly on the opposide, er, side of the planet, the US supply lines are impossible: to win a shooting war here, you'd have to use atomics. The way I see it, the Israelis will be used to break the nuclear taboo. They (and the neocons) are being prepped to take the fall for the biggest atrocity in history. When the gullible Americans have nailed Cheney to the barn door and gassed a few thousand zionists, a moderate president like Clinton (or Guillani, good bet, X.) can step in and assure the sheeple that all is now well, and WWIII can commence in good faith. We are, after all, just trying to clean up the mess left by King George the Mad and his schmaus friends. Yesyes, we are still flinging atomics about, but now that Bush let out the nuclear genie, things have taken on a momentum of their own, and at least now people are being nuked by a compassionate humanist president and not a nutbar batist.
Xymphoras vendetta against Chomsky is a part of this plan, prepping the Jews for slaughter. Chomskys argument about the tail never wagging the dog is eminently logical; it befits the Washington MIB's to let the Israelis run rabid over the arabs: both Arabs and Jews are untermenschen anyways, so who cares? If the Jews are willing to take the heat from keeping the ME pot boiling, why should the US get themselves into this mess? Outright ethnic cleansing does not sell tickets politically, even if it is just stinking Arabs - people that every Westerner despises, even if he says something else in polite company.
So the whole WOT/Islamofascist bullshit is bullshit. The Moslems are not even scape goats, they are just props in the circus. Cheap props at that, Arab lives count for nada in the West.
Maybe Americans really ARE scared of terrorists, apparently they are that stupid, but the real enemy is the China. In fifty years the Chinese rule the world, unless they are mass killed or denied oil. Both solutions involves nukes, so strap yourself in, we live in interesting times.
Erik, if you wrote it out in plain english instead of pseudo trendy journalese, the speculative nature of your scenario would be more apparent.
If all America wants to do is smash some China, wouldn't it be simpler to invade Greece during the wedding season?
"In fifty years the Chinese rule the world, unless they are mass killed..."
Come'on Erik, the English said the same about the Germans in the beginning of the twentieth century and nothing happened.
"the Israelis will be used to break the nuclear taboo. They (and the neocons) are being prepped to take the fall for the biggest atrocity in history. When the gullible Americans have nailed Cheney to the barn door and gassed a few thousand zionists, a moderate president like Clinton (or Guillani, good bet, X.) can step in and assure the sheeple that all is now well, and WWIII can commence in good faith."
-- I still can't quite get my head around this.
Just remember that Jews can by definition always and everywhere only be victims, and you'll be able to get your head around it all right
well in a way I can resonate to that - not personally, but I do appreciate that if you are brought up Jewish you get this horror trip imposed on you. Gilad Atzmon has just written another of his flip essays about this, in which he calls it "Pre Traumatic Stress Disorder".
Gilad Atzmon - Kebab Philosophy
60 comments http://peacepalestine.blogspot.com nighttime wakefulness is the most common workrhythm for assimilee semites nowadays, living as if still under that fierce and punishing sun, no longer stargazing, spice and gold freighting but serving food.
Can't see the jew that easily, Gilad contends. Isn't that cause the last wave has disappeared? Not so much due to german shake and take out but cause they have morphed into assimilation with all the congenital and cultural schizophrenia that entails?
That is, most of them like Leon big fat 'hawk') rather than Harry de Winter (eenanderjoodsgeluid)
"the Israelis will be used to break the nuclear taboo. They (and the neocons) are being prepped to take the fall for the biggest atrocity in history. When the gullible Americans have nailed Cheney to the barn door and gassed a few thousand zionists, a moderate president like Clinton (or Guillani, good bet, X.) can step in and assure the sheeple that all is now well, and WWIII can commence in good faith."
-- I still can't quite get my head around this.
Well, my hypothesis is that the Jews are being setup to take the blame for the next world war, they are the next boogiemen when the MSM tire of ragheads. This also means, that the next POTUS or the one after him, Hillary, Guillani, whoever, can campaign on a basis of saving America from the Evil Jews. (It worked like a charm for Hitler: he was not particularly anti-semitic for his time, but by breaking the Jewish power over German banking and media, he became a hero.) And at the same time, the new POTUS, when nailing the neocons, can say that yes, America was heading in the wrong direction, but now that POTUS Guillani has come to town, everything will be well in the garden. The American can then tell themselves, that the business about killing civilians wholesale for profit is not what America is about, America was cruelly lied to, the killing was done by Cheney and he is not America, he is gone so America can start a new era of philanthropic democracyspreading, only this time with a loving and caring C-in-C. It seems to be the way America works, chuck all bad things down the memory hole, start afresh on the same old follies but with a new vocabulary. I think it was Gore Vidal that was asked if he could ever imagine America under fascist rule. “Yes, only it will be called anti-fascism. The next administration will proceed with the neocon battle plan but call it “anti-neocon”, and everybody will be happy. Except for the teeming multitude of sub-humans being ground to pulp in the humanitarian air campaigns of our new NWO puppet.
Now, I realise you Americans have an AIPAC-problem, but this is not really the fault of the Jews, but of your senators; you legislative body is apparently corrupt to the core. The Jews play dirty, but if you are surprised by this or believe this to be a particular Jewish trait, you are very deluded. There are no nice people in politics. If you feel bad about this you should start financing your own senators. Get this: you can play the victim all day and still BE a victim, which, IMO, the Jews are about to find out, but they’ve cried wolf so many times and crying wolf only works if people like you enough to help you.
We can discuss whether the China-business is hypothetical, but hell, reality is hypothetical. Look at map, look at the numbers and imagine you are the US C-in-C. You job is to secure Americas supremacy with all means at your disposal. Your job is to look a bit longer than until the next election. What do you think?
If a reference would make my hypothesis easier to comprehend, here is a nice summation on the China (and Russia) problematic:
http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Cen...a/
HI27Ag01.html
"...imagine you are the US C-in-C. You job is to secure Americas supremacy with all means at your disposal. Your job is to look a bit longer than until the next election. What do you think?"
