HaloScan.com - Comments

I'MMA LET YOU FINISH

Frist!
Miserable Failure | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 10:39 am | #

Nice chart!
Karin | 10.12.04 - 10:41 am | #

FUCKWADS!!!
ind4ke | 10.12.04 - 10:42 am | #

Anyone else think this is another distraction from the bigger goal (REMOVING BUSH FROM OFFICE, hint hint)?
Andy | 10.12.04 - 10:44 am | #

All this chart demonstrates is that there exists a great bargain right now to pick up some undervalued Sinclair shares.
Larry Kudlow | 10.12.04 - 10:44 am | #

Hesiod (Counterspin) is on this, too.

He's back & he's pissed.

Miss him at your own risk....
Hudson | 10.12.04 - 10:45 am | #

Nope, this is *part* of the bigger goal. Or do you think that we should just let them run roughshod over us in primetime? (hint: no)
int argc | 10.12.04 - 10:45 am | #

I don't want to have to sign up for another on-line subscription to read the link. What are the axes on the graphs representing? Sinclair stock prices and activity?
ZuZu's Petals | 10.12.04 - 10:46 am | #

I just talked with a very nice person at Putnam who said that Putnam was already looking into the Sinclair situation. I emphasized how the negative publicity is driving down the stock price already and it will only get worse. This story was front page, above the fold in the Washington Post this morning and was just on CNN. Negative publicity alone drives down the stock price. And the PR folks at Sinclair are just making it worse with lame comments about holocaust deniers!
bigforkgirl | 10.12.04 - 10:47 am | #

It's October....SELL!!!

When will we see the people running Sinclair jumping out of windows?
Elaine Supkis | 10.12.04 - 10:47 am | #

Andy, it's all one thing.

And not to be cheap, but I think if you polled Holocaust deniers, it would be pretty clear who most of them would vote for, so I wouldn't be as quick as Sinclair seems to be to denigrate them by calling them Democrats. The Republicans may need those six Holocaust-denier votes in a few weeks.

A.
Athenae | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 10:47 am | #

Sinclair is down .14 this morning. Let's do everything we can to make this sucker sink like a rock!
old grizzly | 10.12.04 - 10:49 am | #

Speaking of demented stereotypes, Black Republicans still finding that they serve merely at racist Massah's pleasure.

I must say, I'm shocked.
Grand Moff Texan | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 10:49 am | #

Right now Howard Stern is tearing Sinclair Broadcasting a third cornchute on his program. He's on fire! Lots of anti-Bush news (facts with an anti-Bush bias). Say what you will about HS, but i just have to believe that his stand on the FCC and Bush will have brought a measurable amount of votes to Kerry come 11/2. He's even saying that the more he hears about Kerry's Viet Nam experience, the prouder he is of him. Go Howard!
perry neum | 10.12.04 - 10:49 am | #

I've said it before and I'll say it again: pigfuckers!

Just ask anybody who has the misfortune of working for this bunch of reactionary, anti-union assholes.

Pigfuckers.
Ras_Nesta | 10.12.04 - 10:50 am | #

Freud called it "projection."

And by the way, did you happen to notice that both rethugs and dems gave the store away yesterday to corporate Mur'ka to the tune of another $136 billion in tax "relief." WTF!!!
zepper | 10.12.04 - 10:50 am | #

Attention Cincinnati metro area!
The Marketing Director of Cincinnati and Sinclair’s WB64 is Jeff Doerrer (513) 641-4400 or sales@wb64.net.
Major WB64 sponsors in Cincinnati are:
King’s Auto Mall, including long-time Cincinnati dealers Terry Lee Chevrolet (800) 956-4852 and Borcherding Buick (513) 677-9200,
Value City (local northern Kentucky department store, ask for store manager, (859) 491-6500)
And a national chain of elective surgery shopping malls called, The Wish Center.
The Wish Center’s Marketing Director is listed as Nancy Kavados (630) 693-0216.
Cincinnati's Wish Center in Springboro, Ohio is (88 854-9474 or
infooh@wishcenter.org
peter grant | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 10:51 am | #

I wonder what it's like going through life with a demented world view like that?

Must suck ass big time.

Sinclair is reaping what they sow.
four legs good | 10.12.04 - 10:52 am | #

From GMT's link:

It's also why most blacks have such contempt for black republicans. We know how they get treated. We just wonder how they can stand it.

I will fight like hell to force the Democrats to live up to their promise, but with the Democrats, there is at least a chance.
Meander | 10.12.04 - 10:53 am | #

Also, isn't Hyman just most Unctuous turd ever spat out of Satan's ass?

The guy is a walking hemorrhoid.
Ras_Nesta | 10.12.04 - 10:54 am | #

I was puzzled this morning as to whether to invest my money in Sinclair Broadcasting or "Pork Bellies".

I'll take the Pork Bellies, over the Pigshit.
attaturk | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 10:55 am | #

He's even saying that the more he hears about Kerry's Viet Nam experience, the prouder he is of him. Go Howard!
perry neum

perry, it is good to hear that HS is still on the attack.

actually, it would be pretty cool for a major network to put the swifties silly hit piece on tv after an airing of Going Upriver. And the Sunday night movie of the week could be F9/11!
smarty jones | 10.12.04 - 10:55 am | #

Woohoo. I'm gonna get some cheap Sinclair stock. Have even more influence in the company, and make money at the same time. Thanks guys.
Avestus | 10.12.04 - 10:55 am | #

Hyman's just pissed that chronology and history deprived him of his chance to be a Kapo.
Davis X. Machina | 10.12.04 - 10:55 am | #

So the repugs and white supremecists who support them that DO deny the holocaust will call OTHERS "holocaust deniers" if it serves their political goals?
Anonymous | 10.12.04 - 10:56 am | #

I think they have every right to air the kerry film...

...as long as we get to see the police video of sinclair chumming for hookers.
Maccabee | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 10:56 am | #

Larry, I'm in tears...Perfect.
jack | 10.12.04 - 10:56 am | #

Mr. Hyman, of course, has a well developed Kerry fetish

He's a bigger toe-sucker than Dick Morris.
attaturk | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 10:57 am | #

The interesting thing about that chart is the spike in volume yesterday. Sell!
WorriedMom | 10.12.04 - 10:57 am | #

Avestus,

You rightwing fucktards couldn't have more influence at that network if you were crawling up David Smith's asshole.
int argc | 10.12.04 - 10:58 am | #

To be fair, I hear that Sinclair is considering balancing its 90 minute Kerry program with a 90 minute Bush program that details his courageous, resolute leadership.
Jim Jenkins | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 10:58 am | #

"This is a powerful story," Hyman said. "The networks are acting like Holocaust deniers and pretending these people (the POWs) don't exist. It would be irresponsible to ignore them."

Wasn't there something about Sinclair and an ABC broadcast that listed the names of soldiers who had died in Iraq?
Lucas | 10.12.04 - 10:58 am | #

Go Poll

http://www.wblasvegas.com/lasveg...gas_nv/ Sinclair

Station KVWB in Las Vegas has a poll asking if they should broadcast the documentary.
VestaVenus | 10.12.04 - 10:58 am | #

Freep the poll bitches!

TELL US TONIGHT :

Do you think Sinclair Broadcast Group should run the documentary?

Goto www.kovr13.com and click on the point. This is a Sinclair station.

.
Lydia | 10.12.04 - 11:00 am | #

Tom Schaller at Gadflyer's got a list of advertisers' emails here so we can threaten boycott.

I sent this group email to them:

"Dear Sinclair Broadcast Network Advertisers,

It has come to my attention that the head of Sinclair Broadcasting, who you support with your ad revenue, has issued a directive to its local affiliates to pre-empt prime time programming in order to air a “documentary” on John Kerry’s Vietnam service. Research has shown that the filmmaker is a partisan operative and the film is nothing more than a hit piece on Kerry designed to sway voters just before the November 2 election. In essence, the Sinclair executives, who have a history of dubious ethics when it comes to promoting conservative causes, are giving President Bush a free, one-hour, prime-time ad.

I want to make this perfectly clear: should Sinclair air this propaganda film on the public airwaves, and you support it with your ad dollars, I will never consume another one of your products ever again, and I will vigorously encourage all of my friends and family to do the same.

I trust you see how the actions of Sinclair are an egregious abuse of power and contrary to our cherished democratic traditions. Please, as a fellow American, join me in condemning such actions and letting Sinclair know there will be serious economic consequences if they proceed with their ruse."

Wish I'd known about the "holocaust denier" line. I would have included it.

Remember, polite but firm works best.
Mad AZ Monk | 10.12.04 - 11:01 am | #

I liked how Hyman compared forcing its stations to run the program with McDonalds forcing its franchises to use sesame seed buns.
Jim Jenkins | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 11:01 am | #

Maybe the same right-wingers who bulk order Ann Coulter's books will buy Sinclair stock.
wysiwyg | 10.12.04 - 11:01 am | #

I really don't understand...

Is not saying that atrocities and free-fire zones occurred not more of a "Holocaust denier" slant than saying they did?

Poor logic on his part.
mr_superlove | 10.12.04 - 11:02 am | #

So, is Kerry the Nazi?

Or the veterans who committed the admitted atrocities?

What the hell kind of flat-earth inspired analogy was this? I heard it on CNN and couldn't believe it. Are they really so pathetic they have to reach for the Holocaust to justify their actions?

Rhetorical question, obviously.

Can we cheapen the discourse just a bit more? The country went through this kind of political discourse in the 19th century. I'm trying to figure out just who is so anxious to bring it back.

And the answer keeps coming back to: the Masters of War. The ones who profit from the Bush Administration.
Robert M. Jeffers | 10.12.04 - 11:03 am | #

Let's see, the film that Sinclair is planning to run is supposed to be about Kerry's Vietnam tour of duty. Sinclair's spokesperson is complaining that people are denying (Vietnam) POWs for protesting this film.

... connecting the dots ...

Does this mean that Sinclair's film will say that Kerry caused American soldiers to be POWs?
Linnen | 10.12.04 - 11:03 am | #

Anyone else think this is another distraction from the bigger goal (REMOVING BUSH FROM OFFICE, hint hint)?

Only in the same way that throwing gasoline on a bonfire distracts from the flames.
Thumb | 10.12.04 - 11:03 am | #

I don't know if this will be properly formatted, but here you go:

( PI ) 10/11 08:15AM DJ Analysts' Highest-, Lowest-Rated Stocks: Media Broadcasting

Also included in the list are First Call analysts' estimates for the
companies' current quarters. Estimates are operating income per share based on
a survey of analysts.

First Call Consensus Recommendation Scale
1.0-2.4 = Buy
2.5-3.4 = Hold
3.5-5.0 = Sell

Most Attractive Issues
----------------------

Latest # Analysts First Call # Analysts
Consensus Covering EPS Estimate Covering
--------- ---------- ------------ ----------
(N: DTV) 1.6 21 $0.00 3Q 18
(Q: NTLI) 1.8 6 ($1.14) 3Q 3
(Q: XMSR) 1.8 15 ($0.66) 3Q 16
(Q: GMST) 1.9 7 $0.00 3Q 7
(Q: UCOMA) 1.9 7 ($0.04) 3Q 6

Least Attractive Issues
-----------------------

Latest # Analysts First Call # Analysts
Consensus Covering EPS Estimate Covering
--------- ---------- ------------ ----------
(Q: CHTR) 3.4 17 ($0.6 3Q 12
(Q: YBTVA) 3.2 5 ($0.47) 3Q 4
(N: HTV) 2.8 12 $0.30 3Q 13
(Q: SBGI) 2.8 8 $0.00 3Q 8
(N: CXR) 2.7 19 $0.19 3Q 19

(END) Dow Jones Newswires
10-11-04 0815ET

A weak hold at best...
Bill in Big D | 10.12.04 - 11:08 am | #

More of the same ass-backwards, upside down, grass eating cows world of the wing nuts.
Incognito | 10.12.04 - 11:08 am | #

Liberals have limited political power today, but enormous economic power. Even if Kerry wins, the battle against the Republican cockroaches has to continue unabated; should we not there be marshalling our considerable economic power against right-wing economic interests? We could bring certain companies to their knees with even modest participation in product boycotts.

