I'MMA LET YOU FINISH
primero?
segundo?
heading for third!
diving towards home!
safe at the plate!
alright, that was fun.
More posts about Bai Ling, less about Matt Bai!
that's all I got. gotta go walk the dog.
I like John Edwards. I also like his haircut.
Jonah Goldbergism on the march
Moderator Matt Bai reliably suggests that one cannot want to withdraw from Iraq while simultaneously supporting some sort of measures in Darfur.
Of course, because they're the exact same situations!
You're a moron, Matt.
Why? Conceptually, I get it. But why? Let's scale the fish one. side. at. a. time.
from below (because it is important):
As Bobby said above, Mr. Potato Head is by far the most progressive candidate. I just don't see someone that far left getting elected president.
yes, but do YOU want him to be?
if everyone voted on that basis, instead of for whom they THINK is most pablum - i meam, palatable, perhaps he would.
don't be a coward, vote your conscience.
since there are no Arabs in the Congo I guess we shouldn't really care about that genocide, should we?
These great thinkers puzzle me greatly.
Hillary lost me when Celine Dion was brought up.
I saw Matt Bai in that "get to know yer Kossaks" video, I immediately thought what an idiot fratboy who thinks he's hot shit.
while simultaneously supporting some sort of measures in Darfur.
"some sort of measures?"
since there are no Arabs in the Congo I guess we shouldn't really care about that genocide, should we?
That's not the point.
Let's work toward ending the Darfur mess, but let's get the hell out of Iraq yesterday!
The Darfur clustersnowball is a different animal than the pre-emptive, immoral, illegal war for oil.
if everyone voted on that basis, instead of for whom they THINK is most pablum - i meam, palatable, perhaps he would.
don't be a coward, vote your conscience.
By the time my (Texas) primary comes around, my vote is useless. I'll only get to make a statement vote. Meaningless in its entirety.
I can't believe the Yearly Kos
Keeps functioning so highly,
For hasn't it been ruined by
Commando Bill O'Reilly?
I thought by now, with loofas drawn
On all the Jews and goyim,
He'd had his way, for didn't he
Swear Wednesday to destroy 'em?
John Edwards would win Virginia. I have my doubts about Hillary's chances anywhere in the south.
Why? Conceptually, I get it. But why? Let's scale the fish one. side. at. a. time.
Which situation does the UN see fit to resolve first?
Which situation does the UN think is the just one for the international community to actually be involved in?
The Darfur clustersnowball is a different animal than the pre-emptive, immoral, illegal war for oil.
Vicki, Who ♥ Al Gore
Exactly. Where's the profit motive?
By the time my (Texas) primary comes around, my vote is useless. I'll only get to make a statement vote. Meaningless in its entirety.
smalfish,bikerider | 08.04.07 - 3:06 pm | #
then you might as well at least make a statement.
By the time my (Texas) primary comes around, my vote is useless.
Bush makes me in the mood to bash Texas.
The Kenosha Kid | Homepage | 08.04.07 - 3:07 pm | #
You had me at Bai....
O'Really = Pow Ting
one cannot want to withdraw from Iraq while simultaneously supporting some sort of measures in Darfur.
Like most people, I supported some sort of measures in Iraq.
Those measures, however, didn't include destroying Iraq, torturing people, and building military bases there.
Matt Bai deserves a bad case of botulism. Idiots consume our air, make country weak.
I have my doubts about Hillary's chances anywhere in the south.
bill
I'd hit it. Wait, I'm in Ohio...
And, if you say that you like martinis, you have to drink daquaris, too.
If you have a cat, you have to also have a dog, gerbils, a boa constrictor, and a rabbit.
If you think that Paris is nice, you have to also visit Detroit, Newark, and Biloxi.
That's not the point.
200,000 killed in Darfur: WE MUST ACT NOW!
2 million killed in the Congo: whatever!
Apples and basketballs,Matt.
I'd hit it. Wait, I'm in Ohio...
lipreader | 08.04.07 - 3:08 pm | #
South of Ho Humbus and the banjos play loudly.
Well, what Matt Bai fails to understand is that our presence in Iraq is the result of an utterly illegal and immoral war of aggression.
This sets it apart from any other intervention by the US in recent history. The pretext of a legal, morally supportable action had substance in the others, but absolutely none in Iraq, as we know for a fact that Bush and Cheney wanted to invade Iraq and were searching, desperately, for a pretext to do so and found it in the 9/11 attacks, which had nothing at all to do with Iraq but that didn't stop them from portraying it that way.
pigboy--my comment about Edwards using private insurers to help get universal care--giving choice to citizens and their choice will take us to single payer, perhaps with private boutique coverage (plastic surgery, etc, uberwealthy things).
http://www.haloscan.com/
comments...=53655#10308267
then you might as well at least make a statement.
Most certainly.
John Edwards would win Virginia. I have my doubts about Hillary's chances anywhere in the south.
I dunno about that. When I'm in the South, all the ladies are showing some tit crack.
South of Ho Humbus and the banjos play loudly.
Gilly Gonzylon
I'm soaking in it now.
If you think that Paris is nice, you have to also visit Detroit, Newark, and Biloxi.
Hecate, Runnymeade Conspirator
and if you like sleeping with women, you really should try men. and goats.
Of course, this speaks volumes about the world's policy towards the African continent, as a whole.
We only act when it involves white folk (re: South Africa).
HRC will win in Florida, she has opened up here lead significantly. what do you expect from a state that elects a quisling like Bill Nelson?
As long is there is one war in the world, we cannot be at peace with any country. Or something.
jawbone | 08.04.07 - 3:09 pm | #
Elective surgery is one thing but for common healthcare we need Universal Healthcare.
HRC will win in Florida, she has opened up here lead significantly. what do you expect from a state that elects a quisling like Bill Nelson?
mrs. ibrahim al-jafaari
Massive voter fraud.
Zap -
From the last thread - A-Rod's only 32 and has 500 four baggers? Damn.
I'm glad because Bonds is a bad actor. A cheating, criminal bad actor.
mrs. ibrahim al-jafaari ~
See this line from above:
Well, what Matt Bai fails to understand is that our presence in Iraq is the result of an utterly illegal and immoral war of aggression.
I'm not saying don't do anything about Darfur, but since we caused the fucking nightmare in Iraq, I think we need to tend to that first. Would that our resources and our insight have been available to stop the genocide in Darfur. But the powers that be didn't see it that way.
hell, i live in fucking GEORGIA. i'll still vote for the best candidate, even if mine is the only vote he gets.
of course, i would boycott if appropriate, but when the majority don't vote anyway that seems to go unnoticed.
HRC will win in Florida, she has opened up here lead significantly. what do you expect from a state that elects a quisling like Bill Nelson?
Well, the alternative was that dizzy set of pontoons, Katherine Harris.
I dunno about that. When I'm in the South, all the ladies are showing some tit crack.
Stunt Woman
Ah, a strategic element that had escaped my keen eye. I will have to dedicate myself to digging deeper into the cleavage factor.
Elective surgery is one thing but for common healthcare we need Universal Healthcare.
pigboy
I'd skip the surgery if they'd just give me the drugs.
HRC will win in Florida, she has opened up here lead significantly.
she the nearest we've got to katherine harris.
Everyone gets Murdoch Money one way or another.
I'm glad because Bonds is a bad actor. A cheating, criminal bad actor.
billy b - west coast blues | 08.04.07 - 3:11 pm | #
"Barry Bonds, meet Sammy Stocks"
Heh.
and if you like sleeping with women, you really should try men. and goats.
dirk gently,
been there, done that, and baaaahaaaahh
One of the reasons we can't act in Darfur is our entire motherfucking Army is tied down in Iraq because El Fucktardo has issues with his father.
A-Rod's only 32 and has 500 four baggers?
He'll have 1000 by the time he's 64!
From the last thread - A-Rod's only 32 and has 500 four baggers? Damn.
He's that old?
But yeah, he's the youngest to ever reach 500.
He'll hit 800...I guarantee it.
NTodd, nice post about DK.
Vicki, I agree we need to STOP the Fucking War! now. I'm with you on that.
all I'm saying is take a look at who the loudest cheerleaders are for the Darfur Campaign, and the political rationales they use to demand action to "end genocide in Darfur."
their silence about the Congo is telling, as is their silence about getting out of Iraq.
If you think that Paris is nice, you have to also visit Detroit, Newark, and Biloxi.
You can visit Detroit. I promise not to shoot you.
Ah, a strategic element that had escaped my keen eye. I will have to dedicate myself to digging deeper into the cleavage factor.
bill | 08.04.07 - 3:11 pm | #
That's why Bill Richardson has a chance.
"The Porpoise Song" rocks.
Why is Matt Bai from the lying New York Times a moderator at this forum?
Since when did he become a member of the netroots?
But yeah, he's the youngest to ever reach 500.
He'll hit 800...I guarantee it.
Zap Rowsdower, Own3r
He beat Bonds by a few months.
gawd i'm all giddy..... standing on rubble and dead bodies again!
http://thumbsnap.com/v/AgFkTffh.jpg
Since when did he become a member of the netroots?
The Chimp's Underwear | Homepage | 08.04.07 - 3:14 pm | #
When he was bought in to play the part.
Is this "debate" getting any mainstream coverage?
Well, the alternative was that dizzy set of pontoons, Katherine Harris.
true, which is why when he had a 20 point lead Senator Quisling showed his true colors and ran Right.
Gravel turns a cheap shot into a plea for public financing. Well done.
Why is Matt Bai from the lying New York Times a moderator at this forum?
Since when did he become a member of the netroots?
The kossacks are trying v. hard to show that they are not dfhs, the way that some other blog communities coughherecough are.
Has that fucker left my fair, disaster-strewn city yet?
I'm betting he's already in bed...
dfhs ?
Rudi Julie Annie
Oops. That was I.
Oy. Bai is doing "raise your hand" shit.
standing on rubble and dead bodies again!
And playing dress-up which, Goddess knows, he loves.
Jump, George, Jump!
I think the worst thing about the Bush era has been the intentional, willful stupidity, on the part of so many, in the service of unnamed, yet blatantly obvious objectives.
Rilo Kiley rock.
He's that old?
But yeah, he's the youngest to ever reach 500.
He'll hit 800...I guarantee it.
I hope he stays healthy. If so, he should easily hit 800.
dfhs ?
"Raise your hand
You know why now
raise your hand
If you're bi now
Raise Your Hand
Raise Your Hand
If You're Pure"
standing on rubble and dead bodies again!
And playing dress-up which, Goddess knows, he loves.
Jump, George, Jump!
Hecate, Runnymeade Conspirator | Homepage | 08.04.07 - 3:17 pm | #
He's missing his bullhorn..
Haloscan hates me.
Dirty Fucking Hippies.
dIRTY
fUCKING
hIPPY
s
gravel's heart is in the right place, but his positions on the flat tax and english as the official language show a weak grasp of certain unavoidable side affects.
dennis has considered things far more completely, imho.
He's missing his bullhorn..
pigboy
He had it inserted during his polyp pulling.
heh.
Just scored a Lazy Boy in perfect condition for $40.
dfhs ?
Hecate, Runnymeade Conspirator | Homepage | 08.04.07 - 3:18 pm
Don't fear head stains ?
Flat. Tax. Sucks.
He had it inserted during his polyp pulling.
lipreader | 08.04.07 - 3:19 pm | #
Maybe that explains why dicks head is up there all the time.......
Just scored a Lazy Boy in perfect condition for $40.
ql-was in NY
He got a sistah?
Most of the hippies I knew weren't dirty, actually. They showered, used Dr Bronner's soap and like that.
As for fucking, well, it was known to happen from time to time. SOme of them even made love.
A flat tax dosen't just suck. It's criminal.
It allows the freeloading trash at the top to continue to reap the benefits of this society without payin in proportion to their gain.
Just scored a Lazy Boy in perfect condition for $40
Wow. How'd you do that?
