I'MMA LET YOU FINISH
mAnn Coulter is a skank
Moonbo, you're too kind.
Ann Coulter is psychotic.
Ann Coulter is a skinny blonde female.
Michael Moore is a fat, dark-haired male.
See? They're exactly alike.
didnt you hear michael moore make all those death threats?
.
.
.
me neither.
A person mentioned seeing Coulter in the DC metro, talking to herself and very jittery. I think most cokeheads act like that.
The worst yet is Mickey Kaus -- What Kos said 2 years ago is worse than Ann Coulter.
Let's compare Coulter's *facts* with Michael Moore's and see who understands what they are.
And yes, I'm sick and tired of hearing broad pronouncements without any backing whatsoever.
Moonbo, you're too kind.
Ann Coulter is psychotic.
Sallyh, Grandmere Poissonniere
Ann Coulter is the raging heart of the Bushevik wing of the Republican Party!
Moore tells the truth with a twist. Mr. Coulter tells lies with a twist of the knife.
Michael Moore is nothing like mAnn Coulter.
he is not the one abusing the 9/11 widows!
mAnn Coulter is a throughly disgusting slapper.
Azores summit hosts -- 2, Dudes with Nucular Weapons**
Cristiano Ronaldo scores from the penalty spot.
And yes, I'm sick and tired of hearing broad pronouncements without any backing whatsoever.
pie
The Wankette seems to bring plently of broad backing to the vacuous pronouncements of Time, Inc.
Bring on the barbecues - but watch out for road rage
· 'Fantastic' conditions predicted for weekend
· Risk of rail slowdowns and road crowding
Already the signs are beginning to show. Lawns are yellowing. The air tastes thicker. Sales of kebab meat, deodorant and spinach are on the rise. And, at a time when incidents of food poisoning are supposedly increasing, we've started to leave more tips.
The weather is hotting up. After a week that began with the hottest June 12 on record, Britain is expecting a summer to rival those of her continental neighbours.
Give or take a few shreds of cloud, most of the country is due to bask in above-average temperatures this weekend. "The weather will be glorious, smashing, fantastic, superb," an enthusiastic Met Office spokesman said yesterday.
Today is likely to see bumper sales of barbecue meats, beers, lawnmowers, summer clothes and outdoor sports equipment. Lloydspharmacy has reported that sales of suncream have shot up by 400% and Sainsbury's noted a 150% increase in kebab sales.
The biggest difference between Moore and Coulter (their relative, demonstrable humanity aside) is that Moore attacks and upbraids the powerful for their brutality and hypocrisy, while Coulter beats up on the weak...
.
Ann Coulter is just like Michael Moore because....
just because, that's all! Now, would you like to see pictures of Brad's baby?
OT: America's bogeyman is an Islamist hero to many in Somalia
The Islamist fighters looting the United Nations and African Union compounds in Jowhar were led by a man so thin that he looked almost frail with a row of grenades strapped to his chest.
The man was Aden Hashi Ayro - to the Americans al-Qa'ida's chief killer in east Africa, but to many Somalis a nationalist fighting for his country and for Islam against the US and their corrupt client warlords.
What is not in dispute is that Ayro has been one of those most instrumental in the sweeping successes enjoyed by the Islamic forces, and that even in a place bristling with gunmen, such as the capital, Mogadishu, he inspires genuine fear.
Moore attacks and upbraids the powerful for their brutality and hypocrisy, while Coulter beats up on the weak...
The skinny broad is a playground bully. And you know how quickly the bully turns tail and runs when confronted.
Good comparison.
Moonbo--we had a scorcher here yesterday. Which, in SoCal, means we strain the power grid to the max.
And the North Koreans are all ready to test a warhead-lobbing missle that can reach the Western U.S.. Whoopeee!!!!
Good comparison.
pie | Homepage | 06.17.06 - 10:47 am
dang me...was that a small compliment you just let slip, pie?
careful there...
And the North Koreans are all ready to test a warhead-lobbing missle that can reach the Western U.S.. Whoopeee!!!!
Sorry if I find this more amusing (in a Keystone cops kind of way) than scary.
Didn't Time do a cover story back in the early nineties inferring that Rush Limbaugh was balanced out by that flaming leftie Howard Stern?
dang me...was that a small compliment you just let slip
You deserve them occasionally.
Operation Forward Together -- Mission Accomplished
BAGHDAD, Iraq - A series of explosions struck commercial areas in Baghdad within hours Saturday, killing at least 17 people and dealing a blow to a huge government operation to secure the capital.
The blasts — seven within five hours — brought the death toll around Iraq to at least 23 people. The bombings also wounded at least 72.
OT: Son of Italy's last king held over Mafia and prostitution claims
The son of Italy's last king, Prince Victor Emmanuel, has been arrested in the north Italian town of Lecco as part of an investigation into charges he was involved with the Sicilian Mafia and a prostitution racket.
Victor Emmanuel, who has 10 other names, was nine years old when his father, King Umberto, went into exile in Portugal after Italians voted in 1946 to replace the monarchy with a republic. He and his family were barred from returning to Italy until March 2003, when many years of lobbying finally paid off.
The investigation leading to his arrest was launched at the other end of the country, in the city of Potenza, capital of the region of Basilicata in the far south, by a flamboyant and controversial prosecutor called Henry John Woodcock, the 39-year-old son of a British father and a Neapolitan mother. Mr Woodcock has carved a unique reputation for himself as a fearless challenger of highly placed politicians and other influential people, whom he has accused of being involved with organised crime. But many of his more audacious arrests have not resulted in trials.
Operation Forward Together
Stupidest name ever.
When an Austrian says this, it's bad
VIENNA (Reuters) - Austrian right-wing populist Joerg Haider called President Bush a war criminal on Saturday, days before Austria's government hosts Bush and European leaders in Vienna.
ADVERTISEMENT
Haider, whose group is part of Austrian Chancellor Wolfgang Schuessel's government coalition, said Bush's meeting with his European peers on Wednesday was pointless as he did not expect the U.S. president to pay attention to what Europe had to tell him.
"He is a war criminal. He brought about the war against Iraq deliberately, with lies and falsehoods," Haider said in an interview with Austrian daily newspaper Die Presse.
"The Iraqi population is suffering terribly. Bush took the risk of an enormous number of victims," said Haider.
Operation Forward Together
so I guess they have grown bored with Phallic names for these operations.
And the North Koreans are all ready to test a warhead-lobbing missle that can reach the Western U.S.. Whoopeee!!!!
Sorry if I find this more amusing (in a Keystone cops kind of way) than scary.
pie
To be countered by the Keystone Kops missile defense base in Alaska that has no anti-missile missiles.
Haider, whose group is part of Austrian Chancellor Wolfgang Schuessel's government coalition, said Bush's meeting with his European peers on Wednesday was pointless as he did not expect the U.S. president to pay attention to what Europe had to tell him.
Yep. Everyone pretty much has Bush's number.
The man doesn't listen. Dictators rarely do.
"Star Wars" What a good investment!
When an Austrian says this, it's bad.
not just ANY austrian, you understand...
this austrian was prevented from assuming the positiono f Prime Minister (iirc) because of his too-close ties to the remnants of the Anschluss...
like Schwartzenegger's family...
.
Maybe the real question is: Why doesn't the left have its own extreme caricature on TV to make to run of the mil wing nuts look sane? I'm sure they exist, but they don't get on national TV.
I expect that if someone came out and said something like "Americans are getting screwed by the oil industry, so lets federalize Exxon-Mobile via eminent domain. Also, we need to bring all military services back under direct government control." they would quietly disappear.
Ethiopia denies crossing into Somalia
Ethiopia has denied sending troops into Somalia after the Islamic Courts Union leader accused its neighbour of deploying 300 soldiers across the border.
Sheikh Sharif Sheikh Ahmad, chairman of the Islamic Courts Union, said the Ethiopian troops entered Somalia through the border town of Dolow in the southwestern region of Gedo at 8am (0500 GMT).
"We want the whole world to know what's going on," Ahmed told journalists. "Ethiopia has crossed our borders and are heading for us. They are supporting the transitional federal government.
"They have deployed a lot of soldiers around the border towns, which is why we have been saying that Ethiopia is going to send in troops to Somalia," the cleric said.
I expect that if someone came out and said something like "Americans are getting screwed by the oil industry, so lets federalize Exxon-Mobile via eminent domain.
Isn't this what Putin did?
And so this Nazi-related hyper-conservatard call
Dear Leader a war criminal? Maybe it takes one to know one.
Operation Forward Together
All these operational names are just part of the propaganda these days. I remember a time (may have been during Desert Storm) when the Pentagon claimed it was just a coincidence when the operational names seemed to refer exactly to what was happening (or to what they wanted us to believe was happening). Everything is propaganda these days. I used to say it was PR, but PR taken to extremes becomes propaganda.
Operation Forward Together
Dude, that's gay.
"Tell me more about the future of energy."
Jörg Haider
Jörg Haider (born 26 January 1950) is an Austrian politician. He is currently Governor of Carinthia.
Haider was the long-time leader of the far right Austrian Freedom Party (FPÖ), and after stepped down as the party's chairman in 2000, he remained a major figure until 2005. In April 2005 he founded a new party, the "Alliance for the Future of Austria" (BZÖ), and was subsequently expelled from the FPÖ by its interim leader Hilmar Kabas.
That Ethiopia-Somalia thing that MB posted is another heckuva job for Chimpy. He backed the warlords fighting the Islamic groups -- and lost. So now they're dragging in Ethiopia to help.
Comparisons of invidious fools didn't used to be obligatory - let's remember that sui generis Father Coughlin for example....
Moonbootica: Mmmmmm!
In TRUE barbecue, the flame never goes near the meat; otherwise, it's just "grilling" and you make the meat tough, not tender.
Real Southern-style barbecue is essentially an indirect-heat process midway between smoking meat and grilling it. The heated air around the food (heated air usually seasoned with the steam from hickory or other water-soaked wood chips) is what does the cooking.
it's not a valid comparison whatsoever.
michael moore may be strident, but he's not bombastic.
and if you have to look up the definitions to those words, you may already be a Coulter fan.
P O'Neill wouldn't be the first time an African nation has been drawn into their next door neighbour's conflicts either heh
More east Africa
Reports say two of the Somali warlords defeated in the fighting in Mogadishu have fled the country.
Bashir Raghe and Muse Sudi Yalahow, both part of a coalition formed to fight the Islamist militia earlier in the year, are said to have left Mogadishu by boat.
Reports suggested that the two men had boarded a US vessel off the coast of Somalia.
"Bashir Raghe and Muse Sudi took a boat and they were picked up by the US," a senior aide to the Islamist leadership, Abdulrahman Ali Osman, told Reuters news agency.
Another difference is you don't see MM on teevee every other minute. Apparently he has other things to do.
Phoenix Woman my mother recently got rid of our old BBQ, and so we are currently without one.
but she has promised to buy a new one soon.
What has Moore said that isn't true? So he showed some kid flying a kite in Saddam's Iraq. Does anyone claim that Saddam banned kite flying?
The Coulter/Moore comparison is a subset of the larger phony claim that the problem with politics is polarization because the ultraconservatives have taken over the Republicans and the ultraleftists have taken over the Democrats. A lot depends on how you define the center, but if you take Nixon as representing past conservatism and LBJ as representing liberalism, then it's easy to find prominent Republicans who are far to the right of Nixon, but name any prominent Democrats who are much to the left of LBJ.
Bon Appetit magazine's current Barbeque issue is unadulterated Food Porn.
I saw Scarbourgh last week say that Moore said he wanted to see Iraq flow with the blood of US soldiers or something to that affect. Scarbourgh went on to say that because of that statement he was just like Coulter. I do not beleive Moore every said anything like that.
Sri Lanka, Tigers claim victory in naval clash
COLOMBO (Reuters) - Sri Lanka's government and Tamil Tiger rebels each claimed victory on Saturday after a naval clash that officials said left more than 40 people dead or missing.
The Tigers threatened retaliation if air force bombing restarted.
Sri Lankan jets pounded rebel targets on Thursday and Friday in retaliation for an attack on a civilian bus that killed 64 people in the worst violence since a 2002 ceasefire, raising fears of an imminent return to a two-decade civil war.
The government said on Saturday the air strikes had ceased. But officials said more than 40 people were dead or missing in a clash in the northeastern Mannar district, while suspected Tiger frogmen were captured and attempted suicide near the capital.
When comparing Ann Coulter and Michael Moore, please do not fail to point out that Michael Moore is fat.
Everything is propaganda these days. I used to say it was PR, but PR taken to extremes becomes propaganda.
Toonscribe - 10:57 am
Tooons:
prob'ly i do not have to remind you, but there are others more credulous:
Every fucking word, punctuation mark, and syllable that issues from the Govt is PROPAGANDA...
ALL of it...
Not a single sentence is NOT measured before it is released according to some metric of desired effect.
NOTHING that the Govt--especially THIS regime--says is 'true'...everything is moulded, and shaped for effect in the sense of internal agit-prop...
this is well to remember...
.
Two shrill wind bags who distort the truth with made up "facts", and who put their fame and fortune ahead of the best interest of their country.
Scarborough makes his living getting his knickers in a twist every day. He's always up in arms about very little -- yet we still can't get a clear explanation about the death of a young female aide in his Congressional Office.
In TRUE barbecue, the flame never goes near the meat; otherwise, it's just "grilling" and you make the meat tough, not tender.
What is this 'flame' of which you speak?
WaPo -- they were OK with all the other stuff
"That really damaged Bush," said William Kristol, editor of the Weekly Standard, a conservative magazine, who added that conservatives routinely tell the president that the Miers pick was the moment they started to question him. "It was not an accident that it happened at the height of the [CIA leak probe], when Rove was at his weakest."
http://www.washingtonpost.com/
wp...6061602015.html
Blears admits voters turn to BNP
Labour Party chairman Hazel Blears says the British National Party made gains in May's local elections because voters felt ignored by mainstream politicians
She said the BNP's success had been a "major concern" for Labour.
Ms Blears was speaking to the party's ethnic minority taskforce in Leicester on Saturday.
Ms Blears said: "Extremist politics flourishes where mainstream politics leaves a vacuum. All parties must take the responsibility for this."
She also urged the party to forge new links with communities to fill the "democratic vacuum" that the far-right group had exploited in some areas of the country.
Bon Appetit magazine's current Barbeque issue is unadulterated Food Porn.
I usually love the barbeque issue, but this one was more ads than recipes.
Speaking of food porn, could I interest anyone in fresh strawberries, buttermilk pancakes, coffee, and Bloodys with Bays Seasoning?
PS It's not that they are JUST alike. They just share some particularly disgusting qualities.
Two shrill wind bags who distort the truth with made up "facts", and who put their fame and fortune ahead of the best interest of their country.
Dee | 06.17.06 - 11:04 am
two?
there's that cunt coulter?
but who's the other one? Doughy Pantload? Cabbage-masher? O'Rally?
be more specific, fucknozzle...
Bon Appetit magazine's current Barbeque issue is unadulterated Food Porn.
plantsman, lowercase
Hmmmm..... An ambition for Saturday morning...
US military vessel picks up defeated Somali warlords from Mogadishu
MOGADISHU (AFP) - A US military vessel has picked up two defeated Somali warlords from Mogadishu, while a third defected to the Islamic Courts militia now in control of the capital, officials said.
Musa Sudi Yalahwo and Bashir Raghe Shirar, who were under the protection of their clan in northern Mogadishu's Karan districts, took a boat to an approaching US military vessel on the coast, while Omar Muhamoud Finnish joined the Union of Islamic Courts, they said Saturday.
"Yalahwo and Shirar took a boat and were picked up by the US ship. No one knows where they are heading but they said they will be back," a bodyguard of the warlords said and several residents confirmed.
The three were members of the US-backed Alliance for the Restoration of Peace and Counter-Terrorism (ARPCT), formed in February to help fight the Islamists, who are accused by Western intelligence of having links with extremist groups such as Al-Qaeda and harbouring foreign fighters.
They were among a group of brutal faction chiefs who had divided and ruled the lawless capital since the fall of dictator Mohamed Siad Barre in 1991.
If you see anyone on the teevee comparing Moore and Coulter with a straight face, you basically know that you shouldn't believe one more thing they say.
Putting aside the fact that they both tend to run afoul of the truth, he occasionally and she continually, they are entirely different types of animals.
For one, Moore isn't even that far to the left. and he never, ever preaches hate. Outrage, maybe, but not hate. If you want hate, you need somebody like Ward Churchill. He genuinely hates America, and they would never dream of letting him go near the teevee. Shit --they won't even let Chomsky on the teevee anymore, and he just sort of sternly disapproves of America.
Coulter, on the other hand, is continually preaching hate -- hate of liberals, hate of Democrats, hate of Muslims or any other non-Christians. Hate, hate, hate. She is either batshit, frothingly insane, or as I suspect, a circus act.
It pisses me off so much how all these media shills continually strive to redefine the center. I believe I even heard one of the NPR commentators speak of Bill Maher's exreme left-wing views. Wha?? Meybe it's because he wants to legalize reefer. I guess that makes him a commie. And not approving of every goddam dumbass thing Little Boots does means that you hate America.
My only comfort in all of this is that this tainted corporate media establishment is steadily digging its grave with all these lies.
You know, this need to find a boogeyman on the left to match Coulter is just so ... pathetic. We're gonna FORCE balance where there is none.
I'm not a Moore fan, personally. I don't like being shouted at. However, the comparison with Coulter simply isn't apt. Moore has never, to my knowledge, called for anyone's assasination or incited physical violence against anybody.
Not to mention the whole "selects the facts that support his argument" vs. "completely makes shit up about everything" question.
A.
Kazakhstan signs pipeline accord
Kazakhstan moved to reduce its dependency on Russia on Friday, signing a US-backed agreement to supply oil for a key Caspian-Mediterranean pipeline that will provide an alternative energy source for Europe.
The agreement signed by Nursultan Nazarbayev, president of Kazakhstan, and Ilham Aliyev, president of Azerbaijan, resolves one of the outstanding issues to be settled before a long sought-after visit to the White House by Mr Nazarbayev, analysts said. A spokesman for the Kazakh embassy in Washington said the two sides were working on a date for the visit, expected in the coming months.
Dick Cheney, US vice-president, went to Astana last month to reaffirm support for Mr Nazarbayev, whom he described as a “strategic partner”, despite concerns over Kazakhstan’s human rights record, including the high-profile assassination of an opposition politician and the conduct of presidential elections last December.
I think this blogger's righteous condemnation of Coulter (that reference's the Moore comparison) ia rather excellent, I might even believe that were I not that blogger:
http://www.whatjailislike.com/ad...s/
00000270.html
but name any prominent Democrats who are much to the left of LBJ.
john sherman
If you don't walk around all day with a flag pinned to your ass and pray for Chimpy each night, you're a "leftist."
Another difference is you don't see MM on teevee every other minute. Apparently he has other things to do.
ql in ny
I remember when Moore was on the CBS morning show for F9/11. The newsbimbot du jour made a great show of being disgusted by having to interview such an unpatriotic slob, very melodramatically avoiding eye contact, sighing and shrugging. Hannah Storm, I think her name was.
also: even if they were equivelant, i dont see moore being hosted on every teevee show.
Not that all bloggers don't need an editor, what's that apostrophe doing in "references"?
I believe I even heard one of the NPR commentators speak of Bill Maher's exreme left-wing views.
Yeah, because casual racism and mocking of Arabs is SO left-wing.
I can't watch that wanker. Mr. A finds his shows hilarious. I have to leave the house when he's on.
A.
I can't watch that wanker. Mr. A finds his shows hilarious. I have to leave the house when he's on.
A.
Athenae - 11:12 am
on this we can agree...Maher's a total fucknozzle...
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Athenae sez:
You know, this need to find a boogeyman on the left to match Coulter is just so ... pathetic. We're gonna FORCE balance where there is none.
Agreed.
But how else does one get noticed?
.
Of course Coulter isn't anything like Michael Moore. Michael Moore is fat.
I'm pretty sure this would cause mAnn Coulter's head to explode!
The police are considering a proposal to let selected British Muslims examine the intelligence used to mount anti-terrorism raids before they take place, the Guardian has learned.
The proposal will be considered as part of a review of the raid in Forest Gate, east London, a fortnight ago when 250 officers stormed a family house searching for a chemical weapon which was not found. One man was shot and police have apologised for the "hurt" caused by the raid which has further damaged strained relations with the local community. The review began this week and is expected to be completed before the end of the month.
While such a review after a controversial incident is standard, this one is unique because British Muslims are involved from the start.
Rory, from your post:
The thing is, our mass media, which each side says is biased for the other side but I don't think is biased for either so much as dumb,
So totally true.
A.
Romanesko writes: "I honestly don't know to what extent Coulter believes what she is saying."
I keep hearing this during the latest Coulter "debate" and I think it's immaterial. Pondering whether or not she belives what she's saying gives her an excuse for saying it. "Oh, she's just making a buck!" "Oh, she's just performance art!" It implies that it's not to be taken seriously, that it's harmless. She is not harmless. Dehumanizing people w/language is step one on the road to bigger -- and "better" (in the eyes of Coulter and her acolytes) -- things.
Whome among us does not love naked lesbian art teachers?
Poor Ms. Hoover. She could use some support.
