I'MMA LET YOU FINISH
Also, the government used to regulate investment banks.
thanks snake goddess.
Andrew Sullivan on radical black preachers, then and now.
Indeed, P O'Neill. And utilities which provide electricity.
Grover Norquist almost made me lose my dinner while watching TDS the other night. What. A. Moron.
WAPISH!
And if you are the type of eat chicken giblets there is a recall of ones from Alabama.
WASHINGTON, March 14, 2008 - Cagle's Inc., a Collinsville, Ala., establishment, is voluntarily recalling approximately 943,000 pounds of various fresh and frozen poultry giblets and fresh carcasses with giblets inserted that may be adulterated due to improper disposition of the giblets, the U.S. Department of Agriculture's Food Safety and Inspection Service announced today.
One of six food recalls this week
But everybody knows what the proper role of government is--bailing out huge Wall St firms who took on too much risk and made a bunch of bad bets!
their attitude was, no wonder they're so toxic. They think they know everything.
Sallyh
OK, time for the bazookas.
Obama's "momentum" is grinding to a halt. The Republicans know how fickle the American public is and Hillary would be more difficult to beat by the time November rolls around. Obama has a mere 3 years federal legislative experience and lacks executive experience. He is underqualified and he can't talk his way around that.
..and time for somw diseased wolverine dick, trollie.
JR, not worth it. Mlle told her husband she's trying to get by the easy way in the place, and that it was really starting to work her last nerve.
I'm troubled that they immediately stopped her bipolar meds upon admission.
Here's one for NTodd:
Careful with that coffee! Police say a man placing an order in a suburban New York doughnut shop's drive-through lane didn't have any pants on.
They say a Dunkin' Donuts worker saw John Greco's exposed genitals in the Feb. 27 stunt and then noted the make of his car and his license plate number.
Police say the 46-year-old Croton-on-Hudson resident was arrested last week and has been charged with misdemeanor public lewdness. He's due in court March 27.
Police released a statement Thursday saying it was "unknown how Mr. Greco took his coffee that day."
Greco says by telephone from his home that he has no comment on the police report.
Anyone remember how we were told we couldn't import drugs from Canada because they might not be safe?
Yeah, right.
Bugs | 03.15.08 - 6:06 pm | #
Fuck Off, Racist Pig
Sallyh,
I left you a long-winded screed on the thread below.
Blessings to you.
What we should be doing is offering to scrub the government's back.
And maybe get it a nice cup of tea.
Echidne,
You mean we don't want the "free hand of the market" to take care of it?
I'd put a little laughie-face emoticon in there, but it's just not funny, is it?
President Obama will be quite capable
WAPISH!
I'm sorry, you're much cuter than Gordon the Magnificent.
Enron Founder's Widow Sued by Condo
Mar 15th, 2008 | HOUSTON -- The neighbors of the widow of Enron Corp. founder Kenneth Lay have sued her, accusing her of not paying her share of fees associated with living in one of Houston's most exclusive high-rises.
Linda Lay is already fighting an attempt by the federal government to seize nearly $13 million from Kenneth Lay's estate, including the family condominium at The Huntingdon.
The lawsuit by The Huntingdon Council of Co-Owners seeks more than $100,000 in unpaid fees from Linda Lay or foreclosure of her condo, which tax records value at about $4.75 million.
Mrs. ibrahim al-jafaari
Spread them legs wide!
Whoops, gotta motor. l8rh9rz.
I'm troubled that they immediately stopped her bipolar meds upon admission.
This sounds really worrying. Did they contact her prescribing physician at least?
I'm troubled that they immediately stopped her bipolar meds upon admission.
Sallyh
Isn't that malpractice?
Comment by Bugs blocked.
How can we miss him if he won't go the fuck away?
Anyone remember how we were told we couldn't import drugs from Canada because they might not be safe?
Ooooh, that there is a blog post, son.
Mrs. ibrahim al-jafaari stop the insults and so will I.
Gomez,
From last thread:
:/
But everybody knows what the proper role of government is--bailing out huge Wall St firms who took on too much risk and made a bunch of bad bets!
drowning Bears, Stearns in a bathtub was decidedly NOT what Grover had in mind. he was thinking more along the likes of the Consumer Products Safety Commission, or the OSHA and the FDA.
welfare as we know it is all good, as long as it's the stockholdrs getting them thar welfare checks.
Bugs | 03.15.08 - 6:06 pm | #
Senator Clinton has disavowed you and asked you to please stop you are not helping.
JR, I don't know. But no wonder the kid was flipping out for weeks on end. She was evaluated by a psychiatrist on Wednesday, and the psychiatrist said she should be back on her meds.
Then, there's drug companies trying to push unapproved uses of drugs...
Bugs | 03.15.08 - 6:09 pm | #
Fuck Off, Racist Pig
There is speculation that Bear Stearns could be bought up by an Arab oil fund so in that sense it would be all within the BushCo family.
Echidne, no, they did not.
Can we just drown Grover Norquist in a bathtub?
Along with the trolls?
Senator Clinton has disavowed you and asked you to please stop you are not helping.