BTW, did anyone here ever buy one of those massage chairs that they sell at places such as Sharper Image? If so, were you happy w/ it? I'm kind of thinking about it, now that the basement's refinished.
Flat. Tax. Sucks.
lipreader | 08.04.07 - 3:19 pm | #
it has its attractive side - but totally impractical. as you find as soon as you start to try and overcome its faults.
the 'secondary' candidates really are first rate
He had it inserted during his polyp pulling.
lipreader | 08.04.07 - 3:19 pm | #
Maybe that explains why dicks head is up there all the time.......
pigboy
I understand JimmyJeff is credited with initial discovery on the polyp farm.
God I wish somebody would ask if they would kick Lieberman out of the party.
Most of the hippies I knew weren't dirty, actually. They showered, used Dr Bronner's soap and like that.
the peppermint is overly tingly. be careful what you wash.
Just scored a Lazy Boy in perfect condition for $40.
I was thinking about this kind of stuff the other day. It's just flat out amazing how much stuff devalues once we take it out of the store. I got to thinking how if I had to file for bankruptcy how much I would have to sell and how little I would actually get for stuff I paid a fortune for. For instance, I have a few computers that I paid quite a bit for, but if I had to sell them, I might get 50 or 100 bucks for one or two of them.
"They got a room service menu for food and drink
A porcelain throne and an aluminum sink
Two big pillows to rest my head
A magic fingers and a king-size bed
Put in a quarter
Turn out the light
Magic fingers makes ya feel alright
Uh feel alright
Feel alright
Magic fingers makes you feel alright"
http://www.trap2.com/list_j/
jimm...oom_lyrics.html
God I wish somebody would ask if they would kick Lieberman out of the party.
Jim | 08.04.07 - 3:21 pm | #
Now now. It would send the AIPAC rulers into a frenzy.
BTW, did anyone here ever buy one of those massage chairs that they sell at places such as Sharper Image? If so, were you happy w/ it? I'm kind of thinking about it, now that the basement's refinished
Geez, Hecate, I sat in one the other day and figured that the pain it evoked would elicit my social security number, every crime I have ever committed, every lustful thought I have ever had about ANYONE, and anything else nefarious I have every thought of: pure fucking torture.
I have a few computers that I paid quite a bit for, but if I had to sell them, I might get 50 or 100 bucks for one or two of them.
smalfish,bikerider | 08.04.07 - 3:22 pm | #
sell them to someone with a dinghy.
God I wish somebody would ask if they would kick Lieberman out of the party.
Jim
I thought the Democratic voters of CT did that?
My comment mentioned boutique insurers could remain, pigboy--but citizens, consumers would choose universal single-payer if offered as an alternative to private insurance. Edwards removes the argument that's he's against market choice by, simply, offering it: he believes people will choose the gov't program, not the privates.
That's my point. Boutique insurance will be permitted, and why not? It's still there in Britain and some other European countries, iirc.
Edwards is not trying to do a Mitt Romney, using vouchers, etc., to get everyone into private insurers
And that's why I like his program.
BTW, did anyone here ever buy one of those massage chairs that they sell at places such as Sharper Image? If so, were you happy w/ it? I'm kind of thinking about it, now that the basement's refinished.
You've got a basement ?
It allows the freeloading trash at the top to continue to reap the benefits of this society without payin in proportion to their gain.
There you go. I likes me some righteous anger ATDH.
The thing that pisses me off are the middle class republics I know that get all angry about the freeloading bastards having to pay taxes.
"They got a room service menu for food and drink
A porcelain throne and an aluminum sink
Two big pillows to rest my head
A magic fingers and a king-size bed
Put in a quarter
Turn out the light
Magic fingers makes ya feel alright
Uh feel alright
Feel alright
Magic fingers makes you feel alright"
Love me some Steve Goodman!
peppermint is overly tingly.
She sure was.
DWD,
Really? The times that I've tried them, I've never wanted to get up. I'm just wondering if they break down soon or anything.
You've got a basement ?
Sadly, yes.
peppermint is overly tingly.
She sure was.
spinoza Neque
Dood!! I thought she and Marcy were exclusive.
Hecate,
Maybe it is just MY sore back. Iknow that I could not rise fast enough because it HURT LIKE HELL!
A flat tax dosen't just suck. It's criminal.
A pure flat tax would decrease the rich folks ante, and put a lot of non-rich in dire straits.
I like when the "massage fingers" thump your upper back.
Love me some Steve Goodman!
DWD - Reaching Tinder Point | Homepage | 08.04.07 - 3:24 pm | #
I didn't realize that was a Goodman song. The only one I've heard sing it was Mr. Buffet.....
Goodman died too early
You've got a basement ?
Sadly, yes.
Hecate, Runnymeade Conspirator
i've got one too, nothing sad about it.
stays cool in the summer, warmish in the winter with very little effort.
You've got a basement ?
Sadly, yes.
Hecate, Runnymeade Conspirator
Sadly? On a 200 degree day like to day I'm very happy to pass my time in the basement here at lipreader Manor.
As for fucking, well, it was known to happen from time to time. SOme of them even made love.
ProfWombat
San Francisco was nice like that.
This candidate forum is incredible.
It's actually exhilarating. I feel like I'm watching a big sea change in the way these people have to compete for our votes.
Never much of a hippie myself, though I agree with much of the hippie world view; 'laid back', 'groovy' and such descriptors do not accurately reflect the Wombat reality, sadly, and keeping it simple isn't one of the things I do best, even when it'd be a hell of an improvement...
Dood!! I thought she and Marcy were exclusive.
It was the 60s
A pure flat tax would decrease the rich folks ante, and put a lot of non-rich in dire straits.
MP
Would destroy the middle class and the housing industry.
lipreader, i'll take my coke in the basement.
don't you just love audience participation
Just put on Surfer Rosa.
What. A. Fucking. Great. Album.
Would destroy the middle class and the housing industry.
Fuck the proles, let them sleep under collapsing bridges.
Really? The times that I've tried them, I've never wanted to get up. I'm just wondering if they break down soon or anything.
Hecate, Runnymeade Conspirator
We have one of those big heavy massage chairs that reclines and heats. it does a fair job. Those new pads that attach to chairs are actually much nicer IMHO. They aren't all that expensive either.
sell them to someone with a dinghy.
Exactly.
Bai: "I'm losing control"
Humpy Teh Clown, you never had it.
Just put on Surfer Rosa.
My Velouria....
i've got one too, nothing sad about it.
stays cool in the summer, warmish in the winter with very little effort.
Yep. I'll like mine a lot better once I move the gutters to opposite end of the house.
Don't fear head stains ?
MORE COWBELL!
dirk, you can have something stronger if you'd like. The basement is stocked.
Well, it's sad because last winter I had some water leaking into it. Spent lots of $$$$$ on french drains, sump pumps, etc. This spring, bought a generator so that if we have a hurricane and get lots of rain and the power goes out, my sump pumps won't go out. Then, last month, spent more $$$$ refinishing the basement, since they'd torn off the 1960s paneling in order to install the french drains and sump pumps.
I almost never use the basement.
A pure flat tax would decrease the rich folks ante.
MP
not necessarily, since there would be no loopholes. the question is, would things like stocks and other investment instruments be taxed?
not that i'm for a flat tax. but there are arguments in its favor.
Wow. How'd you do that?
Used furniture store, not an antique store.
Just can't bring myself to spend $600. for a chair even though we can afford it. And I guess the reason we could afford it is because we've spent our lives not buying new.
I almost never use the basement.
Hecate, Runnymeade Conspirator | Homepage | 08.04.07 - 3:28 pm |
You should start a White Stripes tribute band down in there...
Fucking...making love.
Yes, please.
We have one of those big heavy massage chairs that reclines and heats.
i'm married to a massage therapist.
I almost never use the basement.
Hecate, Runnymeade Conspirator
I recommend staying away from pool tables.
Spent lots of $$$$$ on french drains, sump pumps, etc. This spring, bought a generator so that if we have a hurricane and get lots of rain and the power goes out, my sump pumps won't go out. Then, last month, spent more $$$$ refinishing the basement, since they'd torn off the 1960s paneling in order to install the french drains and sump pumps.
I almost never use the basement.
Can I rent it? All I have is a bible and a Jesus Christ nightglow dildo.
-Monica Goodling
not that i'm for a flat tax. but there are arguments in its favor.
dirk gently, sociopathetic©
Ah, that's the key. What exactly is being taxed, and at what rate?
Well done.
Yes, please.
res ipsa loquitur |
[rinses off the dr bronners]
That Cramer video is a bit disconcerting.
But boo-hoo, Bear Stearns. Boo-hoo!
Not.
i'm married to a massage therapist.
dirk gently, sociopathetic© | Homepage | 08.04.07 - 3:30 pm | #
Ah, finally.... Do you get massages from her?
Never much of a hippie myself, though I agree with much of the hippie world view; 'laid back', 'groovy'
I imagine that's because you were studying hard so you could blow the curve for the rest of us.
[winky wink]
Good afternoon, fellow freethinkers!
That question, "Will you have a White House blog?"
I would have said, "Yes, but I am not taking comments!"
I didn't realize that was a Goodman song. The only one I've heard sing it was Mr. Buffet.....
Goodman died too early
pigboy
Jimmy Buffett actually did quite of few of Steve Goodman's songs. That is a good thing for both of them. Cliche's, This Motel Room, and Banana Republics come to mind.
And yes, he died way too young.
not that i'm for a flat tax. but there are arguments in its favor.
It's hard to see how it is fair to tax Bill Gates and an elementary teacher at the same rate.
The one good thing was last month, along w/ everything else, I got them to rig the sump pumps so that they're now pumping into a rain barrel. Which I use to water the herb beds. So in maybe a thousand years or so, the savings on my water bill will pay for the whole thing.
Basement gardens are nice.
Ah, finally.... Do you get massages from her?
Gilly Gonzylon | 08.04.07 - 3:31 pm | #
her clients always say "your husband is the luckiest man in the world" but she complains because i never want a massage.
i explained that when she touches me, i don't want it to ne "therapy"
Good afternoon, fellow freethinkers!
Terry C - Wingnuts R WATBs
So I don't get to have a good afternoon?
Damn.
It's hard to see how it is fair to tax Bill Gates and an elementary teacher at the same rate.
spinoza Neque lugare, neque in | 08.04.07 - 3:32 pm | #
What if they were both 15%
The Fed can't lower rates, thanks to dick's selling off our economy to China. China likes our high rates, plus lowering rates could also cause a run on our already cheap dollar.
Everyone who is now losing their homes due to higher than expected rate re-sets, you have dick to blame.
A pure flat tax would decrease the rich folks ante, and put a lot of non-rich in dire straits.
MP
Would destroy the middle class and the housing industry.
lipreader
Hey, that's the Repugnican way.
ProfWombat | 08.04.07 - 3:26 pm | #
Are you the doctor? (I get my profs mixed up around here) If so, why would a medical school want to know where my daughter's father went to high school? Someone here opined it was to know if she was an immigrant.
I would have said, "Yes, but I am not taking comments!"
res ipsa loquitur
because you would be Teh A-List of A-List bloogers, and you would hate your commenters.
Basement gardens are nice.
bub
A-fucking-men.
So in maybe a thousand years or so, the savings on my water bill will pay for the whole thing.
Hecate, Runnymeade Conspirator
Is your water volume metered. If so how much do you use?
.
i explained that when she touches me, i don't want it to ne "therapy"
dirk gently, sociopathetic© | Homepage | 08.04.07 - 3:32 pm | #
@echo on, dude !
billy b: got a smattering of a's, b's and c's in college. Got a passing good education, but it lacked for rigor and discipline, and I was rarely a threat to curves from above. And was quite sloppy about homework, class attendance and like that for months at a time, as I tried my best to grow up. You can get away with that in some majors, but not in physics and math, unless you're wired for it in a way that I'm not. (This is NOT false modesty.)