I think you need to start financing your own president.
Gilad Atzmon has just written another of his flip essays about this, in which he calls it "Pre Traumatic Stress Disorder".
... to which could be added the current top-of-the-pops for the progeny of H survivors - Artificially Acquired Holocaust Memory Syndrome, and catchy variations on the theme of self-pity; (Can't see the forest for the tears).
"...Hillary, Guillani, whoever, can campaign on a basis of saving America from the Evil Jews."
Yes, the same way David Duke can campaingn to become president of the Republic of Aztlan on the basis of saving latinos from the evil whites.
Erik, I commend you for thinking outside the box, but this time you have gone even out of basic logic. And I mean "basic".
"Can't see the forest for the tears" 
Amusing article, RB. Google Pre traumatic stress
The 7th item is "Pre-traumatic personality as a predictor of post-traumatic stress"...
So it would seem that Pre-TSD was a recognised condition before Atzmon ran it up the flagpole. Kinda makes it official, doesn't it?
David Duke can campaingn to become president of the Republic of Aztlan on the basis of saving latinos from the evil whites.
-- yeah, I thought Erik meant what he says he meant, but his whole theory is based on the notion that there still exists a secret anglo elite which has been just biding its time all through these last three decades or so...
his whole theory is based on the notion that there still exists a secret anglo elite...
Yes, and he is partially right, for there's a secret anglo elite showing up lately which was just biding it's time: the "me jewish too" elite.
Precise meanings of terms aside, there's no doubt in my mind that there's what I'd describe as an anglo, or maybe an 'establishment' elite, in my neck of the woods which is quietly but determinedly anti-Semetic. The evidence for it is the exclusion of Jews from 'anglo-elite' organisations and clubs.
If that's still true in your neck of the woods, I suggest that, as things go currently, your neck of the woods could become both isolated and vulnerable (to a press campaign, in particular, and no such campaign has been known to fail to bring about prompt cessation of Jewish exclusion).
Yes, the same way David Duke can campaingn to become president of the Republic of Aztlan on the basis of saving latinos from the evil whites.
Yeah, yes... Well, maybe I don't really believe it myself, but the point is, that the whole business about wily Jews taking over the world is crazier still. It's got that Hollywood air we've come to love since the James Bond script of 9/11. It's beatifully simple and personal no complicated structural repression, only real, live, identifiable villains with long beards and funny hats.
Well, the world is (still) run by a anglo elite so the fact that an intelligent person like X. (and his alter ego, RB) flatly denies it, smells very spooky. Chomsky's argument that tails do not wag dogs makes a lot more sense than pissing your pants about being sold into slavery by Jews. Jews are a nuisance, yes, but they are not calling the shots in WWIII, they just make a lot of noise.
The Iraq war has done little to make Israel safer and please bear in mind that neither the US nor Israel is run by morons, even if Cheney want's you to think so. It looks moronic only as long as you buy into the ridiculous idea that the greates threat to the West are a bunch of hairy people that puts the Sharia above laws of nature.
RB, I'll double check with a couple of social-climbing aqs but, as you must surely know, membership votes of clubs at the toff (and not so toff) end of the spectrum are conducted by a committee voting 'in camera'. Potential members who suspect they are being excluded, and go public, are breaching a fundamental rule of keeping the club's private affairs private - proof, all on its own, of obvious 'unsuitability' for membership.
Erik, maybe you get your data from some totally inept sources which haven't grasped that anything has changed since about the late 1960s, or you aren't using data at all, just smoke and mirrors.
There are two jewist states, not just one. And as you may have noticed, the crux of public debate in our time, not just in Israel, is a very simple question; "Is it good for the Jews?" You have to find out which of the actors is most Hitler-like, then bomb him.
neither the US nor Israel is run by morons
I agree as long as we do not mistake the public bureaucracy for the political office.
Well, the world is (still) run by a anglo elite
beatifully simple and personal, as you would have said yourself.
X (and his alter ego, RB)
I sense in RB a subtlety and soft irony that's not present in Xymph's writtings. Try "Rowan Berkeley, Esquire" or grab a panama hat and say "Hannibal Berkeley" and it fits, but then try "Count Xymphora", no, "Clarice Xymphora", hmm, and you get the picture.
Sorry, Erik, but your theory (of scapegoating) is against evidence. You seem to be in search for a move that could place jews in the victim position's square in the grand chessboard. That square is guarded by the most unexpected piece.
Hannibal Berkeley and Clarice Xymph?
I really don't fancy that image at all.
I really don't fancy that image at all.
That means it's easier for me to believe Xymph is a government asset (Clarice) with a sophisticated interlocutor than to think you are Xymph's creation (Hannibal's father was a count, that's why the Count Xymphora.)
Erik, if you need proof positive, instead of what if and maybe, then simply try to buck them and see what happens.
yeah but hannibal never gets out of jail.
Here you go again, Mr Berkeley. I don’t know about Anglos, that was your term, but that the world is run by white men is not at phenomenon that has changed much since the sixties. Data? Same place as everybody else: from texts, as Foucault would say. Reality is hypothetical, as I remarked earlier, but I daresay the body of data supporting the hypothesis of a Jewish World Hegemony is a lot thinner than that supporting a White Male Hegemony.
Smekhovo, America is not a Jewish (or jewist, if that was not a typo) state; Americans are amongst - if not the – most religious Protestants in the world, a lot of them dying to see Jesus kill every last Jew on Earth. (Neither is Russia run by Jews, if that was what you were referring to. Ask Khorsodovsky.) Of course, if you have decided that the US ME policy is made by Jews you’ll find ample support in data. But it’s a matter of interpretation, see? Chomsky’s thesis that it is about commonality of interests may just as well fit the bill. Or even that Israel is an US puppet.