The rest of us
--------
If so, tell her to send my money back.
Hey Snake Lady -
I was thinking of Norquist's little boast today.
Sad that the whole god damn thing's perilously close to coming true.
She was evaluated by a psychiatrist on Wednesday, and the psychiatrist said she should be back on her meds.
Sallyh
Yeah, and if they'd stopped something like insulin that long before checking with a phtsician.......
You mean we don't want the "free hand of the market" to take care of it?
I'd put a little laughie-face emoticon in there, but it's just not funny, is it?
No we don't, and yes, it's funny but it's not really funny. The reason has to do with markets with a lot of lack of information. Free markets don't function at all well under those circumstances, and the government has at least the role of providing the missing information.
Read the quote in the NYT article where they discuss their powerlessness:
Erin Gardiner, a spokeswoman for Baxter, said the drug company had intended "to follow the supply chain as close as we could to the original source — the workshops." But she added, "We have not been able to do so."
Ms. Gardiner said Baxter did not have the authority to demand access to the workshops. If such access is granted, she said, Baxter stands "ready to return to China as part of our investigation."
Richard L. Friedman, the F.D.A.'s director of manufacturing and product quality, said the agency generally inspected only manufacturers of active pharmaceutical ingredients and finished products, and did not go further back in the supply chain. In this case, that part of the chain, Mr. Friedman said, is the responsibility of China's equivalent of the United States Department of Agriculture.
So what the medications and foods in this country can contain is now based on what another country's government might or might not do. Globalization.
Why haven't all prints of "Bridge at Kok-Ri" been shoved up McCain's ass with a crow bar?
Is there any one single thing this administration has done right?
One. Single. Thing?
I say we boycott Eschaton for failing to sufficiently trash your sucky candidate.
Sallyh, from my second-hand knowledge of rehab, they want to get the client totally off all drugs while they're under supervision. As long as they've put her back on the necessary meds, she'll be okay in that regard.
Mrs. ibrahim al-jafaari is really Michele Obama.
I think the government just needs a new rubber duckie.
Flory, no.
This has been another edition of...
Got so sick of Bugs that I downloaded greasemonkey and killfile for my laptop.
It's reformatted HaloScan completely. When did that happen?
Bugs | 03.15.08 - 6:11 pm | #
Fuck Off, Racist Pig
“CANADIAN PRESCRIPTION DRUG RE-IMPORTATION: IS THERE A SAFETY ISSUE?”
"FDA has long taken the position that consumers are exposed to a number of risks when they purchase drugs from foreign sources or from sources that are not operated by pharmacies licensed under state pharmacy law. These outlets may dispense expired, subpotent, contaminated or counterfeit product, the wrong or a contraindicated product, an incorrect dose, or medication unaccompanied by adequate directions for use. The labeling of the drug may not be in English and therefore important information regarding dosage and side effects may not be available to the consumer. The drugs may not have been packaged and stored under appropriate conditions to avoid degradation. There is no assurance that these products were manufactured under current good manufacturing practice (cGMP) standards. When consumers take such unsafe or inappropriate medications, they face risks of dangerous drug interactions and other serious health consequences."
It's reformatted HaloScan completely. When did that happen?
It's been like that as long as I've had it.
Senator Clinton has disavowed you and asked you to please stop you are not helping.
The rest of us
--------
If so, tell her to send my money back.
Bugs | 03.15.08 - 6:11 pm |
The check is in the mail.
I say we boycott Eschaton for failing to sufficiently trash your sucky candidate.
I say that Atrios has done exactly the right thing by not endorsing a candidate.
The closest he came was well over a year ago, when he said he was kind of leaning toward my boyfriend, should he enter the race, but at the time, he just didn't know.
"Norquist, who is of Swedish descent, grew up in Weston, Massachusetts, where he learned politics at an early age when his father would liken each bite he took out of his ice cream cone to a different type of tax levied by the government."
Daddy, can't you just enjoy your ice cream cone? Daddy, please, you're ruining dessert .....
Must have been some good fun there, growing up in the Norquist home.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/
Gro...Grover_Norquist
GravatarIs there any one single thing this administration has done right?
One. Single. Thing?
They play a mean guitar.
Ms. Gardiner said Baxter did not have the authority to demand access to the workshops.
So let's see. Baxter decides, in order to cut costs, to outsource production. But they are so bad at business they can't negotiate terms that give them absolute access and control to all aspects of the production?
Fuck me...I just had a drag of a cigarette. My first drag in five weeks. 
NTodd does drive-thru dunkin donuts?
“CANADIAN PRESCRIPTION DRUG RE-IMPORTATION: IS THERE A SAFETY ISSUE?”
The irony of ironies, of course, now that we know domestic drugs are not subject to the safety testing we were told.
Fucking NPR bimbette. It's not Lake CUOMO it's Lake COMO.
Sheesh.
There is speculation that Bear Stearns could be bought up by an Arab oil fund so in that sense it would be all within the BushCo family.
P O'Neill
Heh.
Until the rest of Carlyle goes belly up.