NOTHING that the Govt--especially THIS regime--says is 'true'...everything is moulded, and shaped for effect in the sense of internal agit-prop...
Unfortunately, this is all too true.
My mother is a fan of Maher's.
I just don't get it.
.
Speaking of food porn, could I interest anyone in fresh strawberries, buttermilk pancakes, coffee, and Bloodys with Bays Seasoning?
Sallyh, Grandmere Poissonniere
Yes, please. Got any whipping cream for those strawbellies?
Look, politcal alignment isn't about ideology: it's about how tolerable you are to the media whores and their bosses. Hence, Coulter is 'always fun', whereas Moore is 'fat'.
Remember back during the Republican primaries in 1980 when ROnald Raygun said something to the effect that 'I will not shut up. I paid for this microphen. IT is mine and I intend to use it to speak what I want to say.' All this is a variation of that theme. The corporations own 95% of the microphones in this country. They own the mike, and they can say whatever they want, truth or no truth.
Now they are attempting a hostile takeover via congress, who they do own, of the 5% they don't own, the Internet blogs. Then all truth will be silenced by private ownership of all the microphones.
Michael Moore is fat.
Word.
And that's what matters.
.
Auntie GWPDA--extra heavy, with a dash of vanilla.
Dehumanizing people w/language is step one on the road to bigger -- and "better" (in the eyes of Coulter and her acolytes) -- things.
Lest I devolve into inflammatory rhetoric, I'll just say I've been reading a lot about Rwanda lately. I've been reading about the radio deejays who would give out instructions for where those deserving of murder were hiding and how best to kill them.
A.
It implies that it's not to be taken seriously, that it's harmless. She is not harmless. Dehumanizing people w/language is step one on the road to bigger -- and "better" (in the eyes of Coulter and her acolytes) -- things.
Exactly. I find it hard, no, impossible, to believe that anyone connected to the media thinks Coulter's ravings are harmless.
Who's kidding whom? Thes eguys know how it works.
Coulter knows that controversy and the subsequent outrage draw attention to her and she delights in pushing the envelope. I doubt she believes half the shit she spews.
That or she really is insane.
If The Chimp wasn't being such an obvious tyrant, Maher would be figuratively deep-throating him from dusk till dawn.
The only good thing Maher ever did was having Robert Anton Wilson on his old show when Leary died, must've been someone elses idea.
OT: Military pomp marks Queen's 80th
The Queen has celebrated her official 80th birthday with a traditional Trooping the Colour parade of more than 1,100 soldiers.
Crowds lined The Mall in the sweltering sunshine to watch the annual display of pomp and pageantry marking the monarch's milestone age.
(snip)
The crowds broke into applause as the Queen made her way from the palace to Horse Guards Parade in central London. Behind the open carriage on horseback and in military dress were the Prince of Wales, who is Colonel of the Welsh Guards, the Princess Royal, Colonel of the Blues and Royals, and Gold Stick in Waiting - the Queen's senior attendant.
Pondering whether or not she belives what she's saying gives her an excuse for saying it.
It's about formulating a strategy to deal with her. Is she a New Troll (aka a batshit wingnut) or a Classic Troll (in it solely to pull people's strings)?
Whome among us does not love naked lesbian art teachers?
Artists are just *wrong*, don'tcha know.
Send the lot of them to Gitmo.
.
Michael Moore pursued GM CEO Roger Smith at great expense and difficulty across the country; for all the asspulled accusations about his elitism his documentation of the profit-driven destruction of Flint, Michigan are sincere, unique and deep. When has Ann Coulter done anything like either of these? This nonsense boils down to the idea that if Michael Moore afflicts the comfortable, it must be exactly the same thing as Ann Coulter attacking the defenseless, impotent, unpopular or racially different.
Get hip, people, the media isn't stupid. They are relying on a reputation fdor incompetence and stupidity to get away with flagrant lies that would never be tolerated from a serious researcher.
I have heard of Phelps, of homophobic fame, referred to as a performance artist. I put Coulter in the same catagory and if it is performance art, it is pornography.
William Greene: Individualist Anarchists in the First International
Auntie GWPDA--extra heavy, with a dash of vanilla.
Sallyh, Grandmere Poissonniere
'Enkew.
Blak, the fact that he still thinks Clinton jokes are funny is enough to banish him from my TV permanently.
A.
Hey gas-guzzling bitches, this kind of thing doesn't happen to a Prius. (vRW)
Coulter has been penning the same book -- and preaching the same sermon -- for years now. It might as well be called "The American Liberal: The World's Foremost Problem."
Then all truth will be silenced by private ownership of all the microphones.
Bad Art - 11:16 am
yup...good analysis...the airwaves belong to the people, but thr microphones belong to the CorpoRats...
and the people can suck eggs, pound sand, or just go fuck themselves...
.
This is why I think the way to deal with Coulter is, um, unconventional.
Punk her. Chuck a pie in her face. Spray her with liquid manure. Call her a scraggy old coke fiend on live television. Get a teenager to say 'Mom! You abandoned me as a baby!'
Think Debord.
apre moi | Homepage | 06.17.06 - 11:20 am |
It's nothing like pornography. Coulter is a latter-day Coughln making money off of hateful rubes.
World Cup? We'd rather go shopping
A third of Britons avoided the England game on Thursday. What were they doing instead?
In the shade of the foyer of the Empire, Leicester Square, two women stood squinting at viewing times, working out the maths. Outside in the heat, a man blew a klaxon and tried to get his photo taken. The women were not together. Each had decided that the best way to spend the afternoon was in front of Friends With Money, a film starring Jennifer Anniston in which four women discuss love, life, and the pursuit of shared experience. It was 90 minutes long and would do the job nicely.
At 5pm on Thursday every city centre in England should, by rights, have been a ghost town. If you weren't at work or in the pub then you were soldered to the sofa at home, braced for England v Trinidad and Tobago. This wasn't entirely the case. You had to look hard to find them, but they were there: flitting in and out of cinemas, lying in parks, shopping at Tesco; the football refuseniks, battling valiantly to find something else to do
Coulter is a latter-day Coughln making money off of hateful rubes.
Nah. That's Dobbs.
What will Coulter -- and her media enablers say -- when one of her deranged fans does put rat poison in Justice Stevens' creme brulee?
res ipsa loquitur | 06.17.06 - 11:21 am |
Yeah, that's another thing -- Moore's works are genuinely different, if part of a larger unified theme, but these bastards come out with a new book every year and it's always exactly the same thing. Probably ghostwritten too.
I want to know why thinking the Bush admin was behind 9/11 is automatically crazy, especially with all we know now.
Is it their competence? Well, they were amazingly effective in manufacturing an illegal war for fun and profit (theirs, no one else's).
Is it morality? Well, they have no probably with killing at least 100K innocent Iraqis, and seeding their country with depleted uranium so future generations will continue to suffer. Or any qualms about sending working class Americans to occupy the poisoned country, so we can have another Gulf War syndrome they can deny.
Is it that "they wouldn't do that to fellow Americans"? Well, they let a major American city drown four years later. Not to mention looking the other way and whistling while families go without medical treatment and they give the green light to their buddies poisoning the air, land and water.
You can believe the Bush-9/11 or not on the basis of facts and informed speculation, but to pin the "9/11 conspiracy crazy" label on people who consider the possibility on the basis of sorrowful rationality seems dangerously naive in the face of the evil actions we can actually prove on them.
Nah. That's Dobbs.
pseudonymous in nc | 06.17.06 - 11:22 am |
Loud Obbs' money is really elsewhere, in his efforts to excuse American business (the worlds' real foremost problem). The Coughlin formmula can be applied to all of these idiots really. Mikey Weiner is the closest analog.
Punk her. Chuck a pie in her face. Spray her with liquid manure. Call her a scraggy old coke fiend on live television. Get a teenager to say 'Mom! You abandoned me as a baby!'
i love that idea...
we could start a contest: Punk the Cunt...
give prizes and stuff...
great plan
sister of ye | 06.17.06 - 11:25 am |
What is most exciting about this is, there are a huge number of sane, ordinary people who do think something's up with Bush being totally unable to deal with any of the freakishly, millenially enormous disasters that plague his administration. It's not a minority by any means.
Not to be tedious but I kinda freaked-out yesterday about Coulter at al.
.
I agree Woody...
The police are considering a proposal to let selected British Muslims examine the intelligence used to mount anti-terrorism raids before they take place, the Guardian has learned.
This is very easy for mAnn to understand... because as any real Amurkan knows the British are actually all teh Gay and want to marry one another and be buttfucked by Islamofascists. It's a result of English public schools which were designed to further the insidious gay agenda and destroy the institution of marriage.
At least that's how it works in the wingtard world.
i'd push mAnn Coulter in a vat of raw sewage
give prizes and stuff...
great plan
WoodyGuthrie'sGuitar(aka... | Homepage | 06.17.06 - 11:25 am |
Given our mental inferiors' idea of turnabout the response would be to assassinate Moore.
Also, that Tivo ad frightens me.
Ambulatory televisions are no one's friend.
.
I just read the link. Yowza.
"I honestly don't know to what extent Coulter believes what she is saying. I would not be very surprised if she turned out to be a subversive liberal"
I want to know why thinking the Bush admin was behind 9/11 is automatically crazy, especially with all we know now.
Because, even now, many still feel the need to believe the "official" story. The alternative is too horrible for them to contemplate.
k&y - I think that's at the light end of the scale for the no-necked, knuckle-dragging, drooler brigades.
More from the article linked to:
Powers is a fine media critic, and I'd actually like to see a column by him on this phenomenon (which would have to include a mea culpa.) This practice amounts to a facile "balancing" of a nutbag bomb-thrower's violent fantasies with a comedic filmmaker's merely harsh polemics. It's a particularly stark example of what is perhaps the media's worst problem -- the "balancing" away of truth, which creates the indigestible mush that is sending readers young and old scurrying away from the mainstream media and toward Comedy Central and the blogosphere.
This is not a political assessment. I'm a journalist, not an ideologue. A better comparison to Coulter might be the crazies who say Bush planned 9-11 -- though of course, nobody's knows their names. But why make a comparison at all? There is no rule that says you have to balance Coulter with someone else: She's awful. Ignore her. Case closed.
Well put--and the false "balance" the MCMers "create" (and I do not accept that is what they are doing) has driven me away from the NYTimes (although their imbalance is what I perceived, along with lies and major slanting), CNN (lost me completely when they couldn't manage an "alleged" before describing the 4 medical students of Arab descent as terrorists), and the more idiotic cable talkers (thank heavens for Olbermann--when will he be back?).
What will bring back a more reality and fact based reporting?
Maybe we should convene a journalists/bloggers ethics panel....
Jake Tapper's reactions to criticism by Media Matters is a real eye opener--what happens to these people when they get a bit higher up the food chain of reporting? Very, very sad. They seem to feel that little inconvenient things like truth and facts need not be considered by them.
Feh. But, at least Portugal won. It's not political--I decided I really like their uniform colors!
Coulter to me seems to be a psychic holdover from
the "Capital Gang" school of conduct. She's useful as a barometer of how the body politic responds to such a fire-starting provocateur. When (and if) her schtick grows unpopular, we'll be getting somewhere, IMO.
res asks:
What will Coulter -- and her media enablers say -- when one of her deranged fans does put rat poison in Justice Stevens' creme brulee?
She was "just joking".
.
The lazyness is what is most apparent here. Moore and Coulter are alike in the same way that apples and oranges are. That is, apples and oranges are both mentioned in phrases about comparing things.
Jake Tapper's reactions to criticism by Media Matters is a real eye opener--
Yeah, I saw that and I was thinking, would they ever be so publicly and contemptuously dismissive of Brent Bozelle [rhetoricalquestionmark]
catalexis nails it.
blerb:
Putting aside the fact that they both tend to run afoul of the truth
The funny thing is that when objective facts are available, I have never "caught" Moore playing fast and loose. Every accusation against Moore so far has been little more than assertion.
This first started with "Roger and Me", BTW. Moore has been on the hit list for years.
If you want hate, you need somebody like Ward Churchill. He genuinely hates America
Got any fucking evidence of that?
Moore is a pardigm of calm, sweet reason compared to Coulter. Hell, Coulter makes Ward Churchill look normal.
Justice Alito didn't waste any time coming true to type, did he?
Make the case
I guarantee you they cannot make the case. Actually I've yet to see anything refuting the facts of F911. The media usually resorts to MM is a fat slob who looks like your average Walmart customer and is therefore only worthy of their contempt.
orange mustache voice:
THEY SAID THE WORD POOP ON A SHOW ABOUT RAISING CHILDREN THIS IS WHY THERE ARE DRUGS IN THE BLACK ZONES THIS IS THE SAME THING AS IX/XI!!!!!!!
When (and if) her schtick grows unpopular, we'll be getting somewhere, IMO.
plantsman, lowercase - 11:29 am
that'll be a start, i'd grant you...
but the tide will have turned when, and only when, none of the Busheviks--down to the fucking dog--can appear in public without being met with a hail of rotting fruit, and howls of derision...
Actually I've yet to see anything refuting the facts of F911.
Indeed, and if they couldn't find anything after that witch hunt where they rushed something like eight shitty knockoffs, they can't find anything.
I would rather listen to Moore than that raving mad harpy mAnn Coultr.
given the patriot act, why isn't Coulter locked up makeing terroristic threats?
oh i forgot IOIYAR
"Michael Moore is just like Ann Coulter."
Just because two people happen to have penises and adam's apples, doesn't mean they are alike.
I dunno, something about Churchill rubs me the wrong way.
I have nothing substantial to base this on, mind you. It's just a feeling that I have. Something about him isn't right.
Coulter's run as Honorary Vagina Dentata is just getting very tired.
The panty-sniffer on the WATB
Fun quotes from Watberman:
On criticizing the "war" in Iraq: ""My opponent says it broke Democratic unity," Lieberman said. "Well, dammit, I wasn't thinking about Democratic unity. It was a moment to put the national interest above partisan interest."
On the value of democracy, and holy wars: ""I know I'm taking a position that is not popular within the party," Lieberman said, "but that is a challenge for the party -- whether it will accept diversity of opinion or is on a kind of crusade or jihad of its own to have everybody toe the line. No successful political party has ever done that."
I can think of one successful political party that requires toeing the ideological line. I bet Joe could too. It's currently running the country.
Moore can be annoying, and disingenuous, and even a little nasty at times.
Gonna just say it and be done with it. Moore is "blue collar." He's not bourgeois, middle-class, and therefore "nice" all the time. He sits on the couch and drinks beer and watches NASCAR (so to speak). Which makes him "annoying" and "even a little nasty at time" ("disingenous" is a judgment call, but the upper calls invented "say one thing, mean another", so let's not even go there).
Moore speaks from his background. Nothing wrong with that, at all. Coulter is either insane, or a liar ("performance art"? Are you kidding me?). So let's drop this "I can't quite defend Michael Moore, but he's not that bad" simply because he's not white-collar enough to ape the actions of the American upper class.
It's a stupid distinction, and a meaningless one.
Gotta walk the hounds...be back ( i know you'll miss me)
.
Why is it so difficult to admit error?
I'm an opinionated person and I often spout-off. Sometimes I get the facts wrong. When it's pointed out that I'm wrong I say, "Whoops! I'm wrong!"
Is that so difficult?
.
Crap, typos everywhere in that last remark. Upper "class," not "calls" (huh? Not enough coffee yet?). And I didn't finish the paragraph: Moore is "annoying" if you gauge him by white, middle-class standards of "if you can't say something nice, don't say anything at all."
Moore tells the truth, as he sees it. As Truman said, doing that just makes people think you're giving 'em hell.
It's a stupid distinction, and a meaningless one.
Straight up.
Unlike Dubya or Coulter, Moore is someone who I could "have a beer with".
When it's pointed out that I'm wrong I say, "Whoops! I'm wrong!"
Is that so difficult?
For a great many Goopers, it clearly is. When you base your politics on your granite-hard moral certitude, you never ARE wrong, right?
Gotta walk the hounds
Doggiez!!!
I have nothing substantial to base this on, mind you. It's just a feeling that I have. Something about him isn't right.
BlakNo1
He's batshit insane. That's a given.
However, even when he's frothing at the mouth the points he makes are valid.
AMY GOODMAN: What conclusion have you drawn about September 11th and the...
WARD CHURCHILL: Well, I posit my conclusions that if you want to avoid September 11s, if you want security in some actual form, then it's almost a biblical framing, you have to do unto others as you would have them do unto you. As long as you're doing what the U.S. is doing in the world, you can anticipate a natural and inevitable response of the sort that occurred on 9/11. If you don't get the message out of 9/11, you're going to have to change, first of all, your perception of the value of those others who are consigned to domains, semantic domains like collateral damage, then you've really got no complaint when the rules you've imposed come back on you.
It's difficult to admit you are wrong when you are trying to give the impression that you are infallible.
The funny thing is that when objective facts are available, I have never "caught" Moore playing fast and loose. Every accusation against Moore so far has been little more than assertion.
Moore has the guts to actually face the people he has issue with, to ask them questions directly and let them speak for themselves. He's done that in all of his movies.
Could you imagine Ann Coulter with a camera asking the Jersey Girls if they were enjoying their husband's deaths?
She's both a chicken hawk and a chicken shit.
Churchill's good work is something his critics, particularly the liberals who piss on his name as a token gesture of reason, are totally ignorant of. We would ask, go ahead, name what he did that you should know him, but then they usually introduce him as someone they'd never heard of before.
His IX/XI comment met with none of the fake outrage he was made to suffer when the exact same idea was tossed around by white-skinned Jews. The outrage was fake and was intended as a way for respectable liberals to distance themselves from what looked like a hopeless situation.
One thing that really is worth criticizing about Churchill is his Native American ancestry: it is apparently voluntary, not genetic, as he failed to prove membership in one tribe and then joined another which makes no proof requirement. However, this is a person who has done a lot of work for AIM, and he is hardly just doing it for cosmetic purposes (like Ted Nugent's whoring of Fred Bear or Kevin Costner prtending to be able to assimilate).
Gotta walk the hounds
Doggiez!!!
BlakNo1
Yes?
.
Leaving for now guys - off for Chinese lunch with my niece, then buying a new pair of shoes. Woo woo!
No, nothing to make VV drool over, must my usual 'supportive shoes that don't quite look like sneakers so I can get away with wearing them to work.' But, hey, new shoes is new shoes.
I don't think the people who work on cable news shows can tell the difference between the person who pulls the fire alarm and the one who starts the fire.
But whenever someone on the Left tried to emulate Coulter, they get slammed. Or even if a liberal tries to attack a conservative's record, cue the whining of a 1,000 wingnuts. IOKIYAR
I don't think the people who work on cable news shows can tell the difference between the person who pulls the fire alarm and the one who starts the fire.
thebewilderness
Is it because in their case, they often occupy all 3 roles?
mAnn Coulter is a skank
Moonbootica, Buffy Geek - 10:38 am
-----------------
Moonbo, you're too kind. Ann Coulter is psychotic.
Sallyh, Grandmere Poissonniere - 10:39 am
You're both right: mAnn Coulter is skanchotic!
(Nice "reverse Solomon", eh?)
Something about him isn't right.
BlakNo1
Oh that's easy. He only has an MA yet he has tenure.
That's just wrong.
One thing that really is worth criticizing about Churchill is his Native American ancestry:
There's also a couple of decades olds possible academic violations (minor) that have suddenly become issues.
I don't find him extreme per se, but I do find some of the directions he goes in ... odd. I'm not just talking about his 9/11 comments, which I find very salient.
As long as you're doing what the U.S. is doing in the world, you can anticipate a natural and inevitable response of the sort that occurred on 9/11. If you don't get the message out of 9/11, you're going to have to change, first of all, your perception of the value of those others who are consigned to domains, semantic domains like collateral damage, then you've really got no complaint when the rules you've imposed come back on you.
JR, kerosene and a match
My problem entirely with the idea that every "Muslim" suicide bomber is a "fanatic" who expects paradise and 77 virgins (or whatever the number is). Even John Updike (maybe, I haven't read his latest yet) seems to have gotten in on that.
But the idea that every "insurgent" in Iraq or every suicide bomber is a religious fanatic, lets the US off the hook for what it has done in the world since WWII, especially what it has done in the Middle East since we pumped Texas dry (we built our country on Texas oil; it was once the Saudi Arabia or the world. Now it's gone, and where East Texas is now, Saudi Arabia will be one day).
Sorry, I'm ranting again....
The Bush White House did not invent the presidential signing statement; it goes back to the 19th century. But the frequency and ambition of Bush's signing statements go far beyond his predecessors. Whereas earlier presidents issued signing statements of a highly specific nature, those of Bush are repeatedly broad and unspecific. Above all, they make claims to enhanced executive power that impinge on profound issues of liberty such as torture or wiretapping.
--From The UK's The Guardian
Yeah, and let's not forget that if Murtha's ilk landed at Normandy, we'd all be speaking German. You can't make this stuff up.
On the other hand, there it is on the front page of the Times today that we're torturing people.
If Iraq gets uglier, as it gives every indication of doing, so will this country...
'supportive shoes that don't quite look like sneakers so I can get away with wearing them to work.'
Skechers
French immigration bill approved
The upper house of the French parliament has passed a tough new immigration bill, weeks after it was adopted by the lower chamber.
The bill makes it harder for unskilled migrants to settle in France and abolishes the rights of illegal immigrants to remain after 10 years.
