I'MMA LET YOU FINISH
Hah!
Jeebus that's depressing.
stop!
We have always been at war with Iraq.
We will be here long after you have imploded.
What, you're cockroaches?
yes, and I have a 19 year old son.
Imprinting on war? Terrific. Konrad Lorenz would be proud.
We need to look forward to the future, not try to relive the supposed glory of the past.
What, you're cockroaches?
Sallyh
Cockroaches don't build enormous fucking dams on fault-lines.
For a growing chunk of the population, war has been a normal state of affairs during their formative years.
Feature, not a glitch.
Hellcat, 21 year old daughter.
That is depressing.
When does the sequel to "The Wonder Years" begin?
Well at least when Ronnie was Pres they hadn't even been born yet. That's something, right?
We have always been at war with Iraq.
Susie from Philly
no no no, silly, the Iraqis are our great and courageous allies in fighting anti-democratical terr'rists. Except when we have to wipe them off the face of the earth. Or something.
Bad Art, Ronnie was prez when Mlle was born. And I thought the Reagan years sucked ass.
Imprinting on war?
spinoza
The culture imprints on war even when not engaged in it.
For a growing chunk of the population, war has been a normal state of affairs during their formative years.
More shopping will keep their spirits up.
Cockroaches don't build enormous fucking dams on fault-lines.
True, and they don't hold mortgage backed paper that's nearly worthless.
In one manner or another we have had an active military mission in Iraq since Aug. 1990. 17 years.
And I thought the Reagan years sucked ass.
Well, they did.
But no one could have imagined that the Bush years would inhale the entire ass.
Hellcat, 21 year old daughter.
Sallyh, Grandmere Poissonniere |
08.25.07 - 11:56 am | #
my daughter is 22. The only thing that may save them is that they have both had to take medication for PTSD. It was some time back, but I have the records.
"I thought the Reagan years sucked ass."
hey - he cut your taxes! you ought to be grateful!
was told essentially that once...
This is beyond depressing.
I can't even imagine how I'm gonna feel when we attack Iran, as we inevitably will.
Sorry to make it all about me, but I'm really old and this history repeating shit is not something I had expected in my declining years....
We have always been at war with Iraq.
Why don't we just redraw the maps like the Russians used to, to eliminate certain geographical areas? Redraw them to eliminate Iraq and poof! Problem solved.
On the other hand, our chocolate rations have increased.
Hellkitty, mine has bipolar disorder. Not that that would be meaningful at this point.
True, and they don't hold mortgage backed paper that's nearly worthless.
Sallyh, Grandmere Poissonniere |
08.25.07 - 11:58 am | #
my point from the last thread.
Beats the hell out of coming to consciousness in 1963.
.
I'm 65, not counting little forays like Granada and Lebanon and Nicaragua, etc. etc., my homeland has been at war of 35% of my lifetime. Makes y' think, don't it?
Steve, you do recall the Crusades, don't you?
It should be a negative imprint on their childhood, no? Maybe they will be for peace when they snatch the world out of our feeble, incompetent claws.
Very few of that generation are enlisting
the allure of the revenge for 9/11 seems to be wearing thin under Shrubco
I'm really old and this history repeating shit is not something I had expected in my declining years....
I said to my mother the other day that if we were going to repeat all the bad shit from her formative years, the least her generation could do is share the drugs and the good music that came out of it all.
I really think those of us who grew up in the 1980s got hosed. Reagan, AIDS, crack, and the songs were for shit.
A.
Uncle Blodge, I don't know whose taxes St. Ronnie cut, but they sure as hell weren't mine.
I'm really old and this history repeating shit is not something I had expected in my declining years....
I know, I know. Somehow, I thought that all the Viet Nam marches were the last anti-war marches I'd have to do, that I wouldn't still be marching to protect the right to abortion, etc. And here I am, thirty some years later, protesting the same damn shit. Who was it who said that it's not one damn thing after another, it's the same damn thing over and over?
Sorry to make it all about me, but I'm really old and this history repeating shit is not something I had expected in my declining years....
steve simels
Next up - the 70s.....
"I thought the Reagan years sucked ass."
hey - he cut your taxes! you ought to be grateful!
Odd. Mine went up when he was president. I was on an NIH graduate student fellowship. Reagan decided to start taxing it. So my $4800 a year net pay dropped a bit.
Bad Art, the best argument for that Quiverfull crapola is that kids do tend to rebel against their parents, so by that standard, we should be wildly in favor of anything that encourages Republicans to breed.
A.
I really think those of us who grew up in the 1980s got hosed. Reagan, AIDS, crack, and the songs were for shit.
We got Flock of Seagulls and Duran Duran, so quitcher bitchin!
Speaking of shopping, it's not looking good.
http://www.cnbc.com/id/20425499
For a growing chunk of the population, war has been a normal state of affairs during their formative years.
It's one more reason Godwin's law is inoperative. Rampant militarism is one sign of what kind of government?
Odd. Mine went up when he was president. I was on an NIH graduate student fellowship. Reagan decided to start taxing it. So my $4800 a year net pay dropped a bit.
spinoza-non ridere, non lugare
Don't forget too, that student loan interest was made non-deductible!
Hellkitty, mine has bipolar disorder. Not that that would be meaningful at this point.
Sallyh, Grandmere Poissonniere |
08.25.07 - 11:59 am | #
So sorry, I hope she is doing ok. Mine has been having mysterious fainting spells. She is concious but unable to move. We thought petit mal but there isn't any history of that in the family. There is diabetes though. I don't know if that is a characteristic of type 2
or not. She has no insurance and her visit to the hospital netted her an ekg whatever the hell for I have no idea.
TKK, ew.
Hecate, I think it was Eugene O'Neill. No future, only the past, happening over and over again, now.
Or, as someone else would put it, you keep telling the story until you get it right.
A.
I really liked Tears for Fears. and I hate 99.9% of modern pop music.
Sorry to make it all about me, but I'm really old and this history repeating shit is not something I had expected in my declining years....
steve simels
Sucks big time. One thing that gets me is that by keeping the body bags off the nightly news and constraining involvement to a small percentage of the population,these kids aren't learning the real lesson of war: THAT.IT.IS.HELL.
Hellkitty, she seemed to be doing better. But it's hard to tell with her.
She makes me tired.
I can't keep up with you people.
For those entering their freshmen year next year, the war will have been going on since they were in 7th grade.
For a growing chunk of the population, war has been a normal state of affairs during their formative years.
That's exactly how Vietnam felt, right through my grammar school, high school & into my college years. When the war ended, it felt weird, there was something missing, like when you finally pull bad tooth that's been bothering you forever.
There is diabetes though. I don't know if that is a characteristic of type 2 or not.
Nope. It isn't at all.
My son is 20 and is extremely healthy. This should be reason to rejoice, but I know eventually he'll end up in the military, unless he leaves.
Next up - the 70s.....
GWPDA, yclept Irate Scholar |
Homepage |
08.25.07 - 12:02 pm
Oh NOOOOOOOOOOO!
Re-HICA!
Curly and LarryElvis have new toys from Target.
.
ql, they're not fooled.
A lot of my students know someone in the military (most of my kids aren't rich), and several of them have lost friends, neighbors, and relatives. They assume they're being lied to, all the time.
I can't keep up with you people.
That's because time is slower in Canada.
"Uncle Blodge, I don't know whose taxes St. Ronnie cut, but they sure as hell weren't mine."
I got a buck and a quarter a week. after state taxes went up to cover the shit the feds weren't doing, that went down to about half a buck a week.
a raise in social security and I was in the red.
I figured this out to be ready to argue with a reaganut. when the time came I was told that I didn't understand why ronnie was good for me because if I did I would love him, or something like that.
She makes me tired.
Sallyh
Come, sit by me. We can commesirate together.
Rudy [Kathryn Jean Lopez]
lays out a tax plan.
That's great. I wonder if it includes a capital gains cut?
Had I been born in Germany, that nasty militarist state, it wouldn't be 35% of my lifetime lived under wartime governments, but less than 5%. Granted, prior to my birth the German record wasn't so good. But maybe that says something about militarist Murka too.
We got Flock of Seagulls and Duran Duran,
The Kenosha Kid
Exactly.
Sucked ass.
She makes me tired.
Sallyh, Grandmere Poissonniere |
08.25.07 - 12:04 pm | #
I understand. Mine is an intense little bundle too.
GWPDA, Thanks for that...She's only had two of these "spells" but they really worry me.
