I'MMA LET YOU FINISH
Torture all 15 year old conservative pundits.
Fuck Bush and his henchmen from hell.
Just one thin mint...
Every torturer is precious, every torturer is good...(singing nuns)
Torture is OK if it you wear Condi's power bitch boots.
We already allow Bush to torture the English language in public and the press simply cleans up the blood and sweat afterwards.
Didn't the Hitler Youth wear boots like Tokenleeza's?
Torturing trolls is OK so long as they remain clueless. To be done only for entertainment value, not for information.
There is no information.
Didn't the Hitler Youth wear boots like Tokenleeza's?
Reality Check Bouncer
Good thing Condi isn't into those wedgie shoes with spikes.
professor b
I love that PhD'd bitch.
Mints?
Try burning your mouth on hot soup then eating a fistful of Altoids. That's torture for you.
There IS misinformation...plenty of it. There are still Politicians out there adamantly claiming we found WMD's.
Scary world.
It's waaaa-fer thin...
Bitch PhD nails it. Torture is disgusting, and it's not male or female to think it. It's just RIGHT. You don't accommodate people who advocate torture. Not if you're a) civilized b) a real human being or c) have read the MF Constitution.
I thought everyone agreed that torture as a means to an end, getting information, failed miserably to do that.
Why are we continuing to have this conversation?
People who advocate it are nuts are. Even McCain seems to have forgotten lessons learned. Ugh.
Do they just like to beat people up so they can tell themselves better that they're at least doing something?
So what Volokh is saying is that he's too cheap to do the wrong thing?
My head hurts--I think he's torturing us already.
OMit one *are* and *better*.
Thank you.
LJ, The people subverting the Constitution read it, they had to to walk around it.
Volokh is supposed to be a professor of constitutional law? I am trying to make my mind accept that because this guy does not sound very bright.
Oh and Professor Bitch - that post was awesome. She can write. I hate her. 
Good observation, Tena, but don't hate anyone for it...leave that to those exporting it from our fair country...maybe someday, just someday, it will stop.
I heard Dershowitz on NPR the other day waxing orgasmic at the thought of placing sticking sterilized needles under a captives' fingernails.
God, I hate that faux-liberal bastard.
So..the guy said he was pr-torture and then backed down when people got upset with him. Dammit, say what you mean and mean what you fuckin' say. I'd rather deal with a guy who's pro-torture than some asshole who'll change his stance that fucking quickly when the heat's on. If you're pro something like torture, I'd say you better be damn sure of it. Study on it some before you start shooting off at the mouth.
Who the hell is Oberstar?
A Democrat who sided with Delay.
WTF?
So what happens if the federal courts rule for Mr. Schiavo?
I heard Dershowitz on NPR the other day waxing orgasmic at the thought of placing sticking sterilized needles under a captives' fingernails.
Yeah, I heard that. Can we get Congress to pass a law that Dershowitz is not to be allowed within 10 feet of a microphone for the rest of his life?
Funny. On the train home just now I was reading Katha Pollitt's latest column in The Nation deploring the lack of women columnists in the corporate press and the lack of female bloggers. She posits that reason isn't because there is a dearth of women bloggers, just that they don't get the recognition.
Then who does Atrios link to? A female blogger. Good on you.
One party rule, torture.... pffft! Same old, same old.
Take THIS! , catbloggers.
I think Dr. eHarmony should buy one of us a plane ticket. He's the one who got us in this situation.
Unless he pleasures Liddy Dole with it.
Tena:
Alas, you've missed the "there are no women bloggers" brouhaha, where allegations from the more knuckle-dragging element of the liberal front showed up to assert that women didn't have anything interesting to say, they weren't topical or relevant (Why aren't you discussing what *I*, all powerful male, want you to discuss), they can't write and--oh yeah, we won't compromise on abortion, either. Bunch of man-haters.
I'm starting to wonder about Atrios now that he is linking to one of these harridans.
The Senate is right now meeting to force feed Terri Schiavo.
Cat killer Frist is now speaking.
Can we get Congress to pass a law that Dershowitz is not to be allowed within 10 feet of a microphone for the rest of his life?
Do we have enough troops left to enforce that?
