HULK SMASH!!!
but combat is over... don't you remember aWol telling us that after he flew that jet? Geez man, don't you watch Fox News?
Truly, it's sad when soldiers continue to die, and the only news we hear about are the centrifuges, Winnebagos & backyards of mass destruction.
Can someone remind me why we're there again?
Chatham to Parliament (177
: "My lords, if I were an American as
I am an Englishman, while a foreign troop was landed in my country I would
never lay down my arms- never, never, never".
Please stay angry, it's a fucking outrage. That being said your basic instinct is correct, thanks to blogs like yours and DailyKos a point that pretty much was only heard in the Blogosphere (Bush lied, People died - or my variant Bush lied, GI's died) is now all over the Op/Ed pages and the Sunday talk shows. If they take their eye off the ball it will be time to crank up the verbiage quotient, until then the brief, pithy, pissed off comment and timely link will remain a necessity. Our thanks for your important work.
"Boys in boxes" - We predicted - they delivered.
It is indeed gruesome to keep score. And necessary. It seems that the administration learned the lessons of Vietnam all too well: declare combat over, the embedded media leave, the people lose interest, no chance of Iraq turning into a "living room" war, no worries.
We must have a consistent, persistent message reminding people exactly what BushCo has gotten us into. We can beat the Rovian propaganda. As Bruce noted, the "Bush Lied, People Died" meme is starting to grow. Keep at it. To borrow from Dean: you have the power!
Atrios, I live in WaPo land. This is now a page A17 story. Nobody cares.
Nobody cares. That is what should be the story.
The new Iraqi Information Minister aka Donald Rumsfeld has told us this is not a counterinsurgency operation or guerilla war. Why don't you believe him?
This sort of thing happens all the time in urban areas like Washington DC. Remnants of Saddam's loyalists are responsible.
Iraqis have been liberated. Our troops have been showered regularly with rose petals. Some though look suspiciously like daisy-cutters painted red.
Soon the Iraqis will be governed by a democracy, just like Kuwait.
The new Iraqi Information Minister aka Donald Rumsfeld has told us this is not a counterinsurgency operation or guerilla war. Why don't you believe him?
Because I keep reading stuff from "U.S. military officials" on the ground that say otherwise. Blog slut alert: I'm too lazy to repeat what I just blogged, so go there...
AP is reporting that the 2 missing GIs have been found dead. This just keeps getting worse and worse...
The end of the Eye-rack war was near
And nonchalant as you please,
The White House's flacks turned lies to facts
And trailers to WMDs.
The papers were game to do the same,
Far lower they'd gladly stoop.
Their mandate for truth was deemed uncouth
From now on they all would be FOX TROOP!
Where cave men are thrilled
That Libs get grilled
While neocons get a free pass
And checking facts is strictly cheap-ass.
So now black is white and peace is strife
And crap is tomato soup.
We all love Big Brother more than life
And get all our info from... FOX TROOP!
(ttto: F-Troop by William Lava)
Here's a link to the NYTimes with a little info about the 2 GIs:
Missing U.S. Soldiers Found Dead North of Baghdad
"At least 61 U.S. troops have died in Iraq since major combat was declared over May 1, including at least 23 in attacks." I am mad.
Why not put a box on your page, up near your Wolf spot, where you can keep a running total of service people killed, since the war has "ended?"
So far it's about one-a-day.
Where's the outrage over this?
There is none. Nada. Zip.
I refinanced a mortgage recently and the closer brought the papers to my house to sign. Her husband waited outside. He had a sticker on his car stating that he was a helicopter pilot in Nam. Halfway through the closing she asked when we thought the "war" would be over. The floodgates opened. It turns out her daughter is a nurse at Walter Reed. She told us that the hospital is overflowing with wounded GI's brought in every day from Iraq and Afghanistan, that they are seriously understaffed, that nurses are doing the work of doctors. Has anybody read anything about this in the press or on the blogs?
Why not put a box on your page, up near your Wolf spot, where you can keep a running total of service people killed, since the war has "ended?"
FYI, there's a running total of coalition casualties over at Lunaville.
She told us that the hospital is overflowing...Has anybody read anything about this in the press or on the blogs?
I have a vague recollection of something about this, but no, it doesn't appear to be getting lots of coverage. I think I'll poke around a bit. This is so sad.
DÉJŔ VU - THE PLOT AGAINST THE DOCTORS
I was deeply depressed (also angered) by reading an email from Andrew Wilkie—the Nuffield Professor of Pathology at the Weatherall Institute of Molecular Medicine in Oxford—to Avit Duvshani, an Israeli, reprinted on Little Green Footballs today. Wilkie, in rejecting Duvshani’s application for PhD studies at his institution, allegedly because of Duvshani’s mandatory service in the Israeli army, explains himself this way:
Thank you for contacting me, but I don't think this would work. I have a huge problem with the way that the Israelis take the moral high ground from their appalling treatment in the Holocaust, and then inflict gross human rights abuses on the Palestinians because they (the Palestinians) wish to live in their own country.
Of course, Wilkie does not bother to inquire about Duvshani’s political opinions, but that, alas, is no surprise. In fact, it is par for the course. Allow me the privilege of being a little personal in my response to this:
My late father, Norman Simon, a Jew, was a professor of nuclear medicine at Mount Sinai Hospital Medical School in New York and the inventor of several operations in that field. He went to lecture, with great pride, at Oxford on numerous occasions and frequently entertained British doctors here, many of whom were his students and later his friends. They had many disputes about various issues, but for them, in the end, it was only about one thing—saving lives through scientific discovery.
I remember also growing up meeting a number of his colleagues, many of them Jews and some of them quite illustrious like Jonas Salk and Bela Schick. These brilliant people had views as complex and disparate as any I have ever encountered. Some were Marxist; some were Buddhist in their thinking.
Now surely “The Nuffield Professor of Pathology” must know this. So why the immediate politicization of Mr. Duvshani’s submission? The clue, I’m afraid, is in the quotation above. Wilkie writes: “…the Israelis take the moral high ground from their appalling treatment in the Holocaust…” Why bring the Holocaust, of all things, into someone’s university application, it would not seem the slightest bit germane to the discussion, unless you have it on the brain?
What this appears to be is a perfect example of Ron Rosenbaum’s thesis about the recent rise in European anti-Semitism—that it is a form of mass guilt reduction. If there is something wrong with the Jews today, then we (the Europeans) were not so bad when we averted our eyes while Hitler marched them into the crematoria. This pathology explains a lot of things, but evidently, in this case, not to a pathologist. He would have to examine himself and see a racist (albeit an unconscious one--not that that makes a great deal of difference).
It is also, ironically, yet another in the many plots against Jewish doctors. Stalin’s wasn’t the first or the last--only the most famous one.
UPDATE: Some fascinating de
UPDATE: Some fascinating details on Professor Wilkie's background in the comments on this issue over at the wonderfully-named HORSEFEATHERS blog (which I am now linking.)
