More bullshit, as usual.
French suburbs are a tinder box of resentment caused by poverty, unemployment, and racism.
And how do you explain that Hindus or Chinese are wealthier than Moslems? Racism has nothing to do with that.
I don´t understand why Leftists lose your good points supporting such a depravity that Islam embodies. Don´t forget how they treat their women and the dominant role they give to religion forgetting material issues. It is there where you will find most of their problems not to racism.
However I agree that Zionism takes advantage and promote these differences, but the differences are there, why to deny them?
Response from Udo Ulfkotte regarding Wayne Madsen's article :
"funny what people report who have not read the book. Its quite right that I have written a book on espionage. But I never have written any sentence like this:
QUOTE Wayne Madsen
The book, Der Krieg im Dunkeln (War in the Dark) by Udo Ulfkotte, formerly a correspondent for the Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung, provides details of the operations of two Israeli intelligence units -- the Metsada, which specializes in sabotage, including "false flag" terrorist attacks and assassinations; and LAP (Lohamah Psichlogit), which engages in psychological warfare.
ENDQUOTE
I have written that there was rumours within the German and UK intelligence that some Israelis MIGHT (and I never mentioned "Metsada" or "LAP" - like Wayne Madson did) have jumped on the train to get the best out of the situation that you have discribed. As I am a friend of the state of Israel I clearly deny that Israel was "behind" the outbreak of unrest of muslims last october in France. What I have written is that my sources said they heared that Israel MIGHT have treid to encourage them AFTER the outbreak of the unrest but that nobody knows if this is wrong or right. It was just a question. And even beeing a clear fried of Israel I have quoted that remarks - nothing more.
I privately DON`t think that the Israeli intelligence has anything to do with the unrest in France but being honest if there is quotes like that I had to take it. The reader is intelligent enough to make up his mind ...
Best regards from Udo"
Udo crawling to beg forgiveness of jewists, all too familiar.
I wonder if "Jose Maria" will tell us which Hindu countries are richer than UAE, Qatar or Kuwait.
Another great post, Xymph! 
There is nothing more pernicious, devious and threatening to humanity on this planet than Zionism and its supporters! It is truly born of the devil.
The sooner God's judgment descends on Zionism and Zionists, the better. And for those anti-Zionists who are unnerved by deceptive accusations of harboring 'hatred', it's perfectly OK to hate Satan and his worshipers - Bush, Olmert, Sharon, etc. They are all murderers and so we know that they are the enemies of God. Remember that God hates evil and the devil, so we are in good company Sooner, rather than later, the sons of Darkness and the devil will be destroyed FOREVER, including all those bloodthirsty lions of Judah, who will be melted :O
I've read about the riots in France and not read anywhere they were directed at Jews. They're directed at police, and parked cars, and the issue is employment.
Zionism is racist and bloody, but so is Americanism. Read William Engdahl's article on Asiatimes if you want to know who the real "Satan" is.
Complete and utter bullshit from someone who apparently never set a foot in Paris. For the record I live there, and the Arab and African communities are everything except "insignificant". In some suburbs they are in majority, and the whites are the minority.
The revolts are essentially racial. It's the result of the impossibility for the French educational system and the French society to absorb so many immigrants so rapidly. If you think otherwise, come and have a look yourselves instead of bullshitting a few thousand miles away.
Only very remotely and by Nazi-style methods could Sarkozy be tagged "a Jew". For example, this from Wikipedia:
"[H]is grandfather, a Sephardic Jew who converted to Roman Catholicism and married a Roman Catholic woman, was said never to have passed on his own religious roots to his grandchildren, having turned his back on his Jewish roots when he migrated to France in the beginning of the 20th century. Nicolas Sarkozy, like his brothers, is a baptised and professing Roman Catholic.
Similar to his maternal grandfather, his father Paul Sarkozy never taught him or his brothers Hungarian, or made any effort to teach them about their ethnic background.
The Zionist imperative of promoting the ‘clash of civilizations’ to allow it to steal land from Muslims requires bad ideas which ruin lives everywhere.
It was Xymph's willingness to focus on the global costs of Zionism, and not just to treat it as a regional issue, that first made me perk up my ears at this site. Keep up the good work.
Well well, what do you know...we have jewish apologists like Jose Maria and Numeral telling us how the Zionists couldn't have orchestrated or ignited the French riots. After all, its pretty clear to me that the Zionists did 9-11, and the Communist Jews came to their backing to cover their asses up via the mainstream media, and no one said "boo". A ppl who can do 9-11 and get away with it in open daylight, can do anything else.
"rumours" of Jews doing evil, generally end up being true...Udo knows this too, so he'll let serious investigators further research the perpetrators of the riots...however there are social and ethnic problems in the banlieus...it wasn't a "Muslim" thing...there were non-Muslim Africans involved in it too.
So FatCap, tell us then what you think of sarko's provocations of Muslims, and staging or igniting riots?
And why should any immigrants in France believe they'll get a fair deal from the French state, quite a lot of them know how the French treated the harkis?
harkis...whats that?
eelpie | 10.27.06 - 2:50 pm |
Well, Zionism is hardly Jewish or helpful to Jews. Sarkozy could be a Martian and so long as he is yet another wealthy powerful criminal going along with the New Bigotry, he's a Zionist. The Jewishness quetion is an invitation ty Jews to illustrate the fact that they really do have deception to inferior outsiders as a valued cultural characteristic, that they have twelve different explanations for everything. Sarkozy's as Jewish as any of the Russians they brought in to counter the Mitzrahim population with their white skin. The question of whether Jews are a race or a religion is a non-question, one of the canards they love to waste our time with, because first of all they have always treated the concept as a race (indeed, through tribalism their race preceds the modern concept of race; they sang about the extermination of the Amelekites millenia before Hitler), and as the most dissemling will tell you, you're Jewish for perfectl;y legal purposes in Israel DEPENDING ON BLUTSANTEIL. Think about it: not Synagogue attendance, not charitable donations, but your blood -- like the Nazis.
It's all so painfully obvious. This is where Liberalism will take you. France has always been on the cutting edge of that revolution.
The Muslims are only opportunists taking advantage of this socialist freedom on their way to destroying it.
They don't migrate there in droves just for the cheese and wine. Not to mention that any place on earth is better than the tyranny and supression they came from. Ironically, they bring that with them.
well said, Xymphora....This subject needs to be spread further on the internet, and into the public sphere.
Meanwhile, Numeral claims Udo denies it! Yet Numeral,provides no link, while Udo claims to be a friend of israel...we know how israel treats its friends! Does Udo?
Damsel in distress:
For Israel, the results of the American debate over the future of the war in Iraq are of critical importance. A US retreat will place Israel in grave danger. The eastern front, whose demise the military "experts" were quick to announce in 2003 to justify slashing the defense budget, will make a comeback - replete with massive quantities of arms and tens of thousands of trained jihadi soldiers who will believe that they just won their jihad against the US. Moreover, if the US retreats, the IDF will find itself facing a US-armed and trained Shi'ite army. That is, if the US withdraws, Israel could potentially find itself facing an enemy force better trained and equipped than the IDF.
(Caroline Glick)
http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Sat...icle%
2FShowFull
Eastern front? Delusions of grandeur getting to Mr.Cohen again?
"That is, if the US withdraws, Israel could potentially find itself facing an enemy force better trained and equipped than the IDF."
(Caroline Glick)
It's amazing that few assurances where made by the US that a nationalist insurgency was not a major concern of the US war shills.
History is replete with proofs that armed military aggression against any nation by a foreign power will produce fierce patriotic resistance to the invaders. The US had to know this. Also Iran is it self a prime example of the rejection of foreign interference.
I believe the primary over all game plan is more to do about maintaining a constant environment of instability for the purpose of entertaining the pathological mindsets behind the curtain. If they were as visible as, say, Romania's Ceaucescu, they would eventually be exposed and opposed by the people. I guess what I am getting at is that it's more about instability then complete control, something they will never have, or maybe never want, if more nation states begin to recognize their (Zionist-Banking cabal) modus operandi.
What is needed is an international war, rejection, of international money and excessive wealth at the community level. Am I being naive?
they, the 666, came for our land
they came for our homes
they took our gold
they stole our water
they took our goats
the goats were shot-too much work their preference is for welfare from america
now they take usa, german tax dollars
they kill, kill, kill and hate
their hatred for all others is so deep they are warped, delusional, traitors, and deserving of the hate that they create
they are histories plague bearers
plague bearers, thieves, deceivers
and always they blame others
xander am i. i am xander.
don't want the poor fella, felline taking blame for what i write as a response to what i see.
Interesting interview here concerning growing distrust and enlightenment of 9/11 attack:
http://iamthewitness.com/
Hufschm..._26Oct2006.html
It could be one of the catalyst in galvanizing public opinion about occupied America. Contrary to the belief that people are a sleeping heard there is growing awareness of what and who is behind the curtain of history's staged disaters.
Don't think there will ever be a "rejection of international money"--after all, there is always someone else who will do anything for it.
"666"....is all of America.
Its quite hidden--but the Puritans and the Amsterdam-London Hebrews seemed to have gotten along quite well. Thus Wall St., the Livingstone's. ect. John Jay..ect.
The recent "shopping list" created by Senator Warner (another Chosen One), appears to be pretty firm on unending war.
http://presszoom.com/story_11949...9492/html--
just look at these. Are these necessary. If you have "enemies", I guess they must be.
As the Rep. Congressman from this area said, "We have a lot of enemies"..
WHO is the WE???????
Everybody must die for Israel. Since 2,000 years ago when Nero began the destruction of the State of Israel and Rome changed the name to
Syria-Palestina. I like the sound of "Palestina".
Therefore, the first book of the New Testament..."Revelations"...called Nero.."The Beast", the Number "666"..
and Rome as a scarlett woman atop mountains. So everyone gets nervous when they see "666". YOU SHOULD.
Guess who invented the idea?
Please let me know if any of that is incorrect. Now, of course..all has been turned around and "Rome" is the U.S., which has been run by Hebrews from the very beginning (Dutch East India Company, Boston Tea..anybody?)
Of course, we will have to go through the myth of the Indians sitting down with the Pilgrims again and again until all Walmarts have unloaded their Thanksgiving merchandise. And the newest bombers are just sitting waiting for delivery.
"WE HAVE ENEMIES." See "Somebody Blew Up America...lots of who, who, who's.
http://www.amiribaraka.com/blew.html
I'm not sure why he is on a campaign to glorify the Rosenbergs--
Since when asked by a white female student years ago--"What can we do?"