It's hard to see how it is fair to tax Bill Gates and an elementary teacher at the same rate.
spinoza Neque lugare, neque in
You nailed it. The real tax burden is not felt on income, but on wealth.
So I don't get to have a good afternoon?
Damn.
lipreader
Well, good afternoon to you too, my friend.
What if they were both 15%
Gilly Gonzylon
Because that would be an increase for the teacher. And for me! Fuck that.
It's hard to see how it is fair to tax Bill Gates and an elementary teacher at the same rate.
spinoza Neque lugare, neque in | 08.04.07 - 3:32 pm | #
What if they were both 15%
Sorry. I believe in pre-reagan progressive taxes. No one needs an income at the level of what CEOs and Gates make.
Hillary has to be more defensive in this forum, but she is batting back the offense pretty well, IMHO.
It's hard to see how it is fair to tax Bill Gates and an elementary teacher at the same rate.
spinoza Neque lugare, neque in |
well, the tax gravel is talking about is on consumption, not income. and there would be some base level at which there is no tax - to cover necessities. how that would work is the most complex part.
but think - instead of getting tax breaks for building a $50M house, gates would have to pay a federal sales tax on that house. that's the idea, anyway.
ql: jeez, got me on that one, unless it's a window into questions of class. They didn't ask me that one...
Did it get any better on here last night?
I was on about 8:00 and I left because the troll infestation was horrendous.
Well, that and because the heat in my living room was oppressive and I needed to escape up into the A/C.
Just put on Surfer Rosa.
What. A. Fucking. Great. Album.
Zap Rowsdower, Own3r
Ain't it the truth. Even thought they made some very worthy subsequent efforts, I think it was pretty much downhill for the Pixies after that one.
"What if they were both 15%"
Bog is in the details. what if they were - and I still got to pay all the payroll taxes and gates doesn't? do I lose my deductions, which matter more to me than him?
every time I've looked at a sample flat tax plan it always seem to look like Reagan's tax cuts - the rich get boodle and I get 1.52 a week, while my state taxes go up because the feds have to slash "fat" from the budget.
Is your water volume metered. If so how much do you use?
Yes. I'm not sure, I'd have to look at my last bill. The last few summers, which have been v. dry, I have used a shitload watering the garden. Otherwise, not too much; it's just me and the cat. Load of dishes in the diswasher two or three times a week, two or three small loads of laundry, a shower on the days when i don't shower at the gym. But I use a lot in June, July, and August on the garden.
Until you figure out how much federal tax you actually pay, don't fall for that 15% bullshit. mrs. lip and I both make more than the average household and we don't net out anywhere near 15% income tax.
Because that would be an increase for the teacher. And for me! Fuck that.
lipreader | 08.04.07 - 3:34 pm | #
Sorry. I believe in pre-reagan progressive taxes. No one needs an income at the level of what CEOs and Gates make.
spinoza Neque lugare, neque in | 08.04.07 - 3:34 pm | #
I'm trying to understand how it wouldn't help the ones in the middle.
res: well, suffice it to say that I read your post...
Bush makes me in the mood to bash Texas.
Vicki, Who ♥ Al Gore
The weather been bashing the crap outa it lately. Omens, anyone?
That was me, QL. Maybe I'm just suspicious like that, or not.
I just decided I must have a wireless laptop of some sort--humidity's lifted hereabouts in Northern NJ, temp is mid-80's, breeze is soft and caressing....
Any suggestions for a deck laptop/notebook?
Cheap?
I want to go to Gravel's room. The guy is wacky.
I'm trying to understand how it wouldn't help the ones in the middle.
Gilly Gonzylon
they'd lose their deductions.
"i don't want it to ne "therapy""
it's all therapy.
Hey, I just read the nasty shit that Jerkoff Jonah Goldberg said about Canada.
What an asshole!
Any country that Doughy Pantload, Fucker Carlson and Bill O'Wanker hates is okay in MY book.
billy b: got a smattering of a's, b's and c's in college. Got a passing good education, but it lacked for rigor and discipline, and I was rarely a threat to curves from above. And was quite sloppy about homework, class attendance and like that for months at a time, as I tried my best to grow up. You can get away with that in some majors, but not in physics and math, unless you're wired for it in a way that I'm not. (This is NOT false modesty.)
Sounds a lot like my trip thru school.
As for busting the curve, I was referring to the erudite nature of your posts that often send me to the dictionary or the Google to figure out what you're talking about.
Did atrios pick the bumper music for the feed?
Hillary has to be more defensive in this forum, but she is batting back the offense pretty well, IMHO.
She's wicked smart on her feet. That woman has more brain power in her little finger than 100 George Bushes.
Breakout sessions with each candidate? Dennis K has to go back to House for votes.
I wish I were there!
Fantastic hearing the give and take, but kinda irritating to miss so much from transmission breakups.
billyb: bless your generous heart...
I just decided I must have a wireless laptop of some sort--humidity's lifted hereabouts in Northern NJ, temp is mid-80's, breeze is soft and caressing....
Any suggestions for a deck laptop/notebook?
Cheap?
jawbone
I gotta get me one of those, too!
Bill Gates paying several hundred million dollars in taxes has dramatically less of a household impact than a teacher paying serveral hundred.
You can get away with that in some majors, but not in physics and math, unless you're wired for it in a way that I'm not. (This is NOT false modesty.)
ProfWombat | 08.04.07 - 3:34 pm | #
She's wicked smart on her feet.
She sure is much better in a panel discussion format than she is when she's playing to the galleries.
Cheap?
jawbone | 08.04.07 - 3:38 pm | #
What's your budget?
You can get away with that in some majors, but not in physics and math, unless you're wired for it in a way that I'm not. (This is NOT false modesty.)
ProfWombat | 08.04.07 - 3:34 pm | #
Even if you're wired for it at a certain point you just have to do some work. My younger girl was quite surprised by calculous. She had never brought a math book home from school and always scored between 98 & 100 on the regents. She decided she didn't like calculous.
damn tags
But I use a lot in June, July, and August on the garden.
Hecate, Runnymeade Conspirator |
Our borough charges a fixed amount for the first 40,000 gallons per year. After that you pay by actually usage. I'm often not home for spells of 3 or 4 days and don't have a cat. I typically use 19,000 and get charged for 40,000.
.
I'm trying to understand how it wouldn't help the ones in the middle.
Gilly Gonzylon
The decrease in revenues would lead to fewer governmental programs and services.
Well, that was fun to watch.
Hillary is good on her feet. She's naturally intelligent and has had god-knows-how-much practice whacking back at everything that's been thrown at her.
I have no doubt that she'd make a more than capable president.
"don't fall for that 15% bullshit."
had a libertarian explain it to me - 15% on everyone was 'fair" ok, everyone loses their deductions which is fair, cause gates loses his deductions too!!
reminds me of the manager who told me that employment at will was "fair" because i could quit whenever i wanted to.
Even if you're wired for it at a certain point you just have to do some work. My younger girl was quite surprised by calculous. She had never brought a math book home from school and always scored between 98 & 100 on the regents. She decided she didn't like calculous.
Calculus and organic chemistry wash out a lot of premeds.
http://www.salescircular.com/ is really good for looking at sales in your area. They scour the local papers and post specials going on in your area.
every time I've looked at a sample flat tax plan it always seem to look like Reagan's tax cuts
that's because you are looking at flat INCOME tax, as opposed to flat CONSUMPTION tax.
one thing is, income can be shielded. it's harder to shield consumption, becuase the tax is collected at point of sale.
actually, i would like to see a graduated consumption tax, with rates higher for luxury items (i.e. houses a certain amount over the median price, gold, etc) and none on necessities (say, everything covered by food stamps to begin with?) - but what do we do about financial instruments, income producing purchases, etc? it's just a lot more complicated than gravel's simple plan of a universal rebate to pay for the very basics.
flat income tax is a very, very, very bad idea that should not even be considered.
Who is pimpimng the flat tax? It is by its very nature regressive.
ql: an experience I had in college with analysis and abstract algebra, and with calculus of a more theoretical sort that I took in college. Had to learn how to work in math; it felt strange...
You just can't take away the mortgage deduction. It would benefit like 8 people, and devastate 200 million.
Calculus and organic chemistry wash out a lot of premeds.
spinoza Neque lugare, neque in | 08.04.07 - 3:42 pm | #
That's because the classes are taught by people one step more understandable than Marcel Marceau.
Don't these people have enough to contend with without Monkey King promising to give them "aids"?
http://www.comcast.net/news/inde...l&
cvqh=itn_bush
I typically use 19,000 and get charged for 40,000.
That's crappy. I should pay more attention to the bill. I pay one bill every quarter that covers water and trash pick up, but I know that I pay more for the summer months due to increased water usage. Even w/ the 75 gallon rain barrel, and using the grey water from my showers, I'm still buying water from the county nearly every day for the garden. I have a small yard, but a lot of thirsty plants that I'm not going to let die and it has been just insanely dry.
Oh, QL, I thought of another reason. One of the universities my daughter applied to had a statistic in their glossy brochure like, "18% of our students are first-generation college attendees." Maybe they get some sort of props if an applicant is the child of a non-highschool graduate.
I donno. It's a puzzlement.
Uncle Blodge, I had a bunch of retard freepers arguing with me one time. I asked them all to calculate what percentage of their income they actually ended up paying in Federal Income Tax.
They all came back and said the same thing, that it wasn't fair that the rich had to pay more. They were willing to give up their mortgage deductions (the largest government social program in existence, by the way)to help out Bill Gates and the "late" Ken Lay.
If there's truth to Nietszche's claim that what doesn't kill you makes you stronger, Hillary could hold up an aircraft carrier while dancing a jig...
I have no doubt that she'd make a more than capable president.
Yup. She's not high on my list, but I wouldn't cry into my beer if she were elected.
Fuck you, Bill O
http://www.comcast.net/news/inde.../04/
731465.html
and using the grey water from my showers,
Hecate: Was that difficult/expensive to rig up?
That's because the classes are taught by people one step more understandable than Marcel Marceau.
Gilly Gonzylon |
OK class, let's assume you're trapped in a transparent cube whose edge dimensions equal x...
.
I'm not saying don't do anything about Darfur, but since we caused the fucking nightmare in Iraq, I think we need to tend to that first. Would that our resources and our insight have been available to stop the genocide in Darfur. But the powers that be didn't see it that way.
Vicki, Who ♥ Al Gore
Our.compassion.is.utterly.gone.
If there's truth to Nietszche's claim that what doesn't kill you makes you stronger, Hillary could hold up an aircraft carrier while dancing a jig...
Yet he also said that if you stare into the abyss too long...
Hecate--They just raised our water/sewer rates here--used to be about $60-odd base rate a quarter, went up to about $80, now it's $115, base, before going over 10,000 gallons of water usage. The amount for the base rate also went down, but I don't know what it was before.
I never used to go above the base except in gardening season (which doesn't go into the sewer system, of course), but now I do regularly with no change in usage.
Sewer is that highest part of the charge--and there's no way to know how much one is using during a quarter until the bill comes, no meters are visible. So, it's hard to judge how to conserve.
but I wouldn't cry into my beer if she were elected.
NTodd, Foaming At The Mouth
i would.
but i like salty beer.
Ain't it the truth. Even thought they made some very worthy subsequent efforts, I think it was pretty much downhill for the Pixies after that one.
I'd say that they peaked with Doolittle.
Their plateau, if you will...
"You just can't take away the mortgage deduction. It would benefit like 8 people, and devastate 200 million."
--MP
Probably not. But we bought a house whose interest rates were never enough to deduct. Never did us any good.
Nice dilemma.
The ten year old has a fixation on a marketing scheme that is terrific. Webkins is a unique idea where stuffed toys are sold with a id code that allows you to access a web site that is very feature filled. The prices vary from ten to twenty dollars.
