I'MMA LET YOU FINISH
You kind of have to feel sorry for the poor bastard. He's like the geeky kid with rich parents who buys the cool kids a bunch of stuff only to find that they still won't play with him.
"When Jose Cuervo began polling higher than him, Issa realized it was finally time to go...."
of course he's out...He bankrolled this bullshit and I'd bring that up, wouldn't you? This whole recall thing is about 2004 and Issa was the point man.
No, no, no! Issa has potentially brought down a Democratic governor. That was just what was intended. California could wind up with a Jeb Bush sort of governor.
Do you think Arnold gives a damn about ordinary Californians? Think this guy will help our public schools? Issa has done us a grave worng, and we must not allow it to stand.
Yeah ok the guy that opened Pandora's Box does'nt even have the balls to try to follow through with his run.
He just turns and flees, having reduced California's electoral democracy to a sad farce.
Thanks for nothing, Issa. That's right! Turn tail and run, leaving the mess for everyone else to clean up.
Do you want a Republican administration in California? Good grief.
Hey, I know he's an ass, but he's such a pitiful little goob whose money was used by Republicans who had no intention of letting him play with the big boys. It's enough to make a guy want to steal a car and just keep driving...
Issa wins, if a Republican becomes governor. That was the whole idea, a sort of coup.
(language disclaimer)
What kind of pussy is it that makes a mess like this and then just runs? Are all politicians craven cowards like this? Davis may be about to lose, but at least he did'nt quit and leave a mess for everyone else. Issa can kiss my ass for what he has done.
Look, the bum will be even more influential from here on. I agree, being governor was the the issue, getting a Republican governor was the issue. Issa is winning!
Yeah I don't think Issa had any intention of running. He was just the purse. The Repubs couldn't do it directly because that would be too obvious. Do you think Issa really believed the state would vote for an ignoramous car thief? C'mon ...
I think that everyone was probably gladhanding him behind the scenes, making him think they'd back him. If you've read the guy's interviews, you know he planned on running. Hell, if he can get elected to the House, he probably thought he could get elected to the Governor's mansion.
If this is what it takes to wake CA up to the fact that politics matter, then I would say, yes, I do want a Republican governer. In fact, I want the worst one possible, to make it really bad and snap people out of their apathy.
Oh, he wanted to run, but no one was going to vote for him.
Karl Rove's handywork is all over this. First Issa is out (and he will get rewarded somewhere down the line), then Simon won't get in, and neither will Riordan. He's trying to clear the field for Arnold, and if the both Bustamante and Garemendi are in, together with Huffington, Arnold will win.
Issa wanted to run. He was crying at his news conference. He got duped out of $2M.
The millionaire congressman who largely funded the effort to recall Gov. Gray Davis abruptly pulled out of the race to replace him Thursday, a day after actor Arnold Schwarzenegger jumped in. - AP
The idea really was to have a Republican governor. Schwarzenegger was always slated to run in time. The recall success made the time earlier, and the way easier.
I don't know. I think that some Republicans would have voted for him if he ran on conservative social values. I think once right wingers got a look at Arnold's stance on social issues, they would have split that ticket right down the middle. That's why Issa left. Someone probably took him aside and said "You're out."
i just love it when republicans cry.
Hmm, ok, you've persuaded me that Issa had dreams of grandeur. But he sure did slip out of the race right quick, didn't he?
Another question: the Repubs seem to be able to figure out who to focus on (Arnold). Why are the Dems so damn disjointed?
The Republicans are pulling off a stunning stunning political victory. Imagine how much Arnold, as Governor, would help Republicans in the coming election.
This will be a major major major Republican victory if Arnold is elected.
A major Republican victory is in the offing!!!!!
On both Issa getting stabbed in the back by the GOP and Riordan getting stabbed in the back by Ahnold, only one thing springs to mind: The line from Animal House where Otter says to Flounder, who is blubbering over the ruin of his brother's Lincoln: "Face it - you fucked up. You trusted us."
You'd think these GOP morons would have learned by now not to trust their own party or the others in it.
Davis will be recalled by 50.0002 percent. The winning candidate will come away from the free-for-all with 21 percent. It's called direct democracy.