He replied: "You can die, thats the best thing you can do." (!!! Thats pretty funny, actually)
But most of the poem is good:
"Who got fat from plantations..
Who live on Wall street..."
who?
Who tell the lies..Who in disguise.." Its a good take on 911
and U.S./Hebrew history except for
the worry about those dreaded "Nazis". Who "backed Hitler".
Who cares. At this point. We all know all history is a fraud.
How did it go..the English and French got in a war with the Russian's to get the Turks out of Palestina--for who?
cjenn,
Israel didn't have a state under Rome. The area was called Judea by the Roman's.
It was known as Canna by the Greeks. The Jews didn't really exist according to international archeology. They were most likely nomad mercenaries hired by the Greeks to police the region. Sort of like the Shik of India were hired by the British to police India. Their Biblical history was made up during the Hellenic period while they became comfortable with their new occupation and control of the region. Even half of the Israeli archeologist say they can't prove that there was a place or tribe called Israel. Mesopotamia, Assyria and Egypt have no mention of the "Hebrews" anywhere in their own recorded histories. It's shear fiction.
When these so-called "Hebrews" got uppity with the Romans, the Roman's sent them packing back into the wilderness. Archeologist also proved that there was never a Solomon's Temple. Just Herod's Temple, who was more Roman in his self interest, then "Jewish".
If you ever go to the Middle East and come across a snake, step on its head and kill it before it tells you it's one of the "chosen".
Yes, cjenn, history is a fraud.
Getting a lot of information from
Abram Leon Sachar (former President of Brandeis)--
(Revised edition, 1968.
"...through the 5th C. a reaction against religious laxness...the "scribes" forerunners of the Pharisees were the interpreters of the Law, the leaders in the synagogues..the "law of God" must be strictly observed and that ISRAEL must remain a separate people")... ecet ect..
So with all these "Israelites" and
"Israel" quoted in every line of the Bible and writers like Sachar (his son wrote "The Jews in America")...
Its hard to imagine why the archeologists couldn't find any evidence. We MUST try to tell that to all the Church goers tomorrow--
morning!
How are we going to explain to Christians, who base their lives (and all the U.S. governments money, and all our futures--on their "relationship" with Israel and the "God of Israel)..and not to mention all their business dealings with their Jewish friends--that there was no such thing as "Israel".
For a people with "no history" they created quite a story.
The one "Bishop" Tutu said.."they handed us the Bible and told us to close our eyes and the next thing we knew "they" had our land and we had the Bible."
The Bible has been the driving force for Jews and Christians to exploit and conquer the world for the last 2,000 years.
How can I say--with absolute validity--" archeologists say that Israel and Israelites didn't exist!??
I think Tigs is exaggerating, but the truth is almost as extreme as his version - for instance, rather than claiming that the Israelites fabricated the whole of their supposed ancient history during Hellenistic times, it would be much more defensible to say that they at least started during the Babylonian exile, so that the materials were ready at hand for a full blown ideological offensive as soon as Cyrus gave them the capacity to 'return to their homeland'.
To get a sense of where serious archeology is at relative to zionism's false claims, you could start here:
http://www.bibleinterp.com/artic.../
copenhagen.htm
I would have to doubt the claim of a "Babylonian exile". The first starting point for Judaism/Zionism you could make a good case for? When the scribe Ezra started to weave his web of lies.
cjenn,
Christianity, is a rebuttal to the Old Testament. Christians shouldn't have problems with that. That's why there are two Books, the "OLD" and the "NEW"
Testament.
There are some good writing's in the Old Testament, the Canticles of Canticles (Songs of Solomon), some of the penitential psalms, for example.
The Hellenic Gospels are the moral rejection of what was on the way of becoming the Pharisees Talmud and eventually Zionist justification. The second rejection of the out right message of Christ surfaced through the Reformation where the emphases became the Old Testament God. Again, justification for rejecting the wisdom of Christ is witnessed by the hardness of the new Pharisees like Farwell, Robertson and the Zionist Christian movement in the US.
Christ's message was meant to be universal.
Rowan,
You might find this interesting:
http://www.vtjp.org/articles/
His...ate_Zionism.htm
Eelpee should assume people here can read. According to the same Wikipedia article, which he omitted to mention, Sarko's mom is Jewish:
"He met Andrée Mallah, Nicolas Sarkozy's mother, in 1949. Andrée Mallah, then a law student, was the daughter of Benoît Mallah, a wealthy doctor (or surgeon) with a well-established reputation in the very bourgeois 17th arrondissement of Paris. Benoît Mallah was originally a Sephardic Ottoman Jew from Salonica, (Ottoman Greece). According to Jewish genealogical societies, the Mallah family of Salonica anciently came from Provence in southern France, which they had probably left at the time of the Jewish expulsions in the Middle Ages.
Paul Sarkozy and Andrée Mallah settled in the 17th arrondissement and had three sons: Guillaume, born in 1951, who is an entrepreneur in the textile industry, Nicolas, born in 1955 and François, born in 1957 (now a researcher in biology)"
X got it right, Sarko's Jewish by blood, like Kerry in America.
Fatcap, being French, might want to look at the racist organisation Betar's involvement with Mossad and the drug trade. The same organisation whose thugs beat Professor Faurisson to within an inch of life in the presence of a dozen cops who did nothing.
Hello, Man from Atlan. We should take care in not mixing all things up, the immigration problem and the Mossad/Betar/Zionist things. This is for Salman Hossain too, who points at the social/racial character of the riots, and then talks about provocations of Sarkozy against the "Muslims". What provocations ? Sarkozy has publicly said he would facilitate the construction of mosques in most French towns, if he was elected. He was instrumental in the creation of a muslim Council, in which the islamists of the UOIF are very influential.
Now about the thesis, the Mossad initiated, or helped, the riots. The riots are the symptoms of a grave social and racial problem and its leaders didn't have an overt Muslim message. The only party who did profit from the riots is the FN, who is routinely accused of antisemitism, was opposed to the first Gulf war, and defended recently the right for Iran to have the bomb. It's not zionist, look it up for yourself.
From my experience, many French Jews of the middle class are indeed worried about the progression of Islam in France. No influential Zionist leader, however, ever said a word against the massive immigration which led to this problem. On the contrary. So, until further evidence, I assume the real Zionist goal in France is to destroy the French social fabric with massive immigration/racial mix-up, with Israel as a backup when things will turn really bad. Same tactics, differents eras.
I would have to doubt the claim of a "Babylonian exile".
Israeli Archaeologist Israel Finkelstein (no relation to Norman, the other Norman or Arthur) discovered evidence that while Jews actually did have a politically meaningless claim to being in that area for very long, the Egyptian slavery appears to have been made up to fit in with other local mythohistories. If this is true, the consequences are amazing, because right there in that first persecution you have the template for aggrandizing lying involving horror stories. This is not to say for a minute that Jewish persecution did not happen, we are concerned that we have never accepted the crappy, contemptuous and often obviously impossible presentation (everyone always hates us and only just because we're Jewish; really it's morally indistinguishable from British people claiming they conquered the world because of superior blood), and here is the blueprint. The tribal unity of the Jews millenia before the concept of the nation, their astonishing, genocidal hatred for all other human life, their special status as favorites of the Almighty, the genocidal criterion and the reversal which eventually was reworked into the Uris Exodus story (victims become conquerors). Disturbingly, because of culturally different appreciations of materialism, one can even see a distressing streak of gold-obsession in the looted reparations which you would think God could've foreseen wound up laying the trap of idolatry (Almost all Egyptian gold had some arguable religious reference; it is impossible that slaves could loot all they could carry and not come away with many idols).
It's not Zionist, look it up for yourself.
Rrrrright. Because if it really had been Zionist agents provocateurs, they would carried banners that "HEY, WE ARE Z. A. P.s!" for reasons of space.
It should be added that the claim of the Mallah family to be originally from Provence is no doubt fraudulent, concoted to make them seem more French. There never were any expulsions of Jews from Provence (the comtat Venaissin, around Avignon) where they always lived under the protection of the Popes. I wonder whether the Mallah are on any list of those Jews from Salonica allegedly holocausted in the 1940s?
Greetings, FatCap. I do sympathise with concerns of various cultures about rapid assimilation of immigrants, be it in America, or Europe. Those concerns should however be addressed to those fat capitalists (sorry)that allow and benefit from that very rapid immigration.
I'm also quite aware of the FN and disagree with the analysis that either they or Sarko ultimately benefited from the riots, though I can believe he's now sucking up to the Muslims; it's the socialists under Segolene Royal that's now leading in the polls.
FatCap, it might be that the "non-Zionist" FN that gained the most from the riots, but nevertheless we can't rule out Zionist involvement, either through Sarko or the Zionist media opportunists, for it seems like it was their intention to create havoc. Better yet, just because Sarko "claims" to want to publicly "build" mosques, or was "influential" in bringing about an influential "islamist council", he is still a shape-shifting snake. We can't trust ppl like him. He's tryna "help" muslims in order tor subvert and later trap them. I'd be highly suspicious of anything he says or does...including pretending ot be altruistic towards muslims. Oh BTW...where are the mosques he promised muslims? I'll tell u about another liar from his tribe who is planning on taking over liberal politics here in Canada. His name is Ignatieff. He operates just like Sarko. Left wing, but yet deceptive. Allegedly supports human rights, but loses "no sleep" over deaths in Qana. Then shape shifts and claims Qana massacre is a war crime. And then tells the Jews that heloves them and Israel. Then does an about face and says Israel is doing wrong. Then says Hezbollah is terrorist. Then says terrorism is wrong. Then supports war in iraq (always did). Like this is the crap we get from Jewish politicians. An ultra-deceptive lot. Just throw their asses in the fire(sic!)...lolol
Just the other day, the Sikh fellow down at my local 7-11 charged me for a large Slurpee when I had, indeed, only a medium.
More Zionist shenanigans.
Will it never end?
Ignatieff is not himself jewish, although he is indeed a profoundly vile person.
smekhovo, u're wrong...he is a jew...and so is the other runner up's wife (Bob Rae's wife) to the Leadership candidate amongst liberals is Jewish.