The ten year old already has six of these things ( I don't know why). They happen to be very big sellers and are very difficult to come by. It turns out that today the distributor called to tell the ten year old that they just got a large shipment in and of course she wants to go right out and buy another one.
Am I wrong to deny her?
"flat CONSUMPTION tax."
so - a national sales tax or something?
as soon as you put the word flat into a sentence with tax I reach for my ass, cause I know I'm about to get fucked.
graduated consumption - ok. but that's not a flat tax.
also - since the modern economy is built around consumption rather than production (or so I recall - if i am incorrect please correct) taxing consumption would probably bring on a recession in short order.
Hillary is good on her feet. She's naturally intelligent and has had god-knows-how-much practice whacking back at everything that's been thrown at her.
I have no doubt that she'd make a more than capable president.
People in the rest of the world, including Africa, really like her. And, I imagine that she could handle Puttie Pute and China a hell of a lot better than Bush has managed.
billyb: bless your generous heart...
Thanks, but it be the troof.
She's not high on my list, but I wouldn't cry into my beer if she were elected.
NTodd, Foaming At The Mouth
Hey, whoever the Democrats nominate in 2008 I will support.
I'd like Gore to run, but if not....
Any of the Democratic field beats the shit out of the pack of losers the GOP is offering.
smallfish,
Would she do some chores around the house in order to "earn" it?
taxing consumption would probably bring on a recession in short order.
Uncle Blodge, Urban Teacher
At the very least an increase in the size of the black market.
Probably not. But we bought a house whose interest rates were never enough to deduct. Never did us any good.
mer
You own real estate with a note, and it was still better for you to take the standard deduction?!
Good grief, you're lucky.
And, I imagine that she could handle Puttie Pute and China a hell of a lot better than Bush has managed.
Hecate,
;
One of the many idiocies in that Anne Marie Slaughter piece was that even us DFH lefties have to admit that Condi Rice has been very effective in Europe and Asia.
I think she assumed facts not in evidence.
People in the rest of the world, including Africa, really like her. And, I imagine that she could handle Puttie Pute and China a hell of a lot better than Bush has managed.
Hecate, Runnymeade Conspirator
I just saw a poll....I'll have to find the link...that surprised me.
Hispanic voters prefer Hillary to Bill Richardson.
Or, since it's summer,
would she practice her times tables or read a few books to her younger sibs or write a story about her experience afterwards?
There is this reverance for percentages in the flat tax, and I am not sure where it comes from. It is not based on any universal natural law. Lots of phenomenon are based on percentages, but lots are also based on log and exponential scales. Framing income taxation as a flat tax is as linguistically and conceptually corrupt as framing inheritance tax as a death tax. Both are appallingly cruel attempts to overtax working people while coddling the wealthy. A few of the wealthy know thing (Buffet), but you are not going to hear many of the Wal-Mart children argue against a flat tax or for a death tax. They are greedy sons of bitches who have offloaded much of taxation to others. IIRC, when the income tax was first implemented, only the top few percent were taxed AT ALL.
consumption taxes are even more regressive than flat income taxes. There is nothing at all wrong with progressive taxation of income. We just need to adjust the slope of the curve at each end.
utr: the Republicans have shredded both the domestic social contract and that underlying international relations. Making money in an environment quaintly described as 'free trade' simply doesn't suffice...
Hispanic voters prefer Hillary to Bill Richardson.
Terry C
Hell, the nigras prefer her to Hussein Obama! /freeper
Condi Rice has been very effective in Europe and Asia.
"Effectiveness" and "KindaSleazy Rice" are not compatible.
I'm reliving my youth from the 90s by listening to Helmet.
Man, I'm a nerd.
Hell, the nigras prefer her to Hussein Obama! /freeper
lipreader
And not even Repukes prefer the people that the freepers like.
I don't support US intervention in Darfur. Not because I don't think nothing should be done for those poor people, but because the US is too stupid to help. Our intervention will likely only increase the misery and suffering. We're a nuclear-armed terror state. What good can we do?
"They all came back and said the same thing, that it wasn't fair that the rich had to pay more."
My old hometown is kind of unique - it was a religious colony. There was no school tax, as all the kids went to the church school.
the place was a breeding ground for freepers. they used to get very upset that one of the local rich folk (worth in the tens of millions - used to own a car dealership among other things) had to pay school taxes. fair is a funny word.
also - since the modern economy is built around consumption rather than production (or so I recall - if i am incorrect please correct) taxing consumption would probably bring on a recession in short order.
Uncle Blodge, Urban Teacher | 08.04.07 - 3:46 pm | #
you'd have to ask an economist - too bad we don't know any.
actually, gravel calls it a "fair" tax, not a "flat" tax, but yeah, that's what he means - national sales tax. i'm not sure how shifting from income to consumption would bring about a recession, since the reason for having money is to ultimately buy things.
anyway, i'm not sold on it - i just think it has some attractive aspects. what we have now has been getting progressively (hah!) worse, thanks to bush, maybe it's a good time to just start over.
Man, I'm a nerd.
Zap Rowsdower, Own3r
I'm listening to Dream Theater. How nerdy is that?
That's because the classes are taught by people one step more understandable than Marcel Marceau.
Hah! I was reading "A Beautiful Mind" and was struck by the sheer arrogance of Nash. Then I realized that it matched about half the math department here.
Calculus and organic chemistry wash out a lot of premeds.
spinoza Neque lugare, neque in | 08.04.07 - 3:42 pm | #
My older girl is applying to med school. She gave up her dream of going at 18 when she took organic chemistry at Johns Hopkins. After maturing a bit she was able to ace it and the MCATS. Between that and her three years in Africa with the Peace Corps, I figure she has a good chance in getting in.
and using the grey water from my showers,
Hecate: Was that difficult/expensive to rig up?
Easy to rig up; I just save the water in the tub and then dip the watering can into it, carry the watering can out to the gardenias, pour, go back into the bathroom, dip the watering can into the tub, carry the watering can out to the gardenias . . . . I tell myself that it's good exercise.
I don't support US intervention in Darfur.
Who does?
This is a job for a responsible organization...the UN.
ql: I'd guess she'll find a place, and good on her...
I don't support US intervention in Darfur. Not because I don't think nothing should be done for those poor people, but because the US is too stupid to help. Our intervention will likely only increase the misery and suffering. We're a nuclear-armed terror state. What good can we do?
Mike
No oil in Darfur?
No way for Halliburton to make any money?
We shouldn't be stopping rapes because boys will be boys?
I'm all for a progressive income tax wherein the "patriots" who have benefited the most from living in the greatest nation on earth give the most back to her. Amen.
d then dip the watering can into it, carry the watering can out to the gardenias, pour, go back into the bathroom, dip the watering can into the tub, carry the watering can out to the gardenias
i'd invest in some vinyl tubing and a siphon bulb. you could drain the tub right into a rain barrel.
Hah! I was reading "A Beautiful Mind" and was struck by the sheer arrogance of Nash. Then I realized that it matched about half the math department here.
spinoza Neque lugare, neque in
Oooh, NOT a NICE person, that dude.
My older girl is applying to med school.
ql, that's great. You must be soooo proud. I have a dear friend whose daughter just finished her residency. Lots of work, but what could be more important or more fulfilling than being a healer? Good vibes going her way.
Would she do some chores around the house in order to "earn" it?
That goes without thinking around here. But yes, she's in the process now. But she's usually very good about doing her chores, and she'll be paying for the thing with her own money.
Would it be wrong to deny her this "thing"?
. I tell myself that it's good exercise.
Hecate
....and certainly not expensive!
One of the many idiocies in that Anne Marie Slaughter piece was that even us DFH lefties have to admit that Condi Rice has been very effective in Europe and Asia.
Well, to be fair, she hasn't started a war with Russia yet. That's got to count for something.
Well, to be fair, she hasn't started a war with Russia yet. That's got to count for something.
NTodd,
Finding ponys in the Bush administratin is just a matter of recalibrating your metrics to fit a new paradigm.
It's funny -- with the way the damn U of Manitoba hothouse economists micromanage things here, we have the closest thing to a "flat (income) tax" you're going to find in the Western world, I think, here in Soviet Canuckistan. For example, our top tax bracket -- someone making $70K/a pays the same tax rate as someone making $70M/a pays the same tax rate as someone making $7B/a.
Fair? Fuck no. If we had a sane tax policy in this country, people making $70K/a (double the median income about) would be kicked down several brackets, and the 200 people at the very top would be paying about 85%.
So far I've managed to avoid becoming too terribly angry about the assessed rates by virtue of the fact that I'm po' enough never to have incurred a tax payment at tax time, and I get a quarterly refund on the Grab & Steal Tax (which is kinda funny, since I seldom buy anything GST-eligible anyway)...
I'm listening to Dream Theater. How nerdy is that?
You, sir, are not nerdy in my opinion.
"i'm not sure how shifting from income to consumption would bring about a recession, since the reason for having money is to ultimately buy things."
because things now cost more. sure people would still buy things but it would change the amount they bought. More money would go into savings or just get spent on the black market as lipreader said.
I could be wrong but it seems to me a national sales tax would be the opposite of an incentive to spend. spending drops and a recession happens.
I'm not an economist. if anyone knows this stuff by all means correct me.
OY, nerdy Kossacks singhing Happy Birthday to You to Obama
not sure whether to call him Barack, Senator, or Senator Obama.
Condi Rice has been very effective in Europe and Asia.
Well, compared to the job she did as NSA, I suppose.
There is nothing at all wrong with progressive taxation of income. We just need to adjust the slope of the curve at each end.
if only it were that simple. there is also for example overhead (the irs, h&r block), inaccuracies and recordkeeping requiremnt, the ability to cheat, the ways deductions and rules are set up to encourage/discourage behaviour, etc etc etc.
I'm all for a progressive income tax wherein the "patriots" who have benefited the most from living in the greatest nation on earth give the most back to her. Amen.
lipreader | 08.04.07 - 3:53 pm | #
AMEN. income or consumption, the goal should be the same. it's only fair.
...continuing with the 90s rawk theme:
Fugazi. The first emo band.
Sorry. I believe in pre-reagan progressive taxes. No one needs an income at the level of what CEOs and Gates make.
spinoza Neque lugare, neque in | 08.04.07 - 3:34 pm
This is something that Gates BFF Warren Buffet agrees with. He thinks the current tax system screws the average person.
My older girl is applying to med school. She gave up her dream of going at 18 when she took organic chemistry at Johns Hopkins. After maturing a bit she was able to ace it and the MCATS. Between that and her three years in Africa with the Peace Corps, I figure she has a good chance in getting in.
Good for her! I took orgo and biochem as a graduate student at Hopkins. I thought I was obsessive until I realized the undergraduate next to me went home every night and typed up his class notes.
and she'll be paying for the thing with her own money.
Would it be wrong to deny her this "thing"?
I admit that I'm fuzzy on just what she's buying, but if it's her allowance money and it's not immoral or bad for her, I'd let her go ahead and buy it. Son used to save his allowance money to buy GI Joes. Drove me fucking nuts and I probably still have holes in my tongue from biting it. But eventually he got over it.
because things now cost more. sure people would still buy things but it would change the amount they bought. More money would go into savings or just get spent on the black market as lipreader said.
1) Raise the marginal for any income to 60%or more, with no deductions except for what you give to charity. Assess no income tax at all on any income up to the 20th percentile. Have a negative income tax for people below the 5th percentile.
2) Eliminate the capital gains tax for a second residence, jack it up for everything else, but assess it on inflation-adjusted values.
3) Jack up taxes on all fossil fuels, but not any other consumable.
I thought I was obsessive until I realized the undergraduate next to me went home every night and typed up his class notes.
Um, well, just as a matter of curiosity, and all, well, um, never mind.
~Blushes and runs from the room~
You, sir, are not nerdy in my opinion.
smalfish,bikerider
Nerdy is good.
