HULK SMASHED
Bush presidency: FIERY WRECK!
One must always get people who are against you.
One must always get people who are against you.
No questions in the court house, said the Marshall, as he was escorting Karl Rove past reporters.
and again *at least*
Great link, Atrios! When was Part one?
I've been thinking about that too, who was it that first suggested that? Somebody did.
Anyway, if Fitz is on the "forgery" angle (and why wouldn't he look into that) then this thing is going to blow up huge.
Amazing if that happens, how flat-footed the press has been, let alone the fiction-based entity known as the right-wing.
Funny, I was thinking about this earlier. Usually they know if they ignore something or dismiss it as trivial, people will forget about it.
Ha, but not this time.
res,
If I do, I'll take you up on your kind offer, or some fraction thereof.
attaturk,
I hope Mr. Wilson stays away from small planes....
Where did Fitzgerald go to law school?
attaturk,
I hope Mr. Wilson stays away from small planes....
NYMary
That danger has passed, I worry that Fitz and his staff will all get on the same plane.
driftglass ...
Okey dokey. Go for the ferry. My fave thing to do with folks in from out of the town -- and the price is right, i.e., FREE! Whee!
I hope Mr. Wilson stays away from small planes....
Rove's cunning plan: to pin Wilson's demise in a small plame, er...plane on his wife.
Where did Fitzgerald go to law school?
res ipsa loquitur
I suppose I could look it up, but I'm pretty sure it was Harvard.
we had a little eschaton-west meeting today, tokyo terri, ceabaird, and ben goshi, and "others"
I'm pretty sure it was Harvard.
Is Harvard any good?
pictures later
Fitz is from Harvard Law School.
we had a little eschaton-west meeting today, tokyo terri, ceabaird, and ben goshi, and "others"
Any pictures?
Possibly. Possibly.
Don't forget the bile that is generated by sheer malice when it's perceived by petty, fearful people. People, like Wilson, who are big and strong and casually brave scare people like Rove to death - just by existing. The normal reaction then is to attack, and attack without restraint because it is believe that *this* is the way things are done. Policy disagreements become acts of personal sabotage and are escalated accordingly.
Just saying.
MSM said amherst then harvard
dunno if it is true
pictures later
Heh.
Philosophical Question of the Morning:
Who is creepier-looking than Larry Kudlow?
I'm pretty sure it was Harvard.
Is Harvard any good?
NTodd
Well its no "University of Iowa College of Law" but its okay. 
i didnt wear pants
res,
We guessed this: A solidly built former rugby player who enjoyed getting muddy and bloody well into his twenties, Fitzgerald is nothing but confident in his own skin. Just as he does not fear bin Laden, he seems to fret little that he is now tangling simultaneously with the Bush White House and the New York Times, two of the nation's most powerful and privileged institutions.
And, yes, Harvard Law.
I'm pretty sure it was Harvard.
Is Harvard any good?
It's the second-best law school in Texas!
post profile of FITZ in feb:
A Phi Beta Kappa math and economics student at Amherst before earning a Harvard law degree in 1985, he has a gift for solving puzzles and simplifying complexity for a jury.
He's no slouch at stagecraft, either. At the trial of a Mafia hit man, the defense argued that a ski mask -- part of what Fitzgerald called a "hit kit" that included surgical gloves, a gun and hollow-point bullets -- was really just a hat. (The defense also said the surgical gloves were for putting ointment on the defendant's ailing dog.) During closing arguments, Fitzgerald startled the jury by rolling up one leg on his lawyerly dark suit.
What puzzles me, and I'm hoping that the Grand Jury figures it out, is why, after the senate had abdicated its responsibilities and gave Bush all the war powers he wanted, and after Iraq was invaded, the regime went to so lengths to get Wilson.
Maybe it is because the source of the forgeries on the Niger-yellow cake issue is traceable to the White House, but that seems quite a long shot, especially given the state of the press in this country.
Well its no "University of Iowa College of Law" but its okay.
How does it rank with the school I attended that's advertised in matchbooks?
i didnt wear pants
That's the only fashionable way to attend those events.
so i'm told
One must always get people who are against you.
