I'MMA LET YOU FINISH
Oo, it's all gone small text-wise. Is this new?
i don't want to be first
New meme: Ayatollah Bush.
Further, didn't this administration talk Israel out of bombing Iran's reactor?
Maybe so.
Holy mahoney.
Matt Y turning Bush's own rhetoric against him.
"You're either with us or against us."
Against whom, kemo sabe?
Craig, weeeeeeelllll...
you could argue that in that case they didn't want to see some kinda nucular war, y'know?
Pretty much OT: And Agent Bush's Army issued an "expanded stop loss" order today. Basically, if you're in the military and 90 days from deployment to Iraq, you're locked in for the long haul.
That'll help recruiting.
Amazing how this war is unfolding. In the '80s, the neo-cons sicced Saddam's Iraq against Iran, but also slipped a little cash to the Iranians.
Now the Iranians appear to have gotten revenge, taking the neo-cons for a ride and conveniently getting the US to take out Saddam.
well, if you've seen one theocracy, you've seen them all.
Ok, a bit of a stretch. Damn having to be held to higher standards of proof than conservatives are...
Agent Bush's military also issued "stop move" today as well.
I think it is obvious
Ah, but Matt could have made the story even better: he forgot about Iran-Contra. In that episode, a number of people who now hold senior positions in the Bush administration (but who were then working for Reagan and Bush Sr.) secretly funneled arms to Iran, in exchange for hostages. Iran freed some hostages, but then captured more, so they ended up trading arms for nothing. How conveeeeenient.
Now, I don't really think Bush is an Iranian agent, but the Iranians have sure been playing him like a fiddle.
No mention of the 1980 presidential election?
Pretty much OT: And Agent Bush's Army issued an "expanded stop loss" order today. Basically, if you're in the military and 90 days from deployment to Iraq, you're locked in for the long haul.
Awwwww crap!
And all this time I thought W. was an agent of Satan. Shows how much I know. I guess I'll stick to racing.
How much longer will the Bush family be repaying Iran for delaying the release of the hostages?
oops.
And all this time I thought W. was an agent of Satan. Shows how much I know. I guess I'll stick to racing.
In Iran they now call the US, "The Just Okay Satan".
In Iran they now call the US, "The Just Okay Satan".
OT: VOA reports Cheney personally ordered Halliburton contracts.
Here was Kaus's Goat:
Kaus lent me out to Vlasto last night. That asshole had a real good time with me. Someone please call PETA. I need to get outta here.
Al Franken just totally spanked Neil Boortz, who ranted like a baby and - haha - HUNG UP ON HIM!!!!!!
these whining little babies can dish it out but... you know the rest!
Old Hat,
I never really worked for Halliburton. It was mostly just sitting in a really comfortable chair and going to golf outings. Gee, I could hardly tell you what line of business they are in.
Now, now, the wahhabi al-Bushi clearly suffer Dual (and not rreally that Dual) Loyalty...to their Saudi buddies like Bandar Bush. But if letting Saudis, self-appointed friends of Israel and the good old Guardian Council run our policies looks like this, we still have a lot more people who are going to die.
Anybody remember the way Clinus was supposed to be totally in the pocket of the terrible terrible (and inscrutable) Yellow Peril? America's Voice was talking about China like every other program. Fuck, at this point, we'd take the Chinese over the murderers in charge now!
Don't forget Iraq's other northern neighbor
This can't be good.
Kurdish guerrillas attacked Turkish troops in southeastern Turkey on Wednesday, a day after the rebels announced an end to a five-year unilateral truce, the Turkish news agency Anatolia reported.
[snip]
Turkish authorities have recently complained that the United States failed to act against the Kurdish rebels holed up in mountain bases in northern Iraq despite promises.
What if Bush is an al Qaeda agent first, and an Iranian agent second?
Current CNN poll
Should the United States have relied on Ahmed Chalabi as an intelligence source in Iraq?
Yes
No
No is kickin' it.
I was thinking this exact same thing.
Stop stealing my ideas!
Al Franken just totally spanked Neil Boortz, who ranted like a baby and - haha - HUNG UP ON HIM!!!!!!
I loved how Al squeaked in a goodbye something like "Okay, bye, stop lying!"
OT: Faith-based science takes another beating: The big "prayer really works" study published in a major medical journal has been De-Bunked. Finally.
http://tinyurl.com/yt3zw
Color me not stunned. It's way past time to stand up to religious bullying. Waaaaay past.
Back on topic: Iran, bitches!
It begins.
US Says Iran Hiding Nuclear Bomb Program
Welcome to hell. Enjoy your stay.
Now, I don't really think Bush is an Iranian agent, but the Iranians have sure been playing him like a fiddle.
The Bushies stubbornly and arrogantly latched on to their fevered dreams of power, money, and influence. It was easy to lead them by the nose when it took them in the direction they wanted to go.
I don't even know if it bothers them that they were duped, as long as it didn't interfere with their long-desired goals. They've gotten very good at ignoring reality and dismissing criticism. What scary, immoral people they are.
Renato, damn right they can't take it, nor can they defend their ideas in a forum where opposing views are allowed. Hence, the reliance of Rush, O'Reilly, Hannity, Boortz, et al on the great echo chamber. If any of these clowns were to participate in a real debate, such as Bill Buckley used to produce, they'd get shredded.
Iran is next? That makes sense. It's the one remaining member of the Axis of Evil that we know does not currently have a nuclear weapon. We know North Korea has nuclear weapons, so we don't have to worry about them.
Re: Boortz crying
Wasn't there a story not too long about about "top" (prominent) Republicans steering clear of "Crossfire" ever since Carville became co-host?
Apparently the Republican party was dismayed that their talking heads were getting decimated on cable television.
Nothing evil can stand the light. Just read a Stephen King book sometime if you don't believe me.
Gives new meaning to Iran Contra. How many of the Iran Contra people are there in this administration? Elliot Abrams is one. Who else?
What was with Al Franken and David Brooks? He was pretty easy on him but had a good point about David criticizing a book without reading it.
Now what I'm about to tell you is to be kept between you, me, and my dog.
Big Media Matt makes a convincing case that Bush is actually an agent of the Iranian government.
Ooh, we got us a real Machurian Candidate! I think Bush was brainwashed while he was "serving" in TANG, then activated when he did his first line of coke...
OT, but does anyone have link to a transcript of the Chimp's address at the Air Force academy this afternoon? Yahoo headlined it as addressing the "ideology" of the fight against terrah and as W's comparing Iraq to WWII, even though the speech was billed in advance as intending to outline in "great detail" ... something or other. No surprises there.
Anyway, a link to a transcript anywhere?
"long ago," not "long about"
I had them fill my pitcher with vodka, why do you ask?
Anyway, a link to a transcript anywhere?
NYT and GeorgeWBush.com should have it soon.
Lisa:
LALALALALA I can't hear you. Dinosaurs were on Noah's ark. How'd they fit? Here's how...
Who in god's name is Neil Boortz? I don't have cable, so a lot of these ass-wipes are unknown to me. They seem to be legion in number, though.
