I'MMA LET YOU FINISH
Again?
Fuck Bush and his EVIL minions.
goodness.....
googlefight:
wingnuts 168,000
right to privacy 230 million
That most precious of rights -- the right to be left alone.
Without it, the rights enumerated in the Bill of Rights really aren't worth too much.
If they take away birth control pills and/or any type of contraception, there will be some Republicans as pissed as Democrats.
Isn't Rush supporting a constitutional right to privacy in his medical records case in Florida? Oh wait, IOKIYAR.
Well, probably "not some," but a lot.
Well, even the republicans know which side their bread is buttered on: their mistress' side.
Even the thuglican congress critters will send staffers to Vermont to get birthcontrol.
If an attempt was made to overturn Griswold, I really would get out my boning knife. I'm serious.
Have they overreached? Aren't they making a huge mistake by pandering to a "base" that can't be more than 15 to 20% of the population??
I live in Oregon, so I have very little sense of how the rest of the country thinks, though I have spent a fair amount of time in the south - and, I have to tell you, I just don't think people will put up with this kind of fristy/fisty santorum-soaked nonsense.
If an attempt was made to overturn Griswold, I really would get out my boning knife. I'm serious.
I would have to put my "boning knife" away.
Oh Sarah, they overreached so long ago- we're too numb to remember what numb looks like.
Looks like you get their sexual control issues, just like their guns, only when you pry them from their cold, dead hands....
That's actually an incorrect description of the law at issue in Griswold -- it prohibited the "USE" of contraception, not the "sale," which made the law even more bizarre...
http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/sc...ol=381&
page=479
...buttered bread.
I'm taking a break now to go have some toast. Probably w/cinnamon sugar. Later, 'gators.
Looks like you get their sexual control issues, just like their guns, only when you pry them from their cold, dead hands....
If it was just in my cold dead hands, I wouldn't *care* about Griswold vs. CT...
I still remember when the conservatives were screaming 24/7 about getting the government out of their lives. My, how things have changed!
Hecate--they do want government out of their lives, but not out of yours.
I remember that too, Hecate. See, there's one of those things!
a more conservative court could overrule Roe without touching Griswold because Roe moved the right of privacy into the due process clause of the 14th and away from the penumbras and emanations formed by the bill of rights as a whole.
In other news, Bush administration nominated Andrea Yates to head the Administration for Children and Families.
Just say NO to the American Taliban!
Republicans: Getting government out of the boardroom and into the bedroom.
Yep, and after Griswold goes, they'll have to ban sales of soda (you can douche with that to prevent pregnancy), rubber gloves, toy balloons, oranges and lemons (you can make diaphragms from them), and calendars (so you can't use the rhythm method).
Then they can start up the Santorum Scouts--pre-pubescent youths stationed one to a home who do nothing but monitor and report on the sex habits of the occupants. Anything other than missionary, frequency greater than once a week, or doing it with the lights on will be reported. Then it's GITMO for both parties.
They can pry my IUD out of my cold, dead uterus.
The golden lining in this cloud is that people no longer think I'm crazy for saying these things during the last ten years. Now they bring sacrifices of chocolate ice cream to my altars and ask me to tell their fortunes.
i'm scared i feel this is even a valid question, but- do people honestly believe that BC regulations would be tolerated? there's been quite a backlash over the pharmacy thing, so far govs have been mostly unwilling to sign them and i don't think we've seen the last of the court challenges.
i don't know. abortion i can see as 'regulated' until it's only found in northern urban centers and in the first trimester. but BC? i guess i believe that too many republican lawmakers have too many young mistresses who are just smart enough to know that it's either legal BC or babydaddy scandals/blackmail. the choice seems easy to me.
Funny Derelict -- somehow I am sure the Santorum Scouts would be empowered to pardon the comely females & requisition them for their masters' personal use.
Well, it is Saturday, and I do have an intense Napping/Snacking cross-training schedule to keep up. So, back to the grind. Pretty impressive discipline, huh?
Also Lawrence v Texas
http://photos1.blogger.com/img/1...0/
WHYbible2.jpg
I still remember when the conservatives were screaming 24/7 about getting the government out of their lives. My, how things have changed! - kinda like the WalMart buy American campaign.
One important thing to keep in mind about Griswold being overturned is just how many laws we haven't even considered that the right to privacy protects us from. From Griswold to Roe to Casey to Lawrence, the Supreme Court has created a sphere of constitutional autonomy around the individual. Once this sphere vanishes, government at all levels will legislate morality regardless of its impact on the individual. Possession of pornography, for instance, falls under the rubrick of the right to privacy rather than free speech.
As Atrois says, Griswold is the granddaddy of them all, and would be sure to fall if the SC turns. While some states might limit the use of contraceptives based on Griswold's elimination, I think the greater danger would involve brazen conservative legistatures conceiving of new and interesting ways to invade privacy. Eventually, I think it would lead to an attack on free speech. After all, it becomes a lot harder to justify the right to publicly express certain opinions when government has the ability to ban the activity your opinion pertains to based on morality.
I think Griswold's fall will coincide with an attack on obsenity with an eye towards using the FCC to control cable tv and eventually the internet. Without Griswold to protect you in the bedroom, the "right" to view obscenity becomes far more tenuous, since possession is no longer protected.
Because the liberal justices seem to be holding out, America probably has one more chance in 2008. If it chooses another Christian conservative president, however, all bets are off.
Derelict -- Oh, that reminds me of the Fugs song, "Coca-cola Douche".
Yes. That's also true of people who bring up "penumbras and emanations"; they're talking about Griswold, not Roe. Which tells you what the agenda is. (As I've argued at far too great a length before, the argument that Roe "comes from nothing" is just silly. The unermerated right to privacy--whether right or wrong--has a long constitutional lineage, indeed going back well before Griswold.
Echidne--I have a nice bar of Belgian chocolate I've been saving for a special occasion. Looks like this is it--it's yours 
Seeing as how the infamous red/blue map, when viewed with a bit more detail, shows the USA to be largely Purple, I'd like to take this opportunity to suggest we drop the whole "Red State-Blue-State" thang, and just refer to Reds and Blues. (or Rednecks and Bluenecks, WTF).
This lets us usurp "Better dead than Red!", and have a hearty "Neener neener!" in the process, which is good for the soul.
Nah. I truly do not believe the ban on the use/sale of contraceptive will be reinstituted.
Even lunatic, wingnut fundies fuck, and not all of them want 15 children or bastards for that matter.
I don't think it'll happen.
Roe v. Wade? Mebbe. If they fuck up the courts. Mebbe.
MMMM! Chocolate! I'm sending infinite stores of birth control equipment your way, Sallyh. And happiness.
The Right has been after Griswold since it was decided. They absolutely hate it. But it's the foundation for our right to privacy and overturning it would open up an immense can of worms.
I don't know that it is possible for the SCOTUS to overturn it now, with so many subsequent decisions flowing from it. But I worry - shit like that never stopped the maniacs from doing it anyway.
Have they overreached? Aren't they making a huge mistake by pandering to a "base" that can't be more than 15 to 20% of the population??
W's approval numbers are going down into regions almost unseen before, if that tells you anything.
"Over-reached" is going to be looked back on as an understatement. Sort of like McCarthy "over-reached" when he started the Army hearings.
The Right has been after Griswold since it was decided. They absolutely hate it. But it's the foundation for our right to privacy and overturning it would open up an immense can of worms.
At this point, Tena, they seem hell-bent on overturning Marbury v. Madison. Not to say "anything is possible," just to say you can't overstate their over-reach in this matter.
I think the greater danger would involve brazen conservative legistatures conceiving of new and interesting ways to invade privacy.--owenz
If they don't overturn Griswold, brazen conservative legislatures will not conceive anything.
Lettuce Spray.
I protect my Spermatazoan-Americans by keeping them in mason jars. My basement's filled with 'em.
Gen. JC Christian, remind me never to ask for preserves in your house.
they seem hell-bent on overturning Marbury v. Madison
Chief Justice Marshall always had it in for Christians.
But I worry - shit like that never stopped the maniacs from doing it anyway.
Are they going to go for broke, because they know this is their big chance? Or do they honestly believe the majority would accept all this meddling, or do they think they'll be able to hold on to power...somehow.
The last question scares me more than anything else.
They're fucking insane.
Oh yeah, they make so much sense. Ban abortions. Ban birth control. Push unrealistic abstinence-only programs in place of real sex education.
How many Andrea Yates and Susan Smiths do they want to see/
/=?.
well, it's just too nice outside for daytime blogging. everyone have a great day, and anyone who knows the skinny on what i'm going to do with myself in Cleveland this summer while writing feel free to email me.
phuc boosh with radioactive waste!
They're fucking insane.
pie
Or did you mean they're fucking insanely? i.e., without contraception?
Or maybe both?
This isn't the National Lampoon's Vacation-Series Griswolds, right?
Because I'm kind of in favor of banning that.
Not to say "anything is possible," just to say you can't overstate their over-reach in this matter.
Robert M. Jeffers - 4:47 pm
i haven't seen any evidence to suggest they have overreached yet, given 'o'er-reaching' implies any sort of criticism of their practices from the seething masses...
mebbe i'm too cloistered, i dunno. folks are a bit peeved, some of 'em...but they aren't furious, they aren't even angry...they don't really understand, most of 'em, what's been happening and what's at stake, and mostly they don't wanna know..."things are hard enough without you telling me my whole country's been hijacked by guys i elected?"...they just dont wanna know...
that said, didja get yr coffee yet?
.
Oh yeah, they make so much sense. Ban abortions. Ban birth control. Push unrealistic abstinence-only programs in place of real sex education.n
It's all about about political power and the browning of America. They need more white, Christian, non-Catholic babies.
Do you guys object to the govt. snooping in your bathrooms(low flush toilet) and income or are you just obsessed over bedrooms like the Right is?
Are they going to go for broke, because they know this is their big chance?
Going for broke because they know Schiavo broke them.
What, you expected them to pack up and slip away in the night?
They're going out kicking and screaming. But they're going out; and they know it.
How many Andrea Yates and Susan Smiths do they want to see/
Ahianne -- 4:51 pm
they never run out of needing victims to blame...
are we not at the stage of pitchforks, baseball bats and burning brands yet?
just askin...
.
Or maybe both?
Ah, yes. Both.
Oh, fuck!
"House Democrats have decided to quit emphasizing that they will not negotiate changes to Social Security until President Bush drops his idea for private accounts. The switch in strategy comes after Democrats learned from focus groups that people frown on the lawmakers for being obstinate."
http://tinyurl.com/e2kgc
Do you guys object to the govt. snooping in your bathrooms(low flush toilet) and income or are you just obsessed over bedrooms like the Right is?
Let's see: a toilet requires I connect to a public system for both water (supply) and discharge.
It's private to the extent I prefer the door closed, but that's about it.
The bedroom, on the other hand....
...well, why bother to go further? The comparison is ludicrous on its face.
But they're going out; and they know it.
I wish I believed that.
My questions are what do the pharma companies think of this?
Don't they make a bundle selling birth control (both script & OTC)?
Will they be willing to give up this profit?
Troll,
Far as I know, my state or for that matter, the federal government hasn't mandated that I change out my 20 year old toilet for a low flush one. Haven't received any official notice to do that.
And income taxes were set up to protect us from enemies, keep the infrastructure repaired and in order, and to provide for those less fortunate than I. (Of course, taxes do more now). I don't consider taxation a snooping into my privacy, they're the dues I paid to be able to live in this once great country.
Not too sure about it anymore now.
...that people frown on the lawmakers for being obstinate
Shades of Mark Shields.
So if the Dems become reticient, everyone will bitch that they have *no plan*, no ideas, no blah, blah, blah.
Christ.
Have they overreached
I think so. The right never recovered in WA State after its disasterous Christian dominated Republican Convention in Yakima and it's nomination of Ellen "Jesus appeared to me on the freeway" Craswell. I think we'll see the same nationally, although the advantage the low-population Cleetus states have in the Senate will always be problematic.
reticent
American Taliban!
Yeah. Someone needs to come up with an Ayatollah Khomeini-in-a-red-white-and-blue-turban-wearing-a-
Cross logo.
Or maybe Phyllis Schlaffly and Spoogebomb Stickydobson as "American Gothic" madeover in a decidedly Talibannish manner, pious beards on both of 'em. Also with the red white and blue togs. Any awtists out there?
Why can't people just let Clark Griswold alone?