I admit that I'm fuzzy on just what she's buying, but if it's her allowance money and it's not immoral or bad for her, I'd let her go ahead and buy it. Son used to save his allowance money to buy GI Joes. Drove me fucking nuts and I probably still have holes in my tongue from biting it. But eventually he got over it.
You, my dear, are a pillar. Thank you for your thoughts.
because things now cost more. sure people would still buy things but it would change the amount they bought. More money would go into savings or just get spent on the black market as lipreader said.
(stupid tags. when will i learn to preview?)
yes, but income is now proportionally higher. savings? what are you saving for? i mean, yes it is an attitude adjustment but that's about it. if we could make "tax" an act of patriotism instead of a dirty word - the balance doesn't change.
it's all just a net result game anyway.
OY, nerdy Kossacks singhing Happy Birthday to You to Obama
not sure whether to call him Barack, Senator, or Senator Obama.
HUSSEIN!
A flat tax dosen't just suck. It's criminal.
It allows the freeloading trash at the top to continue to reap the benefits of this society without payin in proportion to their gain.
Apprentice to Darth Holden
An evasion of their proportionally greater responsibility/respect for the rest of us. Greed and comfort clouds their perspective. And pure equality scares the crap outa them.
A store near us limits Webkins purchases. Turns out there's a secondary market in Webkins on e-bay, and adults are scarfin' them up...
I thought I was obsessive until I realized the undergraduate next to me went home every night and typed up his class notes.
Um, well, just as a matter of curiosity, and all, well, um, never mind.
I used to do that to review.
1) Raise the marginal for any income to 60%or more, with no deductions except for what you give to charity. Assess no income tax at all on any income up to the 20th percentile. Have a negative income tax for people below the 5th percentile.
Raise it to the 10% percentile, and I agree.
Afternoon, rational people.
3) Jack up taxes on all fossil fuels, but not any other consumable.
blerb
I assume you are claiming terbacky isn't consumable?
Hecate is evil
August 4th Birthdays:
http://www.infoplease.com/birthd...rthday/August-
4
Happy Birthday, Senator Obama.
There is no need to raise taxes for any infrastructure repair.
Did we raise taxes for the Iraq War?
Would it be wrong to deny her this "thing"?
smalfish
Yes. Not every acquisition is immoral, and not every acquisition should be turned into a lesson on the issues marteriality (probably not a word). I have lots of useless stuff that I bought just because I wanted it and it gave me pleasure. We all do.
A store near us limits Webkins purchases.
Yep, I think the ten year old is limited to two per purchase. Apparently these things are all the rage today.
Hecate is evil
She's a good witch.
Gomez: in fact, Bush lowered taxes. Tom DeLay astonished the world with the observation that it's never more crucial to lower taxes than during wartime...
legalize pot and tax it.
legalize cocaine and tax it more.
A flat tax dosen't just suck. It's criminal.
It allows the freeloading trash at the top to continue to reap the benefits of this society without payin in proportion to their gain.
Apprentice to Darth Holden
An evasion of their proportionally greater responsibility/respect for the rest of us. Greed and comfort clouds their perspective. And pure equality scares the crap outa them.
under the radar
Y'all are just promoting class war.
freepers, trolls and rightards
She's a good witch.
NTodd, Foaming At The Mouth
Zod called me a flying monkey.
.I assume you are claiming terbacky isn't consumable?
lipreader
It occurred to me that I neglected that additional exception in my post. Terbacky, Licker, and most of all Wacky terbacky, which would of course be legal.
Zod called me a flying monkey.
Gomez
Oh, THERE'S a great judge of character.
There is no need to raise taxes for any infrastructure repair.
Did we raise taxes for the Iraq War?
Wars for some, bridges for others!
The Beatles wrote a song called "Taxman", there's one for you nineteen for me. Yeah, that was your million and oneth "taxable" dollar. Not your first.
So many people over estimate how much they actually pay in federal and state income tax.
"income is now proportionally higher."
I want to see the details before i admit this is true. tax me on food and rent and clothes and is my income higher? I doubt it.Bet the top 1%'s would be.
"savings? what are you saving for?"
are you saying you only save to spend? I am not sure i agree.
"i mean, yes it is an attitude adjustment but that's about it."
disagree. it's also just an attitude adjustment to allow same sex marriages. I do not think that'll be easy. What progress we've made in the area of gay rights took decades. also - what damage to the economy while we're adjusting our attitudes?
freepers, trolls and rightards
Terry C - Wingnuts R WATBs | 08.04.07 - 4:04 pm | #
i think it would be fun to put all the stuff in the middle of the country, have all the people line up along the coast, and then yell "GO!"
legalize pot and tax it.
legalize cocaine and tax it more.
dirk gently, sociopathetic©
Legalize prostitution and tax that, too.
http://www.haloscan.com/
comments...=53655#10308267
BushCo is arguing that if he had the powers then that he wants now, US might have been able to rescue to three US soldiers kidnapped (one later found dead) in Iraq.
Say wha???
WASHINGTON: When three soldiers were abducted in Iraq in mid-May, U.S. government lawyers began drafting emergency warrants to try to monitor communications that could lead to the suspected captors.
The Bush administration and its allies, The Associated Press has learned, have argued that the legal work ate up precious hours because of an odd twist to a U.S. surveillance law. One of the soldiers was later found dead in the Euphrates River, and an al-Qaida offshoot has said the others are dead as well.
Normally, warrants would not be needed to eavesdrop on foreigners in Iraq or elsewhere. However, since a secret federal court ruling was issued earlier this year, the Bush administration believes the government must obtain legal approval to listen in on foreign suspects when their conversations cross into the extensive U.S. communications network.
The administration wants to amend the law to allow such monitoring without delay. Many Democrats agree that adjustments are needed, but skeptics say the soldiers' story is being misused.
ya think?
"Gomez: in fact, Bush lowered taxes. Tom DeLay astonished the world with the observation that it's never more crucial to lower taxes than during wartime..."
--ProfWombat
I can honestly say my taxes did not get lowered.
legalize pot and tax it.
legalize cocaine and tax it more.
Now, you're just being rational...
legalize cocaine and tax it more.
dirk gently, sociopathetic©
Meh. I think some drugs really should be illegal. I've seen a lot of people get all fucked up by teh sneet.
Someone here a few days ago suggested eliminating income tax under $70,000 for singles and $90,000 for couples, then ramping up taxes for the wealthy. IIRC, he or she said that a democratic candidate could win on that alone. Too bad we instead have then suggesting that bombing Pakistan might be in order. Clinton the First may have been right. It's the economy stupid. All Bush the Worse has done is get the American populace to ignore the economy because he has leveraged fear and prejudice to levels unseen since Sodom and Gomorrah.
Bridges: We're building them over there so we can't afford to over here.
Wow, it's kind of like Second Life for kids. G/Son is too young for this. Here's his new favorite game. Nonna takes two toys, one soft and fuzzy and one hard (a stuffed duck and an block). Nonna puts both inside a box and says, "G/Son, can you pick the block?" G/Son feels around inside box w/o lookng and pulls out block. Nonna yells, "Yeah!" and claps. Lather, rinse, repeat. Good for hours.
mer: estate taxes, capital gains, others impacting mostly folks with lots of money...
legalize pot and tax it.
legalize cocaine and tax it more.
dirk gently, sociopathetic©
Legalize prostitution and tax that, too.
Terry C - Wingnuts R WATBs
Party at my place!
I propose a graduated tax based on how sucky your baseball team is.
The suckier it is, the less taxes you have to pay.
Tom DeLay astonished the world with the observation that it's never more crucial to lower taxes than during wartime...
ProfWombat
Delay = one of THE great intellects of our time.
I don't think it's just a coincidence that Obama's first name sounds like Osama, and that Hitlery's first name sounds like Hitler. It's proof that Islamofascism exists.
I can honestly say my taxes did not get lowered.
mer | 08.04.07 - 4:06 pm | #
I went back and calculated my federal income taxes as a percentage, it's been pretty steady since the mid nineties
http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2...ence-
Powers.php
Link for the BushCo lies about FISA law and needing new powers to have listened in on Iraqi conversations.
Wow.
He's already had a jacket made for bridge collapses.
I've never seen such a gregarious abuse of clothing options.
We try to save money against catastrophic events, and for when the business runs slow. At this point, the savings have disappeared. We're running on day to day again. Scary shit, let me tell you. Massive overhead and no backup. Fuck!
Someone here a few days ago suggested eliminating income tax under $70,000 for singles and $90,000 for couples
That sounds great, but I don't think that works given our current median income. I also think that tax brackets should be indexeds to percentile rank and not hard numbers. It would make it necessary to rewrite the laws less frequently.
Wars for some, bridges for others!
Zap Rowsdower, Own3r
But ne'er the twain shall meet.
How are things going in the Twin Cities, Zap?
"Someone here a few days ago suggested eliminating income tax under $70,000 for singles and $90,000 for couples, then ramping up taxes for the wealthy."
the sheeple have been so conditioned that taxes are bad that the repugs would trot out "they're raising taxes" and the masses would swallow. the track record of the sheeple for voting against their interests is what leads me to say this would not be a winner and it might be fatal. logic and a lot of the great unwashed masses do not mix.
legalize cocaine and tax it more.
dirk gently, sociopathetic©
Meh. I think some drugs really should be illegal. I've seen a lot of people get all fucked up by teh sneet.
blerb
The same could be said about alcohol.
And we saw how well Prohibition worked.
I went back and calculated my federal income taxes as a percentage, it's been pretty steady since the mid nineties
Jim
Was it greater than 15%?
Alternate proposition:
You get a tax credit for every liberal talk show host in your radio market.
I want to see the details before i admit this is true. tax me on food and rent and clothes and is my income higher? I doubt it.Bet the top 1%'s would be.
well, again, i'm not promoting the idea, just saying there are valid reasons to explore it as an option. no income or payroll tax? the first X dollars of rent/utilities exempt? lots and lots of details - as i said, it could get pretty complex - but it could also be far less complex than our current code, more easily enforceable (how could ntodd avoid it? he'd have to be self sufficient!) and potentially more fair.
mostly i just want people who get the most benefit of living and working here to contribute the most to maintaining the country as a whole.
Lather, rinse, repeat. Good for hours.
Hecate,
Taught the younger kid how to make change. Here's a quarter A, what can you give me to equal it. I think she was five. She would run upstairs and count pennies or nickles or dimes or a combination and come back down. We played that came for hours and hours. Sometimes I think it is just the attention they want.
"I propose a graduated tax based on how sucky your baseball team is.
The suckier it is, the less taxes you have to pay."
I'm a Phillies fan! you may all mail me tens and twenties! OOOORRRAAAH!
He's already had a jacket made for bridge collapses.
I've never seen such a gregarious abuse of clothing options.
Zap Rowsdower, Own3r
Big Dog even dressed better than he did.
Prostitution should definitely be legalized. That would put a lot of sociopathic pimps out of business, which is a very good thing.
He's already had a jacket made for bridge collapses.
I've never seen such a gregarious abuse of clothing options.
Zap Rowsdower,
our macho preznint and our popenfurher seems very pre-occupied with accessorizing.
ProfWombat, we have no estate taxes, capital gains or anything outside of income from work (well, two very modest CD we put money into for emergencies). My taxes stayed the same after Bush's tax cuts as they were before.
Prostitution should definitely be legalized. That would put a lot of sociopathic pimps out of business, which is a very good thing.
blerb
Exactly - the "girls" could get along fine without them.
How are things going in the Twin Cities, Zap?
Pretty calm, right now.
Obviously, the Chimpster was in town this morning; paying his typical lip service to what happened.
Zapette's at her second jewelry sale today in South Minneapolis. And I've been packing...and booked a moving truck!
Fleet as can be...
Legalize prostitution and tax that, too.
Terry C - Wingnuts R WATBs
no tax, it's not fair to pay twice to get fucked.