Lets take a look; Chalabi was told of broken codes by a bragging drunk very high in the US government. Who do we know that is a high up government offical, who do we know is a braggert and has a drinking problem?
The leak; George W. Bush.
OK so he's not, but still its a damn good discription of the chimp.
Why sir, what Ah know 'bout codes would fill an encyclopedia.
OT: Sorry NTodd, but I thought this needed a little advertising here. Looks good, there's even a glossary where the meaning and etymology of the word 'turkee' is preserved for posterity.
It begins.
US Says Iran Hiding Nuclear Bomb Program
Welcome to hell. Enjoy your stay.
Old Hat | Email | Homepage | 06.02.04 - 2:35 pm | #
Iran is next? That makes sense. It's the one remaining member of the Axis of Evil that we know does not currently have a nuclear weapon. We know North Korea has nuclear weapons, so we don't have to worry about them.
Fed up | Email | Homepage | 06.02.04 - 2:41 pm | #
hey, this nice shiny metal thing just popped up out of the dirt in front of me about waist height.
uh oh...
...even though the speech was billed in advance as intending to outline in "great detail"
Yesterday, I heard Suzanne Malveaux report that he was going to outline his plan for Iraq. Did he do that?
GWB is an agent of S.T.U.P.I.D.
Just caught the speech on CNN...
Media Matt does it tongue-in-cheek (I think), and we get a chuckle. With far less evidence, the wingnuts ranted about The Clenis being in bed with China. WAR IS PEACE, FREEDOM IS SLAVERY, IGNORANCE IS STRENGTH. Ignore the man behind the curtain!
Whew! I'm sho hammered I shwear I'm seein' tow of you.
Utterly off topic post:
As the President is getting off the helicopter in front of the White
House, he has a baby pig under each arm. The Marine guard snaps to
attention, salutes, and says: "Nice pigs, sir!" The President replies:
These are not pigs, these are authentic Texan Razorback Hogs. I got one
for VP Cheney, and I got one for Defense Secretary Rumsfeld."
The Marine again snaps to attention, salutes, and replies, "Nice trade,
sir!"
Susie:
Who isn't?
Michael Leeden
John Poindexter
Mitch Daniels
Otto Reich
Dick Armitage
Elliot Abrams
Others?
The dKosopedia is soooooo tight.
Damn it, that'd be "Manchurian..."
Preview, Atrios. Preview! For the love of all that is bloggy...
Iran does "make sense", because it was on the list.
Iran is not Iraq. Lots of mountains, experience of well-remembered American takeovers, building-by-building urban fighting, unified ethnically unlike Iraq. And they hadn't suffered the sanctions and bombing Iraq did.
The cruelest irony will be that the Iranian people are right now avoiding revolution out of fear at what it might become (last time, not everyone was Khomeinist, and the GC pretty much took over to a lot of surprise) but striding mightily toward change now without Bush's help.
Iraq was a travesty, but mostly for Iraqis. It wasn't under a thousand Iraqis who died in the conquest like the occupying forces. Iran, especially while also balancing Afghanistan and Iraq, is going to fucking hurt us. Iran, like North Korea, cannot "win" but either would fucking hurt the hell out of us. It is not so much an attack on Tehran as it will be a devastating attack on America, breaking us to the point of necessitating martial law. And then Strauss's wahhabi al-Bushi will have their elevation of the discourse, above the heads of the rabble and the middle class and those in the upper class not allied to them.
Gives new meaning to Iran Contra. How many of the Iran Contra people are there in this administration? Elliot Abrams is one. Who else?
Susie Dow
Negroponte for one
Sorry NTodd, but I thought this needed a little advertising here.
What, you think the plug on my site won't generate enough traffic? 
When are we going to learn this is all Clinton's fault? And how do I respond?
Have you seen my smoking sovereignty transfer?
Big Ass Explosions at Kirkuk Ammo Dump
AHHH! Dinosaurs on the Ark! My brain hurts! Don't DO that kind of linkage without a warning.
Craig in New Vatican City: "Creationist researcher..." Bwhahahahaha!
Thanks for the link. I will add it to my Maroons On the Loose list o' Web sites.
You're all played (we desperately hope). The imminent threat to Iran is a feint meant to smoke away the news of Chalabi's Iranian service.
Moonie Press International off the Reservation on New Iraqi Govt.
Lahkdar Brahimi, the U.N. special envoy in Iraq, will have some explaining to do when he appears before the Security Council, possibly as early Friday. As he left for Baghdad charged with forming an interim government to take over on June 30 he said he planned to recruit technocrats unconnected with the Iraqi Governing Council.
What has emerged after "frantic, grueling days of politicking in Baghdad" -- as a European diplomat in New York put it Wednesday -- is a government in which the IGC has risen like the phoenix from the ashes of its own disbanding.
Miserable Failure's foreign policy reminds me of a movie I saw. I think it was called Duck Soup. Except the movie was funny.
It should read NSFI(ntelligent people), Chris?
First!
Bush at the Air Force Academy:
Bush told 981 graduates that they will be joining a war whose central front is Iraq.
However,
American forces have not found the weapons of mass destruction stockpiles Bush cited as a primary justification for the March 2003 invasion. And officials have not announced any evidence directly linking Saddam Hussein (news - web sites) to al-Qaida or the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks.
BTW, how many Air Force personnel are currently serving in Iraq? Aren't most of the troops Army or Marine?
Michael Ledeen writing for National Review Online seems to concur with Matt:
"Somehow, despite a torrent of evidence, this administration refuses to recognize that Iran was, and is, the greatest menace to us, the greatest sponsor of the terror network, and either in possession of atomic bombs or soon to have them."
">link
CIA to Investigate Chalabi, US Officials Say
In today's "speech," Bush likens his "war on terra" to WWII.
http://tinyurl.com/3ekxe
Thing is, if W. was preznit during WWII, I'm pretty convinced that we would have been attacking Norway and Argentena instead of Germany and Japan.
Pie, it's not a contradiction, look at the statement. Joining a war whose central front is Iraq. So when we start bombing Colombia, Venezuela, Cuba, North Korea, Iran or France, the "central front" is Iraq (and not Afghanistan, no, never, where's that?).
DNC Invites Some 'Bloggers' to Convention
So who got an invite?
Atrios?
Iraq is coming apart at the seems. This is a geopolitical disaster for the world, not just for Baby Bush.
OMG, dinosaurs on Noah's Ark! You can't make up stuff this good. With folks like these around, the Onion can just start doing straight reporting, no satire necessary.
The image of Noah herding two T-rexes (T-rexi?) onto a boat kills me. I can see him smacking their lizard skin with his staff now...
How'd he manage to keep them from going after the triceratops? Everyone knows that whenever you put a T-rex and triceratops together, there's gonna be a wang-dang-doodle of a battle. From "Journey to the Beginning of Time" to "King Kong," it's just a cinematic fact...
"Some Bloggers" should invite the DNC to fucking apologize on their knees for the Fake Scandal over Kos (or kiss their inaccurately-timed Haloscanned asses), when no Democrat could be too close to Ollie North.