I don't think it's disjointed at all. If the recall goes forward (people vote for recall) then there has to be someone on the replacement list to vote for, hence the jump of Bustamante. It's a good idea.
As with Sutter, others will gain from his dubious accomplishment.
This fiasco has one primary purpose. Bush gets CA's electoral votes, rendering any and all Democratic presidential strategies pointless. Rove gets the keys to the CA electoral machinery, and it's all over. CA registered Dems, call your elections office before Oct 7 to make sure you're still on the rolls.
Of course he's out. He just took the state for a joy ride, being the juvinile car theif he is. It is now in Rove's chop shop, being remade into a Bush 04 model. AS gets to be the hood ornament.
Political Wire reports the big baby cried!!!
Look guys. We had better understand just how well the Republicans have played this game. Arnold can easily win, Issa could not have won. Issa simply paved the way for the strongest possible Republican. The name recognition and publicity will give Arnold a major edge.
The guys who gave us power deregulation and Enron have won a major tactical victory.
I am very worried.
If this is what it takes to wake CA up to the fact that politics matter, then I would say, yes, I do want a Republican governer. In fact, I want the worst one possible, to make it really bad and snap people out of their apathy.
Oddly familiar strategy to... ah, yes: the whole Nader justification/ raison d'etre. Make things really bad so people will stand up and notice and get involved and vote liberal again. Worked great last time, let's try it again.
I know it's OT, but I just wanted to say that Rall's new column is seriously awesome.
...Issa fought back tears as he explained his decision to pull out of the campaign.
Typical little sissy boy thug prick.
You know, I'm kind of glad that this happened. Even if Davis keeps his place, we can point to this historic incident and say that California holds its chief executive accountable when he turns a surplus into a deficit. Shouldn't the country do the same?
(Don't e-mail me how it's not Davis' fault. I know that. Not the point.)
Torture Wolf.
Unfortunately, muscle head will probably only need that percentage to win.
Just what Califoria needs: another asshole Grade-B movie actor as governor. If Flynt is willing to foot the bill, he could puncture Arnold's publicity powered Zeppelin with a few well-placed smut grenades.
The Republicans are very very very smart right now. This was a stunningly smart set of moves, even though part by part it took shape rather than by design.
Arnold as Governor gives California and national Republicans a huge benefit.
It doesn't matter who the governor is, Bush will not have a prayer of winning California unless he is so strong nationally that he could win the election without it. California is one of his very worst states.
Pete Wilson killed Republican chances in CA for at least a generation with Prop 187.
Great. An Austrian movie actor, noted for his violent films, with no experience WHATSOEVER in even local politics, will run for governor of a state with the 5th largest economy in the world, and a $39 billion dollar deficit.
And he stated in his announcement that he's running because (approx. quote) California has big problems.
Wow! Thanks AAAhnuld for telling me this. That was profound and deeply stirring. Also what a visinary you are.
Jeebus goddamn christ on a popsicle stick! Is there anyone out there who can prove to me that I'm not living my nightmare? This IS a joke, isn't it? Tell me.
Shaw Kenawe, living in SoCal, and hiding under my desk.
Emma
I am also worried. Democrats just still can not get united and focused enough. This is a Republican coup.
The sad truth *is* that it is very possible that the next governor of California might "win" the "election" with a lower percentage of the vote than is indicated by Davis' current popular approval rating. In other words, Davis might get 15% of the vote, and The Terminator might get 17%. With the various liberal ticket-splitters on the multi-page ballot, and only 1 known republican, the election is a clear republican win.
What do you think - ~80% of the popular vote goes to liberal candidates? And a farce of a republican actor with a history of mysogyny and low-grade sexual assaults becomes governor with ~15% of the vote?
It is an election that only republicans could feel proud of.
Congratulations, GOP. For 2 million dollars of private cash, you've purchased the governor's mansion in California, through your new imprimatur, electoral gamesmanship and subversion of electoral democracy. Even the Bloomberg campaign for mayor of NYC cost more.
And for those not paying attention, please note the comparison between the GOP gamesmanship and exploitation of Wellstone's wake in Minnesota to create a temporary blip in approval ratings sufficient to put a GOP creep in charge of Wellstone's electorate and what is currently transpiring in the Golden State.