Exactly - the "girls" could get along fine without them.
Terry C - Wingnuts R WATBs | 08.04.07 - 4:11 pm | #
hear hear.
How long before car seats double as flotation devices?
"Prostitution should definitely be legalized."
I think the unintended consequences of legalizing prostitution could be very interesting.
.The same could be said about alcohol.
And we saw how well Prohibition worked.
Terry C - Wingnuts R WATBs
Blow is much easier to get addicted to than alcohol, and much easier to die from. I would rather see heroin be legal than blow.
"Someone here a few days ago suggested eliminating income tax under $70,000 for singles and $90,000 for couples, then ramping up taxes for the wealthy."
I don't mind paying taxes, but I don't think I should have to pay more taxes than someone who makes 100 times more a year than I do.
I also don't think my taxes should go towards illegal invasions and occupations of countries who did not attack us.
Bai: "I'm losing control"
Been chanting for years for that, for the sake of all the control freaks on the planet...
Blow is much easier to get addicted to than alcohol, and much easier to die from. I would rather see heroin be legal than blow.
Don't mind my jaw on the floor.
Michael Irvin, who snorted more coke than Domino makes sugar, gets in the Pro Football HOF, but Pete Rose still can't get into Cooperstown.
Blow is much easier to get addicted to than alcohol, and much easier to die from. I would rather see heroin be legal than blow.
blerb
Hey,don't get me wrong. I've never done drugs. I never "gotten" drugs.
But this war on drugs bullshit....what a joke.
"mostly i just want people who get the most benefit of living and working here to contribute the most to maintaining the country as a whole."
--dirk gently,
bad dirk bad.
These are the people who make our country great. They should pay no taxes at all.
Not that they do anyway.
Meh. I think some drugs really should be illegal. I've seen a lot of people get all fucked up by teh sneet.
blerb
i don't want the govt mandating that i cannot get myself all fucked up if i want too.
it's none of their business.
i would want the fda to monitor blow quality, though.
disclaimer: i do not do any drugs other than alcohol. but that is MY choice, imho.
the sheeple have been so conditioned that taxes are bad that the repugs would trot out "they're raising taxes" and the masses would swallow.
Uncle Blodge, Urban Teacher | 08.04.07 - 4:09 pm
I'm not so sure this time, Uncle B. That bridge collapse and the frenetic inspections of bridges and overpasses all over the country has done a lot to point out what rotten shape our infrastructure is in.
Now, if people would only make the connection between the hundreds of billions of dollars being poured into Iraq and the current state of our roads, highways, freeways, etc., life could become a wee less complicated.
Blow is much easier to get addicted to than alcohol, and much easier to die from. I would rather see heroin be legal than blow.
blerb
I make a distinction between "legality" and "fitness for sale". I think Tobacco, alcohol, coke, pot, heroin, etc. should be legal.
But you shouldn't be able to sell them. Grow/brew/cook your own.
Michael Irvin, who snorted more coke than Domino makes sugar, gets in the Pro Football HOF, but Pete Rose still can't get into Cooperstown.
Gomez
But MICHAEL played on AMERICA'S TEAM!!!!
(Rolls eyes)
Meh. I think some drugs really should be illegal. I've seen a lot of people get all fucked up by teh sneet.
Do you know if they would have not gotten fucked up otherwise? Lots of drugs float through colleges for example. Some students seem destroyed by them. Others seem to get immunized. I am not sure that laws account for any significant amount of the variance.
Obama refers to last night's Senate vote as "embarrassing"
ql,
I'm going to remember that one; keeping the money upstairs so they have to run up and down the stairs is an added bonus. Of course, you're right, it's the attention that they want. Wait until you get to this grandma stuff, it's the most fun in the whole world.
This just in:
Zap's switching to 70s new wave to help hasten the onus of packing.
Gang of Four, MFers!!
drugs are legal as long as you're white and employed.
.Don't mind my jaw on the floor.
smalfish,bikerider
You don't have to take my word for that. Just because alcohol currently kills more people than cocaine doesn't mean that cocaine isn't more dangerous. The percentage of people who use cocaine is much, much lower than the percentage who use alcohol.
disclaimer: i do not do any drugs other than alcohol. but that is MY choice, imho.
dirk gently, sociopathetic©
Making the stuff legal doesn't mean people are going to want to do it.
Anymore than sex education makes people promiscuous.
as i said, it could get pretty complex - but it could also be far less complex than our current code, more easily enforceable
That's not the flat tax the idiots like Armey are pushing. They want the calculation done on the back of a post card.
Obama refers to last night's Senate vote as "embarrassing"
Jim | 08.04.07 - 4:16 pm | #
the black plague was mildly disturbing.
Not once, never have I've known a politician get elected by promising to raise taxes. The cry is always that there is fraud and waste in government and programs can had by cleaning it up. Well, that ship sailed about ten years ago and we are in a severe pickle.
drugs are legal as long as you're white and a right wing Republican whore with a hate radio show.
Mike
Fixed yer typo.
I think some drugs really should be illegal. I've seen a lot of people get all fucked up by teh sneet.
Even though it was illegal at the time.
I'm no fan of cocaine. I've never even tried it, but making it illegal doesn't stop people from using it.
That's not the flat tax the idiots like Armey are pushing. They want the calculation done on the back of a post card.
spinoza Neque lugare, neque in | 08.04.07 - 4:17 pm | #
yeah, well, armey is a fucking idiot. and again, he's talking about flat income tax. which anyone who makes a lot of money would prefer. of course.
.I make a distinction between "legality" and "fitness for sale". I think Tobacco, alcohol, coke, pot, heroin, etc. should be legal.
OK, I'll concede that. Just because I don't think cocaine should be legal doesn't mean I think people should get thrown in jail for simple posession. Our enforcement model is clearly all fucked up.
"Prostitution should definitely be legalized."
I think the unintended consequences of legalizing prostitution could be very interesting.
Hand jobs, blow jobs, and anal sex should be taxed at different rates.
I'm no fan of cocaine. I've never even tried it, but making it illegal doesn't stop people from using it.
Hecate, Runnymeade Conspirator
They can make all that shit legal tomorrow.
Still wouldn't make me want to use any of it.
Fixed yer typo.
Terry C - Wingnuts R WATBs | 08.04.07 - 4:18 pm | #
Oh, come on now. Being white is the only thing that makes this fascist country tolerable.
If we had cars that could double as boats, we wouldn't need any unsightly bridges. No bridges, no bridge collapses. I think Popular Mechanics has loads of designs for just such a vehicle.
69 percent?
Prostitution should definitely be legalized."
I think the unintended consequences of legalizing prostitution could be very interesting.
Hand jobs, blow jobs, and anal sex should be taxed at different rates.
spinoza
I think we could all get along, working across partisan lines to make a better America
/David Vitter.
"That bridge collapse and the frenetic inspections of bridges and overpasses all over the country has done a lot to point out what rotten shape our infrastructure is in."
which might only point out that the government has been wasting tax money for years. I remember a principal of a charter school in Philadelphia who swore to me the Philadelphia school district "has all the money it needs" but they waste it.
we here think facts add a lot to the story. the faux news crowd doesn't and there are still a hell of a lot of them.
.They can make all that shit legal tomorrow.
Still wouldn't make me want to use any of it.
Terry C - Wingnuts R WATBs
Have you ever tried cocaine?
Hand jobs, blow jobs, and anal sex should be taxed at different rates.
spinoza Neque lugare, neque in | 08.04.07 - 4:19 pm | #
69 percent?
Hand jobs, blow jobs, and anal sex should be taxed at different rates.
spinoza Neque lugare, neque in
I'm prepared to do some research!
"You know, we already tax most of the things we do for pleasure... drinking, smoking... what if we taxed... you know, thingy?"
"Thingy?" "Yes, you know, thingy."
"I'm afraid I don't. Could you please be more explicit?"
" You know - thingy!
"Poo- poos? "
"No! - Thingy!" (the guy makes the universal symbol for the horizontal cha-cha)
"Well, it'll sure make chartered accountancy more interesting!"
Making the stuff legal doesn't mean people are going to want to do it.
true. and it does mean that it will be safer for those who DO want to. because a) you can buy it at CVS instead of from colombian gangs, b) the quality could be regulated so people don't snort rat poison and c) you could go to the hospital if you needed to without the fear of prison.
Well, this is a fun article...
No mention on how much black women utterly despise black men...
I think Popular Mechanics has loads of designs for just such a vehicle.
Lime Rickey
Do they still have the plans for making a hovercraft out of a shop-vac?
true. and it does mean that it will be safer for those who DO want to. because a) you can buy it at CVS instead of from colombian gangs, b) the quality could be regulated so people don't snort rat poison and c) you could go to the hospital if you needed to without the fear of prison.
dirk gently, sociopathetic©
Um, didn't we already do this, til, what, '29 or so?
Sorry. I believe in pre-reagan progressive taxes. No one needs an income at the level of what CEOs and Gates make.
spinoza Neque lugare, neque in
Because the kicker is, unless I'm way out of date, that if you die with an estate valued at more than $1.2 million, that overage is taxed at what, 50%?
Have you ever tried cocaine?
blerb
I've never done ANY drugs.
But ex was addicted to it back in the early 1990s.
That was enough for me.
I see your point, blerb, but keeping it illegal won't stop people from doing it.
Oh, come on now. Being white is the only thing that makes this fascist country tolerable.
Mike
It's funny. I've just started re-reading Philip K. Dick's "The Crack In Space," which is about (among other things) the first Black candidate for President.
Dick may have been a 'lunatick,' but he really nailed our time in history some 40 years ago.
having drugs be illegal has zilch to do with health or safety. think of the $billions available for black budgets. Three things make the world go round: money, guns, and drugs.
OK, I'll concede that. Just because I don't think cocaine should be legal doesn't mean I think people should get thrown in jail for simple posession. Our enforcement model is clearly all fucked up.
I completely agree. Jail time for drug possesion is stupid, unnecessary and, really, inhumane treatment. All "offenders" should be required to go through drug treatment and be forced to witness the devastating effects drug addiction can have on all people in contact with the addicted. Treatment does not require that one stop using, but can help those that do have a problem and those that do not realise they have a problem.
Well in my utopia, we'd teach people how to handle substances that expand your mind, from sugar to booze to LSD to shrooms to whatever. We'd teach people how to use sex to achieve altered states and connection w/ the universe. We'd teach people lots of other ways to achieve that same state, including exercise and dance and yoga and meditation, mastrubation, etc. We'd quit pretending that humans aren't wired to require such experiences. But Goddess knows, that I'm unlikely to see that this time around on the spinning blue body of the Mamma.
Well, agreed Armey is an idiot. He gives economics PhDs a bad name. And I say that with some trepidation on his blog.
Three things make the world go round: money, guns, and drugs.
Mike
Sex, drugs, and rock and roll.
I'm no fan of cocaine. I've never even tried it, but making it illegal doesn't stop people from using it.
Illegalizing drugs is probably one of the stupidest things ever done in the 20th century.
It serves no purpose, clogs up jails and courts, and subverts purist capitalism.
And yet, every smart politician that supports legalization of even marijuana gets tarred and feathered. Fucking stupid.
"No mention on how much black women utterly despise black men..."
Not sure that's what this is all about - but let me tell you black men react very strongly to white men dating black women. they really don't like it.
All "offenders" should be required to go through drug treatment
but - but - they are sinners, and god says we can get our jollies by punishing them
Well, this is a fun article...
No mention on how much black women utterly despise black men...
Meander, embittered liberal
Oooh, that is some nasty shit.
I don't understand what ANY woman would see in Kevin Federline.
And, can we just admit that the "real" problem with altered states is that they can take a while to recover from, thus rendering one a less-than-completely-reliable cog in the capatalistic machine?
a) you can buy it at CVS instead of from colombian gangs
Heaven forfend. I'm willing to buy that reasoning for most drugs, but not for meth, blow, heroin (and congeners), or barbiturates/methaqualone. Those drugs have too much addictive potential to be made available for sale freely.