I would have a bit more respect for you, Melanie, if you would admit you are blogwhoring with those posts.
Give people a choice as to whether or not they want to give your site a hit, rather than being deceptive.
and, Old Hat,
The FBI is conducting an intelligence investigation to determine who provided classified information to Chalabi and whether that person was authorized to provide the information, a source familiar with the investigation said.
Another investigation.
How many does this make? And when are any of these investigations going to result in criminal prosecutions?
Worst. Administration. Ever.
I would have a bit more respect for you, Melanie, if you would admit you are blogwhoring with those posts. Give people a choice as to whether or not they want to give your site a hit, rather than being deceptive.
Been doing it for at least a month now. Getting a little old.
From The Financial Times...
http://tinyurl.com/28d4o
Paris bans protests ahead of Bush's visit
Demonstrations have been banned in central Paris throughout this week to ensure no hostile protests are in evidence to disturb President George W. Bush's brief presence in the French capital on Saturday, where he will be dining with President Jacques Chirac.
This blanket ban cannot conceal the groundswell of French hostility to the US president and the unpopularity of his policies on Iraq and the broader Middle East.
It nevertheless underscores Mr Chirac's determination to make Mr Bush's stay in France for the 60th anniversary of the D-Day celebrations a friendly occasion and a chance to improve the chilly state of Franco-American relations...
Lisa-
I think Noah relied on the Sleestak from Land of the Lost to keep those dinosaurs in line.
Holy crapcakes, manyoso! You mean we invaded the wrong country? Iraq, Iran, hell, there's only one letter difference, so I see how a geopolitical genius like Miserable Failure could get them confused.
OT:
While Matt's piece may point to a degradation of our nation's integrity, many people missed the Supreme Court's newest decision which broke down some Miranda protections. I've got a full report at
http://islanddave.blogspot.com/2...v-
alvarado.html
And all this time I coulda sworn he was an agent for the Saudis... Oh, well. Live and learn.
RE: Noah and the Dinosaurs
I can see the T-Rexs stepping off the ark after 40 days and saying to Noah, "We enjoyed your cruise's buffet".
Paris bans protests ahead of Bush's visit
After the way the rethugs treated France, Bush certainly doesn't deserve consideration. Looks like the French are much more mature, but then we knew that.
I guess our boycott of brie and wine is bringing those Frenchies to their knees. Real 'Murikans like Boone's Farm and Velveeta better anyhow. And freedom fries are better, too.
Iraq, Iran?
"What's the difference?"
- George W. Bush
I would have a bit more respect for you, Melanie, if you would admit you are blogwhoring with those posts. Give people a choice as to whether or not they want to give your site a hit, rather than being deceptive.
Either Melanie doesn't read the threads she leaves her deceptive links on (which inevitably end up filled with polite/not so polite requests for "attribution"), or does but continues to ignore those requests. Either way, she's a blogwhore that gives simple "promotion" a bad name. The benefit of the doubt is long expired. I hope her traffic is increasing, because her blogging credibility is shrinking rapidly. I don't care how good her blog may be, her reputation will always be, like preznit, mendacious.
I don't have cable, so a lot of these ass-wipes are unknown to me.
You win the Kentucky Derby and they don't even get you cable for your stable?
Bastards!!
After Paris, it's on to Germanland or wherever all them Germans live. We'll teach 'em to eat 'Murikan food like potato salad.
Paris bans protests ahead of Bush's visit
Hare yew happy now? Weef banned our oown prhotestors. S'il vous plaît, call zee leetle patatoes "French Fries" ahgain.
We should commission a study. Put a T-rex and a triceratops in a cage. A randomly selected group of people will pray to the Christian God that they DON'T fight; a randomly selected group of people will pray to the Muslim God that they don't fight; and a randomly selected group of atheists will place bets on which one of the two dinosaurs will win if they DO fight.
A randomly selected control group will watch Ray Harryhausen movies in the next building.
it clearly wasn't in the president's political interest to produce the current debacle
Finally a liberal hawk line of reasoning that I can almost tolerate!
I think a re-make of Land of the Lost is in order. However, the new version should be much darker.
Instead of a likable family, it should be w. and his neo-con brigade that is transported to the world of the Sleestaks. For humor, a few religious freaks that believe that dinosaurs were on Noah's Ark could join them.
Each episode would conclude with one of these assholes being torn apart limb by limb by the Sleestaks.
The end.
Since we're just about done with central front in the war on terrorism, so we need Iran to be another front to add to Afghanistan and Iraq.
You win the Kentucky Derby and they don't even get you cable for your stable?
Bastards!!
four legs good
They aren't so bad. They let me blog. The only reason I'd watch cable anyway would be to catch Jon Stewart. I hear Dave Chappelle is good, too.
Chris T, Craig in NVC, Lisa:
Did you notice what this dude says?
"When you realize that horses, zebras, and donkeys are probably descended from the horse-like ‘kind’, Noah did not have to carry two sets of each such animal. Also, dogs, wolves, and coyotes are probably from a single canine ‘kind’, so hundreds of different dogs were not needed."
Okay. And h-o-w did those different "kinds" "descend"?
smarty jones-
I'm so relieved I'm not the only idiot who remembers Land of the Lost.
I suppose in your re-make Bush would be the little apelike dude who screamed, "Saree-sa-taka, Saree-sa-taka!", about eighty times each episode.
Okay. And h-o-w did those different "kinds" "descend"?
Jeebus evolutionized-- I mean, Jeebus, er, made them...grow...into, uh, different amnimals.
Okay. And h-o-w did those different "kinds" "descend"?
Down a ramp, silly.
The Bushes and their friends, allies, and fellow travellers are an unbeatable combination of greed and stupidity. Even with all the resources of the US Government at hand, they are swindled like rubes at a carnival.
In a way it's creepy that someone brought up Noah, given the Strangelove Bunker mentality of those actively trying to bring about the end of the world.
Reuters today: An estimated 10,000 Iraqi civilians and thousands more Iraqi military have died.
The 10,000 (or so) Iraq civilians killed by US forces hardly gets mentioned. It's an incredible figure. Think about it -- we went there to 'liberate' them and killed 10,000 men, women and children. Yes, the 800+ troops are bad, but what about the 10,000 Iraqis? That is one out of every 2700 Iraqis.
RE: Land of the Lost
What was the evolved Sleestack called? Wasn't it (Cl)Enus?
History lesson: 1980, the Iranians fixed the election for the Republicans.
Iran-Contra: Republicans give them lots and lots of guns real cheap.
Iran-Iraq War: Republicans (and Cheney specifically) give Saddam lots and lots of nasty stuff (including those chemical weapons that were the only WMD Saddam actually had) that he uses on Iran. Iran is understably a tad miffed at their friends helping the enemy.
Now: Payback's a bitch, ain't it?
Or at least, that's one way of looking at it.
US Battles Shiite Militants in Kufa, Baghdad, Falluja
Neil Boortz is a libertarian radio show host in Atlanta.
Holden, that character (was it Chaka?)was too annoying to make the cut. I remember I had a crush on Holly, so I'd like to somehow keep her character, but my new version has no room for sex.