SECOND UPDATE: Having read Wilkie's non-apology apology posted below on here and on LGF, it should now be quite clear to everyone that the professor is a fucking racist! (Note to Adam Sullivan: sometimes even the "civilized" can crack.)
Ironic hain't it that the only respectful acknowledgment of the military casualties occurs at the end of the News Hour on that lib-burr-yool PBS?
Like bartcop says, every new death is another name on the Iraqi War Memorial.
It's not a game. It's not keeping score. Keeping record of this is a reminder of the reality of what is happening over there.
I cannot complain because this news is on page A17. At least it's being REPORTED. The people who actually care whether the troops live or die will take notice every time they see it. They will look for this information, record it, and share it with the others who care. Us.
We truly are the public that supports the troops. Us. The ones who are hurt when even one soldier dies or is wounded. It must stop.
It will. This is the way it stopped last time, and it will work again. Sooner or later Americans will come to their senses about this waste of life, and hopefully much sooner than it happened in Viet Nam.
Hopefully.
Later,
Being a real conservative means never having to worry about "militarily insigfnifcant" deaths of soldiers....
"At least 61 U.S. troops have died in Iraq since major combat was declared over May 1, including at least 23 in attacks." I am mad.
The other day in the newspaper it was stated that there were 19 deaths in Iraq since the end of the war.
I knew there was more than that because the papers have already reported more than 19 deaths.
Already starting to cover-up the number of military dead. It Vietnam all over again, complete with lies, the bodybags and everything.
The Iraqis are not to happy to be liberated by the USA perhaps because they were never really liberated with Bush's focus on just letting them do business with only his campaign contributors.
Saw Clarence Paige stand up to this fact on the continue killing in Iraq on John McLaughlin last night.
sorry-- "insignificant"
We HAVE to make Bush pay for this disgusting waste of life.
The question is HOW?
With his own.
A soldier a day
keeps Osama away.
Somehow the apparent kidnapping then execution of the two American soldiers seems especially sinister.
It's starting to feel more and more like Blackhawk Down in Iraq.
What's the military "strategery" going to be now? Seems like we're losing control of the situation. Can we regain it?
the only news we hear about are the centrifuges, Winnebagos & backyards of mass destruction.
Interesting to note the results on the current CNN.com QuickVote asking "What was this week's top news story?":
Supreme Court rulings - 54%
Iraq casualties - 30%
Western wildfires - 7%
Strom Thurmond dies - 9%
Once again, Frazier rocks.
My belief is that we're not yet at the tipping point in Iraq. Some of these acts of violence against Americans show careful planning, some not, but they are isolated incidents. If these sparks collect into a "National Liberation Front" flame, which is to say all native parties in Iraq can agree on one thing, "Yankee-Tommy Go Home!" we are fucked. But that might not happen, if we humble ourselves to the Iraqis (let them have elections, no matter what) and get services going again, and sabotage doesnt' stop either from immediate effect, we could run the gauntlet.
pie: Despite the claims of the pack of pathological liars infesting the Executive Branch of the United States Government, we were never "in control" of the situation in Iraq. Saying you are and actually being are two different things, but these mendacious twits do not worry about whether their rhetoric has any connection at all to reality.
The entire thing is the most elaborate lie since "I was out of the loop" or "I am not a crook".
In fairness, the people at Nightline devoted the whole show to the subject last night. This is starting to get play.
Question: Why does no one really care about the ongoing deaths of American soldiers in Iraq?
Answer: We're all (at least, most of us are) completely under the influence of a virtual "soma" (which as you'll recall was the mandatory drug for "bad moods" in Huxley's Brave New World (1932).
there are some great Soma quotes from BNW here: http://www.huxley.net/soma/somaq.../
somaquote.html
Here's the deal. We're now multiple generations away from the last really scary conflict, WW2. This event transformed society; here in LA, literally miles of real estate were converted into manufacturing sites for airplanes, weaponry, components, whatever was needed to win the effort against the Japanese and Germans.
But ask yourself: could you see something like this happen today?
No.
And the reason why is simple: that WW2 generation was the last to truly sacrifice on a huge, society-wide scale FOR society. Nothing against the Vietnam generation, but the reach of that conflict was intentionally limited to keep it on a lower level - something that has been tried again and again with each successive conflict in American history.
This war is no different -- except for one thing: its unbelievable illegitimacy.
Combine that with the "soma"-like effects of the mass media, our consumer culture (think Wal-Mart ads with that stupid 70s happy-face icon and you can literally feel the numbing effects of it all).
So, people die. It happens all the time. People get shot every day in LA; no one cares unless it's a celebrity doing the dying or shooting.
In many ways, i really fear for the world my kids are soon entering as adults.
But at least they've been raised to trust no one, nothing, nobody. Hopefully that will get them a little further through this shit-drenched, drugged culture we live in.
Am I wrong here or what?
"The entire thing is the most elaborate lie since "I was out of the loop" or "I am not a crook".
You left out my own Fave...
"Peace With Honor"
By the way, that "unbelievable illegitimacy" I referenced above refers to the REAL reason for invading Iraq:
OIL.
No matter what any of the right-wing fuckwits say, we are indeed running out of easy-to-get (read: cost-effective) crude oil. There are only single-digit decades of the shit left, and we're dual-digit decades away from hydrogen infrastructures to displace it.
This is nothing more than a grab for OIL RESERVES from people who can least defend themselves.
Next stop, Iran and Saudi. You think all those F-16s that we sold Iran during the Shah's reign, and the ones that Saudis fly now, don't have remote kill switches installed by Lockheed? Puh-leeze.
One flick of that switch and we'll be walking in there, as well.
And when the BFEE (as bartcop puts it) runs about 80% of the world's oil reserves, who will be calling the shots then?
"Daddy, what's a Democrat?"
"Just someone who stood in the way of Emperor Moron's quest for control of oil, for which we're all eternally grateful, son."
Think it can't happen?
It's ALREADY happening now.
By the way, I have a new line:
I'm not paranoid, I'm prescient.
Feel free to use it. you'll see it on my Crew Cab's bumper rolling around LA.
Jim in LA,
If we had decent media representation in this country (like the BBC), which worked harder to get these killings publicized, there might be more outrage. At least, people could have an opinion based on evidence. But there's such a lack of coverage, lack of criticism, with much glossing over, and burying stories in newspapers, that most people just aren't aware of what's going on.
Meanwhile, we see dear leader pranching around the countryside pulling in $$$. His lack of concern is tragic and infuriating.
"Look at me! Aren't I wonderful? I'm such a religious man, a real compassionate conservative."
Exit screaming...
Despite the claims of the pack of pathological liars infesting the Executive Branch of the United States Government, we were never "in control" of the situation in Iraq.