NTodd
Thus the list.
Well its no "University of Iowa College of Law" but its okay.
How does it rank with the school I attended that's advertised in matchbooks?
NTodd
"Indict Lucky"? *
*this may be too obscure.
is creepier-looking than Larry Kudlow?
Kudlow's teevee partner, Cramer, who is as big a blowhard as they come, but not a total fucking asshole (and not a Repuke), is seriously bearish. Is preparing for Fredo's coming economic crisis.
I've only been a regular reader of their work for the last month or so, but Reddhedd and Jane Hamsher at firedoglake have been must reading on all things Plamegate.
Many kudos to them.
Thus the list.
At the top of mine: people who have too many ponies.
NYMary ... YES on the hanging out over turkee weekend.
Fitz: Regis, Amherst, Harvard, Oy.
Can we take a collection to get Daniel Schorr a new set of teeth? Please? His dentures are actually clacking now.
Fitz: Regis, Amherst, Harvard, Oy.
Fitz is a Regis boy?!
"Indict Lucky"? *
*this may be too obscure.
Lucky strikes?
At the top of mine: people who have too many ponies.
NTodd
Pony envy: list.
NYMary
Can I link to a pic of you?
Papal Bull,
Yeah, but George Clooney is certainly nice to listen to.
And so friggin' smart.
Does she fuck?
See! I told you watertiger loved Regis boys! (And they returned the favor.)
re the source of the yellowcake forgeries, Draco posited the other day it was michael ledeen and a couple of former cia agents. he sent me a link but damned if i can find it now. talkleft, maybe? anyway, i can certainly believe it's ledeen, but that just begs the question: who ordered up the forgeries from ledeen? my sense is that it's the whigs--if they couldn't find the evidence of wmd, then by god they'd invent it. and if fitz could demonstrate that, he deserves a whole chestful of medals. but it seems too much to hope for.
oh, and good morning from monsoon country.
Pony envy: list.
Refresh my recollection - how many do you have now?
QL,
Sure. I have no pride.
Why would anyone namesteal NTod when he's right here?
Yup, firedoglake was writing about this a few days ago. It just may be that the entire idea was to discredit Plame who was getting close to revealing the treasonous behavior of these ass clowns. Wilson was a byproduct.
*this may be too obscure.
Hardly. I always wondered about that Art School in Minnesota.
Diane,
I dunno. A lot of things I was skeptical about two weeks ago seem possible now.
all this background talk about fitzgerald, and i just realized he's everything tweety and fat tim pretend to be -- the irish-catholic working class kid, who worked his way through college. it must really gall them to have to answer to him.
See! I told you watertiger loved Regis boys! (And they returned the favor.)
Love 'em - I LIVED with 3 of 'em in college!
I've only been a regular reader of their work for the last month or so, but Reddhedd and Jane Hamsher at firedoglake have been must reading on all things Plamegate.
Their knowledge of Plamegate is a marvel. I spent most of last weekend reading firedoglake until my eyes were ready to close. Great stuff.
For what I hope is the LAST time:
It is NOT "Plamegate."
It is "the Plame Affair."
I'm sick of that bullshit -gate suffix getting thrown onto every scandal.
Wow,
Hector just killed Ajax, funny that.
watertiger,
Yep. I'm a straight man, and I'd be honored to let George Clooney screw me.
deluxe sampo,
Is that Michael "find a small country and kick the shit out of it for morale" Ledeen?
Casual inquiry into one's status vis-a-vis the list: list?
Um, is there a way to have a previous post deleted?
Pony envy: list.
List: top of the list.
Does she fuck?
When have I ever used language like that?
wt - he has none that came from the HK electronics fair.
and i'm hoping the lb0313 wakes up from the stasis chamber to find news of a full dance card of indictments.
deluxe sampo:
Monsoon Country is us!
Man did it rain last night in the Boston/Cambridge area.
But considering we haven't had any raging floods pass by the house, we count ourselves lucky!
Watertiger,
I have a great pic of you from Eschacon. Okay if I post it?