Paint Dershowitz a liberal, and he won't be ABLE to get near a microphone until at least 2008.
I'm starting to wonder about Atrios now that he is linking to one of these harridans.
LJ
Actually, I'm always surprised to find out how many bloggers I like are women.
Paint Dershowitz a liberal, and he won't be ABLE to get near a microphone until at least 2008.
What color do we use? Because I'll be glad to do it....
Anyone beside me notice that 'Volokh' ends in a guttural that sounds a lot like someone blowing chunks (or at least coughing up a clam-sized loogie plus bits of a lung)?
We women RULE!
Or we will torture you with our high heel boots.
I know he gets quoted here often, but Yglesias is really a fucking little weasel...
Then who does Atrios link to? A female blogger. Good on you.
Don't miss Professor B's current posts on this very subject ["... the lack of female bloggers. She posits that reason isn't because there is a dearth of women bloggers, just that they don't get the recognition"].
Bunch of man-haters.
I'm starting to wonder about Atrios now that he is linking to one of these harridans.
Whoa, there.
The compromise legislation applies only to the Schiavo case, lawmakers said.
Isn't that why "Terri's Law" was declared unconstitutional? Been too long since ConLaw, but is this "bill of attainder" territory?
Anyone? Anyone? Bueller? Ferris Bueller?
Why not try this on a pilot basis? We can torture Scooter Libbey and Karl Rove and ask them what they know about the betrayal of Valerie Plame. After all, this is a matter of national security.
Oh yeah, why not throw in Russert, Mrs. Federal Reserve and Judith Miller and ask them what they know about the betrayal of Valerie Plame.
Will someone please tell these perverts that the day might come when they need due process of law.
Since trolls love torture, can we do it to them? I would like to try some turns at the wheel using one of them.
The Senate is right now meeting to force feed Terri Schiavo.
Jesus. Motherfucking. Christ.
Has all the money been stolen? Don't they have anything better to do?
Oh, by the way. Terri Schiavo is still dead. She's a fucking c o r p s e.
speaking of -- can anyone here confirm that rudepundit is a woman.
Pink. The color is pink. For Commie, for gay. Gasp!!
Don't miss Professor B's current posts on this very subject ["... the lack of female bloggers.
Or Shakespeare's Sister. Or Rox Populi. Or Feministe. Or Big Brass Blog. Or Pam's Coffee Blend. Or--
Yeah. No female bloggers. No girls saying anything worthwhile at all. Nope.. Not a peep.
Right.
Monica - I am dense tonight, I just spent the whole day with a dear friend who now a shut in. Did I misquote someone?
Monica:
I'm being sarcastic. Read the whole thing. Look at how the narrative progresses.
The Senate is right now meeting to force feed Terri Schiavo.
BWAH! Mints?
(Sorry, sorry, that's in such poor taste, but how could I resist...)
Elaine Supkis sez:
We women RULE!
Or we will torture you with our high heel boots.
Uhhmmm, I'll be off having some private time now...
.
Tom Harkin is now speaking on the Schiavo issue.
I wonder if the Democrats have something planned, or if they are caving to Republican demands?
Volokh was abused by his parents when they sent him to college at age 10.
And I closed that MF tag. Stupid Haloscan.
Did I misquote someone?
Not that I know of. I was just directing you to posts on the subject at Bitch. Ph.D.'s blog, in case you missed them.
_____
Right.
What's your fucking point?
Good for Professor B. I thought Volokh was nuts saying we ought to allow the famillies of victims to torture their murderers to death.
At that rate, we should just allow famiies to feud with those who killed one of them. Who needs the rule of law?
We women RULE!
Or we will torture you with our high heel boots.
Why *don't* you have a blog, Elaine?
I'm being sarcastic.
OK. I apologize for having misread your previous posts.
Monica:
You clearly don't understand the concept of sarcasm and righteous anger.
It seems like I always pass the Turing test with you.
Careful with that axe, Eugene!
You clearly don't understand the concept of sarcasm and righteous anger.
Hey, I apologized, so I won't take that personally -- as you shouldn't take personally anything I say.
Careful with that axe, Eugene!
.
