I'MMA LET YOU FINISH
are they going to shut down the blogs next?
I wonder how they define "inessential" anyway? Anything that is critical of the Armed forces or the Bush administration?
Anyone who saw Rumsfeld fuming about how those pictures got out "illegally" knows where this comes from.
Unessential drinking of water is next.
Pax Americana.
Well, you know, it's easy to follow the logic on this. It wasn't the abuse that was a problem; it was people seeing evidence of the abuse that caused the problem. So... let's just be sure that no one on the ground in Iraq has a chance to let anyone outside know what's going on... just in case. Damn. I wonder if our troops realize that THEY are in a prison!
Couldn't Rummy have prevented further embarrassment by limiting the size of emails so that pictures couldn't be sent?
I heard about a week ago that KBR (or some Halliburton sub, can't recall the name) is in charge of processing absentee ballots for troops voting overseas. Apparently the company is so disorganized/corrupt that there are allegations it won't be able to deliver ballots to the troops on time for them to vote in the presidential election.
I've also heard that the snail-mail system to Iraq is unreliable and mail is constantly lost.
This administration claims to support the troops, but cuts them off at the knees at every juncture, from body armor and crappy Humvees, to medical care and pay.
Now no email. That will make these kids feel even more isolated--but at least no more "hazing" photos from Iraq!
Hey, hey, hey, what ARE we fighting for?
Okay, it's time to outlaw the Information Age.
Put that genie back in the bottle, fast!
That would require technical abilities that are beyond the resources currently available, patriotboy. Which is why they are going to be doing selective draft of people with computer skills.
No, they probably won't shut down the blogs per se, they'll just use them to track us down one by one.
That's supposed to be a joke.
This is an outrag aaargg ga ga ga
Are family messages considered essential? Several of the photos and accounts of "bad" things were originally sent to family members.
Bush must not be counting on the overseas military vote to win Florida this year.
are they going to shut down the blogs next?
alex, you better bet your ass on that. can't remeber where i read it, so much closing down of dissenting voices, it's horrible, we really don't need to be worrying about democracy in iraq, we have our own problems.
Cofer Black, the head of the CIA's Counterterrorism Center, told Congress in September 2002: "There was a before 9/11, and there was an after 9/11 .... After 9/11 the gloves come off" OK, I pulled that out of context, it was about interogating prisoners. But I did not take lightly Ari Flieshers remarks about "you better watch what you say, and where you say it." these bastards are playing for keeps.
If e-mail to family members is considered inessential, that'll cause some concern among military families.
so does that mean, they're going to be able to prevent the release of the other photos and videos rumsfeld alluded to?
I had just heard on NBC that the Pentagon has know about such abuses for almost a year now, had basicly done nothing so far. Guess this shoots a hole in Rummy's claim that if the media would have kept its nose out of things, everything would have been taken care of.
MiniTrue: suppress, repress, censor. Big Brother is happy. All is well.
AKA Donna
They'll simply shut off any e-mail being sent to anything/anybody that doesn't end in either .gov or .mil. That's it.
Curiously, US Navy ships are now completely networked and set up to transmit any kind of electronic communications. But the Army? The Marines? It reminds me of the oral history accounts of Canadian forces in Kosovo running back channel methods to provide e-mail and all kinds of commo - including illicit acquisition of HP cartridges from Vienna. Baghdad et al. are too far out of the way tho - if the electronic lines are cut, that's it. For now.
Ah, as we all remember the Finland Station.....
let them go to the sook and by a satellite phone with email capability.
GIs' hate America.
Are they going to cut email access for the Iraqis, too?
If there's a will, there's a way.
Duh.
surely the GIs are not so helpless that they would abide by Uncle Sam's rules as they are not in high school and have no need of a hall monitor. will the mp's beat them if they buy a satellite phone?
Well, of course. Listening to the testimony and reading the various opinions all week, no one really cares that the torture went on or that it was American kids who did it...or the fact it was American soliders acting on orders from independent contractors (probably). They're upset about getting caught. The Trent Lott Defense writ large. This is a way of preventing that. It's like supporting the troops. No real aide like flak jackets or decent equipment; all that matters is you saying "I support the troops".
Someone said in a previous thread that the noonerific Kathleen Parker was blaming immoral Hollywood movies for the torture charges. I have to ask a couple things when I hear this. One, don't wingnuts watch Hollywood movies and television, too? I can't see them being fans of Felini. Second...now, I'm just a youngster, just turned 29, and I haven't been on the planet long, relatively speaking. But weren't people extremely cruel and nasty to each other way, WAY before Hollywood was little more than an idea in expatriate New York playwrights' minds?