Interior Minister Nicolas Sarkozy, who drafted the bill, says it will bring France into line with other countries.
Critics say it is racist and accuse Mr Sarkozy of pandering to the far-right.
Oh, I know he's done good work and I agree with most, if not all, of his statements. Many of them are plain old common sense as far as I'm concerned.
It's just something...
We remember thinking much the same biblical reap-sow iude years before IX/XI happened. Years befpre we were all the way converted into leftism we read some Chomsky about the true universality of American interventionalism and terrorism. Our first reaction was that it couldn't be true and Chomsky must be some kid of Brad DeLong imbecile for suggesting it, but our second was that if it were true, there must be millions of people who murderously despise us, and we were long overdue for some kind of huge bombing. We conceptualized it like the first WTC bombing, the Oklahoma City one or the marine barracks bombing in Lebanon, with some kind of kamikaze truck delivering huge amounts of explosives. What is batshit about this? Haven't you all said, in regards to the rape of Iraq and Afghanistan and the torture of innocent people, that this will bring more terror down on our heads (hell, the Colbert Report said that the other night)?
Or even if a liberal tries to attack a conservative's record, cue the whining of a 1,000 wingnuts. IOKIYAR
phinky
Did you see the biggest slam against Sadly, No's commentary on Pasty was that it must have taken so much time to do the research to put it together, which must be a sign of OCD.
Which explains the lack of facts to back up the spew at ClownHall and the KKKorner KKKids.
Easier to just cycle out some obsession on teh cox or teh buttsecks.
Yeah, and let's not forget that if Murtha's ilk landed at Normandy, we'd all be speaking German. You can't make this stuff up.
The boob who said that on the House floor represents the town I grew up in, and where my parents still live.
The shame of it all.....
Rep. Louie Gohmert? Wasn't his retort to Murtha simply sparkling?
Yeah, and let's not forget that if Murtha's ilk landed at Normandy, we'd all be speaking German. You can't make this stuff up.
On the other hand, there it is on the front page of the Times today that we're torturing people.
If Iraq gets uglier, as it gives every indication of doing, so will this country...
ProfWombat
If Bush and his ilk were president during WWII, we'd all be speaking German because the U.S. would have attacked Mexico to avenge Pearl Harbor.
Haven't you all said, in regards to the rape of Iraq and Afghanistan and the torture of innocent people, that this will bring more terror down on our heads (hell, the Colbert Report said that the other night)?
k&y
Sadly, we'd rather turn the conversation to who should be involved in torture, rather than "should we be involved in torture."
It's their fault, for hating our freedom.
I don't think the people who work on cable news shows can tell the difference between the person who pulls the fire alarm and the one who starts the fire.
thebewilderness
It's worse than this: they get drunk on the feeling of disaster.
...You can believe the Bush-9/11 or not on the basis of facts and informed speculation, but to pin the "9/11 conspiracy crazy" label on people who consider the possibility on the basis of sorrowful rationality seems dangerously naive in the face of the evil actions we can actually prove on them.
sister of ye | 06.17.06 - 11:25 am | #
Loved the whole thing you wrote. Add this, anyone who flings the word 'crazy' about this should be made to answer one question: do you deny the authenticity of the 'Northwoods' documents?
shakespeares sister has a good list of all the unhinged wingnuts, and unlike the left ,which is full of righteous anger, her list is a compendium of highly paid talking heads, whose sole purpose seems to be to divide and radicalize america against its own interests.
and it's working. just like osama knew it would.
Totally OT tech question:
Do wireless cards wear out? Mine has been going in and out for a few weeks now.
I like the lead on the MM web site:
"Retreat is not an option..."
-- House Majority Leader John Boehner, R-Ohio
"Tell all those a--holes in D.C. to get us the f--- out of here."
-- U.S. soldier serving in Iraq
RMJ: Buckeye, DORC was making a similar point to me last night: about how easy it is to view some problems--her remarks arose out of her refusal to accept the common caricature of the Balkans as intractably tribal and violent--as arising out of a heart of darkness, some evil other of human nature upriver, rather than reflecting the lives of human beings like us, and therefore soluble by folk of good will. It's not hard for me to imagine troops of an occupying power deployed deep in Second Amendment Baptist country, finding their vehicles strewn with other than flowers...
Jesus, the Haloscan ad Borg is growing in size. Sort of like a Blog Blob. How did Steve McQueen kill that thing anyway?
Ann Coulter's goal is to incite so-called liberals to hate her, thus giving her credence. I'm afraid her strategy is working. If you allow her to just preach to the fox news choir, she will disappear.
No. On the one hand nothing should, but on the other there is this tendency of making everything of super-cheap and emphasizing replacement over repair. But no cards should be wearing out and without knowing more we'd say the problem is more likely with the signal you're getting.
If you allow her to just preach to the fox news choir, she will disappear.
Kinda hard when she gets interviews on all the major networks, eh?
Kinda hard when she gets interviews on all the major networks, eh?
She was having so much fun doing her Lorena Bobbitt on Matt Lauer!
do you deny the authenticity of the 'Northwoods' documents?
fourmorewars
One thing to remember about the Northwoods documents... it didn't come out of the CIA, it came out of the Pentagon, it was too crazy for the spooks.
Now, about the Plame outing.....
*adjusts tinfoil*
Did you see the biggest slam against Sadly, No's commentary on Pasty was that it must have taken so much time to do the research to put it together, which must be a sign of OCD.
You should have seen what Pasty did to Larry Johnson after Johnson implied that Karl Rove played a role in Rove's mother's suicide. Then Pasty whined about Larry Johnson comparing Karl Rove to Joseph Goebbels, which I don't understand because both men are (were in Goebbels' case) in the right-wing propaganda business. But anyhow, Pasty calls out a blogswarm against Larry Johnson.
This from a man who won't ban someone who makes a sexual threat against a child, much less report the IP address to the FBI.
Pasty can dish it out, but he can't take it. WATB.
catch you all laters moonbats
If you allow her to just preach to the fox news choir, she will disappear.
BlakNo1 is right, she's not preaching to the choir, she's a media project trying to create the choir or the impression that the choir is real and large. What is more important is that we recognize the complicity of the "objective" media.
"Tell all those a--holes in D.C. to get us the f--- out of here."
-- U.S. soldier serving in Iraq
Troutski
On that note, Wolfie (I think) interviewed Jack Murtha yesterday and played a clip of Congresscritter Patrick "Prime Fighting Age" McHenry talking about the war "we" are fighting. Murtha slapped the lad down, but failed to ask the obvious question>> has Operation Yellow Elephant interviewed PFA McHenry yet?
Steve McQueen kill that thing anyway?
Troutski
Trapped it in a skating rink.
The remake was better.
Btw, how sad, how fucking ridiculously sad, that a major American news organization runs a poll asking 'can nude photos be art?'
What fucking decade is this????
Phenomenal - that this archive should be open, finally. Stunning.
Holocaust Archivists Piece Together Bits of Lives
The Red Cross' tracing service has unearthed the facts and fates of millions of the Nazis' victims. Now it will open its vast paper archives.
By Jeffrey Fleishman, LA Times Staff Writer June 17, 2006
....
Such stories are stacked in files here at the Red Cross International Tracing Service, which houses one of the largest collections of documents on World War II concentration and slave labor camps. The service was founded in 1943 to search for missing persons. It has unearthed the facts and fates of millions of Nazi victims, and this year the organization is expected to open its archives to historians and scholars for the first time. A Times reporter was recently shown samples of the papers.
Jewish organizations and Holocaust survivors have long sought to study the 50 million documents and 17.5 million names of those considered undesirable by the Third Reich. But the tracing service, overseen by a commission representing 11 countries — including Germany, which has strict confidentiality laws — has restricted access for decades.
In April, Germany agreed to open the files, though questions about privacy are still being debated by the commission.
k&y, Thanks. The signal had been fine until about 2 weeks ago. Now it's in and out. A real PIA.
A recap and GOP assessment of the House Iraq "debate" from today's LA Times
House Republicans described the 256-153 vote in favor of the nonbinding resolution as a resounding rejection of what they called "cutting and running" from Iraq. And they noted that a chunk of the chamber's 201 Democrats were among its supporters.
"Today, the House of Representatives voted to stand up for freedom," said House Speaker Rep. J. Dennis Hastert, R-Ill. "We are pleased that 42 Democrats defied their leadership and stood with House Republicans to support both our troops and their mission to win the global war on terror."
Five House members -- two Republicans and three Democrats -- skirted a yes or no position on the resolution by voting "present."
"Mistakes do not justify leaving prematurely," Shays said, spotlighting the argument the GOP believes will prevail among voters. "I am not afraid we will lose the war in Iraq, I am deeply concerned we will lose the war in Iraq, here at home."
"There are major differences between those of us who support strong national security policies and understand what we have at stake and those who would prefer we retreat from the world stage and attempt to manage the threat of terrorism and the danger it poses," said House Majority Leader John Boehner, R-Ohio.
"Retreat is not an option," Boehner said. "Achieving victory is our only option."
"Retreat is not an option..."
-- House Majority Leader John Boehner, R-Ohio
"Tell all those a--holes in D.C. to get us the f--- out of here."
-- U.S. soldier serving in Iraq
This is making me nuts. The idea that if we tell the "insurgents" when we're leaving they'll wait us out. It's their frigging country. They live there and they have noplace else to go. Set a date or don't but don't kid yourself that it'll make a damn bit of difference to the "insurgents".
Horowitz said that Coulter was 'a satirist'. Meaning that calling him 'Roy Cohn, just a bit more Jewish and a bit less queer' is fine as long as you add 'And that's satire, by the way.'
If Coulter's speech is tolerated in that arena, then anything is. Meaning that you have to push at that line in order to pull it back in. The Dean Swift approach is usually pretty good at deflating horrendous little gobshites.
What is more important is that we recognize the complicity of the "objective" media.
They are beneath contempt. Witness the "Today" show. Coulter calls "America's Sweetheart" Eva Braun and what do they do? Invite her right back!
You can hear the idiot producer breatlessly rationalizing this decision, which was made by the people who count the money, by whining, "But we have to cover the story!"
The General improves Holy Joe's bear ad
Who among us does not heart teh General?
It's a stupid distinction, and a meaningless one.
Rmj
Why I always stop and read rmj's posts carefully.
"Retreat is not an option," Boehner said. "Achieving victory is our only option."
Gimlet
Neither is failure. Both come as standard equipment.
It's my understanding the American people don't consider it an option, either. They want it to happen.
Well, Treasonous Horowitless' "Discover The Network" (about how elitist Jews like Noam Chomsky are in bed with terrorists like bin Laden) can be understood only as satire.
I would love to see a Coulter/Moore cage match.
I'm bothered that folks here bring up Ward Churchill at all, simple because I remember reading this blog somewhere...I'm pretty sure Atrios linked to it...shortly after WC first came to anyone's attention. It listed 5 or 6 tenured professors who'd said things as foul or in some instances far fouler than anything attributed to WC.
Dammit, I wish I could find it again. It s/b required reading, at the least for anyone on the left, so they don't go fighting, unknowingly, with one hand tied behind their backs.
Larry Johnson has consistently shown himself to be an honest, level-headed mensch. I doubt he's intimidated by a little paste.
I would love to see a Coulter/Moore cage match.
JR, kerosene and a match | 06.17.06 - 12:03 pm |
At last a legitimate bit about Moore's apetite: MICHAEL WILL EAT HER!
You should have seen what Pasty did to Larry Johnson after Johnson implied that Karl Rove played a role in Rove's mother's suicide.
Including deleting comments that point out: (a) Johnson's a conservative Republican; (b) he's ex-CIA, and the CIA really does fucking hate Rove with the heat of a thousand infernos.
I didn't like the reference, but I have to admit it was fucking deserved, given the amount of shit Rove has dished out.
Sometimes you have to punch bullies in the face. Repeatedly.
These are riven times, and moderation will only re-enter politics once those fuckheads are humiliated, belittled and exposed.
It listed 5 or 6 tenured professors who'd said things as foul or in some instances far fouler than anything attributed to WC.
Shit, major emendation needed...should read '5 or 6 tenured professors who'd MADE RIGHTWING COMMENTS as foul etc.'
"Retreat is not an option," Boehner said. "Achieving victory is our only option."
Translation: Clap harder for Victory!!
Larry Johnson has consistently shown himself to be an honest, level-headed mensch. I doubt he's intimidated by a little paste.
He's also not as good a shot with an AK-47 as Valerie Plame Wilson.
If Iraq gets uglier, as it gives every indication of doing, so will this country...
This whole country is giving me a stomach ache already. Too much more of this I cannot take.
I doubt he's intimidated by a little paste.
plantsman, lowercase | Homepage | 06.17.06 - 12:04 pm |
No kidding, that recalls Juan Cole's total textbook slapdown of Jonah "Thank Mammon for Nepotism" Goldberg.
This space for sake, um...sale. I I
Johnson was actually in Plame's "class" at the academy.
a couple questions for ann
* did michael moore fabricate 'the rational for war' or did the administration ??
* did michael moore vote to authorize retaliatory force against usama bin missing and use the little known clause in the constitution of 'while we're there ...' or did the administration ??
* did michael moore order a brutal occupation in a land where there is no law under which contractors can be prosecuted for killing civilians in the street or did the administration ??
* did michael moore order the troops to leave places like al qaqaa unguarded and then blame those same troops for doing so or did rudy guiliani ??
* did michael moore have abu ghraïb gitmoized or did the administration ??
* did michael moore order the largest shipment of cash ever moved in history to a place where kaos and disorder would be great improvements to the conditions that were and still are in iraq or did the administration ??
* did michael moore keep us from fully arming and adequately protecting the troops or did the administration ??
* did michael moore order the use of depleted uranium or white phosphorous munitions or did the administration ??
* did michael moore ever use an army of lawyers to evade, erase, render quaint, or ignore vast parts of the constitution to further this country to become a fundamentalist theocracy aiding and abetting a kleptocratic war profiteering police state that continues to remove civil liberties from americans on the premise of fighting a never ending war on a transitive adverb or did the administration ??
Dammit, I wish I could find it again. It s/b required reading, at the least for anyone on the left, so they don't go fighting, unknowingly, with one hand tied behind their backs.
fourmorewars
I find Google pretty useful that way, although it;'s nice to have everything gathered together.
As soon as the WC broiuhaha started I went and read his stuff, and found nothing objectionable about it.
I think one of the major problems is that academics are used to dealing with positions that are not popular or popularized, and have 9at least in their own fields) a fairly deep knowledge of the subject matter). The 'wingers rarely have any such credentials or experience to understand these things, and have been trained like Pavlov's dogs to react to certain things (any mention of the Nazi's, for instance) with howls of outrage.
It's not hard for me to imagine troops of an occupying power deployed deep in Second Amendment Baptist country, finding their vehicles strewn with other than flowers...
ProfWombat
Having lived in Second Amendment Baptist country most of my life, maybe that's why I don't call it "fanaticism."
It is the perception of opppression. In the North, they speak of the "Civil War." In the South, people remember Reconstruction, carpet-baggers and scalawags. We had history classes in high school devoted to teaching us the distinction between the terms, almost 100 years later.
You think the rest of humanity isn't like that? It ain't religious fervor; it's bone deep anger at injustice, or perceived injustice (let's not re-argue the Civil War). If people are angry, or "fanatical," it's usually for a reason other than individual, or even "cultural," psychology.
You should have seen what Pasty did to Larry Johnson after Johnson implied that Karl Rove played a role in Rove's mother's suicide.
No doubt Larry Johnson was terrified.
But those wonderful House Republicans have put it on the (non-binding) record that they support the troops, the Preznit, and every cockamamie idea he's had -- and Cheney's still pushing the Iraq/9-11 conflation on Hannity's radio show.
If Bush and his ilk were president during WWII, we'd all be speaking German because the U.S. would have attacked Mexico to avenge Pearl Harbor.
Stinky | 06.17.06 - 11:49 am
they would have called it a premeptive strike to stop illegal immigration.
At last a legitimate bit about Moore's apetite: MICHAEL WILL EAT HER!
k&y
Not much meat on those bones, at least 80% wastage.
Maybe he could feed her a cookie first.
Tranny Annie has a face made for radio.
Actually, she has a face made for dart-throwing.
Tournament, anyone?
It's already been announced that Iraq is going to be one of THE major issues this election cycle.
Best to look at the arguments, quips, nonsense, etc. the GOP is putting out and effectively counter it.
Michael Moore can always shed the weight.
Ann Coulter will be a hate-mongering psycho cunt until the day she dies.
Which I hope is sooner rather than later.
RE: the Sadly, No! takedown of Pasty: over at another of the dumber rightwing sites, HogOnIce, they were showcasing the "OCD" of Retardo for taking the time to compile the evidence on Goldstein. The blogger said something to the effect of "you would never see something like this on a rightwing blog - they would just photoshop some pictures, call some names, and be done with it."
To which I had to reply: Oh, so your objection is that the guy compiled actual evidence to support his contentions, where on the right, you would just make up some ugly names for a personal attack, not bother with any factual support, and be done with it? Alrighty, then.
Of course, they didn't post my comment.
Every one of these discussions should be slapped down with --
"Has Michael Moore ever expressed a wish that terrorists attack the New York Times or the Capitol? Cuz Ann Coulter and Pat Robertson have. Has Michael Moore ever said his ideological opponents should be murdered as a terrorist intimidation tactic to kill off their way of thinking? Because Ann Coulter has."
End of discussion.
...we gotta get outta here, if it's the last thing we ever do...
Let's compare Coulter's *facts* with Michael Moore's and see who understands what they are.
Michael Moore makes sense -- and valid points.
Ann Coulter is a delusional psychotic bitch that I would love to bitch-slap until her head rattles.
No meat, just gristle.
So that's the secret make an annoying ad even more annoying and it'll get clicked. That must be it.
Let me say once again that all cunts everywhere are demeaned unfairly by having Ann Coulter called one of them.
End of discussion.
k&y
Word!
Speaking of Pastey - via S,N....
Thursday, June 15, 2006
Comment of the Day (From S,N!)
Lo Ping Wong:
Somewhere, Jeff Goldstein is sitting in his basement, fuming over Retardo’s takedown. “Just wait ’til I show them my COCK! Then they’ll be sorry.” Meanwhile, his lawn goes unmowed, his children unfed and his 15,000 word article on the foundational hermenuetics of Scenes from a Mall, unwritten.
posted by TS at 1:12 PM
Ann Coulter is a delusional psychotic bitch that I would love to bitch-slap until her head rattles.
But, but she's THIN unto anorexia!
This whole country is giving me a stomach ache already. Too much more of this I cannot take.
Neponset
I know how you feel. Things have to get better!! I've been feeling really down about it all lately, too.
The press is on the side of Bushco and they are going to prop up the Rs for the mid-terms
We need more of "our" pundits to call bs - in real time - when it is happening - like Begala did yesterday to Wolf Blitzer when he said it was a "disservice to our viewers to call this a bump - it is one point!!"
Kudos to Begala - please do this everyday!!!
I'd like to see Keith Olbermann come on on a Monday evening, and pull out a big white card, and hold it up next to him. On it would be written the 10 most vicious things Coulter has said. It's obvious there are at least 10 where she advocates murder, murder of specific public individuals or of entire populations.
Keith then would say, 'Ok, it's Monday. All you rightwingers who say things like, 'she's just our Michael Moore,' you've all got 'til Friday. Send in your examples anything you can find by Michael Moore, that you think compare in viciousness, in the advocating of violence, to these on-the-record statements of Ms. Coulter.'
By making it a weeklong thing, showing what the right had come up with so far, on Tuesday, on Wednesday, etc., he could a) drive the point home, and b) drive it upward and outward into the realm of too-loud-n-too-juicy-to-be-ignored-by-the-
mainstream-media-ville.
RMJ: sorry I wasn't clearer; my point was that we have no more right to call Iraqis, or Balkan 'ethnics', or what not, fanatics, and thus out of the reach of civilization, than we would be correct to accept such an evaluation of ourselves. I apologize if I came across as patronizing of, to use my words, 'Second Amendment Baptist country' folks. I disagree with most of 'em, as, it seems, do you, on a lot of issues, but I don't dismiss 'em as other than human.
"Retreat is not an option," Boehner said. "Achieving victory is our only option."
"As long as my money and blood aren't involved."
Ann Coulter is a delusional psychotic bitch that I would love to bitch-slap until her head rattles.
But, but she's THIN unto anorexia!
plantsman, lowercase
I'm a pretty girl, a pretty girl, and my daddy loves me!!
The biggest difference between Moore and Coulter (their relative, demonstrable humanity aside) is that Moore attacks and upbraids the powerful for their brutality and hypocrisy, while Coulter beats up on the weak...
Michael is happily married and has a normal life from all appearances.
No one wants Manny and she will never be considered normal.
She belongs locked up somewhere.
I wonder why kind of childhood that twat had. I'll bet she got beat up a lot in school.
Holy Joe channels mAnn Coulter:
"I know I'm taking a position that is not popular within the party," Lieberman said, "but that is a challenge for the party -- whether it will accept diversity of opinion or is on a kind of crusade or jihad of its own to have everybody toe the line. No successful political party has ever done that."
Keith is back on Monday, with Al Gore!
I'm a pretty girl, a pretty girl, and my daddy loves me!!
Ann Coulter
I wonder just how MUCH your daddy "loved" you.