1) Porter Goss calls it "professional interrogation techniques"
2) (sarcasm alert)
Gee, I'm sure glad the folks running on a "bring back morality" platform have got us debating whether torture is a good thing. To paraphrase the Chief of Police in Young Frankenstein Torture is a terrible and a bloody thing - and I think it's about time to do more of it!
3) On a serious note - why don't these KK-Kristians Bible-as-literal-truth folks remember the "Vengeance is mine, sayeth the Lord" stuff? I recall our justice system used to be "punishment-based" rather than "vengeance-based" partly for this very reason.
4) Can't wait for the next "Republican Jesus" mug on this subject from The General. "Vengeance is Mine to Outsource" sounds about right...
Alice Marshall, you forgot Novak. I volunteer to put in the electric needles but only if I get a full haz-mat suit.
So Lord Volderkolhv now thinks it's a bad idea because of administrative problems. Wuss.
I still want to know how soon the fascist harpies of the bloggy depths would take to come down on a leftist professor who defended Cuba's execution of those hijackers a while back. David Horowitz and his mighty handful of the undateable and pockmarked would mobilize, getting him some head time with Brian Lamb. Bobo would spring up again......
BWAH! Mints?
"It's waaaa-fer thin..."
I would really like to kick these fucking fucks on C-Span 2 right now.
Senator Reids official statement on the Schiavo compromise:
“I am pleased Senator Frist and I were able to pass the bill that protects the life of Terri Schiavo by allowing her parents to go to federal court.
If the House Republicans refuse to pass our bipartisan bill, they bear responsibility for the consequences.”
Well I believe it's official now: we have no opposition party. The Fundies are in charge.
Why are law schools admitting independently wealthy multimillionaires? That's what I want to know about Volokh. Unless Volokh writes something that totally transforms the way law is studied, he's nothing but a parasite on the system. People like this should not be taking up space in the academic system.
I would really like to kick these fucking fucks on C-Span 2 right now.
Hit 'em with the CHAIR!
LJ - Right. No woman bloggers exist. Oh, maybe Wonkette. That's all.
independently wealthy multimillionaires ... People like this
Hmm. Don't think the endowment watchers would agree with you.
If the House Republicans refuse to pass our bipartisan bill, they bear responsibility for the consequences.”
Was this yesterday? Or today? And does Reid think the House will balk?
"They had stopped doing these public executions. I'm sad and angry to see them coming back."
North Korean defector
Volokh might have been excessively teased because his name is an onomotopia for the sound of throwing up. Or because his name is Eugene. We had a Eugene in school and if he hadn't been big with a bad temper he'd have had to put up with a lot.
Could be that he's just a psychopath with a degree. Lots of those in law. Bork comes to mind.
Reid and the Democrats really stepped in it.
They are too often such fucking patsies.
Actually, per CNN, both houses will meet tomorrow. Don't know what happened today, but looks like tomorrow they'll vote the thing out and go home.
And poor Michael Schiavo's horror will continue.
Whatever.
Back OT:
Has anyone noticed that Republicans always have a snake oil solution to problems that require real and difficult treatment? Terrorism: We'll stop it by torturing people not to do it! Abortion: We'll take away women's rights to have one! That'll stop 'em! People murdering each other? Kill em to get 'em to stop killing!
Torture has been proven scientifically to be extremely unreliable to obtain truthful information. Torture has also been proven scientifically and historically to be exceptionally degrading not only for the recipient but those that inflict it and those that support its use. It leads to cultures where the individual is completely at the "mercy" of the collective (government) for avoiding being legally tortured. This is antithetical to everything I have understood America to stand for since it's inception on so many levels that I still find it difficult to believe I am hearing this conversation in America.
This is something that has no upside to it from either a practical or moral POV, and this is something that has been proven time and again. Even when one gets the occasional useful piece of information the damage done to the society by the use of torture far outweighs any benefits. That is, in anything resembling an open society like democracies generally are, and what I thought America was supposed to be. Only in already closed societies can you find arguments that torture's benefits outweigh any downsides, because those downsides are already a part of that system. Now, I thought surrendering to terrorists was a good idea, and the more America resembles a closed society the greater their victory will have been.