(And if you think, California, that BBB credit rating for your state is a bad situation, just wait until the creditors get through downgrading you to junk status over your banana republic style of government. I was born in San Francisco general hospital, California, and raised in the Bay Area. And you f---ers just f---ed it all up. F--- you, California. You are a bunch of idiots.)
Emma,
"The Republicans are pulling off a stunning stunning political victory. Imagine how much Arnold, as Governor, would help Republicans in the coming election."
Good point. I have said repeatedly that Issa running taints the recall itself and makes for an easy Davis target. By removing himself and clearing the way for Arnold, the game has been changed.
I would expect Simon not to run though McClintock could be a wild card(he got more voters statewide than Simon though he lost).
Damn it. Quit saying Republicans are so smart. It's not true. It's just that California's rules for recall are so damn lax that you can get one with a relatively few number of signatures. Arnold looks good now, but he's going to piss off conservatives because he's pro-choice, pro-gay, etc., and he's going to piss off women because he's a misogynist. Odds are that California could just as likely end up in the hands of a real liberal.
Issa wants to spend time on peace in the middle east.
Is it just me or does anyone else think "Emma" and "Rhonda" might be related to Mary Rosh?
Emma, you keep saying this, but you're saying it again and again as if by sheer matter of repeating it, it's true. I disagree with you. Can you please give some good reasons why this is a brilliant move on the part of Republicans?
Well, plus the fact that Arnold will be recalled about six weeks later.
Yes, I would recommend that anyone who lives in California should start circulating "Recall Governor Schwarzenegger" petitions right now. Is there anything on the books that says you can't start a recall before someone is officially elected?
Make things really bad so people will stand up and notice and get involved and vote liberal again. Worked great last time, let's try it again.
Did it work? I think Nader wanted Bush in. He seems to have gotten what he wanted. People *have* noticed how fucked up and ugly the regressives are. Would they have under Gore? Maybe, maybe not. Who knows? It's unknowable.
So...maybe it's time CA got a dose.
People get the government they deserve. Don't want Arnold? Get off your ass and work against him. Don't like the stupid recall election law? Work for change.
Otherwise, enjoy the ride!
Oh, and you can bitch all you want, even if you don't vote. I don't care. : )
Most people don't take action unless they are motivated. They're simply not going to get worked up about something until if affects them personally. Look at the recall itself. Would so many people have signed if there wasn't demonstrable proof (fee hikes, taxes, etc.) that the government was hurting them? Probably not.
So yeah. Arnold might not be so bad, in the long run. CA survived Wilson and Reagan. It can survive the Governator.
Could we get the Texas Killer D's to visit CA and help find a dem to win. They are the only ones in this whole country who has my vote at this point. I see this conversation:
Bush: Arnold, change your mind and run. Oh don't worry about promises to Riodon, doesn't matter. no one remembers promises. And by the way, Rove will send some minders over for you, won't have to do a thing. Worked for me didn't it.
I only hope CA wakes up and they smear Arnold with every thing they got. Larry Flynt's in the race, could he smear Arnold?
first time here, nice company.
Ahnuld will be such a major boost for Repubs. Just like how Jesse Ventura helped the Reform Party become a major national force...
If you live in California, plan to relocate somewhere else. Now.
Someone get Linda Hamilton on the ballot, quick! "No fate but what we make" could be her campaign slogan.
Riordan is out, Issa is out - where is Bill Simon?
Surely his blue balls for the governorship are still there.....someone should start a trojan-horse email campaign to convince Simon to join the race and split the GOP vote...he's stupid enough to fall for it.
Wilson may have killed the Rs chances in Calif. for a generation. But leave it to the Ds to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory.
Simon is in.
If Ahrnuld has such a dubious private life, could taking him down reflect on the Republicans as a whole?
I seem to remember stories about a certain pregnant fifteen year-old, a abortion paid for NOT by her, and someone we all know and love. Let the sh*tstorm commence.
I don't think sion is 'officially' in....the most recent thing i could find was that on 7/29 he said he'd have an announcement shortly.....anything from him since then?
and by 'sion' i mean 'simon'
mi kno spel gud.