Hasn't he suffered enough?
"House Democrats have decided to quit emphasizing that they will not negotiate changes to Social Security until President Bush drops his idea for private accounts. The switch in strategy comes after Democrats learned from focus groups that people frown on the lawmakers for being obstinate."
hey...how about that...well, that was unforeseen...took me completely by surprise...Democraps abandonning principle? who fuckin gnu???
btw:
is it pitchforks, baseball bats, and burning brands fuckin YET?
Robert - At this point, Tena, they seem hell-bent on overturning Marbury v. Madison. Not to say "anything is possible," just to say you can't overstate their over-reach in this matter
Yeah, that's why I ended up that comment saying anything is possible with this bunch.
I mean I'm still reeling over the push to overturn Marbury v Madison. I really can't get that thought to stick in my head - it's so insane that my brain keeps rejecting it.
Far as I know, my state or for that matter, the federal government hasn't mandated that I change out my 20 year old toilet for a low flush one. Haven't received any official notice to do that.
They'll have to pry my toilet from my cold, dead ass.
Gen. JC Christian, remind me never to ask for preserves in your house.
random factoid: in Spanish "preservativos" means condoms specifically, and birth control in general.
I once overheard a tourist go into a bakery in Madrid and ask for "pan, sin preservativos"
I laughed my ass off. I'm a bad foreigner.
They'll have to pry my toilet from my cold, dead ass.
Gen. JC Christian, patriot
Well, that's one way to go.
Nah. I truly do not believe the ban on the use/sale of contraceptive will be reinstituted.
Maybe not nationally, but if Griswold is overturned I could easily see towns, counties even states banning the sale. Use is different - enforcement just isn't realistic.
Which of course just means the sales would all migrate to internet/catalog sales from states where its legal.
Then the laws would try to ban the importation.
"House Democrats have decided to quit emphasizing that they will not negotiate changes to Social Security until President Bush drops his idea for private accounts. The switch in strategy comes after Democrats learned from focus groups that people frown on the lawmakers for being obstinate."
Simply strategy. Clinton beat Newt because Newt looked like the guy who "shut down the government." People are always reflexively against "partisanship" and "obstructionism," even if they don't know (a) what's going on, or (b) what the words mean.
Not emphasizing why you aren't submitting legislation, is not the same thing as submitting legislation. All the Dems have to do is tell the Prez to send something to Congress. After all, it's his idea, and his party controls both Houses.
Doozer - Seeing as how the infamous red/blue map, when viewed with a bit more detail, shows the USA to be largely Purple, I'd like to take this opportunity to suggest we drop the whole "Red State-Blue-State" thang, and just refer to Reds and Blues. (or Rednecks and Bluenecks, WTF).
This lets us usurp "Better dead than Red!", and have a hearty "Neener neener!" in the process, which is good for the soul.
Hear! Hear! I concur wholeheartedly.
They'll have to pry my toilet from my cold, dead ass.
Gen. JC Christian, patriot
Once again, General, sir, I salute you.
You crack me the hell up.
yeah, I think this is not such a big deal. As long as the dems don't get suckered into offering a plan (and I naively believe they aren't THAT fucking stupid).
They'll have to pry my toilet from my cold, dead ass.
This actually happens a lot when i get engrossed in something I'm reading in there...
The most precious right is life. Who's sexed obsessed Atrios? It's folks like you. Starve 'em to death, kill 'em in the womb, let them get pregant so we can kiil some more. I want governmnet out of my life, but not when it comes to protecting the innocents you and your kind want to murder.
(and I naively believe they aren't THAT fucking stupid).
They have got to know that georgie's SS reform in dead in the water.
I naively believe that.
I want governmnet out of my life, but not when it comes to protecting the innocents you and your kind want to murder.
Holy fuck. You are stupid.
they will not negotiate changes to Social Security until President Bush drops his idea for private accounts.
rhetorically, iirc, the syllogistic structure of this statement, if it truly represents the Dems' position, declares that, contrary to the past during which they refused to negotiate until and unless the Chimp dropped his demand for private accounts, now the WILL negotiate, even though the private accounts are still in play.
that sounds to me like a chinese coal mine disaster-size cave-in...
disabuse me, please...
i really need it...
.
I am wondering why Wingnuttia has two t's in it?
Shouldn't it be Wingnutia?
Or maybe Wingnutistan, which makes more sense given the declarations of Mullah Frist.
jdw -- Interesting to me that the article has no identified quotes from Democrats about the alleged switch. Even curious-er, the one blind quote about alleged results of the focus-group poll comes from a "top House aide" -- not even identified as a Democrat!
Also odd the story comes out on a weekend when constituents can't call their Dem reps' offices for verification.
Atrios, those who can should check the background on this.
Right | Email | Homepage | 04.16.05 - 5:07 pm
lookee, hyar, mah theres some dead thang caught in the thread... eeeewwwww it stinks...
.
"Cleetus states have in the Senate will always be problematic."
--patriotboy
My mom worked for a guy named Cletus many years ago. Not trying to be funny or anything, but I committed suicide.
According to Scott Peterson of the Christian Science Monitor, moreover, Iran is loosening its social strictures across the board as it seeks to accomodate its youth bulge.
Great. They move forward, and the phundies are trying their damndest to move America backwards.
Lovely.
"MMMM! Chocolate! I'm sending infinite stores of birth control equipment your way, Sallyh. And happiness."
I'm past the age of childbearing, and don't have any of the parts left, anyway, but I do have a worried 19 year old who appreciates it.
I am wondering why Wingnuttia has two t's in it?
Shouldn't it be Wingnutia?
Or maybe Wingnutistan, which makes more sense given the declarations of Mullah Frist.
Ba'al
Ba'al, yer getting bogged down in the Wingnutiae of it all...
disabuse me, please...
Don't look at me. You may have to resort to self-disabuse.
"I want governmnet out of my life, but not when it comes to protecting the innocents you and your kind want to murder."
Given that this moron is missing the point of Atrios' post, which pertained to CONTRACEPTION, I guess this particular wingnut is worried about our killing of innocent human spermatocytes and oocytes (unfertilized) and is ignoring the fact that contraception prevents pregnancy.
Talk about cognitive dissonance!
Almighty Ba'al queries:
Shouldn't it be Wingnutia?
Then I'd want to pronounce it "wing-noo-sha" which just sounds like a town in Wisconsin.
A "wingnutria" would be a flying fur-bearing mammal, I suppose.
No, I don't know what that means, either.
.
Wait, that should be "getting all blogged down in the..."
Oh, never mind.
As a purveyor of fine sarcasm and humor, I find it difficult to digest how someone can be as ignorant as Right is upthread.
Stop breathing my air.
Not trying to be funny or anything, but I committed suicide.
Um.
mer sez:
Not trying to be funny or anything, but I committed suicide.
You're pretty spry for a dead person.
.
disabuse me, please...
i really need it...
The stock market and Enron should disabuse you. Let them drag their feet. Things aren't getting better.
You should be more concerned about the next little horror the bushies have in mind.
Oh Jeez, mer, hope that was "almost committed".
On the Marbury vs. Madison front, IIRC some nutter introduces a bill overturning the power (or, alternately, the jurisdiction) of judicial review just about every term.
Thing is, those notions always got swept under the rug just because of their ludicrous-ness (ludicrosity?). Not so sure today, and I can already see the talking points forming before my eyes about taking power back from activist judges.
Shuddering at the future.
Ba®ndog | Email | Homepage | 04.16.05 - 5:16 pm
clever sig manipulation, sarge...
started formin yr cadre yet?
just askin...
Nah. I truly do not believe the ban on the use/sale of contraceptive will be reinstituted.
Maybe they won't ban birth control pills outright (although maybe they WILL) but you can bet you'll be seeing lots more instances of pharmacies refusing to sell b/c because of Talibangelical pressure, to the point where it could become very difficult to get.
And how long before they start pressuring doctors not to prescribe it? Think Randall Terry and Eric Rudolph outside your OB/GYN's office.
It's really difficult to imagine it could go so far, but OTOH, if you'd asked me 8 years ago if it could go as far as it's gone already, I would have accused you of being way too melodramatic.
They'll have to pry my toilet from my cold, dead ass.
Gen. JC Christian, patriot
Wow. Just like Elvis!
Wingnewton. The favorite Vegas act of Wingnuts.
On the Marbury vs. Madison front, IIRC some nutter introduces a bill overturning the power (or, alternately, the jurisdiction) of judicial review just about every term.
I'd love to see them pass this and the "nuclear option" one month before the Democrats retake Congress and the White House, and one week *after* they finally succeed in packing the judiciary with 100% wingnuts.
Wingnewton. The favorite Vegas act of Wingnuts.
And, of course, their fave philosopher, Wingnuttstein.
(or is that Wingnuttgenstein?)
The point about pharmaceutical companies losing income was a very good one.
Don't see them allowing the phundies to get their way.
That's "wingnutiae" as in the drivel's in the details...
Oh dear, just wanted someone to comment on a comment I made. haha.
"he"
sempar fubar - that's the backdoor they have going into banning birth control - those fucking "conscience laws". They are completely fucked up and I'd love to see someone challenge one. I don't think they could stand. To me, it's so backwards - the public goes to the pharmacist for a service. If the pharmacist won't perform the service, which is the pharmacist's sole raison d'etre - then the pharmacist just forfeited the right to be a pharmacist, goddamn it.
Santorum, for one, would love nothing more than to overturn Griswold vs. Connecticut.
On the Marbury vs. Madison front, IIRC some nutter introduces a bill overturning the power (or, alternately, the jurisdiction) of judicial review just about every term.
Thing is, those notions always got swept under the rug just because of their ludicrous-ness (ludicrosity?). Not so sure today, and I can already see the talking points forming before my eyes about taking power back from activist judges.
Shuddering at the future.
Nah. As we say in Texas, if there weren't nutcases in the Lege, it wouldn't be a representative body.
Last session was the lady who said healthcare for the indigent was an idea that came from Communist Russia, from the mouth of hell. Even in Texas, she was considered bonkers (her complaint actually was that illegal aliens get equal protection of the laws under Plyler v. Doe).
The lunatic will always be with you. Just have to keep an eye on 'em, is all.
What you are witnessing is not their ascendancy, but their flame-out. Two conditions that often appear alike.
Like Icarus, they have flown too close to the sun. Even now, they are falling.....
Interesting....
Former GOP congressman leads effort to oust DeLay
McCloskey says he and others are embarrassed by controversies
By GEBE MARTINEZ
Copyright 2005 Houston Chronicle Washington Bureau
WASHINGTON - A former Republican congressman who was a moderate ally of former President Bush is leading an effort to find a 2006 Republican primary election opponent for House Majority Leader Tom DeLay.
Former Rep. Pete McCloskey, whose eight terms in Congress ended before DeLay arrived in 1984, said Friday that he will meet in Houston this month with perennial DeLay opponent Michael Fjetland and "any Republican who is willing to challenge Mr. DeLay."
"It takes guts to challenge him," said McCloskey, who was known as a party maverick and endorsed Democratic presidential candidate John Kerry in 2004.
But, he said, he and moderate allies are embarrassed by the controversies surrounding DeLay, R-Sugar Land, including three admonishments of him last year by the House Ethics Committee.
"The stench coming out of the DeLay operation" does not represent the GOP that he served with in Congress, McCloskey said.
And, of course, their fave philosopher, Wingnuttstein.
Eli
Hey, now!
pie, i bow to none in my apprehension--nay, sheer terror--of what further depradations upon the Constitution, the People, and the Nation the bushevik regime might be capable and verily even poised...
nothing would really surprise me...
If the pharmacist won't perform the service, which is the pharmacist's sole raison d'etre - then the pharmacist just forfeited the right to be a pharmacist, goddamn it.
Exactly. The pharmacist has every right to have a moral objection, just as the pharmacy has the right to fire his ass, and the state has the right to take away his license. Simple.
Like Icarus, they have flown too close to the sun. Even now, they are falling.....
In that case, rmj, let them soaaaaaaar like eeeeeaaaaaagles. [/ashcroft]
I'd like to see them turn a nice crispy charcoaly color.
As goes Ecuador, so goes the United States, or, A Guide to the Construction of a Banana Republic.
====
April 16, 2005, 9:23AM
Ecuador president declares state of emergency, dismisses Supreme Court
Associated Press
QUITO, Ecuador -- President Lucio Gutierrez declared a state of emergency in the capital city of this Andean nation and dissolved the Supreme Court, saying the unpopular judges were the cause of three days of pot-banging street protests in Quito.