What Volokh did when he made his first post was bad enough, but now walking backwards on it like this, especially with this type of reasoning, is demonstrating a lack of convictions like nothing else. To have raised this issue first without truly being willing to defend it from criticism demonstrates such a lack of courage regarding one's convictions, and a willingness to be inflammatory for the sake of attention and not for the sake of real discussion that is appalling. Especially in someone of Volokh's background and reputation this is a serious matter to be aware of, and to watch against in the future of this man, especially if he ends up being a judicial nominee, IMHO.
``We should investigate every avenue before we take the life of a living human being,'' said DeLay, R-Texas. ``That's the very least we can do for her.''
The case has encompassed at least 19 judges in at least six different courts.
How long, O Lord, how long?
Okay, if I'm hearing this right, they're gonna shove the tube BACK in and have the whole Schiavo case re-heard by a federal court.
And I'm sure whoever is chosen to hear the case has already been hand-picked to deliver the "correct" decision.
Isn't referring to someone with essentially no BRAIN as "disabled" kind of the understatement of the decade?
Sadly, the Dems don't lose on this.
No one is going to vote GOP in '06 over this. Plenty of right wingers would be motivated to vote, however, if the Dems obstructed this.
But they'll be motivated anyway. Maybe if the Dems tried to motivate their base once in awhile, with the way they voted....
it's good to have a dream.
Torture has been proven scientifically to be extremely unreliable to obtain truthful information. Scotian
In my defense, when I offered to tortue Novak it wasn't because I expected HIM to tell the truth.
"We should investigate every avenue before we take the life of a living human being,''
When did DeLay turn his back on the death penalty?
_____
To have raised this issue first without truly being willing to defend it from criticism demonstrates such a lack of courage regarding one's convictions, and a willingness to be inflammatory for the sake of attention and not for the sake of real discussion that is appalling.
Sure, but Volokh has now also helped "torture" clear another debate hurdle. Is it still taboo for the U.S. to consider torture as a tool of foreign policy?
This is how low the bar is set? It's reasonable to debate whether or not torture is ok while tut-tutting the inexcusable level of personal abuse that someone advocating torture gets, praising him for his usual even temper?
Or to debate that concentration camps are a-ok again. Why are we even in a position to still think these are worthwhile topics to debate? What next? Maybe we need to re-think that slavery thing? < /sarcasm off >
And I'll torture Volokh on the basis of scientific research. Keep notes and dB measurements and all.
How long, O Lord, how long?
Robert M. Jeffers
...'till forever
Sadly, the Dems don't lose on this.
I dunno. They offer further evidence of their disdain for an independent judiciary.
LJ --
You are right -- simple solutions for simple minds (of course neither work -- solutions nor minds)
Alice Marshall might be on to something -- suspend the Constitution for some trials of the eifficacy of torture (Whoops, I forgot, that's already been done)
Is it still taboo for the U.S. to consider torture as a tool of foreign policy?
monica_nyc
Did pious little Lincoln Chaffee and the other "moderates" vote to confirm Gonzales?
Silleigh
at least the Florida Senate did the right thing on Friday. though the truly odious Dennis Baxley did get lots of press out of his House Bill. (this is the same idiot who introduced the Horowitz bill attacking the universities.) the fundies are howling down here now.
Has anybody noticed the escalations in the China/Taiwan situation?
Shouldn't we be all over GWB on this? After all, at least Clinton would have sweet talked both sides into maintaining a nominally peaceful status quo by now.
Wasn't it nice to have a president who at least knew how to play with the other kids even if he was Republican-lite?
Jesus Christ. This James Wolcott post is almost enough to make me start weeping for my fucked up country.
We are in a bad way. A bad, bad way...
Porter Gross told Congress that IDF-tested torture techniques like waterboarding ARE perfectly legal, and currently a perfectly acceptable interrogation technique for any CIA agent who wants to use it.
if it's good enough for Porter Gross, and good enough for the our friends in Iran, why should Professor V have anything to be ashamed of?
Ohh, you asked me why I saved you. I tried to carry you off, and the next day, you gave me water, and a little pity.
Can we get Congress to pass a law that Dershowitz is not to be allowed within 10 feet of a microphone for the rest of his life?
Can we add Yoko Ono to the list?
the fundies are howling down here now.