One of the reasons I think that X. and RB are twin souls, is that they follow exactly the same script on Chomsky: Chomsky is one of the most eloquent critics of Empire; I don’t know if he is dangerous but he must at least be a pain in the ass to the NWO-boys. Denigrating Chomsky to prove the Jew-supremacy-theory makes for at double whammy, very slick, very elegant, very spooky. So IMO that makes two incredible standpoints for intelligent people to take: denying White Male Supremacy and totally, completely and utterly denying Chomsky merit. I don’t know if Chomsky is right, but he states a damned good case.
Erik, if you need proof positive, instead of what if and maybe, then simply try to buck them and see what happens.
Well, what happened to you? I mean, we’re all anti-semites in here, no? So how come we’re not having an extended vacation in sunny Cuba? (We may yet live to see the day. This site is - like most good dissident sites - clearly MIB, even if I am being unfair to Mr Berkeley, probably a hothouse to cultivate anti-Semites in case you one day need to combat neonazi terror.)
I retracted my thesis that the Jews are being set up as scapegoats, it was a stray thought born of the observation that they seem to work 24/7 to make themselves hated. But when it comes to spying on America, making Lebensraum in Lebanon, killing and burning and so forth, they have the same right as everybody else, the right of might. I mean from which elevated position do you admonish them? That they do not follow UN resolutions? That it is foul to spy on ones benefactor? That killing your enemies is wrong? As I said, I don’t particularly like Jews, but not because they are playing dirty. The Danish Jews are industrious and smart and largely playing by the book, but I find the way they are humping Holocaust utterly tasteless, and I am much annoyed that they should campaign about Danes becoming more anti-semitic. The first because I f
The first because I find necrophiliacs pimping their dead grandmothers disgusting, the second because it is a self-fulfilling prophecy, everybody resents being slurred by violent whiners. And the pictures of the two girls writing greetings on the tank grenades is the most chilling thing I’ve seen for a long time. But in Denmark, the media, the politicians and the punditocracy is much more sensible towards Moslems than they are towards Jews. The crux of the public debate, not only in Denmark, but in Europe at large is: “Could this be insulting to Moslems?” Israel is criticised in ways that would make every radical Moslem on Earth demonstrate years on end. In Denmark the paper leading the critique of Israel and the massaging of Moslems, is Jewish. And, of course, in ways you’d never see in the US. Again: I recognise you have AIPAC-problems in the US, but that is not AIPACS problem, but the Americans’.
Don’t discount the insanity factor. It wasn’t a sane move for the Germans to attack Russia in WW2. Every German General knew it. Hitler got his way. Had the generals the spine to stand up to Hitler, we’d be looking at the Great German Empire right now. That is a lost lesson from WW2. That although you may have the strongest military, you can’t attack the whole world and win. The US is about to learn that lesson.
It was perfectly sane, Russia was preparing an attack on Germany. Had Hitler had the gumption to keep the generals in line, he would probably have won. THAT is the lost lesson from WW2: Hitler was NOT insane and that is why Irving is being prosecuted, not because of the Holocaust nonsense. The Allies do not like anyone questioning their propaganda on Hitler. IMO the Holocaust-denial-thing is a proxy attack, they are blackwashing Irving because he says that the Allies committed warcrimes on par with the Germans, and that it was Hitler appeasing Britain, not the other way around.
If people start reading Irving they will start asking questions like: "What was so great about Britain and the US helping Stalin to conquer half of Europe? And were the Poles happy being saved from Hitler by being sacrificed to Stalin? How about the Finnish? Or the Balts? And what the f... happened to our empire?" So yes, we saw no Grossdeutchland, we saw a Greater Russia and a diminished Europe and the British Empire passing on to American hands.
The lost lesson is that everyting is realpolitik in international relations: there are no good guys.
That although you may have the strongest military, you can’t attack the whole world and win. The US is about to learn that lesson.
... and Germany was military midget compared to France or Russia. Another lost lesson: the US learned a lot from Hitler but never got the hang of driving tanks like the Germans did. Had they done so, the first Iraq war would've settled matters: Guderian or Mannstein would never have allowed the Republican Guard to escape, but with the American tactical doctrine of pushing the enemy before you, their escape was almost inevitable.
The word jewist was no typo. Jew could refer simply to ancestry, Judaism just to a religion, and zionism merely to creating and supporting a state/ "national home". Only jewist will do to cover the whole range of contemporary judaeoactivity.
The Americans wanted the Republican Guard to escape, silly.
Erik's positions are slightly more credible when you grasp that he lives in Denmark and hasn't studied the USA in any depth.
I don't mean they're credible as positions, I mean it's credible that he really holds them.
Why, thank you, Mr. Berkeley. But does the opposite apply: you live in the US (Or close: GB) and has not studied the outside world in any depth?
This is very frustating, I guess what I wish for is a position in between Jews Rule the World and Jews are Completely Harmless. But the I also wish for a peaceful world...
Smekhovo: That might well be, but they would not have been able to catch them had they wanted.
... or heck, yes, maybe they could've caught them if they really wanted. But they would probably have opted for bombing the daylights out of them rather than catching them. (Which, coming to think of it, I believe they were in the process of when the war ended.)
Just read an item about the Mozart-thing in Berlin. There has been a meeting between Moslem leaders and Secretary of State Schäuble. And lo and behold! The magnamanious Moslems allowed that Deutsche Staatsoper would be allowed to play Idomeno in the future. So, Mr. Berkeley, tell me: Do the British have to ask the Jews if they are allowed to play the Merchant of Venice?
... Because in Denmark Holberg is very hot and so is Grundtvig, both considered cornerstones of Danishness and both deeply anti-semitic. Never had any problems with our Jewish MP's about that. I've seen MP Arne Melchior, brother of the Danish über-Rabbi enjoying Holberg in the Royal Theatre.