But what I came here to mention-did you see a teenage hacker in NJ has succeeded in unlocking the iPhone?
Link to BBC story
When the war ended, it felt weird, there was something missing, like when you finally pull bad tooth that's been bothering you forever.
It's like when you have a horrible flu and can't imagine ever feeling well again, like you can't remember what well felt like.
That's what the last seven years have been like. The country's sick, and I'm having a hard time recalling when it wasn't. Surely there were times I didn't go to bed pissed off and wake up more pissed off.
A.
For a growing chunk of the population, war has been a normal state of affairs during their formative years.
That's been true for the last century. The gap between Vietnam and Gulf War I was the exception that proved the rule. And even Vietnam was just the "hot spot" of the so-called "Cold War."
This country has seen itself as "being at war" since Hitler was defeated. Actually, whatever gap there was between fighting the Axis powers and "opposing world Communism" was almost non-existent, at least to the Baby Boom generation. This "perpetual war for perpetual peace" was not invented by Dick Cheney and Karl Rove, you know. It's been the American Way since I can remember.
So why shouldn't my daughter have known war since the 4th grade? I'm not happy about it. But I might as well tell the tide not to come in.
War has become as American as apple pie. It pulled us out of the Great Depression (or so we tell ourselves) and we've never stopped relying on it since.
That's because time is slower in Canada.
Actually, faster. It's 1 o'clock here.
Reagan made Eisenhower seem like Roosevelt;
Bush II makes Reagan seem like Eisenhower.
I tremble to think who the Republicans will draw from a POD in 2020.
Next up - the 70s.....
I, for one, welcome our polyester-pantsed overlords.
Jeffraham, you'll have to show 4Legs that you too have a budding physicist!
Moe, isn't that 1.30?
On the whole, I wish we'd stayed in Canada.
But maybe that says something about militarist Murka too.
tweedles
That it needs to get its ass kicked, invaded, and its major cities practicaaly razed?
Rudy [Kathryn Jean Lopez]
lays out a tax plan.
Is THAT what the Young Republicans are calling it these days?
A.
I, for one, welcome our polyester-pantsed overlords.
NO FLIRTING.
Sallyh: Jeffraham, you'll have to show 4Legs that you too have a budding physicist!
Unfortunately, Curly seemed completely unimpressed by everything but the feather-on-a-stick.
.
We got Flock of Seagulls and Duran Duran, so quitcher bitchin!
The Kenosha Kid | Homepage | 08.25.07 - 12:02 pm | #
I must admit I have a soft spot for a Flock of Seagulls.
"Wishing" is a really beautiful song, and someday a really smart country band is gonna have a hit covering it. Strip away the synths and it's classic Buddy Holly...
Actually, faster. It's 1 o'clock here.
Moe Szyslak
Half an hour later in Newfoundland.
I work with college students and I can assure you that they don't think it is a normal state of affairs...they are much more politically aware than anyone gives them credit for.
No, 1 o'clock. It's 1:30 in Newfoundland.
JR: you said that, I didn't. I merely remarked on the disparity.
Reagan, AIDS, crack, and the songs were for shit.
I lived in LA during the early 80's. I liked listening to KRKR, (the 'weird' station then) playing Adam Ant, and the other music they had.
Karatist, they are. And so cynical you want to cry.
India is a central front in the waronterra
http://www.outlookindia.com/pti_...s.asp?
id=498719
"Next up - the 70s....."
leisure suits - polyester - quality television like laverne and shirley - the knack - pet rocks - disco -
For a growing chunk of the population, war has been a normal state of affairs during their formative years.
Look at it from the Party's perspective. The durability of the war's a feature, not a bug. The kind of state they want, and from which they profit, cannot exist absent a war. And the fewer people who can imagine, or remember it, otherwise, the easier it will be to maintain.
I merely remarked on the disparity.
tweedles
I merely remarked on the complete difference in initial conditions.
Reagan, AIDS, crack, and the songs were for shit.
Oh, I don't know. The Replacements, REM, Husker Du, U2.
Doesn't seem too awful.
I liked listening to KRKR, (the 'weird' station then) playing Adam Ant, and the other music they had.
Doug | 08.25.07 - 12:10 pm | #
It took me a year to figure out that Adam Ant was a play on words...
On the whole, I wish we'd stayed in Canada.
GWPDA
Sometimes I miss California (and real summer) immensely, but I'm glad I came.
It's working out well, career-wise. But the real difference is things just aren't bat-shit crazy here.
It seems like we elect people who relish war as a chance to raise their own historical stature.
"dividing the occupied country in order to rule it, and paying off some of its natural leaders. That’s what the British did all over the world, what settlers in the United States frequently did to control Indian tribes, and what the French did in North Africa. It’s a return, in other words, to traditional colonialism, and to work in the long run it would require an indefinite presence and flow of arms and money from the United States."
David Kaiser, History Unfolding
dave, I'm so very sorry. Lots of loss for the Trademark household these days.
Sadie's a wonderful cat.
Also, when Vietnam ended, I felt at loose ends-all that free time that used to be spent planning & going to protests.
JR: how true, how true.
Next up - the 70s.....
GWPDA, yclept Irate Scholar
I am NOT dancing to disco music (ever again)!
Jeffraham, Curly's always been particular 
Also, when Vietnam ended, I felt at loose ends-all that free time that used to be spent planning & going to protests.
Karin
Society has used that free time to discover the joys of pubic grooming apparently.
dividing the occupied country in order to rule it, and paying off some of its natural leaders. That’s what the British did all over the world, what settlers in the United States frequently did to control Indian tribes, and what the French did in North Africa. It’s a return, in other words, to traditional colonialism, and to work in the long run it would require an indefinite presence and flow of arms and money from the United States."
David Kaiser, History Unfolding
Um - actually, that's the definition of co-optation and was the foundation of imperialism, not colonialism. The two terms are not interchangeable, nor were the two circumstances. Sorry.
Drive-by before I do the smelly dishes...
Yes, Atrios, but--it's not war like The Great War or any other (no, bush, not even like Vietnam)... It is, instead, a war like an episode/season of the latest television series, reality or otherwise.
Sallyh, in my meatspace life I work with college kids, and they are the purest idealists I know. On their laziest days they work harder to make their world a better place than I do on my most strenuous. Every time I think about hanging it up, going to find an island and just drinking, they remind me why the fight's worth it.
The one thing they're not is cynical. I'm sure some kids their ages are, but not all. The next warrior poets are coming from someplace.
A.
Society has used that free time to discover the joys of pubic grooming apparently.
You say that like it's a bad thing.
"Click here to refresh" parachutes you back about two minutes into the past comments timeline. I hope HaloScan scientists are working feverishly to recalibrate and stick the landing to pick up where you left off.
Because now it's déjŕ vu all over again.
Oh, I don't know. The Replacements, REM, Husker Du, U2.
Don't forget The Minutemen. And X.
Oh, I don't know. The Replacements, REM, Husker Du, U2.
Doesn't seem too awful.
attaturk | Homepage | 08.25.07 - 12:11 pm | #
Tom Petty said it best:
The 80s -- better than the 70s, not as good as the 60s.
That's a shame, dave. Losing two cats in one summer.
There was a time when I was 9 years old that I figured out that if the Vietnam War went on as long as it had already gone on, then I'd be 18 and draft eligible. I was pretty depressed that day, as I recall.
It seems like we elect people who relish war as a chance to raise their own historical stature.
Falstaff
Eisenhower left office under a cloud as a "do-nothing" because he ended the Korean War and didn't fight enough wars otherwise. (apparently proxy wars didn't count)
Like Eisenhower NEEDED to fight more wars.
No, 1 o'clock. It's 1:30 in Newfoundland.
Moe Szyslak
CBC jokes are the only thing that unites Canada
Athenae, I don't mean cynical in the sense that they've given up. They most assuredly have not.
What is sad is that there's no one they can trust, and they're acutely aware of it.
Am I the only one who thinks this is dumb?
http://www.comcast.net/news/nati...l&
cvqh=itn_king
Morning--
Maybe what looks like apathy in the younger set is really cynicism or possibly pragmatism, a belief there isn't much they can do to change things.
We were much more romantic, more naive, maybe, in the early seventies. I continue to battle what are usually losing causes and my kids ask why I bother. I bother because even if I don't "win", it might move the ball towards the goal post for the next advocate. In the environmental arena, you never win, really. You may win for the moment, but they'll be back.