I don't *think* I'm on the list, but then I never checked.
Casual inquiry into one's status vis-a-vis the list: list?
The list!
I'm sick of that bullshit -gate suffix getting thrown onto every scandal.
Suffixgate!
GWPDA,
Thank you very much.
tectonic
QL,
If it gets me more fan mail, sure!
(sorry - got too much sleep)
ledeen speculation was on alternet, not talkleft. ultimately, the source of the ledeen theory is vincent cannistraro, a former cia big shot. my coding skills n'existent pas, but here's the alternet link for thems what's interested:
http://www.alternet.org/waroniraq/21704/
When have I ever used language like that?
When you were growing up.
Watching Troy, kent?
I don't *think* I'm on the list, but then I never checked.
That qualifies you for the list.
yup amherst and harvard and summa... whatever its called at both.
rugby...now i know we are gonna see some shit fly. rugby is played by guys who like to have their front teeth knocked out and if it doesn't happen on the field they just might take a ball pean hammer to them themselves to see if they can not flinch...
When have I ever used language like that?
When you were growing up.
I grew up?
Who is creepier-looking than Larry Kudlow?
I dunno, the new pope?
It is "the Plame Affair."
How about:
The Plame Incident
The Plame Debacle
The Plame Cluster Fuck
I just figured out how to post pics to my blog, which will only be used for quilting related stuff and so is no competition to anyone here. Click homepage for nice picture of NYMary. As soon as WT and others give their permission I will post the rest. I have a great pic of Uncle Smokes and another one of old white lady and NTodd and Mena and Feral Liberal watching the softball game.
Wilson upset their pimped-up apple cart.
great link, btw- a blog I always forget to bookmark.
anyone who hasn't yet read any of Karen Kwiatkowski's articles- they provide good background info on the OSP
and now I have to go -- I decided to go to grad school, so I'm doing GRE prep.
off to go review odious math concepts I thought I'd left safely behind thirty years ago...
leftover friday parrot blogging on homepage
What Reddhedd and firedoglake document is a consistent and continuing pattern of arbitrary "fact selection" on the part of the WHIG to prove a point of view that otherwise would be moot.
In fact, they didn't even have to "prove" anything. They just had to suggest that this horrid man, Saddam, might have WMDs.
The Congress, the MSM and the American people all fell into line after that and did whatever the depraved moron in the WH wanted, which was war with Iraq.
Just as he does not fear bin Laden, he seems to fret little that he is now tangling simultaneously with the Bush White House and the New York Times, two of the nation's most powerful and privileged institutions.
The Times? They're a paper tiger. I think Fitz barely notices they're tangling with him.
But the WH better pack a lunch.
In America's GOP politboro, dissent and dissenters are dealt with by punishment.
In Joseph Wilson's instance, what better way to show him who is boss than target his wife?
The Plame Incident
The Plame Debacle
The Plame Cluster Fuck
The Plame Game
In Plame Sight
Err Plame
Follow the yellow cake road
Follow the yellow cake road
Follow the ...Follow the...Follow the
yellow cake road
Cheney Cohen Group... a consulting firm where the trick is, whatever they advise, do the opposite.
It could be staffed by just about anyone W has ever appointed.
watertiger,
If you ever make me think of the words Bolton and cunnilingus in the same breath again, I swear, I'll....
well, laugh. Or maybe start a pie fight in your kitchen.
yes, NYMary, that michael ledeen. another revenant from iran-contra, to no one's surprise. i'm telling you, being a conspiracy theorist seems like the sanest option these days.
Rudy, make the rain stop! i need a bike ride.
I like the fact that Fitzgerald was a math major. Kind of hard to spin a quadratic equation. Figures it would take someone with a firm foothold in the reality based community to cut through the bullshit.
Looks like the White House Iraq Group (WHIG) are still in business...
http://katrinamemo.blogspot.com/...may-not-
be.html
wÒÓ†
peen, ball peen hammer. you know the one buried under all that salvaged copper wire in your father's garage in the 50's that he thought he would use someday to pound the dents out of the fender on his 49 plymouth. one of those fenders had more steel in it than the hummers soldiers are riding around iraq in this morning.
