I'MMA LET YOU FINISH
First!!
Where?
Der Dritten!!
5th!
Well, Buckley is an old school conservative, and I'm sure has no patience for the wingnuts who have most certainly fucked up everything, including the Republican Party.
There are plenty more where he came from in that regard.
So when Bill Buckley writes that the Plame Leak is a very serious matter and now, more ominously for Republicans, that Iraq is lost, Republican shills and Wingnuts, and indeed, the Media, are put in a very difficult place. Because if Bill Buckley can state the obvious, they paint themselves as fools and/or knaves if they ignore it.
How long before they "Goldwater" him by denouncing the father of their movement as a crazy, senile has-been?
hello
.
Passing along a comment from a reader over at Josh Marshall re: Iraq:
As I heard NPR's reports about Sunis pulling shiites out of their homes (and prbably vice-versa), a chill went up my spine. I have no doubt that the worst is about to begin in Iraq with ethnic cleasnsing / mass murders/ Lebanon-style (Sabra and shatilla) civil war about to begin. And the US is stuck in the middle. While it would be great to get out right now (last month would have been better), the responsibility for everything is on us. We can't leave now, and we will be blamed (mostly correctly) for all that is about to happen. I am filled with dread. Our leadership is still saying to hold the line, when the line is not there.
Our MSM says everythings fine. Chimp says everything's calming down. Condo Bobo says we're on the right path.
Lying %$&^*** %^@&^ &^$%@.
.
A little late, but
So glad we're not in South Dakota
I wonder, is "Chtulu" meant to be "Cthulhu"?
"The great divide on the Right has begun. Those with self respect and honor. And those who do not. How they are lining up is not surprising. The Limbaugh and Liars stand together. The smarter and more honorable ones separate."
I want to know what took them so long. Anyone who couldn't see Bush was an idiot in the first debates with Gore had to have their eyes shut.
what of Judd Nelson?
It's not too late yet, but
The entire country could be South Dakota on this issue if voices aren't raised and some members of Congress obtain spines.
Oh, it's going to be interesting watching the rats leave the ship, that's for sure. I'm still trying to catch up on everything that happened while I was taking the bar last week, and I just came across Tristero's post about Francis Fukuyama's renunciation of neoconservatism. Although making me want to retch, it does at least reveal the extent of the current divide among conservatives:
Mr Fukuyama once supported regime change in Iraq and was a signatory to a 1998 letter sent by the Project for a New American Century to the then president, Bill Clinton, urging the US to step up its efforts to remove Saddam Hussein from power. It was also signed by neoconservative intellectuals, such as Bill Kristol and Robert Kagan, and political figures Paul Wolfowitz, Richard Perle and the current defence secretary, Donald Rumsfeld.
However, Mr Fukuyama now thinks the war in Iraq is the wrong sort of war, in the wrong place, at the wrong time.
"The most basic misjudgment was an overestimation of the threat facing the United States from radical Islamism," he argues.
"Although the new and ominous possibility of undeterrable terrorists armed with weapons of mass destruction did indeed present itself, advocates of the war wrongly conflated this with the threat presented by Iraq and with the rogue state/proliferation problem more generally."
Mr Fukuyama, one of the US's most influential public intellectuals, concludes that "it seems very unlikely that history will judge either the intervention [in Iraq] itself or the ideas animating it kindly".
A bit of truth about New Orleans from the little corner store where I worked for a few weeks, Verdi Mart.
Terry used to call me "little bird."
BULLSHIT!!!!
The more interesting question is how much longer for the Media shills to realize the train is leaving the station? Any shred of dignity to save? In Nantucket and Georgetown, the places the Russerts, et al. care about, they are at a nadir - and it drives THEIR anger at us. We have exposed them brutally.
Well, a lot of these guys are in some trouble because of their involvement in some of the mischief and mayhem. Their future employment is going to be in some serious jeopardy if the Bushies go down, and maybe even if they don't.
They can lash out if they want, but they might ask themselves if that will do more harm than good. They only have themselves to blame.
Well, fuck me.
Post one goddamned little thought, and back out to find three goddamn threads have popped up like mushrooms.
Or the arms of a Hydra.
It's really tough to get traction here some days.