I work with college students and I can assure you that they don't think it is a normal state of affairs...they are much more politically aware than anyone gives them credit for.
I hope so. Maybe this time they'll show up and vote.
"There was a time when I was 9 years old that I figured out that if the Vietnam War went on as long as it had already gone on, then I'd be 18 and draft eligible. I was pretty depressed that day, as I recall."
I r3emmeber thinking the same thing.
Sad news on the cat front...
dave™© | Homepage | 08.25.07 - 12:10 pm | #
Condolences....what a shame.
I think I turned off the radio when the disco era started, and didn't turn it back on for about 15 years.
CBC jokes are the only thing that unites Canada
JR
I made a pretty good one (if I say so) about Rex Murphy in an upcoming article.
Look at it from the Party's perspective. The durability of the war's a feature, not a bug. The kind of state they want, and from which they profit, cannot exist absent a war. And the fewer people who can imagine, or remember it, otherwise, the easier it will be to maintain.
Davis X. Machina, podagric
_____________________________________________
I have come that you may have Death in abundance.
Sallyh - I feel a lot more cynical than the kids I work with, having graduated college and becoming active right around the 2000 election heist.
I'm inspired by their activism, much more so than than my age group at the time.
"Am I the only one who thinks this is dumb?"
No.
For those who prefer cat-on-cat action, I also did video this morning...
.
Sallyh, true, but in some ways I think they're better off not taking things for granted, for having grown up questioning everything. It's given them a real sense of their own power that I don't think I had when I was their age.
I mean, yeah, it's scary, knowing you're not going to be saved by anybody else, but it's exhilarating, too: I can fix this shit and no one can stop me, no one can hold me back.
A.
Damn that is depressing; I honestly hadn't looked at it that way. My son was 13 when this shit started, and now, he's all but a grown man. I talked to my Mother the other day, in a surprisingly not-fucked-up conversation, and she told me she's glad she's near the end of her life; she doesn't think she can bear to watch much more of this. Is it too early to start drinking?
Yeah.
What the fuck happened to The Age Of Aquarius?
Sad news on the cat front...
dave™©
My condolences, dave.
There's a reason why Ike didn't fight wars after stopping the one in Korea. He'd fought one, you know the "good war,", he'd seen the fields of corpses, in fact he ordered those kids on to the beach at Normandy. He knew what war was. The clerisy in DC hasn't, never will.
when Vietnam ended, I felt at loose ends-all that free time that used to be spent planning & going to protests
The reduction of military spending after the Vietnam war, caused a small tech revolution due to all the techy types having to find something else to do. It started during Carter's admin, but Raygun got all the credit. (It wasn't his to flaunt)
Huh. Guess it's not a joke afterall. But true, all the same:
This story reminds me of Rex Murphy, the pompous multisyllabic CBC broadcaster. Say what you will about Rex, but back in the day he successfully cut through similar tuition bullshit. Like a hot knife through butter, he did.
The year was 1965—you weren’t even a walk-of-shame worry yet. But there was this premier, a fellow named Joey Smallwood, who made a bunch of noise about free university tuition, and all the national newspapers started praising his wisdom and so forth. Problem was, it was all smoke and mirrors. Smallwood was juggling the books, turning “tuition” into “big loans to students, payable on graduation” and getting a bunch of positive PR out of it besides.
Murphy was just a lowly college student at the time, but in a nationally televised speech, he called Smallwood all sorts of multisyllabic dirty names, and spelled out exactly how the “free tuition” thing was a scam. The resulting showdown—Smallwood tried to kick Murphy out of the province—saw Murphy victorious and the provincial government ended up in fact giving free tuition to students.
The province? Newfoundland. The university? Memorial.
dave, so sorry for your loss.
A.
What the fuck happened to The Age Of Aquarius?
HoneyBearKelly
The Repukes killed it.
So sorry 'bout your kitty, Dave. They do find their way into our hearts...
I really think those of us who grew up in the 1980s got hosed. Reagan, AIDS, crack, and the songs were for shit.
A.
Athenae
To say nothing of the hair. Oy.
There's a reason why Ike didn't fight wars after stopping the one in Korea. He'd fought one, you know the "good war,", he'd seen the fields of corpses, in fact he ordered those kids on to the beach at Normandy. He knew what war was. The clerisy in DC hasn't, never will.
tweedles
Word.
Jeffraham, shows that boys will be boys
We missed the free love thing, too.
SNAFU--Situation Normal Always Friedman Unit
Eisenhower left office under a cloud as a "do-nothing"
He took his time doing this but he finally stomped on Joe McCarthy. Shut that punk down.
Athenae, very true. They are a determined lot. They keep me optimistic.
My husband is 72. A Korean war vet and really pissed off at this administration. Says its the worst in his lifetime. The thing that makes him angriest is the waste of the youth of this country through the war, lack of healthcare and opportunity to go to college.
"I really think those of us who grew up in the 1980s got hosed. Reagan, AIDS, crack, and the songs were for shit."
70s weren't much fun either.
"There was a time when I was 9 years old that I figured out that if the Vietnam War went on as long as it had already gone on, then I'd be 18 and draft eligible. I was pretty depressed that day, as I recall."
Remembering the length of the Vietnam War is why I think about leaving the US. My son will be 14 in October. If this shit* is still going on when he turns 18, we're getting the hell out of here.
*And by shit, I mean more than the Iraq War -- I mean the whole Rethuglican trashing of America. I don't want my kids growing up in a fucking police state.
Am I the only one who thinks this is dumb?
__________________________________________
Hell no.
Man, I wish I was around your college students, sallyh and athenae. We live a block from the UW campus and it's pretty much all beer, all ROTC on this end.
Athenae, don't forget the fashions of the 80s. Spandex, leg warmers, and I swear I never want to see a shoulder pad again.
Toonscribe: sorry to say, your kids are growing up in a police state. Just sayin'.
As much fun as the sixties were,we had to go through the fifties to get there. Not a lot of fun.
Sorry about your kitty, dave
My granddaughter deserves better than what we're offering.
Oh! And I got ice cube trays @ Target, too.
All that shit fit in my Shad(!), believe it or not. I did have to put the 20oz. Diet Dr. Eli under the seat, after a brief gulp, though.
.
Athenae, don't forget the fashions of the 80s.
Parachute pants!!
I'm really old and this history repeating shit is not something I had expected in my declining years....
I know, I know. Somehow, I thought that all the Viet Nam marches were the last anti-war marches I'd have to do, that I wouldn't still be marching to protect the right to abortion, etc. And here I am, thirty some years later, protesting the same damn shit. Who was it who said that it's not one damn thing after another, it's the same damn thing over and over?
Hecate, Runnymeade Conspirator
Actually, it's going on 40 years ... I was still a kid, but I went to the first peace march in Central Park in April 1967 ... and the civil rights movement and free speech movement had already been underway for a few years by then.
I'm struck by the age of the people who hang out here. We're the old guard. I hope that Athenae is right, and that college kids take up the torch. We can't win this fight without them.
So sorry about the kitty, Dave.
Toonscribe: sorry to say, your kids are growing up in a police state. Just sayin'.
Pretty damn close, but not completely yet, I don't think.
Condolences....what a shame.
Well, she went quick... she was acting really lethargic the past few days and when we took her to the vet, they found very advanced cancer of the kidneys and spleen.
So another one bites the dust. Now we're down to five (and one rabbit) - though I've got my weekly volunteer gig at the local shelter today, so who knows...!?!?!?!
Jeffraham, that's awesome that now you can schlep!
BTW, thanks to everyone for the kind words...
ThinlyVeiled: Parachute pants!!
I had one pair, but never any spandex. Hey, I was in bands.
.
But we're not at war. What we have in Iraq is an *occupation* that is slated to go on indefinitely, even though the objectives of the war have been met. We captured Baghdad, deposed the enemy's leader, and disbanded their military. War's over.
Also, I think the Cold War counts as a war. Growing up in the '80s, I thought there was a pretty good possibility we'd have a nuclear exchange with the Soviets that would result in the death of a large percentage of humanity. Now I'm starting to think that maybe I've been had. The War on Terrorism is largely an effort by the old cold warriors to maintain the Cold War mentality that served their ends so well.
Parachute pants ARE very forgiving..just saying.
What is sad is that there's no one they can trust, and they're acutely aware of it.
Sallyh, Grandmere Poissonniere | 08.25.07 - 12:15 pm | #
There's something to be said for realism...