ADVERTISEMENT
Although they had opposed the court that was appointed by the president's congressional allies in December, his political foes immediately labeled its summary dissolution an act of a dictator.
Speaking in a televised address to the nation Friday night with his military high command standing behind him, Gutierrez said he was using the powers granted him by the constitution to dismiss the justices. In explaining their dismissal, he said opposition to their appointments was causing the protests.
"The measure ... was taken because Congress until now has not resolved the matter of the current Supreme Court, which is generating national commotion," he said.
pie - I raised the point about pharma losing money if BC is banned and GWPDA came back with a long post that boiled down to "no they won't, because they aren't making much off of BC". I don't know - I would think that that would be a pretty big market.
"The stench coming out of the DeLay operation" does not represent the GOP that he served with in Congress, McCloskey said.
Ah, but it does, Mr McCloskey. It most certainly does.
i don't understand the wignuts' obsession with reproduction.
they are deadset against abortion, and birth control.
why do they want to keep us breeding? for what?
to be drones at walmart?
wtf?
M&Ms please.
Plain or wingnut?
I don't know - I would think that that would be a pretty big market.
Maybe it's big, but the margins are low. Don't really know- just guessing.
Interesting: A tornado warning has just been issued for way southeast Bernalillo County /northeast Valencia County...out on the flats on the Isleta Rez, probably...very unstable weather hereabouts lately: summer thunder clouds over the mountains WAY too early for 'em...
freaky stuff
"yeah, I think this is not such a big deal. As long as the dems don't get suckered into offering a plan (and I naively believe they aren't THAT fucking stupid).
Atrios"
Hey Atrios, I have some great beach property in Utah that I'll let go very reasonable.
Ofcourse it is a long walk to the water, but then.... oh did I say it was cheap?
"I'd like to see them turn a nice crispy charcoaly color."
Me too.
Such a pleasing aroma! Pleasing to me, Ba'al.
Afternoon, freethinkers
I don't know - I would think that that would be a pretty big market.
Since insurance doesn't cover as much as it used to, someone's sure making money.
OT
Interesting interview with Riverbend over at Buzzflash.
"Riverbend: Peace and normalcy seem like a distant thing. One begins to forget what 'normal' was in the first place. We've come to realize that peace and normalcy are also relative. What we consider peace is obviously very different from the American concept of peace. Normality also changes with time. Three years ago, normal was being able to walk down the street with a sense of security. Today, normal is hearing at least three explosions a day and the hum of helicopters above."
Hit the"homepage" link if interested.
Interesting: A tornado warning has just been issued for way southeast Bernalillo County /northeast Valencia County...out on the flats on the Isleta Rez, probably...very unstable weather hereabouts lately: summer thunder clouds over the mountains WAY too early for 'em...
freaky stuff
it's the rapture! run for your life!
The Right has been after Griswold since it was decided. They absolutely hate it. But it's the foundation for our right to privacy and overturning it would open up an immense can of worms.
I don't know that it is possible for the SCOTUS to overturn it now, with so many subsequent decisions flowing from it. But I worry - shit like that never stopped the maniacs from doing it anyway.
Tena | Email | Homepage | 04.16.05 - 4:45 pm
The tacit assassination threats on Justice Kennedy last week at the fundie meeting in DC would appear to indicate that they are unwilling to wait until after 2008 when they fix that election. Apparently they feel that the liberal justices may just live another 12 years, hence the extremist push we've seen.
why do they want to keep us breeding? for what?
to be drones at walmart?
wtf?
ƒƒ€® €ÿ€§ 5:31 pm
serious answer to an antic question (and i luv the sig, dahlin...)
the things that effectively ended the unrest of the late 60s were two: Nixon sabotaged the economy, and kids who had been protesting, became parents and too busy with children to devote time to even reading, much less protests...
no shit, i was there...
.
Wouldn't a scientology practacing pharmacist also have the right to deny ant-depression medication under these conscience laws? The Christian Scientists should put a few people through pharma school. They could refuse to dispense anything but prayer.
Have I mentioned today that I hate these people?
and kids who had been protesting, became parents and too busy with children to devote time to even reading, much less protests...
ah....so the idea is to keep people busy with children, so busy that they will just put up and shut and take whatever the wingnuts dish out.
nice.
I believe that women also need to complain to their health insurance provider (assuming they have one) if they have a pharma problem.
If a pharmacy is threatened with removal from the network, they may shape up their business philosophy.
patriotboy,
Yeah, and the Christian Scientists need to get themselves some pharmacists, too. Their conscience will prevent them from dispensing penicillin and, hopefully, viagara. That would piss off red Murika.
Or go mail-order, which is usually cheaper anyway.
Have I mentioned today that I hate these people?
Hecate | Email | Homepage | 04.16.05 - 5:38 pm | # ,/i>
i hate them with a passion i didn't know i possessed.
Poor Iraq. The grass wasn't greener.
Yet they still have hope. I hate to tell them that as long as America is there, they will never own their country.
That realization should, and probably does, piss them off.
see? so passionate can't even do tags, damnit.
WGG:
Actually, what ended the protests
of the 60s was four kids getting
killed at Kent State.
Being shot at tends to concentrate
the mind, if you know what I mean.
I once ate a whole jar of Wingnutella™.
I was constipated for two weeks.
Billmon had a post a while back about some pharmacist refusing to dispense Viagra. And I thought Media Matters had a good post on the subject, too--they made the point that what's to stop some pharmacist from dispensing AIDS medication because, you know, AIDS is divine retribution? There's no end to the shit that allowing conscience clauses could set in motion.
circus came to town featuring:
"the flying wingnuts"
Actually, what ended the protests
of the 60s was four kids getting
killed at Kent State.
Shhhhhhhhhhhhhh. But you're absolutely right.
Four innocent kids.
steve sez:
Actually, what ended the protests
of the 60s was four kids getting
killed at Kent State.
Also, the end of the draft.
.
But all of those students protesting that day were also *innocent*.
Government gone mad. Not America. Government.
heh.
pie:
And don't believe for a minute that
Kent State was an accident.
Nixon was on the phone with the
governor of Ohio that morning.
No question that he gave the go-
ahead.
OT again, but this kinda cheered me up.
"I grabbed the first thing that came to hand — one of my garden gnomes — and hurled it at him, and hit him," she recalled.
"He lay there and I began to scream. I went back into the kitchen and found a rolling pin in case he came down. I didn't want to break another gnome."
Hiya, steve!
What would you say if I mentioned that I had some video of The Monks on Beat Club?
And don't believe for a minute that Kent State was an accident.
Next thing your gonna tell me is the FBI kept files on protesters.
"Tin soldiers 'n' Nixon comin'"
Well, that tune will now be haunting me all day.
Gotta go home and dig out my "Journey through the Past" album....
Nixon was on the phone with the
governor of Ohio that morning.
No question that he gave the go-
ahead.
I know that. I was a college freshman in 1970, and that episode horrified us all. Later, we moved to a town near Kent State. In 1990, the 20-year anniversary, the Cleveland radio stations played old interviews with the *enlightened* townies. I was horrified all over again.
Such fucking ignorance.
Almighty Ba'al queries:
Shouldn't it be Wingnutia?
Then I'd want to pronounce it "wing-noo-sha" which just sounds like a town in Wisconsin.
Definitely! Isn't that where they have the big Cheese Sculpture thing every year?
No, seriously!
Eli:
I would say so do I, but thanks for
thinking!!!
Where did you get it?
Mine's on a very funny video
comp called "Krautschlock" that
was done by some guys at WFMU.
Have I mentioned today that I hate these people?
Louder, please.
Shaw: No they haven't but when you update your bathroom or build a new house the govt. mandates the toilet you SHALL put in. Income tax didn't exist before the early 20th century and the country seemed to do fine. But you probably like the govt. with they're sigmoidiscope(sic) up your ass.
Oh, and the mullahs are loosening social mores to prevent a revolution, not becuase they see the light. Progress as opium for the people.
Eradicating the right to privacy would mean killing Griswold (contraceptives to married folks), Carey v. Population Services International (contraceptives to unmarried folks), Roe (abortion), and Lawrence v. Texas (sodomy).
Can you imagine what the *Please don't kill me* preznitwit would do?
These people are a danger to society and need to be locked up.
pie, You know anyone from Irag? Didn't think so..The grass is getting greener there chump. Just talk to someone related to one of the half a million Saddam killed. You rule here in this slime hole, but in the real world you don't know jack. More news for you, you lost in November, you'll lose ahgain in 06 an 08, and as long as we're here you and your ilk will never own this country...so you can sell it out. And we're not going anywhere, it's folks like us that were around at the beginning, running things. You're not going to ruin it...
Next thing your gonna tell me is the FBI kept files on protesters.
Poppycock! That's Communist propaganda! And Clyde will back me up!
.
Where did you get it?
Oh, the usual place...
*slyly places finger alongside nose*
Shouldn't it be Wingnutia?
Ba'al
Wingnutia is the small detail involved in dragging the country into the gutter of theocracy.
(that may have come out wrong...)
How long before we get into removing the source of all evil.
Cliterectomies
Infibulation
All girls/women over age 12
And castration for non-complient males.
Eliminate the problem at the root.
right:
Just blow me, OK?
I'm too tired to do the whole act,
but those who know me can fill
in the blanks.
Income tax didn't exist before the early 20th century and the country seemed to do fine.
The country seemed to do fine? How the fuck would you know that, little man? Were you there?
OMG. Your stupidity is beyond belief.
Makes me wonder if they will bar tubal ligation and vasectomies too?
"Tin soldiers 'n' Nixon comin'"
Oh hell, RMJ, didja hafta??
You know anyone from Irag?
Never heard of it.
Eli:
Just out of curiosity, how did you
hear about the Monks?
For myself, one day in the early 90s
I was browsing the All-Music guide
and stumbled across their bio.
Frankly, I didn't believe it was
real at first.
It's just too incredible a story.
And then when I heard the album....
blew my tiny mind.
You gotta love this - Our soldiers in Iraq don't have armour and are underequipped, and someone is worrying about low flush toilets back here.
BTW:
The restored version of "Grand
Illusion" is on Turner Classic
Movies at 8.
If you haven't seen it, pounce.
steve - I don't know about the monks and now I'm dying to - what is the story?
Ah, the smell of troll spoor. So easy to just drive on by.
And we're not going anywhere, it's folks like us that were around at the beginning, running things.
The beginning?
Which beginning would that be?
tell me right is a parody troll.
have our resident trolls really gotten this incredibly stupid?
did they all get terminal sunstroke at the Schiavofest?
I'm not even going to ask for smarter trolls...I just want them approximating the cranial capacity of gnats
Right -- uh, reality check, bub.
Iraqi Hostage Situation Reported
Details Unclear but Iraqi Officials Say Sunni Extremists Are Threatening to Kill Group of Shiites
By Caryle Murphy
Washington Post Staff Writer
Sunday, April 17, 2005; 5:03 PM
BAGHDAD, April 16 -- A group of masked, armed men believed to be Sunni extremists reportedly is threatening to kill a group of Shiite Muslim hostages in a central Iraqi town unless Shiite residents leave their homes, according to a police officer and Shiite Muslim officials.
Many details of the apparently still-evolving situation in Mada'in, a town about 30 southeast of Baghdad, remain unclear, including the number of alleged hostages, how and when they were seized, and how Iraqi police and armed forces are responding.
But in a sign of concern over the incident's effect on rising sectarian tensions, Shiite Muslim political and religious leaders have called for calm. They also are demanding that acting Prime Minister Ayad Allawi and other top officials address the situation when the National Assembly meets Sunday.
Mada'in has a mixed population of both Sunni and Shiite Muslim families. But there, as elsewhere in Iraq, tensions between the two groups have worsened as the predominantly Sunni insurgency that is battling U.S. and Iraqi military forces has also targeted Shiite civilians. The latest events in Mada'in come amid an uptick in violence following a period of relative calm in the last two months.
The situation in Mada'in "is very bad, everyone is scared," said Ali Dabbagh, a spokesman for the predominantly Shiite Muslim political coalition, the United Iraqi Alliance, which has asked for an official report to parliament.
"We feel this is an important issue and has threatened the political process," added Dabbagh.
Sabah Kadhim, a spokesman for the Interior Ministry, said he could not confirm the reports of hostage-taking because "the communications were so bad today we could not contact our police or the officials" in Mada'in. He said the ministry had sent police commandos to the farming town.