Example. I do not allow any GE products, including lightbulbs, into my home. I even avoid airlines with GE engines on their planes.
Bob H | 10.12.04 - 11:09 am | #

I read this and just short-sold 1000 shares of the bastards. It is a tiny drop of typical days volume (500k shares) but you never know, every little bit helps. If just 500 people did the same thing it would be a huge message to them today.
warning: don't sell short unless you are prepared to give up and close the position with a shrug before it goes over your personal loss limit.
anon | 10.12.04 - 11:09 am | #

Avestus - You better be loaded if you think you can buy enough stock in Sinclair to have any affect whatsoever on the company's broadcasting decisions. LOL.
Tena | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 11:11 am | #

Commentary from today's Radio Business Report:

RBR observation: The "Nightline" and "SH:WTNH" episodes share one characteristic: They are both blatantly political, completely lacking any subtlety at all. The are also contradictory. In the first case, Sinclair ordered its affiliates not to broadcast a program because it was propaganda, even though most observers said it was not, including at length John McCain (R-AZ). Now, in the second instance, it's ordering its stations to air as news a program most would call propaganda, and at the most highly-charged point of a hotly-contested election. If Sinclair is doing anything, it is fueling the movement to revive the Fairness Doctrine, not to mention efforts to turn back the clock on broadcast ownership consolidation...

Understand, first, that Radio industry publications come down firmly on the side of the industry, and that means deregulation. They're typically very vocal about the fact that they do NOT want to see a return of the Fairness Doctrine, or the inability of any corporation to own fewer TV or Radio outlets in any one market than they damn well please.

That having been said, take this editorial as an expert opinion. Shorter RBR: if Sinclair creates enough outrage with this stunt, and the political landscape changes even slightly, the people and the political leaders are going to demand some accountability, and you're not gonna like that.

As great as that possibility may sound to YOU, here's the problem I see with that. We are now so far past the Fairness Doctrine, that the right has had a generation to indoctrinate the masses to the point where half the population is what we're really fighting against, this year.

If, at this point, the government were to introduce Fairness Doctrine II, it would disadvantage our side completely. Even if Rush and Hannity and Savage, and all 24/7 right-wing formats went away overnight, you'd still have a stealthily-biased "news" apparatus, skirting the new law just fine, thank you.

But more ominously, the few voices on OUR side, the startups like Air America Radio, would die along with 'em. Forgive me if you smell tinfoil, here, but maybe that's the long-term Rove scheme, with the unabashed promotion of a lightning rod such as "Stolen Honor": they've already done their damage with the shock troops... now they can sit back and enjoy their berth in the halls of power and influence (mass media), and pick off the cavalry that's just coming over the hill (AAR, etc.).

I'd think about this real damn carefully before signing any petitions, when a Kerry era happens.
Barry Champlain | 10.12.04 - 11:12 am | #

We could bring certain companies to their knees with even modest participation in product boycotts.

Example. I do not allow any GE products, including lightbulbs, into my home. I even avoid airlines with GE engines on their planes.
Bob H

I plan to fight them from now on. This shouldn't end, by no means.
Incognito | 10.12.04 - 11:14 am | #

Please call these two, the GMs I talked too know nothing about it. One asked if I would buy a car from him if thay stoped running ads on Sinclair, I told him heck yes, and so would my family and friends.
Please call them, hammer them.

Major WB64 sponsors in Cincinnati are:
King’s Auto Mall, including long-time Cincinnati dealers Terry Lee Chevrolet (800) 956-4852 and Borcherding Buick (513) 677-9200,
jmc | 10.12.04 - 11:14 am | #

Wasn't there something about Sinclair and an ABC broadcast that listed the names of soldiers who had died in Iraq?

'Republican senator and Vietnam veteran John McCain lambasted the Sinclair Broadcast Group Friday for insisting its ABC stations not air the program, calling the move "deeply offensive."'

http://www.cnn.com/2004/SHOWBIZ/.../abc.nightline/

I think I may need assistance with hyperlinks...
Shermanesq | 10.12.04 - 11:18 am | #

If Kerry manages to get in there despite winning, I'll work against all this crap. Bush steals it again? I'm the fuck outta here.
Incognito | 10.12.04 - 11:19 am | #

Haw haw!

"Let's BOYCOTT! Howard Stern is telling us that censorship is good sometimes!"

Flip-flop
Poolitzer | 10.12.04 - 11:20 am | #

The Republicans may need those six Holocaust-denier votes in a few weeks.

A.
Athenae

Nice one, A.
geor3ge | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 11:20 am | #

Stern gets half a billion. Pigboy gets 1/5 of that.
Incognito | 10.12.04 - 11:22 am | #

The Republicans may need those six Holocaust-denier votes in a few weeks.

A.
Athenae

Oh, look, there's one of them now! *Nods at "Poolitzer"*
int argc | 10.12.04 - 11:22 am | #

Good strategic advice from a TPM reader. Go local.
Mad AZ Monk | 10.12.04 - 11:23 am | #

Stern gets half a billion. Pigboy gets 1/5 of that.
Incognito | Email | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 11:22 am | #

And sloppy blowjobs from Daryn Kagan (but the media is so liberal).
And Oxycontin from his household help.
And a firing squad (someday).
int argc | 10.12.04 - 11:24 am | #

And sloppy blowjobs from Daryn Kagan (but the media is so liberal).
And Oxycontin from his household help.
And a firing squad (someday).
int argc

Sweet Jesus.
Incognito | 10.12.04 - 11:25 am | #

Sign the petition to Stop Sinclair
Tinman | 10.12.04 - 11:26 am | #

Now there's a way to win friends and influence people. Tell them that if they refuse to air GOP propaganda, they're the moral equivalent of those who claim that 6 million Jews didn't die under Hitler's Final Solution. Nice bit of PR for your company, asshole.
Daydream Nation | 10.12.04 - 11:27 am | #

Volume has increased over 10,000 since Atrios posted this.

Amazing.
pixie | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 11:28 am | #

Copyright 2004 Cable News Network
All Rights Reserved
CNN

SHOW: AMERICAN MORNING 07:00

October 12, 2004 Tuesday 8:30 AM Eastern Time

Transcript # 101204CN.V74
SECTION: News; International
LENGTH: 3967 words
HEADLINE: Candidates Prepare for Third Debate; Controversy Over Sinclair Group's Anti-Kerry Film; Botox to Help Breast Cancer Surgery Patients

Mark Hyman is the vice president for corporate relations for the Sinclair Broadcasting Group, and he is my guest now. And Mark, welcome. Good morning to you.
MARK HYMAN, SINCLAIR BROADCAST GROUP: Good morning, Bill. Thank you very much.
HEMMER: What's the motivation behind this airing now?
HYMAN: Well, this is definitely a newsworthy event. These Vietnam prisoners of war had suffered horrific abuse and unspeakable torture for many years. And they -- most of them maintained silence for 31 years and felt a need to respond to claims made by John Kerry.
They have only recently come forward and, as you may know, they've approached the broadcast networks who all said, "We're not interested in speaking to you folks." Nobody has earned a right to speak on the Vietnam experience more so than these men. There are a pair of Medal of Honor winners in this particular group. So, these folks have some standing.
Now, our goal here is to get John Kerry to sit down and talk with these guys, get a chance to tell them why he branded them as war criminals, why he accused them of committing wartime atrocities. These are questions...
HEMMER: Let's see clear here. You've invited Senator Kerry to follow up on this film, right?
HYMAN: The only thing that's carved in stone with this entire program is we've invited John Kerry. The ball is really in his court. If he decides he wants to spend two hours with us, then it's going to change the whole format is how we...
HEMMER: At this point, have you gotten a response from the Kerry campaign?
HYMAN: The Kerry campaign has not responded to us directly. We're still hopeful that they may change their minds and join us, because we think it's an important debate issue that needs to be addressed.
HEMMER: Well, we don't really need to tell you the Democrats are fuming about this issue. Listen to Terry McAuliffe from last hour here on AMERICAN MORNING.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TERRY MCAULIFFE, DNC CHAIRMAN: This is a clear, partisan attack on Senator Kerry, and they offer the opportunity for Senator Kerry to come on after the 90 minutes and talk. Now, we'd be interested if they would give us 90 minutes at primetime, also. But understand, Bill, they are preempting all of their shows a week before the election to do a 90-minute attack on Senator Kerry.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HEMMER: Democrats say this is illegal. Clearly, you do not. Why not?
HYMAN: Well, a couple of issues. First of all, we haven't even looked at a 90-minute program. But if John Kerry wants to spend 45 minutes or an hour with us, maybe we have a 90-minute program. Again, no formal format ha
Rick Perlstein | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 11:33 am | #

Hey looking at that stock price, I wonder if old Georgie Soros decided to have some fun shorting their stock
Sisyphus | 10.12.04 - 11:34 am | #

"Holocaust deniers"...

Is that like Democrats who deny that Kerry admitted to committing atrocities and war crimes for which he has never been held accountable?

Why not now?

If we're going to hold Bush & crew responsible for their war crimes...

Oh, wait, you mean Pres. Kerry will pardon Bush & crew because he too is in desperate need of pardon?

That's fair, I guess.
POW | 10.12.04 - 11:36 am | #

"Squeaky" Johnson at LGF provides more proof of what a dishonest partisan hack he is. He pretends not to understand the difference between public broadcasting on public airwaves and private, for profit, satellite pay-per-view.
"Squeaky" said:
DNC Moans About Kerry Documentary
After waging one of the most negative, smear-filled campaigns in the history of the US, the DNC still has the gall to whine about a broadcasting company’s plan to air a documentary on John Kerry’s anti-war activities after Vietnam: Dems Object to Airing of Anti-Kerry Film.
Any objections from the DNC about Michael Moore’s plan to show his falsehood-packed Fahrenheit 9/11 on pay-per-view the night before the election, in a blatant, openly admitted attempt to influence voters? No?
Anonymous | 10.12.04 - 11:38 am | #

I, for one, would like to hear the Rude Pundit's take on Squeaky Johnson. I've tried to write a screed about him, but I can't get any farther than "you are the best argument I've ever seen for retroactive abortion" before I get too angry to type.
int argc | 10.12.04 - 11:40 am | #

So has Sinclair (as opposed to the network(s) affiliated with its stations) ever broadcast a documentary featuring interviews with Holocaust survivors?

Has it ever ordered all of its stations to preempt regular programming to broadcast a documentary with interviews of Holocaust survivors?

If not, according to their own standards, Sinclair and Hyman are Holocaust deniers.

And can we call David Smith a low-cost ho survivor?
Roger Ailes | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 11:40 am | #

More of the same ass-backwards, upside down, grass eating cows world of the wing nuts.

found this morning in a tennessee truck stop restroom:

"Liberail Neo-Natzi Brown Shorts"

don't forget, these are intellectuals we're dealing with.
Texmenbashi | 10.12.04 - 11:40 am | #

Um, I'm sorry... "Brown Shorts"?! What, like the UPS guy?

ROFLMAO
int argc | 10.12.04 - 11:41 am | #

Haw haw!

"Let's BOYCOTT! Howard Stern is telling us that censorship is good sometimes!"

Flip-flop
Poolitzer

So in your crazy world, a boycott is the same as censorship, eh? So I guess you would say that the Montgomery bus boycott organized by MLK Jr. was censorship?

Do you even bother to think about the logical implications of what you write, or are you just so happy with your ability to spell the words properly that you skip this important step?
Dave J. | 10.12.04 - 11:42 am | #

"Does this mean that Sinclair's film will say that Kerry caused American soldiers to be POWs?"

From what I understand about the film, it accuses Kerry of extending the war two years and of being in league woth Jane Fonda. These people are truly shameless.
wolf-man | 10.12.04 - 11:42 am | #

That's fair, I guess.