In Joseph Wilson's instance, what better way to show him who is boss than target his wife?
Dartanyon
As Molly Ivins said, anyone who didn't recognize the "target the wife" approach as vintage Rove hasn't been paying attention.
In 1996, Fitzgerald became the National Security Coordinator for the Office of the U.S. Attorney for the Southern District of New York.
And I bet he's not fond of people who fuck around with issues of national security, like, say, the names of CIA agents.
NYMary,
my bad.
OMG, NPR's playing a travelogue that Schwarzenegger did for Rio back in '83. It's embarrassingly rude.
I like the fact that Fitzgerald was a math major. Kind of hard to spin a quadratic equation. Figures it would take someone with a firm foothold in the reality based community to cut through the bullshit.
Ah, but see, we can't really know anything, even math. It's all based on unprovable axioms that you must take on faith, just like Intelligent Design. So unless Fitz is a very good Christian and True American, he won't be able to win.
"Kind of hard to spin a quadratic equation."
You can spin a differential equation.
I don't know why, but I have problems with this story. Tenet seemed pretty accommodating about a lot of the pre-war positioning didn't he -- the NSI with all the caveats buried in footnotes and addenda supposedly? So why did he make such a big deal about stopping the yellowcake claim, specifically?
At one time Sy Hersh suggested the Niger docs were a plant by neo-con opponents who knew they were ginning the intelligence and created the shoddy forged docs to embarrass them. Anyone know what happened to that theory?
deluxe sampo:
I'd be suffering from terminal "cottage fever" if not for indoor tennis.
I've always wondered this, too. Like NTodd says, this administration is going to get you no matter what. But really, so there's a naysayer? Big deal. They made up their minds that no logic or reason was going to stop them from going into Iraq. It seems rather silly to go to such great lengths to slime someone.
OK, more coffee now...
But MediaMatters and firedoglake contradict one another vis a vis Cheney dispatching Joe Wilson to Niger:
From Media Matters:
On Hardball, NBC’s Andrea Mitchell wrongly asserted that Valerie Plame’s husband, former ambassador Joe Wilson, claimed that Vice President Cheney "dispatched" him to Niger.
From firedoglake:
Despite public denials to the contrary it was, in fact, Dick Cheney's requests that set in motion the series of actions that led to Joseph Wilson being sent to Niger to investigate what later turned out to be claims in a set of forged documents.
Who is correct???
Watching Troy, kent?
Yes indeedy, and it is nothing like the Illiad, or at least the copy I read.
I did find the manufacturers of this perfect item for the liberal elite to prepare for the iminent indictments.
Electronic Wine Coolers not to be confused with those overly sweet spritzer things.
Thank you very much.
PickleBreath™Embigulator.
de nada! Pickled little corns are good for breakfast!
The Plame Cluster Fuck
The Plame Game
In Plame Sight
Boss!
de Plame! de Plame!
Anyone know what happened to that theory?
it underestimated the whig stupidity?
Dartanyon - I don't think those are contradictory statements. Firedoglake doesn't say Cheney dispatched Wilson to Niger, just that requests he made led to Wilson's trip.
The Rain in Spain falls mainly on Plame.
There is no contradiction there, Dartanyon. Something wrong with your reading comprehension?
Hide in Plame Sight
"I hate what Cheney did to the WHIGs"
-- Henry Clay
For info on leeden and his possible links to the Niger forgery go to the anti-war.com blog. Scott Horton lays it out and as anti-war writers always do provides plenty of links to back up what he writes.
One must always get people who are against you.
NTodd
How true
" Chapter one, the introduction outlines the problem at hand and discusses the origins of the Basil's reputation as a Bulgar Slayer. It is often attributed to his victory at Kledion in 1014, where he besieged the garrison of that location. Upon the surrender of Kledion, Basil blinded all of the Bulgars except one for every hundred men. These individuals were blinded only in one eye and were to lead the others back to Tsar Samuel. Upon seeing the horror of these actions, Samuel apparently had a heart-attack and died."