I mean, come on...Andersonville, wiping out Vietnamese villages to save them, the treatment of American Indians, lynching of certain people because they were the wrong color to be "lookin' at our wimmin'". Am I reading the wrong history books, or didn't this shit happen way before Howard Stern, Anna Nicole Smith and The Clenis? Oh, yeah...there was a letter in the local rag yesterday that blamed this whole affair on Clinton, cause he got a hummer in the Oval Office. For cryin' out loud, haven't these people ever heard of Warren Harding?
The were was no Golden Age when people were more moral than they are now. People still had sex out of wedlock, had abortions, killed each other, and treated each other like shit. The only difference between now and that mythical, perfect Then is that we know about it quicker now.
Sheesh...
And totally OT, but I saw the tackiest vehicle in the world today: a white Ford Excursion with a 12-inch lift kit on a set of the Bigfoot tires. I'm serious. Saw that thing and thought, "Now, there goes a guy who's never even come close to causing a female orgasm." And, yes, it was a guy.
Here is a brief clip of what Rumsfield sees as the real problem. The press.
http://s88172659.onlinehome.us/
R...use05072004.mp3
Clip time 1 minute 50 seconds.
This is in response to Congressman Cole from OK.
COLE: When were you planning to let us know and how were you planning to let us know.? And there is clearly a process here. But what were you thinking about in terms of timeline?
RUMSFIELD: Well, eh. Let me walk back over it. Eh it was announced to the public in January that there were charges of abuse. In March he announced it again. And he listed specific indecent acts. And sexual acts and other aspects of the abuse. And that was announced to the world. It was briefed to the press. In Bagdad.
CROSS TALK
RUMSFIELD: It was questions on CNN, here
COLE: I understand that Mr. Secretary and I’m not trying to be contrary or adversarial, but there is a big difference, I mean you know when you really want us to know something it’s amazing we usually have a classified hearing I’m not saying it would need to be.
RUMSFIELD: I’ll answer you. You knew exactly what we knew, I knew. [One Minute]The people in command, who were running who were running the investigation, the criminal investigation who had access to that disk know more. I didn’t know it the president didn’t know it, you didn’t know it. The real issue is is that a secret report is given to the press. And the disk. Out of order. And you say, “When did you plan to do this?” We didn’t plan it because we didn’t know about it. We hadn’t seen that report. We hadn’t seen the disk.
COLE: That’s precisely perhaps the problem Mr. Secretary. .
RUMSFIELD: Exactly
COLE: Not just that it was let out, because honestly something like this was going to get out, but why did this not get to you, I mean with extraordinary speed? And why did not. Because I think, as you say the minute you see it the implications are breathtakingly obvious.
Are they afraid of the outgoing or the incoming photos and stories?
So much for supporting our troops, I guess...
support the troops! And since what happens in Iraq stays in Iraq, keep the prison porn in the sandy recesses of our new protectorate.
Interesting. This may not be specifically about shutting off the interrogation scandal, though. Something tells me we may be headed for a pull-out, or at least for a withdrawal from offices in Baghdad. A major move like would need the cover of an information black-out.
All I have wanted, from the beginning of these horrors, was for our government to react in ways calculated to get the smallest possible number of people killed. If the policy is propelled by political expediency, so much the better -- for once, presentation and policy for the BC Regime (Bush/Cheney, Better than Christ, take your pick) are pointing in the same direction.
Someone said in a previous thread that the noonerific Kathleen Parker was blaming immoral Hollywood movies for the torture charges.
Some folk tried to tell Ms. Parker that Schwarzenegger is no good ...
Typical Republican support of our troops. You can die for your country ; you just can't email to it.
As for banning blogs, even though total blog-blocking is really tough and unlikely, it's unfortunately not necessary. A huge chunk of the blogosphere is hosted by Blogger (at blogspot.com). Filter-out Blogger and most (?) blogs go bye-bye. Or just filter Haloscan to kill the Blogger comments. MovableType blogs represent probably the second largest chunk, but are fortunately distributed across many hosts, and use their own commenting system. Amusingly, the next big thing from the MovableType folks is the "portalization" of MT in their TypePad portal. Another big fat censorship target.
Sad to say, this tin-hat speculation has already been implemented a few months ago...by China. They blocked both TypePad and blogspot blogs. Good company...
"As for banning blogs, even though total blog-blocking is really tough and unlikely, it's unfortunately not necessary. A huge chunk of the blogosphere is hosted by Blogger (at blogspot.com)."
There's already legislation pending in congress to outlaw p2p, which can and would be extended to blogs.