Hey, let's start with Kissinger and see where it goes.
Texmenbashi | 10.12.04 - 11:42 am | #

Talking Points Memo has posted a letter from Reed Hundt, former chairman of the FCC, about the Sinclair controversy. He explains, in measured, high-school-civic-class terms, why what Sinclair proposes to do is simply wrong. Good reading.
Daydream Nation | 10.12.04 - 11:42 am | #

John McCain lambasted the Sinclair Broadcast Group Friday

ah, the good old days, back before they castrated McCain.
Texmenbashi | 10.12.04 - 11:47 am | #

I liked how Hyman compared forcing its stations to run the program with McDonalds forcing its franchises to use sesame seed buns.

Anyone who objects to McDonalds requiring its franchises to use sesame seed buns is just like a Holocaust denier!
kc | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 11:47 am | #

Anonymous - Of course the Little Green Raelians will try to fudge the difference between having to pay your own way and people living off gubmint welfare, when it's their morons feeding at the public trough.

Moore is playing the free market. Buying satellite time and seeing if people will buy his product.

Sinclair has a gubmint monopoly protecting its public airwaves from competitors, like your neighbourhood "talk like a pirate tv broadcaster day".

If the Little Green Raelians leaders had actually run a company that wasn't dependent on gubmint welfare, then they might make a wee-bit of sense when they talk about the free market and business. In the meantime they squeal like little pigs when the free market works against 'em.
Tom -Daai Tou Laam | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 11:47 am | #

I doubt the POWs heard the complete Kerry testimony, any more than most of the public has. Kerry should tell Sinclair, "Fuck you. I'm tired of cheap little people twisting my words. Here's the film- play the whole thing, bitches--- and let the American people decide for themselves."

the whole damn thing reeks of desperation-- why risk all the bad publicity etc *unless* they were scared Big John was going to unseat the Chimp-in-Chief
Nick Carraway | 10.12.04 - 11:49 am | #

Sinclair is right to show this movie.

John Kerry should be willing to appear after the movie is shown.

Why deny that Kerry said what he said and the US military did what it did?

We acted like Nazis in Vietnam, the same way we're acting like Nazis today in Iraq.

Let's have the discussion, even if we know the other side are liars.

Or can't the TRUTH about Kerry's honest claims about the sick nature and reality of American fascism survive the light of day?
Anonymous | 10.12.04 - 11:50 am | #

I caught Hyman (sounds like a disease) a couple of weeks ago on his "The Point" segment of our local Fox affiliate ranting about how Kerry's Georges are an affront to every vet who'd _actually_ earned one, many of who had even turned them down.

To call this guy a fuckwad is to give ordinary fuckwads a bad name.

Sheesh.
Jason | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 11:51 am | #

Let's have the discussion, even if we know the other side are liars.

Maybe we could have this discussion some other time than during a presidential campaign, huh?

Or can't the TRUTH about Kerry's honest claims about the sick nature and reality of American fascism survive the light of day?

Oh, I see, you're just trolling. Well, have a nice day, but tell Karl that nobody here is interested.
int argc | 10.12.04 - 11:52 am | #

Obviously, the November 1 PPV broadcast of 'Girls Gone Wild: Jenna and Barbara Do Manhattan' is also an attempt to influence voters too....
anonymous in nc | 10.12.04 - 11:52 am | #

The only thing that's carved in stone with this entire program is we've invited John Kerry.

Wiggle Room?

I continue to wonder if Sinclair can stand up to this kind of heat. I know, I know, they are jackasses made of asbestos, forged in the fires of hell, convinced beyond a shadow of a doubt that they are invisible and bullet-proof.

But what if they're not?

I don't expect anything to crack; but I won't be surprised, either.
Robert M. Jeffers | 10.12.04 - 11:54 am | #

POW - that whole canard about Kerry committing atrocities has been de-bunked about 2000 times at least.

What the fuck is the matter with you wingers? Here is a man who exemplifies all of the values y'all claim to hold so dear - service to his country, heroism, bravery under fire. Y'all support a man who did everything he could possibly do to get out of going to fight for his country. Bush was drunk, lazy and irresponsible in the extreme during the very same time that Kerry was earning 2 bronze stars and a silver star in Vietnam. Y'all are just twisted if you refuse to see the plain truth. Kerry is a hero. Bush is a deserting coward.

Nothing you can do or say will ever change that and I really cannot believe that y'all are so insane that you can continue to insist that you are the ones who support the troops and are true patriots. How can anyone who makes that claim not support a man who lived up to those values? It defies reason.
Tena | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 11:54 am | #

Assuming that this broadcast will happen despite these efforts, wouldn't the most expedient way to defuse it be to beat them to the punch? Have it aired before they do giving those involved an opportunity to respond?
Lucas | 10.12.04 - 11:54 am | #

Whoever wrote that "brown shorts" comments must be a P.G. Wodehouse fan. In the Jeeves stories, there's a recurring character Sir Roderick Spode, modelled on Oswald Moseley. Spode leads the Brown Shorts movement and his followers parade in their brown shorts. They're passionately in favor of all things British, and passionately against all things un-British. They're outraged that the British Empire contains so many un-British things.
Draco | 10.12.04 - 11:57 am | #

Sinclair's "invitation" to Kerry to respond is bullshit. If they REALLY wanted to be fair they'd broadcast "Up River" the next day. By the way, Ebert and Roper gave "Up River" two thumbs up...
wolf-man | 10.12.04 - 11:57 am | #

that whole canard about Kerry committing atrocities has been de-bunked about 2000 times at least

WEIRD! I've never seen anyone 'debunk' the fact that on MEET THE PRESS April 18, 1971, Kerry said this:

MR. KERRY (Vietnam Veterans Against the War): There are all kinds of atrocities and I would have to say that, yes, yes, I committed the same kind of atrocities as thousands of other soldiers have committed in that I took part in shootings in free-fire zones. I conducted harassment and interdiction fire. I used 50-caliber machine guns which we were granted and ordered to use, which were our only weapon against people. I took part in search-and-destroy missions, in the burning of villages. All of this is contrary to the laws of warfare. All of this is contrary to the Geneva Conventions and all of this ordered as a matter of written established policy by the government of the United States from the top down. And I believe that the men who designed these, the men who designed the free-fire zone, the men who ordered us, the men who signed off the air raid strike areas, I think these men, by the letter of the law, the same letter of the law that tried Lieutenant Calley, are war criminals.

How are you going to DEBUNK Kerry's own words? Without flip flopping that is.

Kerry told the truth.

America acted like Nazis in Vietnam and we're doing it again in Iraq.

What does Kerry plan to do about it?

I'd love to know, left-winger.
POW | 10.12.04 - 12:00 pm | #

Anyone who'd call someone "left-winger" as an insult here is clearly tipping their hand as a troll. To be concise, therefore: "POW", GFY.
int argc | 10.12.04 - 12:02 pm | #

It defies reason.

Yes, it does. Which is why any "discussion" of the atrocities of Vietnam can occur among historians. Obviously, it cannot occur as part of American political discourse.

American political thought is entirely slogan driven. "Eurasia is our enemy." "Eurasia in our ally." It's all one. What is overlooked in Orwell's critique is that, once words are removed from any connection to reality, it is reality, not words, that suffer. "Torture," "heroism," "courage," "Leadership." We now live, politically, in the land of Humpty-Dumpty. "When I use a word, it means precisely what I want it to mean. Neither more nor less."

We are through the Looking Glass now. Reason has nothing to do with it.

Wish it were otherwise, but these are the conditions that prevail....
Robert M. Jeffers | 10.12.04 - 12:02 pm | #

Sinclair is right to show this movie.

John Kerry should be willing to appear after the movie is shown...

Let's have the discussion, even if we know the other side are liars.

Or can't the TRUTH about Kerry's honest claims about the sick nature and reality of American fascism survive the light of day?

Anonymous

Anonymous: your argument is dead in the water.

For starters, this film is 90 minutes of smear... NOT a "discussion".

To suggest that somehow John Kerry, after 90 minutes of smear, should then come on, in the hot seat, and DEFEND himself against "questions" raised by the smear, is an absolute set-up.

"Fair" would be 90 minutes of free and clear air time, unencumbered by anyone other than whoever the Kerry campaign wanted seen for 90 more minues. If Kerry didn't even appear live, but just wanted to show "Going Upriver", he should be able to, without comment from Sinclair's handpicked wingnuts.

No, what you and that small-penised convicted john who runs the Sinclair organization are suggesting here, is that 84 TV stations air a 90-minute Moonie lie, and then stick John Kerry, 2004 Democratic candidate for President of the United States, in front of a stationary camera, while wingnuts bombard him with, "When did you stop beating your wife?"

In your fucking dreams, troll.
Barry Champlain | 10.12.04 - 12:03 pm | #

Oh, these wingers like to hide behind the Honor of all Veterans with the money they have, or might have someday.

That's what it all comes down to.
Barndog | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 12:03 pm | #

Oh, wait, you mean Pres. Kerry will pardon Bush & crew because he too is in desperate need of pardon?

That's fair, I guess.
POW

No, you paid troll, President Kerry will prosecute every member of Bu$hCo and their Poppy, too. War Crimes. Racketeering. Treason.

He'll sign on to the International Court at the Hague and have Every Murderous Wrepublican from George W. Bu$h to Henry Kissinger to Ollie North to James Bath and Grover Norquist hounded by Interpol, as well as domestically by the IRS and the Justice Department.

We'll air their trials on C-SPAN to make sure every American gets a chance to see their crimes made made public.

And they'll spend the rest of their unnatural lives in prison where they belong.

It's the only safe thing to do.

After all, we're fighting a War Against Terror.
kelley b. | 10.12.04 - 12:03 pm | #

POW - well I suppose the alternatives are either to continue to act like Nazis in Iraq, under Bush - Abu Ghraib anyone? - or let's all get drunk, party and break chandeliers, like Bush was doing during the same time period.

I'd certainly rather have someone in the WH who actually has been in a war and understands what it is about than a drunken spoiled rotten irresponsible and stupid man who knows nothing. "It's hard work fightin' in Irak - I know, I see it on TV."
Tena | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 12:03 pm | #

RMJ,

Sinclair may have no real intention of airing this propoganda. It is kind of like 527s creating a controversial ad... the ad itself may be seen by very few people, but the buzz gets wide circulation across the country.

Here, all Sinclair has to do to reach w's base is say that they will air this anti-kerry movie, and people hear that there is more controversy about Kerry's past. In the end, they say that because of political pressure they are unable to air this important story.

Brilliant, really.
smarty jones | 10.12.04 - 12:04 pm | #

Sell Sinclair stock.

BREAK SINCLAIR'S HYMEN!
attaturk | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 12:06 pm | #

Anonymous--you have a point. Just as this documentary raises some questions, Molly Ivins, a reporter from Texas, has also raised some important questions about George W. Bush--questions that are worthy of a discussion. By your logic, there would be nothing wrong with ABC forcing all of its affiliates to air a 90 minute presentation by Molly Ivins to air these truly important issues. And, if George W. Bush has a problem with it, I'm sure you'd urge him to appear afterwards for an interview with Ms. Ivins. After all, if he has nothing to fear, why wouldn't he want to take part? Right? Right?
Dave J. | 10.12.04 - 12:06 pm | #

Kerry went to Viet Nam with the same impressions and after hearing the same propaganda from his president and his superiors that the troops who went to Iraq did, you idiot. It was only after he spent actual time there, experienced the war, and talked to others that he came to realize that what we were doing was and is wrong.

If you can't understand or appreciate that, then you're not human.

What are you?
pie | 10.12.04 - 12:06 pm | #

We'll air their trials on C-SPAN to make sure every American gets a chance to see their crimes made made public.

And they'll spend the rest of their unnatural lives in prison where they belong.