It is "the Plame Affair."
How about:
The Plame Incident
The Plame Debacle
The Plame Clusterfuck
Thanks, billyb. I'm going memorize these names so that I never make another faux pas by appending "gate" to a name.
Jennifer - I hate neologisms too. It's lazy. Even the Japenese use the suffix "gate" for name political scandals.
The over-reaction may just be due to the desire to send a signal to critics that anything is fair game.
Pretty bad when this is the least nefarious reason I can come up with.
Dissenting from what the Bushboy WH has proven to be dangerous to reputations and positions.
Paul O'Neill was the Treasury Sec. who averred about the wisdom of Bushboy's neverending tax cuts for the rich. He became "persona non grata" and was forced out.
Joseph Wilson had the temerity to dispute a Bushboy claim made in his SOTU speech, and thus he had to be punished by wrecking his wife's career and endangering who knows how many lives.
Bunatine Greenways was highlighted in last night's NOW program on PBS. It seems she took issue with the "no bid contract" issued to Halliburton and to the $60 million in phony charges they billed the Army. She has been demoted by the Bushboy WH and no longer is allowed to scrutinize such matters.
Perpetrators create patterns and the Bushboy patterns could easily be followed and illustrated by any "news organization," ..... if we had any.
de nada! Pickled little corns are good for breakfast!
mmmmmmm, yes they are! How are your dainty paws this early mornin'?
The Niger docs were so amateurish, I figure they were written by the same Nigerians who send out all those spam letters.
How does it rank with the school I attended that's advertised in matchbooks?
NTodd - 9:32 am
That too was a sketch on the old SCTV series.
Gah! Fucking rain!!
NTodd,
I disagree. If memory serves, didn't Cheney himself in appearances on the Sunday morning blab circuit, deny he played any role (direct or indirect) that led to Joe Wilson going to Niger?
Someone is lying and my guess is the lie is coming from the EOB. As long as Wilson returned with the correct evidence that Saddam was trying to procure yellowcake, Cheney would take credit and be a hero.
But Wilson returned with evidence to the contrary that suggested the Bush administration was lying.
What about the forged/fake document we discussed by the "terrorism experts" at CNN and Fox this past week...
http://katrinamemo.blogspot.com/...may-not-
be.html
Maybe it is just me, but I thought the Trojan War was a 10 year affair, rather than a weekend at Priam's
.
Atrios asks:
"...exactly why was it so necessary to "get" Wilson?"
I think it was a twofer. First, of course, was the need to defuse the charge they lied us into war. I know it's hard for us now to believe the media would actually have run with this, but at the time the Bushistas could not be sure. They must have been amazed and relieved to learn that the country would accept their shifting rationales for war, and that, in effect, they had a pooch that could not be screwed.
Secondly, there was the need to intimidate others in the CIA from pulling back the curtain: the so-called "horse's head" scenario.
Mostly, that has worked, at least to prevent a repeat of the Pentagon Papers dump to the media. We will know soon whether it worked to keep the facts from Fitzgerald. My guess is it did not. Grand Jury subpoenas have a way of concentrating the mind wonderfully.
Karin,
Now you're just being cunty.
Gah! Fucking rain!!
BlakNo1
I was once in a rain for forty days and nights. I built this really big boat. Then all these fucking animals crowded in.
Boy was the wife pissed.
I think the Niger yellowcake was a WHIG "project" and they couldn't have that exposed. I wonder if Plame's operation was close to doing so.
Seems a nasty war between VP office and the CIA was going on.
Now you're just being cunty.
Dartanyon
Isn't that a lyric?
A little bit cunty a little bit rock n roll.
I guess this means Odysseus made it home safely on the first attempt afterwards.
.
NYMary,
Ivins wrote about Rove being so crooked that even Poppy Bush refused to hire him to work on his presidential campaign.
Boss!
de Plame! de Plame!
.
speaking of sat scores a piece in the new york times this morning suggests this analogy...
syria:iraq::cambodia:vietnam
translated--oh shit.
How are your dainty paws this early mornin'?
BabyCornBreath™Embigulator.