There has to be some reason why you're so thoroughly fucked up!
Heehee, if they win and we wind up in a theocracy mAnn will have to shut the fuck up. Can't have the wimyns making speaking in public ya know. Back in the kitchen with ya bitch.
I'll bet she got beat up a lot in school.
I bet she started a lot of fights, then ran screaming to the principal's office about how the other kids were bullying her.
Can't have the wimyns making speaking in public ya know. Back in the kitchen with ya bitch.
ql in ny
I don't think she'd be much use in the kitchen.
She's so dumb she probably burns water.
I wonder why kind of childhood that twat had. I'll bet she got beat up a lot in school.
Terry C,
Did you see her yearbook picture somebody posted yesterday? She was on the fencing team. Insert your freudian spin here.
and where is that Lieberman article? I thought it was by Pantysniffer Broder but I can't find it at WaPo.
Troutski | 06.17.06 - 12:17 pm
Yeah, "diversity" always means them not changing or accepting anything new. More Orwellianism.
Which I hope is sooner rather than later.
Terry C, Politikal Girl | 06.17.06 - 12:11 pm | #
Me, I don't want any of these vermin to die 'till they get to see their country consign them to the dustbin of history.
You think the rest of humanity isn't like that? It ain't religious fervor; it's bone deep anger at injustice, or perceived injustice (let's not re-argue the Civil War). If people are angry, or "fanatical," it's usually for a reason other than individual, or even "cultural," psychology.
Rmj, Uncredentialed | Homepage | 06.17.06 - 12:08 pm
That's what the the last few years of reading about the Balkans and genocides have taught me. It's not that Slavs, or Rwandans, or Southerners, are 'different' from 'us'. They're not, and I think that's what scares people.
End of discussion.
k&y
The discussion has already ended, there never was one with these people and their acolytes.
Pelt them with rotten fruit and cow excrement everytime they appear in public.
k&y, Jennifer, all--why don't the name brand Dems have these replies at the ready? It's not that they haven't heard this crap about Moore before.
Scarborough goes on, of course, and even manages to drag Anthony Weiner down to his level (for a New Yorker, Weiner got very few words in, Joey S. really filibustered with interruptions. Oh, yeah--they control the microphones).
SCARBOROUGH: How about generalizing this? And, again, this has nothing to do with Ann Coulter. This has to do with me and you, again, friends who have worked together, talked together, reasoned together, trying to come to an agreement that there are extremists on the right who do this to sell books. There are extremists on the left who do this to sell books. Would you agree with me?
WEINER: I would agree with that 100 percent. We live in this moment now that apparently there is this race to see who can say and do outrageous things. And I think our obligations as public servants, as protectors of the airwaves, is to say, “You know what? There are lines we‘re not going to cross.”
Uh, just what are those books from the left which do what Coulter's ilk does????
I'm a pretty girl, a pretty girl, and my daddy loves me!!
Ann Coulter
Not pretty at all.
And whether you are a girl at all is a matter of opinion.
Michael Moore stated that he wished Timothy McVeigh had parked outside the Washington Times building. Well, OK, he didn't say that.
Michael Moore said that the church of conversatism is godless. No, he didn't say that either. That was me. Unless I am Michael Moore.
Michael Moore said that the widows of the men killed in Iraq are publicity seekers and that we don't know if their husbands were getting ready to divorce them anyway. Nope, he didn't say that either.
Michael Moore is fat. That's the ticket. Dammit, Ann Coulter is skinny as a rail. Oooooh. Ann Coulter is the fifth rail, um, column.
Michael Moore made a movie that made money. Ann Coulter wrote a book that made money. See, they're just alike.
whether it will accept diversity of opinion or is on a kind of crusade or jihad of its own to have everybody toe the line. No successful political party has ever done that."
Gee, but I thought the reason Zell Miller spoke at the Repub Convention was an acknowledgement of
the Goopers' tiny tent and ideolgical *purity.*
Troutski: did Lieberman, in the times of Rove at the White House, DeLay on K Street, and Coulter in the media, that party diversity is at risk mostly from the Democratic side of the aisle?
He daily becomes more and more a caricature of himself.
End of discussion.
"Has Michael Moore ever advocated the murder of a justice as a way to tilt the balance of the court? Ann Coulter has."
and where is that Lieberman article? I thought it was by Pantysniffer Broder but I can't find it at WaPo.
Ann Coulter
"Oops!!" you can say "oops", can't you?
There are extremists on the left who do this to sell books.
Quick, Joe, name them!
Al Gore on Keith O on Monday! Good tidings, plantsman.
And, Moonboo, "skank" is a fine, fine word for Coulter.
I know I'm taking a position that is not popular within the party," Lieberman said, "but that is a challenge for the party -- whether it will accept diversity of opinion or is on a kind of crusade or jihad of its own to have everybody toe the line. No successful political party has ever done that."
Troutski | 06.17.06 - 12:17 pm | #
You preternaturally blind asshole, there's a party doing that right now in this very fucking country, and you're kowtowing to it. That's why you're history.
There are extremists on the left who do this to sell books.
Quick, Joe, name them!
Snow,
He'd name EJ Dionne and Frank Rich
There are extremists on the left who do this to sell books.
Quick, Joe, name them!
Snow,
He'd name EJ Dionne and Frank Rich
Michael Moore made a movie that made money. Ann Coulter wrote a book that made money. See, they're just alike.
Snow, Stupid Grammar Nazi |
People actually went to see Michael's movie.
Whereas, Scumbag Scialfe buys Tranny Annie's books in bulk.
Not the same thing!
Jawbone (and WGG,rmj et al) got there ahead of me, and not for the first time!
I too regard the bogus association of mAnn and Michael Moore as a lame yoke-- a symptom of the false equivalence which is practically the Prime Directive of Corporate Media.
I thought about this as I channel-surfed my way through network and local news reports of The Great Debate-- remember, I don't have cable TV and I'm not sure I could stand to watch C-SPAN for any length of time even if I did.
In my sharply reduced recent visits here (the new blog-blocker at work mysteriously lifted on Thursday, then slammed the door shut again by mid-morning Friday), I read a lot of comments about the Dems mopping up the Repukes throughout the debate. Atriots generally expressed pride and encouragement. The fact that the entire "debate" was predicated on false pretense and was pure political kabuki aside, it sounded like a symbolic victory for Dems.
(Of course, no doubt the freepers and the trollfolk called it exactly the other way.)
But the news (predictably) played it out on the level of a ping-pong match, with a few juxtaposed clips of Gooper bow-wow oratory alternating with spirited Dem rebuttals. There was no attempt to provide even the usual biased analysis about the content and issues in the debate. The story was: Congress has important debate; clips of R vs. D vs. R vs. D; concluded by the news that Congress resolved to Stay the Course.
The effect of this constant false equivalence, be it "mAnn vs. Mike" or "pro vs. con", seems calculated to paralyze and discourage rationality and even interest. Even the dopey Yahoo masses who write to the "Daily News" or troll on Huffington Post can claim the final wisdom that it's a pox on both their houses, so ya might as well go with whatever your gut tells you. This stance can be argued in a thoughtful, sophisticated context, but on the mass-media scale, it's employed to manufacture consent by flattening the perspective thinner than Sallyh's delicious pancakes.
Al Franken did it! He called O'Reilly blotchy (which he was) and a liar!
"I know I'm taking a position that is not popular within the party," Lieberman said, "but that is a challenge for the party -- whether it will accept diversity of opinion
Holy Joe, you've taken a lot of positions not popular in the party. To which one are you referring?
Again, I'll say: when we focus on her obviously insane statements, we divert attention from her baseless arguments.
In the latest example, her argument is this: the liberals recruit victims to score their political points for them, because you can't respond to them.
Because everyone has focused on the hateful things she said about the 9/11 widows, no one has bothered to press Trannie for her evidence that the widows, or Cindy Sheehan, or anyone else has been "recruited" by liberals to say the things they've said. Without such evidence, her ugly statements only become uglier, because they are based on ...nothing other than her own hatefulness. They aren't made in the service of making a point, because the alleged "point" they support is one she made up out of whole cloth.
Someone here went off on me for making this point the other day, but I'd just like to point out that if you knock the very legs of her pathetically insupportable "point" out from under her, you remove any basis for the Mary Matalins et al from going out there and saying, "well yes, it's an ugly thing to say, but she does have a good point..."
No, she doesn't. She has NO point. That should be the first thing we go after.
Again, I'll say: when we focus on her obviously insane statements, we divert attention from her baseless arguments.
In the latest example, her argument is this: the liberals recruit victims to score their political points for them, because you can't respond to them.
Because everyone has focused on the hateful things she said about the 9/11 widows, no one has bothered to press Trannie for her evidence that the widows, or Cindy Sheehan, or anyone else has been "recruited" by liberals to say the things they've said. Without such evidence, her ugly statements only become uglier, because they are based on ...nothing other than her own hatefulness. They aren't made in the service of making a point, because the alleged "point" they support is one she made up out of whole cloth.
Someone here went off on me for making this point the other day, but I'd just like to point out that if you knock the very legs of her pathetically insupportable "point" out from under her, you remove any basis for the Mary Matalins et al from going out there and saying, "well yes, it's an ugly thing to say, but she does have a good point..."
No, she doesn't. She has NO point. That should be the first thing we go after.
There are extremists on the left who do this to sell books.
Smirkborough is such a total asshole.
Hey, Joe - about that dead woman in your office.......................
Not the same thing!
Drat. Does that mean I get a consolation prize?
Kristin Breitweiser was a Republican on 9/11, iirc.
no one has bothered to press Trannie for her evidence that the widows, or Cindy Sheehan, or anyone else has been "recruited" by liberals to say the things they've said.
The rightards just don't seem to be able to grasp the notion that people can think for themselves.
They don't need someone to recruit them or pay them to express how they feel.
Buckeye: agree entirely. I said something unskillfully enough at 11:53 to allow a different interpretation; again, my apologies...
Kristin Breitweiser was a Republican on 9/11, iirc.
plantsman, lowercase
What it takes for some people to wise up...
Now, of course, according to Toady Putzhole, she's a prostitute.
RMJ: Buckeye, DORC was making a similar point to me last night: about how easy it is to view some problems--her remarks arose out of her refusal to accept the common caricature of the Balkans as intractably tribal and violent--as arising out of a heart of darkness, some evil other of human nature upriver, rather than reflecting the lives of human beings like us, and therefore soluble by folk of good will. It's not hard for me to imagine troops of an occupying power deployed deep in Second Amendment Baptist country, finding their vehicles strewn with other than flowers...
ProfWombat | 06.17.06 - 11:53 am
ProfWombat,
I started studying the Balkans because the media kept saying that the 1914 assissination in Sarajevo started WWI, but they were confusing (perhaps deliberately) starting WWI with causing WWI. So I started reading.
Sadly, most people don't do that, whether it's the Balkans, the south, Africa, etc.
Too many people want the comfort of their prejudices.
If Ann Coulter wants to get a husband, I hear OJ may be available.
Sallyh, do you ever put the sliced strawberries in the pancakes? Ooooooh, sooooo good.
The "Cut and Run" talking point repetition this week nearly made me vomit. Three years, 2,500 lives and half a trillion dollars is "cutting and running"?
Just saw CNN shilling for Boots. Accorsing to the report, Boots is rebounding in the polls up 5% from May to June (32 to 37%) and his handling of Iraq disapproval rating is down to 54% (from over 60%) in May.
Problem is, the polls they reported on were not the same polls. The disingenuous bastards cherry-picked the polls to make their case.
As Atrios says, Boots is an unpopular president. Deal with it.
Was that over the line?
Saying Tranny Annie is the same as Michael Moore is like saying dog shit is the same as filet mignon.
Was that over the line?
Snow, Stupid Grammar Nazi
Nah!
OT: Safeway has portabello caps ( big beautiful ones) for $3.99/lb this week here. Man, they saute and grill up nice!
If Ann Coulter wants to get a husband, I hear OJ may be available.
Snow, Stupid Grammar Nazi |
Well, he IS into blondes.
re the bounce in the polls, isn't all within the margin of error?
You think the rest of humanity isn't like that? It ain't religious fervor; it's bone deep anger at injustice, or perceived injustice (let's not re-argue the Civil War). If people are angry, or "fanatical," it's usually for a reason other than individual, or even "cultural," psychology.
Rmj, Uncredentialed | Homepage | 06.17.06 - 12:08 pm | #
I'm probably missing the point. You can say it's not really religion, it's 'religion perverted,' but how does 'religion perverted' NOT figure at the heart of virtually every mass bloodletting that's ever taken place in the world?
The "Cut and Run" talking point repetition this week nearly made me vomit
Here's a question for Bible-thumping Bill Bennett. If you're at the blackjack table and you're not getting the cards, do sit there and keep doubling down or do you get the fuck up from the table before you lose your fucking shirt?
Hmmmm. Might not be the best person to ask that question.
Well, he IS into blondes.
With a knife.
"The "Cut and Run" talking point repetition this week nearly made me vomit. Three years, 2,500 lives and half a trillion dollars is "cutting and running"?
plantsman"
What aggravates me is that 2500 number. Can we start including all coalition losses and civilian/non-combatant deaths?
Then we can move to wounded including American, Allies and Civilian.
Everyone talks, including the anti-war segment as if only our 2500 soldiers count and everyone else is a detail.
They all matter.
And once we get past that, we can then discuss the economic, social, cultural and poltical casualties including the pure cost.
k&y, yes, it is almost unbelievable that our nation has done the horrible things it actaully has done. And blowback is a bitch.
At the pre-Iraq Invasion March march in NYC, some had a huge poster of all the US wars/invasions--in smallish print, filling the very large poster board. I got close to read it and saw things I'd never learned about.
We are not such a nice nation to many others--and I do not discount what good we have done, but, we are really working at pissing off the world.
OT--There's a show on about "edible gardens." They're eating lilacs, pansies, carnations and roses. Tulips apparently taste like "sweet cucumber," and lily bulbs roasted with Vidalia onions make a good combo. Right now they're blanching lily stems to augment a Chinese black bean sauce. I'm reminded of Roman banquets
No one wants Manny and she will never be considered normal.
Imagine what it's like to wake up as an unmarried, unloved 45-year-old bleached blond who has to botox her face into a stupor and starve herself so she can wear a mini-skirts and try look 20 years younger.
And imagine that your paycheck depends on your ability to lie and say and do some of the most vile things imagineable. The hate she spews is really directed at herself.
It's actually almost sad that the media continues to give someone so confused and conflicted a forum to humiliate themselves.
Almost...
Doesn't Bill Bennett pray for better cards, like a good gambling addict?
I'll bet she got beat up a lot in school.
I bet she started a lot of fights, then ran screaming to the principal's office about how the other kids were bullying her.
The Kenosha Kid
I'll bet the other kids stayed away from her.
And told her she had "cooties."
Wonder if she was as ugly then as she is now.
Imagine what it's like to wake up as an unmarried, unloved 45-year-old bleached blond who has to botox her face into a stupor and starve herself so she can wear a mini-skirts and try look 20 years younger.
My daughter said "No one is going to marry her. The novelty of dating a Nazi only lasts SO long....."
Billy, you mean CNN took the minimun poll number from May and compared it to a maximum number from a different poll in June?
They can't be that stupid.
Can they?
Goldfrapp is amazing, awesome and astonishing, but inasmuch as her first name begins with an "a," she is just as bad as Ann Coulter.
OT--There's a show on about "edible gardens."
I see your point, and must confess I adore the fragrance of Oriental lilies so much that to blanch their stems in order to eat them seems a sacrilege.
Let me say once again that all cunts everywhere are demeaned unfairly by having Ann Coulter called one of them. | jawbone - 12:15 pm
Jawbone, I like the way you think. But although your comment inspires a corollary thought, I don't mean to imply that you endorse it.
So, at the risk of becoming a Ward Churchill here, I have to say the same thing about "panty-sniffing", which is consistently used in a pejorative sense. I suggest-- hypothetically, of course-- that sometimes it is done for sentimental reasons.
"I know I'm taking a position that is not popular within the party," Lieberman said, "but that is a challenge for the party -- whether it will accept diversity of opinion
Shut up, Joe.
The problem we all have is that too god damn many Dems have 'diverse' opinions, i.e., agree with the repukes. And Joe is one of the ring-leaders.
They can't be that stupid.
Can they?
jawbone
Completely invalidates Hanlon's Razor.
re the bounce in the polls, isn't all within the margin of error?
ql in ny |
A fellow Eschatonian put it beautifully the other day:
"As far as I know, shit doesn't bounce."
If you don't get the message out of 9/11, you're going to have to change, first of all, your perception of the value of those others who are consigned to domains, semantic domains like collateral damage, then you've really got no complaint when the rules you've imposed come back on you.
JR, kerosene and a match | 06.17.06 - 11:40 am
gotta say (returned from dog-walk) that those aqre the words of someone who's batshit crazy...
How many hundreds of thousands of innocents victims of world-wide, decades-long, USer military adventurism and violent, retributive paranoiac fantasies have been dismissed and forgotten, consigned to less-than-humanity by their assignment to the class: Collateral Damage...
when you've got the answer, and have internalized y/our own complicity, and y/our own advantage gained from those unforgiveable acts, then mebbe we can talk...
til then, not so much...
.
that those aqre the words = 'those aren't the words...'
.
Goldfrapp is amazing, awesome and astonishing, but inasmuch as her first name begins with an "a," she is just as bad as Ann Coulter.
kei & yuri
Coulter's name begins with "a."
So does asshole.
Draw your own conclusions. 
Maybe the real trick with Coulter is to starve her. She is surfing on the wave of notoriety. If everyone ignored her, didn't discuss her, didn't lambast her everytime she puts out a book, bet she will cease to show up on talk shows and sell books. Make her bank account as skinny as she is, slim to nothing.
Because everyone has focused on the hateful things she said about the 9/11 widows, no one has bothered to press Trannie for her evidence that the widows, or Cindy Sheehan, or anyone else has been "recruited" by liberals to say the things they've said.
Jennifer | Homepage | 06.17.06 - 12:24 pm | #
I have to admit monstrous ignorance to some of the basics of the Jersey girls story, which Joe Conason filled me in on Friday on Al Franken. E.g. that two of the four ladies were Republicans, as were their late husbands, and that their initial advocate was some conservative Republican congressman from New York (and later they got 'picked up' by Lieberman and McCain in the Senate).
We had no idea that during the Panama thing to get Noriega, we killed 3,000 people who had nothing to do with it. The American central strategy is to use overwhelming resources to make up for failures in tactics or planning. We probably kill as many or in some cases more of our own people (in firendly fire) because of our firepower-intensive way of attacking.
I'm probably missing the point. You can say it's not really religion, it's 'religion perverted,' but how does 'religion perverted' NOT figure at the heart of virtually every mass bloodletting that's ever taken place in the world?
fourmorewars
Vietnam. Korea. World Wars I and II. The Civil War. The War of 1812. The Revolutionary War. The slaughters of Vlad Tsepses. The wars of Alexander, Rome, Greece. The assaults of Genghis Kahn. The destruction of the Native Americans. The battles for the Philippines. The Holocaust (Hitler wasn't doing that for "Christianity," and "Jew" was a racial, not solely religious, distinction).
You can invest any battle with the patina of religion; but it is rarely, if ever, the "cause" for war. Usually it is tacked on as a convenient excuse, maybe even a motivating factor for some. But very few wars get underway, or continue on, because "the gods" tell the people it's time to kill somebody.
If you want hate, you need somebody like Ward Churchill. He genuinely hates America
Got any fucking evidence of that?
Dude, the guy hates America, K? You just have to listem to him talk for about five minutes about how he views America's role in history and the world in order to see it. I think I have listened to him talk for a total of maybe 3-4 hours, and I have no difficuly declaring that the man HATES the USA.
Now, I'm not going to say that invalidates every point he makes. That would be stupid. Nor does that imply that I somehow believe that the role of the US in history has been entirely benign. There have been good points and some pretty bad points, too, as any even casual reader of history knows. But I do not believe that the war between the US and Japan was caused by US imperialism. That is just batshit insane. It was caused by Japanese imperialism, plain and simple. He's said a whole bunch of other things that I thought were deeply unfair to the US, but I think that one was the worst.
This also doesn't mean I think he should lose his academic job or be persecuted in any other way. I think he should be allowed to promulgate his hateful ideas in exactly the same way that Coulter is, or rather, I think that they should both be able to say what they want, but not necessarily of national TV every couple of weeks.
But really, the guy hates America. Really.
They can't be that stupid.
Can they?
They're stupid if they think, despite all Bush's fuck ups and the economy, they can convince anyone else that his approval percentages are on the rise.
It's almost as if the media were trying to convince themselves. They might as well be talking to themselves.
The Jersey Girls current politics are the fruit of 9/11 and The Republican plutocracy's response to it. As ye sow, white boys......
I got it. Michael Moore took advantage of a soldier, twisted what he said in his movie, and made a profit from it. Ann Coulter took advantage of a widow, twisted everything she has done, and made a profit from it. Now, when does Kristen Breitweiser get sue Ann Coulter? When that happens, just alike!
Somewhat.
Just a little bit.
I win!
EkCenTrik | 06.17.06 - 12:39 pm |
We already discussed that. Atrios is right for his oft-criticized habit of paying true, critical attention to the puppets the "real" media wants to you pay subliminal attention to. You can't really ignore somebody who gets a free ride across national TV. Homer: "You just lost yourself a customer!"