The DoD would seem to agree:
The Department of Defense announced today that Spc. Andrew F. Chris, 25, of Calif., was killed on June 25 in Iraq. Chris was fatally wounded in combat operations in hostile enemy territory.
Emphasis mine.
so true, Pie, but America right now (at least, the "America" that seems to be everywhere around me) reminds me of those people in that 80s miniseries about reptile alien invaders, "V."
Remember those human conspirators? They couldn't wait to sidle up those reptiles, to sell out their peers, just for a lick of the brass ring.
I view most "Americans" this way these days.
I agree with Frazier. Up against the wall is too good for 'em.
As for the media being too timid to report, this has been the case for decades -- if not longer. When they decide a course of action is no longer in their best financial interest, they'll turn on a topic and present it another way -- generally, the way we want to see it presented.
But ONLY after they've checked their balance sheets.
The only "independent" media is that done by the Righteously Insignificant, such as this site.
==>Why not put a box on your page, up near your Wolf spot, where you can keep a running total of service people killed, since the war has "ended?"
So far it's about one-a-day.
Where's the outrage over this?
There is none. Nada. Zip.
When the war was in the pre-Saddam-out-of-power-phase, they reported the dead and DID note who was killed in combat and who died in a military or friendly fire accident.
Like the helicopters that crashed w/loss of life were sometimes from hostile fire and sometimes "mechanical malfunction" (and I noted that those were also in a "fire" area so I think that sometimes they were fudging those numbers until they had to admit that helicopters were SHOT DOWN). But a person in harms' way who dies in a humvee accident while chasing the enemy or under enemy fire is still dead in a war situation just as if they were shot or blown up by a bomb of some type.
But they DID differentiate during the "hot" phase; I also remember something during GWI that the allies were unhappy to train w/our troops because we trained under "full" combat conditions and had scads of military deaths in training situations.
But I have ALWAYS thought that if you were in Vietnam and died, say, in a car accident while on leave in Saigon, say, you were STILL listing as a "war dead" because you died in a "war zone" and I DON'T think this differentiation about "accidents", "training", "friendly" and/or "hostile" fire existed then.
Dead is dead.
Looks like some of the Dems are finally growing a pair of balls:
Deeper weapons probe is planned; Democrats question prewar intelligence
By Ken Guggenheim, Associated Press
WASHINGTON -- Democrats on the Senate Armed Services Committee announced yesterday plans to stage their own inquiry on the credibility of prewar intelligence on Iraq's weapons of mass destruction and its links to the Al Qaeda terror network.
The announcement by Senator Carl Levin of Michigan, the panel's top Democrat, marked an unusual split with chairman John Warner, Republican of Virginia, on an issue with strong political overtones ahead of next year's elections. Warner and Levin are longtime colleagues on the committee and repeatedly stress bipartisan cooperation.
Democrats in both the House and Senate have been pushing for widened examinations of prewar intelligence beyond reviews already underway by both bodies' intelligence committees.
Levin said he has directed Democratic staff to examine the objectivity and credibility of the intelligence and its effect on Defense Department policy decisions, military planning, and operations in Iraq.
He said Warner refused his request to begin such an inquiry. In a letter released by Levin, Warner said the committee should wait until the Senate Intelligence Committee has completed its review, then decide how to move ahead. Both Levin and Warner are members of the intelligence panel.
The Armed Services Committee, meanwhile, will continue oversight hearings on military operations in Iraq, Warner said in the letter. Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld will appear before the panel the week of July 7.
Warner said Levin's review is "clearly your prerogative" and said his staff may work periodically with Levin's.
In a statement, Warner's press secretary, John Ullyot, said the committee has held four hearings on the weapons and intelligence issues and will hold more, in addition to the Intelligence Committee review. "Senator Levin is welcome to direct his own staff to look into these matters as well," he said.
Levin and Warner will be traveling together next week to Iraq and the Middle East, along with the leaders of the Intelligence Committee and other senators.
The prewar intelligence has been called into question both nationally and abroad because of the military's inability to find weapons of mass destruction in Iraq.
Drip...drip...drip...
Hmmmm...half of the post disappeared..
I was bemoaning how during the Iran hostage situation, the nightly news shows woul begin their reports with "Day ____ of Americans held hostage in Iran". Same thing with the Impeachment. The "libreral" CNN (Clinton News Network, Commie News Network, take your pick) would begin their nightly broadcast, complete with backdrop, with "Day _____ of WH in Crisis). And then they'd continue with 10 minutes of evry sordid update on "Monicagate".
What the hell happened? (BTW, that was a rhetorical question...I ~DO~ know what happened. We lost the media.)
The UK Guardian is reporting two more US soldiers are missing.
I tried Googling for Jeebus the other day and I was asked, Did you mean Jebus? I was looking for the Simpsons episode that (AFAIK) spawned the term. According to the Simpsons transcript online (assembled, I presume, by real-life-comic-book-guys), the correct spelling is "Jebus".
Just FYI.
As in every war, there are more wounded soldiers than those killed outright. The word "wounded" can cover a lot of territory, from minor injuries to "basket cases."
Our ability to quickly evacuate the wounded saves a lot of lives. Unfortunately, some of those saved would be better off dead.
Yeah, but what the hell does a comic-book guy know?
"support our troops"
At least 61 U.S. troops have died in Iraq since major combat was declared over May 1, including at least 23 in attacks.
I wonder about some of these "accidents". If a military vehicle crashes during a firefight, or on the way to assist troops caught in a firefight (as happened this week), and a soldier is killed, why is that death considered "accidental"?
Our need for oil is not so much the real reason. The real reason is strategic control of Iraq's oil - when China and the EU start to rise. We are helping to keep the Saudi Sultans in power - even though the Saudi people hate their roayl family. We are doing the same for the Emir of Kuwait and just about every other oil bearing nation.
Strategic control is the long term benefit. The short term incentive was to prevent OPEC from changing it's currency of trade to the Euro. If that happened, most nations would change their reserve currency to the Euro - which would sock our economy for a very long time.
Saddam Hussein changed his reserve currency ( what he used in trading oil in the Oil for Food program ) to the Euro shortly before the American shift of focus toward Iraq. I think this was a secondary impetus for the invasion.
Strategic control of resources is why we are not helping the people in the COngo. The world's primary source of coltan ( used in anything with a cpacitor or a resistor ) is there, and the war is driving the price for the mineral down to rock bottom prices. Western companies profit from the strife in Congo - so it is easy for the media to ignore the suffering of the innocent.
Meanwhile, we see dear leader pranching around the countryside pulling in $$$. His lack of concern is tragic and infuriating.
Speaking of which, if Dear Leader can raise $200 million by the primary season for his campaign, why doesn't he try raising $400 billion to pay off the federal deficit?
In a just war, armies don't have to keep fighting after defeating the regime in power.
It seems to me, our military was structured to fight just wars. It's very successful at them. It isn't prepared for an unjust occupation that followed an illigal war of agression.