Which is pretty amazing when you consider how carefully the FL legislature has been crafted to do the fundies' bidding. (You down here, too?)
I can't help it. This whole turn of events just makes me spitting mad.
Has anybody noticed the escalations in the China/Taiwan situation?
Yeah. Now Russia, the wounded, bleeding bear, is getting all up in Taiwan's grill.
Again, from the Wolcott post, this is scary as fuck...
Yale historian Paul Kennedy has long argued that great powers typically fail when military reach outstrips a nation’s economic strength. In that vein, there’s little doubt that America is extending its reach in this post-9/11 world. Wars in Afghanistan and Iraq were the opening salvos. The Bush Administration’s recent nomination of two leading neocons to key global positions -- John Bolton as America’s ambassador to the UN and Paul Wolfowitz to head the World Bank (also announced on March 16) -- are more recent examples of a White House that is upping the ante on its 'transformational' projection of global power. In Paul Kennedy’s historical framework, America is extending its reach at precisely the moment when its economic power base is weakening -- a classic warning sign of the fall of a Great Power.
Or we will torture you with our high heel boots.
Stop teasing.
Keep in mind that the IDF and CIA do NOT torture for information anyway: it is a means of nonlethal neutralization. Very often the victim obligingly kills himself later on anyway, and until then he's insane and unable to organize unions or defend himself or function normally.
DAS, I've been watching it a bit and think that China is preparing to move in some way. I suspect that some of their currency activity is to demonstrate to George Bush that they now own enough of the American debt that they could choose to sink our economy. I don't think that they could do this hasn't crossed any of their minds.
If China decides that Taiwan is worth writing off the debt they will invade it and the United States will discover that it is otherwise engaged.
"Now, I thought surrendering to terrorists was a good idea, and the more America resembles a closed society the greater their victory will have been."
This should have read :
"Now, I thought surrendering to terrorists WASN'T a good idea, and the more America resembles a closed society the greater their victory will have been."
Sorry about that, my bad proofing caught up with me...
Santioned torture, that takes us back a hundred years. Pretty soon we'll have (economic) slavery.
Wow, these repugs are just like a Time Machine and they're dragging the country back with them.
All I want to know is how long before 1776 comes around?
Looks like we could use a good revolution.
Well all I can say is that at least it is going back to the courts. In other words, at least it sounds as though the move to have the legislature overrule the courts has been bypassed.
I hope to hell that's what just happened, anyway. This is where I was getting extremely nervous. They were right on the edge of destroying the balance of power. The right is itching to do that anyway, so I can only hope that Reid forestalled that.
If he didn't, I'm fucking fed up with him and everyone else involved in this necrophilial orgy.
Ignored in death as well as life!
That makes me so angry!
If China decides that Taiwan is worth writing off the debt they will invade it and the United States will discover that it is otherwise engaged.
Throw in some fucked up military junta or whatever is running N. Korea at this point and a complete incompetant running the State Department and you've got a mound of ugliness in Asia.
Iran/Pakistan standoff against Israel/USA on the horizon, too.
silleigh,
up North in the G-ville district of the Islamic Republc of Florida.
kei&yuri,
check on that. the White Terror is intended to break individuals, and to send a lesson to others. not that there is anything new in this, it's the international scope and depravity of the Gulag Americana that is the value-added BushCo has brough to the table.
What an evil twit. He finally admits to being wrong about his stance on torture as punishment, not because torture is morally wrong at all times, but because it would just be too dang hard to implement.
Where are all of those righteous people who rail against moral relativism now? Why haven't they spoken up?
Morons.
Tena ... What happens when they get a ruling they don't like from a federal court? It's just forestalling the inevitable Constitutional crisis, which is what these fucks want.
In other words, at least it sounds as though the move to have the legislature overrule the courts has been bypassed.
That's what I thought when I read about this.
Look, the repubs are determined to make this an issue. Fine, let the courts decide (remembering that the Supremes didn't want to touch it).
Meanwhile, the NYT Magazine has devoted an entire page in tomorrow's edition with an interview of the Republican Man Whore, JeffJimGannonGuckert.
