I'MMA LET YOU FINISH
Yes!
heaven forbid we might uncover some funny business!
bastard corporate media.
my boycott started wednesday.
I would have left off the last two sentences. It's good that it leaked--we knew what they knew. If they're mad, it's because we're going "Hey, how did that happen?" Makes it harder for them to put one over on us. All hail leakers!
The voter fraud story is getting legs. Check out these two sites, especially the chart of exit polls vs. actual results, broken down by state and by voting method in the second link.
We ahve to push this story, and not just for Kerry, but for future elections.
http://www.newstarget.com/002076.html
http://img103.exs.cx/img103/4526...6/
exit_poll.gif
The first call on Diane Rehm today is about funny votes in Ohio and e-votes.
David Corn is on and he's rocking.
It's hard to keep the public in the dark with all you damn bloggers out there.
Now shut up and let the real journalists lick the anus of power.
It's all about access.
Welcome to the internets!
I completey forgot to mention. In the Boston areas free paper, The Metro, there was a brief article about this very thing. This site was mentioned as a prime offender.
Mad that the information was leaked? Find the leakers and fire them.
You are referring, exactly, to whom??? 
Off topic:
Guys, and gals, check out the cover of November 4th, Britain's Daily Mirror.
Click homepage.
I wish we could post this on the site in this forum, or Atrios could pick it up.
MYOB'
.
this election is not over!
Boy is Grover fat and happy lately. He's already given about 6 or 7 grover-quotes. here's one as a reminder of what he thinks:
"ONCE the minority of [the] House and Senate are comfortable in their minority status, they will have no problem socializing with the Republicans. Any farmer will tell you that certain animals run around and are unpleasant, but when they've been fixed, then they are happy and sedate. They are contented and cheerful. They don't go around p- - -ing on the furniture and such."
— Grover Norquist, president of Americans for Tax Reform, to the Washington Post's Richard Leiby.
.
Dont' blame me - I voted for the one with a brain!
Bloggers Bad!
Atrios, I love you, dude.
That said, this post:
Something's Coming
The movement continues...stay tuned.
-Atrios 1:58 PM
Has been very painful for me and many others. I do wish you would make either a clarification or a retraction.
JMO.
Yah, they are just frantic because they are finally realizing that there is real power here. Damn right there is.
Fuck them.
CALLING ALL COOPERATION
Myself and a friend are in the early stages of a film asking, basically, "What is going on in the South?" We currently live in New York and work in independent film--him as a research/developer for one of the bigger small production studios, and me as a freelance animator/editor, most recently on a short documentary by Chris Hegedus about the Fox News vs. Al Franken lawsuit.
What we are most urgently looking for is footage is video footage of the South's reaction to the election--especially during this coming Sunday's church services and/or community gatherings of any sort. If you are in the South and are able and willing to supply us with anything at all, please do. We would be extremely grateful.
Please pass this request on to anyone you think can be of some help.
We are most interested in the less-documented of the states (ie. AL, AR, KS, KY, MS, MO, TN ... ), but will obviously take what we can get.
Participating filmmakers will of course be compensated for their work, and credit will be given. We are not looking to go this alone. Ideally we hope this project evolves into a collaborative effort.
For full, admittedly long-winded details, GO HERE: http://modernarthur.com/southernodyssey
We can be reached at: tom@modernarthur.com (Tom) and pmg0628@earthlink.net (Phil) -- Please address your e-mails to both of us.
Thank You,
Tom
We can't help but suspect that it will be an, uh...interesting next few years. A project of this nature, we believe, is overdue.
http://modernarthur.com/southernodyssey
I haven't been keeping up much, I've been sidelined by continuous migraines since Kerry conceded. But in case everyone hasn't seen this yet, Greg Palast says Kerry won Ohio.
It's only a problem because the early exit polls made it look like Kerry would win. It ended up a very close race, those old people got to the polls late.