We'd teach people how to use sex to achieve altered states and connection w/ the universe.
where do i sign up for your class?
The 'real' problem with altered states is that you might see thru the military infotainment complex propaganda.
My back pain is getting to me (as it always does about this time of the day) and I am reaching into the pill bottle for my five o'clock half pill a little early. Anyone want a Percocet?
There is a point: drugs, even dangerous addictive drugs that can give a person one hell of a buzz, do have a function; the alleviation of pain that enables a person to function.
Neither here nor there. Just stating a fact I guess.
even marijuana gets tarred and feathered.
Zap, and I thought MY pipe was a bitch to clean...!
let me tell you black men react very strongly to white men dating black women. they really don't like it.
Uncle Blodge, Urban Teacher
I've seen how my African-American girlfriends react to black men with white women.
They don't like that, either.
Who is this rather linear nut on booktv? He just spent 5 minutes telling the audience how he writes and then takes bowel movements 7 days a week.
I don't understand what ANY woman would see in Kevin Federline. Terry C
Try removing all vestiges of self-esteem and self-respect and look again.
The obvious solution is use taxes. People should pay directly for what they use. Drive? pay for the roads. Use mass trans? Pay for the train.
The more you drive, the more you pay. Its only fair, as your getting the benefit - you should pay. I bet people would act MUCH more rationally if THEY had to pay directly for the shit they use.
I mean. why should I pay for some schmuck in Wyoming to have a nice highway?
Those drugs have too much addictive potential to be made available for sale freely.
Sweetie,
They are for sale freely. I am just saying.
Needless to say, we don't put an emphasis on treating people that are addicted to things like MONEY...
That hurts and kills more than drugs will ever.
Three things make the world go round: money, guns, and drugs.
Mike
Sex, drugs, and rock and roll.
lipreader
Music, sex and cookies
(Alex Bevan sang it - damned if I can remember who wrote it)
Hecate - He's probably old enough to sit on your lap and you can show him George Washington on a dollar bill and Jackson on a twenty, etc. All he needs to get is that things that look the same can be different. And all that schnuggling would be fun. *Sigh*
We'd teach people how to use sex to achieve altered states and connection w/ the universe.
where do i sign up for your class?
It's one thing to lead with your chin. It's another to lead with.....
Three things make the world go round: money, guns, and drugs.
Mike
Sex, drugs, and rock and roll.
lipreader
Lawyers, guns and money.
Who is this rather linear nut on booktv? He just spent 5 minutes telling the audience how he writes and then takes bowel movements 7 days a week.
spinoza Neque lugare, neque in | 08.04.07 - 4:27 pm | #
Vitter is an author?
Article Six of the United States Constitution
The Senators and Representatives before mentioned, and the Members of the several State Legislatures, and all executive and judicial Officers, both of the United States and of the several States, shall be bound by Oath or Affirmation, to support this Constitution; but no religious Test shall ever be required as a Qualification to any Office or public Trust under the United States.
What do the candidates think of all the religion being injected into politics?
I had root canal last year, and I threw out the leftover Vicodin as soon as the pain was manageable, cause I could tell they made me feel way too good.
Fireworks broke out at a Friday morning session of the second day of the YearlyKos Convention entitled “The Military and Progressives: Are They Really That Different?”. An as yet unidentified uniformed soldier attempted to address the panel on the subject of the “Surge”. He was unceremoniously escorted out by panelist Jon Soltz.
The soldier’s words were either suppressed or inaudible on the convention’s own video. They can be heard hear on this exclusive PJM Video by Andrew Marcus, who also interviews the soldier and tries to interview Soltz.
I'll never understand why liberals hate our soldiers and love to censor speech. What are they afraid of?
too much addictive potential to be made available for sale freely.
blerb | 08.04.07 - 4:25 pm | #
freely? hell, you can't buy psuedofed freely.
he, if rush wants to walk around in a mindnumbed oxy state, that's really up to him and those close to him. it has nothing to do with me or with the govt.
I mean. why should I pay for some schmuck in Wyoming to have a nice highway?
Bjorn,a poor young country boi
Someday you might like to visit Yellowstone? (as every American really should!)
.And, can we just admit that the "real" problem with altered states is that they can take a while to recover from, thus rendering one a less-than-completely-reliable cog in the capatalistic machine?
Well, that argument may be true for pot, LSD (and congeners), PCP(eech!), etc. But for some drugs there really is an inordinate potential for total dependency.
The 'real' problem with altered states is that you might see thru the military infotainment complex propaganda.
Well, yes, and then there's that.
IMO, altered states are worse than useless if you never get around to applying any insights gained to your unaltered states.
I don't understand what ANY woman would see in Kevin Federline. Terry C
Try removing all vestiges of self-esteem and self-respect and look again.
JeffCO |
Yeah, really.
"gregarious abuse"
ain't that when the preznit talkins offn the cuff?
Neither here nor there. Just stating a fact I guess.
DWD
bonjour! I'm really liking your book now. I'm waiting for at least one mention of Atrios (QL got a mention!). It's indeed a page turner! I keep it for my breaks at work but at 15 minutes a a time, it's not long enough. I might finish it a one shot tomorrow.
It's one thing to lead with your chin. It's another to lead with.....
spinoza Neque lugare, neque in | 08.04.07 - 4:28 pm | #
i know, but i have a very weak chin. one has to go with one's strengths.
Someday you might like to visit Yellowstone? (as every American really should!)
DWD - Reaching Tinder Point | Homepage | 08.04.07 - 4:29 pm | #
Then I should pay to get in.
An as yet unidentified uniformed soldier attempted to address the panel on the subject of the “Surge”. He was unceremoniously escorted out by panelist Jon Soltz.
um.... he was engaging in political advocacy in uniform. That's illegal.
Who is this rather linear nut on booktv? He just spent 5 minutes telling the audience how he writes and then takes bowel movements 7 days a week.
spinoza Neque lugare, neque in
I've heard of people who do all their reading while on the throne (see Chimpy, for example). Writing's a different story, though.
"I've seen how my African-American girlfriends react to black men with white women.
They don't like that, either."
isn't it nice that we've moved past all that?
yeah I know and that's why I am not sure this is in any way proof that black women despise black men. in fact there was a color line split in the feminist movement because black women were unwilling to make black men the enemy.
Comment by Juan Colon blocked. [unkill][show comment]
(Flush)
The obvious solution is use taxes. People should pay directly for what they use. Drive? pay for the roads. Use mass trans? Pay for the train.
The more you drive, the more you pay. Its only fair, as your getting the benefit - you should pay. I bet people would act MUCH more rationally if THEY had to pay directly for the shit they use.
And so the single mother who has to drive 50 miles round trip to clean the houses of some rich bitch should have to pay for her road use? You must have Ayn Randitis. Take antibiotics stat.
I'll never understand why liberals hate our soldiers and love to censor speech. What are they afraid of?
Juan Colon
And speaking of altered states.....
Needless to say, we don't put an emphasis on treating people that are addicted to things like MONEY...
That hurts and kills more than drugs will ever.
Addiction is not limited to drugs. It really is an illness, but most of society sees it as a bad choice. Until that mindset changes things will remain fucked up.
um.... he was engaging in political advocacy in uniform. That's illegal.
Jim
It is impossible for Republicans to break the law. They called it.
IMO, altered states are worse than useless if you never get around to applying any insights gained to your unaltered states.
JeffCO | 08.04.07 - 4:29 pm | #
Uh, no. Insights are unavoidable. Even if they're subtle, you will get them even without any intention of doing so. Of course, it depends on the setting and the substance
hope monger
monger, monger, monger
at 30 years old (10 years ago for those counting), i pretty much stopped drinking and started smoking pot instead. I'm not depressed and crying like i used to do with booze. I smoke my ganja everyday. Addicted? Probably i am. But at least i'm happier 
And so the single mother who has to drive 50 miles round trip to clean the houses of some rich bitch should have to pay for her road use? You must have Ayn Randitis. Take antibiotics stat.
spinoza Neque lugare, neque in | 08.04.07 - 4:30 pm | #
Nope no AR fan here.
My point is that "rich bitch" would have to pay her fair share too.
did the house pass extending shrubs spy program?
"monger" is a great word. I don't care if it's fishmonger, whoremonger, or ironmonger.
Great word.
Someday you might like to visit Yellowstone? (as every American really should!)
DWD - Reaching Tinder Point | Homepage | 08.04.07 - 4:29 pm | #
Then I should pay to get in.
No. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.
Our national parks should be as available to the poor as to the rich. Everyone, regardless of their level of income, deserves to spend time in nature.
Someday you might like to visit Yellowstone? (as every American really should!)
DWD - Reaching Tinder Point | Homepage | 08.04.07 - 4:29 pm | #
Then I should pay to get in.
Bjorn,a poor young country boi
Before you enter Killfile purgatory, is there a reason that you cannot understand that Interstate Highways are a good thing? I have no problem supporting a system that enables Americans to freely move themselves and goods about this country. Wyoming may be a small state but it needs a system of roads that are adequate for the greater need. Maybe I would like to get from Minnesota to Oregon without flying . . . .
Addiction is not limited to drugs.
i'm gonna have to face it
i'm addicted to love
Did I miss something? Avoiding helping out in Darfur somehow keeps us in Iraq? WTF? Is this guy a retard acting clever or just a 25 cent bj crack whore?
But at least i'm happier
plum p, who loves Al Gore
Certainly healthier.
I had root canal last year, and I threw out the leftover Vicodin as soon as the pain was manageable, cause I could tell they made me feel way too good.
I broke my hip a few years ago and the doctor put me on a regulated self administered morphine drip. I still have friends tell me about how they would come to visit me in the hospital. And I would say, wait a second, and then let my eyeballs roll back in my head.
Great word.
Jim | 08.04.07 - 4:33 pm | #
word monger
"that "rich bitch" would have to pay her fair share too."
define fair share. 500$ each? any time you try to make taxes "fair" in absolute terms the poor seemed to get screwed.
"monger" is a great word. I don't care if it's fishmonger, whoremonger, or ironmonger.
Great word.
Jim
Don't like warmongers.
Meh. I think some drugs really should be illegal. I've seen a lot of people get all fucked up by teh sneet.
We are constantly surrounded by a zillion corrupting influences, that's just how it is. Boils down to a matter of self-control, ultimately. We have a Master-Slave relationship with everything outside of our own skin.
Self-control is the Path to Happiness and Peace.
I wouldn't expect Wyoming to pay for my stuff, either.
at 30 years old (10 years ago for those counting), i pretty much stopped drinking and started smoking pot instead. I'm not depressed and crying like i used to do with booze. I smoke my ganja everyday. Addicted? Probably i am. But at least i'm happier
Darls,
You're a mere year younger than me...but a helluva lot wiser.
I went the pot route before I went the alcohol one. Should've stuck with my first instinct.
Hello moonbats
.Sweetie,
They are for sale freely. I am just saying.
Hecate, Runnymeade Conspirator
I have been around the mill quite a few times with the drug thing, Hecate. I have done pretty much all of them except heroin intravenously, some (like LSD) quite a few times. I know how available they are, or at least were until arount 1990. Buying blow now is not as easy or cheap as going to the CVS would be, and I am thankful for that. In no way, however, do I advocate jailing people for posession or just being high. That approach is nonsense. But some substances are just too dangerous to be universally and cheaply available.
I had root canal last year, and I threw out the leftover Vicodin as soon as the pain was manageable, cause I could tell they made me feel way too good
They gave me a 'script for Percocet (?) when I had my biopsy in 2004.
I threw it out and used Motrin instead.