The old man admitted he had a pair too, this morning when we were watching We Are The 80's on VH-1. He used the band excuse, also, but I think he secretly liked them. 
"I wish I was around your college students, sallyh and athenae. We live a block from the UW campus and it's pretty much all beer, all ROTC on this end."
depends on what college I think of - my main alma mater is full of people with some passion to change things. Another place I took some classes recently is well, not.
it was there I was told the current mess was all my fault because as a self centered baby boomer I had fucked up the world. after all, I had elected the clenis. thank bog things were now getting straightened out. I still don't know what to say to someone like that.
Dave, kitties come to you when you need them. I am sorry for the loss of that lovely girl. I have two calico cats and they certainly have unique personalities...very different from my other cats.
I don't want my kids growing up in a fucking police state.
Just a nice, ordinary, normal country. One with a flag, and a passport, and a mediocre soccer team. With good features, bad features, and a national anthem. And universal health care.
And without a mission civilatrice, White Man's Burden, mandate, or destiny, thank you very much.
Like Belgium, just bigger.
Steve, and they're nothing if not realistic. I admire my students immensely. They really want to make it better.
Parachute pants!!
as a picture frame for the right body, they are nice.
As much fun as the sixties were,we had to go through the fifties to get there. Not a lot of fun.
Here's what I was doing in the '50's:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/924...in/photostream/
(front row on the right side, in pigtails)
Sorry, but I was very fond of the ubiquitous split skirt when that was fashionable.
(Wore them well into the 90's )
Sallyh: Jeffraham, that's awesome that now you can schlep!
Reliably, and at a fairly high rate of speed, to boot!
Tomorrow, I'm going to a picnic, a mile or so from the workplace. Never been over there, so it's an adventure.
I was gonna break bad and ride out to Kingston Springs to see a buddy, but he may be out of town... can't raise him by phone.
.
As the mother of two draft age children, let me say aloud what I fear deeply, which is that we elect a Democrat next time and they resurrect the draft. Bush has set this up perfectly--we're stuck, the military is broken, what next.
So another one bites the dust. Now we're down to five (and one rabbit) - though I've got my weekly volunteer gig at the local shelter today, so who knows...!?!?!?!
Sorry, dave, but something tells me another kittie is going to get a home soon.
The ASPCS has set up a tent at the community fair, and there are lots of dogs and cats waiting to be adopted. Would be hard to go anywhere near the place without falling in love with one of them.
The Age of Aquarius? We got that sucker in spades...
ASPCA
grumble, grumble.
The War on Terrorism is largely an effort by the old cold warriors to maintain the Cold War mentality that served their ends so well.
superdude | 08.25.07 - 12:25 pm | #
Bingo.
Hearing the likes of Hannity insisting that we're in the middle of a Clash of Civilizations would be funny if it wasn't also such an effective scam.....
And they better keep them grades up and keep the loan manna coming or it's selective service 4U!
The Age of Aquarius? We got that sucker in spades...
JR, kerosene and a match
Heh.
Parachute pants?
Never had them.
But I did have a Nehru jacket back in '68-'69. I, too, was in a band.
On the other hand, back in the '80s, I did have a Miami Vice white linen jacket.
The War on Terrorism is largely an effort by the old cold warriors to maintain the Cold War mentality that served their ends so well.
superdude
Yeah ... it's sure making the arms dealers mighty happy, and mighty rich.
I have two daughters, one entering her sophomore year in college, the other her junior year in HS, so they're right in the midst of this group you're describing.
They know their President is a fraud and a buffoon, but since they were mere children, twelve and nine respectively, when he took (and I do mean took) office who can blame them if they have trouble imagining how things could be different?
I've tentatively arranged to be off on September 15 so I expect to be participating in my first march in several decades.
as a picture frame for the right body, they are nice.
I did not know him at the time, but I think you could be right; he is very tall with long, lean legs and a nice behind. I think they probably would have looked very nice on him. Me, not so much...
ThinlyVeiled: The old man admitted he had a pair too, this morning when we were watching We Are The 80's on VH-1. He used the band excuse, also, but I think he secretly liked them.
Pretty comfy, they were... when I was 20.
I remember wanting some Ocean Pacific nylon shorts really bad when I was 18... went to Virginia Beach that summer, after graduation, and all the cool beach bums were wearin' 'em.
.
...kitties come to you when you need them.
Fiona showed up under our porch exactly 24 hours after our cat Cleo passed away.
Hard to argue with that!
And they better keep them grades up and keep the loan manna coming or it's selective service 4U!
bibimimi=^:^= |
08.25.07 - 12:28 pm | #
Congress has removed the college deferment. If there is a draft anyone (under a certain income limit) can be called up.
karin--there's a trip down memory lane for ya! Hands folded on your desk, I can almost smell those pink erasers! You cutey, you
I've tentatively arranged to be off on September 15 so I expect to be participating in my first march in several decades.
SteveLG
Hope to see you there!
"On the other hand, back in the '80s, I did have a Miami Vice white linen jacket."
i still got one, but dunno where i'd wear it....
Just to give some perspective, we left Vietnam just before my 15th birthday. We'd been involved there since before my birth, and in a big way since my babyhood (an uncle of mine was in the Navy and involved in the Gulf of Tonkin incident).
I'm 47 years old now. I never in my life thought that we'd be in the same kind of clusterfuck AGAIN in my lifetime.
AGAIN, goddamnit, AGAIN.
Actually, it's going on 40 years ... I was still a kid, but I went to the first peace march in Central Park in April 1967
I was there too! And I saved the buttons to prove it.
"Fiona showed up under our porch exactly 24 hours after our cat Cleo passed away."
that is waaaay cool.
Jeffraham, the music for your video.. it sounds kinda like Herbie Hancock, but neutered.
...something tells me another kittie is going to get a home soon.
Seriously, five's enough.
Right now we're having a little flea problem because we couldn't really afford the nearly $80 for a month's supply of Frontline/Advantage for them all at the time.
Throw in vet bills and food and - oy!
I gotta put a couple hours into the garden. See ya'all later.
Fiona showed up under our porch exactly 24 hours after our cat Cleo passed away.
Hard to argue with that!
dave™© | Homepage | 08.25.07 - 12:30 pm | #
Oh my god. That is without question the cutest kitten I've ever seen...
On the other hand, back in the '80s, I did have a Miami Vice white linen jacket.
Toonscribe: UDFH Local 839
Hubby, too, and he was teh hawt in it!
i still got one, but dunno where i'd wear it....
I've still got mine squirrelled away in a closet somewhere, but it would no longer fit. Back in the 80s, I had a 29 inch waist. Bought a pair of jeans yesterday -- 36 inch waist. Time to walk more and drive less.
Hope to see you there!
Toucari, fka cosmic tumbler
Well, you know... wherever two or more Atriots are gathered in his name...
If there's an Eschatonian staging area and I'm not working, I'll be there.
That is without question the cutest kitten I've ever seen...
You've never seen Fiona?
Check out this!
And here's a more recent pic.
I've tentatively arranged to be off on September 15 so I expect to be participating in my first march in several decades.
SteveLG
Hope to see you there!
Toucari, fka cosmic tumbler
Yippee! Don't forget to hit the roll call at www.paxamericana.net if you want to keep abreast of Atriot plans.
And then there's The Amazing Oskini!
Society has used that free time to discover the joys of pubic grooming apparently.
During thunderstorms. In bathroom stalls. For 20 bucks.
that is waaaay cool.
jdw |
Homepage |
08.25.07 - 12:31 pm | #
Cats just know. My cat Grusendorf is the self-appointed indoor cat. She decided that she was going to be MY cat and no one else.
My husband tells me that she gets up and walks around looking for me well before I come home from work. We have timed it as I don't always leave the office at the same time...but she is almost always correct. She will start looking for me about the time I leave, not when I should arrive.
Yippee! Don't forget to hit the roll call at www.paxamericana.net if you want to keep abreast of Atriot plans.
V for Virginia
I do and I shall. T'anks!
"(front row on the right side, in pigtails)"
cutie! can i chase you around the playground?
Yippee! Don't forget to hit the roll call at www.paxamericana.net if you want to keep abreast of Atriot plans.
BREASTESSESSSSS!
Society has used that free time to discover the joys of pubic grooming apparently.
During thunderstorms. In bathroom stalls. For 20 bucks.
NTodd, Hungry For Mimi
Oh, I see your problem -- that's not "grooming."