The Wikipedia page states the scene is not in the original libretto:
"The production, directed by Hans Neuenfels, shows King Idomeneo staggering on stage carrying the decapitated heads of Poseidon, Jesus, Buddha and Muhammad; a departure from the libretto and score."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Idomeneo
NYT confirms:
"The disputed scene is not part of Mozart’s opera, but was added by the director, Hans Neuenfels. In it, the king of Crete, Idomeneo, carries the heads of Muhammad, Jesus, Buddha and Poseidon on to the stage, placing each on a stool."
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/09/2.../
27germany.html
Erik, you see Xymph's attack on Chomsky as a deliberate, calculated action. I see it as a reaction to Chomsky's blind denials after the Walt-Mearsheimer paper. Then came the Lebanon bombings and he just lost any "xymphaty" he still had for Chomsky and jews in general. But time will make ammends. As for me I think Chomsky is just chanelling Lord Cherwell and will soon be hit in the head by a liquid fuel propelled flying zionist.
world is run by white men is not at phenomenon that has changed much since the sixties
Good to know yor partnership in the freezer with Austin Powers was a solid one... until he was released.
Neither is Russia run by Jews
Yes, that's why we hear every day a British or American pundit saying Putin is in fact a Rowlerian house-elf dreamming of great bears.
they are blackwashing Irving because he says that the Allies committed warcrimes on par with the Germans
My Patron-Saint, G. H. Hardy, would have said Irving should stop admiring himself in the mirror too much and start thinking about using an anti-God kit.
Very interesting comments, Erik.
Erik, have you read part 5 of Asia Times Hungry Bear series?
http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Cen...a/
HI29Ag01.html
Mythology aside, America's military record is abysmal. Since WWII it has confined itself to attacking what it perceived as soft targets and got most of them arse up. If ever a country was unsuited to seeking a military solution to political problems, it's America. The vast majority of its military adventures have been pissant mock wars against unarmed/disarmed targets but it lacked the weapons, strategy or wit to win even those 'cakewalks'.
Superficially, this may be hard to fathom (and it's certainly impossible for America-firsters to admit). But when one examines how corrupt and inept the Military/Industrial complex has proven to be, and compare the hype with the reality, a clear and logical explanation emerges.
The M/I complex is a taxpayer-funded rort by industrialists who've hijacked the political agenda to make war a priority. Winning to them means war, win or lose. They get to sell WWII weapons and America gets to fight WWII for the umpteenth time.
There's a big defense contractor in almost every state of the union and, thanks to a corrupt Congress, and other civilian political interference, a large proportion of these are producing redundant variations of WWII weapons and idiotic political pipe dreams and financial black holes such as BMD, the Valkyrie bomber, the very crash-prone SR71, Reagan's Rail Gun, the giant mobile canon etc etc - ad nauseum.
A threat to China will be interpreted as a threat to Russia and vise versa. As part 5 of the Hungry Bear points out, Russia and China were forming an alliance before the War on Terra (as the Earth is known in s.f. circles). Since the war was launched the speed of formation of various strategic alliances and sub-alliances, with an epicentre in either or both Russia and China has accelerated exponentially.
Iran won't be attacked because the only country on Terra in favour of Palestinizing, Lebanizing or Iraqizing Iran is Israel. China, or its interests, won't be attacked because this will start WWIII and America won't win. And it won't win because WWIII will be a 21st Century war - not just another re-run of WWII.
Xymph's objections to Chomsky's geopolitical analysis go back a long way before Walt and Mearsheimer. From time to time I refer newcomers to this long and exhaustive (not to say exhausting) essay on Chomsky's Israelophilia by Jeffrey Blankfort, who knows where all the bodies are buried:
http://www.leftcurve.org/LC29Web...es/
Chomsky.html
Hoarse, I believe what you say has merit. Once again, the apathetic pathetic American majority does not have a clue, or want a clue. The F-22 costs 200 million a copy! One damn fighter plane. The B-2, 2 billion a copy. A carrier, 4.5 billion a copy. An attack sub, 2 billion a copy. An M-1 tank, 3 million a copy. Even the easily blown to pieces Stryker costs 2 million a copy. That's not even considering the black-ops equipment developed and created with all that tax free drug money, estimated at around 500 billion a year. Half a trillion tax free unaccounted for dollars.
Thanks for the link, Rowan.
IMO Chomsky's problem is the quintessential Jewish one - verbal diahorea. He'll never use a word if he can think of a sentence to replace it and can usually manage to expand a sentence into a paragraph. I stopped reading Chomsky a couple of years ago because I got sick of converting it to raw text and deleting the blather in order to find the message. I've yet to see anything written by Chomsky which couldn't be made more readable and lucid by deleting the minimum 50% which is pretentious literary crap. People who communicate in this manner usually have something to hide.
When I read the headline saying "Muslims object to Mozart opera" I thought, - Must be Die Entfuehrung aus dem Serail! - That's a trifle harsh! - Oh, it's Idomeneo??! - Don't remember anything about Islam in that!
Then, of course, it turned out the culprit was one of those ludicrous modern stagings the Germans feel obliged to inflict on the public. If we could get rid of all those, we would be greatly indebted to radical Islam!
Incidentally, that's what's happened with the Merchant of V. - Jewists have forced it to be almost always staged with Shylock as noble hero of beautiful appearance.
Followed by a chorus of Spike Jones' "Der Fuehrer's Face."
yup, I posted two authoritative sources to the effect that the scene invoving the decapitated head of the prophet Muhammad was added by the current producer. So really the interesting thing will be to see how the tabloids ignore that fact and read it as "Muslims against Mozart".
So the US, GB are run by Jews. I guess if you are a Brit or an American that would look like a world conspiracy, just as lack of interest in the US would look like stupidity.
"The production, directed by Hans Neuenfels, shows King Idomeneo staggering on stage carrying the decapitated heads of Poseidon, Jesus, Buddha and Muhammad; a departure from the libretto and score."