"Yeah, but what the hell does a comic-book guy know?"
Worst... post... ever!
I of course meant illegal and aggression.
Support the Troops - Impeach Bush!
NTodd,
Thanks for the nod.
"I shall be on the Internet registering my disgust in seconds!"
Milhouse: "We need to spread this around! Let's put it on the Internet!"
Bart: "No, we have to reach people whose opinions actually matter!"
I'd like to point out to everyone reading this thread who didn't notice that in this post Gary Frazier explicitly calls for the murder of the President of the United States. Such exhortations violate federal law, and Frazier deserves to be punished to its fullest extent.
By the way, I realize that Frazier is probably a right-wing troll trying to make this board look stupid, but that doesn't make it okay.
Dear Fed Up With Violent Threats:
You seem to be jumping to conclusions.
Besides: I would no more advocate the "murder" of the fratboy coward than he would advocate the "murder" of Karla Fay Tucker.
I have the distinct feeling from watching Rather and the PBS programs last night that there are now tens of thousands of wives and parents in the US who are now living in dread that a military officer is going to appear at the front door with the telegram.
More and more of these people just want their loved ones out from a situation that is less and less defensible.
So stay mad and keep pointing the deaths out in their behalf. (By the way, Jim Lehrer has shown about 50 new faces of the American postwar dead at the end of his program, but the Pentagon now says 22; what gives?)
Also, I've never once said I'd ever harm a hair on Al Gore's head.
Isn't "high treason" still a capital offense -- and subject to the death penalty? Surely it must be lawful to call for prosecution of Bush and his whole coterie of criminal cronies for treason -- and then application of the appropriate penalty -- after their conviction.
Isn't "high treason" still a capital offense -- and subject to the death penalty? Surely it must be lawful to call for prosecution of Bush and his whole coterie of criminal cronies for treason -- and then application of the appropriate penalty -- after their conviction.
Isn't "high treason" still a capital offense -- and subject to the death penalty? Surely it must be lawful to call for prosecution of Bush and his whole coterie of criminal cronies for treason -- and then application of the appropriate penalty -- after their conviction.
Oh well, I just learned that one can't refresh the comments window after making a post.
Sorry
SENATE CONFIRMS ABIZAID AS HEAD OF US CENTRAL COMMAND -
U.S. SOLDIER DIES IN AFGHAN ACCIDENT -
FRUSTRATED US DEMOCRATS LAUNCH OWN IRAQ WEAPONS' PROBE
These are the headlines at Islamonline.net. There were no accompanying articles yet. They seem to have earlier information than other sites. I don't know where it's located, but it's in English. I have not heard anything about the "frustrated US Dems" launching their own probe for WMDs.
But the American people are really in the dark about Afghanistan. This is at least the second death I've read about in Afghanistan this week. Most people think things are going great there. I think news from Afghanistan is several layers below real Iraq news.
(Apologies ahead of time if the link doesn't work --- I was trying to remember the 'formula' from memory)
Also, I've never once said I'd ever harm a hair on Al Gore's head.
LOL, Gary.
streaker sorta mentioned this, but there's also americans dying in afghanistan (not to mention non-americans) who get even less attention.
yesterday's casualty is at:
http://www.nytimes.com/2003/06/2...sia/
28AFGH.html
Scott Fanetti:
Your dead-on analysis lays out the rational from the PNAC playbook, almost verbatim. The PNACers occupy almost every important position in DoD, but the organization is NEVER mentioned.
Also, our activities in Saudi and Kuwait are a sad echo of Iran, Phillipines, Nicaragua, El Salvador, Panama, Haiti, etc., etc.. We somehow almost always end up carrying water for the people wearing the jackboots, all in the name of "prgamatism" or, "national interest". Will the day ever come when we act like we actually believe the words of the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution? I'm nearly 50, and I still get chills when I read or hear those words, or those on the Statue of Liberty. I refuse to give up.
Selah-but not for long.
Gosh, I'm just fed-up with violent threads, too. Too bad this whole thread is about government sponsored violence. 'Cause you know what? I'm sick to death of government sponsored violence. I'm sick of this administration of death that thinks nothing of the lives of Americans, whether it is Americans who have been convicted of a crime, or service men and woman who are sent to invade another country that was no threat to anyone but itself. Or elderly Americans who will die because they can't affore health care. And I'm sick of reading about innocent Iraqis who are dying like flies because of this government of death. And I personally wish the entire administration and it's hatchet-men in Congress WOULD ALL DROP DEAD.
Lying re blowjobs wasn't very costly in comparison to the lies that got us here. Bush and his cohorts' lying about Iraq is costing billions of dollars, the loss of American credibility, and, most importantly, the lives of hundreds of Americans and tens of thousands of Iraqi civilians. We (it's a democracy, so it's "we" not the soldiers) shot and killed an 11 year old boy in the last 24 hrs because we thought he was a gunman. We are destroying lives left and right without any accountability. Bush has yet to go to Iraq to see the devastation he's wrought. A lot of us knew as early as last fall that the Bushies were lying and Ramsey Clark had articles of impeachment drawn up before we ever invaded Iraq (or as the media put it "war broke out"). If there is any justice in this country, Bush and all his creepy cadre will be ousted before many more people die.
We shot and killed one 11-year-old boy and ran over and killed another.
At this hour the totals for US deaths in Iraq are right around 55 total with 23 of those combat deaths. I noticed this 'combat death' reporting last week when the number was 17. This deliberate DoD spin was picked up by CNN, and if you watched the crawl of the 24hr version both numbers would show up without qualifiers.
This deliberate downplaying of casualties will not last for two reasons. First we will not let it, there are some powerfully angry people here. Two, as time goes on the ratio will begin to narrow. Two weeks ago there was not an active, ongoing attempt to achieve a fatality a day. There was the Baghdad sniper, and the point-blank shooting at the checkpoint, but these in retrospect were simply beta testers. We are seeing the rollout of Version 1.0 of this third-person shooter and a shortage of master gamers on our side. Which means the loss of an increasing number of our very, very non-virtual soldiers.
I am not trying to be funny. BushCo started a game of PNAC Risk - sweep armies into this country, move on to the next - look Mom - Pax Americana. Instead they are trapped in a game of Iraqi Sniper. And they suck at it.
Fanetti: the US controlling 80%-plus of the world's easy-to-get-to oil reserves is strategic control over oil reserves.
The EU matters nothing to the US.
China is another matter. It would take a month-long hailstorm of nukes to wipe them out, so it's easier to simply control their access to raw materials (e.g. oil and its byproducts) on which their economy is now do dependent.
Ultimately, the 21st century will be about the US-China battle for earthly hegemony. and it'll make our current problems with the unelected moron look like a walk in the park.
so, i suppose, we do agree!
"By the way, I realize that Frazier is probably a right-wing troll trying to make this board look stupid, but that doesn't make it okay."