Speaking of cute kittens, here's a pair from the shelter.
Now THAT'S adorable!
Congress has removed the college deferment.
therealhellkitty | 08.25.07 - 12:30 pm | #
Of course. Lookin' out for the people as always. Kee-rist.
"Back in the 80s, I had a 29 inch waist. Bought a pair of jeans yesterday -- 36 inch waist. Time to walk more and drive less."
ha! i can still wear stuff from high school, and much to my wife's chagrin, probably still have some of it....
(an uncle of mine was in the Navy and involved in the Gulf of Tonkin incident).
You do know that incident now appears to have been a fraud, don't you?
http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSA...AEBB/NSAEBB132/
Right now we're having a little flea problem because we couldn't really afford the nearly $80 for a month's supply of Frontline/Advantage for them all at the time.
Tried this?
http://www.gardenharvestsupply.c...32&
idproduct=39
Of course. Lookin' out for the people as always. Kee-rist.
bibimimi=^:^= |
08.25.07 - 12:37 pm | #
oh yes, diligently working away on our behalf....always!
So you have to review a book about why Democrats have been losing. Who to give it to?
Why only the BIGGEST FUCKING CONCERN TROLL OF THE WESTERN WORLD That's who.
Actually, it's going on 40 years ... I was still a kid, but I went to the first peace march in Central Park in April 1967
I was there too! And I saved the buttons to prove it.
Karin
Cool! It was very exciting to be part of something like that.
Okay, the timing is bad, if StatCounter is to be believed, but... I bring you two more cat pixels, and now, I will hop on the scooter for parts undecided.
♥
dave™© is facing the possibility of a Gulf of Tonkinese incident.
you have a rotating opening in your cat roster
cutie! can i chase you around the playground?
People tell me I still have that innocent, sugar-wouldn't-melt-in-her-mouth look. Saved my ass from being arrested at least a few times, I think.
Throw in vet bills and food and - oy!
Wait until you have to send them to college!
Why only the BIGGEST FUCKING CONCERN TROLL OF THE WESTERN WORLD That's who.
Good grief. Bobo.
Wait until you have to send them to college!
pie |
08.25.07 - 12:42 pm | #
and pay for the wedding!
Why only the BIGGEST FUCKING CONCERN TROLL OF THE WESTERN WORLD That's who.
Gomez
Oh, broTHER. "Fundamentalist Democrats?"
FOAD, Brooks.
Tried this?
http://www.gardenharvestsupply.c...32& idproduct=39
bloggus
I wonder why they have it listed as an insect repellent. It's not a repellant, it's an insecticide.
Dunno how well it will work on fleas, might be worth a try.
The Washington Post, which many liberals mistakenly assume to be liberal, usually takes traditional conservative positions, ie. they're not fire breathers. The most notable of its conservative positions is its unequivocal support for our excellent Iraq adventure.
For the 1st time, I'm seeing readers' dissent of WP war support published. From today's paper:
Your Aug. 21 editorial "Tougher On Iran" indicated that the spirit of Paul D. Wolfowitz and his neocon soul mates -- above all, Vice President Cheney -- continues to dominate your thinking. Once again "according to the Pentagon" is cited as a standard of proof; European caution is dismissed; Chinese and Russian objections are given no weight.
We have seen this show; it "bombed," and it does not bear repeating. To its everlasting shame, The Post was in the forefront of the cheerleading that helped give us the Iraq disaster. Regarding Iran, you appear poised to reprise your disgraceful advocacy.
No one expects the Bush administration to learn from its mistakes, but we expect better of The Post.
I really think those of us who grew up in the 1980s got hosed. Reagan, AIDS, crack, and the songs were for shit.
A.
Athenae | Homepage | 08.25.07 - 12:01 pm |
Actually, there was a lot of good 80's stuff, it just didn't get played on the radio.
I didn't find out about it until college, when my dormmates who were way cooler than I, let me know there was a hell of a lot of interesting stuff out there.
Of course, if I ever hear The Pogues again, I'll have to harm someone.
"Saved my ass from being arrested at least a few times, I think."
oh my, a mischievous streak, too....
"Fundamentalist Democrats?"
Right up there with "fundamentalist atheists"
Speaking of Cats, a little advice? Ever since the arrival of Baby Kitty, Old Man Cat has taken to "marking" around the house. I'm growing quite tired of having to clean it up. Is this something I should just wait out, or is there something I can do to discourage it? I've never had more than one cat before.
People tell me I still have that innocent, sugar-wouldn't-melt-in-her-mouth look. Saved my ass from being arrested at least a few times, I think.
People tell me I still have that psycho, gonna-snap-and-kill-everybody-if-you-fuck-with-me look. Amazing I haven't been arrested.
Hello moonbats
niece has returned home, quite worn out!
oh yes, diligently working away on our behalf....always!
therealhellkitty | 08.25.07 - 12:39 pm
you might enjoy this:
Tim Murphy (R) 18th Congressional District of PA locks his constituents out of his office:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V...h?v=VUT3BEfcl-
s
If this is old news, forgive me.
Heh - this Broderick Crawford movie features a character named "Jolie Angelino".
Dunno how well it will work on fleas, might be worth a try.
JR, kerosene and a match |
08.25.07 - 12:43 pm | #
DE has a micro crystalline structure which cuts the carapace of the insect. They dehydrate and die. It is very effective but be careful not to get on mucous membranes or in the kitties eyes.
I have found that insanity keeps people from messing with you, and hence you get into less trouble.
"Why only the BIGGEST FUCKING CONCERN TROLL OF THE WESTERN WORLD That's who."
it reads like a parody of brooks.
I was in the first year of my A Levels when the war started and now I've recently graduated from university.
how time flies
Of course, if I ever hear The Pogues again, I'll have to harm someone
river river have mercy,
take me down to the sea......
Doug...yup. I think he knew it too, at the time.
This uncle came home from the war, went to college, started going to peace marches as a VVAW, moved in with his married sister and her family, smoked dope, drove a VW Bug, and played loud rock and roll.
God, what a formative influence in my young years!
DE has a micro crystalline structure which cuts the carapace of the insect. They dehydrate and die. It is very effective but be careful not to get on mucous membranes or in the kitties eyes.
therealhellkitty
Exactly... mechanical pesticide... not a repellent.
really nice August Bank Holiday Weekend photos of my niece
Tried this?
I'll check it out!
The real problem is Oski is allergic to fleas. The other cats don't seem bothered one way or the other.
Congress has removed the college deferment. If there is a draft any male between 18 and 26 can be called up.
Fixed your typo.
Dunno how well it will work on fleas, might be worth a try.
I've been using it on my dog and two cats for almost a year now and it works very well. They all live indoors, I'm not sure how effective it would be for outdoor critters.
ThinlyVeiled -- Maybe someone has better input than I, but make sure you pay more attention to Old Mean Guy than to Baby Kitty. I make a point of greeting my established people before the new kid, talk to them a lot, etc.
It's not perfect, but it seems to be better.
War IS A Racket by Major General Butler is a must read.
Written in 1935
I spent 33 years and four months in active military service as a member of this country's most agile military force, the Marine Corps. I served in all commissioned ranks from Second Lieutenant to Major General. And during that period, I spent most of my time being a high class muscle-man for Big Business, for Wall Street and for the Bankers. In short, I was a racketeer, a gangster for capitalism.
The War in Iraq is about nothing except Money.
Congress has removed the college deferment. If there is a draft any male between 18 and 26 can be called up.
Fixed your typo.
GWPDA, yclept Irate Scholar |
Homepage |
08.25.07 - 12:48 pm
Thanks and you should know, too!
" I'm growing quite tired of having to clean it up. Is this something I should just wait out, or is there something I can do to discourage it?"
he won't grow out of it. get him on prozac. stat.
ThinlyVeiled - he needs to be (gulp) neutered. My kitten still has a few months to go.
Wait!
How is Adam Ant a play on words?
i've been worrying as little as possible about the current state of affairs this weekend
been enjoying the glorious sunshine, current temp is 25°C (77°F) plus the company of my darling niece!
we had a BBQ earlier and drank Pimms, most civilized
I still think there will not be a draft like we had up to 1973 or so.
I think this time it'll be tied to things like student loans. Want a student loan? Join the army.
that way they can claim they're actually increasing opportunities for people to go to college.
How is Adam Ant a play on words?
smalfish
remove the space
Thinly Veiled, bitter apple smells good to humans but cats hate it. It stops the marking.