No, each episode of my version is more like 30 minutes of pure terror. Sort of like Mel Gibson's Passion, but with a neo-con being tortured by bad-assed Sleestaks.
For signed autographs of Holly, go here!
http://www.landofthelost.com/hol...om/
hollypic.cfm
Craig, I was delighted to here that Noah took teenaged dinosaurs with him on the ark. How charming!
BTW, I spoke to an otherwise intelligent woman last year who assured me that genesis is correct- and that first god created the earth, and it was all in darkness and covered in water, then there was light, then he created man.
"Where and when did the dinosaurs come into it?" I asked.
"Before the light." she said.
"What did they eat?" I asked. "if there wasn't any light, and the earth was still covered with water, there couldn't be photosynthesis and therefore no plants and nothing for dinos to eat."
At that point she got really confused and said she'd have to consult her minister. I'm certain she believes I'm a minion of satan.
As long as Matt started it, I think we need to take this to the logical conclusion.
Bush isn't an agent of Iran. Iran is actually a puppet government of the Bush family. Think about it. What if Bush Sr., realizing the the Shah was not long for this world, decided to "overthrow" the (new, post-reform) CIA's puppet? Suddenly, they have control of Iran and nobody questions the bona fides of the mullahs.
It explains the wilingness of Iran to cooperate on the "October Surprise." It explains Iran-Contra. It explains why Israel continued to trade with Iran during the hostage crisis. It explains why a bunch of neo-cons don't seem too concerned about Chalabi. It explains why Haliburton has a subsidiary doing business in Iran. Hell, it even explains why Bush has to do what Sharon says (Sharon knows).
In fact, making Iraq a puppet state of Iran would make it easier to control than if it were simply a puppet of the U.S.
The only flaw in this logical deduction is that it would require a brilliant, evil genius to pull it off.
"Okay. And h-o-w did those different "kinds" "descend"?"
-Dreaming feet
It's called "Selective Creationism" - You know when pale beautiful people have pale beautiful kids. Occasionally you will have someone performing a homosexual act or man-on-dog Santorum and a new race is created.
anon -- How big will the 800+ troops killed in Iraq get by June 30, the end of the 'occupation' phase? Do I have any takers for 911?
Iran is the next logical step. If your logic is to secure the massive oil reserves in the Caspian Sea. First you take our Afghanistan to secure a free pipeline. Then you take out Iraq so you have a base to stage an all out war with Iran. Then you've got your oil and all you had to do is spill the blood of thousands! Now everyone get in your SUV and drive to the Krispy Kreme to celebrate!
"we'd take the Chinese over the murderers in charge now!"
kei & yuri, there is actually something odd here too. For all the ranting and raving of the religious reich about China, our admin, always one to kiss the religious reich's buttocks, has been strangely silent and the religious reich does not complain.
This is especially odd because right through GWB's axis of evil lies China. After all it was China, locked in a border dispute with India, which helped arm Pakistan which helped WMDize our current axis of evil. Also, there is always the threat of collapse in China (it looks a lot like Rome before the fall).
One almost wonders whether the religious reich purposefully distracts us with yellow-peril hysteria in order to delegitimize even reasonable concerns about China.
But then again, I am wearing my tinfoil hat all the time now and still think that the theocratophilic neo-cons and the theocrats in Iran are in bed together and that we are still suffering from the after effects of Iran/Contra and the rest of the Reagan mis-administration. I just wonder how peace manages to be kept between the Saudis and the Iranians within our little axis of military-industrial complex profits.
Pie, it's not a contradiction, look at the statement. Joining a war whose central front is Iraq.
Or, paraphrasing Pascal, a war whose center is everywhere and whose circumference is nowhere.
Holden, Smarty
Bush does remind me of a pakuni (or whatever those little ape things were)
After the way the rethugs treated France, Bush certainly doesn't deserve consideration. Looks like the French are much more mature, but then we knew that.
pie
I have never been more ashamed of my state when they rescinded an invitation to French President Chirac last year when we celebrated two hundred years since the signing of the Louisiana Purchase on Apr. 30, 1803 because France didn't support the Iraqi War. We're totally run by the wingers now. He did send some minor officials from France, though.
Also, people were questioning about Israel, Iran, and Chalabi (can't we ever go without an Israel mention? Geez...), thought I'd point out that this war was sold in large part through AIPAC and JINSA- Chalabi sold them on the idea of him ruling Iraq and normalizing relations with Israel, even talking about rebuilding the Kirkut-Haifa oil pipeline. He took them in bigtime, and now he can't give them what he promised even if he wanted to. They're not terribly happy at this, coupled with the destabilizing of Iraq and chance of fundamentalists taking power. Especially Iran-allied ones.
I really, honestly, wish someone could explain to me how the hell Chalabi's still alive. So many reasons for people to off him.
Forget about all this war crap. Who cares!! I'm much more interested in Land of the Lost and dinosaurs on Noah's ark.
I'm imagining it was something like the boat scene from Jurassic Park II. (a stupid movie but I did enjoy seeing a bunch of bad guys getting eaten up.)
Yesterday, I heard Suzanne Malveaux report that he was going to outline his plan for Iraq. Did he do that?
Uh, yeah, sorta [blogwhore].
Raskolnikov, Foundling, smarty jones-
The real issue here is:
Is Karen Hughes
a Sleestak?
I think this explains many things.
On Bush's openness to the Chinese: a lot of that can be linked to Elaine Chao, Chinese-born SecLabor, who's been strongly pushing China-friendliness, and the corporate wing of the GOP is listening. It's too big a market to piss off.
Profit trumps ideology every time.
Loved the "dinos on the ark" explanation, particularly how Noah didn't have to take two of everything we have now, because they, um,
.
.
.
...(cough)evolved or something.
"Also, there is always the threat of collapse in China (it looks a lot like Rome before the fall)."
-DAS
I'm sorry DAS but the United States looks more like Rome than does China.
I really, honestly, wish someone could explain to me how the hell Chalabi's still alive. So many reasons for people to off him.
I think it's called *the manilla envelope to be delivered to ? in the event of my death*.
Four legs, you are Satan's representative.
Lisa, I'm at the National Academy of Sciences, and if you can come up with funding to do your proposed study, I'd be happy to take it on.
The weather is almost stifling now. The air is heavy and dry with heat. By early noon, it's almost too hot to go outside. For every two hours of electricity, we have four hours of no electricity in our area- and several other areas.
From Riverbend's new post. At least they can grow roses so they can throw rose petals at our troops.
Robert Parry has a related article.
space - hmmm ... sometimes I do wonder, too. The problem is that Bush Sr. never really did like Israel and made no bones about it (unlike GWB who pretends to "like" Israel because he realizes the base wants to see Israel starting armegedden so that Jeebus can come back from his hiatus in South Park, CO). How does that fit in with your theory?
Still - I gotta say, we all gotta remember who was behind Team B. Maybe Team B's activities went beyond trying to empty our government's coffers into the pockets of the military-industrial complex by hyping the soviet threat. I mean, the plumbers did more than fix leaks, after all.