So the MBFs are deciding who is and isn't an MBF? Sweet...
pie - Oh, that link was too much. We're shooting 11 year olds. Oh, Jesus wept.
I'd gladly contribute toward however many bags of pretzels it will take to get rid of George W Bush, but I'd rather IMPEACH GEORGE W BUSH right now, and then see him and Cheney, Wolfowitz, Perle, et al
HANGED AS TRAITORS
dave - not only are the MBFs deciding now who are MBFs, they think they've pulled the ultimate hijack. Since they've been doing the MBF in liberal clothing this week, there are a lot of people who can't tell the difference and join their rants. Hopefully next week they'll be onto another tactic. If not, so be it.
"I'd like to point out to everyone reading this thread who didn't notice that in this post Gary Frazier explicitly calls for the murder of the President of the United States. Such exhortations violate federal law, and Frazier deserves to be punished to its fullest extent.
Fed Up With Violent Threats | 06.28.03 - 12:25 pm"
Hey, where was your outrage when Annthrax Coulter said of Clinton, "either impeach him or kill him?"
And just recently when some tv wannabe pundit suggested bludgeoning Senator Clinton with a tire iron?
Oh, wait, those are libruls, and it's okay to advocate for their deaths. Sorry, Fed-up.
"...they think they've pulled the ultimate hijack. Since they've been doing the MBF in liberal clothing this week, there are a lot of people who can't tell the difference and join their rants."
Really? I think it's pretty obvious...
But the real question is: what was Benjamin Franklin's secret with women???
The opening paragraph from a Page 1 story in today's Lexington (KY) Herald-Leader:
"The joy and relief that Kentucky military families enjoyed just a few weeks ago when Saddam Hussein's regime was toppled now are turning to fear and frustration as attacks and ambushes against U. S. soldiers in Iraq continue."
It's starting to hit Middle America, folks.
er - not to be a partypooper, although I often am - couldn't these types of remarks trigger a visit from the Secret Service?
librul - I think you have to directly threaten the POTUS in a credible way. I don't think we've come so far with creepin' fascism that we can't still exercise our freedom of speech to each other by saying the kinds of things we say here.
I think I posted this to he wrong thread earlier.
Support our troops -- bring them home.
I've been thinking about this a lot lately. I didn't want them to go over there in the first place, but now they are there.
We took out the Iraqi government and filled the void with our troops. If we pull out now, radical islamists are likely to fill that void. Iran will become the preeminent power in the region. It will be in Turkey's national interest to strengthen ties with Syria and Iran to counter the Kurdish state that will surely result (unless, of course, we abandon the Kurds yet again, and let the Turks take what is now Northern Iraq).
On the other hand, if we don't pull out, we'll need to station hundreds of thousands of troops there for years to come. The costs of doing so, both in budgetary and human resource terms, would be enormous. It would compromise our ability to react to other threats to our national security.
We're going to pay the price for Bush's megalomania for years to come.
Speaking of Bush's megalomania, did you see this:
According to Abbas, immediately thereafter Bush said: "God told me to strike at al Qaida and I struck them, and then he instructed me to strike at Saddam, which I did, and now I am determined to solve the problem in the Middle East. If you help me I will act, and if not, the elections will come and I will have to focus on them."
Whoops. These quotes should have been intalicized:
Support our troops -- bring them home.
and
According to Abbas, immediately thereafter Bush said: "God told me to strike at al Qaida and I struck them, and then he instructed me to strike at Saddam, which I did, and now I am determined to solve the problem in the Middle East. If you help me I will act, and if not, the elections will come and I will have to focus on them."
One good thing that came out of our decade-and-a-half haul in Vietnam was since then, our military excursions have had very tightly defined goals: we accomplish such-and-so and leave. So Grenada, Mogudishu, Haiti, Bosnia--well-planned, light casualties and short. (1) And open-ended occupations were clearly out.
. . . until President Drinkin' Buddy got into the White House. Remarkable how little effect Vietnam had on that boy.
Humanitarian issues aside, Iraq has turned into a bottomless pit for public monies. But that's our money, not Bush's. His safety isn't threatened, he doesn't even have to deal with noise, heat or bad smells. Really, how would he distinguish the war from a video game? We've blown off Afghanistan? Sort of like abandoning a Vice City game for Half Life.
(1)I suspect that the reason Clinton took so much time going to Bosnia was that, no matter how much we hated "ethnic cleasing," exactly how were we going to fight it and how would we know we were finished?.( Plus, of course, he was having his time wasted by the other party, which did zippola for eight years but harrass him on the public dime. But I digess.)
Ignore the trolls who need to come to websites with a leftward slant to learn anything at all about their countrymen who are dieing in Iraq.
Not really being spoken about much on LGF? Or the AI Rottweiller?
"Since they've been doing the MBF in liberal clothing this week, there are a lot of people who can't tell the difference and join their rants."
Whenever I quibble with anything anyone says here, I get asked questions like, "How can you possibly justify [insert Bush administration outrage here]?" And I have no answer to that, because I can't justify it, because I FUCKING HATE THE BUSH ADMINISTRATION. But people here can't see shades of grey - either you're with us - violent threats, childish nicknames and all - or you're with the "moronic brownshirt fucks".
"And just recently when some tv wannabe pundit suggested bludgeoning Senator Clinton with a tire iron?"
I know it was Scarborough or Savage Weiner, but I can't remember which. (I've never watched either of their shows, and pretty much everything I know about them I've gotten from this blog.) And most people here correctly agreed Scarborough/Savage deserved a visit from the Secret Service. And Gary does too.
Is it AT ALL conceivable to you that there might be people in the world who agree with you on most public policy issues but don't approve of "the duck pit" or "moronic brownshirt fucks"?
As far as pulling out now and the danger of Islamic fanatics taking over in Iraq, the way I see it, we probably are going to have to stay, if for no other reason than to get a working infrastructure in place. However, even if we are there for 25 years, I don't see any guarantees that Islamic fundamentalists won't still come in at that point. Time is not going to change that part of the equation, IMO.
Gary should perhaps be more careful to point out that the traditional punishment for treason is execution.
Maybe we can get the White House counsel to prepare a brief on it?
Seraphiel - or the Solicitor General? I'd like to see a comprehensive legal opinion on all the grounds for treason, and just how many of them Bush and his bunch of Death Eaters have violated.
"Bush and his bunch of Death Eaters"
I've always seen Bush as more Draco Malfoy than Voldemort. And Cheney and Rumsfeld as his Crabbe and Goyle.
Think I'll change my name to "Fed Up With Unka Karl's Trolls."
Though it is amusing to see them pounding their chest so violently to establish their "props."
Anyhoo... Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz...
These are some of the latest news items:
Distorted Intelligence?