ThinlyVeiled -- Maybe someone has better input than I, but make sure you pay more attention to Old Mean Guy than to Baby Kitty. I make a point of greeting my established people before the new kid, talk to them a lot, etc.
It's not perfect, but it seems to be better.
V for Virginia
That sounds right ... he's probably jealous, and feels like his territory is threatened. I was lucky with my two (same scenario as yours, but my older cat is not territorial) ... btw, is the kitten a male or a female?
Adamant...resolute, pricky
V for V, we do make a diligent effort to remind Vlad that he was here first. Problem is, he was never overly affectionate in the first place, and now seems to be even more standoffish. He has been slowly returning to climbing onto the lap for pets, etc., so I think there is progress, but he's such a curmudgeon in general, it's hard to tell.
Speaking of 80s music, I totally was baffled by my younger friends enthusiasm for the Pixies back in the day. Didn't get 'em at all.
Now, invariably whenever I hear a song on a jukebox that I like but don't know what it is, it turns out to be -- you guessed it, the Pixies.
Go figure....
hey Britain is further along in the race to become a police state ya know!
smallfish: adamant, adamantine or diamond like also "hard".
The War in Iraq is about nothing except Money.
That's pretty much what most wars are about -- who's going to be in charge, who's going to make the money. It's like competeing gangs worrying about somebody muscling in on their territory and rackets.
Ok, it's still unpleasant outside, and I don't feel like housekeeping.
Poll:
Blade of Darkness
or
Medieval: Total War
The .avi file and BitTorrent are proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy.
Chris Tucker
No, silly, beer is proof, etc.
(h/t Ben Franklin)
I still think there will not be a draft like we had up to 1973 or so.
Anything can happen. However, there is a Selective Service and there is a Selective Service Act which governs what is called 'the draft'. If there is to be a draft and if this country's administration chooses to obey the law, the draft will be conducted under the existing law. If this country's administration chooses to disregard the law and is allowed by Congress to do so, then anything at all can happen.
Cool! It was very exciting to be part of something like that.
I still remember we were in a big mass of people assembling in midtown, and then seeing the Harlem contingent coming down 5th Avenue to join us. Because Manhattan slopes downhill you could see a long river of mostly black folks, fast stepping and chanting, for blocks and blocks, as far as the eye could see. I'm pretty sure MLK & Stokely Carmichael,were in the front row with some other notables. Still one of the most awesome things I've ever seen.
That's pretty much what most wars are about -- who's going to be in charge, who's going to make the money. It's like competeing gangs worrying about somebody muscling in on their territory and rackets.
Toonscribe
Milo!
Vlad is 13, and already "fixed." Baby Kitty is probably about 5 months (best guess, she was an abandoned stray), female, and not yet spayed.
i will say I'm currently turned off by the current state of British politics
I thought you meant atom ant...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g...h?
v=g4F7w4mQTnw
Thinly Veiled, bitter apple smells good to humans but cats hate it. It stops the marking.
Sallyh, Grandmere Poissonniere
And white vinegar, although it doesn't smell so good, is the best thing I've ever seen for really getting rid of cat pee smell. (You have to really soak down whatever it's on.) The smell abates after a couple of days. Much more effective than any commercial product I've ever tried.
War IS A Racket by Major General Butler is a must read.
Written in 1935
SMEDLEY!
JR, kerosene and a match |
08.25.07 - 12:52 pm | #
I have been avoiding cleaning the shower and mopping the floor quite successfully for several hours. Why shouldn't you?
Blade of Darkness
or
Medieval: Total War
I like Medieval: Total War.
Since I got a new computer a year ago, however, I can't get the map to show up when I load the game. Any ideas?
Thinly Veiled, bitter apple smells good to humans but cats hate it. It stops the marking.
Sallyh, Grandmere Poissonniere
Awful stuff! I can't think why Two Legs Tall gives it houseroom.
Of all people, Joe Klein.
Well, I suppose it was inevitable that the Weekly Standard would figure out some way to trash the 7 enlisted men from the 82nd Airborne, who wrote the courageous Op-Ed piece about the unreliability of our Iraqi allies in the New York Times last Sunday. At least the piece is written by other Iraq war vets and the tone is respectful...although the neocons continue to try to use Anbar, an all-Sunni province, as an avatar of what will happen in the rest of Iraq, which is utter nonsense.
But where on earth are the Democratic politicians on this? Why haven't they embraced the grunts from the 82nd the way the Republicans have embraced the "liberal" Brookings scholars? It's just very frustrating and truly outrageous.
For a change, he's not wrong, especially that bit at the end about the Dems.
After the FISA debacle, how anybody can still cling to the belief that they're not utterly useless is beyond me....
And no, I'm not voting for Nader, so don't anybody give me that shit.
now seems to be even more standoffish.
Yeah -- he's offended. Pile on the lovin' whenever he's willing.
I tremble to think who the Republicans will draw from a POD in 2020.
attaturk
Well, Atta J., we just haveta work real hard to ensure that there won't be no Podnas.
Stay alive, stay well, and don't be silent in the face of these mendacious rapacious and utterly heartless thugs.
Don't drink, don't smoke, what do you do?
Where do I find this "bitter apple" of which you speak?
I'm not telling.
.
Blade of Darkness
or
Medieval: Total War
Starship Titanic.
(No -- it's hilarious. I even scavenged an old Win'98 computer to run it on, although I haven't hooked it up yet.)
Tim Murphy (R) 18th Congressional District of PA locks his constituents out of his office:
Nice representative democracy we have here.
Thanks for that link. I knew they were scumbags, but this is definite proof.
Any ideas?
Toonscribe:
Is the OS XP and the video card a Radeon?
"Speaking of 80s music, I totally was baffled by my younger friends enthusiasm for the Pixies back in the day. "
the wife got a dvd of them at newport at the library. i had no idea who they were and was pretty shocked to learn how long ago they were popular.
i found the late 70's and 80's to be so depressing, musically, i was still in the 60's and early 70's.
Don't drink, don't smoke, what do you do?
JR, kerosene and a match |
08.25.07 - 12:55 pm | #
<evil grin>
Thinly Veiled, a pet store like Petsmart or Petco or Tags carries it. It's not super cheap, but it's well worth it. I forget the name of it exactly, but someone in the store will know.
every decade as good and bad music, and I have little time for people who say 'this or that decade bad or all music after (insert year) is shit'
sorry but it just annoys me immensely
Speaking of 80s music, I totally was baffled by my younger friends enthusiasm for the Pixies back in the day. Didn't get 'em at all.
Now, invariably whenever I hear a song on a jukebox that I like but don't know what it is, it turns out to be -- you guessed it, the Pixies.
Go figure....
steve simels | Homepage | 08.25.07 - 12:51 pm
I'm surprised that The Pixies didn't get played more on Dayton radio in the 80's, considering Ms. Deal was from Dayton.
OTOH, they did play The Breeders.
But where on earth are the Democratic politicians on this? Why haven't they embraced the grunts from the 82nd the way the Republicans have embraced the "liberal" Brookings scholars? It's just very frustrating and truly outrageous.
For a change, he's not wrong, especially that bit at the end about the Dems.
I wonder if watertiger would mind very much if I borrowed her desk for just a moment?
Bitter apple spray:
http://www.drsfostersmith.com/pr...&pc=1&N=0&
Nty=1
But where on earth are the Democratic politicians on this? Why haven't they embraced the grunts from the 82nd the way the Republicans have embraced the "liberal" Brookings scholars? It's just very frustrating and truly outrageous.
Well, it pains me to agree with him, but he's spot on.
Thanks, Sallyh, I will look for it next time I make a run.
Bill Maher made a similar point about the Dems last night. I was irked at first, because why take time away from bashing Bush and Republicans, but he's right. And why the despair runs deep.
What is Haloscan always 4 minutes ahead of the atomic clock?
Tetris + Geography
Ebenezer Le Page
Oh, tay good gawd, just what I need . . .
When Clinton was elected the first time, I felt this tremendous relief. But now I think it was like that part in the horror movie just before you see the hidden egg of the space alien hatch or the hand stick up from underground.
Tetris + Geography
Ebenezer Le Page |
08.25.07 - 12:59 pm | #
I hope this isn't a team sport. Americans won't have a chance.
I was also at this one. Out of a whole busload from my college, I was the ONLY one who DIDN'T get arrested.