Damn - we need to have a full accounting of Iran/Contra if we are ever going to progress as a nation. At best, we are letting ourselves get distracted by ridiculous conspiracy theories. At worst, our theories are true and the people behind Iran/Contra should be in prison rather than continuing to destroy our country.
Selective creationism? Were these animals intelligently designed to evolve. Head spins, got to sit down.
anon -- How big will the 800+ troops killed in Iraq get by June 30, the end of the 'occupation' phase? Do I have any takers for 911?
The only people who will be killed after 6/30 are $1k a day mercenaries - and they don't make the official list of dead. EZPZ. There's an election to be won/stolen/whatever.
Karen Hughes a Sleestak. Brilliant!
(hmm, thought I hit OK...)
On China: Elaine Chao, Chinese-born SecLabor has a lot to do with the current policies. She's been strongly pushing openness with China among the thinktank squad, and the corporate wing of the GOP agrees, much to the grumbling of the (largely marginalized now) militant anticommunists.
Profit over principle every time with these people.
slightly OT.
This just in: Condee, asked ``Who is responsible for Ahmed Chalabi's actions?'' by Judy Woodruff, replies ``He is responsible for himself.''
There you have it. The No-Fault Administration is still perfect.
DAS, if you think China is about to fall when it has clearly succcessfully transitioned from Maoist Stalinism to classic third-world empire-by-proxy, with laogai for banana or sugar plantations or mines, it's just a great big ol' El Salvador it is, maybe you are reading the wrong things. China's "fine", unfortunately. China looks like Rome? Exactly how? China always looks like China.
We are the ones tolerating mercenary armies with no particular love or loyalty for us, "giving" the world the "gift" of our culture/language/"laws", etc, expanding beyond our reach, falling prey to crossworshippers and getting tied up with bad government in Israel, etc.
I really, honestly, wish someone could explain to me how the hell Chalabi's still alive. So many reasons for people to off him.
Jake Nelson
I think it's because he knows too much about Saddam's dealings with many in the current administration. He was allowed and and he stole all Saddam's records and wont give them back. Slick. He needs to be shot in the face, though.
Holden,
I don't think so, Pakuni and Sleesak hated each other.
"I'm sorry DAS but the United States looks more like Rome than does China." - Yoshimi
Nowadays, yes. Thanks to the efforts of the C+ Augustinian neo-cons supporting the C+ Augustus Chimperor of New Rome, we are starting to look like Rome. But for the longest time, I thought that China (paternalistic, insulated leadership loosing its grip on its populace and going bonkers trying to prevent the spread of religions it views as threatening) was looking a helluva lot like the Roman Empire in its declining days.
Is anyone still here who can give me the gist of Franken's handling of Boortz.
I haaaaaaaaate Boortz.
DAS,
My theory would be that GHWB used Israel as a conduit but didn't see them as a strategic partner.
Don't harass Melanie, she might start accusing you of persecuting her for her religion.
anon -- How big will the 800+ troops killed in Iraq get by June 30, the end of the 'occupation' phase? Do I have any takers for 911?
Current US deaths: 817. May average (US only): 2.61/day.
At that rate, it looks like 895.
I'd bet it's within 10 of 900 on June 30th.
Which will mean the 1000 total coalition deaths mark will likely precede the handover.
About Chalabi,
does anyone know if charges could be brought against him if what has been reported is true? The media seems to not want to ask this question.
If all he did was pass on information that was freely given to him by criminal elements in the administration, could he walk. This seems to be different than actively engaging in espionage against the United States.
Also, has anyone heard anything recently about the allegations that he sat on info that the Jordanian embassy was going to be attacked?
Holden, Smarty, though Karen has the intelligence of Sleastack, they're much to svelte. Maybe more akin to the baby brontosaurus Holly would ride around?
damnit! much TOO svelte
In fact, making Iraq a puppet state of Iran would make it easier to control than if it were simply a puppet of the U.S.
The only flaw in this logical deduction is that it would require a brilliant, evil genius to pull it off.
Now that's a faith-based program. Bush is the evil genius. He's learned well from Obi Wan Reagan. Play dumb and no one will think you have the brainpower to pull it off.
Hmmm... I'm inclined to believe that T. Rex were scavengers, or opportunistic hunters at best. Meanwhile, triceratops were herding (better: "flocking") animals, so a more realistic conflict would be between a lone, hungry T. Rex looking for easy pickings and a flock of triceratops with long pointy horns and body armor. Advantage: triceratops.
"Dude, T. Rex would so-o-o-o take the one with the horns!"
There's a very elaborate metaphor here about offense vs. defense, presumed cakewalks, and romantic fantasies of valor that I leave for others to develop.
Four legs, you are Satan's representative.
It would be more accurate to say that I'm a minion of Gozar.
Just saying.
Is Karen Hughes
a Sleestak?
I always hated those guys.
Funny thing: the only episode of Land of the Lost I remember was the one where they fought the Medusa. Everything else is a blur.
Which will mean the 1000 total coalition deaths mark will likely precede the handover.
Jake Nelson
Jake,
lunaville (iraqi coalition body count) has also started reporting contractor deaths, which are now over 70. In all, this would bring deaths to over 1,000 already.
On another thread, I mentioned I caught the end of Nightline on Friday. Koppel read the names of those American service men and women who have died since the first remembrance.
It was pretty chilling, and seemed to last an eternity.
DAS, nobody since Nixon has treated Israel as anything less than some kind of special unique thing far better than an ally. If GHWB didn't "like" Israel-look, Ike didn't "like" or "hate" Israel, but he chewed them out for something they did as if they were any other country (which is the proper way). If GHWB didn't "like" Israel there were plenty of things he could've done that we'd still be talking about.
And Rome hardly "went bonkers" to prevent the spread of certain religions, check out Freeman's Closing of the Western Mind.
Space is right to bring up older relations between the wahhabi al-Bushi and the Iranians in the October Surprise, but irresponsible or satirical to go off on this bit about a puppet government of ours.
Can you imagine what the wingers would be screaming right now if someone in the Clinton administration allowed someone to pass on information to Iran that we had broken their codes? Listening to Hannity right now, you'd never know about it because it's the Bush administration. Can things be more surreal? Now one of his breathy sluts is calling in.
Raskolnikov,
I don't think anyone would ride Karen for nothing!
Halliburton Hearings
Don't expect anything out of the House, but Susan Collins is independent enough to heed the call.
The e-mail, reported by Time magazine, provided "clear evidence" of a relationship between Cheney and multibillion-dollar contracts Halliburton has received for rebuilding Iraq, Sen. Patrick Leahy said.
"It totally contradicts the vice president's previous assertions of having no contact" with federal officials about Halliburton's Iraq deals, Leahy, a Vermont Democrat, said in a conference call set up by John Kerry's presidential campaign. "It would be irresponsible not to hold hearings."
[snip]
New Jersey's Sen. Frank Lautenberg, another Democrat, urged the chair of the Senate Governmental Affairs Committee, Republican Sen. Susan Collins, to subpoena e-mails and any other evidence of contacts between the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers and Cheney's office on Halliburton's Iraq contracts.