Billy, you mean CNN took the minimun poll number from May and compared it to a maximum number from a different poll in June?
Yes.
They can't be that stupid.
Can they?
Yes.
The coverage of the Panaman assault has been assiduously kept quiet. The few articles get buried deep in the back pages or in little read sites or magazines.
Actually, IIRC, we have no idea how many people actually died in our brave mission to bag Noriega. Something about not counting them.
Which, based on circumstances, is either not done (or permitted to be known) or the numbers are bragged about.
Are any of you following the latest on Coulter--that huge portions of *Godless* are demonstrably plagiarized? Rude Pundit and Raw Story have the details.
This could be good. Kind of like busting Al Capone for tax evasion...
Rmj, Uncredentialed | Homepage | 06.17.06 - 12:39 pm |
But this is silly. You are distinguishing between real religion and the cynical use of religion, when the real problem is that religion must always be separated from the state.
We had no idea that during the Panama thing to get Noriega, we killed 3,000 people who had nothing to do with it. The American central strategy is to use overwhelming resources to make up for failures in tactics or planning. We probably kill as many or in some cases more of our own people (in firendly fire) because of our firepower-intensive way of attacking.
kei & yuri
But we didn't "intend" to, so the dead were all just "collateral damage."
A military term that means "Ooops." Note that "Collateral damage" only involves people killed in large numbers, anonymously. When we do it individually, as from gunfire or grenades, it's a "massacre," and illegal. And only the people on the ground are responsible.
Bombers and missile launchers are never held responsible for blowing up restaurants in an attempt to kill one person, or destroying a neighborhood and yet still missing the target (al-Zarqawi died from his injuries from the blast, but they still missed him).
He'd name EJ Dionne and Frank Rich
DemByDefault - 12:22 pm
Ha! I was going to guess "Joe Klein"! 
"I know I'm taking a position that is not popular within the party," Lieberman said, "but that is a challenge for the party -- whether it will accept diversity of opinion
If Joe wants to hold onto that opinion, he might as well be a member of the party that also holds it...
the republican party.
"We already discussed that."
Ah, missed it.
conservative pundits, trolls, bloggers, and mainstream balanced commenators
Drat! Apparently, I'm not even qualified to compete. Unless you really stretch the definition of blogger.
RMJ: sorry I wasn't clearer; my point was that we have no more right to call Iraqis, or Balkan 'ethnics', or what not, fanatics, and thus out of the reach of civilization, than we would be correct to accept such an evaluation of ourselves. I apologize if I came across as patronizing of, to use my words, 'Second Amendment Baptist country' folks. I disagree with most of 'em, as, it seems, do you, on a lot of issues, but I don't dismiss 'em as other than human.
ProfWombat | 06.17.06 - 12:16 pm
Buckeye: agree entirely. I said something unskillfully enough at 11:53 to allow a different interpretation; again, my apologies...
ProfWombat | 06.17.06 - 12:27 pm
I understand/knew what you meant. I'm guilty of the same, myself. I'm much more consious of it now. We all have our biases/prejudices. I'm learning to work on those. Always a work in progress!
This has probably been said already, but Michael Moore is obviously *worse* than Ann Coulter, since no-one is willing to put him on TV.
Breitweiser is considering suing Coulter for slander, but the tv heads I've heard talk about it said the chances of the Jersey Girls prevailing were slim in suit a suit.
Are any of you following the latest on Coulter--that huge portions of *Godless* are demonstrably plagiarized?
Her garbage isn't even original.
that those aren't the words of someone who's batshit crazy...
Almost every professor I've had was, one way or another, nuts.
Doesn't mean they were wrong.
Nice quote from ilkm:
Friday Jefferson
"Timid men . . . prefer the calm of despotism to the boisterous sea of liberty."
- April 24, 1796
Our current media, of course, likes to make the waters a little choppy with their lies and twists, and a little bloody with the smears of Dems and progressives, to soothe the savage Right.
This has probably been said already, but Michael Moore is obviously *worse* than Ann Coulter, since no-one is willing to put him on TV.
Moore's not telegenic. This acoounts for his lack of face-time on TV as much as anything. Skanky vixens clean up -- see "Deal or No Deal."
If you want hate, you need somebody like Ward Churchill. He genuinely hates America.
So does most of the world.
With good reason.
the reason lou dobbs, woof blitzer, spikey mikey, et al denigrate michael moore is he thoroughly punked them with f9/11 by revealing how lazy and easily rolled they were -- yes, what lapdogs they were for the bush admin. they will never forgive him for that -- so the best way to minimize him is thru mockery and he's a much easier target with his, ahem, appearance. they don't and won't deal with the facts of his books or films; their energy is devoted to destroying him.
But this is silly. You are distinguishing between real religion and the cynical use of religion, when the real problem is that religion must always be separated from the state.
kei & yuri
A Jeffersonian distinction, and my position is not "silly" at all. Religion is often dragged in as an excuse for war; but it is seldom the real fomenter of war.
Even today, in Iraq, the news is all about "Sunni v. Shi'te," yet the people from Iraq who are asked, say the distinction never existed until recently. It has been exploited (probably by people like al-Zarqawi), which is to say, invented, in order to foment struggle, i.e., for one party to gain power.
War is all about gaining power. What tools you use: racial identity, religious identity, national identity, tribal identity, are merely means to the end, not the cause. Wars that are fought "at God's command" are only recorded, so far as I know, in the Hebrew Scriptures. And even then it was all about control of property. Same can be said of the Crusades. The excuse was religion; the reason, was control of property. Power.
Everything is, is just a means to motivate uninterested person to go along with you. Kings used threats to the kingdom; Bush uses fear of "the other." The end never changes; only the excuses for getting there.
Breitweiser is considering suing Coulter for slander, but the tv heads I've heard talk about it said the chances of the Jersey Girls prevailing were slim in suit a suit.
Libel, might be difficult. But if she keeps going, slander is more of an option.
And where did these tv talking heads go to law school?
Or did you mean legal consultants, not talk show hosts?
Well, it's been a fun drive-by, but I really must be going if I want to get some good papier-mache puppet pictures...
she will cease to show up on talk shows and sell books. Make her bank account as skinny as she is, slim to nothing.
EkCenTrik
The right wing-controlled media are determined to shove her down everyone's throats.
Hard to ignore that.
Please consider Darcy Burner into your political donation matrix, in her fight against Dave Reichert.
She looking to raise $75K by Sunday, she is at roughly $30K.
This is a winnable seat with the proper amount of support.
BTW, El Presidente held a fundraiser in Medina for Reichert yesterday.
Couter? Plagiarism?
And Tweety isn't all over it?
Surely, Hardball and Scarborough covered Cynthia McKinney's not being indicted thoroughly, so maybe there wasn't time for the plagiarism.
Safeway has portabello caps
Don't make the same mistake I made!
I accidently bought child-proof portabella caps, and of course I couldn't get them open. 
Happy Saturday again, rational people.
I don't think Michael Moore ever suggested that Bush enjoyed the deaths of American soldiers or something like that...
Whatever one thinks of Ward Churchill, he's not appearing on the TODAY show in an outfit slit up to his upper thigh and roasting the hosts nuts for fun. That's someone else.
Dude, the guy hates America, K? You just have to listem to him talk for about five minutes about how he views America's role in history and the world in order to see it.
So, making a fact-based criticism of something = "hate"? Disliking the actions of an administration = "hate"? We have seen those "arguments" over in Wingnutistan.
And yes, there was an element of imperialism in the US involvement in the Pacific war. Not the sole element, but it was there.
You still haven't provided any evidence that he hates America.
that those aren't the words of someone who's batshit crazy...
Are you saying that all those people deserved to die on 9/11?
What distinguishes them from you, then? Do you deserve to die just for being an American?
Just because our government has done some bad things in the world does not mean that we all deserve to die in attacks like 9/11. To assert that any such attack is justified, regardless of who perpetrates it, other than as part of an existential struggle along the lines of WWII, is to live out of hate, period.
the reason lou dobbs, woof blitzer, spikey mikey, et al denigrate michael moore is he thoroughly punked them with f9/11 by revealing how lazy and easily rolled they were -- yes, what lapdogs they were for the bush admin. they will never forgive him for that -- so the best way to minimize him is thru mockery and he's a much easier target with his, ahem, appearance. they don't and won't deal with the facts of his books or films; their energy is devoted to destroying him.
linda
Plus "F-911" portrayed "America's Sweetheart", TWITney Spears, as the know-nothing idiot that she is.
9/11/01 = Inside Job
Duke Law. Ruh-Row!
I don't see the comparison. Michael Moore is a talented filmmaker but his movies share little fidelity with the truth. His work has largely been debunked and discredited by the likes of Larry Elder and anyone who wants to look at the facts. He is a propagandist who hates America (and Israel). His days in the spotlight are over. Does anyone really think he will be the hero of the next Democratic convention and given the seat of honor next to Jimmy Carter? I don't think so. As we all know carrying around all that weight for so many years catches up with you. Michael Moore is done; put a fork in him. He is irrelevant. Just a fat stinking carcass on the road to hell.
Sorry for being a doofus, but is there a reason why tv is spelled "teevee?" This seems to be common in the blogosphere, and so I wonder if it's a reference to something particular, or simply a spelling preference?
I don't think Michael Moore ever suggested that Bush enjoyed the deaths of American soldiers or something like that...
Bobby McGee
No. Bush doesn't give a fuck about the deaths of American soldiers.
On second thought, I can catch the puppets again at 3, and then check out the drumming and the circus without having to figure out how to kill two extra hours...
It's funny. They advertise them as 'caps', but they have stems just the same!
So, making a fact-based criticism of something = "hate"? Disliking the actions of an administration = "hate"?
You are not paying attention to what I am saying. The things Churchill says go way beyond that. And you can hear the seething anger and hatred in his voice when he talks. He's a hater. Maybe you're a hater too, I don't know.
Thank you, jawbone!
TeeVee is slightly derisive, TeeBee is more so.
even today, in Iraq, the news is all about "Sunni v. Shi'te," yet the people from Iraq who are asked, say the distinction never existed until recently. It has been exploited (probably by people like al-Zarqawi), which is to say, invented, in order to foment struggle, i.e., for one party to gain power.
War is all about gaining power. What tools you use: racial identity, religious identity, national identity, tribal identity, are merely means to the end, not the cause. Wars that are fought "at God's command" are only recorded, so far as I know, in the Hebrew Scriptures. And even then it was all about control of property. Same can be said of the Crusades. The excuse was religion; the reason, was control of property. Power.
Everything is, is just a means to motivate uninterested person to go along with you. Kings used threats to the kingdom; Bush uses fear of "the other." The end never changes; only the excuses for getting there.
Rmj, Uncredentialed | Homepage | 06.17.06 - 12:48 pm
The collapse of Yugoslavia II was called religous. As more than a few folks pointed out, it was a 'religious' war in which the Serb Orthodox and Croat Catholics didn't go to mass, and the Muslims didn't go to prayer. The Balkan wars and genocides of the 1990's weren't about religion, they were about politics and power.
Anyway, isn't pointing out that Michael Moore is fat pretty much completely at odds with saying he's exactly like Ann Coulter?
His work has largely been debunked and discredited by the likes of Larry Elder and anyone who wants to look at the facts.
Larry Elder? Never heard of him.
Anyone who wants to look at the facts did so (a bunch of lawyers, included) and found that Moore's presentation was accurate.
Look, asshole, he let those people SPEAK FOR THEMSELVES. They hung themselves WITH THEIR OWN WORDS.
What don't you get?
Well, one huge difference is that of access--Coulter manages to show up any where, any time, on any topic, whether she has a book to flog or not. When's the last time Moore was called onto a half dozen network shows to express his opinion on anything?
TeeVee is slightly derisive, TeeBee is more so.
I can't understand why anyone would want to deride The Great Nurturing Mother.
(Now, Haloscan, on the other hand, can bite my shiny metal ass...)
blerb | 06.17.06 - 12:53 pm |
Actually, we categoricaly disgree, and not just because we hate this illiterate non-word "hater": it was very heart-warming to see Ward in an appearance insisting that everyone obey the same rules. He looked the very soul of rationality making his supporters ask a succinct question or make room for smoeone who would. He dodged no one, and tolerated rambling poetry from no one either.
I don't see the comparison. Michael Moore is a talented filmmaker but his movies share little fidelity with the truth. His work has largely been debunked and discredited by the likes of Larry Elder and anyone who wants to look at the facts. He is a propagandist who hates America (and Israel). His days in the spotlight are over. Does anyone really think he will be the hero of the next Democratic convention and given the seat of honor next to Jimmy Carter? I don't think so. As we all know carrying around all that weight for so many years catches up with you. Michael Moore is done; put a fork in him. He is irrelevant. Just a fat stinking carcass on the road to hell.
Jose Chung
Aw, I see the trolls have dragged their sorry asses out of bed!
Larry Elder - isn't he another of Bush's good little house negroes?
Why don't you take your bullshit over to LGF?
I'm always amazed when people use Larry Elder as a primary source.
Larry Elder is one of those uncle toms who explains that black people who haven't made it are lazy.
Bush administration war policy in a nutshell:
We will not leave Iraq until the Iraqi army can defend itslef against Iran.
Or until it is strong enough to invade Kuwait again.
Therefore, we will never leave.
blerb, are you saying that the millions killed in SE Asia between 1958 and 1975 deserved their fate at the hands (often quite literally) of USer forces deserved that?
the thousands upon thousands killed by USer arms and proxies in Grenada, Panama, Nicaragua, Guatemala, El Salvador, the Philippines deserved it?
No?
Well, neither am i (nor is WC) saying the dead of ixxi 'literally' deserved to die. But they, like the unfortunates on the bridge at san luis rey (to choose a literary example) were--not unlike those who were unfortunated to be underneat USer bombs, or in front of USer tanks, all over the fucking world for the last 50 fucking years--simply in the wrong place at the wrong time...
sorry bout dat...
.
Are you saying that all those people deserved to die on 9/11?
What distinguishes them from you, then? Do you deserve to die just for being an American?
Just because our government has done some bad things in the world does not mean that we all deserve to die in attacks like 9/11....
blerb | 06.17.06 - 12:50 pm | #
Put it this way. Have we somehow earned the right to be excluded from the same shooting gallery that certain parts of the world have been turned into, thanks to the West's centuries-old economic gobbling-up of the Third World?
Larry Elder is one of those uncle toms who explains that black people who haven't made it are lazy.
Ah, an asshat.
Larry Elder is one of those uncle toms who explains that black people who haven't made it are lazy.
kei & yuri
That's exactly what he is!
Anyway, isn't pointing out that Michael Moore is fat pretty much completely at odds with saying he's exactly like Ann Coulter?
Yes, as I sadly realized as I tried to make the case. Plus he's sloppy, bearded, married, and male. But, Ann could be all of those things.
He is a propagandist who hates America (and Israel).
This is a tell of total ignorance: Moore very studiously avoids Israel. Maybe next time you'll do research instead of reciting a talking point.
Michael Moore has fought for the common good in America. Anne Cunter
is for the right wing elite white power structure.
Larry Elder is one of those uncle toms who explains that black people who haven't made it are lazy.
Ah, an asshat.
That is the technical term.
I'm always amazed when people use Larry Elder as a primary source.
Diane
Because the wingtards don't like what Michael Moore has to say and some Uncle Tom cries about it, the 'tards consider that "debunking."
sure bush is a lousy pres; but, but clinton got a blow job in the O.O.
see how it works? cheney is a thieving sob, but gore lied about the nets, he also wore earthtones. so hastert is a lay puppet, but pelosi is a liberal....fuck it, you cant debate a winger. they have won.
executive, legislative, judicial, law enforcement, the military, religion,
media, they have it all......november will be a fuckin disaster....
a symptom of the false equivalence which is practically the Prime Directive of Corporate Media.
It's worse than a false equivalence (which could be an error), it's a false impartiality, which can never be an error, but is always a lie.
I think this has evolved from the old days when the print media, before broadcast, was as far from impertial as you could get, and happy that way. Fox news is nothing new. Where the myth of journalistic impartiality came from, I don't know, but a myth it certainly is.
Does anyone really think he will be the hero of the next Democratic convention and given the seat of honor next to Jimmy Carter?
You really are a nitwit. You have no idea how & why he ended up sitting next to Carter, do you? Worse, you don't care.
He is a propagandist who hates America (and Israel).
This is a tell of total ignorance: Moore very studiously avoids Israel.
Well, that proves it, then. If he *liked* Israel, he wouldn't be avoiding it, now would he. Do you avoid people *you* like?
He is a propagandist who hates America (and Israel).
This is a tell of total ignorance: Moore very studiously avoids Israel. Maybe next time you'll do research instead of reciting a talking point.
kei & yuri
The troll is another asshat looking for attention.
They say something outrageous, even when it has no basis in fact.
I don't know much about Ward Churchill and only heard him speak once, on C-Span's BookNotes. He was talking about his book on genocide. What I recall was that he was not a really good speaker, but he did lay out quite well that genocide can be accomplished by many different methods, not just camps and military killing, but exposure to illness and lack of medical care, removal of children from their families to be schooled by dominant group or adoption, destruction of language and customs.
He was in no way wacky or filled with hate, at least on the appearance I saw part of (I tuned out because he was quite boring).
Anyway, he is so little known that he simply doesn't make any news except when attacked, it seems.
There are no Coulters on the left that I know of. And I would be hard put to make any comparison of her to him.
Are you saying that all those people deserved to die on 9/11?
That's not what either myself or Ward Churchill said.
He said that they were not "innocent".
You really are a nitwit. You have no idea how & why he ended up sitting next to Carter, do you? Worse, you don't care.
Thers, Mighty
I would consider it an honor to be seated next to Jimmy Carter.
If everyone ignored her, didn't discuss her, didn't lambast her everytime she puts out a book, bet she will cease to show up on talk shows and sell books.
How many times does it need to be said? Her book comes out on 6/6/06, and she appears at 7am on 'Today' with Matt Lauer, before the fucking bookshops open. Her publicist releases advance material about the Jersey Girls. She's a fucking troll. Do our fucking trolls go away?
As PZ Myers said, too many scientists hoped that by ignoring creationists, they'd go away.
No, her 'arguments' shouldn't be engaged. But she can't be ignored. She can be dismissed, and better, she can be provoked. Trouble is, you need to get her in forums where she's not treated as 'fun' or adored. She won't go up against Stewart. She won't go on Letterman.
So she needs to be punked. Fake wingnut radio hosts claiming to be from Bumfuck, KS. Fake talkshows. Fake journalists with tape recorders. Fuck 'off the record'.
You can say that 'everyone' should ignore her, but Lauer and Father Dobbs and Jay fucking Leno would invite her on no matter what.
Michael Moore is not loud. Ann Coulter is loud. Why does she always shout?
Focus on me! This is all about me! Listen to me! I want to talk! Keep the camera on me! That is all there is to know about Ann Coulter.
Chimpy
You know, I like strong women. (Laughter.) I was raised by one, I married one, and I hope we're raising two. (Laughter and applause.)
False comparison.
False dichotomy.
False "facts" combined with magic ellipses and editing.
Does truth enter in anywhere in MCMland?
The Larry Elder?
The libertarian Town Hall columnist and teevee judge of "Moral Court"?
Well, hell-- that's all I need to hear. Michael Moore is dead to me now.
Actually Moore did do one piece on Israel for TV Nation. It said nothing about the illegal occupation, it was all about the wierd relationship the fundies have with the Israeli right, and a mental disorder called The Jerusalem Syndrome. It seems that religious people who visit God's Own Hometown succumb, with peculiar regularity, to Biblically-based delusions of grandeur. One broke the mold by deciding he was a Greco-Roman God, but most go with various canonical figures like David.
blerb, are you saying that the millions killed in SE Asia between 1958 and 1975 deserved their fate at the hands (often quite literally) of USer forces deserved that?
For God's sake, No! Stop attacking strawmen.
He is a propagandist who hates America (and Israel).
(a) I don't give a fuck about Israel. If fewer Americans cared about it, we'd all be better off;
(b) Using your right to free speech is not hating America. When are you asswipe fascist Bush fellators going to understand that?
Madeline ALbright said the exact same thing as Churchill on 60 Minutes.
Almost every professor I've had was, one way or another, nuts.
The best chemistry professor I ever had was a fundy that 'spoke in tongues'.
Weird.
The thing is, Michael is a little sloppy looking, but Michael tells the truth.
I wish we'd stop imputing facile comparisons like this to "lazy and sloppy" thinking. That's too kind to these people. This is cynicism pure and simple. The media are completely corrupt. They share the Bush Administration complete contempt for the intelligence of the American public and show it when they deliver manifestly dishonest rationales like this. (Michael Getler's unfalsifiable standard for press criticism (progressive ones only), enunciated in his laughable "rebuttal" to Boehlert's book Lapdogs, is another.)
Proof if any were needed that they don't even believe this false equivalence between Moore and Coulter is the relative frequency of their appearances. Unless Moore is making an unignorable splash with his latest movie, he just doesn't bet that much airtime, and when he does, the atmosphere is always adversarial. Compare his appearance on Lauer, for example, with Coulter's. Can you imagine Moore being told at the end, "Always fun having you on, Michael?" The idea is absurd.