From your fingers to God's ear.....
Northcoast | 10.12.04 - 12:07 pm | #

I invite right wingers to support Sinclair's share price on its fall to the floor; this will tend to move the economic damage from innocent mutual fund investor's to guilty collaborators.

For my part, not living in a Sinclair local station broadcast area, I have taken the only direct action available to me and notified the national/international companies advertising on the Sinclair network (which I do business with) that I will decline to do business with them as long as they are doing business with a viciously unAmerican company such as Sinclair.

Sinclair is attempting illegitimately influence a national election, and we should carry the fight to them on a national basis using whatever non-violent means are available.
TomR | 10.12.04 - 12:07 pm | #

kelly b. - THANK YOU! God, I needed a laugh, and your claim that President Kerry will prosecute every member of Bu$hCo and their Poppy, too. War Crimes. Racketeering. Treason. is so hi-fucking-larious!

Especially because you're the only person here at Eschaton who thinks this way!

HAW HAW!

Tena would rather have an old war criminal in the White House than someone who's just started committing war crimes.

Wait, that's not fair. Kerry supports the War on Drugs, so his support for terrorism and war crimes is as up to date as Bush's.

Remember, Kerry wants to DOUBLE Special Forces!

I'm sure they won't commit any war crimes, kelly b.!

HAHAHAHA!
Anonymous | 10.12.04 - 12:07 pm | #

Sorry if someone mentioned this already, but regarding this argument of 'pretending these people (the POWs) don't exist', is that not EXACTLY what these guys did reagrding the Nightline show about Iraq KIAs?
zone_master | 10.12.04 - 12:07 pm | #

I saw this on another blog. It sounds like a good plan of attack for Singclair. Maybe you guys could spread the word!:

**********************************
Here's how to have an impact on the local Sinclair stations: first, watch the LOCAL station and make a list of all of the local advertisers. Then, write to the sales manager -- not the general manager, but the sales manager -- and tell him that you're going to contact all of the local advertisers to register a protest about the station airing this program. Be specific -- mention the names of those local advertisers. Then, actually contact them (if you write or email, cc the sales manager). These stations make most of their income (around 60%) from local advertisers and will NOT want to have that income threatened.
*********************************
Sounds like a good plan, don't it?
trashman | 10.12.04 - 12:07 pm | #

zone_master scores!!!
smarty jones | 10.12.04 - 12:08 pm | #

POW

The sound of one tiny, malformed brain exploding.
Central Scrutinizer | 10.12.04 - 12:08 pm | #

This must be the October surprise that Karl Rove was talking about. I would love to see some information about contacts between Mark Hyman and the spokesmans for Amerikan Pravda (aka, Rove). Any chance that someone can investigate this before the broadcast? Can we counter with a demand to show the John Kerry documentary currently in theaters, Going Upriver, or perhaps air Fahrenheit 9/11?
Defender of the True Faith | 10.12.04 - 12:09 pm | #

Mr. Hyman is a lying hypocrite. I had a homosexual affair with him.
Steve | 10.12.04 - 12:10 pm | #

Dave J. - YES! Let's show all the political movies all the time!

Anything that will start an honest discussion about how neither Bush nor Kerry are fit to lead and how America is a fascist state that acts like the Nazis whether lead by Republicans or Democrats.

I'm all for that discussion.
Anonymous | 10.12.04 - 12:10 pm | #

I just emailed Michael Moore and asked him to offer Sinclair to show Fahrenheit 911 just a few days before the election. If Sinclair follows their own logic there shouldn't be anything wrong with that. And it would nicely counterbalance that Swift Boat crap. Of course, F911 is an actual documantary - unlike the Swift Boat smear campaign stuff - but, I'm sure, Sinclair will view that differently. I hope Michael Moore will do this...
Joerg | 10.12.04 - 12:10 pm | #

Come into my parlor, mr kerry
spider | 10.12.04 - 12:10 pm | #

Sinclair needs to do a documentary on some of those rampant lesbians in Oklahoma (we guys love that sort of thing!)
Strangelove | 10.12.04 - 12:14 pm | #

Joerg,
Unlikely. Sinclair've already turned down previous offers by Bush-Bashers. That's precisely why the DNC are suing for equal time. I have to say I agree with them.
Anonymous | 10.12.04 - 12:15 pm | #

"It's hard work fightin' in Eye-rak. I know, I see it on TV."
Tena | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 12:16 pm | #

Here's how to have an impact on the local Sinclair stations: first, watch the LOCAL station and make a list of all of the local advertisers. Then, write to the sales manager -- not the general manager, but the sales manager -- and tell him that you're going to contact all of the local advertisers to register a protest about the station airing this program. Be specific -- mention the names of those local advertisers. Then, actually contact them (if you write or email, cc the sales manager). These stations make most of their income (around 60%) from local advertisers and will NOT want to have that income threatened.

THIS IS GETTING RESULTS. CHECK OUT TALKINGPOINTSMEMO.COM. SOMEONE IN OHIO TRIED IT AND IT WORKS! BUT IT CAN'T BE JUST A FEW PEOPLE THEY NEED TO HEAR FROM A LOT OF PEOPLE.
trashman | 10.12.04 - 12:17 pm | #

There's something inspiring about a mobilized electorate. The KOVR site is running very slow.

Nothing is so sweet as seeing their stock tank, however.

My suggestion, to the VP of sales at my Sinclair station was run the program and kill the goose that laid the golden egg. Translation, run the program and I'll set-up a website that actively promots the boycott of your advertisers.

Now this isn't that hard to do folks. I suggest taking similar actions with "your" local Sinclair station.
Let's go get'em | 10.12.04 - 12:20 pm | #

Anything that will start an honest discussion about how neither Bush nor Kerry are fit to lead and how America is a fascist state that acts like the Nazis whether lead by Republicans or Democrats.

Er, except right now it is totally run by the GOP. Totally. They control the White House, Senate, House, and Supreme Court. So I wonder how you can really claim that America is a Nazi-esque state when run by the Dems. Now, I know you are just a loser troll who's actually a Bush supporter, but I'd still enjoy what passes, in your brain, for an answer.
Dave J. | 10.12.04 - 12:20 pm | #

Carlton Sherwood has a long history of less-than-factual-for-hire television investigations orbiting certain carefully-masked RW elements within ever so PC Gannett Corp.
I had to embarrass myself with a televised public apology when I purchased and broadcast Carlton's "investigation" of the funding of Vietnam War Memorial during a late 80's May sweep week on Channel 9 in Washington DC.
Carlton Sherwood is also such a pleasant fellow...butch bukkake, anyone?
Dave Pearce | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 12:21 pm | #

BTW, people always want to know how Charles 'Squeaky' Johnson got his nickname. It's simple, a couple of right-wing radio shows had him call in as a guest (Prager, for one). He made numerous posts begging his 'lizardroid' followers to listen to him. They did, and left message like 'I thought you were pretty good'. What no-one could tell him is that he has the worst voice. It is high and nasal and whiny with a sort of stuttering tremolo. He was never asked back by any of the shows. Hence 'Squeaky'. This is very painful for Squeaky as he longs for fame as a blogger. He is always reading comments here (hi, Squeaky!) and 'reporting back' to his blog, which is a hate-filled racist screed, where commentators frequently advocate (no exaggeration) genocide against muslims and arabs. Squeaky is a skilled propogandist in the Goebbels model, and as much as he promotes arab/muslim hatred needs to be watched carefully. There is one site that tries to do that, but it's a one man operation (so far). That is lgfwatch.com

Sorry to post at such length, but Squeaky is a menace.
Anonymous | 10.12.04 - 12:22 pm | #

By the way, I think it is time for Nightline to run another Fallen segment.

Approx. 240 more have died in Iraq since it aired on April 30.
smarty jones | 10.12.04 - 12:23 pm | #

Trolls coming out like maggots today, crawling out of the rotting carcass of SinclairBroadcasting Group Inc, which is rotting from its own unexpelled feculence...

See a troll/maggot? Squash it...
Konopelli | 10.12.04 - 12:26 pm | #

For those of us in the Northen California area, KOVR13 is the SBG affiliate. Their advertising sales number is 916-374-1405.
Call them to let them know you'll be boycotting their sponsors:

Thunder Valley Casino
Atlantis Casino and Resort
Hyundai
Isuzu
Heald College
ITT Technology Institute
SBC Yahoo DSL
KIA
Dan Gamel RV
Ganda | 10.12.04 - 12:28 pm | #

Anything that will start an honest discussion

Except you started your discussion with stupidity (go on, just admit it, you aren't old enough to remember the Vietnam War, let alone mature enough to understand the issues involved as you so amply proved) and lies (so which Nazi war did YOU fight in, "POW"?) as well as outright incivility and hostility. And you've continued in pretty much the same vein... We've had supposedly "Green/Third Party" trolls here for years now, and they've all been ignorant rude assholes like you... and not one person has seriously considered changing their vote over to what ever pet cause it was they thought they were flogging here. And they won't be convinced by you either; Because you wouldn't know an honest discussion if bit your huge, cheeto encrusted, ass
America's Nemesis | 10.12.04 - 12:29 pm | #

smarty jones--

Hadn't thought of that. Announce the film, then withdraw it. Well, it would appeal to the Bush base, which is probably dispirited after his abysmal performance in two debates. They may still believe Bush is "the man," but the "the man" has failed totally to put his "opponent" (known to the rest of us as "Sen. Kerry") away.

So if it is simply a ploy to motivate the Bush base, it really reeks of desperation.
Robert M. Jeffers | 10.12.04 - 12:29 pm | #

Shut the POW's up!!!!! Their voices should not be heard. What have they done for this country?
Large Marge | 10.12.04 - 12:31 pm | #

Don't let CNN off easy here.

Shifty Bogus Veterans buys ads on the weekend.

Looks like Sinclair bought a whole day of platform off CNN with their weekend ad buy.

Live at Daybreak has "independent" media analyst Hoe' Kurtz softly comparing the Swift Boat "documentary" to F/911 on pay per view. (They're "equally" propaganda, you see.)

Meanwhile, Turner Broadcasting assured the FCC in a recent pitch for bundling stations rather than allowing consumers to pick a-la-larte -- the kind of flexibility that would allow me, for example, to dump CNN and pick up an actual news network like BBC, or allow someone with smut issues the same flexibility -- is the best deal for the consumer. As a tradeoff, Turner said they would give smut-shy consumers blocking options but made no mention of what they'd do for a consumer like me, who wants news coverage rather than the 24 hour knob polishing of the Bush regime that Turner Broadcasting passes off as news and would dump CNN from my dial in a heartbeat for an independent alternative. THE REPORT TO CONGRESS IS DUE JUST AFTER THE ELECTION.

That was part of Turner Broadcasting System Inc.’s recent pitch to federal regulators, who are about six weeks away from a congressional deadline to produce a report on the pros and cons of a la carte programming.

Turner, a division of Time Warner Inc., told staff at the Federal Communications Commission last week that their economic consultants concluded that a la carte mandates would thwart cable’s ability to offer consumers a broad range of programming in the most economically efficient manner.

According to Analysis Group Inc. economists Coleman Bazelon and Thomas Hazlett, bundling “dramatically lowers distribution costs for programmers and transaction costs for customers who are able to continuously sample a wide variety of programs at no additional cost.”

Turner’s presentation to the FCC did not discuss whether a la carte would be advantageous for consumers who want to filter indecent programming by purchasing only those channels they want.

Or cancel certain Crappy News Networks service to people looking for FUCKING NEWS IN THEIR NEWS instead of continual polishing of the First Knob. CNN's not being as blatant as Sinclair but they're insidiously engaging in election fraud, IMO.

CNN ran what was essentially a 55-minute Kerry attack ad that the WH falsely labeled a "major policy speech" and though CNN could have cut away within the first few minutes, they carried in its entirety. As far as I could tell, no comparable response time from the Kerry campaign and this strikes me as an overt campaign donation rather than news. CNN has run other Bush stump speeches uncut and/or as "news" without the sa
Peanut | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 12:33 pm | #

Just as a matter of technical interest, it's not that hard to bring down a transmitter tower. A hot-air balloon floated into one here the other and KKKOB(local NBC affil) was off the air for about three hours, which was a relief...And the balloon didn't even cause the tower to sway...