Are you sure, smekhovo? I thought he was. He certainly seems to be--
1. Self-described "liberal" human rights theorist who backed the invasion of Iraq. (That's usually a dead giveaway.)
2. Author of books on Isaiah Berlin and Raphael Lemkin.
3. Left the U.S. for Canadian politics at the time of the big Jewish push for control there.
4. Writes for the New Republic.
just read the name "Ignatieff"...the prefix "ignat" is 100% jewish...like that other yhid called "ignatus loyola" and his jew comrades that created the Jesuit Order in the catholic church. Then u have jews that generally have a "ie" or "ei" somewhere in the middle of their names (i.e. fuselier, leising, eichmann, eisenhower)...well you get the idea...plus every1 in canada knows him as a jew...i'm surprised you don't (well if u're canadian that is)
What surprises me is the news that Ignatieff has criticized Israel. I suspect there may be more to that story.
more on ignatieff's jewish roots...http://www.stormfront.org/forum/
showthread.php?t=227466
if he's father is jewish from Russia, and he supports Israel, that is jew enough in my eyes, although according to halakhic customs, he's not officially an "ethnic" jew...wadever that means
No, his father was descended from a famous Russian ambassador to the Ottoman empire (partly responsible for the Russo-Turkish war of 1879) and his mother was Scottish-Canadian (sister of the interesting political philosopher George Grant). The most one could say is that his wife may be Jewish. But then he was shit even before he married her.
Re Man from Atlan, I agree. Fighting immigration should be accompanied with the suppression of the globalist/liberal economic model which actively encourage this phenomenon. However, the racial cohabitation is bound to lead to clashes between the immigrants and the natives, and it is for me entirely natural. And, when it comes to this, all the mainstream politicians, especially the ultra-zionists like Strauss-Kahn, unanimously tend to accuse the French population of being bigoted, racist and intolerant, implying that the blame should be put squarely on the French society as a whole.
I cannot deny the official media sometimes hypes up or gives a lot of attention to the Muslim or the immigrant question (though usually it's completely blacked out), and it can be really hard for me to understand the motives. The best answer I can come up with is that they try to strong-arm the population into accepting ever more coercive anti-discrimination laws and rejecting completely any form of ethnic conscience. I see the same thing happening in Germany. I know deep politics and double games exist, but the sheer propaganda effect of the universally anti-racist, pro-Zionist, pro-immigrant medias on the general population is so effective. Why should the Mossad go underground and initiate some riots, when it could achieve a far better effect by having the mainstream media making a U-turn and treat the immigrant question in a aggressive way ? Same goes for the politicians. They are so subservient to Israel, especially the socialis.
Re Solman, you're right, in that Sarkozy is very unpredictable. He talks a lot, but does very little. He's a little Tony Blair clone, but mind you, Royal is just as hollow.
smekhovo, his dad was a JEW...
FatCap, Sarko is an ultra-liberal Zionist...and I believe he had a hand in the French riots as well. the conditions were ripe to create the riots, but one of his men launched tear gas into a mosque on the holiest night in the holy month of Ramadan (laylatul Qadr), and then went about calling the attendees of religious gatherings "extremists" and perhpas terrorists. He definitely is hated by French Muslims for being a "dirty" jew. (sale juif)
man i don't trust "muslims" who were once jews, and i definitely don't trust "christians", "hare krishnas", new ageys (most are jews), and any of these lots that were once jews. An "ex-jew" shall always remain a Jew. Once in the CIA, you'll always stay that way. Once a Jew, always a Jew.
More on the fabrication of Israel's history, from the Nov./Dec. 1997 issue of Archaeology Magazine, on the Masada Martyrs:
"Skeletons found at Masada by Ygael Yadin between 1963 and 1965 and later given a state burial by the Israeli government were not those of Jewish patriots but Roman soldiers, says Joseph Zias of Jerusalem's Rockefeller Museum.
The claim that the skeletons were those of the Jewish fighters who defended Masada against the Romans in AD 70 has long been questioned. . . Furthermore, Yadin confirmed in 1982 that pig bones were found with the human ones. . . Zias notes that Romasn sacrificed pigs at burials. He concludes that the skeletons may well be the remains of soldiers from the Roman garrison that occupied Masada after the Jewish rebellion was surpressed.
Zias says that Yadin had doubts about the identification of the skeletons, but that pressure from Israeli political leaders to connect the bones with the Masada legend led him to acquiesce to the state funeral."
Somehow, the spectre of a state funeral for pig bones and the deliciousness of IDF recruits taking their oath on pig bones, seem to personify the zionist enterprise perfectly.
hahaha, zionists swearing on pig bones!!!
"The only party who did profit from the riots is the FN, who is routinely accused of antisemitism, was opposed to the first Gulf war, and defended recently the right for Iran to have the bomb. It's not zionist, look it up for yourself."
Le Pen has been a strong supporter of zionism. Both Sarko and Le Pen profit from the riots, but Sarko will take away from Le Pen's vote.
kassandra,
I read the same findings on Masada some years ago. It seems Josephus, a "Jewish" historian was employed by the Roman governor Flavius Silva, that was given credit for the hoax (the assault and defeat of the so called Jewish rebels at Masada). Josephus was on the dole of Silva. Rome always wanted to hear good news from her governors and generals thru out the Empire.
What most likely happened at Masada was nothing more than a Roman military training exercise against an empty deserted old Herod winter retreat. Assaulted by catapult training, engineering units and infantry.
The few Roman skeletons found at the site with pig bones were those Roman's that died in the practice maneuver of the Roman army (I believe there were three Roman remains found).
Troops often die during training maneuvers. You'll notice that Josephus reports that all the Jews were cremated and modern historians report that no "Jewish" remains were ever found. But Roman remains were?
Concerning immigration issues in Europe and the US:
It is all part of the international banking houses plans to destabilize nation states. Many of these "refugees" are from countries that have been brutally and systematically destroyed, that is, its economies, social institutions (religious/culural networks), by the cabal of investment finance capital bankers through its front scam organizations such as the World Bank, International Monetary Fund, currency dealers and Wall St. players.
In, or around, the late 1970's the US Census Bureau reported that the US population was beginning to level off. That meant that births and deaths were reaching a negative balance. That balance occurred at a 220 million population level.
US manufacturing tycoons panicked. That meant that workers were beginning to be in a position of having the upper hand concerning wages and benefits. The corporate mantra was that we wouldn't have enough cheap labor to compete with cheap foreign labor. So rather than reinvesting in retooling the pre World War mode of production to meet production demand they began opening the doors to immigration from the World Bank and IMF victims. If you want some insight into this scam read John Perkins, Confessions Of An Economic Hit Man.
They had to keep investors happy because they know people would invest wherever the best return on dividends could be found. It's a logical fact. This fear gave way to mergers and acquisitions of/with other companies. A grand buy out and consolidation of competing companies intensified tremendously. Record buy outs and acquisitions intensified into the nineties until we woke up to the largest consolidated corporations ever in the history of US business.
The same thing was happening in Western Europe.
Headlines in European newspapers were suddenly worried about the shrinking ethnic populations of Europe. Even the Pope pleaded with Europeans to have more children.
I just realized that this explanation can be an extremely lengthy comment. Perhaps I'll leave it up too you, if you want this comment to continue.
OT question for xymphora and anyone else: do you think South African crime is a "strategy of tension" situation, purely the inevitable difficulties of sudden enfranchisement of a majority of society long denied rights, or both?
Man From Atlan:
JOHN KERRY IS JEWISH!????!??
That would exlain why he is often referred to as a Cousin of Bush!!
Can you provide the family names?
The issue of immigration and the decline of the original population--is a huge subject. Its the same all over the world. Caucasian/European (whatever you want to use as a label) are a very tiny minority in the world.
Obviously, U.S. and European business wanted cheap labor. They LOVE it. So they "allow" millions of people to "sort of sneak over the border" or otherwise enter a country.
When the business people find some other worker-group performs better and cheaper-they have nothing for the original immigrants.
Thus, millions of Mexican Americans find themselves in slum housing, with horrible job prospects and in and out--do not pass go--jail and prison. Americans of European background were "handled" a little differently and used in factories for quite a bit longer--thus most saved enough money to survive being throw on the scrapheap. Some, lucky to have had a union actually got retirement. The new generation of white Americans must compete (fairly savagely) for whatever is out there--thus continued racism: they certainly won't want to share what little there is. But that is no matter of concern, as American schooling makes SURE that AfroAmericans and MexicoAmericans (for the most part) get horrid "educations".
WHERE WILL THEY WORK? WHERE WILL WE ALL WORK, as they pile in more "new" immigrants were are very young, strong and willing to do anything!
I am at a loss as to how to research the "non-existence" of the so-called
people of Israel. Will check out Rowan's site suggestion.
Basically, we have almost the entire Old Testament to debunk. A lot of it was written and re-written in a few hundred years AFTER Christ.
I HAD the entire picture of slavers,
importers of luxury goods for the Romans. Their history of being involved with slavery and and being close to "royalty" (advising, scheming)..is repeated over and over throughout European history from early Middle Ages.
Now, there is the ADDED scheme of "creating" most of the Old Testament. Myth & fiction. I mean manugacturing what didn't even "exist"!!??
Just imagine if someone wrote a book about this-a huge best seller--
Of course, the religious right would refuse to believe it. But little by little you bring empires down>
Kerry's father was a Cohen.
He wanted to change their name for business reasons so John Kerry claims that his father simply chucked a dart at a map of the world and hit County Kerry, Ireland.
This is what John claimed was the origin of the name Kerry.
I can't stand the man myself. he looks like the walking dead.
Indeed, John "Kerry" Kohn fits in well with Wesley "Clark" Kanne and George "Allen" Lombroso.
We could debunk the Old Testament – and I am not saying that we should not, but what would that do to Christianity and to the whole history of the European people who accepted Christianity? I am afraid we might eventually face the question of whether Christianity has been a 2000-year mistake.
Gosh, that would never do would it?
Seriously, though,, there is no analysis that will not find 'Christianity' to have been mistaken in some respect. I suppose you really mean Christendom, the Empire.
smekhovo,
Good point. Ezra seems to be the transition prophet to the Hellenic tale.
The date of Ezra writing is dated 500 BC. Based on a Biblical time line and not historical or archeological time line proofs. It's interesting that it is Persia (Cyrus) who liberates them but those pesky Greeks, later on, play the bad guys who squashed the first major "Jewish" uprising since their earlier bogus "flight" from Egypt.
Wasn't the oldest found testament written in Greek?
I may be wrong. Would or could someone verify this?
Two hundred years from now,
some figure, equal to Nietzsche,
will declare the Holocaust is dead.
People will be ashamed their
ancestors were so easy to deceive,
that they carried this idea in
their collective head without
once thinking,
'yes, but what if cyanide turns you
red?'
p.s.,
I did forget the defeat of the Philistines by David, who, as of yet, has not been proven to have even existed. David also turns out to be a common Semetic (Arab) name used thru out the ancient Middle East.
fake rowan at 1:46, 10/29 the sikh at the 7-11 saw you slip a candy bar into your pocket. this is how you were charged.