And totally OT, but I saw the tackiest vehicle in the world today: a white Ford Excursion with a 12-inch lift kit on a set of the Bigfoot tires. I'm serious. Saw that thing and thought, "Now, there goes a guy who's never even come close to causing a female orgasm." And, yes, it was a guy.
Backslider, i see that down here in cent. fla. a good bit, and very often it's a 20 sumth'n hottie. always makes me think, (and i know you don't like this) "a girl in a flatbed ford slowing down to take a look at me" sadly i am way beyond 29, they don't look, and if they did, they would be looking way down.
ps. good post as usual, there is nothing constant but change, and the more things change, the more they stay the same.
When a reactionary sloth like Cole has negative vibes at the sight of Bush puppitry (as reviewed here at 9:45 pm), the implications for Republicans in November are not good.
He's a great plains plowboy who got sophistication in the wheatfields but very little sangfroid, and thus is not a threat to the high sweet notes of reason.
Still, when he frowns at Rumsfeld, it's a harbinger of right wing turmoil and probable late summer collapse.
Those damned anti-american soldiers!! They're only over there in Iraq to undermine the war on terror. Why are the soldiers slitting their own throats? Don't they realize that if they keep sending bad news via email they could end up forcing Bush and Haliburton to leave iraq and then what are they going to do? Surive the war perhaps?
And when they get back stateside who are they gonna have to kill? Those fucking ACLU people keep us from liberating the 5th column sand niggers holding out here in our country because they wanted freedom. But we know the truth.
I'll bet at least half the soldiers in Iraq have converted to islam. That's why they're sending dangerous emails holding information vital to the U.S effort to liberate iraqis using 'Operation Torture to Freedom'.
Who are they going to rape once they get back to the U.S? Whose testicals are they going to attach to electrodes? It is their sworn duty as white christians to ensure that every american has the right to torture people! Besides, Condi gets turned on when she sees pictures of naked iraqis with hoods on! And George likes it when his hot chocolate gets turned on!
MYOB' (Mr. Extreme Sarcasm)
.
Maybe I'm ignorant, but couldn't someone simply use Kazaa or any other P2P to get photos or videos out?
No, they probably won't shut down the blogs per se, they'll just use them to track us down one by one.
That's supposed to be a joke. gonzo
Not to me.
Gee, next thing you know digital cameras will be banned in Abu Ghraib.
Talk about locking the back door after the horse has withdrawn...
...that didn't come out right, did it?
Soldiers and their families back home, rely on email access to keep in touch with loved ones and let them know they are still alive. It's a great moral boost for soldiers as well.
If they follow through with this, it will be an incredible kick in the gut to morale, which is probably not all that high to begin with.
Why does DoD and Halliburton hate our soldiers?
re kazaa: no unauthorized applets or programs (or files for that matter) on government property. Even as in many cases where they brought their own, they need a link out, which would almost certainly have a government firewall.
mark my words, those videos will get out. somehow, if not already. this is the fucking internet we're talking out...
charley,
Thanks for the kind words. And, no worries, I begrudge no one some Eagles lovin'...as long as I don't have to listen to it.
And for the record, I used to live in Gainesville, so I know those "20-something hotties" of which you refer. It's a little different here in Athens, as the average 20-something hottie comes from higher up on the socio-economic ladder and generally drives an S.U.V., albeit one lower to the ground.
Anyone that thinks the w admin gave a damn about torturing Muslims is wrong. They only cared that the pics hit the media. I imagine the top priority is to find WHO sent the pictures to the media.
Here's more revelatory Rumsfeld verbiage:
"We're functioning [...] in the information age, where people are running around with digital cameras and taking these unbelievable photographs and then passing them off, against the law, to the media [...]"
I'd love to know which law Hersh's/CBS's sources were breaking.
But here's the kicker: Rumsfeld also repeatedly admitted (for example, to Sens. Collins and Graham) that he had read the specific details of the torture back in January and March, but that he somehow couldn't put 2 and 2 together and realize that this was a major clusterfuck until he saw those darn pictures.
So, Mr. Rumsfeld himself has provided the only argument we will ever need for releasing any other still-undisclosed videos, etc.: the images are absolutely essential to an understanding of what happened. If words on a page didn't do it for Sec'y. Rumsfeld, they obviously won't suffice to inform the public, either.
It's vitally important to make this argument LOUDLY, because I guarantee you we will soon hear much about how "a simple press release is quite sufficient; we don't need to inflame public anger with gratuitous, morbid imagery."
If this maladministration has two choices in a given situation they will make sure that they find an even worse third choice.
Their supporters seem to have an incredible tolerance for BushCo idiocies but at some point some of them will defect from Bush.