Very useful, thanks. I'm going back outside and dig me some bugs!
Isn't that a lyric?
A little bit cunty a little bit rock n roll.
?
ROFL!!!
"I've been thinking about that too, who was it that first suggested that? Somebody did."
That would be Josh Marshall. He wrote obsessively about the origin of the forgeries over a year ago. Here, for instance:
http://
www.talkingpointsmemo.com...8_01.php#003235
Noah,
What's a "cubit?"
I know some people who know Mr. Fitzgerald.
The report:
"Fitzgerald is their worst nightmare. He's fearless and unstoppable."
"He knows everybody who matters at the CIA and they're pissed and he's pissed. If I had to make a choice, I would rather piss off the CIA than Fitzgerald."
"I haven't talked to him out of professional courtesy, but I know that expression on his face. He has the goods, they're totally implicated and they're going down. And they're not just going down, they're going to be ruined and fucked."
"His case will prove treason. There could be... I've said too much. It's bad."
I think the Niger yellowcake was a WHIG "project" and they couldn't have that exposed. I wonder if Plame's operation was close to doing so.
Seems a nasty war between VP office and the CIA was going on.
scout prime
Strikes me more like a Report to the Commissioner scenario.
CIA wants Niger validated. They send someone to do just that. But it blows up in their faces.
No doubt there was manuevering by Cheney.
I disagree. If memory serves, didn't Cheney himself in appearances on the Sunday morning blab circuit, deny he played any role (direct or indirect) that led to Joe Wilson going to Niger?
Yes, he did deny it, but evidence appears to contradict his denials, just like everything else the fucker says on the Sunday meathead shows. Regardless, the two statements you quoted are not contradictory.
Ivins wrote about Rove being so crooked that even Poppy Bush refused to hire him to work on his presidential campaign.
Dartanyon
As I recall, he was hired and then fired after he did something scummy.
I predict pardons all around.
Issued by President Hastert.
History doesn't repeat, but it rhymes.
'80s pop music lyrics quiz:
We close our eyes...
drifty, you old so and so, the blog is kicking ass.
If memory serves, didn't Cheney himself in appearances on the Sunday morning blab circuit, deny he played any role (direct or indirect) that led to Joe Wilson going to Niger?
The assumption you're working on is faulty. You're assuming Cheney was telling the truth on the Sunday talk shows.
Or that he even knows how.
Noah,
What's a "cubit?"
driftglass
Faux Diamond.
Cubit Zirconium.
The Wife has a bunch.
She wanted the real, you know the whole animal thing, but I pulled a switcheroo.
Ain't I the devil.
BabyCornBreath™Embigulator
To be fair, The Iliad itself only deals with about three weeks of the war, when Achilles was being a pouty little shit. Both the preceding nine years and the ensuing year or so are implied.
Ivins wrote about Rove being so crooked that even Poppy Bush refused to hire him to work on his presidential campaign.
Dartanyon
As I recall, he was hired and then fired after he did something scummy.
NYMary
Didn't he leak to Israel?
Not much difference between now and then.
This has always been the most confounding things about the Plame Affair - all this effort to muddy the waters surrounding who sent WIlson to Africa. Big Fuckin' Deal. What difference does it make, compared to idea that there were forged documents floating around that were used to justify a war desperately desired by the Bush Administration.
Occam's Razor tells you where those docs came from.
You could write a differential equation to predict the misbehavior of the Bushboy regime. It might go something like this:
Achieve a Desired End DE = (select facts or rumors that support the DE) x (feed it to mediawhores anxious to please)extrapolate this to the third power, (dismiss, degrade or demote anyone who disagrees)raise this exponentially as required and then add in Bushboy staged public appearances, repeating the lies as often as possible before homogonized Gooper groups.
The result is a "campaign" for war, or for tax cuts for the rich or to destroy Social Security or any other abomination Bushboy and the Goopers choose to promote!
To be fair, The Iliad itself...
greek geek
William Rivers Pitt wrote about this on TruthOut. It's a decent read.
http://truthout.org/docs_03/0711...3/
071103A.shtml
.