Dabbagh said residents of Mada'in told the alliance that 60 hostages were taken from a Shiite mosque, and that the mosque was damaged by a bomb. Other sources said the number of hostages was in the range of a dozen.
Haytham Mohamed Ali, 34, a police captain in Salman Pak, a town near Mada'in, was in Mada'in Saturday and told The Washington Post that armed, masked men driving three pickup trucks and an Opel used loud speakers on Friday to threaten Shiites, telling them to leave the town within 48 hours "because we cannot be patient any more with you being agents and spy for the occupiers."
They threatened to kill more than 60 Shiite male hostages, Mohamed said, adding that 13 Shiite families had fled the town.
Haitham Al Hassani, a spokesman for Abdul Aziz Hakim, head of the Supreme Islamic Revolution in Iraq (SCIRI), said that on Thursday Sunni extremists in Mada'in "blew up" the Shiite mosque Al Rasool Al Adham. The situation "deteriorated further" Friday, he added, when "a large number of armed men took some hostages."
Similar reports reached Najaf, the holy city of Shiite Muslims about 90 miles south of Baghdad, where about 20 families from Mada'in have taken refuge, according to Sheikh Ali Bashir Najafi, the son and spokesman for senior Shiite cleric Bashir Najafi.
Najafi added that the extremists doing such things "are not Iraqis. This kind of act is shameful and against the unity of the country and we stress the right of all Iraqis to live together. The Sunnis and Shiites are brothers."
A man in Najaf who gave his name only as Abu Jassim, or Father of Jassim, told The Post that he had left Mada'in earlier this week with his seven children because the extremists, who are residents of the town, "told us if you don't leave we will destroy the whole family.
"We have no power in that place because most of the people are Sunnis and Wahhabis," he added. "They have the doctrine of fighting the Iraqi government, the American forces and the Shias because the Shias do not fight them."
Filing from Mada'in Saturday, Reuter reporter Waleed Ibrahim wrote that no U.S. or Iraqi forces could be seen in the town, where masked extremists with AK-47 rifles appeared to move about freely.
"Tin soldiers 'n' Nixon comin'"
Oh hell, RMJ, didja hafta??
flory
Mention Kent State, and I'm back in Texas Stadium in Irving, for the encore on CSNY's last tour.
It's like a flashback or something....
A group of masked, armed men believed to be Sunni extremists reportedly is threatening to kill a group of Shiite Muslim hostages in a central Iraqi town unless Shiite residents leave their homes, according to a police officer and Shiite Muslim officials.
Well, that shouldn't do anything to make things worse.
Oy.
well bkny, sounds to me like these are just fine and fucking dandy over in iraq, wouldn't you say?
goddamnit!
No they haven't but when you update your bathroom--Troll
I updated a bathroom in another house 5 years ago. No federal mandate for any kind of flush toilet.
Income tax didn't exist before the early 20th century and the country seemed to do fine.--Troll
Before the 20th century there was less than half the population, no cars, trucks or buses, so no well maintained highways, bridges and tunnels were needed. That names only one change since the turn of the century. We were using horse and buggies fer chrissakes, pre-20th century, and rural America didn't even have indoor plumbing or electricity! Sheesh.
We are not the same country in any way that we were pre-20th century!
What an asinine comment.
Do you like the government with their fist inside your uterus? or your wife's or girlfriend's? Or the government telling you how to have sex?
You are hopelessly stupid. Scat.
And stop embarrassing yourself.
Just out of curiosity, how did you
hear about the Monks?
From this eccentric-but-cool music critic who hangs out here sometimes - perhaps you've heard of him?
"Tin soldiers 'n' Nixon comin'"
when i proudly proclaimed (many moons ago) i had learned that song on the guitar, patriot boy responded "best protest song ever" and he was right.
and lets hope it doesn't come to that, but i fear it well.
my advice, sharpen your boning knives. these fuckers are drunk on power, and they are on a rampage.
and now sadly, i remember the time RMJ posted Orwells 'To Shoot an Elephant'
Does anyone else hear a high-pitched whining sound?
AW geeze, lookit this! Someone just threw up a whole bunch of very stupid sentences upthread...
Guess I'll tell Ted to grab his mop...
I think this is a little more than we needed to know about Sullie:
In deference to my relationship (and my sanity), I'm not blogging in the early hours any more. I'm spooning.
Tena:
Here's a link to their official
web site, which has the whole
astonishing story.
http://www.the-monks.com/
Before the 20th century there was less than half the population, no cars, trucks or buses, so no well maintained highways, bridges and tunnels were needed. That names only one change since the turn of the century. We were using horse and buggies fer chrissakes, pre-20th century, and rural America didn't even have indoor plumbing or electricity! Sheesh.
We also didn't have a great big honkin' state-of-the-art military.
No they haven't but when you update your bathroom or build a new house the govt. mandates the toilet you SHALL put in.
Seeing as the government determine riparian rights in the first place (whose water is it, and how much does any individual get to use), I don't have a problem with this.
Why do you?
I disposed of this argument on the same lines earlier, BTW. Do try to keep up.
Hey, chris/tx, if spooning will make him from posting crap, then spoon, baby, spoon to your heart's content.
You gotta love this - Our soldiers in Iraq don't have armour and are underequipped, and someone is worrying about low flush toilets back here.
Tena
Did you read the entire post, Tena?
He/she says we didn't have income tax pre-20th century and we did very well then.
Y'know, these mouth breathers get all hissy-faced when we say they're stoooooopid. But every time they post or open their mouth, they just confirm it in a blazingly painful way.
These are Bush Boy's followers. If they were any more stupid, we'd have to put wheels on them.
You know anyone from Irag? The grass is getting greener there chump.
I do, and things are getting marginally better there than they were under the islamic radicals who ran their country like you want to run ours. It's taken 25 years. Moderation was beginning to emerge before the Glorious War to Liberate Iraqi Oil by Killing Thousands. My Iranian friends think the US has made the process more difficult, not less, because by reaching out toward the west the moderates appear to be conciliatory toward the US, and this is not generally a popular stance in the Middle East -- are you aware that we aren't so popular in a lot of places?
Just talk to someone related to one of the half a million Saddam killed.
Then talk to someone related to one of the 100 thousand or so killed by the US, and ask them which people they prefer to have their family murdered by. You may be surprised to learn that there is not so much gratitude for liberation by death as you might expect from watching Fox.
You rule here in this slime hole, but in the real world you don't know jack.
Speaking only for myself, but having observed others in this particular slime hole quite closely, I'm in a position to tell you that you don't know your ass from a hole in the ground on this one.
More news for you, you lost in November, you'll lose ahgain in 06 an 08,
That's possible. We'll see.
and as long as we're here you and your ilk will never own this country
. . . because you and your ilk own it? Thought it was one of those free society deals. I think it still is, marginally. I get that you don't care much for freedom, but we're working on that.
...so you can sell it out.
Jeez, what could we sell first? Votes in congress and the senate -- nope, already gone! How about freedom of expression . . . oops, bidding has already closed. Drilling in national parks and cutting old-growth forests and polluting the air and water for dollars . . . damn, we missed that opportunity, too! An impartial judiciary that is independent of political pressure? Hell, missed again.
And we're not going anywhere,
Well, you are, but it's starting to look like where you're going is 1861. Or 1461.
it's folks like us that were around at the beginning, running things.
So you gotta be, what, like 30,000 years old?
You're not going to ruin it..
You're going to beat us to the punch on that one by a mile, for sure.
And we're not going anywhere, it's folks like us that were around at the beginning, running things. You're not going to ruin it...
That about sums it up nicely, I should say.
Didn't like Brown, either, I bet.
Troll: Shaw: No they haven't but when you update your bathroom or build a new house the govt. mandates the toilet you SHALL put in.
The government mandates all kinds of crap, not just crappers. They're called building codes, for crying out loud.
Income tax didn't exist before the early 20th century and the country seemed to do fine.
That's because an income tax was unconstitutional until the passage of the 16th amendment in 1913. Funny, they seem to have found it important enough to change the Constitution over it.
We also didn't have a great big honkin' state-of-the-art military.
Eli
As Kurt Vonnegut points out, that came after WWII.
And Eisenhower warned us against it when he left the Presidency.
Hmmm. Using wacky old-timey-America analogies to justify a wingnutty point?
I think Justice Scalia is trolling today.
(That's not quite fair to the old sodomophobe, since he's more wrapped up in original intent voodoo, but whatever. It's cocktail time.)
(jack black, high fidelity) Ooooh, is [right] in a coma?
I don't know if anyone's interested, but I suspect I'm seeing the beginning of the housing bubble bursting here in New Orleans. I'm seeing houses sit on the market for months, and prices being lowered in the uptown area. This may be a reflection of the fact that NOLA crime rate is going up again, but it may also be the beginning of a sell-off.
Eli:
Seriously, where did you find the
video?
Did you get it off the web
somewhere?
ƒƒ€® €ÿ€§ -- yea, things be going just dandy in iraq. here's some more of that good news:
BAGHDAD, Iraq Apr 16, 2005 — Eleven detainees upset about their treatment by U.S. captors escaped Saturday from the military's largest detention center in Iraq by climbing through a hole in the fence, and bombings around the country killed a dozen Iraqis. Ten of the 11 escapees were recaptured after fleeing Camp Bucca, the largest U.S. detention facility with about 6,000 prisoners, nearly two-thirds of all those in Iraq.
The situation in Iraq is becoming very similar to the situation in Rwanda in the 1990s.
As conditions become more oppressive and the the rulers disappear behind higher walls, the general population begins to fight each other for the limited resources available.
In Rwanda it started Tutsi vs Hutu, then progressed to the village level.
In Iraq is is moving from Sunni to Shia and progressing to the village level.
It's beginning to get hot in Iraq and the nightmare has gone on too long for the average Iraqi.
You know anyone from Irag? The grass is getting greener there chump.
Actually, I understand Iraq had the highest number of Ph.D.'s in the Middle East under Hussein; excellent health care; and steady utilities.
Now they have water a few hours a day; ditto for electricity; schools are almost non-existent, except for the ones we've "painted;" and the medical system is so broken it's almost non-existent.
This is greener?
Rmj, Dynamic Swami | Email | Homepage | 04.16.05 - 6:15 pm | #
Rape rooms!!!!
You want Saddam back in power!!!
Rape rooms
Sounds like Abu Gharaib run by private contractors.
fill in the blank time:
not satisfied with fucking over the us, the current fascist regime invaded another country called iraq.
after completely destroying that sovreign nation and justifying it by claiming "freedom is on the march," the fascist regime then moved on to _________, and justifed that invasion by claiming ________.
Hey, Right - go enlist!
For everyone else, raspberry pie's on me.
Rape rooms!!!!
You want Saddam back in power!!!
Abu Ghraib.
Rape, murder, et cetera, et cetera.
Oh, did it say "Iraq?" My bad.
Yes, the burnt, smoking grass under the car bomb du jour is getting quite a bit greener. And the child starvation, being only double what it was under Saddam, is much, much nicer when the starving child is "free! free!" And the women who are becoming more and more afraid to leave their homes alone, even in burkas, are as green as can be. In fact, it's so wonderful I can't imagine how a freedom-loving democracy fan such as yourself could keep himself away!
mmmmm raspbery pies... mmmm...
Virginia:
Have I mentioned I really enjoy
your work?
Oh, did it say "Iraq?"
It said Irag.
As Kurt Vonnegut points out, that came after WWII.
In its present state of gigantism, yeah. But when did we start having great-power aspirations and start building up our military? Didn't we step up the imperialism around the turn of the century?
It's abortion. Many forms of BC work after fertilization, (think the pill, IUD, patch, morning after) by changing the lining of the uterus, thus preventing the fertilized egg from emplanting. If you believe, as they do, that life begins at conception, it is only logical that they want to try and outlaw BC.
An ancillary benefit: if guys aren't home getting laid on a regular basis, how many more will sign up to go to war. That energy has to go somewhere. Why not channel it into killing brown people. As for the women, well we never really counted for anything anyway. White women to produce progeny, and brown women for some hubba, hubba.
Makes perfect sense if you are a ratfucker.
Have I mentioned I really enjoy
your work?
steve simels
Dayum, you sure know how to make a girl's day! I think you're brilliant, so I hope you're not mocking me . . . (If you are, please don't say so -- i'll almost certainly cry.)