Excellent point! A nazi like Neuenfels has no right to decapitate Gods on stage. It would of course have made a world of difference if the scene was scripted by Mozart himself. Just like Papa Ratzi’s speech, or how is it? Does it make a difference to the righteousness of the outrage and teeth-gnashing if he had misquoted Manuel?
But I also asked you a question. It’s a free world, of course, but until now I’ve had little but style critique from you. What would you think if the British Minister of the Interior met with a flock of rabbis to discuss whether the Royal Shakespeare Company was kosher? (And yes, I’m aware that that was not the original Berlin agenda, but that was what it became and apparently you endorse that.)
Neither is Russia run by Jews
“Yes, that's why we hear every day a British or American pundit saying Putin is in fact a Rowlerian house-elf dreamming of great bears.”
No cigar. Putin is not only dreaming of great bears, he’s a grizzly-pup munching stereoids, tooling up for major action. Not only hardware-wise, but politically too. Ever heard of the SCO? The reason the West bashes Putin is because they are scared witless of him. They didn’t make this much noise about Khorsodovsky, did they? No, in twenty years this bear will walk all over the ME and Xymp and Rowan will still mongering fear about the Jewish World Order. Maybe they are SVR-spooks.
Look! A raghead with a dynamite belt! (Hmm… he doesn’t seem to believe me. He must be a born sceptic.) But hey, look! There’s a yarmulke-head with a chequebook! (Much better, now he’s having a heart attack.) Now folks, don’t ever mention Russia again or Esquimeaux with poisoned harpoons will come and steal our freedom.
Hoarsewhisperer, I read ATOL daily. Apart from a few cranks like Henry Liu, it is the best free online rag on international relations I’ve come about. (Monde Diplo is good too, but you’d have to read French) I agree with you about America’s military record, it is pathetic. They have few battles to be proud of since the civil war, don’t make soldiers like the Germans or the Brits. No discipline. All the mean little brushfire wars has done nothing good for the Marine Corps. (Their airforce, however, is hands down the best in the world, not only in size but also in quality. Way better than the much touted IDF.) I shake my head in disgust every time I hear a Yank telling the French that the US won not only WWII but also WWI They seem to have succeeded in completely erasing the Russian front from their consciousness in respect to WWII. To them the main stage of WWII (o
To them the main stage of WWII (outside the pacific) was North Africa, Italy and France. I told one Californian guy that Monte Cassino was taken by French colonial volunteers but no way, he had seen on Discovery how…blabla, confirming my most dearly held prejustices against Americans.
They should study the Brits. During the Falklands they invented a new military concept: Blitzkrieg without tanks. I’ve managed to filch a copy of a report made for the Danish military high command, including many original battle reports from both the Brits and the Argentines. Besides not having tanks, the Brits had scanty air support and little artillery. The British just stormed the Argentine fortresses with mortars, assault rifles and hand grenades, and with a gusto as if the bunkers were stuffed with booze and whores. Their logistics was fucked up, of course, 5.000 miles away from home and all, and they shockingly took naval losses from the shitty (but plucky) Argentine air force. After a few days of fighting the Argentines took to running whenever they heard the Brits were coming to their sector. Some committed suicide rather than face the Brits. Taught them a lesson in machismo they are not likely to forget soon.
Hm. Coming to think of it, the Manuel-thing sounds fishy. Manuel was a vassal of Sultan Bayzid, I doubt very much that Manuel would provoke Islam so.
Then, of course, it turned out the culprit was one of those ludicrous modern stagings the Germans feel obliged to inflict on the public. If we could get rid of all those, we would be greatly indebted to radical Islam!
I'd fucking convert!
Hoarsewhisperer, try this on for size:
Putin and Hu is having dinner, the talk shop, they strike a deal: China’s got manpower and the industrial muscle the US used to have. Russia’s got land that China craves, they’ve got oil and short supply lines to the ME in case of er, a humanitarian crises in need of a solution. Russia has got blueprints for a modern military designed specifically to kill US hardware. Russia also - as opposed to the US - has a sensible space program. (Russia is the worlds biggest lift operator. Europe is second.) And both Russia and China has soldiers willing to assault machine gun positions with teaspoons. If they can work it out, they’d be untouchable. The opposite is true also of course, China and Russia could never conquer America. But the ocean barriers that serves the US so well for defence now becomes a liability, the US can’t effectively participate in the Great Game with supply lines half a world long, the playing field is too much in Putin’s and Hu’s favour. Go figure. That’s why you are putting madmen in the WH. Only madmen would try to play the Great Game with the deck thus stacked against them. In other words, you need a madman to push the red button.
Now, the thing is, this deal was struck years ago, this is not a blueprint, this is a plan that is now being implemented. And Putin will not forget how the West fucked over the Rodina in the nineties.
Now, Iran... they have friends, see? Their best friends are: Russia, China and add to that their new friend India. Attack on Iran? It's nuclear or nothing.
As for the hardware-stuff, an American spook warlord by the name of Victor Corpus wrote a piece for Asia Times about it. Kooky as hell and chock-full of weird agendas and phony data but his basic tactical and strategical problematics seems genuine. It's a few years old, but maybe they've still got it in their archives.
For chuckles, try googling "van Ripen Millenium Challenge", I was still laughing as the dentist did my root canal.
Actually, Voltaire did apologise to the Ottoman ambassador for giving offence by the production of his tragedy Mahomet. No-one was stupid enough to think it meant that France was about to convert to Islam.
Your search - "van Ripen Millenium Challenge" - did not match any documents.
Eric, your guess is as good as anyone's. Last I heard (in early '05) India was still contemplating Uncle Sam's carrots and sticks. I'd be interested in any evidence that India has firmly committed to BRIC. Its Gurkhas had a reputation for striking the balance between success and self-sacrifice.