Ain't taking that shit!
but the best drug is demerol, a synthetic morphine i think. I had some after a surgery, i was seeing happy colors everwhere!
by the way, can somebody explain why the drugs companies don't buy opium from Afghanistan to produce their drugs? Instead of poor afghanies selling it for the smack market?
Warmonger, whoremonger, fishmonger...which 2 smell the same?
I wouldn't expect Wyoming to pay for my stuff, either.
Bjorn,a poor young country boi | 08.04.07 - 4:34 pm | #
you need a nap.
I think trying to keep people locked into states of anxiety and hopelessness while at the same time maintaining the illegality of substances they might want to use to alleviate those states is a very useful strategy for maintaining power. Forcing them to pay for pharmaceutical derivatives of these substances is icing on the cake.
Of course, people could always choose to screw the system by meditating or something. I'm not holding my breath for that, though I am breathing in and out slowly and rhythmically.
i'm gonna have to face it
i'm addicted to love
dirk gently, sociopathetic© | Homepage | 08.04.07 - 4:33 pm | #
--------------------------------------------------
------------------------------
You cant sleep, you cant eat
Theres no doubt, youre in deep
Your throat is tight, you cant breathe
Oh shit...it's obvious that I don't do math very well.
PlumP's ten years older than me.
I'm a mere 31 years of age...
Warmonger, whoremonger, fishmonger...which 2 smell the same?
lipreader
You SO bad.
Our national parks should be as available to the poor as to the rich. Everyone, regardless of their level of income, deserves to spend time in nature.
Hecate
You indirectly remind me of my personal 'wingnut of the week, Drew Carey:
Carey then volunteered that although he doesn't belong to a particular religion, he believes his money is "not my money. It's God's money."
"I am really blessed to have it," he said. "Money is only worth what you perceive it to be worth. If you're even a lower-income guy in the United States, you live better than Solomon. You have a way better backyard than me if you go to Central Park. You have a way cooler TV room than me if you go to Hooters. ... I just happen to have a little extra property that's more private."
Phila is a nudibranch monger
you could dry up muggings and so forth by decriminalize drugs
because then junkies would probably be able to function in a job and can get their fix from a reliable and clean source, instead of losing it all, ending up on the street, robbing and assaulting people for cash for their next fix.
also it takes it out of the hands of the criminals
he, if rush wants to walk around in a mindnumbed oxy state, that's really up to him and those close to him. it has nothing to do with me or with the govt.
No, it really does affect you. That guy driving on the freeway at 75 MPH could be high as a kite and not realise you're right there as you're changing lanes.
Some person who is fucked up has a good chance of getting into an accident causing yours and my insurance rates to go up.
That person dependent on drugs abuses his child and causes that child's life to be altered forever, bringing about more misery.
I guess it just p's me off that I have to pay every time I get on the train but people that drive in basically are getting a free ride.
You indirectly remind me of my personal 'wingnut of the week, Drew Carey
Unfunny fascist asshole.
That is all.
Uh, no. Insights are unavoidable. Even if they're subtle, you will get them even without any intention of doing so. Of course, it depends on the setting and the substance
I didn't say anything about getting insights, I said applying them. Sitting around high may provide all kinds of other perspectives on life, but if you don't apply any of them to the time when you're not sitting around high, what is it that you've gained, aside from temporary respite?
Our economy is right now based on people buying shit they do not need to survive. Huge numbers of people are employed to convince people to buy shit they do not need to survive
A consumption tax on an enconomy predicated on buying shit you do not need is fundamentally insane.
But some substances are just too dangerous to be universally and cheaply available.
blerb | 08.04.07 - 4:35 pm | #
er, why? dangerous to whom? who decides whether the risk is worth it? and what is cheap?
gravity is free. so is the ocean. both are extremely dangerous, esp without any education. but i don't want the fucking police state to tell me i can't go skydiving or swimming with sharks. and i don't want you telling me i can't snort coke. i want to make that decision myself.
Addicted? Probably i am. But at least i'm happier
plum p, who loves Al Gore
Probably not. If you couldn't smoke it you would probably not miss it. When we moved to Italy we gave it up without any problem at all. Took up red wine. Yummy.
My problem with the drug laws is the opportunity costs. Think what else we could do in education if we had the billions and billions that we spend on law enforcement and imprisonment. To say nothing of unclogging the courts.
Moon:
For one so young, you are indeed wise.
bonjour! I'm really liking your book now. I'm waiting for at least one mention of Atrios (QL got a mention!). It's indeed a page turner! I keep it for my breaks at work but at 15 minutes a a time, it's not long enough. I might finish it a one shot tomorrow.
plum p, who loves Al Gore
Glad you are enjoying. I actually wrote the last six chapters of that book in one FANTASTIC day. I started writing at about seven at night and I finished it the next day at around noon. It needed extensive rewriting but I did not change ANYTHING that actually happened or the order that it happened in nor did I add or subtract anything. It was a feeling that I have no words to describe.
BTW, I heard from my publisher that they are sending SILENT SCREAMS OF A SURVIVOR out to a bigger printer for a much larger run than they are capable of printing for its second printing. (I had to update the cover information)
Yep, I am chuffed. Maybe someday I will be a recognized author yet.
you ban drugs and people still are going to do it.
whatever laws you put forth, there will always be a market
the war on drugs has not lessened drug use one iota as far as I can see
time for some new thinking perhaps?
I'm a mere 31 years of age...
Zap Rowsdower
a kid you are, sweety! Now, show aunty Plum some kittens, will ya?
You indirectly remind me of my personal 'wingnut of the week, Drew Carey
nothing funnier than making fun of the less fortunate, the people without hope.
Unfunny fascist asshole.
No, no, no. He's a libertarian. That's a rich guy who wants to get high and not pay taxes and doesn't care about poor people.
"Unfunny" and "asshole" though, you got that part right.
A consumption tax on an enconomy predicated on buying shit you do not need is fundamentally insane.
Apprentice to Darth Holden | 08.04.07 - 4:38 pm | #
but it makes perfect sense to tax the income one makes on three jobs to afford to buy the things one does no tneed.
crusty sheets
SILENT SCREAMS OF A SURVIVOR out to a bigger printer for a much larger run than they are capable of printing for its second printing. (I had to update the cover information)
Yep, I am chuffed. Maybe someday I will be a recognized author yet.
DWD
that's your next book? I will have to order that one as well!
"I just happen to have a little extra property that's more private."
Jim
I think Drew is referring to his expansive ass.
booze is just as harmful but is treated as legal
tobacco is dangerous but gosh its legal
you can get drugs from your doctor legally and get addicted to
No, no, no. He's a libertarian. That's a rich guy who wants to get high and not pay taxes and doesn't care about poor people.
Jim
I don't see any difference between them and the Repukes, then.
i've never done drugs and i'm for decriminalization of them
Now, show aunty Plum some kittens, will ya?
Will this suffice?
"He's a libertarian."
Berke breahted - the opus the penguin guy - once said he thought he was a libertarian till he realized they were all tax dodgers at heart.
But some substances are just too dangerous to be universally and cheaply available.
blerb,
It sounds as if you know more about this than I do, and I'm not trying to be flip, but I could buy any of those substances this afternoon without driving ten miles. And if I were addicted, it wouldn't matter whether or not they were costly. Making them costly would only ensure that I'd skimp on my kids' food or on my rent or that I'd whore myself to get them. If keeping them costly were the answer, it would make more sense to sell them at CVS and tax the shit out of them so that we could use the excess $$ to build bridges instead of having the excess $$ go, as it does now, to buy hummers for dealers. But, of course, since the substances, themselves, can be produced cheaply, even that wouldn't stop people from buying them on the black market and getting addicted. Which, again, is why I say that we need to teach people, from the time that they are babies, how to handle mind-altering substances and experiences. But I'm a crazy old crone.
nothing funnier than making fun of the less fortunate, the people without hope.
pigboy
Oh he wasn't joking, I don't think. I think he really believes that crap. In fact, that's a major Cato institute talking point: There are no poor people because they have indoor plumbing and TeeVees.
Hmmmmm what am I missing?
Something i should liveblog
i've never done drugs and i'm for decriminalization of them
Moonbootica, Graduated
You and me both.
. i don't want you telling me i can't snort coke. i want to make that decision myself.
dirk gently, sociopathetic©
Well, I guess if you wanted to grow some coca plants yourself and extract the cocaine from them, I would not have a problem with that. Ditto opium poppies. I just do not want to live in a world where cocaine and heroin are things that corporations can use to make a profit from consumers. It is bad enough with tobbacco, and that stuff makes you feel like shit the first few times you use it.
Will this suffice?
Zap Rowsdower
oui! merci. Franny is just lovely
I don't see any difference between them and the Repukes, then.
Terry C -
he's too hungover for Church.
"i've never done drugs and i'm for decriminalization of them"
i did a lot of drugs and if they were made legal I'd celebrate by firing up a joint.
imagine the scene... Kristol entering the ballroom at YearlyKos by mistake.... what do you think the kossacks would do to him?
They gave me a 'script for Percocet (?) when I had my biopsy in 2004.
I threw it out and used Motrin instead.
Ain't taking that shit!
Terry C
Motrin? Tylenol? My pain literally giggles at those. I could take a bottle of Motrin and feel no change whatsoever.
But on the other hand, I use these pills very judiciously. I take half a pill at five in the afternoon. I take a pill at ten at night. Another at ll and half just before I go to bed. The strongest effect then is while I am sleeping and it does last most of the next day. That is a good thing and I do not have to experience the "Drugged" feeling except just before I go to bed (I sometimes complain of it when I am trying to form an argument at night. I am not really very good at that under the influence)
Yep, I am chuffed. Maybe someday I will be a recognized author yet.
DWD
I really am pleased. I have a copy of Challenge in a plastic bag, with the spine uncracked. I figure when you finally get famous it will be worth quite a bit!
D R A P E S
"The Price is WRONG, Drew"
[ Whap! ]
I can think of some fundies who need to smoke some Bob Marley-sized joints.
I figure when you finally get famous it will be worth quite a bit!
ql-was in NY
QL: you're in the book!
"Motrin? Tylenol? My pain literally giggles at those. I could take a bottle of Motrin and feel no change whatsoever. "
bet you've heard this one - "have you tried Aaleve? 2 of them will knock it right out.
people get very upset when I tell them I have not been pain free for years.
Living with three addicts I can tell you that drug use is not benign. It destroys relationships and many other positives of life as the stuff becomes all controlling and more important than anything else. It's ugly. The problem is ya don't know until you go there if you can take it or leave it. All that said, the war on drugs is stupid and counterproductive. Everyone who is addicted and comes to the place where they want to leave their monster behind should have access to excellent rehab. As it stands. only the rich or folks with excellent insurance can afford it.
Don't like warmongers.
Terry C
My daughter and her boyfriend visited us recently, and as usual they had a ton of laundry to do. Hanging them up to dry, I noticed that Michael had one that said NO WAR! on the back, and he gave it to me. Now, I wear it as often as I can.
But I like Dennis' notion of a Department of Peace. Trademark Dave, you here? I love to have a white tee or knit shirt that says Peace. in large blue letters across the back, and an official-looking seal, in blue as well, on the left breast. Mebbe a dove with an olive branch in its mouth, and the letters around the seal say, "The Department of Peace of the American People."
Why should we wait for Dennis to do it? Peace will only be won in an aggressive, nonviolent campaign, that we initiate.
Uh, no. Insights are unavoidable. Even if they're subtle, you will get them even without any intention of doing so. Of course, it depends on the setting and the substance
And the quality and quantity of those insights hinge critically on your intent. Are you looking for omens personally, or ignoring them?
Of course, people could always choose to screw the system by meditating or something. I'm not holding my breath for that, though I am breathing in and out slowly and rhythmically.
JeffCO
I chant Daimoku, as I have for the last 40 years. It has made me happy and very fortunate. Works for everybody.
because Iraq is important? oh wait.. no no its not... This is the dumbest comment I have ever heard. We should actually be in Darfur..
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