PS: Tena, if you're still about, I wonder how you feel being a bird in the gilded cage of popularity.
I notice that ql lamented downthread that she hadn't managed to get a response from you in spite of addressing you specifically about her water woes.
I was similarly distressed the other day-- I still wonder if you ever even saw my multiple posts about a "New Yorker" article that made me think of you.
This speaks not only to your popularity, but to the fact that these comments have long since morphed into a kind of time-delay chat room.
I remember when I first began exploring various on-line fora a few years back; people often sharply reminded "chat"-type commenters that this is a "discussion board", not a "chat room".
I guess we showed 'em!
PS: Would you consider being fitted with some sort of electronic ankle bracelet or GPS detector? Ql and I will chip in. It's important for us to know where you are at all times. 
How long before they "Goldwater" him by denouncing the father of their movement as a crazy, senile has-been?
I give it until next Sunday's morning protofascist wankfest.
Wolcott:
Poor President Bush, prince of fools. He let the neoconservative creative destructors play upon his religiosity (and Cheney's power hunger) and persuade him that the overthrow of Saddam Hussein would be a transformative moment that would set democracy and freedom in motion across the region, and crown him in history with Churchillian honor....
the "F" stands for Fuckley (i just made that up right now)
...but he is right on this one
The Corner is hilarious today. Cliff May has a post up, building on his central theory of foreign policy:
"You can determine how right you are by how many enemies you have"
Fucking retard.
High pie. Sorry I missed you guys. Kinda like the wife was still a little paranoid after getting whacked in the drivers side and totalling her car. :/
Next time, dammit.
I wonder, is "Chtulu" meant to be "Cthulhu"?
rorschach
No, it is not. I'm tired of humans being unable to spell my name correctly, and there is another who posts under the handle "Cthulhu". I'm Nominal, which suggests regularity and consistency, and that there are some standards over here in R'yleh.
In the words of santa claus, "There can be -- only one".
. . . Congress . . . pours most of its Iraq-related energy into allegations of manipulated intelligence before the war. "Those aren't irrelevant questions," says Sen. Joe Lieberman (D-Conn.). "But the more they dominate the public debate, the harder it is to sustain public support for the war."
Lieberman is an unctuous, smarmy son of a bitch.
And, god damn it, that is exactly why the questions should dominate the public debate.
. . . Congress . . . pours most of its Iraq-related energy into allegations of manipulated intelligence before the war. "Those aren't irrelevant questions," says Sen. Joe Lieberman (D-Conn.). "But the more they dominate the public debate, the harder it is to sustain public support for the war."
Lieberman is an unctuous, smarmy son of a bitch.
And, god damn it, that is exactly why the questions should dominate the public debate.
PS: Would you consider being fitted with some sort of electronic ankle bracelet or GPS detector? Ql and I will chip in. It's important for us to know where you are at all times.
Little Brøther | 02.25.06 - 2:39 pm | #
Why oh why does no one want to track my every move?
rorschach, that is indeed the truth.
when I showed up to take the NC Bar last week, I ran into several attorney friends from new orleans. some had decided not to return, some had returned and were anxious to get the hell out. without exception, they were all despondent over the city's future. There are very very few of my friends and neighbors who have any optimism left. The city is dying before our very eyes. This mardi gras is nothing but rouge placed on a patient to make them look more healthy.
Next time, dammit.
Totally understood, Barndog. Missed you though.
Next time, yes.
Anyone want to start a pool as to the date the helicopters begin landing on the roof of the US embassy to pluck the last of the Americans to safety on a carrier in the Persian Gulf.
I'm thinking July at the latest.
This mardi gras is nothing but rouge placed on a patient to make them look more healthy.
TJ
I just really, really hope we're wrong.
I've never understood why the radical Bush administration can be called conservative, except they do so with little objection. What's conservative about them, other than an ostentatious Xianity, having little to do with the actual New Testament? There's merely a cult of personality around W, whom I find utterly mystifying in his lack of charm.
Stay the Course has done so well, so far, hasn't it?
Anyone want to start a pool as to the date the helicopters begin landing on the roof of the US embassy to pluck the last of the Americans to safety on a carrier in the Persian Gulf.