If the early exit polls were favorable to Bush, the story would be about how the new information revolution of the internet allowed the people to get political news faster.
But I really feel bad for all the Freepers who bought the "Bush in a landslide" stock on the Iowa Electronic Markets at 60 cents. They lost a ton of money. "Bush under 52%" seriously underperformed all year. Shows what the markets know.
see post below, "what to do"
But if I cancel my satellite service, how will I receive state-run media?
http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLIT...tion/
index.html
Vote - are you pleased with the outcome of the elections?
What pixie said.
Fuck them.
Well put.
Fire the leakers? We should sue everyone that got the files.
Signed -
Lars Ulrich
As you said, the first place I saw the numbers was from NRO.
GDoyle
Maybe what has the "conventional" media in such a tizzy is how, aside from noting the exit poll results and the voting results were exact polar opposites, the evil bloggers pointed things out like how CNN reversed the results of its exit polling in Ohio in the middle of the night.
BY THE WAY, SPEAKING OF EXIT POLLS
THE PLACES THAT SHOWED THE BIGGEST DISCREPANCIES BETWEEN EXIT POLLING AND VOTE-COUNTS HAD SOMETHING IN COMMON: THEY ALL HAD ELECTRONIC OR OTHERWISE UNVERIFIABLE SYSTEMS.
NH and ME had tiny discrepancies-- and they both happen to have verifiable receipts and trails and so on.
If Palast has real, conclusive evidence, he shoudl turn it over to someone who can do something about it.
Oh wait, he'd rather blab about it on talk radio, use it to sell books and collect huge speaking fees from appearances. What was I thinking?
Links to blackboxvoting which is investigating via freedom of information act and getting evoting records. Coming up with fraud evidence. Rage against the night!
What atrios said about "What to do."
http://www.bradfriedman.com/BradBlog/
Sorry, here's the link.
Where are all the lawyers that were on notice to fly to Ohio in the middle of election night to contest the election? What did I miss?
What! People had information! But information is only for the privileged! It's not for the public!
Don't you people understand that's the will of the people!?! If it wasn't, Bush would have lost!
Don't you get it?!!?!?!
Another thing, this idea of Hillary Clinton running in 08 has to be cut off at the knees NOW. You think the fundies turnout was big in this election? If she's the candidate, 04 will be a picnic compared to 08.
Sy Hersh in WaPo chat:
On Iraq: "The military are scared of telling Cheney and Bush the truth and that will have to end within the next six months. They cannot deliver in Iraq what the president wants, and we'll have to start getting out. So I believe anyway."
Fallujah is just the beginning of the bad (badder) news to come.
Vote against Bush everyday until he sails the ship of state to the center.
Pledge not to spend as much as you can afford not to every single year.
Put it in a savings account. A mattress. Anywhere but into Bush's 'mandate'. Save for your own personal warchest for the next elections. Every dollar saved is a vote against Bush.
Remember: we only reward good behavior.
If enough of the 55+ million Kerry voters did this, and organized, and sent the message to their representatives in the house, and senate, we could have a voice as loud as the lobbyists.
Money: it's the only thing they listen to.
The media needs to destroy the blogs. This has nothing to do with exit polls or faulty analysis, it's all about trying to shut down the blogs, so the media can run whatever storyline it wants with no fact-checkers.
You think it likes having these websites out there which call their BS? That points out how miserably they fail at their jobs?
The full-frontal assault is coming. This is just a warning shot.
Boycott corporate everthing. Sustainable economies built one day at a time. Boycott major media, let the blog-alution continue.
When nobody buys the corporate crap, when human beings prefer reading poetry to each other, singing together, dancing for joy despite the darkness, connecting with reality rather than watching tell-a-vision invent illusion, then human communities can do the real work of humanization, and the mad politics of the Power Ego Mad state can stagnate and be seen for the folly it all is.