There is one, and only one way in which one can take seriously this spurious claim. It's that Moore, virtually alone among public intellectuals with a megaphone, does not assume the intrinsic benvolence of US policy. This assumption is truly a sacred cow in public discourse. It is the all-but-stated subtext of Joe Klein's rabid hatred of the Left, and drives the media's obsession with refusing to cover issues like the Downing Street memo, our permanent bases in Iraq, and the like. They will eat live toads in Hell before they will admit that the war in Iraq was for anything as crass as imperialistic reasons, an assumption that no one makes about any other country's conduct on earth. And for not toeing the line on that dogma, Moore is given "beyond the pale" status.
So in that sense, he might appear like Coulter to the soi-disant "non-ideological" ideologues who enforce political conformity in our country. (See Mitchell's self-description at the link.) But that's an issue for psychiatric pathologists to investigate, and not worth taking seriously by sane people.
Chimpy
She's going to win [Heather Wilson, R-NM]. No doubt in my mind, she's going to win. (Applause.) I want to thank her family, Jay, Joshua, and Caitlin. I was telling Joshua and Caitlin coming over -- I spent some quality time with Heather on Air Force One; it's amazing what people do to get on Air Force One, by the way. (Laughter.)
and I hope we're raising two.
Get used to disappointment.
He said that they were not "innocent".
You are splitting hairs.
90% of the people that bag on Michael Moore have not even seen Faranheit 9/11
Watch the movie first!
But they wont because they are afraid that *gasp* there just MIGHT be some truth in it...
For God's sake, No! Stop attacking strawmen.
blerb - 1:03 pm
strawmen?
reply to the rest of the fucking comment, shitwhistle..
Potato Head gets it.
Jose Chung is a troll from Hullabaloo. Maybe Digby banned him.
I will say this, however: I'd give my right arm to have had boring old Al Gore sitting in the oval office these past 5+ years.
Oh, and 'Jose Chung' is the troll who's been shitting over at Digby's place for weeks. He fucks goats.
Chimpy
And it's hard work. But I went to take the measure of the person.
My earliest recollection of Cooties come from seeing "her" on Bill Maher's "Politically Incorrect", where "she" would make the most idiotic statements (although, to be fair, "she" would make one comment out of ten or twenty that did make sense, so "she" wouldn't appear to be a complete imbecile). The other panelists would then slap down "her" statements with no difficulties. Maher would look at "her" with incredulity and bemusement. Then Cooties would go off on another outrageous tangent, never acknowledging that anybody who disagreed with "her" had made valid points. Eventually, the show got cancelled because the host said something about the 9/11 hijackers having more courage than someone who bombs from afar, which actually contained some truth.
One thing that really is worth criticizing about Churchill is his Native American ancestry: it is apparently voluntary, not genetic, as he failed to prove membership in one tribe and then joined another which makes no proof requirement.
I don't know too much about Churchill, myself, but I can tell you that proving Native American Ancestry can be pretty difficult. #1, Your ancestors HAD to live on a reservation in the late 19th early 20th Century, which is not true of all Native Americans. #2, They HAD to take part in a voluntary census, which many did not take part in, out of a fear of ethnic persecution. #3, you have to provide documentation linking yourself to your ancestor. In some cases, this is just impossible, due to things like fires in the courthouse, ancestor used Christian name for official documents and NA name for tribal rolls, etc. I don't know whether Churchill is an Indian or not, but I can say that he probably believes himself to be, based on what I've heard, and that's good enough for me.
And it's hard work. But I went to take the measure of the person.
'...and he's doing a heckuva job.'
90% of the people that bag on Michael Moore have not even seen Faranheit 9/11
Watch the movie first!
But they wont because they are afraid that *gasp* there just MIGHT be some truth in it...
PoliShifter
The same assholes who haven't seen Al Gore's movie.
For the same reason.
Think Ann Coulter's publisher would pull her books off the shelves if plagiarism is strongly shown?
Not effin' likely--they'll just use them away at indoctrination camps.
You are splitting hairs.
blerb
No, I'm not. You are beating on a strawman.
blerb, are you saying that the millions killed in SE Asia between 1958 and 1975 deserved their fate at the hands (often quite literally) of USer forces deserved that?
This is such an inept comparison we don't know where to begin. What did the Viet Cong do to America that they deserved that war at all?! The WTC housed the mechanisms of globalization and offices for Raytheon and the CIA.
Michael Moore is a talented filmmaker but his movies share little fidelity with the truth. His work has largely been debunked and discredited by the likes of Larry Elder and anyone who wants to look at the facts.
You are as full of shit as a Christmas goose. And stupider than a goose, to boot.
You think you can come around here and bullshit and get away with it? Please. Most every story in F 9/11 was old news to the folks that hang out here and was true, you flaming hemorrhoid.
Manny Annie Cooter is a lying ass. As are you.
Chimpy
It seems like to me the people of this district [Heather Wilson, R-NM] would want somebody to be able to pick up the phone and call the President of the United States and have the President of the United States answer the phone. I'm close to Heather, you know. She a -- as I told you, she's independent. But that doesn't mean I don't hold her in the highest -- highest regard and deep respect, which I do. I love her integrity. And when she calls me on the phone, I answer.
I was telling Joshua and Caitlin coming over -- I spent some quality time with Heather on Air Force One; it's amazing what people do to get on Air Force One, by the way. (Laughter.)
What? You told Joshua and Caitlin what? That their mom blew you on the way over? That you did their mommy doggie? Oh shit, you didn't drive up her one way street, did you?
Can this guy complete a thought before going into one of his funnies?
My earliest recollection of Cooties come from seeing "her" on Bill Maher's "Politically Incorrect", where "she" would make the most idiotic statements (although, to be fair, "she" would make one comment out of ten or twenty that did make sense, so "she" wouldn't appear to be a complete imbecile). The other panelists would then slap down "her" statements with no difficulties. Maher would look at "her" with incredulity and bemusement.
Maher kissed her ass.
What there IS of one.
Put it this way. Have we somehow earned the right to be excluded from the same shooting gallery that certain parts of the world have been turned into, thanks to the West's centuries-old economic gobbling-up of the Third World?
fourmorewars
"The West" is not a unitary entity. It is therefore didingenuous to lay the crimes of "the West" at any one people's feet. Two wrongs don't make a right.
And it's hard work. But I went to take the measure of the person.
P O'Neill
Ironically Chimpy probably spends less time "working" than any POTUS in modern times.
.
If everyone ignored her, didn't discuss her, didn't lambast her everytime she puts out a book, bet she will cease to show up on talk shows and sell books.
Who's "everyone"? The Blogosphere? We aint buying her books. Scaife is doing that. The netroots doesn't book her on the Teebee, and we don't watch her, unless we're hoping for George Carlin to...yeah, right. Anyway, Ann could care less about any discussion of her that only takes place in the blogs. Fox, CNN, MSNBC, the Formerly Big Three are where the action is, and action is what she wants. Face it, there's not much we can do about her one way or the other, without the Real Media in our corner. Which they aint. Aint this boogie a mess?
War is all about gaining power. What tools you use: racial identity, religious identity, national identity, tribal identity, are merely means to the end, not the cause. Wars that are fought "at God's command" are only recorded, so far as I know, in the Hebrew Scriptures. And even then it was all about control of property. Same can be said of the Crusades. The excuse was religion; the reason, was control of property. Power.
Everything is, is just a means to motivate uninterested person to go along with you. Kings used threats to the kingdom; Bush uses fear of "the other." The end never changes; only the excuses for getting there.
Rmj, Uncredentialed | Homepage | 06.17.06 - 12:48 pm | #
'to motivate uninterested person to go along with you.'
I.e., convince ordinary people to be cannon fodder. What war could happen without that? And how does that happen without religion? You cited Vietnam and Korea earlier? What part of 'godless Communism' did you miss?
Alexander, the Romans, the Greeks? Why would any of their cannon fodder care to become such? To subjugate the barbarians. What makes a barbarian a barbarian?
Yes, the soldiery often fought to take part in the spoils. They still had to justify it amongst themselves. Only pirates and such gleefully talk about loot for the pure love of loot.
And, actually, in the fogs of my mind I seem to recall even pirates using religion at times.
BW: So you're not saying the people who died on 9/11 deserved to die?
WC: I'm not a judge. I want the whole goddamned process to stop, you know? That extends to these collateral damages... I certainly don't embrace that. I didn't judge Eichmann. I didn't impose the death penalty. You can adduce that if Eichmann is worthy of death, because of what he had done in arranging train schedules and such, then these other Eichmanns are worthy of death.
But I didn't pronounce the sentence. I merely made the comparison. I've pointed this out when I've actually gone on with these attack dogs: You show me where I said it was justified.
Michael Moore is not loud. Ann Coulter is loud. Why does she always shout?
That's her "debate" tactic. She never shuts up. She just keeps talking louder and louder until some friendly host (usually Hannity) asks her some question like So do liberals hate America because they hate George W Bush, or do they hate George W Bush because they hate America?
I was telling Joshua and Caitlin coming over -- I spent some quality time with Heather on Air Force One; it's amazing what people do to get on Air Force One, by the way. (Laughter.)
What? You told Joshua and Caitlin what? That their mom blew you on the way over? That you did their mommy doggie?
Condi is going to be awfully pissed off if Heather is encroaching on her turf.
It seems like to me the people of this district [Heather Wilson, R-NM] would want somebody to be able to pick up the phone and call the President of the United States and have the President of the United States answer the phone.
Oh yeah, I just love the "If you elect a Democrat you can go fuck yourselves" message.
She a -- as I told you, she's independent. But that doesn't mean I don't hold her in the highest -- highest regard and deep respect, which I do. I love her integrity. And when she calls me on the phone, I answer.
But when Michael Brown called you on the phone, you were too busy to take the call.
Chimpy-And when she calls me on the phone, I answer.
P O'Neill |
Liar.
.
"The West" is not a unitary entity. It is therefore didingenuous to lay the crimes of "the West" at any one people's feet. Two wrongs don't make a right.
blerb | 06.17.06 - 1:09 pm |
Ah, that's what you're dishonestly refusing to comprehend. Churchill, and all the other people you're not bothered by even though they say the same thing, is saying that something is inevitable, not "just." Big difference, very hard for Americans warped by puritanism and social darwininsm to grasp.
"The West" is not a unitary entity. It is therefore didingenuous to lay the crimes of "the West" at any one people's feet. Two wrongs don't make a right.
blerb | 06.17.06 - 1:09 pm | #
Who's laying them at any one people's feet? I wasn't separating us out from other westerners. I said we didn't have much claim to be excluded . Kinda means one of us is trying to separate us out, and it ain't me.
That's her "debate" tactic. She never shuts up.
Which is why she needs to be told to shut the fuck up. Ideally on live television. By the first non-wingnut to get the chance.
But that's never going to happen. She's sheltered by her publicists.
So you punk her. I say it again. Mike Stark is doing a good job of calling radio wingnuts. It's time to take it to the next level and pretend to be one.
Michael Moore is not loud. Ann Coulter is loud. Why does she always shout?
That's her "debate" tactic. She never shuts up. She just keeps talking louder and louder until some friendly host (usually Hannity) asks her some question like So do liberals hate America because they hate George W Bush, or do they hate George W Bush because they hate America?
DemByDefault
I saw the Lauer interview.
That bitch was on speed. She had to be.
She kept going on and one and didn't stop to take a breath.
shitwhistle..
You just ended the discussion, WGG.
I can't believe anyone would want to marry Heather Wilson, much less fuck her and make babies with her.
Oh yeah, I just love the "If you elect a Democrat you can go fuck yourselves" message.
Eli |
Bingo!
Think folks will begin to catch on?
This other discussion is getting a little heated. Please reserve the flambe for the trools.
Put it this way. Have we somehow earned the right to be excluded from the same shooting gallery that certain parts of the world have been turned into, thanks to the West's centuries-old economic gobbling-up of the Third World?
fourmorewars
"The West" is not a unitary entity. It is therefore didingenuous to lay the crimes of "the West" at any one people's feet. Two wrongs don't make a right.
blerb | 06.17.06 - 1:09 pm
okay, cully let's call a spade a spade:
Put it this way. Have we--USers-- somehow earned the right to be excluded from the same shooting gallery that we-USers--have turned certain parts of the world into, thanks to the usOFa DECADES-LONG POLICIES of militaristic terrorism to enforce the USer eonomic model on the rest of the world???
if you can deny the truth of the facts stated in the question, we have nothing further to say to one another, because you're speaking./reading some other languagge than english...
.
Ann Coulter is loud. Why does she always shout?
The nuns back in my grade school had an saying for people like her:
"Empty barrels make the most noise."
Coulter: big mouth, little brain.
okay, cully let's call a spade a spade:
Put it this way. Have we--USers-- somehow earned the right to be excluded from the same shooting gallery that we-USers--have turned certain parts of the world into, thanks to the usOFa DECADES-LONG POLICIES of militaristic terrorism to enforce the USer eonomic model on the rest of the world???
if you can deny the truth of the facts stated in the question, we have nothing further to say to one another, because you're speaking./reading some other languagge than english...
If you regularly visit Hell upon other countries, karma dictates that Hell will eventually be visited upon yours.
That bitch was on speed. She had to be.
She kept going on and one and didn't stop to take a breath.
That makes sense, TC. She exhibits all the signs - Emaciated, druggy bags under the eyes, chain-smoker, yapping incessantly.
I'll be damned. I think you've got it.
You just ended the discussion, WGG.
blerb | 06.17.06 - 1:14 pm
oh, you just fuckin broke MY heart...asshole!
Sorry, that should be, "If *your country* regularly visits hell upon...", since we seem to be a bit hair-splitty today.
That bitch was on speed. She had to be.
She kept going on and one and didn't stop to take a breath.
That makes sense, TC. She exhibits all the signs - Emaciated, druggy bags under the eyes, chain-smoker, yapping incessantly.
I'll be damned. I think you've got it.
Or she could just be batshit insane.
MANN Coulter just took her pronouncements from the Bush Lesson Book as Holy Writ from the Spewer Lushbaug--pronounce, don't explain. Too smart to have to stoop to explain.
Listen to Bush in his press pronouncemtn after his trip to Irock.
We'' stay the course, course that takes determination, (more lives terminated) and will power (we have more 500lb bombs where those came from)
Not a word outa his mouth bout whether it was a good or evil decision to occupy another soverign country and depose their government, not jes there leaders, but the whole kit and kaboodle.
Pompous asses all with their Pronouncements.
hat bitch was on speed. She had to be.
She kept going on and one and didn't stop to take a breath.
That makes sense, TC. She exhibits all the signs - Emaciated, druggy bags under the eyes, chain-smoker, yapping incessantly.
I'll be damned. I think you've got it.
billy b
Buddy of mine is a drug counselor.
Said the bitch is doing meth.
From Heather's written bio:
Heather Wilson is married to Jay Hone, an Albuquerque attorney. They have one adult son, Scott Hone, and two younger children, Joshua and Caitlin Hone.
Then the bullet points:
Family: Husband: Jay Hone; Children: Adult son Scott and Joshua and Caitlin
I can understand the description of Scott as an adult in the written bio, but why again in the bullet points?
Big winds blow from empty caves.
Ah, that's what you're dishonestly refusing to comprehend. Churchill....
1) I am not especially bothered by Ward Churchill. I just held him up as an example of somebdy who actually does hate America, unlike Michael Moore, who as I said, is not even very far to the left in my book.
2) Your generalization about Americans as warped by puritanism and social Darwinsm puts you firmly in the category of haters. There are 300,000,000 Americans. Any pejorative statement pertaining to all of us is bigotry. And as it happens, I am both an atheist and a socialist, and an Austrian to boot, so your asessment of the basis of my arguments is wildly off the mark.
If you regularly visit Hell upon other countries, karma dictates that Hell will eventually be visited upon yours.
It's too bad that those who claim to live by the Golden Rule don't understand and appreciate the dictates of karma.
Or she could just be batshit insane.
Eli
I didn't say she couldn't be a druggie AND nuts!
Or she could just be batshit insane.
Maybe both. Speed and mental instability do not go together all that well.
I didn't say she couldn't be a druggie AND nuts!
Touche.
I can understand the description of Scott as an adult in the written bio, but why again in the bullet points?
Snow, Stupid Grammar Nazi
Her only achievements in life?
Besides being a Repukelican piece of caca?
If you regularly visit Hell upon other countries, karma dictates that Hell will eventually be visited upon yours.
Eli - 1:17 pm
exactement!
ixxi = karmic come-uppance...
i truly sympathize with those who lost friendas and family on ixxi...
i just wish those folks who rail loudest about it, weep the most copious tears, and loudly proclaim their fury could feel the same sympathy for the millions whom USers have killed--and written off--just because they got in the way of our fucking lifestyle...
.
Spot on.
...Moore, virtually alone among public intellectuals with a megaphone, does not assume the intrinsic benvolence of US policy. This assumption is truly a sacred cow in public discourse. It is the all-but-stated subtext of Joe Klein's rabid hatred of the Left, and drives the media's obsession with refusing to cover issues like the Downing Street memo, our permanent bases in Iraq, and the like. They will eat live toads in Hell before they will admit that the war in Iraq was for anything as crass as imperialistic reasons, an assumption that no one makes about any other country's conduct on earth. And for not toeing the line on that dogma, Moore is given "beyond the pale" status.
Potato Head |06.17.06 - 1:04 pm
Beautiful!
Big winds blow from empty caves.
With all the restraint I can muster, I shall leave this one alone while I dunk my head in the bucket of brain bleach.
Potato Head, your entry for the first time helped me understand Joe Klein, and it applies to others on the "liberal" side of MCMers.
i just wish those folks who rail loudest about it, weep the most copious tears, and loudly proclaim their fury could feel the same sympathy for the millions whom USers have killed--and written off--just because they got in the way of our fucking lifestyle...
And the thing is, in both instances, it's mostly the ordinary citizens just going about their business who pay the price, not the culpable guilty fuckers themselves who truly deserve it.
i just wish those folks who rail loudest about it, weep the most copious tears, and loudly proclaim their fury could feel the same sympathy for the millions whom USers have killed--and written off--just because they got in the way of our fucking lifestyle...
.
WoodyGuthrie'sGuitar(aka..
Woody:
That is SO well put...and so true!
Big winds blow from empty caves.
With all the restraint I can muster, I shall leave this one alone while I dunk my head in the bucket of brain bleach.
Snow, Stupid Grammar Nazi
Wow that was some mental jujitsu: You just made me think of Coulter blowing big queefs!!
I swear that was no where near my head. Oh sweet jesus
Family: Husband: Jay Hone; Children: Adult son Scott and Joshua and Caitlin
Translation:
We had the adult son years ago, but forced ourselves to have sex twice more because having little ones looks good with the Family Values crowd.
and an Austrian to boot,
blerb
Interesting that you assumed that I was American, then. It's no secret here that I'm not.
so your asessment of the basis of my arguments is wildly off the mark.
Your assessments of Ward Churchill's arguments and positions are widely off the mark.
Of course, it is natural to respond to the most hostile of the responses, but I would like you to address the words of Ward Churchill himself, and Madeline Albright's agreement with his assessment.
just because they got in the way of our fucking lifestyle...
Damn. That was good, Wood. You are a thoughtful old mother, ain't you?
I'm not going to get into trying to assess the level of guilt of those "ordinary citizens" - yes, you can easily argue that everyone is responsible, but you can't argue as easily that everyone is *knowingly* responsible.
Although I reckon that if most Americans were offered the choice of either scaling back their lifestyle, or making life better for some brown person Over There, I'm guessing they would vote for Number One.
I reckon that if most Americans were offered the choice of either scaling back their lifestyle, or making life better for some brown person Over There, I'm guessing they would vote for Number One.
Eli
It's the American Way.
Wow that was some mental jujitsu
And so you learn, grasshopper.
I never heard of Ward Churchill before 9/11. He became the poster child personification of the wingnut stereotype of the wicked, insidious, left-wing extremist "Amerika hater" simply for having uncomfortable truths snatched up, pureed into scandalous soundbites, and disseminated by the corporate media long after the remarks were actually made without much contemperaneous fanfare or disapprobation.
The dynamic, IMO, is similar to Malcolm X's comment right after JFK's assassination that it was a case of "chickens coming home to roost".
Like Churchill's remarks, Malcolm's comment was translated as "the SOB had it coming". And there is at least some plausibility to this translation-- by which I only meantersay that the words alone might come off like a handful of salt being deliberately ground into a fresh open wound. Malcolm might as well have run out to little John-John when he saluted at his father's funeral and smacked the tot upside the head in front of a national audience.
Like Churchill, Malcolm was commenting from a much broader perspective-- and I think it's fair to interpret their stances as a restatement of the ancient maxim that "he who lives by the sword, dies by the sword".
But the comment so scandalized the simplistic and passionate jingo beast that was fully aroused and provoked by the violent tragedy that it turned the commentors into handy scapegoats.
Hey, Amerika may screw up now and then, but we're basically a good-hearted, high-achievement nation-- the kind of nation you'd like to have a beer with. Who the fuck are you to suggest we ought to take a hard look at ourselves before doing what we do to the rest of the world?
What peaceful reading on a lazy Saturday afternoon. I'm soooooo relieved this place is an echo chamber. Wouldn't want to be bothered with heated discussions.