With an unlimited supply of people who want revenge for what the US has been doing to their brothers and sisters in Iraq, I wouldn't want to be in the position of the troops.
I want to know what took them so long. Anyone who couldn't see Bush was an idiot in the first debates with Gore had to have their eyes shut.
Yah, I think it's all relative. More like whether or not they have trace amounts of self-respect and honor, determining just how much bullshit they're willing to swallow (and regurgitate) and for how long.
I would posit that the evidence of the slightest honesty in a person precludes the possibility of being a "wingnut" in the fullest and truest sense of the term.
"You can determine how right you are by how many enemies you have"
Well, that Hitler guy must have been really, really right then, huh?
It's about time. It's one thing for flat-earther, Jesus-addled trailer trash to buy into the neocon pirates' talking points constantly reinforced by shills like Limbaugh and O'Reilly. It's another thing for a literate and intelligent individual with reasoning ability (I hope I'm not giving Bill Buckley too much credit here) to do so, or to continue to carry water for a group of crooks and liars who have as much in common with Conservatism as they have with an eggplant. It looks like Buckley's intracranial pressure may have built up to the point that he's having to get off the neocon whackjob bandwagon before his head explodes.
The Corner is hilarious today. Cliff May has a post up, building on his central theory of foreign policy:
"You can determine how right you are by how many enemies you have"
Fucking retard.
thehim
So Cliff May is saying that HITLER was the most correct person of all time.
Nice.
They can lash out if they want, but they might ask themselves if that will do more harm than good. They only have themselves to blame.
heh.
Nicely put.
so, as i;ve been saying to the unhinged trolls
these people aren't republicans they are bush worshippers
Oh good, Armando talking about himself in the third person again, thanks duncan, just the thing.
So Cliff May is saying that HITLER was the most correct person of all time.
Followed closely by Saddam, Osama, Howard Dean, Michael Moore, and the Clintons.
these people aren't republicans they are bush worshippers
And they sure as shit aren't conservative.
Followed closely by Saddam, Osama, Howard Dean, Michael Moore, and the Clintons.
Eli
I'd say Steinbrenner deserves the spot between Osama and Dean.
Why has no one bothered to notice that putting two people in charge (Rice and Hughes) of shaping our image abroad whose entire schtick consists of talking to people as if they're 8 years olds was probably not the best idea.
But, Daniel Schorr told Scott Simon this morning that he never thought he'd have to report that Sec. Rice had failed at something!
(and NPR sinks even lower in my esteem; as if that was possible)
It's difficult for most people to admit when they're wrong, but impossible for some.
Some people would rather die than be proven wrong.
and they don;t worhsip what bush is
they worship what they percieve him to be
They will label Buckley as a "senile old coot" who has lost his marbles and outlived his usefulness.
McCarthy will get thrown out of the club.
Really, the right wing is insane. They can't tolerate sensible talk. Makes 'em crazy.
Besides, all the fun in being a political pundit is getting to debate with the other side.
When there is no debate because it's been effectively squelched, what's the point?
But, Daniel Schorr told Scott Simon this morning that he never thought he'd have to report that Sec. Rice had failed at something!
MY HEAD A SPLODE
TJ, This will be lost in the chaos, but the fact that Fukuyama has weighed in on the side of "responsible" conservatives is important -- though, to me, anyone who supported our the rise of the proto-fascist religious sociopaths is just another Good German, and "responsible" for more than they would want to accept.
The questions his comments raise in real terms: Do Fukuyama, Snowcroft, Buckley, et al. have enough weight and influence on The Right any longer? Can they erode conservative support for these creatures? Or has the Putsch gotten so far ahead of them that their commentary is too little, too late?
.
have they started to call Mccarthy
"the liberal andrew amccarthy"
Daniel Schorr told Scott Simon this morning that he never thought he'd have to report that Sec. Rice had failed at something!
Which is not the same as saying he never thought she'd BE wrong, just never thought he'd have to REPORT the fact.
Coming soon -- facts from the media!
Prepare yourselves.
It looks like Buckley's intracranial pressure may have built up to the point that he's having to get off the neocon whackjob bandwagon before his head explodes./i>
Well, good for Bufuckley. The fact that he backed these insane assholes and their anarchic policies (or lack thereof) defines intellectual dishonesty, in my opinion.