Let the humans, one by one, Awaken.
boycott the red states and red corporations!
we need a red corporations list (it is probably THE list of every corporation except like Tom's of Maine or something like that..)
Last night I watched 10 minutes of the 700 Club - Pat Robertson and his cohort were gloating.
I realized that we need to watch this shit continuously now in order and analyze their message. Then we need to approach those who watch this shit and see what effect it has on them, what they get out of it. They all mostly look like Wal-Mart shoppers - just kidding! But not really. It's anthropology, folks. Let's do it and learn.
i voted this year first time, to specifically give bush a mandate "get the fuck out" and quite a few voted my way too. these blogs helped bring that about.
and i don't think any of the major media should be piss'n and moan'n about the consequences of inaccuracies. can anyone say "there are no weapons of mass destruction?"
of course with the major media, it's not what they tell us, but what they don't tell us that is the real crime.
According to the NYT IIRC, the only bloggers awake by the time the Ohio votes "came in" were the ones at the Corner. Kos, Atrios, Insty, Sully, and most of the others weren't posting.
If Palast has real, conclusive evidence, he shoudl turn it over to someone who can do something about it.
His information on "spoilage" comes form the U.S. Civil Rights Commission, and a Harvard (?) study (can't now remember which major university did the study, but it wasn't some fringe political group).
Who, exactly, is "someone who can do something about it" if not the major establishment institutions like those? This is, in other words, publicly available data. But, as in the case of the "exit polls leaks," what is available and what gets made public, is decided by private citizens.
Who resent anyone treading on their turf. Palast made his information available via the BBC. It was broadcast world-wide. But squelched in America because, per Palast, it was "too controversial." But, again, the information comes from the U.S. government.
Ironic, no?
Okay so comments are down - just don't go and pull a billmon on us
Where are all the lawyers that were on notice to fly to Ohio in the middle of election night to contest the election? What did I miss?
Kerry. Who said: "Aw, screw it!"
THe Media shall henceforth be known as the Pravda Media, we need to start our of information campaign and expose the State Sponsored Media as the Ministry of Information that it is, co-opting the media is essential in building a facist state.
Has anyone seen an update on the counting of New Mexico's votes?
It's in the red column, but I've heard the provisional ballots may be changing that.
Lima,
As a resident of suburbia, I can tell you that your comment is completely on target. I always thought of 700 club people as a joke; not anymore. These people want to roll over my family, and I don't plan to "go with it", smiling all the way.
Who resent anyone treading on their turf. Palast made his information available via the BBC. It was broadcast world-wide. But squelched in America because, per Palast, it was "too controversial." But, again, the information comes from the U.S. government.
Ironic, no?
Well, well, well. Good old Auntie for raising the point (presumably on Newsnight or Panorama - Palast is a regular on one or other of these).
It took me till the 2000 "election" to catch on to the extent to which the media, on election night, can skew not the votes but the attitude towards the purported "winner." Once you're pronounced the "real winner," it's extremely hard for the opponent to prove his case, no matter how many votes are revealed to demonstrate the opposite. That does indeed put the election process in the hands of a coalition of corporations.
There are stories all over the place now -- in respectable media (that's an overly kind adjective, I know!) -- about voting irregularities during this election. We know, of course, that it would be impossible to get Bush out of office even if we found millions of votes for Kerry uncounted or "disappeared."
I'm with David Corn who celebrates the polarization of America because I'm one of those who'd rather be right than president! However, our side of that polarity needs to press for a serious and open analysis of this election. I don't mind if Bush is shown to have won by even more votes and would be thrilled to find that everyone who wanted to voted, and that every vote was counted. But we need to reach that point before Americans -- and the world out there just waiting to be "democratized" by America -- decide this country is not in fact a nation of legitimate, trustworthy elections, nor is it in any way a role model for democracy.
You can't boycott everything - you could be damaging poeple who are genuinely good but ignorant. That would not be good for us because the bushies would use it against us.