On Monday, May 3rd, 1971 one of the most disruptive actions of the Vietnam War era occurred in Washington, DC, when thousands of anti-war activists tried to shut down the Federal government in protest of the Vietnam War. The threat caused by the May Day Protests forced the Nixon Administration to create a virtual state of siege in the Nation’s Capital. Thousands of Federal and National Guard troops, along with local police, suppressed the disorder and by the time it was over several days later, over 10,000 would be arrested. It would be the largest mass arrest in U.S. history.
(From Wikipedia
That's pretty much what most wars are about -- who's going to be in charge, who's going to make the money...
Butler is true, but thinking small. His was a smaller world.
War profiteering and the armaments trade in sensu stricto are simply the froth on the pot. Profits from the war-as-such are the equivalent of the chips you toss the dealer when you get up from the table.
The war, properly exploited, should make it possible for the Party to submit the budget, re-write the tax code, fill the judiciary, create the regulatory environment, and manage fiscal policy for the most powerful nation, and the largest economy, in the world, deep into mid-century.
The potential ROI for a few thousand US lives, a few hundred thousand Iraqi lives, a few hundred billion over five or six years, is in the trillions.
Robbing banks is unskilled manual labor. Who needs to rob a bank when you can buy the bank, sell the bank building, and write the statute of fraud out of the statute books?
When Clinton was elected the first time, I felt this tremendous relief. But now I think it was like that part in the horror movie just before you see the hidden egg of the space alien hatch or the hand stick up from underground.
rootless2
Let's hope you're not saying this in 2015
Thousands of Federal and National Guard troops, along with local police, suppressed the disorder and by the time it was over several days later, over 10,000 would be arrested. It would be the largest mass arrest in U.S. history.
Now they'd just shoot them.
pixies yay!
When Clinton was elected the first time, I felt this tremendous relief.
Me too. Imagine my disappointment when I found out he wasn't the liberal I thought I had voted for.
The war, properly exploited, should make it possible for the Party to submit the budget, re-write the tax code, fill the judiciary, create the regulatory environment, and manage fiscal policy for the most powerful nation, and the largest economy, in the world, deep into mid-century.
The potential ROI for a few thousand US lives, a few hundred thousand Iraqi lives, a few hundred billion over five or six years, is in the trillions.
Don't forget that the real profits are in the management of the masses. Power is a tangible product, to be bought and sold.
Now they'd just shoot them.
V for Virginia
Which may explain this generation's lack of direct action
i've only been on 1 anti war march, no one was arrested as far as I know.
Is the OS XP and the video card a Radeon?
Windows XP, but can't remember what the video card is or where I've stashed the info. Still hunting. The computer's a Dell Dimension E310.
When Clinton was elected the first time, I felt this tremendous relief.
Me too. Imagine my disappointment when I found out he wasn't the liberal I thought I had voted for.
steve simels
We had an inaugural ball. People went and bought formal wear and thrift stores. We ended the evening dancing in the streets to the tune of "Don't Stop Thinkin' About Tomorrow."
Should anything good happen in November of next year the celebration is likely to kill me.
Although often-times when the press accuses Democrats of being silent on an issue it is because they haven't bothered to listen... but in this case...
I think most Democrats in power are under the delusion that the American people simply don't understand details when it comes to war and feel they must stick to slogans.
for my age group, i get the sense they do have political views and believe in causes but mainstream politics does not address them, it seems remote and well dull, or rather stale, same old bollocks.
Now they'd just shoot them.
V for Virginia
Which may explain this generation's lack of direct action
noblejoanie | 08.25.07 - 1:05 pm | #
You think it was an accident that the anti-Vietnam War movement ground to pretty much a screeching halt right after Kent State?
As a character in Catch-22 said, the bastards were trying to kill us.
at least here in the UK, the political debate remains in a rut, with both sides showing little knowledge of their own political history, they only know half of it sadly.
Me too. Imagine my disappointment when I found out he wasn't the liberal I thought I had voted for.
steve simels | Homepage | 08.25.07 - 1:04 pm | #
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I think he was that liberal, but he was a coward and selfish and easily flattered too - and he sold us all out for a couple of million and some corporate speaking gigs.
You think it was an accident that the anti-Vietnam War movement ground to pretty much a screeching halt right after Kent State?
As a character in Catch-22 said, the bastards were trying to kill us.
steve simels
I do. I remember a kind of depression setting into the antiwar movement after Kent State.
Steve, the bastards are still trying to kill us.
I didn't vote for Bill because he was liberal. I voted for him because I was sick of the past twelve years.
As a character in Catch-22 said, the bastards were trying to kill us.
steve simels | Homepage | 08.25.07 - 1:08 pm | #
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Malcom X, MLK, RFK, Fred Hampton, dead.
And so many to jail.
And a certain number got bought.
And so many reporters purged.
And the lessons were learned.
The alternative to Clinton was too appalling to consider.
little kiddies might be in for a rude shock one of these days. wot me go??!!
I have no idea who I will be voting for at the next general election.
and sometimes I think 'why bother?'
Windows XP, but can't remember what the video card is or where I've stashed the info. Still hunting. The computer's a Dell Dimension E310.
Toonscribe
I have found that with certain games that were pre-XP and certain video cards not everything will make it. Some video cards/chips released updated drivers to address the problem, but some older cards remain sadly unpatched.
Advise... look for patches from the game company and newer drivers from the video card maker, or try running it in 98 compatability mode.
I didn't vote for Bill because he was liberal. I voted for him because I was sick of the past twelve years.
smalfish,beatnik | 08.25.07 - 1:10 pm | #
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I remember wincing as I walked past TVs that were featuring Bush I's whiny voice. It was such a relief to have that gone.
Toons, you could look in the Admin Tools and look under computer management--it should give details about your hardware.
Is the OS XP and the video card a Radeon?
I found the info.
The OS is XP.
Video card is a 256 MB ATI Radeon X600 HyperMemory.
According to my journal, 10 years ago this summer, my top three concerns were:
1. Fallen limb causing small damage to roof.
2. Possible hip dysplasia (ended up being arthritis) in Old Boy.
3. The new CD's I was buying wouldn't play in my old CD player.
What a difference a decade makes.
Time for yard work.
BBL.
Let's hope you're not saying this in 2015
noblejoanie | 08.25.07 - 1:02 pm | #
I hate to say it, but that's not the worst plausible alternative by a long shot.
Every time someone doesn't vote because the perfect candidate isn't on offer, god kills a kitten.
plus there was socks, first cat
The OS is XP.
Video card is a 256 MB ATI Radeon X600 HyperMemory.
Toonscribe
Ok, definitely a mismatch issue... some 98 games don't play entirely well with Radeons in XP... my advice above stands.
Every time someone doesn't vote because the perfect candidate isn't on offer, god kills a kitten.
V for Virginia | 08.25.07 - 1:13 pm | #
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I believe in St. Molly Ivins line "the lesser of two evils is less evil." In Moon's defense, however, it is not at all clear that Bliar was the lesser of two evils - even though it certainly seemed so at one time.
its not about whether a candidate is perfect or not, is just fed up feeling with the whole damn system.
the ruling class do their very best to fix the parameters, rig it in their favour
thats how I feel sometimes
other days I am more positive
I'm sorry but war has NOT been a normal state of affairs during anyone's years, except for those who have someone over there. You can walk down any street in America and not tell that we're involved in a war as we "go shopping" like president bitch loves for us to do. Let's get real here please. Ty.
JR & Sallyh - thanks for the advice.
Now if I could just get my old Boston Digital BA735 speakers to work with this damn computer, life would be sweet.
I believe in St. Molly Ivins line "the lesser of two evils is less evil."
Damn, I miss her.
American children entering College know nothing of war compared to the Iraqi children of the same age. Thing what we've done to the kids over there.
"I didn't vote for Bill because he was liberal."
i think in his heart of hearts, bill was a big gvt bleeding heart....as i think most dems are, even if they don't show it.
he's easy to bash, but i'd give anything for a little hope and sanity right now...
There's nothing wrong with the situation in Iraq that can't be solved with a Gen. Petraeus™-brand Premium Pro Gold Service Pack 4 install and reboot
Steve, the bastards are still trying to kill us.
Sallyh, Grandmere Poissonniere | 08.25.07 - 1:10 pm | #
Believe me, I know. It's just that Kent State was so blatant and a lot o us were naive enough to think that it couldn't happen.
One word: Anthrax.