Shut up. We need to have a few rules so we can keep information out of the liberal media's hands. War is a messy business that does not need to be explained to the hoipolloi. They should stop trying, and let anyone who questions the judgment of our brave men and women that the liberals can -- and should -- be next in line for the broomstick. I'm serious. We must bring back law and order or we will fail.
Pulling the plug on the GI's is just one step to try to contain this.
I strongly suspect that Uncle John has lawyers from the Solicitor General's office working this weekend to draft up the argument for prior restraint injunctions (what Nixon failed to get to stop publication of the Pentagon Papers). There's probably a pretty good argument that the next wave of filth will be more inflammatory and damaging than the Pentagon Papers were. Which, of course, is why the public has a right to know what was done in its name. But as I see it Rumsfeld already has laid the rebuttal groundwork by moaning about how much damage was done by what has been published so far and admitting that there is worse. So if the public knows there is worse, why does it have to actually see it?
Whatever else you want to say about the current Supreme Court -- and you can say a lot -- they have been pretty strong on free speech issues. I really don't know how they would come out. How much sympathy can they have left for the monkey-boy they handed the White House?
This is Radio London erwooeeearrrrrr The Jerries are scanning the airwaves looking for erwoooerarrwoooo receivers. If you are listening to this broadcast crrraakk turn off your radio set errrwwwoeeee.
no dead soldiers after march. he will be lucky if there isn't 1000 dead by nov.
i don't think they will be able to hide the shit.
I too would like to know what law any of our soldiers are breaking by taking pictures while they are out and about?
We're not talking about military secrets here but routine activities.
Sounds like Rummy isn't sorry they did this, but sorry they got caught!
His words, and now this email plot are proof of that.
MYOB'
.
They probably don't want pictures sent all over the world -- why, that might be embarrassing or something!
Scorpio
Eccentricity
go back a few blogs and read this, all of this, Media Revolt, Orcinus. I hate being pessimistically correct. pissnutbutter stinks.
It's over.
If this is true, it truly is. Certainly "some journalist" will look into this: it is now open season on the Administration in the Media (justifiably, if belatedly so) and this seems a transparent, easily verifiable, way that some are limiting access to troops. Anyone want to set a pool on how long this story, if true, will circulate?
It's over.
If this is true, it truly is. Certainly "some journalist" will look into this: it is now open season on the Administration in the Media (justifiably, if belatedly so) and this seems a transparent, easily verifiable, way that some are limiting access to troops. Anyone want to set a pool on how long this story, if true, will circulate?
I'm sure restricting email access will make the extended incountry deployments much more enjoyable.
Looks like Rumsfeld is tightening the leash he holds on his soldiers. I'm sure Smirky Bunnypants is laughing and pointing.
But hey, it's not ALL bad news. At least there's finally a Rick's Cafe in Casablanca again. http://www.rickscafe.ma/
Anyone who thinks that the problem is the pictures and not the actions is deserving of a crotch-kicking so severe that it cannot be administered with current crotch-kicking technology and should be cryogenically frozen until that day arrives.
Doesn't appear to be true, or at least not yet. We exchanged e-mails overnight with a good Reservist friend who's in Baghdad at the moment; he'd heard nothing about this, says that KBR has no control over the e-mail, and believes that people would not stand for losing e-mail contact. He also said that the soldiers are outraged by the photos from Abu Ghraib, and he had a few choice words for them himself.
For what it's worth.
As usual with these bozos, they NEVER look at possible unintended consequences.
Somewhere, there may be a GI that would have kept some pictures to himself, that gets more than a little pissed off about them shutting him off, with their hard handed tactics...and you know the biggest boom in Iraq reportedly has been online cafes, and such...they may be once again screwing themselves.
Tax cuts? No that was EMAIL cuts that we promised...
So are they affraid that the soldiers will find out what is going on at home or that the folk at home will hear from the soldiers?
I think that they don't want any news getting back home as they try the coverup.
I suspect that what is really going on is that this has been suggested and the troops are kicking back to make sure it does not happen.
The torture pictures did not come from email, they came from the lawyer of one of the soldiers who was charged. The original scheme seems to have been trying to blackmail the admin into dropping charges.
Well, I've done some investigating, and it turns out that there is no "e-mail ban" in Iraq.
thanks SMASH...good to get updates, and corrections.
"Well, I've done some investigating, and it turns out that there is no "e-mail ban" in Iraq."
SMASH - I'm glad to hear it isn't true. What's really sad is that rumors like this are so eminently plausible these days. Anyway, good work! You might want to e-mail Atrios directly so he can update the main entry with a correction and a link; I don't know if he'll notice your comment this late in the game.
Characters Remaining:
Commenting by HaloScan