Steve: Yeah, the internet is a wonderful thing...
Softer Yahoo, same feeds, and I suspect some uncharted new features...
http://beta.news.yahoo.com
Virginia, of course I'm serious.
Shame Santorum and Frist weren't abortions - or their moms didn't do more blow jobs!
"Will wedding bells ring tonight for Mary Kay Letourneau?"
Swear to god - just heard this on the news.
Does anyone really care that this headcase daughter of a right wing nutjob hypocrite is going to marry a guy 1/2 her age?
I feel sorry for her first husband and all of her children.
What a psycho bitch she is! Her daddy would have fit right in with this current crowd.
"Grand
Illusion"
+++++++++++++++++++++++++
Reinforced everything I learned in First Day School. Wonderful movie.
steve - wow, thanks for the link. That was fascinating.
That was an awesome smackdown, Virginia. The only marginal bright side to having trolls around is that it brings out some great writing (and/or snark) from the fine people here. Me, I just deny desserts to them.
It's like I've been saying.
This is all about fucking, and the fact that it drives fundies nuts that people fuck without guilt and without consequence, that is, a bundle of joy arriving 9 months after they fuck.
This drives the fundies batshit. They are sick, twisted people who should be put on a fucking island someplace if they don't stop butting into the lives of others.
who is Mary Kay Letourneau?
Oy
Amid fresh jitters from Wall Street, finance officials from the world's industrial powers said Saturday surging oil prices could crimp the economy and they pledged to limit the fallout.
Notice the look on Snowjob's face in the picture accompanying the article.
Looks like you get their sexual control issues, just like their guns, only when you pry them from their cold, dead hands....
They're going to be looking down the barrels of a few guns if they persist in barging into people's bedrooms.
And I agree with a prior poster: if they outlaw abortion or birth control, many members of their own party will be tres pissed.
Tena:
The album is, alas, out of print
at the moment (at least I think so)
but if you want I'd be happy to
burn you a copy.
Just e-mail me your snail mail
address.
ƒƒ€® €ÿ€§, please. Just google it.
QL in NY, the pill works mainly by preventing ovulation. If ovulation happens anyway, which would be in very few cases, then it is possible that the fertilized egg will not be able to attach to the lining of the uterus. But it also may. I have googled on studies about this, and there is no definite study showing this effect. Which is behind the wingnuts' refusal to dispense birth control pills.
steve simels - Thank you - I will do that. That's very kind of you.
did someone say raspberry pie? Oh my!
I loooove pie. And I love raspberry pie,too!
Gotta go kids....have fun and
pray for Bush to resign before the
night is over.
oh, i remember her now.
Thanks Echnide for the most up-to-date info. I admit, since I no longer worry about getting pregnant, to not being completely up-to-date. When I did worry about conception, that was the explanation given me by my gyno.
and as long as we're here you and your ilk will never own this country
Ilk? We have ilk?
Hmmm....
Got ilk?
it's folks like us that were around at the beginning, running things.
Right
There's tremendous irony here. One hardly knows which direction to take....
Gotta go kids....have fun and
pray for Bush to resign before the
night is over.
I just can't picture him resigning from anything, *ever*. It's an admission of error, the one thing he can never do.
Our only chance would be to give him a billion-dollar Golden Parachute to go away. Me personally, I'd rather give him a golden something-else...
Got ilk?
Ilk, it does a body politic good.
Ciao, steve. have fun.
You've got mail.
googlefight:
sex 173 million
fundamentalists 1,140,000
diarrhea 5,730,000
trolls 2,250,000
it's official: an attack of diarrhea is preferable to a troll attack in a comments thread.
Echidne, that's what bothers me the most about pharmacists refusing to dispense the pill. They're supposed to know how these things work!
Sure there's a small percentage of failure with the pill, but that's measured by actual pregnancies, not ovulations. How the hell could anyone count ovulations, if they were stupid enough to try?
Our only chance would be to give him a billion-dollar Golden Parachute to go away.
God willing, he was awake that day in MBA school...
One of the reasons Bork was such an unpopular nominee for the SC was that he criticized the Griswold ruling on the grounds that banning contraception was really no different than zoning an industrial plant out of a residential neighborhood. Obviously, the analogy could hardly be more perfect.
Also, the next time a conservative tries pulling the one about how there's not right to privacy in the constitution remind them of the ninth amendment:
The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.
I don't know why "strict constructionist" keep missing that one.
it's folks like us that were around at the beginning, running things.
Right
One hardly knows which direction to take....
Easy. His ancestors were monkeys.
I updated a bathroom in another house 5 years ago. No federal mandate for any kind of flush toilet.
OK, so we allow high water-use toilets, the city/county water services run out of water in late summer and we take showers with seltzer water.
We're running out of resources, period. Scrap metal doubled in price in 2004, and wood products were up an average or 27%. Maybe the water systems need similar price increases, then a 10 gallon flush would become costly enough to warrant replacement.
But then, maybe the trolls have so much shit to dump on the rest of society that they'd clog up their sewers. Yes, that's it.
And one of the primary cases used in Griswold as a precedent goes back to the 1920s and, if the right to privacy were overturned, would bite the wingnuts in the behind.
I forget the name of the case, but it involved the state of Oregon trying to inhibit Catholic schools by requiring that all children attend public schools.
The SC's reasoning, IIRC, was based on the 9th Amendment: "The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people." The court said (and I'm paraphrasing from memory here) that there are certain individual rights that are so basic, so intrinsic that these are among the "rights retained by the people." Among them, the court ruled, was the decision of where to send one's children to school: this was a personal decision in which the state has no right to intervene.
And of course if you take away the right of privacy as outlined in this case, that means that wingnuts could be forbidden to send their children to Christian schools or homeschool them.
Even more oy.
"WASHINGTON, April 15 (Reuters) - Don't hold your breath for the euro to oust the dollar as the world reserve currency, a top European Central Bank policy-maker recommended on Friday.
{edit}
Others cautioned the euro may be denied the luxury of time, with the mammoth U.S. current account and budget deficits potentially unseating the dollar as the world's reserve currency and promoting the euro by default.
"Ready or not, it's coming. The dollar's decline is coming and we need an additional leader," said Adam Posen, a senior fellow at the Institute for International Economics which was hosting the conference."
Gotta go kids....have fun and
pray for Bush to resign before the
night is over.
steve simels
That's aiming too low. I was hoping for a massive coincidence with all of the rethuglicans dropping dead overnight.
I don't know why "strict constructionist" keep missing that one.
Well they are the same strict constructionists who construe the free exercise of religion in the First Amendment to mean that fundie xians get to rule because their religions says so. It's their "free exercise of religion" to acquire power and run an inquisition.
The sand is getting greener in Iraq, people. GW is the greatest preznit ever. Freedumb is on the marsh. Trolls are too stupid to get out of their own way, too cowardly to fight the "wars" that they jack off over, and are really just a waste of air. Abortion could only be improved upon if it were retroactive. Think how much better off the world would be if Barbara Bush had the brains to have had several abortions rather than the monsters she spawned.
Troll:
Income tax mostly covers Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid and defense. You could look it up. Then you could either be against these things or figure out how to pay for them. Pays for the infrastructure that lets a couple of hundred million people have sewage connections and running water, too. Oh, well.
Justice Kennedy a liberal judge? A Reagan appointee, one of the Fab Five in Bush v. Gore? How the goal posts have been moved.
RMJ:
Hope you're right, but I can count a few times when I was sure they'd jumped the shark with some new outrage. The pendulum will swing; the only question is how many people get hurt, and how much rot seeps into the foundation.
And of course if you take away the right of privacy as outlined in this case, that means that wingnuts could be forbidden to send their children to Christian schools or homeschool them.
This is why the Schiavo case blew up in their faces. Most Americans understand, in some way, that the legal/social fabric is a tapestry, and the more imbedded the threads (privacy, judicial review) the more unravelling it does when you try to remove one.
The supporters of "original intent" miss this reality altogether.
From an AP business writer:
"I think the economy is on solid footing and we're in the middle innings of an expansion and we have a way to go," Battipaglia said. "The message for small investors is, don't make changes to your portfolio allocation because the momentum of the moment is putting you out of favor."
snip
"I don't think this is the end of the cycle. It's an extended breather, one that gets people psychologically down, and from that point we'll get the rally," said Riley. "You gotta buy when nobody wants 'em."
Ah, the world through rose colored glasses.
Evening Moonbats * or afternoon depending on time zones
Hieronymous - In other words, they read the constitution the same way they read the bible. Selectively and with intent.
Ya know, back when I was agitating for choice (in the late Pleistocene), I was standing on a street corner holding a sign -- you know, the way ya do -- when a big white Cadillac swooshed up to the curb. The driver leaned over and shouted out the window to me, "I wish YOUR mom had had an abortion!" I have never understood exactly how that would work. So . . . you're a LITTLE pro-choice, except you need to be able to foresee the future?
BTW, my mother tried to get an abortion. In those dark long-ago days, three doctors had to agree that the mother's life was in danger, and she could only get two to sign on. I would have liked to have told that guy that I perfectly understood (she almost died, again), and never took it the least personally.
Justice Kennedy a liberal judge? A Reagan appointee, one of the Fab Five in Bush v. Gore? How the goal posts have been moved.
How many times have the goalposts been moved?
When they test the efficiency of toilet designs, they simulate 'turds' with a soy based paste.
"Tin soldiers 'n' Nixon comin'"
Listening to it now. Still think it's the best protest song ever.
Soon not only will women have to stock up on Today sponges, a la Elaine Benes ("Are you sponge-worthy?") but men will have to stock up on their favorite condom brands...too bad they have expiration dates, though.
"strict constructionists" is right up there with "states' rights" as far as cooked-up code words go.
Anyone recall Bush in 2000 when asked about his preferences in judges?
"I'll appoint strict constructionists."
and what are those exactly, governor?
[moment of pure panic, followed by smirk and recitation of taling points]
--
Yeesh. Thanks for keeping me sane, y'all. Off to enjoy the only 2 things that don't need to change in the South: barbecue and bourbon.
Oh man, I just teared up a little there...
Our only chance would be to give him a billion-dollar Golden Parachute to go away. Me personally, I'd rather give him a golden something-else...
May he drown under such a shower.
When they test the efficiency of toilet designs, they simulate 'turds' with a soy based paste.
But you get so *attached* to soy-based paste...
Listening to it now. Still think it's the best protest song ever.
patriotboy,
I'm partial to Don Henley's "Little Tin God," myself. But "Ohio" is rillyrilly good, too.
Is there any raspberry pie left? Mmmm, pie and coffee.
When they test the efficiency of toilet designs, they simulate 'turds' with a soy based paste.
hahahaha. What the hell is the job description for that?
How many times have the goalposts been moved?
Damn pie, they did away with the goalposts a long time ago. Now they just declare victory in mid-game and move on.
But "Ohio" is rillyrilly good, too.
Four dead in O-hi-o.
Oh-- and "I am a Patriot," Stevie Ray* via Jackson Browne.
*I'm gonna feel like an idiot if that's wrong, but I'm too lazy to check.
I just found out Dick Cheney is coming to Oklahoma City on Tuesday to commemorate what his bastard step son Tim McVeigh did here ten fucking years ago.
Why not bring the author of the fucking Turner Diaries with you Dick?
chris/tx--sounds like the real esate agents in Austin in the '90's, just after the bottom dropped out and bankruptcies skyrocketed.
UN must reform or die, says Rice
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/ameri...cas/
4450941.stm
hahahaha. What the hell is the job description for that?
watertiger
Vegan Chef.
Now they just declare victory in mid-game and move on.
But they lost the last battle. And the one before that. And so many others before that.
They're not competent to run the country.
Patriotboy,
When Isaw CS&N last summer two things stood out: one, theylouded sported FUCK BUSH stickers on their equipment and Two, their first song was Graham Nash's MILITARY MADNESS. (Not a bad protest song either)
Actually, what ended the protests
of the 60s was four kids getting
killed at Kent State.
Being shot at tends to concentrate
the mind, if you know what I mean.
i respectfully disagree, senor Steve...
kent state occurred May 4, 1970...
and the vastly less known killings at Jackson State, in Mississippi, 10 days later; unrest continued unabated, and if anything increased, right through the 1972 presidential campaign (in which i was up to my neck, in various campaigns)...
then the troops started coming home, in late '72, and by the end of '73, US ground forces were effetively out of Nam...fearful that the mobilization which had ended the war might be turned to other targets, Nixon started a recession, killed off a bunch of industrial jobs, and began the long, slow, agonizing empauperization of the middle class...