Secret German Records Cast Doubt on Saddam/al-Qaeda connection
Missing U.S. Soldiers found dead north of Baghdad
Public Mood Has Turned Critical in Iraq
Another thread hijacked by someone using a temporary nom de plume.
Carl Heineken - Ok, I've just got to put in my favorite quote so far from "Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix." It's the reporter, Rita Skeeter, talking about the wizard paper of record:
"So the Daily Prophet exists to tell people what they want to hear, does it?" said Hermione scathingly.
Rita sat up straight again, her eyebrows raised, and drained her glass of firewhiskey.
"The Prophet exists to sell itself, you silly girl," she said coldly.
Fed Up With Threats, I understand what you're saying, but sometimes people become so furious about what's going on that they use strong language. It reflects an incredible amount of frustration that many of us feel, knowing these insane policies are being instituted, and absolutely no one who can question it is doing so. Where's our democracy?
I have to admit I was always more interested in compromise. Reasonable, freedom-loving people are.
But not this bunch of tyrants. We've entered uncharted waters, and we're going to have to change our tactics. I don't like it, but there's too much at stake.
Bushco absolutely cannot continue to thrust his agenda down our throats. He's destroying us as a nation.
Unified? Don't make me laugh.
Yeah, Tena, I finished reading it Thursday evening, and felt the same thrill of recognition when I read those lines.
And, by the way, wasn't Umbridge one of the most frightening--and real--characters ever created? I can see the name becoming synonymous with "ruthless zealot."
Carl - yes re: Umbridge. This book really is a lot more grown up - the whole thing with forcing Harry to write "I will not tell lies," with the pen that cuts it into the back of his hand got to me.
All the decrees Umbridge keeps issuing - the whole thing.
Fed Up With Threats, I would have agreed with you at one time. Reason and compromise were once in evidence, and I had the feeling that we as a country were fairly well-regarded by other nations, and we were ALL WORKING TOGETHER.
Not any more. The strong language sometimes used here (NO direct threats against the little moron) reflects our complete frustration with Bush's policies, as we watch our country chart this new destructive course. And who's stopping him? He's an employee, not a dictator. He answers to US. We must make him accountable for his actions.
We're in uncharted waters. We need to change our tactics accordingly. I don't like it, but I care what happens, so I'm willing to. Being the nice guy isn't going to work with these tyrants.
Carl - PS - don't tell me too much - I haven't finished it yet.
Hmm. Didn't think my first post went through. Oh, well.
Carl - PS - don't tell me too much - I haven't finished it yet.
Yeah, please! I'm not getting through it very fast, which is annoying my wife to no end, but I plan on finishing next week when I've cleared some projects off my desk. In the meantime, shhhhh... 
From Yahoo news:
U.S. Death Toll in Iraq Passes 200
AP - 38 minutes ago
After days of intense searching by ground and air, U.S. forces on Saturday found the bodies of two soldiers missing north of Baghdad, as the toll of American dead since the start of war topped the grim milestone of 200.
Umbridge removing the teaching of spells from the "Defense of the Dark Arts" curiculum while the Dark Lord was gathering power struck a chord with me. It reminded me of the push to move kids from public schools to what amount to being conservative indoctrination centers.
its qWagmire Dave.
on deaths, again, i have been keepng count since Bosnia. and as of today 334 soldiers have died playing war. The mighty Clenis™ killed 3 in bosnia, 9 in kosovo(7 accidental, 1 suicide and 1?). Bush has killed about 250 so far. i guess codpiece boy wins.
"And, as Voldemort's final breath passed out of his body, he muttered, 'Rosebud.'"
Woops. Sorry.
patriotboy - ooh, good point. The whole book is extremely political, as others have said before me. I was a little surprised, even having read that it is here, just how political it is. Good for Jo Rowling.
[I am compelled to put in a plug for my favorite "children's" books, however. Any of you who have not yet read the Phillip Pullman trilogy really really needs to. It is amazing.]
That should be "Defense Against the Dark Arts"
Carl - Not funny. Not funny at all. Extremely cruel... 
Thanks for the response, pie.
I agree that BushCo's policies pose a nearly-unprecedented threat. Normally I'm skeptical of how important each day's events will seem in hindsight, but it's not exaggeration to say that our foreign policy over the last three years is going to have horrendous consequences for the next half-century.
So yes a change of tactic is needed, but where we differ is on what that tactic should be. I don't have all the answers, but I don't think that violent rhetoric accomplishes anything. I'm not a DNCer who wants to be Republican-Lite either: I think "Bush lied, people died" is a really cool slogan.
As for everyone who wants to accuse me of lying about my motivations, I don't know what else I can say. If it'll make you feel better, I'll be happy to post some trash about "Deanie-babies" or a link to Ann Coulter's site if it'll make you feel better.
NTodd - sorry but, Carl - LOL
Fed Up - well a good way to start would be to quit jumping Gary Frazier and dave for their comments. Gary and dave have been commenting here longer than I have. They have good arguments, good reasoning and really good senses of just how screwed up things are in the US.
read this and cry for America
THE SELLING OF THE IRAQ WAR.
The First Casualty
by John B. Judis & Spencer Ackerman
Go to:
http://www.tnr.com/doc.mhtml?
i=2...rmanjudis063003
Full story on New Republic web site address above.
sorry if someone else already sent this along
Dave E - the link didn't work for me.
I'm starting to get really angry ... you ... wouldnt like me when I'm angry ... HUUULLK!!!
...but I don't think that violent rhetoric accomplishes anything.
Well, first of all, I've been reading Gary Frazier's posts since I started blogging (a few months ago), and I just don't consider his statements to be violent. (I'm a middle-aged mother of two and a former English teacher.) Bush and the neo-con's and their ilk use rhetoric that's much more violent. They've caused major death and destrucion, after all.
We've been too nice. Look at what they've spewed for years. They viciously attacked Clinton and then Gore and continue to use their foul, destructive language to smear anyone that disagrees with them.
Some Americans seem to think that's okay. I don't, but I am convinced that we have to change the rules of the game if we're going to defeat these people.
"Blowing off steam" is necessary for our sanity.
destruction, that is
I think it's okay to be bad as we wanna be here, but when we're dealing with the unconvinced public, we need to be nice as pie (sorry), while, at the same time, saying over and over again, "It just makes me feel sad that the President lied about (pick a topic)." "Lied" and "President" in the same sentence, over and over again.
Hasta luego. Gotta run.
Carl Heineken - I know you said you gotta go - but anyway, just wanted you to know that that is the tactic I've been using - I just keep slipping "lie" and "Bush" into the same sentence as often as possible.
But here, I feel free to say that I'm completely fed up with the right, and this administration, and I wish everyone of them had been strangled at birth. They are responsible for thousands of deaths. They deserve to die, in Gary Frazier's duck pit. Along with all of the rest of dave's MBFs.