"The revelation that the Vice President's office was involved in the awarding of this contract ... makes the need for an investigation essential," Lautenberg wrote to Collins.
[snip]
On the other side of Capitol Hill, Rep. Henry Waxman, a California Democrat, wrote to Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld suggesting he also helped steer Iraq oil work to Halliburton.
Waxman said the General Accounting Office, the audit arm of Congress, told him the oil work should have been obtained competitively.
The Army knew this, Waxman said the GAO had told him. But, he wrote Rumsfeld, "your office overruled the Army and directed Army officials to issue the task order to Halliburton."
Lautenberg, Waxman and several other Democrats have called for months for hearings into details of U.S. government deals involving Halliburton, the biggest contractor in Iraq.
"And Rome hardly 'went bonkers' to prevent the spread of certain religions, check out Freeman's Closing of the Western Mind."
kei and yuri, thank you for the book recommendation. I was somewhat under the impression that Rome would have done better to be a bit more tolerant. A lot of the appeal of fundie Christianity and similar movements in the Roman Empire was a matter of rebelliousness. Moreover, in going to such extremes, the Roman Empire set itself up so that it could devolve into theocracy.
My knowledge on the subject, though, is limitted and highly biased. I just thought I saw more than a bit of Rome in the paternalism of the Chinese government. I could be wrong, though.
anon -- How big will the 800+ troops killed in Iraq get by June 30, the end of the 'occupation' phase? Do I have any takers for 911?
Sick B
I just think its terrible how the civilian death toll never gets a mention. These are people that got killed in their own country, at home or work or out shopping. Sons, daughters, brothers and sisters...
And, on the same bent, boy, that wedding-party story sure had legs, didn't it?
wÒÓ†,
I will never be able to eat a Sloppy Joe again. Ever!
wÒÓ†- brilliant. BTW, on Miss Universe last night they showed a blue footed booby.
"Big Media Matt makes a convincing case that Bush is actually an agent of the Iranian government."
Having read the article now, I can say that the argument is beautiful in its simplicity and its ability to solve all the riddles of the Bush presidency.
I don't know, wÒÓ†. I think my Sleestak theory has legs.
Sure, Mr. Hughes is much bulkier than the Common Sleestak, but she has to wear a bulky body suit and sensible clothing to hide her reptillian features.
I hate Karen Hughes. I wish a tornado would get her.
Oh, and the big hair hides the horn.
A lot of the appeal of fundie Christianity and similar movements in the Roman Empire was a matter of rebelliousness. Moreover, in going to such extremes, the Roman Empire set itself up so that it could devolve into theocracy.
The first Christians were the most despised lower class in Roman society. Christianity appealed to them with its, "The meek shall inherit the earth." The Burning of Rome was by these early Christians. They thought it would provoke God's Second Coming. Similar to what I see them doing now.
Holden, I think you may be right.
Good point, Holden. Hadn't thought of that angle.
In thinking to myself, I dont find the concept of bush being a provider of accomodation for whoever comes along down the pike (Iran ...Iraq ...Saudi Arabia ..etc.) a surprise of outrageous speculation ..my point being ..their, (the stencil and decals of Karl Rove's meatplow i.e. past Nixon/Bush alumni and fresher thief/bullies ..neofacist Republican "yoots", "motis operandi" has been to befriend and provide just before they betray and indicate, anyone they associate with, as an "enemy" for us to loathe that they will take it upon themselves to defend and protect us from.
Please don't denigrate perfectly nice Sleestacks by comparing them to something like Karen Huges. I will NEVER forget what she said after the March for Women's Lives. Never.
Wedding party -- I take it back. Here's Washington Post, yesterday:
http://tinyurl.com/2xyks
There's a link to a BBC story which includes pics of wedding guests, including kids (unless you believe this was a propoganda scam).
Basically, the Christian rubes burned Rome in their day to provoke God's Second Coming just like the Christian rubes of our day are trying to provoke God's Second Coming after Armageddon. Strange how history repeats itself.
Our little dog Archie was lost for three weeks, but yesterday while we were watching TV we heard a sound at the front door, and when we opened it there standing on the porch wagging his tail was the Antichrist. You know what they say about Beelzebub eating small children alive? Well, take it from someone who knows...it is so true.
Lisa, I'm at the National Academy of Sciences, and if you can come up with funding to do your proposed study, I'd be happy to take it on
OK. I just got back from lunch, so maybe this weekend I'll see what I can do. "Will Work For Funding."
Also, since you're at the NAS, maybe you can hip me to where I might find a couple of dinosaurs?
DAS-oh, no, absolutely no question that Rome could've been more tolerant-depending on how you mean tolerance. Rome wasn't Ghenkis Kahn, who had no policy on religion (and whose men were completely above torture [but not rape], interestingly enough), but nevertheless Rome was extraordinarily sensible and tolerant. Their one concern was that whatever you thought not be a threat to them, which they ritualized by swapping gods Indian-style. Almost the only people to resist this were the extremely violent, vocal, and worrisome crossworshipping whackjobs.
There is a chilling passage in that book, regarding the great Machivellian bishop Ambrose of Milan, who balanced manipulation of seven emporers (and some of their wives/mothers), died a natural death despite sometimes backing the wrong Emporer-To-Be, and was buried in his own church under the altar (after "discovering" the remains of some saints on the site).
There was a synagogue that got destroyed in a rampage, and the Emporer in true Roman (and unChristian) style became enraged. "I don't care who's right, the Jews pay their taxes and don't bother anybody, and this is a barbaric affront to sacred Order", more or less. This same guy had talked about holding crossworshippers accountable for up to four times the repayment for such crimes since they thought they were morally better than everyone else.
So Ambrose goes to him and says, "what if I had led the charge against the synagogue?" He hadn't, this was like a hundred miles away, but Ambrose talks him out of a Roman multi-cultural legal order and into a Christian chauvenist mindset that was to last for a thousand years.
The Romans should've stamped them out; they bent over backwards to be nice, in real life, and European History was the consequence.
anon -- yep. At first I wondered how close we'd have to get to the 9/11/01 count before we'd rexamine our strategies, but now I wonder how many civilians we have to kill for each on of our dead before we're satisfied.
He was allowed and and he stole all Saddam's records and wont give them back. Slick. Incognito
This is the most critical incident in this whole mess. Who does Chalabi have the goods on? Apparently everyone, 'cause he's still among the mortals...
Link to Bush a USAF Academy
http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/r...6/
20040602.html
Can Bush be an Iranian Agent AND good for Israel? Better get Judith Miller on this story poste haste!!
This is the most critical incident in this whole mess. Who does Chalabi have the goods on? Apparently everyone, 'cause he's still among the mortals...
MisterX
He has the goods on Rumsfeld and Cheney and their dealings with Saddam during the 90s is my guess.
Yes, will work for funding.
Hmm. I don't work in dinosaur policy, but http://books.nap.edu/catalog/6024.html
describes science and creationism.