Labour always comes out with a snappy soundbite and grabs headlines but then when the publicity has died down, we find out the 'new' policy is underfunded or delayed, things like that
and don't even get me started on the scandal that is PPP/PFI
the Tories aren't much better and the Lib Dems barely register these days.
Now if I could just get my old Boston Digital BA735 speakers to work with this damn computer, life would be sweet.
Toonscribe
Huh? Like monitors, there shouldn't be any "compatability" problems... check your speakers and wires.
I'm sorry but war has NOT been a normal state of affairs during anyone's years, except for those who have someone over there. You can walk down any street in America and not tell that we're involved in a war as we "go shopping" like president bitch loves for us to do. Let's get real here please.
Bullshit. War has direct influence in the economy. It has a psychological effect as well. The only ones ignoring it, are the ones who support it.
I'm sorry but war has NOT been a normal state of affairs during anyone's years, except for those who have someone over there
Except that people are inured to the idea that certain basic principles have to be sacrificed in order to protect the world from terror, and war appears to be something not that bad, since so many people are not touched with it in any way.
the ruling class do their very best to fix the parameters, rig it in their favour
thats how I feel sometimes
other days I am more positive
Moonbootica, Graduate | Homepage | 08.25.07 - 1:15 pm | #
The first part is always true. How you fell about it goes up and down.
"war appears to be something not that bad, since so many people are not touched with it in any way."
but...but...i paid $3.95 for thie yellow magnetic ribbon....
Huh? Like monitors, there shouldn't be any "compatability" problems... check your speakers and wires.
I've tried all that -- which is what mystified me originally. I went on the web a couple of months ago and found that this particular make of Boston speakers was made expressly for Gateway (back when I had a Gateway computer) and they don't work with anyone else's computer. At least that's what the website said.
There is nothing wrong with this thread that some fresh sheets won't cure.
The Clinton Years
Its easy to be critical of Bill. But for the time period, for we liberals, its the best we could do. The country was right of center, the MSM & the big money were overwhelmingly dominant over our political process & liberalism was in a state of disarray.
Clinton was the opening wedge for the left. He broke the right's grip on the presidency & the national discourse. Sure, he wasn't a true liberal but he was the best we could do for the time if we wanted to win.
but...but...i paid $3.95 for thie yellow magnetic ribbon....
jdw
I'm sure you could have gotten one for 2.88 at Wal*Mart. Made guess where, of god knows what.
Suez Fertilizers Company workers on strike
Damn, I miss her.
V for Virginia
Yeah, me too also, V.
I have found a new columnist who is showing signs of providing us with the same kind of snarkful analysis that Molly Ivins gave us: Rosa Brooks
The scale of the human disaster in the Iraq war has become clearer from statistics collected by two humanitarian groups that reveal the number of Iraqis who have fled the fighting has more than doubled since the US military build-up began in February.
The Iraqi Red Crescent Organisation said the total number of internally displaced has jumped from 499,000 to 1.1 million since extra US forces arrived with the aim of making the country more secure. The UN-run International Organisation for Migration says the numbers fleeing fighting in Baghdad grew by a factor of 20 in the same period.
These damning statistics reveal that despite much- trumpeted security improvements in certain areas, the level of murderous violence has not declined. The studies reveal that the number of Iraqis fleeing their homes not intending to return is far higher than before the US surge.
http://news.independent.co.uk/
wo...icle2893884.ece
At least that's what the website said.
Toonscribe
Website is full of shit. I just looked 'em up.
You need to use digital output (hence the "Digital" in the name).. you may have to update your soundcard's drivers for that.
Or you could get a set of Altec Lansing speakers... very good ROI.
Good news for those depressed by the wettest summer since 1956: the August Bank Holiday offers respite from the almost relentless rain over the UK, with forecasters predicting temperatures of 24C (75F) and dry, fine weather in much of Britain.
But for motorists taking advantage of the last long weekend before the new school term in September, the AA predicts widespread traffic jams,with 18 million cars expected to travel an average of more than 77 miles each.
More than a third of Britons are planning to get away this weekend, with 80 per cent heading for the sea. The AA said jams would be worst in Newquay, Torquay, Bournemouth, Brighton, and Great Yarmouth. Major routes to avoid include the M25, the M1 northbound, the M4 westbound, the M6 and M5. Roadworks remain on the M1 between junctions 6a and 10 near Luton in Bedfordshire, and the M4 at junction 12 near Reading.
http://news.independent.co.uk/
uk...icle2893905.ece
Check in the Advanced Properties "Play Control" and check off the "digital output only" if it's there.
Clinton was the opening wedge for the left. He broke the right's grip on the presidency & the national discourse. Sure, he wasn't a true liberal but he was the best we could do for the time if we wanted to win.
Carter | 08.25.07 - 1:23 pm | #
I'm less sanguine about him. I think the DLC brand of triangulating centrism has been on balance a disaster.
I'll grant you Clinton probably did the best he could given the extremely weak hand he was dealt, but I think by and large his impact on the Democratic Party has been pernicious.
The Iraqi Red Crescent Organisation said the total number of internally displaced has jumped from 499,000 to 1.1 million since extra US forces arrived with the aim of making the country more secure. The UN-run International Organisation for Migration says the numbers fleeing fighting in Baghdad grew by a factor of 20 in the same period.
It's not possible the number of killed civilians falling is a product of the number fleeing, is it? I don't suppose that the dying while fleeing is a stat of war.
A long-standing mystery over the way men's skulls changed from long to round in medieval Europe has been deepened by discoveries at a Yorkshire village.
Huge volumes of data collected at Wharram Percy cast doubt on all current theories about the unexplained blip between the 11th and 13th centuries which has been recorded by archaeologists across the continent.
Immigration and climate change have been the two main hypotheses but neither makes sense of the 700 Yorkshire skeletons. They are expected to cause widespread revision of the period's history, as the first large-scale find from a single, accurately-dated indigenous community.
The leading theory, that Scandinavian incomers brought new racial characteristics to the rest of Europe, does not make sense at Wharram, a lonely valley in the Wolds near Malton. Its natural isolation was reinforced during the 200 years of the skull change by plague and sheep blight which soon after led to its abandonment.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/scienc...e/2007/aug/25/
1
Or you could get a set of Altec Lansing speakers... very good ROI.
Been looking at those.
While nosing around again, I've found a few other things that are supposed to fix the problem. I'll give those a try. I really liked the sound out of these Bostons.
Bye for now.
It's not possible the number of killed civilians falling is a product of the number fleeing, is it? I don't suppose that the dying while fleeing is a stat of war.
smalfish,beatnik
That's a good question, smalfish, but even if those deaths are not tallied, the fact that many thousands have been uprooted from their homes with no safe place to go is a bad enough statistic.
"but I think by and large his impact on the Democratic Party has been pernicious."
i don't know about that, except to say that him getting his dick sucked was a monumental error. because if he hadn't, we'd have had gore, and i don't see much dlc in him.
further, the influence of the dlc seems to be waning with each day...
i don't know about that, except to say that him getting his dick sucked was a monumental error. because if he hadn't, we'd have had gore, and i don't see much dlc in him.
Gore, like Edwards, is a threat to the powers that be. Clinton was not so much a threat and he was allowed to president, but he was kept on a short leash.
"national greatness!"-William Kristol as the war lasts 27563437265 years
Who was it who said that it's not one damn thing after another, it's the same damn thing over and over?
Edna St. Vincent Millay.
But for those of you who find Duncan's factoid depressing, take heart from this: the national Alzheimer's amnesia of America means that, a few short years after this current war ends, no college freshmen will be able to be found who remember it nor who will even be able to tell you the least thing about it nor about how it started. *
And then, of course, those freshmen will graduate and mature and will vote for jingoistic morons who will start similar wars, and the cycle of life and death, American style, will begin anew.
(* My morose attitude about this was reinforced by a piece read to me by my sweetheart the other day, about the impenetrable ignorance of the entering US college freshman cohort about the Cold War years. A quite substantial percentage of those kids would not even be able to have told you who the adversaries of the US during that period were. Santayana had it right: those who will not remember the lessons of history are condemned to repeat them.)
--
For a growing chunk of the population, war has been a normal state of affairs during their formative years.
which means that except for the few who have lost brothers and sisters, all that American youth know of war is that it is someone else's problem and thank goodness it doesn't interrupt their video games in the least.
.
Just like the Vietnam war I grew up with... always in the background until I was old enough to do something about it.
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