I agree with BlakNo1, absolutely no way should Hillary Clinton run in 2008. The right is just salivating at that thought of her. Why give them what they want. We need someone without all the baggage.
I agree with BlakNo1. If you guys want to take back the WH in '08, don't even think about putting Hillary up there. Sorry to say, but Powell would be elected President in this country long before a woman would be.
this is what happened in '88...all us lefties wanted reagan/bush I out, but alas Dukakis - another northeastern liberal...
but know what happened? the left got together and the environmental movement began anew - green products and co-ops showed up everywhere, etc...it was the resurgance of hippies and long hair, greenpeace and ActUp...we need to organize and motivate
we need this to happen again - a rejection of the closed-minded and simpleton cult-religion based moronacy that is our administration!
You can't boycott everything - you could be damaging poeple who are genuinely good but ignorant
example?
ignorance is not an excuse - get out of the way of evolution!
Say what you will about Kerry, and believe me, I've said plenty here and elsewhere, he was a far better candidate than Dukakis. He did not lose because he was a Mass liberal, he lost because of voter fraud and massive fundie turnout, and because he decided to concede without a fight.
Don't get me wrong, Palast did a good job uncovering all this stuff. But, if nothing is to be done about it, what's the point?
Pledge not to spend as much as you can afford not to every single year.
40k, this is the key. For all of their nonsense about "morals" the Republicans are a party of shop keepers. Money is the only thing they really care about. Save your money (keep it in a credit union), drive purchases down and they will dearly regret their corrupt deal with Bushco.
Sinclair was fun, wasn't it? Go after CNN. This time we kill it. It's cable, it should be easier. Carville and Begala aren't worth the rest of the schedule, Mark Hyman clones every hour of the week. They've got other jobs.
We need to find a wedge issue with which to divide the unholy alliance of fundamentalists from the corporatists. Because these fundamentalists are unmoved by any incompetence or malfeasance on the part of their elected officials as long as they mouth their anti-abortion, anti-gay rights, anti-feminist agendas, they are unreachable. The only reasonable reaction to these voters is LEGAL suppression. They must be made to see that they are being played for fools. They must choose to sit out elections rather than vote.
Whatever you do, don't close your comments window. Atrios has taken comments offline until after the weekend.
Was it something we said?
If Colin Powell and Hillery Clinton ran against each other in a presidential race you would have the losest voter turnout in American history.
That's the kind of country we live in.
Rudy seems to be the number 1 repub choice for 2008 at the moment.
Got other good lefty blogs out there, I need my fix.
but alas Dukakis - another northeastern liberal...
How about Mondale, a mid-western liberal or Gore a Southern moderate. Hate to break it to you but we in the North East are fed up with this line.
I repeat, the Northeast has given Southern candidates more support than the south or Rocky Mountain states have. We haven't been the ones practicing regional chauvinism. We are the heart of the Democratic party. It can't build without us.
I don't care where the next Democratic nominee comes from, I could support many possible candidates from any area of the country but I'm not going to take a flat ban on candidates from the most loyal part of the country.
In terms of the presidency we are free of trying to please the DLC pipe dream. It's never going to happen.
I don't see Rudy as the next rethug nominee. He'll never be able to run with his anti-troop comments. I'm betting on Gov. Patacki (SP?)
There's at least a few other people here who the keys to the blog. Why not open it up again? We had a great time breaking into Atrios's liquor cabinet and raiding his stash the last time he took off for a few days
If anyone needs to open another window after posting and doesn't know how, click on the # after any comment. It will open a new window for you.
Atrios, if I offended you I am truly sorry. We are all hurting right now, but we still have to stick together. It's all we've got.
I don't see Rudy as the next rethug nominee. He'll never be able to run with his anti-troop comments. I'm betting on Gov. Patacki (SP?)