It Can Be Done
Konopelli | 10.12.04 - 12:34 pm | #

I just left a message for the GM at the Chevrolet dealer in Cincinnati listed above. I made it very clear that I live in the area (in a rather well-off neighborhood) and that I am in the market for car. But if this piece of propaganda airs, I'll be shopping elsewhere, which is too bad, since I had oh-so-hoped to spend my money at their dealership.
steve | 10.12.04 - 12:34 pm | #

How does that tune go?

He's making a list,
Checking it twice,
Gonna find out who's naughty or nice.
de Sade | 10.12.04 - 12:34 pm | #

smarty jones - *sigh* 240 dead.

Oh dear god.

The local news here did a story on the foundation that runs residential housing near military hospitals all over the world where families of American military personnel can stay for free while their loved ones are in the hospital. The number of wounded from Iraq that was given in the story was 17,000. The woman who is in charge of the residence outside the hospital in Germany where virtually everyone is airlifted to first out of Iraq is the one who gave that figure. I had thought I had read that the number was lower. Anyone know for certain?
Tena | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 12:35 pm | #

cont'd

. CNN has run other Bush stump speeches uncut and/or as "news" without the same uncritical exposure for Kerry's appearances. (Bush speaks for himself and his audience faithful's reactions left in, Kerry's often paraphrased by a CNN shill, often shown in talked-over video, and in much shorter clips.)

CNN persistently uses pro-Bush weighted Gallup polls and pro-Bush "objective" poll analysts like AEI-robot Bill Schneider who misrepresent Bush's likeability, popularity, and viability as a candidate.

I'm not sure whether consumer voices are being heard for this upcoming FCC report, or how pressure can be applied at least to get fair coverage before the election, but CNN should be part of this target for fair coverage.
Peanut | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 12:36 pm | #

...it really reeks of desperation.

The most telling characterisitic of the whole Bush campaign is exactly that.

Let's face it. All georgie can use in his speeches anymore is faked, outraged nonsense involving some part of a Kerry statement that has been totally taken out of context.

How pathetic is that?
pie | 10.12.04 - 12:37 pm | #

Shut the POW's up!!!!! Their voices should not be heard. What have they done for this country?

Like, say, John McCain?

You're right. This is all about silencing the POW's. Lord knows, they haven't yet had a chance to make their views on Kerry's Vietnam War protests known.

The Swift boat ad controversy. The best-selling book (well, on some lists it still is, if not the NYT), Unfit for Command. And now this brouhaha.

Yup. Nobody's listening to this group of POW's. That Kerry, he's got the U.S. media on a very strict lockdown.

Meanwhile, he's forcing every TV station in the country to run "F 9/11" continuously. Why, I have to turn to FoxNews to get some relief from the voice of Michael Moore.
Robert M. Jeffers | 10.12.04 - 12:39 pm | #

Large Marge

See what I mean? Completely immature. Hardly worth addressing, let alone able to persuade anyone they've got a sensible point to make.

Why should we care what War Criminals have to say? Oh wait, that's right, the Vietnam War was only Nazi because Kerry, the One Man Wermacht, fought in it. Every other POW was an angel in comparision.

*rolls eyes*

Pathetic, absolutely pathetic...
America's Nemesis | 10.12.04 - 12:39 pm | #

Kerry's anti-war activism is a strength, not a weakness, especially since he first of all volunteered for Vietnam and for dangerous duty, and served honorably and bravely. He spoke then, and speaks now, from experience--and from a position of courage in both cases (serving in the war, later criticizing it). I wish, in his "reporting for duty" speech at the DNC in Boston, he had emphasized BOTH his military service and his anti-war activism, and had stressed the patriotism of both. It's unfortunate that he did not, because it left him open to just such an attack as this (and his advisors should have anticipated this!).

It's a difficult question whether Kerry should accept Sinclair's invitation. It reminds me very much of John Kennedy's acceptance of Baptist Convention invitation in TX in 1960, to rebut charges about his Catholicism (that he would be run by the Pope)--which Kennedy handled very effectively. Kerry is not as good a speaker, nor nearly as slick as Kennedy--but he could probably handle such a appearance quite well.

The trouble is that Sinclair (with probably Karl Rove behind it) appears to be laying a trap, to make this election about Vietnam and NOT about Iraq. So, if Kerry accepts, the news will be dominated with Kerry defense of his anti-war activities, which of course the corporate media is prepared to spin against him.

I don't think this film (whatever it says) will change many (or any) minds. It's probably meant to shore up Bush Inc. base, which is eroding due to fiscal irresponsibility and Halliburton corruption. However, I believe it is true that the Swiftboat Liars, and NOT the stupid Republican Convention, were responsible for Bush post-convention bounce.

Upshot: Kerry needs to issue a simple statement about his military service and anti-war work (willing to serve, willing to criticize--both patriotic), and otherwise ignore the Sinclair film, AND THEN he needs to CALL BUSH ON THE CARPET in the last debate about Republican HARM TO THE MILITARY by questioning his medals, Bush failure to disavow it, and other such issues re: Swiftboat Liars. Bush is in fact the most ANTI-MILITARY president we have ever had!
Peace Patriot | 10.12.04 - 12:40 pm | #

Large Marge:
POWs?
If there are any Murkins left over in SE Asia since 1975, they're volunteers, you great blue ho'...

Tom Robbins takes up the matter in his latest novel, Villa Incognito: People have the right to choose which shit-hole they'll occupy, and our's isn't even the second-most appealing ... thanks in large part to the likes of Marge...Thinking of you as a country'man' makes my sphincter loose...I just wanna take a huge dump...
Konopelli | 10.12.04 - 12:40 pm | #

Why does Large Marge hate John McCain?
Thumb | 10.12.04 - 12:40 pm | #

large marge, im gonna bust yer Hymen.
Anonymous | 10.12.04 - 12:41 pm | #

Especially because you're the only person here at Eschaton who thinks this way!

[smiles like a Kzin]

Ya think?
kelley b. | 10.12.04 - 12:41 pm | #

The best argument for a draft is the 101st Fighting Keyboardists. Squeaky is draft age, isn't he? And why hasn't he joined right up already?
Tena | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 12:41 pm | #

Kerry claimed to be a war criminal and admitted to atrocities.

I didn't accuse him of being one.

I merely accept him at his word when Kerry admitted that he had committed war crimes.

America is fascist and our military does behave like the SS...they take and follow inhumane and atrocious orders.
FactCheck | 10.12.04 - 12:41 pm | #

Why does Large Marge hate John McCain?

Why doesn't John McCain hate John Kerry?
pie | 10.12.04 - 12:42 pm | #

Well said, Tena. It's all about the cognitive dissonance and false dichotomies.
max | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 12:43 pm | #

Let's face it. All georgie can use in his speeches anymore is faked, outraged nonsense involving some part of a Kerry statement that has been totally taken out of context.

How pathetic is that?

pie--

I honestly think he reached the frayed end of that rope during the second debate. The vaunted "Shrub charm" didn't seem to work on Midwesterners (spent 4 years among them, a Southern boy in a foreign land; I know the look they were giving him).

Clearly he's decided to tie a knot in it, and hang on for his political life. But I don't think it's gonna work. His support is eroding down to only his fanatical base, the one that thinks Bush has kept the elephants away, and the best thing for U.S. foreign policy is to nuke Foggy Bottom.

Beyond that, I think the momentum is turning fast for Kerry. Couldn't come at a better time, either.
Robert M. Jeffers | 10.12.04 - 12:43 pm | #

Let's have a vote:

WHO HERE besides kelly b. THINK PRES. KERRY WILL HOLD BUSH & CHENEY & OTHER TOP LEADERS ACCOUNTABLE FOR WAR CRIMES AND/OR WILL COOPERATE WITH WORLD COURTS WHO WILL DO LIKEWISE?
B honest. | 10.12.04 - 12:43 pm | #

Large Marge was considering getting breast implants, and decided to get her husbands opinion.

"You don't need breast implants", her hubbie exclaimed. "Just wad up some toilet paper and rub it between your breasts."

"And what good will that do?" asked Large Marge.

"Well", her husband replied, "I don't know, but it seems to have worked wonders on your ass."
Central Scrutinizer | 10.12.04 - 12:44 pm | #

Rove must have the whole staff on for the next two weeks.

It'll be like shooting fish in a barrel with the water running out.

Got your post-election job cleaning toilets for DynCorp lined up yet? Good luck with that. They're one of the Company agencies we're going after next after Kerry wins.
kelley b. | 10.12.04 - 12:45 pm | #

Yo, fuckwitz:
Kerry claimed to be a war criminal and admitted to atrocities.

I do not suppose you can actually supply a link to the source of such a provocative assertion, can you?

Otherwise, shut the fuck up, dickwipe, and go crawl back up Karl Rove's asshole...
Konopelli | 10.12.04 - 12:45 pm | #

Kerry claimed to be a war criminal and admitted to atrocities.

Whereas Bush can only admit he's made some bad appointments. Which means the mistakes were made by others, not by him. He thought he made a mistake once. But he was wrong.

Who to vote for? Who to vote for?

Gee, that's a tough one.....
Robert M. Jeffers | 10.12.04 - 12:46 pm | #

FactCheck

Ahhh, so you aren't a POW now? I suppose that's one way of avoiding admitting that you yourself must have been a Nazi by your own logic.

But a little clue for you; admitting that you are basically a lying weasally son of a bitch doesn't actually strengthen your already terrible arguments... but actually makes them even less credible.

Seriously now, why do you bother? Everyone can see it's you doing a parody of what you think is an extreme left wing viewpoint, even if you weren't so imbalanced that you'd already shot yourself in your foot with your "Left-wingers" comments. So why are you bothering to try and keep the pretense up?
America's Nemesis | 10.12.04 - 12:46 pm | #

RMJ, I think that when it's all over, and Kerry's been democratically installed in the Oval Office, everyone's going to look back and realize (if they don't already) that georgie's performance in that first debate was the defining moment of the whole campaign. He lost it right there.
pie | 10.12.04 - 12:47 pm | #

There's only one way the GOPuke bushista fascisti will ever be held accountable, and that is if we--the People--take matters into our own hands...I'll be in the vanguard of that effort, folks. Let's get it started...
Konopelli | 10.12.04 - 12:47 pm | #

Hey, Kuntopelli, choke on this blueshirt:

(Videotape of MEET THE PRESS, April 18, 1971):

MR. KERRY (Vietnam Veterans Against the War): There are all kinds of atrocities and I would have to say that, yes, yes, I committed the same kind of atrocities as thousands of other soldiers have committed in that I took part in shootings in free-fire zones. I conducted harassment and interdiction fire. I used 50-caliber machine guns which we were granted and ordered to use, which were our only weapon against people. I took part in search-and-destroy missions, in the burning of villages. All of this is contrary to the laws of warfare. All of this is contrary to the Geneva Conventions and all of this ordered as a matter of written established policy by the government of the United States from the top down. And I believe that the men who designed these, the men who designed the free-fire zone, the men who ordered us, the men who signed off the air raid strike areas, I think these men, by the letter of the law, the same letter of the law that tried Lieutenant Calley, are war criminals.

(End videotape)

MR. RUSSERT: You committed atrocities.

SEN. KERRY: Where did all that dark hair go, Tim? That's a big question for me.
Anonymous | 10.12.04 - 12:49 pm | #

It'll be like shooting fish in a barrel with the water running out

pie | 10.12.04 - 12:49 pm | #

pie--

agreed. Nixon's "Five o'clock shadow." Reagan's "There you go again." And Bush's uncontrollable facial tics, squints, squirms, illogical answers, "Let me finish!,"....