" Can you please give some good reasons why this is a brilliant move on the part of Republicans"
Well, its pretty much assured that Arnold will win. There are no longer any name Repubs, and three or four name Dems on the replacement ballot, along with Flint. Now, in 2004, Bush has Arnold, who is immensly popular, to campaign with him and make commericals with him. Arnold will try to govern to his instincts, whihc seem relatively moderate, so Bush will get a two-fer: a moderate politician who is also a popular movie start telling California that Bush is a great guy. By himeslf, Arnold will bring in people who not otherwise have voted. I think California is in play, and that pretty much kills the Dems electoral strategy, based on the amount of money they are going to have to spend .
Let Issa know what you think!
DC Office: 202.225.3906
San Diego Office: 760.599.5000
Does the Democratic party have any leadership? Who decides the strategy for winning elections. where were they on this issue. It seems like the Dems have no direction, we really are a passive party.
The only good thing is that it can't be a stepping stone to the White House, since he's foreign born. And I mean it's the only good thing. But it's just another acting role to Arnold, with Rove writing the screenplay.
It seems to me it should take *more* votes to recall someone (like a 2/3 majority or something) than *fewer*. What a loony state!
My dead grandma could run this country better than what's happening now.
Davis should just resign so as to end this farce and allow Bustamante to take over.
Why not nip this in the bud now, and allow Bustamante the chance to shine and make him more formidable for the next election?
MYOB'
First off, Issa didn't do this for the party. He's waaaaaay to self centered for that. Trust me on that.
If Arnold wins, will it help the Republican Party in Calif? No chance. The state party is run by California's version of the DeLay wing. These guys couldn't eat an apple without setting the house on fire. They are that screwed up.
Can Bush win Ca. in 2004? Only if the Democrats screw up and nominate the wrong guy. California is theirs to lose, which doesn't mean they won't try...
Let Issa know what you think!
DC Office: 202.225.3906
San Diego Office: 760.599.5000
Too much assumption here that Arnold is a strong candidate. The tabloids have been holding back waiting for this moment. Just wait until you see what Arnie's been up to while Maria's been having babies and cashing NBC paychecks.
Sexual harassment like it's the 1950's.
I don't understand why the Terminator wants to be governor. I'm not aware that he has any political experience. Why would you want to start near the top of a career in which you've never worked?
And why would voters ever elect someone on an absolute lack of merits? I mean, what reason would they have? "I really liked him in 'Kindergarten Cop'"?
What a joke.
(Of course, if I'm wrong and he has tons of experience and has spoken extensively about his position on the issues--other than "I'm a Republican"--I hope someone lets me know.)
Hestia: What's to understand? Ahnuld's Hollywood career has been going downhill for quite some time now (the latest Terminator sequel notwithstanding), and this is one way to keep himself & his overinflated ego in the public eye.
http://www.stopschwarzenegger.com/
Stop him!
Wouldn't it be fitting if Flynt wins.
There is so much f**king going on in this whole process that he somehow seems the most qualified.
BUSH HAS A 36% RELECT NUMBER IN A FOX POLL!
http://www.pollingreport.com/wh04gen.htm
FOX News/Opinion Dynamics Poll. July 29-30, 2003. N=900 registered voters nationwide. MoE ± 3.
"Considering how President Bush has performed so far, do you think he deserves to be reelected or would the country probably be better off with someone else as president?"
Deserves
Reelection Someone
Else Depends
(vol.) Not
Sure
% % %
%
7/03 47 40 8 5
8/01 36 42 13 9
Two points:
1) Could be a backlash against Arnold.
2) Davis still has a couple of days to step aside for Cruz. Could happen!
If I were a gambling man, I'd wager that the California Supreme Court will use the "if appropriate" clause (see http://www.dailykos.com/
archives...705.html#003705 ) in the constitution to cancel this whole successor-ballot circus and reduce the recall to a pure yes-or-no choice.
In such a case, Davis will be recalled and the Lt. Gov. will take over. However, I still think the recall is illegitimate and should be rejected.
Sure am glad I live in Illinois. The worst we have to deal with here is massive corruption. 
"I really liked him in 'Kindergarten Cop'"?