I imagine most of them went extinct when it was found that their gall bladders were aphrodisiacs. Or through selective creationism, they became birds or monkeys or horses or something (see upthread).
Please don't denigrate perfectly nice Sleestacks by comparing them to something like Karen Huges. I will NEVER forget what she said after the March for Women's Lives. Never.
Hecate
Hecate,
in my Land of the Lost re-make, a different neo-con is tortured to death by Sleestacks in each episode. The Sleestacks represent some type of brute justice. If you want Karen torn apart limb by limb - probably in episode 7 - by another creature, I am open to suggestions.
Big Ass Explosions at Kirkuk Ammo Dump
Old Hat 06.02.04 - 3:00 pm | #
Since when did Kirkuk have an airport?
Is anyone still here who can give me the gist of Franken's handling of Boortz.
I haaaaaaaaate Boortz.
Al caught him in a bunch of petty, grade-school, hand-in-the-cookie jar lies. As is SOP for a wingnut, Boortz was more interested in talking about WHY Franken was "playing 'Gotcha!'" than acknowledging or explaining any of his lies.
(Remember: it's not the liar who's sick...it's the person who is obsessed with exposing lies in order to tear people down.)
Boortz's big lie this time around was in response to a comment by Janeane G. about liberals having ended segregation. Bortz started braying about how the Civil Rights Act of 1964 was passed over the objections of "Democrats in the Senate."
Franken pointed out that the use of the term "Democrat" was disingenuous...first, because Janeane had been discussing the goals and successes of liberalism as a political philosophy; and second, because the "Democrats" Boortz was talking about were actually Dixiecrats like Thurmond and Eastland (Eastland being probably the single worst racist ever elected to political office in this country).
Boortz kept up with the predictable "If I call them Democrats, they're not only Democrats but liberals" argument.
Franken read a quote from Newt Gingrich, sayong that segregation had been ended by "The liberal wing of the Democratic Party."
Boortz stammered a lot.
Franken asked if Boortz considered Strom Thurmond and James Eastland "liberals." More stammering.
Finally, Boortz decided he'd had enough, and tried the patented O'Reilly escape hatch. Grew incredibly pompous and puffed up with self-regard. Said Franken was "obsessed" with catching him at lies, said it was childish and beneath Franken's dignity. Held forth about the type of behavior up with which he would not put, and hung up.
The fact that Franken was chuckling the whole time really interfered with Boortz's attempt at projecting iron-spined sang-froid.
Shockingly lame even by Boortz standards, but I'm sure they're drinking lots of Andre Cold Duck around Boortz HQ today nonetheless. After all, a battle is only a defeat if you call it one!
Bush is too stupid to be an agent of anything...duped and used, yeah, agent, no.
======
Holy crapcakes, manyoso! You mean we invaded the wrong country? Iraq, Iran, hell, there's only one letter difference, so I see how a geopolitical genius like Miserable Failure could get them confused.
Fed up
If this country's Iraq'n
Don't come knockin'
-Chalabi
Incognito - Yeah, I figured those two left some messes there. Wonder if family Bush has anything to hide in Iraq?
Okay. And h-o-w did those different "kinds" "descend"?
dreaming feet | Email | Homepage | 06.02.04 - 3:28 pm | #
And what did they eat for 40 days and 40 nights? It isn't just space for the critters, but their provisions. Early scientists got a kick out of this kind of intellectual masterbation. According to Neil Stephenson anyway.
Incognito - Yeah, I figured those two left some messes there. Wonder if family Bush has anything to hide in Iraq?
MisterX
Probably, going all the way back to the early 80s during the Reagan administration.
Oops...sorry about that "Anonymous" post. Just cleaned out my cookies.
Viva pseudonymy! Philalethes in the motherfuckin' house, representin' Cali OGs nonstop in 2 double-O 4, bitches!
Hmmm...maybe my dog is actually a stegosaurus!
The fundies believe that dinosaurs were covered in mud during the Great Flood when the water receded. They always blank-out when you ask them why aren't there any fossilized cow bones then. I think that's what unnerves me the most about fundamentalists is their absolute refusal to accept facts that don't jive with their belief system. And that they want me to believe such bullshit that they're actively trying to make this country into a Theocracy and force that to be taught in schools. I'm just not going to do it.
In a rational world I wouldn't have had to just write that.
Thank you anonymous stranger, for the Boortz summary. I guess that's you, Philalethes? Boortz is definitely one of those who relies on his listeners not really knowing what a "liberal" is, assuming liberals are just secret communist ne'er do wells. Why did he even go on Franken's show to begin with?
No, that's not true that the Romans were universally tolerant of everything except Christianity (q.v. Mithraism, Judaism, various Egyptian local culti) - what is true is that it was a way more complicated situation than either Gibbons or traditional Christian hagiography has any awareness of.
There was ethnic identity involved. There were revolutionary ethno-political movements involved. There were warring schools of philosohy. There was good old conservativism, of the What's with all this foriegn Eastern crap, anyway? Isn't Zeus good enough for you? (q.v. Lucian) There were attempts to forge a synthetic group identity as We Romans (this is what the Cult of the Emperor was all about.) There was resentment - who are these weirdos who have dropped out of society, won't eat the same food as anyone else, and hold these "love-ins"--? Freaks!
What happened is that when Christianity went mainstream and became the Establishment, it - or rather the individuals now part of it who weren't idealists belonging to a minority movement - started acting the way Establishments do everywhere. (qv. Buddhism in the Shogunate, frex) Which always includes persecuting rivals both philosophical and economic.
And then countermovements start up within it, again qv. Buddhism.
There is *nothing* new under the sun.
does negroponte count?
well, i have to say, i don't think george is WOKING for america certainly.
Probably, going all the way back to the early 80s during the Reagan administration.
Incognito
Wow! I just realized that Babs gave up a son to be the Manchurian Candidate for the new millenium.
My question is this:
is Al-Qaeda on the GOP payroll (hence the need for all that fund-raising) doing George W Bullshit's--I mean Dick Cheney's--bidding,
or is George W Bullshit--I mean Dick Cheney--on the Al-Qaeda payroll, since everything he does works to their benefit?
Which one has more money?
Bellatrys-we never said Romans were terribly lovely people. But generally, their "persecutions" of crossworshippers were myths, evil myths which served to stoke the criminal imaginations of later accepted crossworshippers who thought it was all about suffering and lamented their comfort. Romans tended to "persecute" legitimate threats to their rule (eg, accepting and defending Jews, but ruthlessly attacking Israel in reaction to terrorism like any other empire). Crossworshippers were the kind of sadistic murderers they had nearly worshipped in the "thrown to the lions" stories.
The point isn't just that history is more complicated than the Cecil B. DeMille version, it's that crossworshippers were little bastards, even before they took over Europe.
Aaargh, as in other parts of the Empire (like our proxy dictators, not all of whom are actually on the payroll per se), they do not need direct connection to collude.
slightly OT.
This just in: Condee, asked ``Who is responsible for Ahmed Chalabi's actions?'' by Judy Woodruff, replies ``He is responsible for himself.''
There you have it. The No-Fault Administration is still perfect.