.
iirc...
As for the women, well we never really counted for anything anyway. White women to produce progeny, and brown women for some hubba, hubba.
Makes perfect sense if you are a ratfucker.
Just thought this deserved repeating.
Once they get rid of contraception, we'll all be giving and getting that oral sex that sends Rush and others into such a snit. Maybe they hate it because it doesn't threaten to cause pregnancy??
men will have to stock up on their favorite condom brands...too bad they have expiration dates, though.
So do Today sponges, but you can buy them from Canada. Adding in the shipping costs, they're a little pricey, which adds another meaning to the question "are you sponge-worthy?"
DWD, are they still touring at all? Doues Neal Young ever get together with them?
Protest Song -
Buffalo Springfield -
There's something happening here,
what it is ain't exactly clear;
there's a man with a gun over there
telling me I got to beware
think it's time to stop, hey what's that sound
everybody look what's going down---
RMJ - Yes, reminds me of rule #1 in consumerism - Never take the advice of someone that will profit from your purchase.
"Tin soldiers 'n' Nixon comin'"
Listening to it now. Still think it's the best protest song ever.
Prolly so - but its also one of those songs its impossible to get out of your head once it starts replay.
Tena, that's my second favorite.
Hieronymous - In other words, they read the constitution the same way they read the bible. Selectively and with intent.
Tena
Oh, Lord, don't get me started. I'm stuck in the bookstore now with Joel Osteen's "Daily Journal" to accompany his "Your Best Life Now!" piece o'crap. It's full of scriptural proof-texting of the worst kind.
I need left rev. here to commiserate with me over this butchery of scripture. It's hideous, I tell ya.
Patriotboy (Who still does excellent work and I appreciate him very much.)
CS&N still touring? Not that I know of. I think Neil does sometimes. My wife saw them a year ago in the winter and he was with them. But I think he has been ill as of late.
Oddly enough, one of the band members is from this area: that is the only reason I can conceive of that they played a little backwater place like Muskegon, MI. But it was one hell of a show.
(Damn! I just want to wake up from this nightmare. Kerry would be president and . . . )
Maybe they hate it because it doesn't threaten to cause pregnancy??
Hecate
Why can't a bar open (around here) on Sunday until after noon? Because, like everything else, they cannot STAND to imagine someone doing something they wish they could do -- especially while they're in church. Same deal with sex in general. All this anti-abortion anti-bc horseshit is just sour grapes. They're not comfortable with it, so no one else gets to, because I said so, dammit! They looooooove the consequences! If you want to have sex, you should get AIDS/pregnant/whatever. Neener, neener.
(I seem to have bloggohrea this afternoon. Need to vent. Sorry.)
Maybe they hate it because it doesn't threaten to cause pregnancy??
I thought the general consensus of opinion was they hate it cos they're *never* gonna get any?
"I don't think this is the end of the cycle. It's an extended breather, one that gets people psychologically down, and from that point we'll get the rally," said Riley. "You gotta buy when nobody wants 'em."
++++++++++++++++++++++++
Does this remind anyone of Ken Lay telling his employees to buy Enron while he himself was dumping the stock.
Protest Song -
Buffalo Springfield -
Okay, now I do have to dig out "Journey Through The Past."
"Well hello, Mr. Soul, I dropped by to pick up a reason...."
Haggard's Walkin' on the Fightin' Side of Me is my favorite.
I hear people talkin' bad,
About the way we have to live here in this country,
Harpin' on the wars we fight,
An' gripin' 'bout the way things oughta be.
An' I don't mind 'em switchin' sides,
An' standin' up for things they believe in.
When they're runnin' down my country, man,
They're walkin' on the fightin' side of me.
Yeah, walkin' on the fightin' side of me.
Runnin' down the way of life,
Our fightin' men have fought and died to keep.
If you don't love it, leave it:
Let this song I'm singin' be a warnin'.
If you're runnin' down my country, man,
You're walkin' on the fightin' side of me.
I read about some squirrely guy,
Who claims, he just don't believe in fightin'.
An' I wonder just how long,
The rest of us can count on bein' free.
They love our milk an' honey,
But they preach about some other way of livin'.
When they're runnin' down my country, hoss,
They're walkin' on the fightin' side of me.
Yeah, walkin' on the fightin' side of me.
Runnin' down the way of life,
Our fightin' men have fought and died to keep.
If you don't love it, leave it:
Let this song I'm singin' be a warnin'.
If you're runnin' down my country, man,
You're walkin' on the fightin' side of me.
Yeah, walkin' on the fightin' side of me.
Runnin' down the way of life,
Our fightin' men have fought and died to keep.
If you don't love it, leave it:
Let this song I'm singin' be a warnin'.
If you're runnin' down my country, man,
You're walkin' on the fightin' side of me.
finance officials from the world's industrial powers said Saturday surging oil prices could crimp the economy and they pledged to limit the fallout.
yup...they've already been successful at that latter part, limiting the fallout mostly to the poor and middle-classes...
you'll also have noted that the finance officials (or the reporter) do not distinguish among economies anymore, but refer instead to a single, world-wide economy...
now will someone explain to this ancient and decaying hippie how being a wage slave of a world-wide economy is superior to (or frankly much different from) being a citizen of a global state?
just askin, fer chrissake...
.
WOW, kismit but freaky. today i drove 40 miles just to by "4 way Street" by CSNY
virginia -- you were close, it's Little Steven (aka miami steve, aka silvio dante)
It really isn't sex in general - it's only unmarried women having sex. That's the one they just cannot deal with. They already see every woman as Eve - temptation walking - just exactly like fundamentalist Muslims do. The idea of women being able to have sex without consequences scares the living shit out of them.
Between that and all those Satanists they are so convinced are running around, they must piss their pants on a regular basis.
bkny -- thanks. I knew it was something about a Steve. I wish I had a dime for every brain cell I've . .
. . . what?
There are a lot of great protest songs; can't rank 'em numerically: off the top of my head--
The Bells of Rhymney (Pete Seeger, I think)
No Man's Land/The Green Fields of France (Eric Bogle)
Power and Glory (Phil Ochs)
I Ain't Got No Home (Woody Guthrie)
We Didn't Know (Tom Paxton)
We Shall Overcome (traditional)
Nina Simone's entire oeuvre (sp?)
Help me out here, friends...
Sex is something the wicked do.
RMJ - haha Joel Osteen, as my dad says, all he is is a motivational speaker. When his dad started the ministry, they had all these bumper stickers around Houston in the 70's with some stupid phrase (yellow?, wish I could remember, real corny). Think they started out as revivalist with the tents, working out of the trunk of his car.
Oh...Pete Seeger. Waste Deep in the Big Muddy.
...oh and Justice Douglas rock and ruled in Griswold
WoodyGsGuitar/Happy Desperado, sorry to disagree. You might have been in the thick of it there, but kent state cooled things off, both for us who were protesting and the government, who absoulutely fucked up and sanctioned murder of innocents.
Young American soldiers shooting at young college students. I'd like to know who was giving them a pep talk prior to the *incident*. Assholes. Murderers.
It took a while for the truth to come out. When it did, it only added to the horror.
Oh yes, the end of the draft, in one man's opinion, dampened protests. The 'Vietnamization' of the war. Made the war an abstraction to a lot of people whose necks had been getting warmer.
Were there a draft, and 500,000 troops rotating through Iraq, there would be more of a shared sense of urgency about the war, more boots on the streets. Don't doubt it for a minute.
No Man's Land/The Green Fields of France (Eric Bogle)
The ultimate anti-war song. I cannot listen to it without tearing up.
Sex is something the wicked do.
Gen. JC Christian, patriot
Cue MJS.
I give up.
A world in turmoil, plague, famine, death, and political intrigue.
And there is an international tournament, with an official strategy guide, for "Rock, Paper, Scissors."
I am not making this up.
I can no longer retire to Bedlam. I'm in Bedlam.
Re: Sex Regulation
the key to it to me is to remember that the key emotive authority of Judaism, and hence Christianity and Islam, is patriarchy. it may only be effectively maintained as long its affect is palpable, experienced in the physical, sensual body of the subject, especially the female subject who may challenge patriarchal (male, phallic, Sky-father) authority...
one mentions this knowing it is perhaps too obvious, but still...
.
The fundies want to turn the USA of 2020 into Uganda. A dictatorship with no security for the average person, one-third of the population dead from AIDS, and 1% of the population holding all of the wealth.
The dead from AIDS will be their mortal enemies, the ones who are have sex.
We will overcome these people.
I saw Seeger about 15 years ago at the 75th anniversary of Joe Hill's execution. It was at Sugarhouse Park (site of the old prison where Hill was hung) in Salt Lake City. Rosalie Sorrels and Utah Phillips performed as well. I rode the UTA bus back to Ogden with Phillips. He told stories the whole trip. Nice guy.
"Christmas in the Trenches"
John(?) McCutcheon?
the story of the christmas truce that almost ended the war in 1916?
I bought a Little Red Songbook from the Wobblies at the Joe Hill thing. I treasure it.
more of a shared sense of urgency about the war
seriously. tune into oprah sometime and take a look at that audience. iraq doesn't register in the top 100 things of concern to them. and they are middle america. until those suv driving soccer moms feel the pain, nothings going to change.
Were there a draft, and 500,000 troops rotating through Iraq, there would be more of a shared sense of urgency about the war, more boots on the streets. Don't doubt it for a minute.
Which is why the assministration is conducting its draft through the back door. They know a draft will destroy them.
Because the liberal justices seem to be holding out, America probably has one more chance in 2008. If it chooses another Christian conservative president, however, all bets are off.
America didn't choose a conservative Christian.
George W. Bush isn't conservative, he's not Christian, and America didn't choose him. We sort of hit the shit trifecta.
Oh well, somebody has to -
Dylan
A Hard Rain's Gonna Fall
It really isn't sex in general - it's only unmarried women having sex. That's the one they just cannot deal with. They already see every woman as Eve - temptation walking - just exactly like fundamentalist Muslims do. The idea of women being able to have sex without consequences scares the living shit out of them.
Between that and all those Satanists they are so convinced are running around, they must piss their pants on a regular basis.
Tena
Tena, you need to be gay for a day. You have no idea how afaid they are of us, especially the fundie men, of the gay men.
The fundies want to turn the USA of 2020 into Uganda. A dictatorship with no security for the average person, one-third of the population dead from AIDS, and 1% of the population holding all of the wealth.
Right fucking now, the only element mising in your horrid fantasy is the national AIDS pandemic...we're two thirds of the way there already...
not that i dont agree, y'unnerstan?
Eric Bogle does not come up on Itunes, but no man's land has dozens of songs.
Tena - With ya, brought that song up on another thread about protest songs, no bites. Tough crowd.
George W. Bush isn't conservative, he's not Christian, and America didn't choose him. We sort of hit the shit trifecta.
God, Seraphiel, that's so funny it hurts.
Oh well, somebody has to -
Dylan
A Hard Rain's Gonna Fall
Dylan?
"Masters of War"
"Even Jesus would not forgive what you do."
Now that's protest!
'Nother Thing: Pat Tillman
notwithstanding, you don't find a lot of fragging in the volunteer army...LOTS more frequent/prevalent in a conscript corps...
it was not for nothing that ALL the founders feared a standing army...nothing is more fraught with peril for a republican polity than a professional "Officer" class...
before the Nazis, there were the Junkers...
.
woody -- i'm thinking bushco is working on a different type of pandemic. anybody see the article earlier today that lebanon and mexico didn't receive the shipments of that flu strain that was 'mistakenly' shipped to 4000 labs around the planet.
The fundies want to turn the USA of 2020 into Uganda. A dictatorship with no security for the average person, one-third of the population dead from AIDS, and 1% of the population holding all of the wealth.
The dead from AIDS will be their mortal enemies, the ones who are have sex.
We will overcome these people.
Reality Check Bouncer
I don't think they want that -- I really don't. I don't think a lot of people consider the down side of getting what they want in the short term. I don't think they know a lot about history, or human/social psychology, or the Enlightenment principles on which this country was founded. I don't think they know much about the world at large, aren't exposed to different ways of perceiving reality, and are threatened by ambiguity.
The Bad People are great at focusing people's attention very acutely on a few disparate points that don't seem to be related, and individually can be made to make a kind of sense. It's not easy to pay a lot of attention to things you don't understand.