This holier-than-thou asshole can lie in the bed he helped make.
I wouldn't get so excited about the right-wingers changing their minds on Iraq. It's just a re-structuring to get themselves ready for elections.
Mark my words--these guys will be hailed for their boldness in breaking ranks and the Dems will be criticized for being too hesitant in calling for a withdrawal.
This is what frustrates me the *most* about the Democratic leaders. It never occurs to them to get ahead of the political curve.
And I would rather be proven wrong than die...
Or has the Putsch gotten so far ahead of them that their commentary is too little, too late?
I'm guessing too little, too late. The GOP is about nothing but power now; there is no consistent ideology behind it beyond capital.
But, Daniel Schorr told Scott Simon this morning that he never thought he'd have to report that Sec. Rice had failed at something!
At something?!! Good grief. The woman has failed miserably, involved in some of the worst fuckups this country has ever experienced.
Wake up and smell the blood!!
welcome to World Forum....
Actually, today, I'd rather die than pay taxes.
Ugh. I'm doing them right now.
Not that I mind paying taxes. Just that I hate preparing them for the IRS to scrutinize.
There are so many things about which I would LOVE to be proven wrong, including my opinion of myself, of the world, of the future...
Daniel Schorr told Scott Simon this morning that he never thought he'd have to report that Sec. Rice had failed at something!
That was a "historical" commentary.
They will label Buckley as a "senile old coot" who has lost his marbles and outlived his usefulness.
Aside from his conclusion, his argument actually is quite tepid, and consists largely of "we'd have won in Vietnam if not for the liberals."
He defines a "postulate" of American foreign policy, and then has to reach across Iraq, the Gulf War, Panama, Grenada, Vietnam, and Korea, to WWII, in order to show us "how it's done when it's done right."
So what he's really saying is not that Iraq was the wrong war, but that W. screwed it up so badly it's now pointless.
Which, yes, is the best you could ever expect from a Catholic war-monger like Buckley (hey, he makes a big deal of it, not me!), but still....
Has anyone at NPR noticed how senile Daniel Schorr has become? Surely there's an NPR employee somewhere who considers him the embarrassment he's turned into.
I guess it's like Red Barber, always talking about the crocuses in Tallahassee. They seemed to bloom every spring
notice how trolls don't come by trying to win arguments anymore - just declarative, "i love bush you're all traitors." statements and then they run away - never answering one of our objections or questions or posting a link - I think they've all gone back to looking at porn pages and whacking off!
here trollee trollee trollee...
screaming owls
The NYTimes has an article, What Civil War Could Look Like, that opens a whole new can of stinky worms on Iraq:
"The greatest fear of leaders throughout the Middle East is that an unrestrained civil war, if it ever comes to that, would not only give birth to warring Sunni, Shiite and Kurdish enclaves inside Iraq, but that the violence could also spread unpredictably through the region."
This isn't about WMDs anymore or that Saddamm was a bad guy.
If people are starting to evacuate the cities, the mass exodus may be such a magnitude no one will be able to address it in terms of humanitarian aid, services or supplies. And who is going to protect them?
Bush's little war may be at a turning point, but not in the direction he intended. It'll be a run-away train and the brake handle will be broken.
Welcome to South Dakota...
where the state owns your uterus.
The questions his comments raise in real terms: Do Fukuyama, Snowcroft, Buckley, et al. have enough weight and influence on The Right any longer? Can they erode conservative support for these creatures? Or has the Putsch gotten so far ahead of them that their commentary is too little, too late?
.
Nominal Chtulu
Those are all good questions. Sadly, I don't think so. I think that Greenwald's Bush Cult theory is correct. IIRC, even George Will was dismissed as "not really a conservative" by Captain Special Ed (Tbogg posted about it sometime last week) because he disagreed with the administration position on wiretapping. As long as the Limbaugh faction (Hannity, Hume, Barnes etc.) are the voices dominating the media, I don't see how so-called responsible conservatives can even get their message out.
But, Daniel Schorr told Scott Simon this morning that he never thought he'd have to report that Sec. Rice had failed at something!