It all makes perfect sense!
He gave himself sensitive, classified information he couldn't possibly have had access to without someone giving it to him.
And that someone was, of course, Ahmed Chalabi himself, that embezzling, bank-frauding, backstabbing rat.
What an ingenious ploy, for Ahmed Chalabi to betray our secrets to someone as devious and despicable as Ahmed Chalabi.
In reality, the Roman persecutions were desultory and unpopular, even the one mistakenly blamed on Diocletian.
Especially after the 3rd century, Christians had to invent the elaborate slaughter tales: most of the people killing Christians were other Christians (for being the wrong kind of Christians). Alexandria looked like South-Central L.A.
Even Nero was gunning for the Jews at first, only to find out his main squeeze was hanging out with their priests like they were Maharishis or something.
The American people need to start asking themselves, whose side is Bush on?
If a village idiot gets punk'd in the desert by a Mullah, does it make a sound?
Blood, indeed, Constantine "converted" (not really) for the sake of all-important stability, and was immediately shocked and confused by what Christian legitimization (to include special rights for "true Christians", like tax exemptions) brought: bloody, riotous infighting worse than any persecution or insurrection before.
Crossworshippers are barbarians. Randall Terry is not an aberration, he is the son of Paul and Augustine and Catherine Emmerich.
Gosh things have gotten interesting while I've been doing things other than staying glued to Atrios.
Holden - Where are Bushie's numbers now?
Say, under the terms of the proposed Patriot II Act, shouldn't giving aid and comfort to the Iraqi National Congress be sufficient grounds for stripping Bush, Rummy, Perle, Wolfowitz, et al of their citizenship and sending them to Gitmo?
K & Y: well, he's certainly no follower of Christ.
Constantine had Xians in the family, I think, wh/ is why he went in for the minority Trinitarian sect. strictly IIRC
But Xians had been bringing issues to Emperors before Constantine, for adjudication. Another theory is that Constantine, coming out of the west (where there was no Xity to speak of, esp. in Britain, his haunt) used the Xians as a sort of 5th column: the poor and disaffected in the eastern Empire.
Kinda like US aristocrats playing the fundies so they can make an Old Sarum out of the Solid South. But I digress...
Crossworshippers are barbarians.
You know, most liberals would reject vociferously the kind of hate you direct at Christians, complete with adopting creative slurs, if directed at anyother religion.
But I guess this kind of broad-brush hatred direct at Christianity is still okay.
cmdicely:
What Christianity? He said crossworshippers.
Do we need to review our 10 Commandments?
I heard some clips from bush's speech to the USAF academy on NPR. He actually said something to the effect we need to support democracy in Iraq because totalitarian regimes quash dissent and force the citizens to live in mindless conformity.
all I could think of how different that is from what the right is pushing this country to now
Yes, Jase, it breaks my heart to see these two faith-based organzations with the blood of thousands of innocent civilians on their hands always at each other's throats.
The have so much in common , if they could only see that.
Iran to GHW Bush: You want to be president? Give us your first-born son.
The dinosaurs did become birds, but it wasn't 5000 years ago- it was more like 150 million years ago.
Once again, the real world is not only queerer than we know, it is queerer than we can know: some evidence exists that velociraptors may have evolved from the early birds about 80 million years ago.
And while this may seem wildly off topic, it's probably worth including it in this thread: the jeebofascists hate the evidence of the natural world that like the followers of Zeus, their world view is eventually destined to the dustbin of mythology.
kelley b. - It's true that the Jeebofascists hate evidence that goes against their theories about the origins of life on earth. But I doubt that they think their worldview will be consigned to history's dustbin since they don't think history is going to exist much longer. They think we're deluded and are going to get our just comeuppance after they are Raptured out of here. And I hope they are, and very soon. They've ruined the country.
If kei & yuri didn't mean to indicate "Christians" by "crossworshippers" - that certainly wasn't clear. But their statements weren't terribly articulate of anything but anti-religious bigotry*; some of the sentences hardly parsed at all. If they'd bothered to take a look at the part of my homepage I linked to, they'd have realized that I am hardly unfamiliar with the seamier bits of Early Church History. Or the particulars of Late Imperial Rome.
*I mean, there aren't any "crossworshippers" and never have been, unless you're using "worship" in the extremely archaic English sense of "to do some form of honour, to indicate reverence" as in "with my body I thee worship" - so either kei & yuri are talking nonsense, or they're insulting both Christians and Bible-Thumping Orcs™ (abridged to BTOs aka Xtians) in one cute but empty catchphrase.
Oh boy ... it turns out that the Republicans are being awfully hypocritical when they blame the Clenis for our policy of supporting Chalabi and the INC.
From the 2000 Republican platform:
The [Clinton] administration has used an arsenal of dilatory tactics to block any serious support to the Iraqi National Congress, an umbrella organization reflecting a broad and representative group of Iraqis who wish to free their country from the scourge of Saddam Hussein's regime.
Of course, there are more examples of of this sort of thing on Buzzflash today.
I'm confused. I thought the Bushes were Saudi agents.
True enough, Tena.
But even if they do ruin the country, even if they squeeze every drop of oil out the ground, eventually they are going out the door.
Why? Because there are alternative energy sources. There are people who teach their children well, and these children- like their parents- see through the jeebofascist myths and bigotry. Social progress will continue even as the psychotics try to drag the gullible back to the stone age.
This country may be doomed to the superstitious decay of the old Empires, but somewhere, sometime, people will make a place where they can live free again.
Somewhere inside themselves they know that like fossils in the earth, time will leave them behind, as those with eyes to see will learn and evolve and grow.
It makes them frantic and desperate.
I'm confused. I thought the Bushes were Saudi agents.
Maybe Bush Sr is in bed with the Saudis, and Jr is pals with Iran. Oh my god, it all makes sense!
TENA IS BACK!
[spinning around in circles]
belle-"christians"= imitators of Christ, like Francis of Assissi or the Berrigans. "Crossworshippers"= descendants of Paul, evangelicals, etc
I mean, there aren't any "crossworshippers" and never have been.
Actually, the charge of cross worshipping has often been levied against the Armenians, first by the twelfth century Jacobite writer Dionysius Jacob bar Salibi.
Armenians prefer ornately incised khachkars, or cross stones, to the icons of the Orthodox church. In the past, they have been known to offer prayers and libations to these khachkars.
Obviously the way we use it is not literal. We were just irritated by these idiots claiming that the Soyuz proves that Socialism can never work anywhere and then turning around and declaring that such-and-such a crime is not part of their heritage because Bakker or Ximenez or Cortez was "not really Christian", the question of as with all dogma making it up as they go along.
How silly. Everybody knows Bush is an agent of the Saudi Goverment.
A randomly selected control group will watch Ray Harryhausen movies in the next building.
I randomly select me for the control group.
As most of the time it feels like we're living in a John Frankenheimer movie (I saw "Seconds" again last week, I think it's his best), Harryhausen would make a welcome change. Die, puny human, die!
And Holden - more pics please! Fab!
Characters Remaining:
Commenting by HaloScan