Well, where to start, huh?
Robert M. Jeffers | 10.12.04 - 12:50 pm | #

The vaunted "Shrub charm" didn't seem to work on Midwesterners (spent 4 years among them, a Southern boy in a foreign land; I know the look they were giving him).

They don't call Missouri the 'Show-Me State' for nuttin'.
anonymous in nc | 10.12.04 - 12:50 pm | #

Konopelli and Central, you two young men have a poo poo fetish dont you.
Large Marge | 10.12.04 - 12:51 pm | #

This article by Michael Tomasky in the current American Prospect really says it all:

http://tinyurl.com/4sfh2

The fact that we are arguing about this is just really fucking sad.
park | 10.12.04 - 12:52 pm | #

So, who think Kerry will hold Bush personally accountable for war crimes?
Just asking. | 10.12.04 - 12:52 pm | #

Had anyone else seen that Sinclair is claiming that they are only responding to the other networks allowing Michael Moore a 3 hour special to interview people and show exerpts from F911? I know I heard that right after the last debate, but now it seems to have been dumped down the memory hole.
Jay | 10.12.04 - 12:52 pm | #

Squeaky is too old for the draft, but not too old to encourage other people to go fight.
http://littlegreenfootballs.com
/about/bio_charles.gif
He seems to have given up his 'web-design' business in favor of hate-mongering. He spends all his time scouring the web for anything he can spin as 'anti-jew' or 'anti-israeli'. He also loves posting pictures of dead Palestinians.
Anonymous | 10.12.04 - 12:52 pm | #

Sinclair's Hyman is a closet homo and hypocrite.
Steve | 10.12.04 - 12:54 pm | #

The iconic picture from the campaign will be the one of Bush's back at the first debate, with the mysterious rectangle. Whether wired or not, he looks like a loser in that pic and you can practically see the door hitting him on his way out.
underwhelm | 10.12.04 - 12:55 pm | #

Well, it doesn't undo what Mr. Kerry said, but let's allow the Senator to complete his answer:

SEN. KERRY: Where did all that dark hair go, Tim? That's a big question for me. You know, I
thought a lot, for a long time, about that period of time, the things we said, and I think the word is a bad word. I think it's an inappropriate word. I mean, if you wanted to ask me have you ever made mistakes in your life, sure. I think some of the language that I used was a language that reflected an anger. It was honest, but it was in anger, it was a little bit excessive.

MR. RUSSERT: You used the word "war criminals."

SEN. KERRY: Well, let me just finish. Let me must finish. It was, I think, a reflection of the kind of times we found ourselves in and I don't like it when I hear it today. I don't like it, but I want you to notice that at the end, I wasn't talking about the soldiers and the soldiers' blame, and my great regret is, I hope no soldier--I mean, I think some soldiers were angry at me for that, and I understand that and I regret that, because I love them. But the words were honest but on the other hand, they were a little bit over the top. And I think that there were breaches of the Geneva Conventions. There were policies in place that were not acceptable according to the laws of warfare, and everybody knows that. I mean, books have chronicled that, so I'm not going to walk away from that. But I wish I had found a way to say it in a less abrasive way.

It goes on a bit longer, admittedly. But the issue is more nuanced than a soundbite or an accusation would admit.

And I note, in his original statement, Kerry lays heavy blame on the officers ordering the men to do what Kerry said was done. Kinda like Abu Ghraib again, huh?

Second note: Kerry is man enough to admit mistakes, even mistakes he made as a young man with a slightly more fiery tongue. So again, I have to ask: who to vote for? who to vote for?

Decision, decisions......
Robert M. Jeffers | 10.12.04 - 12:55 pm | #

Let's see, hmmm - should I choose an actual decorated American hero with 2 bronze stars and a silver star? Or should I go with a draft dodging deserter who spent the same years getting drunk and arrested over and over and finally had to flee the state of Texas to avoid prosecution, who completely ignored serious warnings of an imminent attack on the U.S. and when it happened fled all over the country to avoid any personal danger? What to do, what to do...
Tena | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 12:56 pm | #

And here comes the coprophilia comments once more; add that to the synchronistic trolling from 1 person who claims to be arguing seriously, and 1 person who is pretending to be far more simple (this time it's Large Marge), mix in a little obvious Green Matryr Psychosis, and what do we get?

Why, hello again America's Memory.
America's Nemesis | 10.12.04 - 12:56 pm | #

FactCheck is actually Fat Chick is actually Large Marge. See, Karl's Kool Kidz use puns! Fucksticks.
anonymous in nc | 10.12.04 - 12:57 pm | #

Had anyone else seen that Sinclair is claiming that they are only responding to the other networks allowing Michael Moore a 3 hour special to interview people and show exerpts from F911?

My TV viewing seldom extends beyond TDS w/JS, and Adult Swim (now the truth can be told!), so I have to ask: did this happen? Or was it canned?

I never heard anything about it.
Robert M. Jeffers | 10.12.04 - 12:57 pm | #

Could there be any way to take the energy of the Sinclair story and build on it to attack the corporatism of media in general as a disservice to the American people? That might also be a good tactic; put fear into them so the rest of the bloody crew might also tell Sinclair to back off.
Anonymous | 10.12.04 - 12:57 pm | #

Can we take time out from tearing hell out of Sinclair and the rest of the fascist right to consider this little nugget from BushLand? Faith-based health care - it'll give you gooseflesh ...

http://www.detnews.com/2004/metr.../b01- 298475.htm
megisi | 10.12.04 - 12:58 pm | #

Too bad Pat Paulson isn't still alive....
Barndog | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 12:58 pm | #

should I go with a draft dodging deserter who spent the same years getting drunk and arrested over and over and finally had to flee the state of Texas to avoid prosecution, who completely ignored serious warnings of an imminent attack on the U.S. and when it happened fled all over the country to avoid any personal danger

...or should I vote for the self-confessed war criminal who enabled the drunk to do what he did and has stated that he would enable the same drunk to do the same damn thing even if there were no WMD's?

So difficult.

I think neither will do fine.
Anonymous | 10.12.04 - 12:58 pm | #

By any objective calculus, the Vietnam war was one huge war crime. Every USer who fought there--myself included--is therefore culpable in the commission of that crime. We were invited into Nam the same way the Germans were 'invited' into the Sudetenland...

By definition, then, whether in self-defense or in a purely aggressive mode, anyone who killed a Vietnamese citizen--Cong, NVA, or civilian--committed a war crime; in precisely the same way that soldiers (and even more so the mercenary 'contractors') killing Iraqis are ALSO war criminals. It is, in fact, this very culpability and complicity which underwrites the denial afflicting the Swift-boats fuckwitz. Like the Preznit, these casual killers cannot acknowledge their own mistakes, and are therefore condemned to stew in their own viciousness...

Now you may go eat shit and die, okay?
Konopelli | 10.12.04 - 12:59 pm | #

Kerry is man enough to send others to make the same mistakes and ruin and kill innocent lives.

AND HE WANTS MORE SOLDIERS THAN BUSH HAS!

What a man!

What a war criminal!

Just admit it...Kerry was honest when he said he committed atrocities.
Anonymous | 10.12.04 - 1:02 pm | #

Thanks for admitting that you are a war criminal, Konopelli!

That explains your adled judgment.
Anonymous | 10.12.04 - 1:03 pm | #

See, kelly b., nobody else here expects Kerry to do a good goddamn thing when it comes to holding Bush criminally responsible, or anyone else for that matter.

How could he when Kerry's a self-confessed war criminal himself?

By this logic Bush can't enforce the nation's laws, since he has been convicted of violating them himself (DUI's, at least).

Will Kerry hold Bush responsible? I doubt it, but only because the national mood is not to punish Bush. Such high profile prosecutions usually serve a public, not just a judicial, purpose. It would be just, but it would be labelled "partisan" and "political." The same poobahs who know worry about "another Florida" were, in 2000, telling us all not to worry about Florida, to act as if it never happened. They would tut-tut over Kerry's attempt to prosecute Bush, too.

And the controversy would swamp any legislative effort Kerry ever made. And it might well put us on the course to a true Roman government, where every new ruler tries to destroy his predecessor. Too many bad precedents involved for Kerry to go after Bush. Or Cheney, Rumsfeld, Wolfowitz, etc.

So that's why I think he won't do it. But it has nothing to do with his Congressional testimony 30 some odd years ago.
Robert M. Jeffers | 10.12.04 - 1:03 pm | #

I think neither will do fine.

Are you man enough, mature enough to withstand the disappointment when Kerry wins?
pie | 10.12.04 - 1:03 pm | #

Steve -- I get that vibe from Mark Hyman, too. Do you have evidence?
cs | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 1:04 pm | #

don't feed trolls, plz.
underwhelm | 10.12.04 - 1:04 pm | #

Should I vote for Kerry, a self-confessed war criminal, or Bush, the war-criminal Kerry enabled and would enable again?

Why bother chosing?

You lose either way.
Anonymous | 10.12.04 - 1:04 pm | #

OK Anon, you've convinced me, I'll vote for Nader.

When hell freezes over.
Central Scrutinizer | 10.12.04 - 1:04 pm | #

I think neither will do fine.

If that were the choice presented.

Personally, I'd love a "none of the above" vote, which would suspend the incumbent and force a new election with new candidates, on, say, a six week deadline.

But that's not the choice. To not choose, is to choose.

Acting otherwise is grossly irresponsible, and frankly, naive.
Robert M. Jeffers | 10.12.04 - 1:05 pm | #

(partisanly) alleged war criminal or actual criminal? what to do what to do...

How many times has George W Bush been arrested?
Tena | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 1:05 pm | #

pie - I HOPE KERRY WINS!

The Kerry Depression!

The Kerry Draft!

The Kerry Defeat in Iraq!

That will be so great for the Democratic Party to have to wear!

Please, please force Kerry to have to go down in history as the Depression President who Drafted Americans to be Defeated in Iraq...

PLEASE!
Anonymous | 10.12.04 - 1:06 pm | #

How could he when Kerry's a self-confessed war criminal himself?

Or maybe there's a couple of complications, things like precedence and standards of evidence, Kerry will be unlikely to want to compromise and which could only further destabilize the checks and balances in the system as it currently...

But that's too complicated for your little lettuce mind to understand, isn't it? You prefer simplistic, self-persuading solutions, like voting for Nader makes you a better person, or thinking that somehow trying to control your obessional focus upon individuals here will convince people that it's not you again, despite showing all of your other usual traits too...

There's a reason why nobody is debating you seriously or honestly. I've already told it you today. You been told it for years now. Simply making up new trolling identities doesn't show that you are witty; it's shows only that you have an insanely pathological inability to learn.
America's Nemesis | 10.12.04 - 1:07 pm | #

So- when the Kerry Justice Department hauls James Bath before a Grand Jury, do you suppose he'll talk about how much the Bin Laden family paid Bu$hie to leave Osama alone?

Millions? Billions? Or just a lifetime supply of good toot?

If Bath could get the cash, he certainly has the connections...
kelley b. | 10.12.04 - 1:07 pm | #

NEWS FLASH:

Sylvan Learning Centers pulls ads from Sinclair stations.

from Kos.
Barndog | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 1:09 pm | #

Nemesis, you should invest your time explaining to kelly b. why she's dreaming when she gushes about the Kerry Justice Dept. bringing James Bath or Bush or anyone to justice.

Apparently she just won't learn!
Anonymous | 10.12.04 - 1:09 pm | #

Goodness alone is never enough. A hard cold wisdom is required, too, for goodness to accomplish good. Goodness without wisdom invariably accomplishes evil.
As Jubel always said, "the slickest way to lie is to tell the right amount of truth - then to shut up."
michael valentine smith | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 1:10 pm | #

(partisanly) alleged war criminal or actual criminal? what to do what to do...

Tena, you obviously mean Bush in the first instance and Kerry in the second...

or don't you believe that Kerry was honest when he said he committed war crimes?