Fed Up: As for everyone who wants to accuse me of lying about my motivations, I don't know what else I can say. If it'll make you feel better, I'll be happy to post some trash about "Deanie-babies" or a link to Ann Coulter's site if it'll make you feel better.
You'd have more credibility if you didn't hide behind a psuedonym you created expressly for the purpose of attacking Gary. The fact that you are either too cowardly or otherwise unable to post under a name or psuedonym which regular commentors might recognize makes me wonder if you are actually the MBF who's been stalking him (Yes, I too post ocassionaly using a throwaway name, but I always list the same homepage address).
I can't even find the remarks you're complaining about. Your link didn't work. I can't find anything in this comment thread that resembles a threat. Did I miss it, or did he write it somewhere else and you just decided to attack him here for it?
If you want people to take you seriously, use your regular name or psuedonym. Otherwise, don't complain if people think you are full of shit.
So if Bush is Draco Malfoy, does that make Unka Karl, Voldemort?
I think Grover Norquist is Voldemort. Rove is Wormtail.
So if Bush is Draco Malfoy, does that make Unka Karl, Voldemort?
He even looks like him!!!
I think we've noted every combat death, which is important. Every dead and wounded soldier is a tragedy to their family. Not a news story.
And of course Coulter is Bellatrix Lestrange.
We've been too nice. Look at what they've spewed for years. They viciously attacked Clinton and then Gore and continue to use their foul, destructive language to smear anyone that disagrees with them.
To my mind, there are two kinds of nice. There's DNC nice - i.e. the welfare-slashing Iraq-bombing Republican-appeasing kind of nice. And then there's basic decency. Remember the 1998 congressional election - the Republicans thought they'd coast on Clinton's sexual misadventures. Instead they lost seats because America was disgusted with their hysteria. Clinton won the moral high ground.
I can't even find the remarks you're complaining about. Your link didn't work. I can't find anything in this comment thread that resembles a threat. Did I miss it, or did he write it somewhere else and you just decided to attack him here for it?
My bad on the link. I was referring to "Alex | 06.28.03 - 9:46 am" and "Gary Frazier | 06.28.03 - 9:56 am".
If you want people to take you seriously, use your regular name or psuedonym.
On every site but Eschaton and LGF, I use my real name or a regular recognizable alias. I don't mind being called an idiot or an asshole. I DO mind being told that I am going to be killed for what I post. Maybe you think it's irrational to worry about death threats on weblogs, but I think it's worrying enough to merit this minor precaution.
Another good one, patriotboy.
On every site but Eschaton and LGF, I use my real name or a regular recognizable alias. I don't mind being called an idiot or an asshole. I DO mind being told that I am going to be killed for what I post. Maybe you think it's irrational to worry about death threats on weblogs, but I think it's worrying enough to merit this minor precaution.
Are you claiming that you've recieved death threats for your posts on Eschaton? The people here don't stike me as that type. You're credibility just took another hit.
Maybe you can explain to me how the use of a single psuedonym for all of your Eschaton posts would place you in danger. I'll even pick one out for you so as to protect you from unconsciously giving clues as to you real identity. How about "stalkerboy?"
Pay no attention to reality while we instead discuss Gary Frazier.
I've had girlfriends with more flair in hijacking a room's attention with their insistent "pay heed to my issue!" shrill-a-thons.
"...it's 'qWagmire'."
You're not getting my nickle!
"They have good arguments, good reasoning and really good senses of just how screwed up things are in the US."
In my case, one out of three ain't bad...
Wasn't Water Closet whining in a similar fashion the other day?
The only "danger" any of us pose is refusing to toe the party line and insisting on booting Bush's sorry behind out of the White House next November. Let's do it!
My guess is that Stalkerboy is Water Closet
any of us poses. Geez.
"Maybe you think it's irrational to worry about death threats on weblogs..."
Finally, something we can agree upon!
"Wasn't Water Closet whining in a similar fashion the other day?"
They all sound the same, because they're all reading from the same script.
"My guess is that Stalkerboy is Water Closet."
I say Col. Mustard with a lead pipe in the conservatory.
dave - I know who his accomplices were, too.
Patriotboy - the only problem with Coulter being Bellatrix is that Coulter bleaches her hair and Bellatrix is dar. We can fix that, though.
Atrios is Dumbledore!
well, Bellatrix is dark, anyway. She may be dar, although I'm more inclined to think Coulter is dar (D.A.R.) or wants to be.
The chair is against the wall
The chair is against the wall
John has a long mustache
John has a long mustache
Harry Potter notwithstanding, Ann Coulter is, and always will be, the Chucacabra.
Strange how Jessica whatsherface is getting huge offers from CBS, while the poeple who didn't make it back are getting little more than their names listed in the national media.
At least the folks at home don't forget.
From the NYTimes today:
Once Hailed, Soldiers in Iraq Now Feel Blame at Each Step
By EDMUND L. ANDREWS
AGHDAD, Iraq, June 28 — After riding into Iraq on a wave of popular euphoria, American and British forces are unexpectedly finding themselves the brunt of criticism for everything that goes wrong these days.
"We are furious about people pointing guns at us," said Hamid Hussein, 33, pushing his broken-down Volkswagen bus to the front door of his house this morning. A United States Army Humvee was parked in the middle of his street, and a soldier in the turret ordered Mr. Hussein in English to stop where he was.
Advertisement
If the complaint is not about security, then it is about the lack of electricity this week in Baghdad.
"Don't talk to me about Saddam Hussein," snapped Ibrahim Aullaiwi, a 46-year-old shop owner in the poor neighborhood of New Baghdad. "The Americans are in charge of everything here. They could have brought generators in here within 24 hours."
Can you say qWagmire?
Shaw Kenawe - that was one of the scariest things I've ever read - this sounds like a situation that could turn into a massacre at any second. The soldiers are hot, tired, scared and a long way from home. The Iraqis have seen their country destroyed, they have no services, they can't move in their own country without some coalition soldier pointing a gun at them.
Oh, God, that is as bad as it gets.
To patriotboy.
"God told me to strike at al Qaida and I struck them, and then he instructed me to strike at Saddam, which I did, and now I am determined to solve the problem in the Middle East. If you help me I will act, and if not, the elections will come and I will have to focus on them."
Mr. Christianity himself did this war thing with Iraq not because his campaign contributors told him too but because God did? IT’S a lie.
It’s like Frank Rich said. Bush thinks we’re stupid and that we will buy into this BS line of reason under act of Christianity. This is just one of my lies and acts of deceit that Bush would like you to believe.
Bush is putting on show. I did it for God. Bush did the war with Iraq because he was told to by those who financed junior's climb into power.
Bush defrauded the nation into war under act of outright lies. Cheney, Perle, Wolfowitz, Rumsfeld stood to make money from the deals with war in Iraq.