The nuke option for Iran presents two problems: blowback and escalation: retalliation and thinking one knows when to quit, but then feeling obliged to keep nuking until everthing and everyone glows in the dark - just to be on the safe side.
The biggest problem for war predictors is guessing the motivational trigger points of the main actors. The biggest problem for Americans is that their actor seems to believe his own bullshit.
I wouldn't be at all surprised to discover that Bush actually thinks he's God.
Eric, your guess is as good as anyone's. Last I heard (in early '05) India was still contemplating Uncle Sam's carrots and sticks. I'd be interested in any evidence that India has firmly committed to BRIC.
They've signed a gas deal with Iran. A pipeline is in the works. Maybe I'm overstating evidence, but this war is about energy so I find it less than innocuous. A pipeline usually means long, or at least middle term commitment.
The nuke option for Iran presents two problems: blowback and escalation: retalliation and thinking one knows when to quit, but then feeling obliged to keep nuking until everthing and everyone glows in the dark - just to be on the safe side.
That's why the Crazies have been put in the WH. No sane person would start a nuclear war.
Your search - "van Ripen Millenium Challenge" - did not match any documents.
That would suggest you live in the US. I've heard that "democracy human rights" returns no matches in China.
Maybe the Israelis are meant to start the nuclear part of it, the scapegoat theory revisited: the US hopes they can compartamentalise things and it would be a temptation for Iran to play along. One thing for Iran is to take a nuclear exchange with Israel; Iran is big and can take a lot of hits. Another thing is to fight US directly, the US can waste Iran completely. Very speculative, I admit.
you get rid of Iran and Israel with one blow.
The biggest problem for Americans is that their actor seems to believe his own bullshit.
His own? You think Bush writes his own lines? You have great trust in his abilities 
Anonymous, try this:
http://www.exile.ru/2002-Decembe...1/
war_nerd.html
Brecher is a spook if there ever was one and I've not been able to find a report of the exercise online, so maybe it merits checking. But I don't think so, it smells so MIC.
Actually, Voltaire did apologise to the Ottoman ambassador for giving offence by the production of his tragedy Mahomet. No-one was stupid enough to think it meant that France was about to convert to Islam.
Never said it did. It's a straw man argument. Just like if I argued, that if 300 MEP's enjoy tax paid drinks and snacks with a bunch of kikes it doesn't mean that all of Europe is going to mutilate their penises all of a sudden.
Europe is not going to convert, not for a long time at least. Islam is the anti-thesis to the last 300 years of European thought.
India-Iran pipeline:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world...sia/
4070916.stm
India can have the carrot and eat it too.
Actually, Voltaire did apologise to the Ottoman ambassador for giving offence by the production of his tragedy Mahomet. No-one was stupid enough to think it meant that France was about to convert to Islam.
I don't know of this episode. It seems to me that Voltaire apologised to a country, not a religion. The Ottoman Empire carried clout back then and I doubt that a guy like Voltaire should've done as you suggest if not pressed to do so by the king. Maybe that's why he apologised to an ambassador, not an imam.
And if Voltaire's thought dreams could be seen,(like yours and mine,)they'd probably put his head in a gullitoine.
Anon, try Van Riper.
Brecher is a spook if there ever was one and I've not been able to find a report of the exercise online, so maybe it merits checking. But I don't think so, it smells so MIC.
For chuckles, try googling "van Ripe(r) Millenium Challenge"
Yep, done all that - so what makes Brecher a spook? His perspectives on 'insurgency' make a helluva lot more sense than the drivel put out by Bush Rummy Blair and the MSM etc. Brecher at least explains how and why insurgents usually win - and at what price. He also explains, as well as any expert, the learning curve all resistances go through and regularly touches on the only insurgency solution that's ever worked - kill everyone - genocide. (Welcome to the Catch-22 Iraq mock war - "we're gonna stay 'til we've beaten the insurgents").
Yep, done all that - so what makes Brecher a spook? His perspectives on 'insurgency' make a helluva lot more sense than the drivel put out by Bush Rummy Blair and the MSM etc.
That's one of the reasons, he makes sense. A telltale trait with spooks, there’s not many politicians amongst spooks. Also, he uses an alias. There’s no Gary Brecher, and the photo he uses is of a Norwegian jazz musician.
Most of his best pieces are from small, contemporary wars, terrorist wars, insurgent wars, mostly CIA-productions. His knowledge about those is probably first hand, gained from his stations. That’s where his bigotry comes from. Nothing to make a racist out of a man like being stationed a few years in some third world hellhole. The perspective is that from the ground, not that from the books, there’s no high-brow B.S. that one would suspect from one who has learned his war-stuff from books. His pieces would reflect the academe of wars instead of the common sense perspective. He has inside dope, he accredits it to unsolicited emails received from boys of the Acronym Gang.
He has lots of insider knowledge that purportedly has been mailed to him unsolicited. And he never writes about real, pitched battles. Of more than a hundred pieces, we’ve yet to see him do one on Napoleonic warfare, the golden age of war. Of course, his originality lies otherwhere, but just one? The Sun of Austerlitz – first hinged battle in recorded history? Or the Battle of Marengo, a peal of thunder announcing that a new force has come to Europe? Napoleon was the father of modern war, for Heavens sake! He even calls Napoleon small, a propaganda-slur that derives from Punch Magazine. And the mistake about the size of a Roman legion is VERY embarrassing. Well, maybe he’s not a spook but if he’s a true war nerd, my wife is Scarlett Johansson.
I like Brecher, he has many very sharp and original observations like “war is just demography on fast forward.” And he can be really hilarious when he gets up a good head of warmongering.
(Van Riper!? Sorry, my mistake, then.)
Another thing: he's very much in awe of North Korea. That may be merited or not, but warwise NK is a fringe issue, while I suspect it is very much a spook issue. On the other hand he writes nothing on neither Russia nor China which smacks of the official Omerta surrounding these elephants in the living room.