Why does Tena hate Kerry?
Anonymous | 10.12.04 - 1:11 pm | #

Anonymous (America's Memory), if you think anyone here is going to listen to your cries about the sky falling, you're out of your mind. Your poor little deluded self believes only the worst and predicts only the most dire consequences. You hate with a passion that has consumed and destroyed you. Same old recycled arguments again and again. The election is three weeks away, and for all your efforts, you've never been able to convince anyone that you are right. How frustrating that must be for you.

I almost feel sorry for you. Almost.
pie | 10.12.04 - 1:13 pm | #

Who is America's Memory? Oh, wait, it's just delusional old lady pie and her inability to distinguish between people she disagrees with.

Yup, 3 weeks until America elects Bush for the first time and thereby earn the world's scorn.

Or we elect Kerry and watch the Democratic Party go down in history as the Depression Draft Defeat Party.

I think both outcomes are super!

Be sure to vote!
Anonymous | 10.12.04 - 1:16 pm | #

You left out the best part. He also claimed news of car bombings as being pro kerry reports.
Steve | 10.12.04 - 1:16 pm | #

Ken Doll Hemmer asked if the attack ad could be considered an "in-kind" contribution, the SOB from Sinclair said "... every car bomb in Iraq could be considered an in-king contribution to Kerry." And this was AFTER he said Sinclair had no bias!
stjohnixx | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 1:17 pm | #

I just heard the "Holocaust deniers " comment from Hyman on CNN. These guys just keep digging themselves a deeper hole with bazar comments like that. LMAO!
wolf-man | 10.12.04 - 1:18 pm | #

Anonymous = chicken little.

You lose. Too bad.

pie | 10.12.04 - 1:18 pm | #

Oh, wait. When does the part where your parents died come in? And, more specifically, which time?
Barndog | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 1:18 pm | #

To be a criminal, one must have been convicted in a court of law; not merely in one's own conscience.

Bush has a criminal record. Kerry has not been convicted of any war crimes. He confessed to non-specific activities which he alleged were illegal. He has since recounted the language he used, but not necessarily retracted the sentiment.

All of which is, actually, totally irrelevant: Bush's criminal record, and Kerry's public mea culpa. Except as the latter has apparently outraged Vietnam Veterans, and inspired the Sinclair group.

Otherwise, who cares? Precious few people, judging from the polls. And precious few agree with Sinclair, judging from their stock, and the stories of advertisers pulling away from their stations.

This will all be over soon. I think smarty jones was right; Sinclair will pull the ad, scream "censorship!", and only the hardcore Bush base will pay attention.
Robert M. Jeffers | 10.12.04 - 1:19 pm | #

NEWS FLASH:

Sylvan Learning Centers pulls ads from Sinclair stations.

Excellent! Next?
pie | 10.12.04 - 1:19 pm | #

American Atrocities

http://www.villagevoice.com/issu.../0419/ turse.php
Anonymous | 10.12.04 - 1:23 pm | #

Sorry (almost) to pop your bubble Anon trollie, but I'm a man, pie is definitely not old, and we all know she's certainly not Americas Memory.

I got to get back to work, gang. See you later!

And thanks for the , pie.

You know what I mean
kelley b. | 10.12.04 - 1:23 pm | #

Having a tough time finding your nitro pills through all that rage?
Barndog | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 1:23 pm | #

Thanks for admitting that you are a war criminal, Konopelli!

Where as you just lied and claimed to be one, didn't you "POW", because you wanted to be like John Kerry too? Or at least, the John Kerry and the millions like him you claim exist in the US Armed Forces, in which you supposedly served...

*sighs*

Don't you realise how insane you are? You can't even act convincing, much less appear it. And what's more... You've addressed almost everyone else on this thread now, except curiously me. Why, it's almost as if there was a prior history between us... but surely not, when good old honest "POW" has only turned up today!

*sighs again*

Haven't you worked out yet that the way I can spot you now is how you try and pyscopathically avoid refering to me, after I made such a fool of you last time? I've even illustrated that in one of my little dancing parables; it doesn't matter how much the flat footed, spotty idiot stands by the wall and stares at the ceiling, he's not going to convince everyone that he isn't still obsessed with the dance, because he's proving it by how much he has to determinedly pretend he doesn't care.

Can't you even recall that the reason you had to stop using "electionthief" was not only because I pointed out your insane illogicallity under that name too, how you couldn't keep your beliefs coherant, but also how eventually after many, many posts you finally had to admit you were deliberately avoiding me because "Arguing with you is boring" except... why you'd recently claimed to have never argued with me before! And here you are again, obviously here to pick a fight with everyone... except for me. And it's obvious. You've gone from dementedly obessesing about myself, Pie and others to trying to obsessively avoid refering to others; oh, the mask slips a little here and there... The "Blueshirt" comment, the focus on two other posters and poo poo, but even so, we can all still recognise the same basic obsession behind the actions as we've seen all along.

You are a joke, a sad laughable joke of a man, and everyone get's the punchline except for you it seems. Come on now, be honest like you claim to be here; just admit that you are driven by nothing more than hatred for this site. Of course, doing that would mean that you would become even more alienated from any kind of influence here than you already are; but when you've had nearly 2 years and still not influenced a single person positively, what's the point of even hanging on? Just admit honestly that you are a disgusting, deceitful little shit, and for fucks sake let it all go and try and do something more worthwhile with your life...
America's Nemesis | 10.12.04 - 1:25 pm | #

If Kerry claims to have committed atrocities, I take him at his word.

Why don't you Mr. Jeffers?

Is Bush a criminal? Yes.

Does Bush have poor judgment? Yes.

So why did Kerry not only trust him once and enable him to order more war crimes but said he would enable him to do it again even if there were no WMD?

Kerry is a loser for trusting loser Bush.

Neither is fit to lead.

Either one will suffer if they win as the Depression/Draft/Defeat in Iraq President.

Why do you wish that on Kerry?

Why does Robert hate Kerry?
Anonymous | 10.12.04 - 1:25 pm | #

Okay, I was just kidding.

John Kerry NEVER committed atrocities...

and he was lying when he said he did.
Better? | 10.12.04 - 1:27 pm | #

I like that America's Nemesis is feeding trolls with lettuce minds and cheeto-encrusted asses. Har....
hopeless spinster | 10.12.04 - 1:28 pm | #

CS--I'll see what I can do to prove it, it shouldn't be too hard.

Evidently sexual indiscretion is the norm at Sinclair.
Steve | 10.12.04 - 1:28 pm | #

OT, but Peanut touched on an important point. A hell of a lot of important government business is being put off until after the election: Most of the appropriations bills, raising the debt ceiling, finalizing the budget and let's not forget the anticipated post-election military offensive in Iraq.
Fed up | 10.12.04 - 1:33 pm | #

Is this crap about David D. Smith having been picked up for public lewd acts (getting a blow job) from a hooker in Baltimore really true?

If so, why don't we bombard media with e-mails about it, that oughtta stop the airing of this PIG FILM right quick.
Doug in Virginia | 10.12.04 - 1:37 pm | #

Hahahaha - yeah, I hate Kerry; I prefer a draft dodging drunkard and cokehead criminal names George W Bush. Oh wait, that's who you are supporting. LOL.

But you are such a waste of time and energy that I'm ignoring you after this and from now on.
Tena | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 1:38 pm | #

Ahah! I stand corrected! He's well and truly off his meds tonight... here comes the obesession with myself and Pie after all!

So let the madness continue!

Oh, wait, it's just delusional old lady pie and her inability to distinguish between people she disagrees with.

This is why no one takes you seriously. Because you are insane. Look at you, lecturing people here about intelligence and honesty and standards... but you are too obsessional and arrogant to even read this thread properly; It was ME who pointed out who you were first, NOT PIE. Pie is simply repeating what I had previously said.

*guffaw guffaw*

Man, you are seriously stupid. But why doesn't anyone take you seriously?! After all, you may just be some insane, obsessional, lying, false *ahem* Memory creating, spotty teenage kid, and they may have actually lived the political experiences years ago you claim they should be embracing now, but damn it, you are the Self Declared Prophet of Eschaton, your word is Holy Writ, how dare they ignore what you say...!

*guffaws some more*
America's Nemesis | 10.12.04 - 1:38 pm | #

SINCLAIR MEDIA ADVERTISERS BOYCOTT

here is my boycott list for local adverstisers on Sinclair Media owned stations in Pittsburgh area:

(this list is culled from approximately THIRTY ads that ran during the one hour of "News" Central last night on WB22--Sinclair also owns Fox53 here, which runs the same news at 10, except last night there was baseball.)

Local Ad Buys (one each

1. Law Offices of Gail Suhr & Micheal Weiss 412.343.0300

2. Edgar Snyder, Attorney
www.edgarsnyder.com

3. "Shootz" Billiards Bar on Southside

4. Empire Today carpet store
800.588.2300

5. Pittsburgh Used Car Source instant credit hotline 438.2777

6. LiveLinks Singles Network
210.1010

7. HighMark Blue Cross & Blue Shield Health Insurance

(so, cheap carpets, car loan scams, sex phone lines, bars, health insurance and well-known "ambulance-chaser" law firms...i am sensing a theme here!)

National Ad Buys:

1. Movie: Disney's "Incredibles"
2. Movie "The Grudge"

3. Honda Accord LX Sedan
4. Nissan Altima
5. KIA Sedona

6. Subway Sandwich Shops (that one makes me sad!)

the remaining ads, some 20 or so, were ALL for the local WB22 station programming, or for the national WB programs--over and over and OVER again, with one ad for a Fox53 show--they must have gotten the two stations mixed up? who knows. in any case, i was ready to stab out my own eyes with a plastic fork!

anyway, that was an hour of SHEER and TOTAL hell. they have ONE local woman anchor type, who got maybe 10 minutes total of "local" newsreading time, mostly one-sentence stories, and one or two stock photo shots. there was also 10 minutes spent with a local sportscaster, doing actual sports, with real interviews and video. they did three weather spots (two of which were the exact SAME footage repeated, i swear, and all of which were national feed, with almost no detail locally.)the rest of the time was their national News Central feed dude, letting Hyman call people "Holocaust deniers," telling me that gas prices were actually higher under Carter than they are today, some Pro-Bush and some Kerry snarking, and some throw-away stories from places i don't care about around the country--some with that anonymous guy outside someplace footage that is supposed to make you think it is local--which i ESPECIALLY LOATH.

now, one more interesting thing i noticed:

no non-white people of any variety on camera.

and only three women--the local anchor, the News Central weather girl, and the News Central "Health/Consumer" reports girl (the News Central anchor is a white male, the PGH sports guy is a white male, all the people covering "news stories"--all of which were feed, were white males.)

interesting "mix" of people, huh? not exactly what i'd say would be representative of the people they broadcast to here in my city.

oh yeah--on "Get This" i also learned that PA. Senator Rick "Man on Dog" Santorum has been honored with the coveted "
Librarian | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 1:46 pm | #

It would be good to be a bit cautious. Clearly this is an extrordinary case, but the club will be pick up by the right for the most trivial, as was the case when Clinton was beat on by Ken Starr abusing the special prosecutor laws.

Having started down this path, which I agree is necessary, be prepared to defend others when they are abused by the right.
Eli Rabett | 10.12.04 - 1:47 pm | #

(woops! lost my last, and best, item!)

*

on News Central "Get This" i also learned that PA. Senator Rick "Man on Dog" Santorum has been honored with the coveted "Hero of the Taxpayers" Award--by the Grover Norquist people! must be for those national sales/flat tax bills, huh? huh?! (AAAAARGHHHHHHH, it burnssesss ussss, it freezessss! NASSSSTY bad humansesss!)

okay, Librarian needs to go swimming in a vat of whisky now...to get clean again.