Ya know...this back and forth thing with this poor woman...don't you find it odd that this is the ONLY thing Americans are talking about this friggin weekend. And who's sitting pretty in the catbird seat thinking they got away with the fact that today marks 2 years of this effing stupid ass war.
Book tv has an interview with Ward Connerly.
Tena, at least the dead woman doesn't know what's being done to her body. I can't begin to imagine what the husband feels but he's gone through fifteen years already. The parents are living in a delusion.
The only bright side of this is that as the circus goes on a lot more people are going to become disgusted.
Did you see that Little Audrey link on the other thread. That is a real horror show, a young girl brain dead since three turned into a "religous" shrine. Complete with devotional objects for sale. My old church and its cult of death and sickness has a lot to answer for. Seems like the thumper protestants don't do much better.
Tena ... What happens when they get a ruling they don't like from a federal court? It's just forestalling the inevitable Constitutional crisis, which is what these fucks want.
Yup...
"You do have to wonder what a Democracy is when it comes down to a few men in the Pentagon and a few men in the White House having their way...I'm writing about all of this soon, so I don't want to overdo it, but there's been a tremendous sea change in the government. A concentration of power."
- Sy Hersh
Meanwhile, the NYT Magazine has devoted an entire page in tomorrow's edition with an interview of the Republican Man Whore, JeffJimGannonGuckert.
Res Ipsa Loquitor
Do they expect him to tell them the truth? Is it news when it's a page of lies? Will they do any "analysis" of his answers? Or will it just be the same old nyt wittery that we are coming to expect?
They were right on the edge of destroying the balance of power.
They could have made a more naked grab, but I think they've effectively accomplished this anyway. Haven't the Repugs been quietly stacking the federal bench since the Reagan years?
Has anybody noticed the escalations in the China/Taiwan situation?
There are international conferences taking place in China last week and next, so making noise about Taiwan is timely -- given expected media attention.
And who's sitting pretty in the catbird seat thinking they got away with the fact that today marks 2 years of this effing stupid ass war.
Terri Schiavo we can blame on somebody: her husband; the courts; doctors; somebody.
The war, we voted for. Responsibility is a bitch.
Who can we blame for Schiavo this hour?
...don't you find it odd that this is the ONLY thing Americans are talking about this friggin weekend.
It's March Madness. That gets the attention of a segment of the population. Priorities, ya know.
And I doubt that most Americans give a rat's ass about Terri Schiavo's case except to think it's a circus.
Are we getting close to needing triple beds, so there will be room for our Congressmen?
Meanwhile, the NYT Magazine has devoted an entire page in tomorrow's edition with an interview of the Republican Man Whore, JeffJimGannonGuckert.
Res Ipsa Loquitor
Is it a fold-out?
Rrrrrrruff!
Robert, you left her parents out there, dude.
I always wonder what Bush's approval rating would be if we actually had a 4th Estate.
up North in the G-ville district of the Islamic Republc of Florida.
::waving north::
(outskirts of Tampa, here)
The Senate is right now meeting to force feed Terri Schiavo.
Cat killer Frist is now speaking.
David
Can we insert a tube into C.K.Frist to force feed him the shit he let go in the Senate yesterday? Can we? Please?
I always wonder what Bush's approval rating would be if we actually had a 4th Estate.
I wonder why the media wants me to care about the Schiavo case -- but insists that I not notice the power grab of the legislature, with the backing of the executive, against the judiciary.
Why does the media want me to care about Michael Jackson? About the little white girl in Florida who was abducted and killed? About Scott Peterson [?is that his name?]? About Robert Blake? About steriods use by baseball players?
It's Red Herring Season, I guess.
I wonder why the media wants me to care about the Schiavo case
Could the fact that it's happening in Florida and it's the end of a hard winter have anything to do with it? Bet if it was Idaho in March it wouldn't get the same treatment.
CNN, which I couldn't avoid for several hours yesterday afternoon, was absolutely into Faux FOX mode.
Res Ipsa - There isn't anything that the Repugs can do about a ruling they don't agree with (besides appealing) that I'm aware of short of a constitutional amendment. I don't see how they can actually provoke a crisis. They can disagree; they can appeal; they can use it to try to get the amendment that's been floating around that would give Congress final say over the SCOTUS in front of the public. But without an amendment, there really isn't anything they can do, except defy a court order and see what happens.