Cheney was on TV with Tim Russert a few days before the war started telling Russert over and over again all about Saddam’s nuclear program. Russert sat there and quietly listened to Cheney’s repeated lies (and all this after Mohammed ElBaradei, director-general of the International Atomic Energy Agency had denounced US nuclear evidence against as Iraq as fraudulent).
This administration committed a flonies like John Dean mentioned in his last column and they are getting away with this criminal act even when US Senators (even Republicans Senators) told newspapers that Bush and Cheney had failed to show them adequate proof of Saddam’s WMD but gave Bush a resolutions for war anyway.
This situation is that not only did Bush defraud US citizens, the whole US congress help Bush to defraud US citizens, (except for those few congress members that refused because of lack of evidence--like Sen. Levin).
Iraqis aren’t free when they are only allowed to get help from Bush highest paying campaign contributors and with Bush NO bid process. Bush would like nothing better then for the Iraqis to shut-up while his campaign contributors rape them as well as the US taxpayer, no questions asked.
Bush is NOT a Christian; he is a criminal who conspired to defraud a nation over national secuity issues and international community as well by cherry picking evidence for the exclusive benefit of his campaign contributors.
It does seems however that the Iraqis are at least smart enough to understand that Bush is not thier liberator nor their benefactor, it's just to bad most Americans don’t quite understand Bush yet.
Bush is NOT a Christian. He lying about even that, it's a scam and that all it is.
This administration committed a "Felonies".
Also on another note wasn't it very Christian of Bush not to give Sharon or Arafat the time of day prior to 9/11 and after 9/11 when he was playing golf with Bush Sr. Bush said other nations should help the MidEast. This Christian act is a Karl Rove production and how Bush lies to get out of "understanding" the crime he committed against the nation, the UN and the Iraqis.
"I did it for God", talk about using the name of God in vain. Bush is using the name of God commit sin.
I read a columnist who pointed out that none of the news shows are running a post-war countdown on the days without finding WMD.
However, The News Hour with Jim Lehrer is continuing their silent roll call of the US servicemen and women killed in Iraq.
I've read more than a few articles that pointed to the single biggest problem with stabilizing Iraq:
The perception, in that part of the world, that America can do anything it decides to do. This translates into the notion that electricity and water are still offline because the occupiers don't want these services restored, or they just don't care.
Seraphiel - I'm sure the problems with getting things going again are much bigger than we can imagine - I mean, I am having a water problem that our well manager can't figure out either.
But - some of this should have been talked about and planned for before we ever went in. It was not as though it was an emergency, no matter what they were saying. It's criminal really, how mismanaged all of this has been. They seem never to have planned for any resistance at all. I don't know what they were thinking.
Obviously there are unforeseen problems. I'm talking about the perception of many people in that part of the world, and the conclusions it leads to.
In some sense I can see why they think that. We did a remarkably efficient job blowing their country up, but it looks like there was no plan whatsoever to put it back together.
Speaking absolutely hypothetically, someone could physically humiliate Bush in a way that would not actually hurt him. Throwing blood in his face maybe. I doubt anyone could get close enough, even if they were dressed as a freeper or we turned some Republican fundraiser fatcat, but I would like to see Bush with blood running down his face and on his hands. PETA types do this to poultry industry CEOs (of course they use fake blood so as not to kill any animals).
Seraphiel - I know there have to be monumental problems, and I know you were talking about the perceptions, and I can see clearly why most of the rest of the world would think that we can do anything - we say so often enough. We've spent years selling ourselves all over the world - American products everywhere, and each one promising the American "we can do anything better than anyone" way.
I guess I'm not differing with what you were saying. I just think that we should be at least trying to act like we care and have some clue what we're doing in Iraq.
Seraphiel: I was just thinking it might help to defuse the sitution over there. It just is escalating daily. It is going to really get ugly - I don't think we've seen anything yet.
The blood idea is a good one but could anyone get within a square mile of the bastard?
Atrios says he's getting angry, as are we all, but I saw BBC footage of the crowd that killed the 6 Brits the other day. That is angry.
Our anger has an admixture of shame; their's doesn't. We are sitting on the throne Saddam vacated and they have this unaccountable aversion to doing what we tell them. If we can't stand the heat we should get out of the kitchen.
The only American anger that can match the purity of their resentment might be the collective rage of parents and families of soldiers killed in a shameful cause. The intensity would turn from blue to white hot if it were generally realised how under-represented are the families of those who arranged and led the cheering for this evil enterprise. And how shamefully treated those who make the sacrifice are if they are lucky enough to make it back.
But that would require the services of an independent media. Back to square one.
I think that Cheney would be considered Voldemort. I think that Car; Rove would be considered Malfoy. Bush would be Crab.
The blood idea is stupid. It would backfire and the punditocracy would chew up the guilty party - unless the guilty party claimed to be a Republican. They would make the individual reflect on luberals in general - and it would make us all look like assholes.
What we need is a liberal network that really is liberal. We need a network that will ask real questions - not ignore the important things in thus world for trivial nonsense.
I mean how trivial is the Lottery or Lacy Peterson, or that chick that hit a guy and left hi for dead. That shit has no impact on anyone. We should be learning about Bush's moves to elimunate overtime.
SCLM my ass.
Speaking absolutely hypothetically, someone could physically humiliate Bush in a way that would not actually hurt him. Throwing blood in his face maybe.
Blood? There's a reason God put cream pies on the Earth....
There's a reason God put cream pies on the Earth....
Ooh, let's get Noel Godin to throw a pie at Bush!
Well...I go to Seattle for the day to watch the Mariners get shutout by the Padres (how humiliating!) and I see that everyone is talking about the person who is fed up with violence and me.
Person fed up with violence: you haven't seen anything yet, because the fratboy coward and his unholy masters are steering this nation to revolution. It will not be pretty.
Threating the pretender is the last of our worries. The country is careening toward civil war, and it won't be a nice geographically defined one this time.
The only threat we need to take care of Bush is the threat of real Democratic leadership calling him to task re:
- WMDs
- The REAL Reasons for the War
- Environmental Issues
- Attempted Stacking of the Courts
- Cutting Veteran's Benefits
- Alienating the U.S. from the rest of the world
- Diluting our civil liberties and keeping previously FOI-available information locked up away from public view.
...and the threat of strong Dem leadership in November of 04.
I apologize about the blood idea; on second thought it was stupid. He already has blood on his hands, and we are the people who can see it (or admit we can see it), and we must bring the public around to seeing it (like Fudge's admitting that Lord Voldemort has returned).
Oh, God, that is as bad as it gets.
Tena,
Unfortunately, it's not. It's "just before it gets as bad as it gets". The pressure cooker's heating up, but it hasn't exploded yet.
How can you criticize the brilliance of the adminstration, when they managed to defeat the Iraqi armed forces with nothing but the combined might of the US Army, US Navy, US Marine Corps, US Air Force, British Royal Navy, and British Royal Marines? Doesn't that Herculanean task prove they Rumsfeld knows what he's doing?
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