-L.
Librarian | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 1:48 pm | #

From Gadflyer.com, some larger Sinclair food and beverage advertisers...
Applebees (ca.diraimp@applebees.com),
Corona Beer (procermexlt@corona-extra.com,
Macaroni Grill, Chili's Restaurants
(investor.relations@brinker.com),
Dr. Pepper, 7-Up
(consumer_relations@dpsu.com),
Pepsi Cola, Mountain Dew
(boardofdirectors@pepsi.com),
Sonic Drive-in Restaurants
(sonicpr@sonicdrive-in.com)
Proctor and Gamble - - Pringles, Eagle Snacks, Folgers
(Talbot.cg@pg.com),
Taco Bell
(Amy.Sherwood@Yum.com)

Sic'em!
Keith | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 1:50 pm | #

Is this crap about David D. Smith having been picked up for public lewd acts (getting a blow job) from a hooker in Baltimore really true?

Doug, see Atrios's last post yesterday. It's true.
pie | 10.12.04 - 1:51 pm | #

Someone posted that Applebees has also withdrawn ads.
pie | 10.12.04 - 1:52 pm | #

Eli - be cautious, kind of like the Right was cautious when it pressured the network to pull the Reagan bio-pic? LOL

God you guys couldn't be any more transparent if you reallly really tried.
Tena | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 2:07 pm | #

More Republican love for the simple darkies.

Posted on Wed, Jan. 08, 2003

Oakland's Reeves rips GOP racism

State Republican official's e-mail to board members says that blacks 'provide window dressing'

By Daniel Borenstein

TIMES POLITICAL EDITOR

The highest ranking African-American in the California Republican Party on Tuesday condemned the racism he has endured working for the GOP.

"Black Republicans are expected to provide window dressing and cover to prove that this is not a racist party, yet our own leadership continues to act otherwise," party Secretary Shannon Reeves wrote in an e-mail to party board members.

His comments were sparked by news last week that Vice Chairman Bill Back had circulated an electronic newsletter in 1999 containing an article by someone else suggesting that the nation would have been better off if the South had won the Civil War.

Reeves, an Oakland businessman, called on Back to drop his bid for party chairman in next month's election at the state GOP convention. Back is running against Silicon Valley attorney Duf Sundheim.

Electing Back "would take the CRP beyond the point of repair with voters in a pluralistic state ... and doom us to irrelevance," Reeves wrote.

Back will not drop out, spokesman Darrel Ng said. "Bill has spent many, many years working to broaden the party. He's not going to give up now. He's in for the long haul."

Meanwhile, two key Republicans said some leaders are trying to draft former Secretary of State Bill Jones to run.

"It's been discussed at high levels," said one Republican. "If Jones comes in, these two guys are going to have to bow out. He's going to be the unifying candidate."

Reeves, who said he would not make an endorsement in the chairmanship race, had previously condemned the controversial newsletter. His comments Tuesday went beyond the election to the racism he perceives in the party.

He said "the time has come" for Republican leaders to understand what he has had to endure.

"When I travel to speak at Republican conferences and events around the country, wandering through hotels, convention centers and social clubs, as I approach the rooms where I'm scheduled to speak, I am often told by Republicans that I must be in the wrong place," he wrote.

"As a Bush delegate at the 2000 convention in Philadelphia, I proudly wore my delegate's badge and (Republican National Committee) lapel pin as I worked the convention. Regardless of the fact that I was obviously a delegate prominently displaying my credentials, no less than six times did white delegates dismissively tell me (to) fetch them a taxi or carry their luggage."

Reeves praised President Bush for bringing diversity to his administration.

He "has set the example," Reeves wrote. "It is up to the California Republican Party to follow."

Craig DeLuz, chairman of the California Black Republican Council, supports Back.

"I don't think he's bigo
Chris Tucker | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 2:09 pm | #

To. Doug In Virginia

Here is the link to the arrest of Mr. Smith.

http://atrios.blogspot.com/2004/...0/ sinclair.html

Also, if you are close to Baltimore or know anyone there, head the call.

Calling All Baltimoreans

Or whatever you call yourselves. Sam Seder had a great idea on Majority Report tonight. Someone needs to go wherever one goes to find these things, and try to locate the mug shot of Sinclair CEO David Smith, from his 1996 arrest. It happened on or about August 13, 1996...
-Atrios 10:35 PM
Steve | 10.12.04 - 2:09 pm | #

(foo! I thought it'd sneak in under the character limit. Here's the rest)

"I don't think he's bigoted. I just think the issues of the black community are not a priority with him or with the rest of the Republican Party," he said.

DeLuz said he, like Reeves, has been frustrated by the state party's refusal to work on projects to help urban communities.

DeLuz said he has not experienced the same overt racism Reeves describes.

"But I respect Shannon, and if Shannon says that's what he went through, I 100 percent believe that's what he's gone through." DeLuz said. "I don't question the validity of his statements at all."

Reach Daniel Borenstein at 925-943-8248 or dborenstein@cctimes.com.
Chris Tucker | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 2:11 pm | #

Wow, how is this not being broadcast all over the place? This will discredit them faster than anything else, so we can get back to the real issues--why Bush has f--ked up the country and the World...

But it is yet another example of the values of the right-wing, so hearty and wholesome....
Doug in Virginia | 10.12.04 - 2:16 pm | #

Here it is:

FCC COMMISSIONER STATEMENT ON SINCLAIR AIRING OF ANTI-KERRY SHOW
Tue Oct 12 2004 13:39:02 ET

FCC COMMISSIONER COPPS CRITICIZES SINCLAIR CORPORATE DECISION TO PREEMPT LOCAL STATIONS FOR POLITICAL BROADCAST

Commissioner Michael J. Copps reacted to reports that Sinclair Broadcast Group will preempt more than 60 local stations across the country to air an overtly political program in the days prior to the Presidential election.

Copps stated: “This is an abuse of the public trust. And it is proof positive of media consolidation run amok when one owner can use the public airwaves to blanket the country with its political ideology -- whether liberal or conservative. Some will undoubtedly question if this is appropriate stewardship of the public airwaves. This is the same corporation that refused to air Nightline’s reading of our war dead in Iraq. It is the same corporation that short-shrifts local communities and local jobs by distance-casting news and weather from hundreds of miles away. It is a sad fact that the explicit public interest protections we once had to ensure balance continue to be weakened by the Federal Communications Commission while it allows media conglomerates to get even bigger. Sinclair, and the FCC, are taking us down a dangerous road.”
Ensley | 10.12.04 - 2:22 pm | #

Found the Google cache of the above story about the black Republican delegate.

Share and enjoy!
Chris Tucker | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 2:25 pm | #

But that's too complicated for your little lettuce mind to understand, isn't it?

Yo. Lay off the lettuce motif, man ... these leaves are on your side.
Lettuce Prey | 10.12.04 - 2:25 pm | #

Bush should also be invited to participate.

Kerry should say that he will debate the swiftboaters, if Bush will debate Michael Moore.
Or some group who opposes his policies.

Throw it back at Sinclair and Bush.
Joy | 10.12.04 - 2:29 pm | #

Insiders and institutions have been dumping SBGI for the past 6 months.
Padlock | 10.12.04 - 2:31 pm | #

Morris Jones is high yeller and passes the paper bag test.
butterfly mcking | 10.12.04 - 2:36 pm | #

Nemesis, you should invest your time explaining to kelly b. why she's dreaming when she gushes about the Kerry Justice Dept. bringing James Bath or Bush or anyone to justice.

Just Google "Kerry BCCI" and you'll have enough reading material to answer your own question. I believe both before and after Kerry joined the Senate he specialized in bringing people to justice.

Now when I count to three and snap my fingers you're going to wake up.

One . . . two . . .
Thumb | 10.12.04 - 2:49 pm | #

Okay, let me see if I understand this guy's argument.

These people are complaining about something that happened, if it did, 30 years ago. They had 30 years to make their case, but didn't.

John Kerry has been the presumptive nominee since at least March of this year. These guys knew that he was going to be running for President at least since then. This show was not produced then.

John Kerry was nominated in July, and throughout August, the Swift Boat Liars basically had the airwaves to themselves, telling lies about Kerry's Vietnam records. These guys didn't join in.

The only time this show could be broadcast is on the eve of the election? Because they never had a chance to tell their story before? Because nobody would listen to anyone smearing Kerry's record before?

How damn stupid do they think we are?
Nora | 10.12.04 - 2:57 pm | #

Pardon me if anybody has made this point
upthread, but --

Holocaust deniers? I'm assuming Sinclair
has affiliates that have given Pat
Buchanan airtime recently.

Buchanan is a Holocaust denier.

WTF?
steve simels | 10.12.04 - 3:35 pm | #

Wonderful article about the Kerry's antiwar movement's effect (not) on POWs being held in Vietnam:

Why Truth Matters
http://tinyurl.com/3k8jg
Ensley | 10.12.04 - 3:53 pm | #

My e-mail to the rat bastards at Sinclair:

Are we never going to rid ourselves of the specter of the Viet Nam War?

It was wrong then and it's still wrong. It was a waste of 58,000 American lives and untold misery. There were countless wounded, both physically and emotionally.

We were lied to then and we're being lied to once again. There seems to be no conscience. The politicians weren't satisfied with the loss of all of those lives and history repeats itself.

Had it not been for the anti-war people, people who spoke out against the debacle, it would have gone on for another five, ten years! Is this what these professional Viet Nam vets wanted to happen? More lives lost?

How can any Viet Nam veteran worthy of that title support an arrogant, spoiled brat who was off getting high while they were over in Southeast Asia getting shot at? How can they trash a Viet Nam war hero?

These people are not vets, not heroes, but Bush's whores who have sold their honor and their souls.

And are they that self-centered that they WANT to see ANOTHER generation killed in ANOTHER unwinnable, senseless war?

God, what a disgrace. Is there no shame? Think of what you are doing in bringing all of this back, and for what?

One day there will be no young persons willing to fight for this nation because there will be generations of families who have been deceived.

A Democrat who has HAD it with the lies and the distortions!
Terry C | Homepage | 10.12.04 - 4:33 pm | #

Why not pool some bucks and have AL Gore's media group buy out sinclair and run F911 24 hours a day.
wowser | 10.12.04 - 5:18 pm | #

This issue isnt about SWIFT BOATS...
It about POWs and MIAs.
These sl;eazy asswipes are dredging up a couple dozen people who either were or were kin to POWs and they're gonna blame John Kerry for extending the war by being a sympathizer with the VietCong. If it airs, listen for a LOT of references to hanoi jane and Kerry alegedly laying a wreathon Ho's grave, and a lot of other repressed, nativist, jingoistic, racist, asshole shit...
Cuz a LOT of people feel REALLY guilty about the things they did in the Nam, the gratuitous shit, like slaughtering water buffalo just because they might be used by Charlie to harvest rice, but depriving a family and sometimes a whole village of the means of successful subsistence...
And that says nothing about the goatfuckers, running amok, killing everything and everybody insight, as happened in Danang on no few number of occasions, for example.

The Vietnam war poisoned us all, folks. There's only one cure, and that is to recognize your own complicity in the slaughter, in the crimes, in the terror WE inflicted, and accept that, whatever else you want to say about it--and it was a crime, though not on a par with the 10 million dead in SE Asia upon our retrea--on the cosmic scale, on 9/11, we had it coming...
WoodyGuthrie'sGuitar | 10.12.04 - 6:47 pm | #

The FCC has set up a special email address for complaints about Sinclair's plans. It's campaignlaw@fcc.gov
Lyn | 10.12.04 - 10:11 pm | #

What is happening to FREEDOM OF SPEECH?! The FCC has no right in deciding this issue being it involves truth and what poor representation by the FCC to our veterans those surviving and those who died for us protecting our freedom. Hanoi Jane and McMurray need to be stripped of their citizenship and deported along with all who share their views. This is America if you don't like it, LEAVE! I choose to believe in the ORIGINAL FIRST AMENDMENT not what was adopted by a judge in 1947, Everson vs School Board deciding he knew what was best for our nation. Good job judge. What a mess our country and courts are in today.My family and friends will be viewing Stolen Honor and thank God for all our veterans and may God continue to bless America.
Terri L. Gookenbarger | 10.25.04 - 10:51 am | #

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