"in the fields an old man had hitched his wife to the plough. she was naked. her breasts were like flaps. she didn't have teeth. she had lice. her husband, chief rabbi, had her ploughing for luck - for 'greater' israel. no wheat was to be planted."
- "Born into Insanity"
cluster bombs, phosphorus bombs, uranium bombs, plague bombs: the jewish wheat.
You are all so full of shit and hate.
What a sorry collection of "humans" you are, what a waste of flesh
Sickening.
When a patriarchy banishes Sophia the soil becomes a dead thing and yields the emotional and delusional walking stillborn.
There is an Inca story about a Spaniards obsession with plundering temples for gold to the point that he loots and kills to obtain it.
One evening Indians seized him while he slept. They held him down on his bed as one of the natives said, "You have a hunger for gold? We will give you gold", and began to pour melted molting hot gold down his throat!
"We have a sickness of the heart, which we treat with gold" - Cortez
Yes, the Septuagint, much the oldest version of the Old Testament, is in Greek.
Thank you, smekhovo.
Disgusted...go preach your "love" somewhere else!!!
Dear disgusting,
Shit? Hate? Sickening?
A certain "chosen" people usually have a monopoly on the above vernacular when tougue-tied.
Especially when they are overwhelmed by argumentation and can't offer an intelligent rebuttal.
Salman,
A poll taken about five years ago, in USA Today, asked Catholics what religion they most identified with outside of their own. The surprise answer, at 64%, was Islam! Why? The reason most offered was that the Muslim dress and appearances reminded them of the historical Holy Land!
I, for a period of time, had Jesuits as professors in college. Never have I heard a derogatory remark against Islam from them. As a matter of fact they lauded their great historical cultural advances and strength of faith.
They were also quite aware of both "Christian" and Muslim atrocities committed by both sides during the historical conflict between them.
My favorite Muslim leader, as a young
man, was Saladin.
Muslims never did anything to me and when I was introduced to a Muslim they always took my extended hand graciously, some times with both hands.
Catholics were never encouraged to distrust Muslims, US government hacks have.
The Jesuits taught us to use our capacity for critical and analytical
thinking and to reconize propaganda and bullshit when we see it. I hope no (religious) Catholic has ever demeaned
you or your faith and your personal integrity as a fellow human being.
We are all in this mystery together.
Salam.
Salman,
p.s.,
"from Deuteronomy onwards we find the teaching that it is correct to lend money at interest to non-co-religionists but not to one's own. It is specifically stated that this will bring the other nations to a position of subordination."
Absolutely. Usury is also a method of war:
“From him demand usury, whom you desire to harm. From him exact usury, whom it would not be a crime to kill. Where there is a right of war, there also is a right of usury”
-St. Ambrose (against the practice of usury.)
I named my first son after
St. Ambrose.
That's right---the oldest Old Testament is in Greek.
All people who don't revel in your hate must be Jews or Zionists.
And George Bush is the greatest president, EVER!
You garbage have nothing going for yourselves, you weave your elaborate little theories as to why you're personally so miserable, and it all comes back to the evil Jews.
Look in the mirror. Pathetic, isn't it?
Tiger Eye, smekhovo, Salman, Man From Atlan, Hoarsewhisperer, et al...
Let's do the world a favor and kill ourselves.
It would be the first positive thing we've ever done.
To fully appreciate the difference between classical Christianity (Catholic, Orthodox, and various old fashioned denominations, not including Opus Dei) and new fangled evangelical stuff, it is instructive to read the 'Jim Jones Death Tape':
http://jonestown.sdsu.edu/AboutJ...Tape/
death.html
INTERVIEW - Hezbollah chief wins unlikely fan in sexy pop diva
Yara Bayoumy, Reuters, 30 Oct 2006
http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/...k/
L30332976.htm
BEIRUT, Oct 30 (Reuters) - Racy Lebanese pop diva Haifa Wehbe hardly seems a typical supporter of conservative Shi'ite Muslim Hezbollah leader Sayyed Hassan Nasrallah. But the green-eyed, 30-year-old singer, arguably the Arab world's best-known sex symbol, has only praise for Nasrallah's part in the July-August war between his guerrillas and Israel. "It's a land that has people to defend it ... and therefore Nasrallah had a big role ... in defending Lebanon's honour and border," she told Reuters in an interview before a weekend concert in the coastal resort of Jounieh. Human rights groups criticised both sides for targeting civilians during the conflict, in which about 1,200 people were killed in Lebanon, mainly civilians, along with 157 Israelis. "There's no war that starts with no reason. The one who begins it is the aggressor and I don't think we started it," Haifa said of the conflict that erupted after Hezbollah captured two Israeli soldiers in a cross-border raid on July 12.
The war made Nasrallah a hero across the Arab world, but it is still surprising to hear Haifa pay tribute to a cleric who probably looks askance on performers like her. Hezbollah's television channel does not feature female singers. However, Haifa is a Shi'ite from south Lebanon and had a brother who died fighting against Israel in the 1980s. The former model's own fame rests on sex appeal and outrageous rumours that have made her an Arab tabloid favourite. She has even taken part in a reality television celebrity show. Haifa stormed on to the small screen a few years ago to win popularity in the Arab world for music videos relying heavily on saucy outfits which religious conservatives consider scandalous. For her Jounieh concert, Haifa sauntered from her black Mercedes to her dressing room wearing a skin-tight navy blue tracksuit and black stiletto heels, greeting journalists and backstage workers with a sultry "Bonsoir". Home to several popular Arab musical legends, Lebanon has also produced many female pop singers who are less conservative than their counterparts elsewhere in the Middle East.
Phil Weiss has an interesting short piece on Brandeis and some of the other key players in the rise of Zionist influence in America early in the last century.
http://mondoweiss.observer.com/2...r-
lippmann.html
Yes, the Septuagint, much the oldest version of the Old Testament, is in Greek.
smekhovo | 10.30.06 - 3:16 pm | #
Any evidence for that smekhovo?
http://
www.informationclearingho...rticle15445.htm
texas vs. tel aviv
James Petras on the Lobby.
http://tinyurl.com/yygrnc
night watch,
"Today’s critics also have the advantage of looking at material even older than the fourth- and fifth-century uncials. Included in this material are fragments written on papyrus and discovered in large numbers, mostly in Egypt, over the past century or so. Although the papyrus fragments vary considerably in age and quality, some take us well back in to the pre-Christian era, to a period near the time of the original Greek translation of some parts of the Bible. Fragmentary remains in Greek have also been found among the Dead Sea Scrolls."
http://members.bib-arch.org/nph-...d15&UserID=3d0&
and;
http://www.septuagint.net/
"The Septuagint has its origin in Alexandria, Egypt and was translated between 300-200 BC. Widely used among Hellenistic Jews, this Greek translation was produced because many Jews spread throughout the empire were beginning to lose their Hebrew language."
Pseudo Rowan, stewing in his own bile, needs to look up his Jewish History: Prior to the Dead Sea scrolls discovery, the oldest existing version of Torah in Hebrew was dated 895 C.E. http://www.jtnews.net/
viewArticl...ebut+in+Seattle
http://www.evangelicalnews.org/i...isplay&
pr_id=81
The Greek Septuagint was written at the behest of Ptolemy II in 3rd century BCE Alexandria, and much in use by Hellenised Jews:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Septuagint
"Relationship between the Septuagint and the Masoretic text
The sources of the many differences between the Septuagint and the Masoretic text have long been discussed by scholars. The most widely accepted view today is that the Septuagint provides a reasonably accurate record of an early Semitic textual variant, now lost, that differed from ancestors of the Masoretic text"
"The association of the LXX with a rival religion may have rendered it suspect in the eyes of the newer generation of Jews and Jewish scholars" (which is why later versions of Torah appeared, written in Aramaic/Hebrew)
The Dead Sea Scrolls, while authentic, are incomplete. The Codex Vaticanus, and the Codex Sinaiticus, written in Koine (Greek) are the oldest complete texts of the Old Testament.
Apparently the sons of the Lions of Judah can't read (sorry)
I'm familiar w. the Septuagint, but did not think it earlier than the Hebrew texts.
Also,
http://books.google.com/books?
vi...bjz8W2CYBHqWZ4g
There is really, as of yet, no real proof that the story of an existing
Old Testament text before the Hellenic period ever existed. The story offered is definitely suspect and remains debatable until an older text is unearthed.
That is "until an older "Hebrew" text is unearthed."
My understanding is the same as Tiger Eye's. The oldest physical copy of the Old Testament that we have is the Codex Vaticanus in the Vatican library. Next in age is the Codex Sinaiticus in the British Library. These are both in Greek, and they are both based on the same Greek text. The name given to this earliest edition is the Septuagint.
Legend has it that the Septuagint was translated in Ptolemaic Alexandria from an even earlier text in Hebrew, but nothing of that exists.
BTW, that James Petras article linked above is well worth reading.
All of which are only bits and pieces of the truth, lifted from the Vedas. Distorted, irreligious constructs created by Hebrews, Egyptians, Babylonians, Assyrians, Chaldeans, Greeks, Romans, etc.
Before there was an Egypt, a Greece or a Rome, there were the Vedas.
And the Vedas are not some thought dreams of scriptures waiting to be "discovered," fanciful legends or as yet to be revealed secrets of what is real and what is not. They are here now, complete with math, science and every detail of human life.
Once Jesus the Christ arrived on the scene, the Vedas and all other non-biblical spiritual writings became irrelevant. And since they're irrelevant, why bother?!
God's identity, supreme wisdom and power were revealed in Christ's healing and teaching, on the Cross and in His resurrection from the dead! He is Light. Everything else is Darkness or Shadows.
Anonymous,
This is not a competition of who's religion is better. It's about a scam.
The Vedas are as ancient as the Celtic Druids, who by the way split off to the east and west during prehistory migrations. One migration went to what is now India, the other into what is now Europe.
Both area's of the world developed earlier cosmologies that where more similar then different. It's the literal bullshit for the purpose of stealing land and the systematic murdering of innocent people, in Palestine and the Middle east, coupled with their international subterfuge, is what is pissing people off on a global scale.
It's not about religion but more about violent ideological justification.
There are dangerous Hindu sects as well as Christian sects but they are a lot more revealing about their motives.