I can understand why you might form that opinion, but if you look at both on their merits, I think you'll find that 'Jingle All The Way' is really the superior film.
I am absolutely disgusted and ashamed to be a Californian. This is, pure and simple, a coup in progress and we are watching it unfold as high comedy.
Shame on anyone who thinks that a burly weight lifter who has never served in public office ought to waltz into the top job of the sixth largest economy in the world.
To speak about it as a serious possibility is to grant it a legitimacy that is undeserved. We need to heap ridicule on Schwarzenegger and on anyone who is participating in the destruction of the democratic process.
I am not a Davis fan, but I have never felt more energized than I am today and will do whatever I can to halt this insane recall.
Well, its pretty much assured that Arnold will win.
Actually, his negative polling numbers are reported to be pretty high. Was listening to TOTN on NPR today, his numbers didn't sound too good. And he has so many skeletons in is closet -- many of them unnaturally burly, and smoking pot -- that I think his candidacy may degenerate into farce in short order.
Glad to hear that Issa is out, though. That guy is a serious toad.
>I am absolutely disgusted and ashamed to be a Californian. This is, pure and simple, a coup in progress and we are watching it unfold as high comedy.
Look, Americans are too stupid and lazy to have a representative democracy. It's easier and more fun to have entertaining despots like Duhbya who provide flags and photo ops and cool wars and stuff.
Nice country we used to have.
I just heard the NPR story about Ahnold running, and it was all jokes and movie clips. Does no one want to talk about how this guy is a political puppet for the hard right wing (hidden by moderate lip service)? Or discuss his steriod abuse, or his slightly insane (and hypocritical) personal life? Or his connections to the right in Germany? Just like Bush, Ahnold will get away with cynical manipulative politics because everyone would rather make jokes. When are folks going to understand they are only clowns on the surface?
Sadly, grytpype, the poll number you cite is from August 2001, when the World Trade Center still stood.
Ahnold is sure to increase turnout.
What that will mean for the result is anyone's guess.
No, anon, that poll, as explicitly noted above, is from July 29-30, 2003. See http://www.pollingreport.com/wh04gen.htm if you don't believe me.
And while we're OT, did anyone catch Gore's speech to MoveOn today? An absolute knockout! Text is at http://www.moveon.org/gore-speech.html
Pretty please, can we draft this guy back?
This whole situation is really shaping up to be quite the idiotic clusterfuck, but the question I'm interested in at the moment is this: If Issa is the one who got this ball rolling, can he really just squirm out of it, free of any reprecussions? I mean, he's basically responsible for this farce, but now that it's turning out to be rougher than he expected, he doesn't want to play? Shouldn't he suffer some consequences for this? It seems to me an understatement to say he's behaved with almost breath-taking irresponsibility. The man can't just trash the democratic process (or what passes for it these days) and serenely toddle on his merry way. Isn't there some legal action that can be brought against him?
As for Arnold, it would be delightful to see him get the nomination and lose by a humiliatingly large margin, and not just because he's a Republican. His entire involvement here is nothing but an ego trip, pure and simple. It's bullshit.
Trickster, or grytpype, or whoever you are, I did go to that URL. That's how I noticed it was from August 2001.
Do you see the "7/03" and the "8/01" in the text you cut and pasted? The "7/03" poll (47%) is the current one from last month, and the "8/01" is an old poll provided for comparison purposes. Take a look at the Gallup section of that page if you don't believe me. You don't think they did 14 different polls this week, with names like "3/14-15/03" and "6/12-18/03", do you?
I don't think Arnold is the favorite at all....while his name recognition and celebrity give him an early bounce, there is plenty of time for the real weaknesses to be revealed. All of you GOP's are in for a rude awakening.
Trickster, I have a serious case of unrequited Al Gore love. He was wonderful today and I would love to have him back in the game. However, I think he will stay out and the only hope is getting him through a draft movement in a deadlocked convention.
Anon,
It is unclear how a poll taken between july29 and 30 could be published on july 3.
Anonymous, you are right, darn it all to heck. I took 8/01 as meaning August 1st, but no, it's August '01. The good part, though, is that the current number, with 47 re-elect, isn't all that great, especially when you consider that Fox polls tend to come in a couple of points to the right of the pack (go figure).