I am unaware of anything in which the woman has succeeded. At least as far as her involvement in the government goes.
So what he's really saying is not that Iraq was the wrong war, but that W. screwed it up so badly it's now pointless.
I've noticed that that seems to be the trend among the hawks. That way, they get to pretend that they weren't wrong in the first place.
Concede nothing. Blame everyone else.
"The great divide on the Right has begun. Those with self respect and honor. And those who do not. How they are lining up is not surprising. The Limbaugh and Liars stand together. The smarter and more honorable ones separate."
POPCORN! Get hot buttered Popcorn!
Dems will be criticized for being too hesitant in calling for a withdrawal
nah! All dems have already been painted as wanting out of iraq - regardless of what their stance on the war actually is - I think there are internal repug polls out there predicting a storm this november and they are scared shitless - they haven't a clue what to do, so what you'll see is a lot of rethuglicans waging very individual campaigns - I'm a maverick, no I'm a maverick... etc.
But, Daniel Schorr told Scott Simon this morning that he never thought he'd have to report that Sec. Rice had failed at something!
Well, in a semantic way there's truth to that. Condoleezza has spent her career dodging responsibility for anything, so when things fail she's been able to blame it on "Not Me" and "Ida Know" (oh that wacky Family Circus). I'd say she's like Sgt. Schultz, but I wouldn't want to compare the Bush government to Nazi Germany.
I'm guessing too little, too late. The GOP is about nothing but power now; there is no consistent ideology behind it beyond capital.
rorschach
Yah; like you, I don't want to say we're in a situation with few positive options, but... I have a feeling Fukuyama is really only writing for ten of his Rightist dinner-and-cocktail party-circut pals; a sort of Get-Outta-Jail-Free pass he can point to when the shit really hits the fan and say See? See? I was right!
Even if Bush and the rest of the bowl-scum go down hard, now, what they've left behind will take a generation to clean up ... if people haven't gone back to sleep, that is, which (apologies in advance) Boomers did after the end of the Vietnam War...
.
"So what he's really saying is not that Iraq was the wrong war, but that W. screwed it up so badly it's now pointless."
Rmj. Yeah, you nailed that one. The fault is not with the cause, but with the tool used to implement the process.
It doesn't look like Thers is here and I have to go to work now. So if he comes around and anyone thinks of it could you tell him....
Scout posted her reaction to the story Thers had on Tweety saying Bush=Atticus Finch ...my daddy
...but I wouldn't want to compare the Bush government to Nazi Germany.
puppethead
Aw, why not? C'mon; it's fun! And more accurate by the day!
.
I've noticed that that seems to be the trend among the hawks. That way, they get to pretend that they weren't wrong in the first place.
It'll be something like this:
Even tho we are saying what you were saying years ago, it's not that we were wrong then, it's that it was wrong to say it back then but NOW it's the right thing to say. So we were always right and you were and are wrong.
.
Terry used to call me "little bird."
rorschach
rorschach - left you a comment over on your blog, which does not get enough attention.
I am suspicious that this is just the wingnut way to re-serve a spoiled chicken (hawk) soup.
rorschach - left you a comment over on your blog, which does not get enough attention.
Tena
You are a sweetheart, Tena.
I still think it is hilarious when Duncan, Armando or Kos call someone out for being dishonest. Very funny.
"Lieberman is an unctuous, smarmy son of a bitch."
Not for nuttin' is he known unaffectionately as "Joementum".
So when Bill Buckley writes that the Plame Leak is a very serious matter and now, more ominously for Republicans, that Iraq is lost, Republican shills and Wingnuts, and indeed, the Media, are put in a very difficult place. Because if Bill Buckley can state the obvious, they paint themselves as fools and/or knaves if they ignore it.
How long before they "Goldwater" him by denouncing the father of their movement as a crazy, senile has-been?
Stinky |
Or Wellstone him?
I still think it is hilarious when Duncan, Armando or Kos call someone out for being dishonest. Very funny.
Cog
Shame no one gives fuck what YOU think.
Welcome to South Dakota...
where the state owns your uterus.
SSquirrel
The Assbackwards State.
You can tell when a persons politics have overwhelmed their humanity when the only aspect of any situation they are willing to address is the political advantage. Weep my country
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