And he buys into the idea that Osama is legit, which no intelligent person should do. He does't buy Zarkhavi so why Osama? He's got an agenda all right.
And if Voltaire's thought dreams could be seen,(like yours and mine,)they'd probably put his head in a gullitoine.
Probably. Had he been borne a hundred years later. (Unless I'm missing a pun with "gullitoine")
Voltaire had many enemies at Charles II's court. Once, a courtier slipped him a note during a dinner saying "Voltaire is an ("un", in French - back then the language of English kings) idiot" with a fake signature: Charles II. Charles was curious and asked Voltaire what was in the note. "Sorry, I cannot say, your Majesty". The king pressed, but Voltaire was adamant. "Reading this note would be lèse majesté" The king granted him pardon in advance and ordered him to read it. He read: "Voltaire is one idiot, Charles the other."
I wonder how many Moslem rulers of today would abide humour like that from a courtier.
Kings were in general much more tolerant than today’s democratic rulers. (Not to mention the theocratic ones). In the day of Louis XIV, Paris was a veritable hotbed of dissent; Voltaire was not the only one mocking royalty or indeed religion. A guy like Paul Scarron threw the hottest parties in tout Paris, on account of his brilliant jokes about the royal couple. The King liked his jokes, so he paid him a handsome retainer. Of course, sometimes someone stepped over the line, but the guilloutine was a republican invention. Kings rarely executed people. Mostly dissenters were threwn in the slammer for a day or two to cool off and if they persisted, got, er, expelled from the country. (Banished, the dictionary say, I dunno.) Scarron, eventually, fell into disgrace, but all the king did was to retract his retainer.
That's exactly what the U.S.A. needs; a king.. A King and health care. We would live happily ever after!
Well, xymfie, the rats in your skull have gone and done it - they've eaten your brain and are now chomping on the stem.
BTW, Zionism RRRRRAWWWWWWXXXXXXXXX!!!!!!!!!!
"That's one of the reasons, he makes sense. A telltale trait with spooks..."
Fair suck of the sausage, Erik. Doesn't this strike you as a logical fallacy? If not, try it this way:
That's one of the reasons we should believe Bush, he doesn't make sense. A telltale trait with people who aren't spooks. (Not so classy, is it?)
Having said all the above I agree that Brecher's bona fides are obscure - at best. For one thing, to take up your point, he advocates torture and genocide - devices even Rummy has been reluctant to emblazon in neon lights.
The point Brecher makes, that the US is fighting half-assed wars in Afg & Iraq, is perfectly valid to anyone familiar with WS Lind's numerous essays on 4G war. What Brecher doesn't say is that the goal of these wars isn't victory in the traditional sense. It's comprehensively ruining the targets and suspending them in this ruined state for as long as the US taxpayers will put up with being gulled by a handful of war profiteers.
His pro-war stance is an indicator that he's part of the problem rather than part of the solution. But he's amusing and educational, no matter whose side he's on...
The logic seems sound to me. I'd rather trust a spook than a politician.
Brecher advocates genocide and torture because both work if done properly. Spooks are rational, politicians are not.
As you may have surmised, I don't believe the neocons are stupid and I don't really think Brecher believes so either. The fallacy of logic lies in assuming that Iraq
(Fumbling with the keyboard)
...assuming that the Iraq-war is not going according to plan, as you yourself point out. The reason the neocons don't make sense is not because they are incompetent but because they are not coming clean about their purpose with Iraq but keep talking about spreading democracy. And Brecher doesn't state this obvious fact, another spook mark. There were other small details that made me pause when I read Brecher, I don't remember them anymore.
I wrote above that politicians are not rational, that's untrue. Their rationality just has other premises and purposes as that of spooks or military. I think most spooks are patriots and I think most politicians has no values at all.
As for the pro-war: I'm a conscious objector myself but I have despaired about brining war to an end. Might as well enjoy the show. War beats any sport hands down.
Kings... I don't know if you are being sarcastic, HP, but maybe the idea is not as stupid as it sounds. I would certainly prefer a king in Denmark to what we've got now. Monarchies has had bad press for many years, but they have many advantages to democracy. And disadvantages of course, but IMO it would be worth trying.
I've studied Nigeria and Westerners would wonder why people would vote known criminals into office term after term. But the African logic went that if they elected a new dictator, he would then have to start afresh with the stealing. The old scoundrel was assumed to have been stealing for so many years, that his thirst would be somewhat slaked. Same logic applies to kings.
Another thing was, that many Nigerians admired rich people and despised people who was too stupid to become rich when they had a public office to bilk. Same logic, I'm afraid, applies to kings too. People admire rich kings.
Like it or not, money grants nobility. And sex, of course.
Democracy/monarchy… The way democracy works today, pits the electorate against itself, it's the divide an conquer of the Democratic Prince. Most people doesn’t have the slightest idea about how society works, and asking them to vote is like asking a plumber with a brain tumour how he thinks the surgeon should proceed. The party-system creates fault lines in society by positing that it is of material interest to the voter which party is robbing him, thereby diverting attention from the robbing itself. A king would unite people, IMO, even if there’d always be dissent of course. But the dissent would be directed against the state, not against a party.
The problem is that you cannot swim in the same river twice. You’d have to revamp monarchy, maybe with some checks and balances. And call it something else, of course.
Hm… I’m being argumentative; I don’t think I really mean it. All said and done, democracy has done well so far, so one should be careful about fixing something that works. But heck, I’d love to have a (real) king. Would be very sexy, IMO.
Hey, thank you for directing me to William Lind, even if it took som googling; lots of Lind's around. Way better than Brecher, if not as funny.
I'm not so sure, Erik. The theoretical advantage of democracy is that ultimate power is vested in a majority of citizens - not in a single unassailable individual, with the usual human failings and prejudices.
Eric, wasn't the first consideration for ruler of the new America a Prussian Prince, to become King of America?
Prince Heinrich?