But I really don't think most people who oppose gay marriage, for example, want gay people to die of AIDS. It's a big picture problem. And (Soapbox Alert!) I think the drive to weaken public education -- especially in the sciences -- is designed to keep people from learning how to think critically, broadly and deeply.
In spite of all this, I believe as Anne Frank did that people are generally good.
Reality Check Bouncer - I understand that. I was talking about one of the reasons I think they oppose birth control.
Otherwise, absolutely.
You have no idea how afaid they are of us, especially the fundie men, of the gay men.
Reality Check Bouncer --- 7:26 pm
brother, are they afraid of you???
or of themselves???
we probably'd agree on the answer...
Woody, It's the fundie's fantasy, not mine....
No offense taken, we're on the same side, the AIDS reference is to consider what the removal of birth control will do to us. Less than the birthing of millions of Wal*Mart wannabees, we will have serious problems with disease. Many in the country will give up on life without jobs, housing, etc to anchor their lives. May as well have unprotected sex, there will be no future to be whole for.
From my protest compilation.
Bob Dylan - Blowing in the Wind
Bob Dylan - Chimes of Freedom
Bob Dylan - it Ain't Me Babe
Bob Dylan - It's Alright, Ma (I'm Only Bleeding)
Bob Dylan - Masters of War
Pete Seeger - Waist Deep in the Big Muddy
Creedance - Run Through the Jungle
Bob Seger - Fortunate Son (Live)
Canned Heat - Sic 'Em Pigs
Country Joe & the Fish - I Feel like I'm Fixin' to Die Rag
Crosby Stills, Nash, and Young - Chicago
Crosby Stills and Nash - Ohio
Five Man Electrical Band-signs
Beatles - Revolution
Buffy Saint-marie - Universal Soldier
Simon and Garfunkel - Scarborough Fair
John Prine - Your Flag Decal Won’t Get You Into Heaven
Kingston Trio - Where Have All the Flowers Gone
Kris Kristofferson - Good Christian Soldier
John Prine - Take the Star out of the Window
Temptations - Ball of Confusion
Edwin Starr - War
Christmas in the Trenches--John McCutcheon
Lyrics available in an unlikely spot:
http://www.catholic.net/RCC/musi...mas/
trench.html
Fellow boonmats. Just finished a righteous suppah (I'm from Bawstin) of pan sauted trout, broccoli with garlic and roasted red peppers, and for dolce, a sliver of fig and almond torta. Oh my!
Later, I've got "Maria Full of Grace" on the DVD. Anyone seen it?
"Masters of War"
"Even Jesus would not forgive what you do."
Now that's protest!
Rmj, Dynamic Swami - 7:29 pm
dat's what worries 'em, and why they HAVE to command "God."
seems to me...
RMJ: Tenes cafe ahorita?
In spite of all this, I believe as Anne Frank did that people are generally good.
Generally.
Tena, yes, the source is all the same, and we must stick together. Each respective person feels attacked by these people in their own way.
OK, I have to correct my statement here....the dead will be the RESULT, not the fantasy of the fundies. Their actual fantasy is a world where nobody has sex. They truly do believe that they can remove it by removing birth control. Scary, deluded thinking. It will happen anyway, we all know from experience. There was a time not that long ago that teenagers had a hard time betting BC.
May as well have unprotected sex, there will be no future to be whole for.
Reality Check Bouncer -7:34 pm
brother, i hear you! derridean supplement/complement...desire is about absence, about not having...evidence manque! many whole dissertations still undone in that mess there, i assure you...because that is the truth upon which hangs the whole industry of false conscienceness...
(/pedantry)
.
In spite of all this, I believe as Anne Frank did that people are generally good.
Generally.
pie
pie, awesome.
I played Anne in our high school senior play.
I was obsessed by her.
"In spite of everything, I believe people are good at heart." --Anne Frank
Virginia,
Yes, ignorance is bliss for some people. Your comments today have been exceptional and insightful. Mahalo.
Later, I've got "Maria Full of Grace" on the DVD. Anyone seen it?
The lead actress - who's name I forget - deserved her Oscar nomination.
Otherwise I thought the movie was so-so.
You know it's always about sex. About ten-fifteeen years ago feminists like the late not particularly lamented Andrea Dworkin were running around saying that 30% of all women had been raped by their daddies but had forgotten all about it (Anybody besides me remember the repressed-memory/multiple-personality hysteria? The fundies were also part of that too.)
The Chinese communist have been historically anti-sex as well.
All I'm saying is that being paranoid, weird and controlling about sex isn't a righty thing. It's a fringy thing.
Unless is people who are extreme about liking sex. Obviously, those people are crazy.
I was obsessed by her.
Me, too. But she was older when life turned sour. I can't imagine turning people in like that.
My god.
All the more reason why the bushies must not be allowed to continue to spread their hatred.
Reality Check Bouncer - I certainly agree that we must stick together and I honestly appreciate the fact that you see it that way. It's so true.
I feel so strongly that discrimination against homosexuals is illegal and immoral, that I'd stand up for gay rights regardless. I believe in it with all my heart.
bobo is writing about sex y'all:
April 17, 2005
OP-ED COLUMNIST
Public Hedonism and Private Restraint
By DAVID BROOKS
ou see the febrile young teens in their skintight spaghetti strap tank tops with their acres of exposed pelvic skin. You hear 50 Cent's ode to oral sex, "Candy Shop," throbbing from their iPods. You open the college newspapers and see the bawdy sex columns; at William and Mary last week I read a playful discussion of how to fondle testicles and find G spots.
You could get the impression that America's young people are leading lives of Caligulan hedonism. You could give credence to all those parental scare stories about oral sex parties at bar mitzvahs and junior high school dances. You could worry about hookups, friends with benefits, and the rampant spread of casual, transactional sexuality.
But it turns out you'd be wrong.
The fact is, sex is more explicit everywhere - on "Desperate Housewives," on booty-quaking music videos, on the Internet - except in real life. As the entertainment media have become more sex-saturated, American teenagers have become more sexually abstemious.
Teenage pregnancy rates have declined by about a third over the past 15 years. Teenage birth and abortion rates have dropped just as much.
Young people are waiting longer to have sex. The percentage of 15-year-olds who have had sex has dropped significantly. Among 13-year-olds, the percentage has dropped even more.
They are also having fewer partners. The number of high schoolers who even report having four or more sexual partners during their lives has declined by about a quarter. Half of all high school boys now say they are virgins, up from 39 percent in 1990.
Reports of an epidemic of teenage oral sex are also greatly exaggerated. There's very little evidence to suggest it is really happening. Meanwhile, teenagers' own attitudes about sex are turning more conservative. There's been a distinct rise in the number of teenagers who think casual sex is wrong. There's been an increase in the share of kids who think teenagers should wait until adulthood before getting skin to skin.
When you actually look at the intimate life of America's youth, you find this heterodoxical pattern: people can seem raunchy on the surface but are wholesome within. There are Ivy League sex columnists who don't want anybody to think they are loose. There are foul-mouthed Maxim readers terrified they will someday divorce, like their parents. Eminem hardly seems like a paragon of traditional morality, but what he's really angry about is that he comes from a broken home, and what he longs for is enough suburban bliss to raise his daughter.
In other words, American pop culture may look trashy, but America's social fabric is in the middle of an amazing moment of improvement and repair.
The first lesson in all this is we shouldn't overestimate the importance of the media. People like 50 Cent may produce hit after pornographic hit, but that doesn't mean his fans want to lead the lives he raps about. It's make-believe.
What matters is reality. The reality is that we have a generation of kids who have seen the ravages of divorce, who are more likely to respect and listen to their parents and their ministers, who are worried about sexually transmitted diseases and who don't want to mess up their careers.
Second, it's becoming clear that we are seeing the denouement of one of the longest and increasingly boring plays on Broadway, the culture war.
Since the 1830's, we've witnessed the same struggle. One camp poses as the party of responsibility, lamenting the decadence of culture and the loss of traditional morality. The other side poses as the army of liberation, lamenting Puritanism, repression and the menace of the religious right.
No doubt some people will continue these stale kabuki battles on into their graves: the 50's against the 60's, the same trumped-up outrage, the same self-congratulatory righteousness, the same fund-raising-friendly arguments again and again.
But today's young people appear not to have taken a side in this war; they've just left it behind. For them, the personal is not political. Sex isn't a battleground in a clash of moralities.
They seem happy with the frankness of the left and the wholesomeness of the right. You may not like the growing influence of religion in public life, but the lives of young people have improved. You may not like the growing acceptance of homosexuality, but as it has happened heterosexual families have grown healthier.
Just lie back and enjoy the optimism.
Young people are waiting longer to have sex. The percentage of 15-year-olds who have had sex has dropped significantly. Among 13-year-olds, the percentage has dropped even more.
Link. please.
David Brooks, provide a link.
Young people are waiting longer to have sex. The percentage of 15-year-olds who have had sex has dropped significantly. Among 13-year-olds, the percentage has dropped even more.
If true, thank the goddess.
One of the finest anti-war songs, ever, "Green Fields of France
Eric Bogle
Speaking of Andrew Dworkin, MacKinnon had an op ed piece today that read like revisionist history. And she said it was sad Dworkin had never been nominated for a Nobel Prize in literature. feh!
So come back Woody Guthrie
Come back to us now
Tear your eyes in Paradise
And rise again, somehow
And if you run into Jesus
Maybe He can help us out
Come back Woody Guthrie, to us now
Steve Earle
Young people are waiting longer to have sex.
more foreplay?
actually, there's almost no such thing as too much foreplay, so Kids, rock on...
.
Romanticism has been obfuscated by the battle for control over sex.
Perhaps it will renaissance someday after the world becomes fair enough to allow real expression.
here's link to bobo:
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/04/1...7brooks.html?
hp
If true, thank the goddess.
Teenagers don't have sex?
On what planet?
From Brooks' article:
You may not like the growing acceptance of homosexuality, but as it has happened heterosexual families have grown healthier.
Amazing. Someone who, in this climate of nonsequitorism, doesn't attack homosexuals for the destruction of the family, and even goes out of his way to comment on that.
And did he say "growing acceptance" as well?
MacKinnon and Dworkin were close collaborators.
They both have a take-no-prisoners style that makes it hard to agree with them even when they're right.
Still, Nobel Prize?
You may not like the growing acceptance of homosexuality, but as it has happened heterosexual families have grown healthier.
Links, please.
Well, he can't provide any.
And everyone knows that.
Brooks' article looks like an op-ed piece, pie.
At least he was somewhat impartial. Where his information comes from is dubious... but it's what the right wants to hear, that kids are implied to be wanking instead of copulating.
In other news, Bush administration nominated Andrea Yates to head the Administration for Children and Families.
beaut
She was as much a victim as her kids were - and her ex-husband is an asshole!
Why couldn't he have gotten a vasectomy?
I didn't agree with everything Andrea Dworkin wrote, but she made a helluva more sense than that skank, Camille Paglia, and these other "I've Got Mine, Fuck You" feminists.
Reality Check Bouncer, he's not impartial.
He says shit, and doesn't back it up. He can't back it up.
David Brooks and the rest of them need to stop telling us how to live. He thinks he can make a difference? That's hilarious. He's a bespectacled eunuch.
it looks like modo got moved to the less glamorous saturday edition to make room for frank rich on sundays.
thought it was weird to see her column this a.m.
"What It's Worth" - Buffalo Springfield
"Stop The War Now" - Edwin Starr
"Bring the Boys Home" - Freda Payne
Do you guys object to the govt. snooping in your bathrooms(low flush toilet) and income or are you just obsessed over bedrooms like the Right is?
Well, like most trolls, he makes no fucking sense whatsoever!
The most precious right is life. Who's sexed obsessed Atrios? It's folks like you. Starve 'em to death, kill 'em in the womb, let them get pregant so we can kiil some more. I want governmnet out of my life, but not when it comes to protecting the innocents you and your kind want to murder.
Right
Who let the white trash out?
Your post makes no sense.
For more background on the Wahabbis of Washington, see:
The American Taliban
Darling Terry C.: No you just won't see the point. It is not about low flush toilets. The progressive fascists will be in everyone's lfe telling them how to live just as much as the right wing fundie nutjobs will. But the progressives are so much smarter than everyone else so their orders will be good for us but the right wingers ...well they're just crazy!!!