Rowan here's the real deal on the Balfour declaration, Brandeis, Morgenthau, etc.
http://www.wrmea.com/archives/No...05/
0511044.html
Tiger Eye,
Sorry. As you may have assumed, I am anonymous above.
The migration into India theory, and that is exactly what it was, has been widely discounted these days. Mostly because Max Muller, the resident western authority, has been found biased and lacking in his interpretations. Also Harrapan and Mohenjo Daro writings, to this day still not deciphered, far predate the automatic assumption of Assyrian being the earliest known writing. Same as the "Arabic" numeral system, which is known to be Vedic as well. The idea of zero and infinity. The church had a hard time with that one. The Aryans were the Vedic peoples. This, along with the theory of the first Americans migrating across the Bering strait, among others, now occupies the realm of Columbus discovered America nonsense.
And as for even suggesting the Druids culture is as old as the Vedas is abject nonsense. Perhaps in western "prehistory" there is confusion about this, but then western history is incredibly distorted and filled with assumptions, theories and guesses.
Godsend, isn't it amazing, miraculous even, that the advent, life, deeds, disappearence and return of Krishna is almost a carbon copy of Christ's own life? Even the same Name? Not troubling or transparent even though Krishna's immaculate life ocurred thousands of years earlier?
Lastly, the Vedas are not a religion, though all religions sprang from them.
hp:
Are you suggesting that Christ visited twice? Perhaps that He didn't finish the job as Krishna? Were Krishna's arrival and details of his life prophesied in some written records several hundred years before he appeared? Did Krishna claim to be God, the son of God and the son of Man? Did he raise people from the dead? Was he crucified and rise on the 3rd day? Did he say "I and the Father are One"? and "No one comes to the Father except by Me"? Did he talk about and describe the End Times that we're about to enter? Did he talk about the Devil and the anti-Christ? Did he explain his own death and why it had to occur? Did he explain human sin and why and how mankind has to be purified and sanctified in order to exist in God's presence? Etc., etc., etc.
What, exactly, are you implying?
As you can probably tell, I'm no expert on Krishna and the Vedas - and I don't intend to become one. Christ explains everything - and it all makes sense Krishna is for Hindus, not for the followers of Christ!
Yes God came in person twice. First as Krishna, approx. 5,000 years ago and second as Lord Chaitanya, in 1486.
Both times He was in person but wore a transcendental body, unable to be pierced, nor containing blood and bile. Jesus was not God, totally. He had a material body, like us. Also, He talked a lot about His Father, who is real, not some conglomeration of concepts.
Unlike you, I am unwilling to usurp either Jesus or His Father, nor do I have a desire to do so. The fact that you are unable to hear the word Father, even from Jesus, and are unable to concieve and/or accept this as truth, is your failing.
HP,
Thanks for the clarification.
As far as the number "O" the Celtic God Bal's symbol, ironically, resembles the pi symbol, except it has a little round buldge on the outside bottom right side leg. Bal was another name for the Sun God. It's interesting to me that pi also participates in an infinite number of digits determining the area of a circle, yet not absolutly? And the arguement by non Euclidean Geometries that parallel lines meet somewhere in infinity.
Yet when one counts on his fingers of both hands he arrives at 9+0 (10) to begin again and yet we don'n have an infinate number of fingers! Notice the dates Homer.
The Vedas and Upanishads;
http://san.beck.org/EC7-Vedas.html
Aryan influence:
The Rgveda therefore can't be trusted and archaeological evidence is ambiguous, but one science clarifies where the first-tier Aryans must have come from: linguistics. The Aryan languages are so similar to Slavic and Greek that the Aryan precursors could not have left the common ``I-E Homeland'' before 3000 BC and probably left even later. Either the language now dominant throughout northern India arrived from West Asia during or after the Harappan era, or India itself must have been the I-E Homeland. The latter case completely conflicts with linguistic evidence, but in the former case, one imagines small troops of warriors from Northwest Asia crossing the Khyber Pass and, with superior military technology (horses, armor), eventually dominating an entire subcontinent. This process occurred only a few centuries before the Celtic conquest of Western Europe, but while the Celts have proud legends of their origin far to the East, the Aryans of India were so outnumbered they may have felt a need to disguise their foreign origin, perhaps even inventing a religion for a similar purpose.
The earliest Aryan invaders may have cohabited with the Harappans, with the main invasion arriving at or after the Harappan collapse. That such a magnificent civilization disappeared completely suggests that the Aryan invaders were a destructive influence, but there is no evidence that the Aryan invasion precipitated the Harappan collapse. In fact there's only circumstantial evidence that there was an Aryan invasion at all. A `DNA signature' is visible with most major prehistoric migrations but there is no such signature for the presumed `Aryan invasion.' The Hindu Kush Mountains were a formidable obstacle, so the `invasion' may have been pulled off by a small number of male warriors who didn't bring their womenfolk -- yet it led to almost complete replacement of the linguistic base of Northern India.
HP,
I love this stuff. It would be great to sit down with a lot of peole on the blog and drink, dine and talk.
By the way I'm not saying that the above is absolute or right. Just food for thought and so findings that connects us all.
hp:
How am I not able to hear 'Father' and accept it as truth?, viz., that it's God, His Father Who was being described by Jesus? - as opposed to God the Holy Spirit or God the Son.
So if Jesus was not God (as He proved and claimed), who was He? In other words, Jesus was a liar, right?! And, I suppose, there have been lots of blokes who have raised people from the dead, right?
And God came in person twice - as Krishna and then as Lord Chaitanya? Why? And why not a few more times under different names? And what makes you think those folks were God? Did they claim they were God? - and which of the many Hindu gods did they claim they were? Did they prove they were God or a god? - and who were the witnesses and what makes them reliable? And what do the Buddhists have to say about all of this, huh?
Maybe God also came as a caterpillar and a cow - and the Hindus might claim those were God as well?!
Holy cow! - are you serious???
GodSend,
We can never kill pride. Your war is within yourself. Greet the "good" guest.
He may be God disguised as Krishna.
Tiger Eye:
War, what war? I'm fighting the Devil - no matter what disguises he happens to choose Who is 'good'? Are you?
God kills pride! - usually with a heavenly 2X4 (I know - from personal experience 
God does not walk around under a pseudonym, trying to fool people! Although you might meet an angel or two in disguise
You're as confused as that hp creature :O
GodSend,
Your faith is your own.
"Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother's eye and pay no attention to the plank that is in your own eye?" (Matthew 7:3)
Who is good!!
Christ was told that he was good. His reply was, "I am not good, only my Father who is in Heaven, is good."
Can you figure that one out, my friend?
I liked more the comments section than
the article it self. You guys I have to
admit that you "ROCK", even those whom I disagree. BTW, TE I will be around just
to listen you and the rest [MFA,HP,CJENN,(the real RB),Salman...].
Xymphora please keep up the good work!.
Tiger Eye (with the plank in it?):
Christ was being overly modest - modesty is in His nature, so to speak Take my word for it, Christ was/is good! His Dad, however, is the One who dishes out blessings to humanity from the Goodness of His heart. OK, I figured it out
Now, about those errant planks getting into people's eyes - including Tiger Eye(s). Mine was removed some time ago And my faith is sooooo strong, I have enough to go around to help some who need it! The key here, is to try to remove the planks from all the eyes that surround us - and thereby help folks to SEE! Hey, that was easy Next time, make sure you throw a parable that can't smack into your own glass house
The point was that Christ to be in communion with humanity had to take on the imperfection of humanity to be human. He went to the ordeal of being tempted to have the things of this world and not the world to come.
"Rabbi how must we know God? Christ answered, "If you must know God know Him as a father. But no one comes to the Father but thru me". "For I and the Father are one."
To be human is to be imperfact. Otherwise we would "be" gods. Goodness comes into the world by measuring our own limitations, our own weaknesses and mortality and that of others. Who is without sin cast the first stone.
That's the human state. If we can accept the fact that sacrifice, that is, by making life a sacred gift, we begin to understand the many different manifastations of the face of Our Father. We then will come to know the face of God's love when other people are loved as fellow human beings, sons and dauthers of our creator, you'll see His reflection in their faces and once in a while you might catch a momentary glimps of Him in your reflection.
The hardest thing that my fellow commuicants admit as being the most difficult part of the Mass and yet the most liberating, was the response befor communion, "Lord I am not worthy to recieve You, only say the word and my soul will be healed." I've heard converts weep with joy during the Mass. They said it felt like a weight had been lifted off their shoulders.
Don't be like those who have fixed the law in stone but not upon their hearts and adhere to the letter of the law but not the spirit of the law.
Love one another as he loved us. Die to the old and you are made new.
Holy Cow is right Godsend. Just what is it about the reality of a father and a son that you either don't or will not understand? Even to the point of usurping and taking it upon yourself to interpret what Jesus meant when He said things you simply refuse to accept. If Jesus said directly to you that He is the Son and lesser than His Father, for some reason I think you would tell Him what He "really" meant.
The reason God comes in person and also as an incarnation(s) is because He, like Jesus often and always proclaimed, Loves us and only desires we Love Him. Not rocket science or psycho babble or even a mystery.
We, you and I and Tiger Eye and everyone else are the same quality as God Himself. It's a quantity thing.
The Buddhists, being atheists, obviously do not believe in God as a personality. Even as Lord Buddha, an incarnation of God, tricked them into worshipinng Him indirectly. Because of love for them and their exempleary behavior and moral fortitude. Please don't tell me or God that He can't do this if He so desires.
Godsend, it seems for some reason you wish to be a demi-god or a favored agent of God to a twisted point where you seem to almost revel in false pride of denying anyone access to or favor of your God unless they pass your conflicted and constricted muster. Hard, if not impossible to believe God would condone or encourage such hateful and prideful behaviour.
Jesus was pretty careful what He said about His Father. Even in his precious moments on the cross. Especially in those moments..
Tiger Eye,
I'm not sure what the Catholics say about animals, but I believe they are included as well. By this, I mean they have souls also. The same quality soul as you or I. This is where the incarnations are in play. On and on until earning the highest form of life in the universe; us humans.
Hopefully Godsend does not have a stroke when reading this belief of mine. My ears are on fire Godsend, not my soul.
Godsend, I would never say you are anything but right to worship God so fervently and adoringly. This can't be wrong. It's just that God, being limitless, has limitless names and accepts any name directed to Him. Be it Allah, Jesus, Krishna, Buddha or Great Spirit. Isn't it fitting and just that it truly is the thoughts, deeds and praise which really counts?
If you want to start an argument in a pub, talk about politics. If you want to start a fight, talk about religion.