Bloggernoob
I can't see the Republican fascists going for a guy who cheated on his wife to beat the band. Made Bill Clinton look like a saint. And who fled the gov. residence to batch with two gay men while his wife performed the Vagina Monologues. Rudy's got major embarassment factors in his past. Sexy ones.
What pixie said.
We understand if you're frustrated, join the club. As long as you don't give up, it's all good.
Oh well, time to turn the lights off, I guess...
Don't worry, he's just taking some time off taking more cat pictures.
Nah, I'm sure something on this latest thread set him off.
On the one hand, if it was me, I'm sorry for ofending him. But, on the other hand, I'm not sorry for having an opinion and stating it.
Is it still possible to post to this thread?
No, it is no longer possible to post on this thread.
Check this out (Hunter, via Kos):
Franklin County, OH: Gahanna 1-B Precinct
638 TOTAL BALLOTS CAST
US Senator:
Fingerhut (D) - 167 votes
Voinovich (R) - 300 votes
US President:
Kerry (D) - 260 votes
Bush (R) - 4,258 votes
Hmmm....
Come on over to First Draft, a bunch of us are there already.
Have you had your daily Pastabagel?
THEY CALL ME PASTABAGEL
Well, here we go.
Ohio machine error gives Bush extra votes
http://www.usatoday.com/news/pol...hio-
error_x.htm
A minute passed. Then another minute. And another.
Then a minute, which seemed like an hour, but was only a minute, passed. He looked at his watch: it was a minute past. This was it.
A minute passed. Then another minute passed quickly past...
Anyone seen an error favoring a Democrat yet? Anyone?
How about the last election in 2002? Anyone?
http://www.petitionspot.com/peti...ions/
deanfordnc
Howard Dean for Chairman of the Democratic National Committee
By Jason Gooljar
It was a solemn day the crowd gathered around the stage where the candidate was to give his concession. Smiles were on the faces of some, while tears fell from the cheeks of others. Rhythmic applause could be heard erupting from the people all in unison. No, this was not the election night of November 2nd , 2004. This was Howard Dean back in the winter about to end his primary bid. For some this moment can now be looked back on as the day we really lost the presidency to our own party.
It has been said "When you trade your values for the hope of winning, you end up losing and having no values -- so you keep losing." The truth has never been more clear than it is now. We must strengthen the newly found spinal transplant of the Democratic Party. We must now take a stand with our democratic values in tow. First, I'll tell you what we should not stand for anymore. We can no longer be a party who has to move to the center. The right has never had to do it and neither should we. We can no longer be a party who is beholden to special interests. No more of the big money donors, there is a better way. Raise the money from the grassroots.
We need real campaign finance reform. We need to be the party of inclusion and the party of the poor and the middle class. We need to go to middle America and talk to them about what we stand for. We need to show them that we truly have their interests at heart. We need to go to the evangelical Christians and have a real discussion about America. We need to have a real discussion of religion in America. We need to re frame the debate from our perspective and not reinforce the conservative frames already in place.
When Goldwater lost, his backers did not give up. Goldwater actually lost badly. We have not been greatly defeated like they were. It took them forty years to build the machine they have in place now. We let them do it while we snickered at them and laughed at them for being extremists who would never hold power. They continued to work and they continued to organize. They started winning locally at the state level throughout the middle states and then they went national. They threw the moderate republicans out in favor of the new conservatives. There is much to learn from our opponents indeed.
As we rebuild our party we must keep some things in mind. The neo conservatives do not have absolute power. There were millions of Americans who voted against this President. We still have the power, you still have the power. We as the progressive movement can no longer be afraid of losing. In order to win you must loose. As long as you keep your values when you loose you can continue to fight on. If you give them up you have nothing. Either we as the democratic party stand for something or we stand for nothing at all. After all why vote for a right wing l
For all of those who promised to leave if Bush won, here's some info to aid in your escape.
http://www.reuters.co.uk/printer...&
storyID=616225
Remember-- a promise is a promise!
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