I'm not so sure, Erik. The theoretical advantage of democracy is that ultimate power is vested in a majority of citizens - not in a single unassailable individual, with the usual human failings and prejudices.
Yes. I guess that is pretty much the nub of the problem. I mean the advantage, of course. But the theoretical concept of citizen power... Well, it sound very odd: democracy is the people governing... themselves. If the people are able to govern themselves, why not cut out the expensive middlemen all together? And Hitler was elected and hugely popular. And Bush... He still enjoys amazing popularity, thirty percent plus last time I looked.
Eric, wasn't the first consideration for ruler of the new America a Prussian Prince, to become King of America? Prince Heinrich?
Hehe... Hadn't heard about that. The very first American king was Columbus, he was appointed by the Catholic Kings of Spain even before the Discovery. And as far as I remember, his title was approved by the Vatican soon thereafter. (And later rescinded. He had been promised - get this - 10 percent of all proceeds coming from America. In perpetuity. Inheritable.)
But it would have been pretty, King Heini the First. The Danish royal family is of German stock, so take my words, German royalty can be every bit as entertaining as Anglo. You should have said yes, figurehead kings are fun.
Gulp! My countrymen will kill me. The first American king was of course Leif Erikson the Lucky. Shame on me!
The Danish royal family is of German stock - not any more, it won't be - Laborde de Monpezat, I think
Yes, also a very amusing person. To his eternal (and publicly expressed) grief, a woman marrying a king becomes queen, while he does not become king but merely a prince consort, so he doesn't really count, not to Danes anyway; most of them (us) hate his effete and haughty manners like poison. His consternation about not being king was more the painful for him, as Margrethe as God meant women to be submissive and obedient serfs, and his lack of a proper title created all sorts of problems vis a vis both his woman and kids. This was in the seventies, the throne has better spindoctors today.
With small kingdoms like Denmark, you don't have enough nobles to perpetuate a throne without importing princes and princesses. The mother of Queen Margrethe was a Swede, but don't walk up to a Dane and tell him that to his face, Danes are peaceful people but you can push them too far.
Oww so now there IS an Establishment which is not a complete Israel puppet. Aha. So it follows, Zionists are one in a long list of power groups.
Now We're making progress here.
An Ode
She was an exotic beauty of Yemenite extraction.
The hottest piece of tail on the kibbutz.
But, alas, she wouldn't have urinated upon me had I been aflame.
Oh, damn you, Jewish temptress.
Oh, damn you, cruel fate.
I am Rowan Berkeley.
ha, I see its little snout, thank you for drawing my attention, smekhovo.
I don't think Yemenite Jews spent much time on kibbutsim though. The most famous one, Ofra Haza, started out making gorgeous records with an authentic yemeni flavour, then got involved with a sort of techno style producer, and finally married an idiot who got her onto heroin and eventually gave her AIDS. This is widely understood to be evidence of what a nasty degenerate place Israel actually is.
Ofra Haza was not from a kibbutz.
She was Shechunat HaTikva in Tel Aviv.
Her first records were standard Israeli pop (Western-style; NOT ethnic).
She made one authentic Yemenite record.
After that record was sampled by American rappers, tracks from that release were remixed and charted in Europe.
She was then signed by US-based Sire Records, where she did 2 records, one of which Thomas "She Blinded me with Science" Dolby produced.
She did not get into heroin; her shitbag of a husband liked to take it up the rear.
not heroin, ok, but as regards her records, it seems to me that the non techno version of 'yemenite songs' came before the techno one (though the techno one became a global spash hit, and was sampled a lot, and even ripped off eventually by madonna, with a completely different version of 'im nin alu'.
My point was not really to pose as an expert in Israeli pop music, so much as to gently dissociate myself from the person who claims to be me, as is always best, otherwise some idiot will assume every post under my name is genuine.
It's nice to see we have Israeli readers. As an israeli music fan, can you tell me whether it would be fair to describe Wreck & Drool, and Drone Lebanon, as anarcho-zionists? I did try contacting them via their myspace pages to ask them, but they didn't reply.
You can listen to Wreck & Drool vs. Drone lebanon in a long track from the album of "Noisemass 2005" here:
http://www.bolt.com/
theeasternfr...dio_large_PAGE2
I notice that they have used William Burroughs' "Last Words" in such a way that you don't hear Burroughs saying:
Listen! Listen! Listen!
I rub out all the words and reports of the board, forever.
I rub out your Thing Police, for ever, for eve - r.
I rub out the words of Marx Lenin Einstein Freud fraud, forever.
I rub out the formulas of Einstein Oppenheimer, forever.
I rub out their words, forever.
I rub out the Qabalah, forever.
I rub out the Talmud, forever.
I rub out all the formulas and directives
of the Elders of Minraud, forever.
I rub out the word, forever.
Incidentally, James Gruerholz (who is of course Jewish, but was Burroughs' assistant, amanuensis, and lover during the last decade or so of his life, says in his book that Burroughs once expressed the view to him that 'Hitler was right'.
This is further evidence, if any were needed, that the most potentially dangerous 'anti-Semites' often seem to acquire from somewhere Jewish lovers, spouses, or at least sex partners.
I am hoping this will happen to me, though of course I am not gay. The story of Esther seems to encourage Jewesses to sacrifice themselves in this way, to mollify the anti-Semitic Beast.
Eric, since you had the interest to find William S Lind, perhaps you'd be interested in the 3 part BBC doco The Power of Nightmares. It made a serious attempt to unravel the ideological claptrap surrounding the War on Terra.
Evidence that it was very/too close to the mark was provided when a 3-part "other side of the coin" doco was hastily cobbled together for balance(C)...
If you can't find the live video the full transcripts of TPON are a good read. They may still be available on the BBC web site. Information Clearing House also published them in full at the time the program was attracting interest/opposition - late '04 / early '05.
Erik, not Eric. Sorry, I keep forgetting you're a viking.
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