Tiger Eye:
Paragraph #1: NO, Christ did not have any of the (moral) imperfections of a human being. He was the son of Man as well as the son of God and He was perfect. Yes, He was human with a mortal body BUT He was able to resist all of the temptations of the Devil. We can't. Even Paul couldn't and admitted as much.
Paragraph #2: I have no problem with any of that. The ONLY path to God (the Father) is through His Son.
Paragraph #3: OK with most of that. Goodness comes into the world (from us) through our partaking of the nature of God - the expression of love. Love is imparted to us by God and is not of our own nature. "You are as gods".
Paragraph #4: This sounds good but I think you're making things up - about seeing the 'face of God' in people, etc. I prefer the idea of becoming perfected in Christ (Christ-like) and more spiritual than natural beings. When we are so possessed by the spirit of God (agape love) through His Grace that He dominates our being, then our faces may assume a godly aura.
Paragraph #5: Not sure what your point is here. I'm not Catholic and I have serious doubts that the RCC belongs to the Body of Christ (individual Catholics may, however). I find the Mass inspirational and the Spirit of God can move people in the manner you describe.
Paragraph #6: The Law you refer to has been supplanted by Christ, if you mean the Law of Moses. If you mean Christ's commandments to His disciples (in addition to the 10 Commandments), it's pretty clear what they are: 1) Love God and 2) Love one another (believers). I place no law above Christ's commandments!
Paragraph #7: Yes, die to the old (Self and the natural man) and you will be 'born again' through the power of Christ's love and sacrifice. But the re-birth is only the starting point of a long journey of becoming perfected and attaining the full stature and measure of Christ (we don't actually get there)
I think you have some misconceptions about what I believe. You may also have some misconceptions about what a true follower of Christ is. Let me suggest that you read 'The Life' on my website. It was written by someone anonymous but it captures the essence of the true Christian life. Then study my website, especially the links to the Austin-Sparks writings/lectures/sermons. You will then much better understand where I'm coming from and what I write
You sound like an ecumenist to me. Are you or do you consider yourself a Christian? You can't be both If you are a follower of Christ, you can't be a follower of anyone else! "No one comes to the Father except by Me". "There is no other name by which we must be saved".
hp:
What, exactly, do you consider "prideful' and "hateful" in my comments?
I am a disciple of Christ. I hate the Devil and those who worship him in open and willful defiance of God.
I have no problem whatsoever in understanding a Father:Son relationship. I have 2 sons of my own and one of them calls himself a missionary and evangelist. If God the Father and God the Son are One, I don't see the problem! Where do you see a problem? Christ prayed to His Father and He instructed us to pray to the Father. We pray to both. All power over the Creation (including humanity) has been given to the Son - by the Father. I can understand that. Can you? The Father and the Son have their own personal relationship with us, according to Scripture. The Son is our Redeemer (Savior) and the Father is also our Father (or will be if we accept the sacrifice of His Son).
I don't consider myself anyone special in God's eyes or my own. But I have a love for the Father and the Son (and the Holy Spirit) which derives from an understanding (through Grace) of the immensity of the love which God has for me. I was saved by Amazing Grace, even though I was a sinner and rejected God. Not only that, I was the recipient of Grace when I didn't deserve it!
There is nothing that God cannot do - except deny His own nature. God appeared to Moses and to others - but not as a man in disguise. The notion that Krishna was God is totally incomprehensible to me. Christ coming as a man is another story completely.
God's name is holy. So holy that the Jews dare not say His Name but call Him Hashem (the Name). No, I don't think that we can call God whatever we want and that He doesn't care. Some of us will see His face - but only after we're purified by the blood of the Lamb (otherwise we would perish). Holiness is a profound concept and probably beyond our true comprehension. Can you imagine anything more exciting or awesome than looking into God's face? It's worth dying for
What really counts are God's instructions to us - not what we like them to be! His instructions are clear: "This is My son, with whom I am well pleased". To reject the sacrifice of His Son is to slap God in His face! "Though He slay me, yet will I love Him". God help those who knowingly reject His Son!
See my suggestions to Tiger Eye about my website - they apply to you as well. If you find something objectionable there, tell me what it is and why it's objectionable. In particular, read "The Life" and the Intro (What is this website about) and the pieces of The Puzzle should fall into place.
Interesting interview with David Ray Griffin, in which he reveals himself to be one of the 'useful idiots' of crypto-Marxist Judeo-Christendom:
http://wholelifetimes.com/2006/
0...riffin0609.html
The attempt to paint ancient Jews as a people fighting imperialism is indeed comical. In reality they were an international sect of financial bandits using a religious pretext, which rose to power by serving empire. Just as in the modern world.
Chris Bradley | 11.01.06 - 1:08 am | #
Shmuel Rosner - the Lavrenti Beria of Haaretz:
In the Ohio race, there is no regret over the incumbent, but concern about the likely newcomer. Brown is a Democrat of the most liberal and radical mold the party has to offer. Like Ned LaMont, Joe Lieberman's rival in Connecticut, Brown has given no sign or clue that he plans to target Israeli policy for change. Nonetheless, Israel supporters in Washington furrow their brows at the polls predicting his victory. Even if he does no harm, someone said, he will certainly not help. Brown, a Congressman, has a very liberal voting record, which in current times makes him immediately suspect - even without any proof.
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spa...ges/
782048.html
Some believe that the Semitic invaders of Egypt, the Hyksos, were one and the same as the Hebrews of the Old Testament.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyksos and that they came during the Middle Kingdom era, a time of Egyptian collapse:
http://nefertiti.iwebland.com/hi...istory12-
17.htm
That the story of Joseph may be related to the Hyksos (the researcher has a 'Biblical' bias)
http://nefertiti.iwebland.com/hi...istory12-
17.htm
I would also recommend this link about the connection between Akhenaten and Moses
http://www.domainofman.com/forum...rames;
read=1037
Though those such as Ahmed Osman claiming Moses and Akhenaten are one and the same are just barking up the wrong (palm) tree.
The link to Joseph is here, sorry.
http://www.freemaninstitute.com/...lery/
joseph.htm
It would seem almost OT to say so at this point, but I thought "Notice how Zionism is the only nationalism whose propaganda war impacts detrimentally on the lives of people all over the world, including Europe. The Zionist imperative of promoting the ‘clash of civilizations’ to allow it to steal land from Muslims requires bad ideas which ruin lives everywhere" was an astute observation and one worthy of intelligent comment, GodsEnd excepted.
"Notice how Zionism is the only nationalism whose propaganda war impacts detrimentally on the lives of people all over the world, including Europe. The Zionist imperative of promoting the ‘clash of civilizations’ to allow it to steal land from Muslims requires bad ideas which ruin lives everywhere"
I totally agree with that statement But I would add that behind Zionism lurk the Devil and his worshipers (Illuminati). And they don't just ruin lives, they also annihilate lives and destroy souls! Their intent is to create the NWO, with Lucifer as God.
Christ's message was meant to be universal.
Wrong. Jesus spoke to Jews specifically. Once, when he was travelling with the apostles, a goy woman begged Jesus to heal her child. The apostles wanted to chase her away telling her that one did not feed the dogs when the masters were starving. The term dogs was of course meant to denominate non-Jews. The woman said that even when the masters were starving, a kindly man might throw the dog a morsel. Jesus said that the woman had spoken well and healed her child. The point was, of course, to show the magnamaniousness of Jesus, but it also speaks of Jesus' racism. The universality of the Christ was a later invention.
It would be very easy for an agent provocateur, simply by tossing a stone at a group of policemen and disappearing into the crowd,
Bollocks! It woud be a very easy way for an agent provocateur to be arrested.
"God's name is so holy that the Jews dare not say His name."
That's one of the most hilarious things I've ever heard in my life!
Mighty respectful, them there Jews..
hp:
Well, not ALL Jews show such respect for their Creator! Some (most?) don't say His name but blaspheme Him through their actions - think Zionists and/or Jewish Neocons Yeah, it's hilarious :O
PS Of course, God may not find this hilarious at all! - He may be sharpening a new and improved edition of Damocles' sword instead
Where the fuck's xympy?
Tiger Eye,Wasalam, sorry for the delay...got into an incident this halloween with this pseudo Sri Lankan Jew (claims such) clown over restaurant food at dinner...bastard tried to trap me. But anyways, to confirm the message of Christ, and why he threw out those money changers in the temple, the quran confirms it the best...
http://www.submission.org/islam/...rest-
usury.html
[2:275] Those who charge usury are in the same position as those controlled by the devil's influence. This is because they claim that usury is the same as commerce. However, GOD permits commerce, and prohibits usury. Thus, whoever heeds this commandment from his Lord, and refrains from usury, he may keep his past earnings, and his judgment rests with GOD. As for those who persist in usury, they incur Hell, wherein they abide forever
The Quran forbids usury, not interest. Quite a few states in USA have laws against usury. Usury is defined as excessive interest. A Dictionary defines usury as "an excessive or inordinate premium for the use of money borrowed", "extortionate interest", or "the practice of taking exorbitant or excessive interest." The Arabic language also makes distinction between interest (Fa'eda) and usury (Reba). The Quran forbids Reba or usury.
Earning interest and paying interest is perfectly acceptable, as the Quran has not prohibited interest. Interest is an essential component of the financial aspect of an individual or an organization. Individuals may need to save money in a bank, may carry a credit card for convenience, or may borrow and pay interest for an automobile or to own a house. Borrowing money and thus paying interest for business loans is an essential component for business and organizations. Thus paying interest, as long as it is not considered excessive by the standard of the day and community, to a credit card company, to a financial institution for a loan of any kind (business, car, house mortgage) is allowed and perfectly legal from a Quranic point of view. Also earning interest from a financial institution like a bank or bonds or mutual fund is also fine.
As defined above usury is excessive interest. Unlicensed or illegal moneylenders (mafia as a well known example) charge usury, excessive interest. Such unlicensed or illegal moneylenders are all over the world and can easily be accessed by a few inquiries. For those who live in USA, any individual can find out about these moneylenders by asking about them within their ethnic business community. These illegal moneylenders have entirely separate standards for making loans - they charge excessive interest (usury) and usually rely on someone's life (guarantor) as collateral. The Quran forbids in dealing with usury - borrowing money and paying usury or earning money by charging usury. The Quran specifically states that usury cannot be equated to commerce or taken as a normal business practice. The practice of usury, unfortunately, is prevalent all over the world
[2:275] Those who charge usury are in the same position as those controlled by the devil's influence. This is because they claim that usury is the same as commerce. However, GOD permits commerce, and prohibits usury. Thus, whoever heeds this commandment from his Lord, and refrains from usury, he may keep his past earnings, and his judgment rests with GOD. As for those who persist in usury, they incur Hell, wherein they abide forever
The Quran forbids usury, not interest. Quite a few states in USA have laws against usury. Usury is defined as excessive interest. A Dictionary defines usury as "an excessive or inordinate premium for the use of money borrowed", "extortionate interest", or "the practice of taking exorbitant or excessive interest." The Arabic language also makes distinction between interest (Fa'eda) and usury (Reba). The Quran forbids Reba or usury.