A Nobel for Ms Dworkin would be more than a bit much, but I must admit the Literature prize winners have been a strange company. I'm not sure, for instance, if Wislawa Szymborzka is massively influencial, but she's a wonderful poet. Dworkin seems to me a largely diversionary figure, who builds more walls than bridges.
Dworkin deserves a Nobel.
Divisive? Perhaps, but, goddamnit, she made you THINK.
Link to a Dworkin essay, about which I'll talk: MacKinnon thinks rightly that I owe Dworkin the courtesy of criticising her actual words than a caricature others would paint.
http://www.nostatusquo.com/ACLU/
...urBloodIII.html
Me, I have trouble with the idea that 'fucking' (her word, not mine) scares me so to death that I must dominate, or rape; that making love is always a power relationship.
She's wrong, more trivially, about people in Columbus' time thinking the world was flat.
Now, the notion of cutting off breasts is quite loaded, so let's go to history. When Halsted first came up with the notion of radical mastectomy,1900 or so, most breast cancers were big Stage III honking ugly monsters--no mammograms; no one talked of it; no point in doing a thorough breast exam anyway, and of course most doctors were men then--and there had been a tradition going back to the Edwin Smith papyrus, the world's oldest known scientific document, that a breast cancer meant death. He cured them. Wasn't pretty, but a lot of them lived, more than ever had, ever. State of the art in this country, because nothing worked better. Meanwhile, in England McWhirter, a (male) radiation therapist, started using radiation before mastectomy in 1948. This led to the modified mastectomy (preserving the chest muscle) and to haphazard use of radiation and lesser surgery. It was only in 1985 that a trial was published comparing 'lumpectomy' and radiation with mastectomy for early cancers. About six months before that, I told one of my patients in a discussion lasting about an hour and a half that her 3-millimeter cancer would be treated by some with radiation, but most by mastectomy, and offered to send her 8 miles into a teaching hospital to be treated on protocol, or to do her mastectomy. She chose the mastectomy, not the choice I would have made for myself. When the NSABP paper came out, I called her and her family into the office and told them all about it, that she would almost certainly have been cured as surely with radiation as with mastectomy. They responded with many questions, and with grace and generosity. This is a complex story. When Dworkin talked about chopping breasts off because of sexism, she was, sadly, right sometimes. She was wrong other times. And on issue after issue, her flamethrower stridency and looseness with fact make it hard to concede she's right without intense ambivalence. I find myself, on reading Dworkin, angry at her for not making her tent big enough for me as well. I feel a bit like a white person, listening to a black speaker telling me that my existence as a white person suffices to make me a lyncher or slaver. Sexism, like racism, is ubiquitous in human society, and should be fought against both in the world and in one's self. Im the first to agree to this. But I'll say it again: she built more walls than bridges. We should have been comfortably on the same side.
Sarah: gotta hit the sack soon. Happy to continue another day--good luck w/work...
They wouldn't necessarily have to overrule Griswold. It was largely based on the asserted special intimate nature of the marital bedroom, and Douglas' infamous emanating penumbra. They could just overrule Eisenstadt v. Baird, or draw a distinction between contraception and abortion that would allow them to overrule Roe while leaving untouched precedents that would provoke more widespread outrage if overturned.
There are lots of ways a right-leaning court could finesse the overturning of Roe without completely eviscerating the right to privacy.
Let's get something straight Atrios. They have no plan to get rid of contraception, just as they have no plan to ever get rid of abortion. It's just something they talk about to get churchgoers to write checks.
"Divisive? Perhaps, but, goddamnit, she made you THINK."
Well, so do holocaust deniers but I personally don't want to hand any of them Nobels. Besides, I think we can all agree that any women who gets one really ought to know how to dress. That's obvious.
And, though I am frequently put off by Camille's neo-reactionaryism at least the bitch knows how to crack a joke. I don't know about the rest of you folks but that goes a long way with me.
I have my disagreements with Dworkin (vide supra) but putting her in with holocaust deniers is a bit much, seems to me. And writing about a putative Nobel dress code, following by saying that 'at least the bitch knows how to crack a joke' while dissing a radical feminist also has its charms. I guess; I don't see 'em. Build bridges, not walls. And Einstein didn't wear socks.
Teenagers may be having less intercourse but I doubt they're having less sex...
Well prof, seeing as you, near as I can tell, don't actually have a sense of humor I can see where you might not understand why somebody else might consider funny. What I like about your prose style is that it's stuffy yet, at the same time, immeasurably dull. It isn't everyone who can strip the life out of their own prose like that. My guess is that putting people to sleep is your idea of having company.
As far as the halocaust remark I was responding to this quote in support of a Dworkin Nobel Prize:
"Divisive? Perhaps, but, goddamnit, she made you THINK."
My point was that mere divisiveness is no qualification for a Nobel even if it is thought-provoking. Halocaust denyers are thought provoking because, crazy and irresponsible though these nefarious chowderheads may be, they cause you to reflect on how you know what you think you know, that is assuming you actually do know it. Dworkin was useful in the same way. I still don't see giving the bitch an award.
Let us not forget that Dworkin in addition to making a career out of slandering men was one of the ferverent believer in the repressed-memory/multiple-personality hysteria of the 1980s which posited that tens of millions of women had been raped repeatedly by their daddies but forgot all about it . Supposedly this was all part of the international patriarchal satanic conspiracy — and idea about as nuts as anything some bunch of anti Semitic goobers ever cooked up (this used to be big cheese in the psychotherapy industry but you don't hear much about it any more - I wonder why).
Now go back to your enlighted nap.
Exactly atrios! And it was only in 1965 that the Supreme Court legalised the use of contraceptives, and then only by married couples.
Hieronymus:
It's not as easy being humorless and pedantic as I make it look. I could teach you.
I don't see the humor in what you wrote. I told you why. I didn't pretend to be funny; wouldn't have succeeded if I had. You responded with a list of my inadequacies, rather than a reason for a grown-up to disagree with me.
Let's try it again:
Holocaust deniers deny that an actual event, the Holocaust, happened.
Andrea Dworkin is coping with the sexism of the world, an actual event, in a way I find counterproductive and alienating. I agree with you that her participation in the false memory craziness hurt both her cause and some people who didn't deserve to be hurt. As I said in my post, I find her fast and loose with facts, and needlessly inflammatory in rhetoric, and chose one of many possible examples to discuss at some length. Since I, as I said, acccept the reality of sexism and the odd exploitation of a woman or two by a man or two in the pornography industry, the family and in relationships, I distinguish her from Holocaust deniers. Doesn't mean I agree with her.
Since we evidently agree, for the most part on her merits, I'm not sure why you disagree so violently with me as to snark at me so when I question you. Whatever our opinion of her, Dworkin meant a lot to a fair number of progressive feminist thinkers. I'd like to be able to talk to them. If I can't, I can't. I don't think you make progress by calling a recently deceased person who someone cares about ugly names chosen to maximally offend those you're trying to reach. Just don't. Sorry.
Back to my nap now...
"I didn't agree with everything Andrea Dworkin wrote, but she made a helluva more sense than that skank, Camille Paglia, and these other "I've Got Mine, Fuck You" feminists."
Nicely put, Terry C. I couldn't agree more.
Andrea changed laws and got people thinking and talking about violence against women, a subject which had always been swept under the rug. There were no domestic abuse shelters before Andrea; there were no laws against marital rape before her, either. She worked to change our culture for the better, and was a true warrior for women.
Camille Paglia shits all over women and calls herself a feminist. I fucking hate her.
"Since I, as I said, acccept the reality of sexism and the odd exploitation of a woman or two by a man or two in the pornography industry, the family and in relationships, I distinguish her from Holocaust deniers."
I believe this is the single most outlandish sentence I've ever read.
"About ten-fifteeen years ago feminists like the late not particularly lamented Andrea Dworkin were running around saying that 30% of all women had been raped by their daddies but had forgotten all about it"
Hieronymus Braintree
Link, please. If you're going to make a claim like this, you need to back it up with some proof.
Gayle:
I disagree with much of what Dworkin said, and how she said it, but not with some of her core beliefs, and accept the reality of sexism and violence against women (this is the third post in which I've made that acknowledgement on this thread). I disagree with Holocaust deniers because of their core beliefs. I thus refuse to lump the two together, disagreeing with Hieronymus at 4:01. I'd guess you'd agree with me once you got past my (increasingly oft-cited) inadequacies as a writer, for which I apologize. Nothing I can do but try again, maybe learn something from someone. Not sure why that's so outlandish. Help me out here.
The positive things Dworkin did that you enumerate are all important things that I'm glad happened. If she did them, I should know about it. Help me out here, too. I linked above to an essay she wrote with which I took exception, and explained why as best I could. I'd be happy to learn there's more to her story.
Getting snarked at here from all sides while trying to talk to everyone. Sorry.
Just occurred to my simple brain that you may have interpreted me as viewing exploitation of women as odd and occasional, if not exceptional. If so, I apologize; not what I meant. I'd given in to a bit of snark myself, and not been adept enough to make my meaning clear.
Have they overreached? Aren't they making a huge mistake by pandering to a "base" that can't be more than 15 to 20% of the population? - Sarah
I am not so sure about this figure. I know a lot of people who don't believe in birth control (even if they seem to practice premarital sex) outside of "Catholic roulette" -- the concept that "if you engage in sex, you have to be willing to have a child" is deeply ingrained in much of the population.
From my Jewish point of view, this is a horrible way of thinking (kids are punishment for sex) ... but it is a part of the psychology of many.
Fortunately, many of the people I know (at least the African-Americans -- both direct immigrants from Africa and those whose families have been here longer than mine) are open to pragmatic arguments (what is it with White religious folk being so dogmatic?) even on abortion.
We Dems. need to be careful that we do not misunderestimate the prejudice of people toward what we would consider backwards, pre-Reformation/Counter-reformation religion. Moreover, our positions are easily skewered by the MSM who is interested in protecting the interests of the powerful by trying to destroy us. On the other hand, when people understand our positions, they do tend to support us, if only out of pragmatism.
While people like my parents might question "how can anyone be against birth control?" and think that we can score points by arguing that a ban on abortion could lead to a ban on birth control, the fact of the matter is that many people, even those who happily "fornicate" view birth control as somehow wrong or at least suspect.
We cannot depend on scoring points by some "jeopardy" argument. We need to defend abortion directly but in a manner in which we do not come off as wanton baby killers. As many have suggested, the way to do this is obvious: most people really don't believe that abortion is homocide when the logical conclusions of that belief are explained to them (rather their not being pro-choice is based on mindless prejudice against "abortionists" and in favor of certain religious strains). We need to confront people:
You believe abortion is homocide? Are you in favor of investigating "suspicious" miscarriages as possible murders? Do you want prosecutors even threatening women who have had abortions with jail time, if only to get them to rat out their doctors? Do you want to open the floodgates of fathers to have been to sue women who have miscarried their fetuses for wrongful death?
Because once you say that a fetus has the right to life that an independent human does, then you cannot treat a fetal death any differently than a human death. And when people die, there are investigations into foul play, etc., etc. So unless you want women going to jail, you cannot per force want abortion to be legal.
I can tell you, this argument does work. Well, it hasn't worked on a single White person to my knowledge, but I know many African-American religious fanatics who would otherwise be pro-life but for this kind of logic (similarly such people are in favor of gay civil unions, etc. out of pragmatism).
We Dems need to stop being so mealy mouthed about things and realize that pragmatism isn't being DLC wishy-washy but is an ideology of its own. We need to communicate that our ideas "work" and Rethug ideas don't (unless by "work" you mean to bring back the middle ages).
We point out the consequences of Rethug ideas and bring up our own, and we win every time. So why don't we do that instead of trying to compromise? Of course to do this, we need to (1) boot out the DLC and (2) understand what middle America really needs to hear rather than what the Kristofs and Bobos of the MSM claim about a middle America with which they would never interact.
This rise in nationalism and Christian Blocks, for a government that works for business and business that works for Gov , got me worried. It just reminds someone of prewar Nazi Germany.
Because the washington business minded bigoted fools have destroyed the school systems, the nation is debt and so are its inhabitants. The breaking of the Levees assure us that they are always shopping somewhere even when death is coming - so much of christian neighbourliness and love!
Christianity is an ignorant grandson of America's bigoted past; a stepsister of America's blindness to all the other folks, an easy trade off of under-educated fools going to corporate churches. Hopefully with this blogging the demise of this damn networks is promised.
When I die, let me not be backed to a corner like a dog, but die like a man fighting - Claude Mckay.
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