What peaceful reading on a lazy Saturday afternoon. I'm soooooo relieved this place is an echo chamber. Wouldn't want to be bothered with heated discussions.
It's the American Way.
It's human, and Americans don't have a monopoly, I'm afraid.
Amerika may screw up now and then, but we're basically a good-hearted, high-achievement nation-- the kind of nation you'd like to have a beer with. Who the fuck are you to suggest we ought to take a hard look at ourselves before doing what we do to the rest of the world?
Little Brøther
I'd MUCH rather hang out with the Canadians and the British!
Dan Rather [Jonah Goldberg]
Considering obscure cable job.
At least people can stand near Rather without being overcome by shit fumes.
I'm not going to get into trying to assess the level of guilt of those "ordinary citizens" - yes, you can easily argue that everyone is responsible, but you can't argue as easily that everyone is *knowingly* responsible.
Ward didn't even do that. He seperated out those who were working in the technocratic engine of imperialism from the "collateral damage". The janitors and stewardesses were not who he compared to Eichmann.
Although I reckon that if most Americans were offered the choice of either scaling back their lifestyle, or making life better for some brown person Over There, I'm guessing they would vote for Number One.
Eli - 1:26 pm
it has been amply demonstrated over the last 100 years that, given a 'choice' (albeit not a necessarily conscious one--between a somewhat diminished 'life style' and the lives of thousands of innocent--mostly brown--victims, murkins almost universally would gladly choose--and have reflexively chosen--the latter...
i guess that makes me a 'hater'...
tough shit
Interesting that you assumed that I was American, then. It's no secret here that I'm not.
I wasn't talking to you.
but I would like you to address the words of Ward Churchill himself, and Madeline Albright's agreement with his assessment.
And which assessment would that be? I have said 2 or 3 times that I don't take issue with everything the man has said. But I have heard him say enough things to be clear that he hates America, all the same. My feeling that way about him and my agreeing with some thing or another that he he may have said are not mutually exclusive propositions. I don't hate Ward Churchill. I just don't take him that seriously.
If you regularly visit Hell upon other countries, karma dictates that Hell will eventually be visited upon yours.
Eli
So is Bush our Hell?
Dan Rather [Jonah Goldberg]
Considering obscure cable job.
At least people can stand near Rather without being overcome by shit fumes.
Lime Rickey
Jonah is another one who can't leave this world soon enough for me!
But the comment so scandalized the simplistic and passionate jingo beast that was fully aroused and provoked by the violent tragedy that it turned the commentors into handy scapegoats.
What is more, Churchill's statement would not have made it into the spotlight had not someone who knew the broader meaning knowingly used the simplistic meaning to scandalize the simplistic and passionate jingo beast.
So is Bush our Hell?
More the Hellbringer than Hell itself.
Jesus wept. I just read taht whole Broder column on Lieberman. The man is more delusional than Bush.
If you regularly visit Hell upon other countries, karma dictates that Hell will eventually be visited upon yours.
Eli
So is Bush our Hell?
Bugs, BNNY
You know how the fundies are always screaming about how (their mean, hateful, psychotic version of) "god" is going to punish America.
What the fuck did this country do to deserve Preznit Asshat?
But the comment so scandalized the simplistic and passionate jingo beast that was fully aroused and provoked by the violent tragedy that it turned the commentors into handy scapegoats.
And FWIW, I did not come to the conclusion that Ward Churchill hates America based on his comments about 9/11.
Afternoon, everyone!
Well, lessee:
Coulter: hatemongering, lies, death threats all to aid the consolidation of the greedy fascist regime
Moore: Facts, facts & more facts to try to bring some hard-won truth to American working men and women
Yup, can't see any difference there.
And Dan Rather's great crime?
He let himself be punked by Karl Rove.
Broder column on Lieberman.
That's all I need to hear. Blech.
And Dan Rather's great crime?
He let himself be punked by Karl Rove.
By that standard, half of America should be out of work.
But really, the guy hates America. Really.
So Churchill hates America. How is that material? His statements were cloddish, ill-timed, insensitive. Was his point any less valid?
P.S. Michael Moore is faaaaat!
By that standard, half of America should be out of work.
Eli
Give them time, my friend, give'em time....
The more things change....
I'm watching a Biography of "Superman" on A&E.
Some assclown said COMIC BOOKS were bad for American youth??????
Jezuz Chripes on iceskates.
Give them time, my friend, give'em time....
I'm waiting to hear that Dan Rather is in hock up to his eyeballs to the Chinese...
Lieberman on Lieberman:
"We have an incumbent senator who is quite popular in the state; ... Why would we want to challenge an incumbent senator who could lead the other candidates to victory?"
"I think we did the right thing in overthrowing Saddam, and I think we are safer as a result,"
"My opponent says it broke Democratic unity," Lieberman said. "Well, dammit, I wasn't thinking about Democratic unity. It was a moment to put the national interest above partisan interest."
Some assclown said COMIC BOOKS were bad for American youth??????
Was a huuuge issue in the mid-1950s.
Books were written, Congressional hearings were held, sermons were preached.
And which assessment would that be?
The one I posted a while ago, that many in the towers were not "innocent".
But I have heard him say enough things to be clear that he hates America, all the same.
Then provide us with examples. Direct quotes from Churchill that are evidence that he hates America.
And no more of this passive aggressive shit, either.
It's not to crime to hate America.
Yet, anyway!
What the fuck did this country do to deserve Preznit Asshat?
Terry C, Politikal Girl | 06.17.06 - 1:34 pm
pretty much everything the US has done on the international stage for the last hundred-plus years (possibly excepting 1941-45, end even then the atom bomb vitiates the claim to moral superiority), starting with the so-called Spanish American War, has been aimed at bringing the Busheviks to power...
.
I've fixed the typo in Lieberman's quote:
"Well, dammit, I wasn't thinking about Democratic unity. It was a moment to put my career interests above national interest."
There, that works better.
So Churchill hates America. How is that material? His statements were cloddish, ill-timed, insensitive. Was his point any less valid?
P.S. Michael Moore is faaaaat!
res ipsa loquitur
Really, Res, you should skim through the rest of the thread, and then you could answer that question for yourself. I did not compare Moore to Churchill, I cantrasted him with Churchill.
Some assclown said COMIC BOOKS were bad for American youth??????
Was a huuuge issue in the mid-1950s.
Books were written, Congressional hearings were held, sermons were preached.
Gummo
"If any form of pleasure is exhibited
Report to me and it shall be prohibited
I'll put my foot down
So shall it be
This is the land of the free!"
P.S. Michael Moore is faaaaat!
I wish to change this meme. Lots of people are fat. Look at the Speaker of the House. Michael Moore is sloppy. That is the new meme. My gosh, he even wore his worn hat to the Oscars. The Oscars, for crying out loud.
What the fuck did this country do to deserve Preznit Asshat?
Terry C, Politikal Girl | 06.17.06 - 1:34 pm
pretty much everything the US has done on the international stage for the last hundred-plus years (possibly excepting 1941-45, end even then the atom bomb vitiates the claim to moral superiority), starting with the so-called Spanish American War, has been aimed at bringing the Busheviks to power...
.
WoodyGuthrie'sGuitar(aka...
Yeah, but why should the rest of us have to suffer?
I wish to change this meme. Lots of people are fat. Look at the Speaker of the House. Michael Moore is sloppy. That is the new meme.
Doesn't matter. In the land of the supermodel, fat is the greater crime.
Make the case. Really - conservative pundits, trolls, bloggers, and mainstream balanced commenators - make it. I'm happy to be convinced, but it's just lazy and sloppy to make the assertion without having a clear idea about why the comparison is valid.
They have the indentical number of letter's in their names, you moonbat loosers.
If Michael Moore is just like Ann Coulter, why isn't he constantly on television?
Maybe the comic books lead to Bush?
Because being fat is a moral failing.
I am the Ann Coulter of the left.
Blow up AEI and other stuff I don't like. Arrest an execute all members of the Federalist Society. Michael Moore isn't fat. He's portly.
And this kind of discussion always reminds me of a bit from Vonnegut's "Cat's Cradle", which is no less relevant today than when it was written.
In the book, we meet Ambassador Horelick Minton and his wife Claire on their way to the ambassador's latest assignment-- the tiny Caribbean island of San Lorenzo. Later on (n.b., spoiler if anyone cares), though, we find out that this is a pretty lousy post by diplomatic standards. The ambassador explains, in effect, that his career received a fatal blow after his wife had a letter published in the New York Times (!) suggesting that Americans needed to understand that they could not always expect non-Americans to accept them with uncritical positive regard.
The ambassador concludes by ruefully noting that his wife committed an American sacrilege by openly daring to suggest that Americans would not be instantly loved and respected by all foreigners, everywhere. Amerikans, generally speaking, just can't stand to hear that. And to the Ruling Class, the sentiment is utterly taboo. So violations are punished as harshly as possible.
Some things never change.
Some assclown said COMIC BOOKS were bad for American youth??????
Was a huuuge issue in the mid-1950s.
Books were written, Congressional hearings were held, sermons were preached.
I actually wrote a (not especially good) paper on this in college. All kinds of horrific examples of juvenile violence supposedly inspired by lurid comic books.
I did like my opening quote, though:
[Senator Estes] KEFAUVER: “This seems to be a man with a bloody ax holding a woman's head up, which has been severed from her body. Do you think that is in good taste?”
[Comics Publisher William] GAINES: “Yes sir, I do for the cover of a horror comic. A cover in bad taste might be defined as holding the head higher so that the blood could be seen dripping from it.”
KEFAUVER: “You've got blood coming out of her mouth”
GAINES: “A little.”
Ward Churchill: Hates American or No? Opinions differ.
P.S. Michael Moore is faaaaat!
So are Rove, Cheney, Hastert, etc.
But I guess it's okay for Repukes to be fat.
You know, the whole "hate America" thing is a canard.
It has nothing to do with any actual issue -- it's an assault, an attempt to shift the grounds of discussion onto an abstract emotional plane, a way of deligitimizing people you don't like.
Who cares what someone you don't know feels abstractly and emotionally about America, which is in many ways also an abstraction?
Are they right? Do their arguments make sense? Should they be used to affect the actual policies of a government that is allegendly "democratic"?
These are the real questions. The "hate America" stuff is purest bullshit.
Yeah, but why should the rest of us have to suffer?
Terry C, Politikal Girl - 1:40 pm
karma is no respecter of such puny things as individuals, dahlin... 
Some assclown said COMIC BOOKS were bad for American youth??????
Was a huuuge issue in the mid-1950s.
Books were written, Congressional hearings were held, sermons were preached.
Gummo
Maybe he was right. Look where we are today.
Really, blerb, you should read my post. I did not compare Moore to Churchill.
But you still haven't provided any support for your assertion that Churchill hates America.
What a stupid fucking pointless assertion. Churchill's really out there beating the drums, isn't he? He's on every teebee show 24/7, in all the mags and papers. Christ! He's preaching hate on my street corner right now. The many is a menace -- a menace, I tell you.
Coulter, on the hand, gets no attention by comparison.
Eli, that transcript excerpt is priceless. LOL!
Maybe he was right. Look where we are today.
Andy Coulter
Censorship is NEVER the right thing!
In the land of the supermodel, fat is the greater crime.
OBEY MY AUTHORITAY!
[/cartman]
Thers, Mighty | Homepage | 06.17.06 - 1:42 pm | #
Exactly.
The current corollary is that anyone who isn't openly and convetionally religious (no pagans need apply) has nothing meaningful to add to the public debate.
Thers, Mighty | Homepage | 06.17.06 - 1:42 pm | #
Thank you, Thers.
I am now going to build an altar to you in my living room.
Later, Liberal Elitists.
P.S. Michael Moore is faaaaat!
So are Rove, Cheney, Hastert, etc.
I am fascinated that rumor has it that WH staffers feel they risk the wrath of the Codpiece (Snow, get your mind out the gutter) if they're out of shape, that Larry Lindsay's weight had as much to do with his eventual firing as his under-estimate (I typed accurate first) of the cost of this war, but Rove clearly mainlines Kripsy Kremes.
Hm -- not only the spelling, but the grammar of my last post fell completely apart.
If Michael Moore is just like Ann Coulter, why isn't he constantly on television?
The MSM only put Coulter on in order to attack her. They avoid Moore because they love him and do not want to expose him.
Or something.
The ambassador concludes by ruefully noting that his wife committed an American sacrilege by openly daring to suggest that Americans would not be instantly loved and respected by all foreigners, everywhere. Amerikans, generally speaking, just can't stand to hear that. And to the Ruling Class, the sentiment is utterly taboo. So violations are punished as harshly as possible.
Some things never change.
Little Brøther
As I have said many times:
The in-your-face, we-are-better-than-everyone-else, blow-down-before-us American brand of "patriotism" (nationalism these days) has always embarrassed me.
These are the real questions. The "hate America" stuff is purest bullshit.
All I did was say that if they want to say that somebody hates America, they should say it about somebody who actually does, like Ward Churchill, and not about Michael Moore, who clearly, clearly, clearly, does NOT hate this country. I then made the mistake of engaging the couple of people who predictably leaped to Churchill's defense,and now, as usual, I have had a constellation of sentiments imputed upon me that do not exist.
Damn typos. That is what we ought to be hating on. If they would just go away, I would seem a little smarter.
Well, probably not, but they should still go away.
Sorry -
BOW down before us.
Then again, it seems Murka does want the entire world to servuce it!
Early comic books were full of weird shit. Where do you think Robert Smigel gets his ideas and inspiration from? Harmful to the kids at the time? Hardly.
(Snow, get your mind out the gutter)
But that is how I always know where to find it.
Sorry - SERVICE it.
Damn, I need some chocolate.
I reckon we're still at least an hour or two away from Threadbot putting up 3 or 4 posts in a half-hour span...
Or something.
They want Moore's message controlled, and they can't control it if they put him on teevee. He'll say things they don't want heard.
The Superman thing is talking about the Bizarro World.
Otherwise known as the Repuke Party and its supporters,
Censorship is NEVER the right thing!
Oh, that's not true. Child porn is a good example.
Anyway, I'll get back to my discussion of art and censorship at my place later. Gonna take the little ones swimming this afternoon...
Books were written, Congressional hearings were held, sermons were preached.
Gummo
They were forbidden in my house.
Harmful to the kids at the time? Hardly.
"Harmful to the kids" was just a screen -- the real problem is that things like comic books and Mad Magazine and early rock-n-roll made kids question the status quo and held up conventional morality to a mocking light. Made them all into hippies, peaceniks and -- gasp! -- thinkers!
Last thing a 'peaceful' society needs is a lot of uppity kids asking questions....
I have had a constellation of sentiments imputed upon me that do not exist.
blerb
Like the part where you imply, without actually coming out with it, that I also hate America? That part?
You were challenged to support your statement that Ward Churchill actually hates America. You have not yet done so.
That is not a "constellation of sentiments".
I have had a constellation of sentiments imputed upon me that do not exist.
blerb
Like the part where you imply, without actually coming out with it, that I also hate America? That part?
You were challenged to support your statement that Ward Churchill actually hates America. You have not yet done so.
That is not a "constellation of sentiments".
(Snow, get your mind out the gutter)
But that is how I always know where to find it.
I got tired of always having to fish it out with some chewing gum on a stick.
In a society comprising mature people, Ms. Coulter's infantile rantings would be ignored, just as one ignores any six year old engaged in extreme and outrageous behavior solely to get attention.
Sadly, however, our country is comrising 3.5 million extreme cases of arrested development, easily swayed by emotionalism without reason and given to knee jerk reactions to serious problems.
Is it any wonder we have become the New Weimar?
Enjoy your fascism people. you have earned it well.
They want Moore's message controlled, and they can't control it if they put him on teevee. He'll say things they don't want heard.
pie
He did threaten to make a movie about the media's spinelessness int he run up to the war. he ought to team up with Boehlert and MM and make that film.
The Superman thing is talking about the Bizarro World.
Otherwise known as the Repuke Party and its supporters,
Terry C, Politikal Girl
Absolutely! They aren't what they seem. They sold us a pack of lies!
"Harmful to the kids" was just a screen -- the real problem is that things like comic books and Mad Magazine and early rock-n-roll made kids question the status quo and held up conventional morality to a mocking light. Made them all into hippies, peaceniks and -- gasp! -- thinkers!
Last thing a 'peaceful' society needs is a lot of uppity kids asking questions....
Gummo
That's why people like Cal Thomas hate Boomers.
Things should have stayed as they were in the 1950s: women and minorities stayed in their place, and gays stayed in their closets.
Sadly, however, our country is comrising 3.5 million extreme cases of arrested development, easily swayed by emotionalism without reason and given to knee jerk reactions to serious problems.
Only 3.5 million?
Not bad.
Afternoon all. I anyone watching the Ghana v Czech Republic match?
wow!
I got tired of always having to fish it out with some chewing gum on a stick.
Hip waders are trendy where I am from.
All I did was say that if they want to say that somebody hates America, they should say it about somebody who actually does, like Ward Churchill
OK, but all I'm saying is that the question of "America loving" is at root a tactic of deligitimization, and best seen as such. The answer is meaningless, anyway.
I got tired of always having to fish it out with some chewing gum on a stick.
Oh well, chewing gum! And a stick!
You grew up right posh, didn't you?
That's why people like Cal Thomas hate Boomers.
Things should have stayed as they were in the 1950s: women and minorities stayed in their place, and gays stayed in their closets.
Terry C,
What are you implying about Cal Thomas and his Hitler mustache....?
You were challenged to support your statement that Ward Churchill actually hates America. You have not yet done so.
It is obvious to me, that short of finding a quote of him actually saying the words "I hate America", which is not going to happen, I will not convince you of how he feels about this country. If you cannot infer his feelings about this country from all the things that you have apparently heard or read that he has said, then you are either using a different definition of what it is to hate America than I am or you are being deliberatley obtuse.
Either way, I am bored with this now.
Hey David (Austin Tx)!
Yeah! Incredible game! I'm in Boston's North End and you should see the Italian flags flying all over the place. Loud Obbs would be shitting bricks if he were here.
Hundreds of Italians speaking their furrin' language and flying their country's flag IN AN AMERICAN CITY!!
I'm going to the local caffe sporto to watch the game!
Books were written, Congressional hearings were held, sermons were preached.
Gummo
They were forbidden in my house.
ql in ny
Comic books were the reason I learned to read before grade school (I didn't go to kindergarten).
I would read them...and if I didn't know a word, I would look it up.
Then I graduated to reading the newspapers and to books.
When I was in fourth grade, my parents weretold that I was reading at the ninth grade level.
And this was parochial school.
Anyway, I agree that comic books should be banned. So should balloons and toys.
Later, all.
You were challenged to support your statement that Ward Churchill actually hates America.
If Ward Churchill really is a native American, even in part, he might justifiably have reason to dislike certain institutions of the U.S. Government. Even conservatives do that, for less justifiable reasons. Ward Churchill does not hate America. We love America.
U.S. Out of North America!
"The in-your-face, we-are-better-than-everyone-else, blow-down-before-us American brand of "patriotism" (nationalism these days) has always embarrassed me."
Terry C,
Now you know what I have to face every day I walk out the front door. While I'm proud to be an American, I'm quite embarassed to have to explain "why" we do such stupid things and have not the slightest hint of guilt or remorse. Being the world's only, self-proclaimed Super Power doesn't entitle us to be the world bully. But in many people's eye, we are.
There's more to the world than the US. Americans are going to have to recognize that before its' too late.
blerb | 06.17.06 - 1:45 pm
any moderately attentive close reading of this thread would rebut your watb assertions of innocence abused or misunderstood...
He did threaten to make a movie about the media's spinelessness
I wonder how the traditional media would approach such a movie. Would they wisely ignore it? Or play like the RC church (and others) and widely denounce it?
Mike Malloy had a listener on who said at his local energy supplier's website there was blurb which instructed anyone having problems paying their bill to contact some religious organization instead of a welfare office or some other state entity. I wonder if I did that and mentioned that I am an atheist if the religious org would still help me out.
Important advice that could save your life!
What are you implying about Cal Thomas and his Hitler mustache....?
DemByDefault
And his bad rug?
And his voice that makes everything out of his mouth sound like an important proclamation?
And the fact that he thinks the only good TV shows ever made were "Seventh Heaven" and "Touched by An Angel"?
The asshat worked for Jerry FOULwell at the (Im)Moral Majority. That says it all!
This Just In:
Michael Moore is still fat.
And he still hates America.
As you were.
Afternoon, funseekers.
Has anything irksome occurred since
the middle of last night?
Now you know what I have to face every day I walk out the front door.
Do you live abroad? Or are you talking about flag-sweater bumper magnet types?
your watb assertions of innocence abused or misunderstood...
And what nefarious agenda do you suppose that I have, WGG?
Never mind. Don't tell me. I'm outta here.
I wonder how the traditional media would approach such a movie. Would they wisely ignore it? Or play like the RC church (and others) and widely denounce it?
They wouldn't denounce it. They would calmly and reasonably "debunk" it. All very ojectively and regretfully, of course, with a few meaningless concessions that the movie may have a point in a few select bad-apple instances.
Hurray for Ghana!!
There's more to the world than the US.
Anonymous
So many people don't want to hear that.
And it's always the people who have never been 10 miles away from their house.
They know nothing about the rest of the world and they don't care to learn.
I think blerb has been leaving for... at least an hour, yes?
DemByDefault,
Yes, I'm across the pond.