Well, we always have loved our circuses. Can't only blame the media.
The sight of a c o r p s e being manipulated before your very eyes--well, it's damn near irresistable.
It bugs me that the media wants everybody to care about Michael Blake Peterson on Steroids.
But I can't put the Schiavo case in that same category (and not because it's a local case here). When a legislature, state or federal, tries to throw every bully tactic at its disposal into a personal family matter, I do think that's important to all of us.
When a legislature, state or federal, tries to throw every bully tactic at its disposal into a personal family matter, I do think that's important to all of us.
I agree, but I think the media has been grinding its organ over this story even before the bigger bullies came on stage.
"When a legislature, state or federal, tries to throw every bully tactic at its disposal into a personal family matter, I do think that's important to all of us."
Of course it's important to all of us! The Congress is circumventing the rights of the judicial branch. This goes way beyond one case. They are subverting the separation of powers mandated by the Constitution of the United States of America! And the Democrats are joining them!
"I thought Volokh was nuts saying we ought to allow the famillies of victims to torture their murderers to death.
"At that rate, we should just allow famiies to feud with those who killed one of them. Who needs the rule of law?
Wile E. Odysseus |
====================
Pity the poor bastards who don't have family or other loved ones and are victims of crime. Under the Volokh definition, a crime isn't punishable unless there is a victim family member to mete it out. Way to value all life. Right...Idiot...
Is there really any other conclusion but that Volokh and all those who are trying to cover for him are insane psychopathic fascists?
I still say Yglesias should not get a quiet pass for taking an "I'm not inherently against this" intellectual exercise approach. I should repudiate his own words. That's another form of allowing the bar to be set low.
I heard Volokh got pressure from TPTB to recant his post. Volokh just used Kleiman's post as a convenient excuse to do so. Apparently Volokh doesn't want to become the conservative equivalent of Ward Churchill. What a greedy little coward.
Apparently Volokh doesn't want to become the conservative equivalent of Ward Churchill.
Too late...
Actually, Ward Churchill didn't say anything that outrageous. In context, it's easy to see the argument he was (somewhat clumsily) trying to make.
Anyway, Volokh's career should be over. There is no disputing what he said, and there's no doubt what he meant. He went to great lengths to support torture, and that should be all anyone needs to know about him.
I suppose that in the Platonic Republic that too many of Matt Yglesias', Brad DeLong's and Crooked Timber's commenters inhabit, the philosopher king would be an infinitely just and merciful torturer, a true Seeker of Truth and Penitence.
The other universe that the advocates of torture inhabit is the action-film universe: the ticking-bomb scenario. How crappy all of these scripts are.
I fully endorse the poster who called Matthew Yglesias a little weasel - somebody his age alrady this cynical and devoid of true moral principles, and apparently unaware of the lack, might well grow up to be a Cheyney clone in another thirty or forty years. Remember, he apparently supported the Iraq war because he thought the pro-war side "cooler" than the anti-war crowd. Totally shallow and amoral, in other words.
The other day he had a post seriously discussing whether corporal punishments (ten lashes or so) should not be brought back to law enforcement, as cheaper than prison. Disgusting.
"How crappy all of these scripts are"
Don't you see how nice and self-indulgent it is. The media doesn't inform, it pitches scenarios at us, like we are all big producers deciding which script will become a movie or TV show.
Isn't that why "Terri's Law" was declared unconstitutional? Been too long since ConLaw, but is this "bill of attainder" territory?
`When I use a constitution,' Humpty Dumpty said, in rather a scornful tone, `it means just what I choose it to mean -- neither more nor less.'
`The question is,' said Alice, `whether you can make constitutions mean so many different things.'
`The question is,' said Humpty Dumpty, `which is to be master -- that's all.'
(with apologies to C.L. Dodgson, aka "Lewis Carroll")
Cheers,
Yes, for some reason--I think it's called 'inhumanity'--when you admit an emotional element to your arguments, or if you are 'passionate'
about your values, it immediately disqualifies your position, no matter what you advocate.
Only the dispassionate can be right, you see. All that emotional stuff--unless you love God, money, or your country (not necessarily in that order)--is just silly.
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