Earning interest and paying interest is perfectly acceptable, as the Quran has not prohibited interest. Interest is an essential component of the financial aspect of an individual or an organization. Individuals may need to save money in a bank, may carry a credit card for convenience, or may borrow and pay interest for an automobile or to own a house. Borrowing money and thus paying interest for business loans is an essential component for business and organizations. Thus paying interest, as long as it is not considered excessive by the standard of the day and community, to a credit card company, to a financial institution for a loan of any kind (business, car, house mortgage) is allowed and perfectly legal from a Quranic point of view. Also earning interest from a financial institution like a bank or bonds or mutual fund is also fine.
As defined above usury is excessive interest. Unlicensed or illegal moneylenders (mafia as a well known example) charge usury, excessive interest. Such unlicensed or illegal moneylenders are all over the world and can easily be accessed by a few inquiries. For those who live in USA, any individual can find out about these moneylenders by asking about them within their ethnic business community. These illegal moneylenders have entirely separate standards for making loans - they charge excessive interest (usury) and usually rely on someone's life (guarantor) as collateral. The Quran forbids in dealing with usury - borrowing money and paying usury or earning money by charging usury. The Quran specifically states that usury cannot be equated to commerce or taken as a normal business practice. The practice of usury, unfortunately, is prevalent all over the world with individuals and business engaged in this practice.
In practical terms as long as we are dealing with any state-licensed institution like a bank, Mortgage Company, Credit Card Company, etc., we are not violating any Quranic commandment as these institutions usually follow the law of the land and do not charge excessive interest. They calculate their interest rate on daily ba
As defined above usury is excessive interest. Unlicensed or illegal moneylenders (mafia as a well known example) charge usury, excessive interest. Such unlicensed or illegal moneylenders are all over the world and can easily be accessed by a few inquiries. For those who live in USA, any individual can find out about these moneylenders by asking about them within their ethnic business community. These illegal moneylenders have entirely separate standards for making loans - they charge excessive interest (usury) and usually rely on someone's life (guarantor) as collateral. The Quran forbids in dealing with usury - borrowing money and paying usury or earning money by charging usury. The Quran specifically states that usury cannot be equated to commerce or taken as a normal business practice. The practice of usury, unfortunately, is prevalent all over the world with individuals and business engaged in this practice.
In practical terms as long as we are dealing with any state-licensed institution like a bank, Mortgage Company, Credit Card Company, etc., we are not violating any Quranic commandment as these institutions usually follow the law of the land and do not charge excessive interest. They calculate their interest rate on daily basis considering the status of the economy and the need of the society. However, if we deal with the illegal moneylenders who practice usury, we are in violation of clear Quranic commandments. This is not to say that one may not borrow or lend money to a friend or relative and even charge interest. Such transaction must be in writing as the Quran cleary commands in verse 2:282 and may involve interest, to at least pay for the cost of the loan to the lender if any, and compensate for any change in the value of the currency over the time of the loan, but should not involve usury.
[2:282] O you who believe, when you transact a loan for any period, you shall write it down. An impartial scribe shall do the writing. No scribe shall refuse to perform this service, according to GOD's teachings. He shall write, while the debtor dictates the terms. He shall observe GOD his Lord and never cheat. If the debtor is mentally incapable, or helpless, or cannot dictate, his guardian shall dictate equitably. Two men shall serve as witnesses; if not two men, then a man and two women whose testimony is acceptable to all. Thus, if one woman becomes biased, the other will remind her. It is the obligation of the witnesses to testify when called upon to do so. Do not tire of writing the details, no matter how long, including the time of repayment. This is equitable in the sight of GOD, assures better witnessing, and eliminates any doubts you may have. Business transactions that you execute on the spot need not be recorded, but have them witnessed. No scribe or witness shall be harmed on account of his services. If you harm them, it would be wickedness on your part. You shall observe GOD, and GOD will teach you. GOD is Omniscient.
A note should be made that the Quran, which spells out religious laws for our great religion, removes the shackles and burdens imposed on us by the ignorant scholars and religious leaders. Most of the "Muslim" countries have various laws against interest and have sham "interest-free banking" reflecting their ignorance of this simple Quranic truth. Unfortunately, quite a few of those who call themselves Muslims fall victims to the falsehood spread by these religious leaders.
[2:276-280] GOD condemns usury, and blesses charities. GOD dislikes every disbeliever, guilty. O you who believe, you shall observe GOD and refrain from all kinds of usury, if you are believers. If you do not, then expect a war from GOD and His messenger. But if you repent, you may keep your capitals, without inflicting injustice, or incurring injustice. If the debtor is unable to pay, wait for a better time. If you give up the loan as a charity, it would be better for you, if you only knew.
[3:130] O you who believe, you shall not take usury, compounded over and over. Observe GOD, that you may succeed.
[4:161] And for practicing usury, which was forbidden, and for consuming the people's money illicitly. We have prepared for the disbelievers among them painful retribution.
[30:39] The usury that is practiced to increase some people's wealth, does not gain anything at GOD. But if you give to charity, seeking GOD's pleasure, these are the ones who receive their reward manifold.
[7:157] "(4) follow the messenger, the gentile prophet (Muhammad), whom they find written in their Torah and Gospel. He exhorts them to be righteous, enjoins them from evil, allows for them all good food, and prohibits that which is bad, and unloads the burdens and the shackles imposed upon them. Those who believe in him, respect him, support him, and follow the light that came with him are the successful ones."
info@submission.org
david ray griffin doesn't believe that zionists did 9-11, and tries to support any link with jews 2 9-11...he's another crypto jew...is griffin a jewish name?
block*...not support
wrong word...oops...but u get the idea
here's my list of left wing (crypto and not crypto) jewish deceivers and liars:
david griffin
michael ruppert
amy goodman
dave von kleist
bob bowman
aaron russo
greg szymanski
NOAM CHOMSKY
norman finkelstein
Anthony Zinni
William Blum
Michael Chertoff
Schatz (my prof)
...i can't think of any more names...but if u do know of any...just holla and lemme know (i mean post it up)
Salman,
Often I have loaned money to friends and acquaintances. Occasionally one would ask me what the interest would be!
Those who I knew where in real financial trouble.
I never pressured them or simply forgave the balance.
I want to sleep at night. I came from poverty and I learned early that usury is a trap.
I have been working, for a couple of years, to establish an interest free mortgage bank. A flat fee of 10% for the service. That 10% pays for the wages of the people doing the paperwork and overhead. I asked a friend who worked at a local commercial bank to break down a 30yr. mortgage of a $50,000 loan. He told me, at that time, that after the principle (50k) was paid, the homeowner would still owe $130,000 in compound interest over those thirty years! That actually goes far beyond the US racketeering laws!
Any money left over from the flat fee of 10% would become additional available money for more home loans. We also considered car loans and establishing a member plan for local dental and medical care depending on the costs, of course.
When I first suggested this idea to people I began my self education on how little people know about financing.
St. Thomas Aquinas called interest that "dirty thing" and was even suspicious about profit. He asked how could anything be worth more then it is?
If we get it going we plan on calling it, The St. Thomas Aquinas Mortgage House (All faiths, nationalities, races and atheist welcome).
Local business men like the idea because it would free up money for people to buy more from local businesses. I was warned that banks might find ways to prevent it happening. But our clients would be aimed at people clearing less then $50,000 (also the size of the family).
This idea would first be tested in a more rural setting then in a major city.
People who know each other would make it difficult for politics to disrupt the effort. Smaller towns have better access to government.
HP,
I've had to shake the dust from my sandals and move on. Since we both are heathens I know that I would enjoy your company anywhere. "GodSend" is worse that any Dominican, Ursuline, Sisters of Charity, Christian Brothers, Irish Christian Brothers or Jesuits, I've had, combined!
It's the Evangelical Inquisition.
Tiger Eye:
Coming from you, that's a compliment! Thanks So you're an ex-Catholic, huh! No wonder. They messed you up but good - like many others I know. You can still get over it, though
HP,
Concerning Catholics attitude toward animals.
Of all the Saints known for the love of animals is our little brother St. Francis of Assisi, of Italy. He is world renowned and his statue is found in gardens, more than anyother. Usually he has birds perched on his shoulders. Once a year many Parishes have the "Day of the Blessing of the Animal's" in honor of Francis. People bring mice, birds, fish, even horses to be blessed by the priest.
Souls? Who knows? All that matters is that they are loved. Right HP?
http://www.americancatholic.org/...cis/
who_was.asp
Tiger Eye,
I second that emotion!
Good Luck!
Duh! What, exactly, do you consider "prideful' and "hateful" in my comments?
"Paragraph #1: NO, Christ did not have any of the (moral) imperfections of a human being. He was the son of Man as well as the son of God and He was perfect. Yes, He was human with a mortal body BUT He was able to resist all of the temptations of the Devil. We can't. Even Paul couldn't and admitted as much."
Ans: Then why did he go into the desert? For fun and games, or to purify himself for his day of reckoning. He suffered the temtations of all humanity by Satan. Why bother if he was perfect in the first place?
By the way,
As I began to answer your paragraph by paragraph reply to my statements I was suddenly aware that I may be responding to another person. Are there two "GodSend's"?
Was this being answered by the Evangelical minister "GodSend the Younger"? Or "GodSend the Elder"?
And yes, it does matter to me. If it is so, you should have identified yourself as other. I sense two people.
Tiger Eye:
The question was: Where is the pride or hate in my comments? You didn't answer the question. There is neither pride nor hate in my comments - there is only truth
He went into the desert because the Devil invited Him there to tempt Him. But, being the perfect Man, He was able to resist (all) the Devil's temptations. Like I said, He endured suffering, having a mortal body but morally He was perfect (without sin). Get it?