Never mind. Don't tell me. I'm outta here.
blerb
Of course you are, after contradicting yourself several times and getting called on it.
Look, I know you aren't a troll, but if you are going to engage in a discussion then fucking engage in it!
Important advice that could save your life!
Phila
The cartoon figure was wearing a mortar board to make sure the audience knew he wasn't fucking around. BTW, I dig the hell out of YouTube.
WGG, you have first right of telling blerb, "Don't go away mad..." if you feel like it.
Countries where it is illegal to burn the flag....
Cuba, Iran, North Korea... there may be one other... Oh yeah! Maybe here.
The US bullies? Nooooooooooo!!
Iraq VP Asks Bush For Withdrawal Timetable
Meanwhile, a leading Iraqi official has asked the US for a timeline for the withdrawal of foreign troops.
The government says Vice President Tariq al-Hashimi made the request during a meeting with President Bush Tuesday.
In a statement, President Jalal Talabani said he supported Hashimi’s demand.
The Bush administration has firmly rejected calls for a timetable for withdrawal.
Yes, I'm across the pond.
I would be wearing one of those t-shirts that says "I'm sorry my president is an idiot" in every language in the world, every chance I got...
OK, but all I'm saying is that the question of "America loving" is at root a tactic of deligitimization, and best seen as such. The answer is meaningless, anyway.
Thers, Mighty | Homepage | 06.17.06 - 1:52 pm | #
To paraphrase Oscar Wilde, "There are two ways to hate America. One is to hate it, and the other is to love George W. Bush."
My love for America has to do with aspects of its culture and landscape that the Right has very little interest in, if any.
...Hundreds of Italians speaking their furrin' language and flying their country's flag IN AN AMERICAN CITY!!
I'm going to the local caffe sporto to watch the game!
Shaw Kenawe | Homepage | 06.17.06 - 1:53 pm | #
Btw I'm still hoping somebody in Philly will take a videocamera into Geno's and order in Italian. So that the asshole has to either a) piss off every Italian customer by denying service, or b) prove himself a racist hypocrite.
So many people don't want to hear that.
And it's always the people who have never been 10 miles away from their house.
They know nothing about the rest of the world and they don't care to learn.
Terry C, Politikal Girl | 06.17.06 - 1:58 pm | #
Well, it is logical.
The very fact that THEY have never visited other countries proves that these other countries are simply not worth visiting...
Surely someone has said that Moore would look better in a mini skirt.
This is the false equivalence that a completly corrupt media engages in for their masters. I have decided that dividing the electronic media into bad and the tiny handful of good and broadcast and cabloid takes too much time. From now on I will be calling all of it "Republican media" which also takes in many of the larger print organs too. It will save time to exempt the real news media when it is mentioned.
It's all "Republican media" now.
Or are you talking about flag-sweater bumper magnet types?
DemByDefault
The ones made in China?
The ones that ORDER everyone to "support the troops"?
Seen in my neighborhood yesterday: A blue ribbon that said "BRING THE TROOPS HOME NOW!"
Iraq VP Asks Bush For Withdrawal Timetable
I reckon that fellow don't get C-SPAN. Or he didn't have power Thursday and Friday.
rorshach,
Awesome game huh?
Btw I'm still hoping somebody in Philly will take a videocamera into Geno's and order in Italian. So that the asshole has to either a) piss off every Italian customer by denying service, or b) prove himself a racist hypocrite.
fourmorewars
you mean someone hasn't done that already? Shite! I can't get to Philly this afternoon. Gotta watch the US play Italia.
When Ward Churchill gets his own show on MSNBC, maybe I'll feel like worrying about whether his politics are "extreme."
Sheesh.
The very fact that THEY have never visited other countries proves that these other countries are simply not worth visiting...
rorschach |
We have one scumbag troll (shall remain nameless) who calls the rest of the world "third world slums."
Never mind that those countries have been around CENTURIES longer than Murka has!
I would like to bitchslap the lot of them for their ignorance and their pride in that ignorance.
Mike Malloy had a listener on who said at his local energy supplier's website there was blurb which instructed anyone having problems paying their bill to contact some religious organization instead of a welfare office or some other state entity. I wonder if I did that and mentioned that I am an atheist if the religious org would still help me out.
ql in ny
I'm not sure if it is The Salvation Army, I think it might be, they do have a one time thing for energy bills. Once a year, per household, and if you are a Devil worshipper you are still eligible.
I can't get to Philly this afternoon. Gotta watch the US play Italia.
Who ya rootin' for?
If you cannot infer his feelings about this country from all the things that you have apparently heard or read that he has said, then you are either using a different definition of what it is to hate America than I am or you are being deliberatley obtuse.
Full circle. "Criticism" = "hate".
Btw I'm still hoping somebody in Philly will take a videocamera into Geno's and order in Italian. So that the asshole has to either a) piss off every Italian customer by denying service, or b) prove himself a racist hypocrite.
fourmorewars
He's been told by the City to take that sign down.
The government says Vice President Tariq al-Hashimi made the request during a meeting with President Bush Tuesday.
In a statement, President Jalal Talabani said he supported Hashimi’s demand.
And Pony Blow will suggest that they were misquoted but have no idea how they were misquoted.
The very fact that THEY have never visited other countries proves that these other countries are simply not worth visiting...
rorschach
During the 2000 campaign, I got the distinct vibe that Shrub's conspicuous lack of world travel was not a source of embarrassment to him, but rather some sort of badge of honor.
I'm in Texas, as most of you know, and my "Bush is a Punk Ass Chump" bumper sticker was torn from my car twice when I worked on the capitol grounds. And I've been flipped off by guys in trucks a couple times.
But more often than I can count, I've been approached in parking lots and such and complimented.
But then again, this is Austin...
I can't get to Philly this afternoon. Gotta watch the US play Italia.
Who ya rootin' for?
Eli | Homepage | 06.17.06 - 2:03 pm | #
Viva Italia!!
Oh yeah, Red China, it's illegal to burn the flag.
The company we keep. Red China, North Korea, Iran.
Pa. group supports censure of Geno's
The Human Relations Commission also comes out against "Speak English" signs.
By Gaiutra Bahadur
Inquirer Staff Writer
The Pennsylvania Human Relations Commission, silent until yesterday on the "Speak English" signs at Geno's Steaks, says it backs its Philadelphia counterpart's decision to file a complaint against the cheesesteak shop.
The state antidiscrimination agency said, in a statement, that it encourages the use of English as a common language but compared the laminated placards near the shop's takeout windows to discriminatory signs in the country's past.
"Even though this may not have been the intent of Geno's, the presence of the sign harkens back to a time when signs stating, 'no colored allowed,' 'Whites only,' 'no Jews,' or 'no Italians or Irish need apply,' often greeted patrons of public places," said Stephen A. Glassman, the commission's chairman.
Joey Vento, owner of Geno's Steaks, posted the signs about six months ago, when illegal immigration became a hot-button issue. They declare, "This is America," and direct customers to order in English.
On Monday, the independent city Human Relations Commission filed a complaint that Vento's signs violate the city's Fair Practices Act, which prohibits public accommodations from discriminating on the basis of national origin or race.
Vento has said that he has never refused service to anyone on the basis of race or ethnicity. The signs are a political statement protected by the First Amendment, he says.
The Pennsylvania Commission on Human Relations noted that the investigation by the Philadelphia agency is not complete, and that no violation has yet been found. But it said the signs have created such a charged atmosphere in the city that they warrant investigation.
The state agency also monitors bias-related tensions in Pennsylvania.
I don't know the details, but it's a good thing I wasn't in Beaver Creek. I hope if I ever saw Cheney in person, I'd have the guts to yell "Go fuck yourself.
BEAVER CREEK – A man was arrested by Secret Service agents when he tried to approach Vice President Dick Cheney in Beaver Creek Village yesterday afternoon, said Secret Service spokesman Eric Zahren.
Cheney was walking outside when the agents charged with protecting him noticed the man, identified as Steven Howards, who “wasn’t acting like the other folks in the area,” Zahren said.
“His behavior and demeanor wasn’t quite right,” Zahren said. “The agents tried to question him, and he was argumentative and combativ
He's been told by the City to take that sign down.
Terry C, Politikal Girl
Yeah, but look at all the free PR. If only Democratic consultants were that good.
rorshach,
Awesome game huh?
David (Austin Tx) | Homepage | 06.17.06 - 2:02 pm | #
That was the best game I've seen yet, I have to say.
And, given that I almost always root for 3rd World nations against 1st World, I am of course pleased with the amazing outcome.
During the 2000 campaign, I got the distinct vibe that Shrub's conspicuous lack of world travel was not a source of embarrassment to him, but rather some sort of badge of honor.
Max Planck
Oh hell yeah. There's more than one 'winger congresscritter who brags in his stump speech about not owning a passport.
Here's news for the Republican media and the tiny Republican subsidiary that squeeks here, the trolls. Ward Chruchill has a smaller presense on the left than the late Andrea Dworkin had in feminism. You are liars when you pretend they are major figures.
Neo-nazis, Ann Coutler, Rush Limbaugh, Michael Savage, these are people who have been honored by the highest levels of Republican-fascism, Limbaugh was given honors during a house session that I don't believe anyone else ever has been given.
You can't escape your evil, it's sticking to you like epoxy paint.
He's been told by the City to take that sign down.
Terry C, Politikal Girl
Yeah, but look at all the free PR. If only Democratic consultants were that good.
Andy Coulter
His steaks suck.
Pat's are better.
We have one scumbag troll (shall remain nameless) who calls the rest of the world "third world slums."
Well, I need to be a missionary to Sweden then.
And, given that I almost always root for 3rd World nations against 1st World, I am of course pleased with the amazing outcome.
rorschach
I always root for England.
English ancestry and all that.
He's been told by the City to take that sign down.
Terry C, Politikal Girl | 06.17.06 - 2:03 pm | #
Oh, good. Although I wish that'd been tried, anywho.
I watched some of the Ghana-Czech game. Why did the dummy color guy on ABC say that the U.S. 'still has to get past Italy'? That's not necessarily the case.
We tie Italy, beat Ghana (obviously not easy), Italy beats the Czechs, we're in (4 pts. to Ghana's and the Czechs' 3).
Zarquawi replacement - picture released by Pentagon.
Have you all noticed that the new propaganda bogeyman being promoted is actually Johnny Depp dressed as an Arab
"They know nothing about the rest of the world and they don't care to learn."
Terry C,
I understand your point, however, how can Americans expect "others" to be interested in the US and their products if Americans could care less about them?
There are some very interesting things going on overseas that would benefit the average American, if they would just open their eyes.
Trade is just a fancy name for exchanging, thoughts, ideas, concepts and products.
Being an American puts me at a very distinct disadvantage. We aren't thought to be open to new ideas and concepts. We are assumed to insist on doing things "our way".
I know I've gone much deeper than I should and I appreciate your patience, but its a point that needs to be expressed. Americans need to get out off their me-only mentality, especially with the new free-trade era we are now in.
Ann's job is to be a form of insulation. As long as they (the media)have a far right wing screech they can occasionally chastise for going too far, they are empowered to allow damn near any other nonsense on their shows. It's all about "balance".
I'm in Texas, as most of you know, and my "Bush is a Punk Ass Chump" bumper sticker was torn from my car twice when I worked on the capitol grounds. And I've been flipped off by guys in trucks a couple times.
Like I said, it's bad enough that these people's lives are so empty that they have to live through someone else.
But through a loser like Bush?????
Damn!
Unspecified owls
Unspecified owls
During the 2000 campaign, I got the distinct vibe that Shrub's conspicuous lack of world travel was not a source of embarrassment to him, but rather some sort of badge of honor.
Max Planck | 06.17.06 - 2:04 p
Funny thing, he'd been overseas before election. Visited China while dad was ambassador, and IIRC he and the LauraBot visited Italy.
I think what pisses me off about that, and others who go overseas and don't actually 'learn' or experience anything, is that there are so many of us who would love to have that travel/living opportunity, and these folks just waste it.
We tie Italy
I seriously doubt that will happen. The US is about to his its ass handed to it.
Eli,
I'm rooting for Italy because the US already has its fair share of "world championships."
Being an American puts me at a very distinct disadvantage. We aren't thought to be open to new ideas and concepts. We are assumed to insist on doing things "our way".
My motto is: the day has been wasted if I haven't learned something.
I love being able to be able to say: "I didn't know THAT!"
The US is about to his its ass handed to it.
rorschach
I hope so!
And Italy would be motivated to win, for fear that Ghana would beat us J(games are being played at the same time)and earn a higher seeding with 6 pts. to their 5.
I think what pisses me off about that, and others who go overseas and don't actually 'learn' or experience anything, is that there are so many of us who would love to have that travel/living opportunity, and these folks just waste it.
Buckeye, Dealer of Rare Coins |
Oh, and GOTTA love the ones who go to another country and expect the folks there to speak English....just to accommodate THEM.
The Ugly American
And what nefarious agenda do you suppose that I have, WGG?
i wouldnt accuse you of having an agenda...inasmuch as that would imply you had a fucking chinchilla of sentience, and evidence of that, or of any shred of intellectual honesty would be hard to show...
.
But then again, this is Austin...
rorschach
The People's Republic of, no less.
As to the World Cup, the US needs to win. If only for the morale boost a win over Italy would provide.
Americanocentric Map of the world.
I wish I could hace a Philly Cheesesteak delivered to CA.
when Shrubb went to China, he spent most of his time watching movies at the embassy. I think there's a story that Big Bad Bar had to more or less make him go sightseeing one day.
had a fucking chinchilla of sentience
Now that's hilarious, WGG! You are the new Norm Crosby!
I seriously doubt that will happen. The US is about to his its ass handed to it.
rorschach | Homepage | 06.17.06 - 2:12 pm | #
Maybe this year's version is that much inferior to last time's. But last time's was good enough to give the eventual runners-up a scare. The Mexican network showing that game gave the German goaltender their man-of-the-match award, indicating their opinion that our guys gave him all the work he could handle.
Anyway, since our guys are underdogs in this sport, I tend to decouple them in my head, from the jingoism that saps my enthusiasm at other times.
(Like the Stanley Cup finals, where some inbred dumbshit was waving the American flag around late in Game 2. As his Carolina Canadians-Russians-etc. + a couple Yanks were beating the Canadians-Russians-etc. + a couple Yanks from Edmonton.)
"I love being able to be able to say: "I didn't know THAT!"
Terry C,
You'd fall in love with Europe then! They definitely do things quite different than what Americans would expect, but the outcomes are the same and at times better than one would expect. It's a whole different way to approach a problem, resolve the issue, and satisfy everyone in the process. You just have to shed off your American perceptions and accept what you are given and work with it. You get the same result, just in a different fashion that what you expected. And sometimes easier.
This thread has completely fucked up my tentative plans for the day!
But before I scramble to reassemble the shattered remains of the day and venture out into the latest heatwave, I'll observe that I agree that the Geno's Steaks nonsense has given Joe Vento far too much attention and importance.
A co-worker frequently gives me the Philly "Daily News", which I accept out of politeness and skim during the first few stops of my El commute. I admit that reading that proletarian rag has intensified my despair for Amerika. Joe has acquired a vast claque of admirers, including more than one letter-writer complaining about voice-mail presenting a Spanish-speaking option.
Why should I have to press a button to hear English?-- on that level.
However, while I think that individuals and interested organizations have a right, and perhaps even an obligation, to publicly rebuke and repudiate Joey's ham-handed, confused, and bigoted tactic, I don't think he ought to be legally sanctioned. He's already playing the martyr role to the hilt, and (like mAnn), the attention only ratchets up the nonsense.
Vento is a dope, but it grates to see him, in effect, lifted onto the shoulders of his cheering admirers and milking it for all it's worth.
had a fucking chinchilla of sentience
Now that's hilarious, WGG! You are the new Norm Crosby!
Andy Coulter | 06.17.06 - 2:18 pm | #
Maybe it got gerbiled in translation.
Ward Churchill doesn't hate America, he hates what's being done in America's name, at home and abroad, and who can blame him? American Exceptionalism has been a national disease since the Industrial Revolution, and the Ugly American has been a worldwide cliché for 70 years or more. Loud, ignorant, badly-dressed, pushy tourists from the states are only tolerated for their money, which street gangs rip them off for consistently, with little law enforcement involvement. I wonder why. There's much to love about America, and much to question about the American Corporate State, so eager to push us back to the 19th century wage-slave, child-labor robber baron days. Ward Churchill should be on the TV every time Ann Coulter is; that's some balance. If there's anyone hating on America, it's Coulter.
... Limbaugh was given honors during a house session that I don't believe anyone else ever has been given...
olvlzl | Homepage | 06.17.06 - 2:07 pm | #
Rev. Moon?
Maybe it got gerbiled in translation.
fourmorewars - 2:23 pm
i'm incapybara of further comment
Damn, ronjazz:
You ALWAYS say what needs to be said...and you always express it so well.
That's a real gift!
A co-worker frequently gives me the Philly "Daily News",
The Daily News has always been a joke.
My parents always called it the "Dirty News."
My ex always called it the "Daily Snooze."
"I love being able to be able to say: "I didn't know THAT!"
Terry C,
You'd fall in love with Europe then! They definitely do things quite different than what Americans would expect, but the outcomes are the same and at times better than one would expect. It's a whole different way to approach a problem, resolve the issue, and satisfy everyone in the process. You just have to shed off your American perceptions and accept what you are given and work with it. You get the same result, just in a different fashion that what you expected. And sometimes easier.
Anonymous
My daughter has a long distance relationship with a British fella - and she's been to England twice. Hates to come home.
As for shedding my American perceptions, don't worry. I would not act like The Ugly American.
Bigots on parade:
http://www.philly.com/mld/philly.../
printstory.jsp
AO, have you appealed that ruling from before ??
Has anyone said that Michael Moore is fat yet? Sorry I don't have the patience to go through 600 or so posts. I just wanted to make sure someone said it because i know that any wingnuts who are trolling here would probably feel out of sorts unless someone pointed that out. They always do though ...
ronjazz
trying to defend ward churchill is a waste of pixels. sorry. the guy really IS full of shit despite the fact that wingnuts love to trot his name out in situations like this ...
Moore may be fat. Coulter is simply a formulaic robot who rings a bell that makes pod people salivate. I couldn't care less about her peroxide blondeness, her long legs, her mini-skirts, the characterizations of her face and throat, her sexual proclivities or the gender tags applied to her.
Set all that aside and Moore appears to be fat and regularly correct. Coulter still appears to be an asshole with a bad case of diarrhea that sickens all who willingly ingest it.
And ya have to wonder why there's so many masochists in the Republican Party willing to do so. It's truly a mystery only a scatologist could properly define.
Eventually Ann will come to terms with having been sexually abused by her father at a young age. I suspect when she makes peace with that fact she'll quiet down and go away for good. Meantime, just ignore her like everyone else does.
Eventually Ann will come to terms with having been sexually abused by her father at a young age. I suspect when she makes peace with that fact she'll quiet down and go away for good. Meantime, just ignore her like everyone else does.
I don't think we should waste our time debating Ann Coulter vs. Michael Moore. It's obvious she's an insane hate-monger.
Here's what we SHOULD be doing instead: we should hang her around the necks of the Republicans, in the same way they refer to people as being part of the "Michael Moore wing" of the Democrats when they're trying to think of a smear.
Call them "Ann Coulter Republicans." Make them repudiate her or or disavow her TOTALLY. (They typically won't.) So when they say, Well, I disagree with some of the things she says, but she has a point that [FILL IN THE BLANK] ... NAILED!!!! An Ann Coulter Republican!
In the same way, we should make the most of the fact that 5 senators (including Ted Stevens of Alaska) defended the Iraqi plan of amnesty for insurgents who had killed Americans, not Iraqis. These are "Iraqi troop-killer amnesty Republicans" or whatever is more concise.
Challenge them to repudiate the plan. And if they do, challenge them to say why Bush HASN'T. When they don't answer, ask how they can continue to support a president who doesn't support the troops, as against the Iraqi amnesty plan.
STOP DEBATING COULTER!!!!! Use her and this amnesty plan against the Republicans. It's exactly what they would do against any Democrat.
And the main thing is to get this echoed through the media. If this just goes by, they'll get away with their treasonous actions without anyone even raising an objection.
Also, when we nail someone as an "Ann Coulter Republican," simply reel off a couple of her worst quotes, such as the one about the 9/11 widows.
Ann is at best "the Ward Churchill of the Right" She just has a better publicist and agent.
They are both carbon based lifeform, bipedal and completely indistinguishable from on another, so long as you you are blind, deaf and living as a brain in a tank.
He's batshit insane. That's a given.
However, even when he's frothing at the mouth the points he makes are valid. - JR
That's why I don't even get the Coulter=Churchill comparison -- Churchill has some valid points.
They of course both have a right to their opinions. Granted Coulter is a venemous lying rightwinger getting attention through voicing outrageous spew. The issue is WHY she isn't being boycotted en masse as we all did with STOP SINCLAIR?? If sponsors and networks got a bold and organized response against giving her a forum, it certainly would limit the poison she spreads. When Swiftboat was heavily touted by Sinclair, they were seriously affected and curtailed. Website should go up. Why hasn't this happened?
To re ipsa: Moore may be fat. But just watch Coulter's Adam's Apple. I have yet to see a woman with an Adam's Apple.
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