Radiowallah, I think you are right, too, darn it all to heck twice. (But what a killer speech--everybody should read it and quote from it.)
Why do you all have to be so right??? 
Atrios, you got caught the same way I did. 7/03 means July '03, not July 3rd.
ah, gotcha. anon is correct.
The good part, though, is that the current number, with 47 re-elect, isn't all that great
Indeed.
Which Schwartzenegger film was it where he played the world's first pregnant man? Will footage from this movie be used to cast him as a pro-life candidate?
John D - WRT Issa, can't he be recalled as well? That would be the ultimate in poetic justice.
I was inspired:
http://www.wage-slave.org/archiv...s/
00000222.html
Pissed about Issa? Then pass laws making his car alarms and boomcars illegal. Looks like Hawaii and NYC may do just that. They are only a pain in the ear anyway.
Chuck remarked "Do you really think Californians would stand for an ignoramus car thief?"
Car thief and gunman. Let's not forget his weapons violation.
"Total Recall: 2004"
I'd really like an explanation of why people think Arnold is such a sure winner. He's got name recognition, sure, and that counts for a lot in a wacky ballot like this, but he's not a particularly likable guy when he isn't acting, he's got a major ossuary in the closet, and it seems likely that the right wing of the repubs is going to look at the relatively moderate stances and go running.
I'm a broken record on this today, but what the hell.
Instant Runoff Voting would solve the problem of vote-splitting. Issa in, Issa out... it wouldn't matter. Folks can still vote for their 1st choice first, and their 2nd choice second, etc., and not worry about accidentally helping the candidate they hate.
Go learn more about IRV at:
WWW.FAIRVOTE.ORG
wow, we made TWO repugnicans cry.
and it would be REAL funny if he spent ALL that money to be Guv and then his SHIT alarms got banned. that would be AWSOME!
I'm a little bit puzzled why some people think that if Ahnuld is elected (something which I do not favor, let me hasten to add) that means Bush carries California in 2004, or at least makes it close. There is no evidence governors can help presidents or presidential candidates of their party carry California. Remember Pete Wilson? He was governor during both the 1992 and 1996 presidential elections--which GHW Bush and Bob Dole respectively lost overwhelmingly in California.
With or without AS winning, California *may* be a close state in 2004--but *only* if Bush is running so far ahead nationally, he doesn't *need* California.
Let the Repugs elect Ahnold. Many many Americans will roll on the floor and laugh. Ahnold is not that popular, except in his own mind and will just give the Democrats a huge target.
I've seen a few posts asking how the Publican right will react to Ahnold's moderate stances. One of the benefits of a two-month campaign - not a lot of time to delve into actual issues. I forsee lots of grand general bumper-sticker pronouncements, lots of movie references, and very little substance.
To those calling on Davis to resign, that wouldn't stop the replacement election. It might put Bustamante in a stronger position in the election, but unless he can get Garamendi out, it's going to be hard for him to win.
Wish I had thought of this Godfather ref. Josh Marshall at talkingpointsmemo.com:
snip
According to press reports, Issa had to fight back tears when making his announcement today. Now at first I figured Issa was tearing up because he'd spent such a big chunk of change on what's turning out to be someone else's party. But then I realized that wasn't it at all. He was just thinking how much more money he's going to have to spend to replace that sheet set and mattress and that fancy duvet because of the mess from that decapitated horse head he found in his bed this morning.
I mean, where do you think the call that got Issa outta this race came from? Yeah, me too ...
snip
Ahnold will of course win a sweeping victory. The man himself is not the problem--his politics are actually pretty liberal as far as I can tell. The problem is that he is only the figurehead and that his administration will be controlled by the Rove gang. Any similarities to the federal executive are not coincidental: insert a brainless guy with name-recognition, control and manipulate the media and have your way with the public till. Oh, and make sure the electoral machinery works exactly the way you want it to cement your control forever. Why do I feel like I've moved to Mordor???
too much vicodin too much vicodin too much vicodin // unemployment insurance costs unemployment insurance costs unemployment insurance costs
how do companies make money how do companies make money how do companies make money // irs student loan irs student loan irs student loan
Characters Remaining:
Commenting by HaloScan