Your senses cannot be trusted! There are a few GodSends in the world but in this forum today, there is only one
You won't be able to do yourself justice with your answers unless you follow my advice and study my website first, as I suggested. You need to deepen your understanding and get a more complete picture. Otherwise, we could be here for a very long time. Some homework on your part is required
Tiger Eye,
I have been working, for a couple of years, to establish an interest free mortgage bank. A flat fee of 10% for the service. That 10% pays for the wages of the people doing the paperwork and overhead.
This is a nice idea but is it viable in the long term? If I understand you correctly a customer wanting to borrow 50k would sign up for a total debt of 55k to be repaid over 30 years (at a nominal interest rate of circa 1/3 of 1% pa). I would have thought that the base effective annual interest rate would need to slightly exceed the prevailing rate of inflation just to preserve the value of the capital. Also what would be the incentive for people with spare cash to put capital into the scheme?
Just curious. The road to financial ruin is paved with good intentions and all that... Ask your banker friend to reverse engineer one of your loans (on paper) and report on the true return and to explain the potential pitfalls of charging too little interest, and what his opinion of 'too little interest' is. For example $3-20 pw isn't much to diligently and competently manage a 30-year $55k loan, in a rented office with paid staff, but that's all you'll have 25 years into a 2006 loan, when wages might have quadrupled. No offense intended, btw.
On the other hand charging just a bit less than the prevailing interest rate would still have people knocking down the door and would require only slightly less ingenuity, dedication and fancy footwork than the break-even operation. It would be much easier to start the break-even operation you favor from an established, thriving and profitable business base with an inbuilt margin for error.
Horsewhisperer,
When people apply for a loan, usually the borrower determines whether he can stretch a loan out over a period of time to be able to make payments. With a flat fee of 10% it would make the repayment period about a third of the time to pay it off at say $500 a month. That's a rent for many of the people we are interested in helping.
Of course no one would have to take out a 30 year second mortgage if the payment was only a fraction of the cost of a commercial bank or mortgage house. We would not offer 30 yr. loans on such a small amount. A persons income would determine their ability as to how much they can pay. The client would still have to have the lender hold the deed as collateral as an incentive to pay off a loan as soon as possible.
We believe, again, that small inexpensive loans would increase tremendously faster than a local commercial bank especially for lower income members. This would make a segment of the low income earning community members more capable of paying off short term low cost loans.
Remember there is no profit motive. A small town incentive, such as this, will have a very small overhead and staff of about three to four people. The town size that I'm am talking about rangers from 10 to 30 thousand people.
As a not for profit organization many wealthy people would be interested in writing off some of their tax payments as donations/lending to this kind of local project.
Financial ruin? Depending how much money is available for this insentive will naturally determine the extent of people it could help.
God Send,
"Pride or hate in my comments"?
Where did I say that? Or are you confusing me with HP?
But since you mention it I would call it Egotistical arrogance and fear mongering.
There's an Irish song that reminds me of you. It goes something like this;
"Though you know all the words and you sang all the notes, you never quite learned the songs you sang.
I can tell by the sadness in your eyes (tone) that you never quite learned a song."
You, being a literalist, I feel, haven't learned from the faith you profess.
You, to me, are the new Pharisee.
And I think I've been on your site once. I thought the site design was going to set off an epileptic seizure so I got off your site as quick as I could before I fell off my seat. It took me a week to recover.
Isn't that the one with the Bible Code nonsense? You know, Tabloid Religion.
Tiger Eye:
You are obviously blind - perhaps in only one Tiger Eye, but I suspect in both! But God can help you SEE! It will be painful but if you should be so blessed with His Amazing Grace, remember through the pain that it is for your ultimate good If you don't get hit by a heavenly 2X4 that really wakes you up, you will come to a tragic end, like millions of others who are deceived by the Devil or who defy God through arrogance!
You're not ready to understand what is on my website and you're not ready to engage me in any sort of useful dialog. You are not alone
godsend's site is one of those slightly over the top on screaming colours (takes one to know one), profusely illustrated (with fotophoppery) sites by an early adopter and that means midi assault. You need to shift gears on your audio dude and while you are at it compare the Nat. Geog. program on the the gospel of judas scrolls with interps like that off the wall one by Robert Graves (see 'King jesus')*. The NG program borrows so liberally from RG that I was genuinely suprised they didn't admit it. Anyway, in the end they back off and emphasize some mystico-gnostic and conventionally christian sacrificial interpretation of the judas part. The program is knitted around the gospel of judas.
so salman, whaddup widda 19 code man. Believe that stuff?
Tiger Eye, suppose you are aware of http://www.reinventingmoney.com
also see jewdas.org for a great joseph story.
Personally i think the bulk of the bible (and similarly aged docs) interps are utter non-sense; worse than trying to idf people on internetboards without Kevin Mitnick and the NSA helping out. That's why i like Robert Graves' outrageous but to me true ringing hunch. It's on the OKMaerth level of fliplepleapery; i lap it up. Now, if you'll excuse me; got a new xymph to read.
Like the Pharisees, GodSend is judge, jury and executioner.
Their back! And in force.
I should have listened to Rowan and have been done with him along time ago.
He's, like all Pharisees, impenetrable in their self righteousness.
piet:
Well, you got the 'early adopter' part right, if nothing else I love the unadulterated simplicity of midi As for the Judas gospel, the 4 that are part of the Bible are sufficient!
Tiger Eye, take RB's advice (which is otherwise useless) and give me the respect of not answering my comments - they are not meant for the likes of you. You remember the advice about pearls and swine, right?! Chew on what you're able to digest and leave the pearls alone
Thank you piet.
Tiger Eye, I liked your reply. Hope the idea catches on and grows.
RB's advice (which is otherwise useless)...
you mean, that when I tell people that other people (like you) are worthless drones, that's useless?
After reading the above posts it's clear that there are some very caring and understanding people who read this blog. Then there are the others with closed minds and vengeful hearts. It's fascinating to me how we arrive at who we are and what we feel. On a base level it's probably to do with how much fear we have and how much faith we have in each other.
Tiger Eye, believe it or not, the current judeo-banking system as we know it will have to be overthrown from the top and through physical force. This is what Christ did in the temple (the only time in the gospels he ever got violent physically), and Mohammed the Prophet declared militant war (i.e. physical combat) against those who engage in these types of usury (read above). Usury has destroyed families, nations, and empires...and continues to do so. The only tribe famous for this type of racketeering are the Judaists.
piet, i don't believe everything on that submission.org site because it has certain individuals with twisted agendas. However Rashad Khalifa's translation is in many ways simplified and sophiusticated than the other translaters, and he does a good job (but not perfect) of going over the meanings in the Qur'an.
More to this, Rashad Khalifa's 19-code is correct for the most part (i've personally done most of the counts...they perfectly add up in most cases). So i'll say RK did "discover" the 19-code. Try it for yourself to disprove me about the 19-code.
Hoarsewhiperer,
By the way, there is no interest or profit involved at all. A 10% flat fee is for wages and overhead only. If any additional monies remain from the flat fee costs after a finical year, it is simply added to the money that is available for loans.
I know it's difficult for people to understand that no interest or profit need be applicable to any human financial transaction.
Many people find it difficult, at first, to understand the concept at first glance until the realize the unnecessary plundering by profit, interest and compound interest of people's labor.
Salman,
I agree.
P.S...piet...the 19-code confirms the verses of the Qur'an to be intertwined mathematically...that is not the issue...the main issue is what we do with the message of the qur'an, and how we implement it correctly in our lives...
Tiger Eye, if you agree..then how do we crush the banking cartel physically/militarily? I know there are only a handful of Muslim nations in the world that don't/didn't use the jewish financial system (iran, perviously iraq, maybe cuba, north korea, iran, libya, previously afghanistan).
...and non muslim nations like cuba and north korea...but u get my point.
hey what does any1 think of that Jew Aaron Russo yapping about the scam of the monetary system, yet it seems like he provides no explanation/objectives of what to do with the situation...and he seems to be connected with Israeli Jews that distributed his film "From Freedom to Fascism", and is connected to Dov Zakheim and other Zionists. Now the same tribe that caused us these problems is selling us the problem as if they discovered it (it was exposed over 30 years ago), without asking the never answered question of how to deal with the Judas and their scams. The West needs to ask what we have to do with the Jewish question.
More on Russo the Jew...http://www.libertyforum.org/
showthreaded.php?Cat=&Board=news_press&
Number=294662816&page=&view=&sb=&o=&t=0
Only very remotely and by Nazi-style methods could Sarkozy be tagged "a Jew".
eelpie | 10.27.06 - 2:50 pm | #
Yeah, hence that is what you see done. What are you not understanding about this blog eelpie ?
I would expect the Jewish libertarian gold bugs to make a big 'radical' showing (as they have been doing on the Lew Rockwell Dot Com site for years).
David Pidcock pointed out in one of his sessions with Daryl Bradford Smith that gold is nothing unique, any commodity can serve as an effective backing for a system of paper money.
Well, it had better be something durable and hard to obtain, which rules a lot of stuff out.
Tiger Eye, I understand the non-profit idea very well. It's noble and I admire your courage. But I'd much rather run a business predicated on profit. Keeping a break-even operation's head above water wouldn't thrill me one bit (too many factors beyond one's control). My concerns were the ones I expressed, namely, charging enough interest to preserve the value of the capital and sourcing new capital. I was 2IC in a very profitable corporate subsidiary for many years and I reckon running a non-profit would be harder. I'm not convinced that a non-profit business can flourish and grow. The biggest problem imo is that a single blunder can kill a non-profit. Profit provides great insurance/headroom and businesses do make mistakes and/or get ripped off occasionally. Having said all that, your reply suggested that you're going in with your eyes open and that's a good start.
Hoarswhisperer,
My friend, it's not about "growth". It's about necessity and common sense. Forces beyond our direct control will ultimately will determine our future unless people understand the basic principles and simple purpose of money. The "social contract", that is, stable money, has to return to it's original intention. Life can no longer be based on "I got mine now you'll get yours" mentality. Savage capitalism is destroying the means to simply live without fear and slavery to the privileged. Rothschild and company can no longer be our employer and nemesis.
The point is that interest rises exponentially and production does not, or should not.
http://www.islamic-finance.com/i...om/
item18_f.htm
Rowan,
Islamic banking site is excellent!
Thanks.
Glad you like it, Tigs. I also have a copy of Frederick Soddy's "Wealth, Virtual Wealth, and Debt", which Tariq al Diwany, whose site that is, credits as a major influence - unfortunately it is in the tiresome Deja Vu format. Somewhere in there, Soddy points out that if you had lent a ball of gold the size of a football out at 5% in Jesus' time, it would now be bigger than the entire galaxy, or some such thing.
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