Oh....like they'll let that happen....
Zap, off label usage is commonplace. What is troubling in the Zyprexa trials was the underreporting of side effects.
They play a mean guitar.
So did the Pinball Wizard, and he was deaf dumb and blind.
One word: Thalidomide
Zap, don't beat yourself up.
I fell off that one weeks ago.
We'll both get back on.
If so, tell her to send my money back.
WHAT "money"?
What is troubling in the Zyprexa trials was the underreporting of side effects.
Well, that's what I was getting at, I guess.
And that's why Alaska is suing them, correct?
Hey Little Karl, let's play a game.
It's kind of physical, so it may challenge your pussilanimous nature, but what the hey, we've seen you cry like the snivelling little chickenshit you are.
Ready?
Red Rovester, Red Rovester
Send the little mutant to the Dumpster
Weston, Mass?
hahahahaha
rich fucking pricks, landed estates, snobby stockbrokers and commercial bankers and law firm partners keeping the riffraff middle-class out. that Weston?
it explains so much about Grover Norquist that he grew up in Weston.
Fuck, I need some weed.
Haven't hardly smoked for months, other than abot 3 weeks ago, but right now, I think weed would be a good thing.
It's been like that as long as I've had it.Weird... maybe it looks different on Windows (laptop) than Mac (iLamp).
My poor old iLamp is just too slow to deal with Firefox and killfile... takes farkin' forever for the long threads to load.
If you think all those wonderful cheap generics brought to you by the nice folks at Wallmart ($4 per prescription) or your friendly neighborhood HMO are being manufactured in factories in India and China that have been throughly inspected by the FDA, then I've got a condo in south Florida you might be interested in buying. Its a great investment, really.
And to think Bush the Last, (hopefully) was trying to worry us about drugs made in Canada!
What a country. (us, not them)
For instance, the FDA might want to test all heparin products imported into the country, to save a few lives here and there.
B--but, but...the *private sector* will test drugs cuz it's in their interest not to kill their customers. Except they cut corners and take dodgy risks with ingredients to save a few pennies. Not to worry, the families of the people who die can sue them, and this will somehow bring the market back into alignment...except for the people who died, I guess.
But after the Rethugs ram through 'tort reform' (which somehow doesn't count as government interference in Magical Marketplace Land), the families won't be able to sue, or the damages will be so minimal that the companies will just price in the cost of killing a few customers and a few cheap payouts as a cheaper option than ensuring a safe supply chain.
"the market is god. god is perfect"-FDA
So let's see. Baxter decides, in order to cut costs, to outsource production. But they are so bad at business they can't negotiate terms that give them absolute access and control to all aspects of the production?
puppethead
I had trouble following this logic myself.
Uncle Smokes, the problem with thalidomide is that it has potential legitimate uses. I haven't read the clinical trials data on thalidomide, but I should. It's a fairly old drug. I'm not sure what the data turned up in it, and/or if it was not reported.
Good thing the people voted Grover's candidate into office twice, so he can shrink the government real small and not invent a wholly new multi-billion-dollar branch and start an unnecessary and incomprehensibly expensive war or anything!
Fuck me...I just had a drag of a cigarette. My first drag in five weeks.
Let it go. You'll be okay.
One word: Thalidomide
I have a Finnish friend with those flipper arms.
God I hate Firefox. How can anyone stand it?
I'm switching back to Safari. Back in a sec.
I have an older version of Killfile that doesn't mess up Haloscan any more than it's always messed up.
It's version 0.7.20070607.0, if it's still available.
I get a daily reminder that there's a newer version available, which I think is less annoying than making Haloscan worse. I just ignore the reminder.
So did the Pinball Wizard, and he was deaf dumb and blind.
Vicki, Who ♥ Al Gore
So....more capable than Chimpy?
Oh Christ! My sister just called to tell me that a friend of the family who had an aortic dissection (what John Ridder died of) and has been in a coma for 12 days just woke up!
Shouldn't each community devise its own method for testing its heparin, in accordance with each community's unique value system? In my community, we will test everything first upon the limp and mewling body of Mr. Grover Norquist.
So....more capable than Chimpy?
You're setting the bar mighty low there, woman.
I hate Firefox too, which tells you how I feel about Bugs.
Not to worry, the families of the people who die can sue them...
Ummm, well ... see, there was this little Supreme Court ruling recently ...
Vicki, that's amazing! And wonderful.
Wow - bodies found at site of Manson ranch:
http://www.comcast.net/news/
arti...SI.Manson.Ranch
I'm not sure what the data turned up in it, and/or if it was not reported.
Sallyh
Thalidomide is not a particularly harmful ... unless you are pregnant. The problem is that back then the testing was done on non-pregnant animals.
Firefox has has never given me much trouble.
Not that this might influence anyone's choice of credit card, computer, or software, but ....
"Norquist has represented various corporate interests including, American Express, National Rifle Association, Microsoft. Records show that Microsoft paid Grover Norquist $60,000 in 1999."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/
Gro...Grover_Norquist
I think something was wrong in the recent downloads from Firefox. It's after those that I've had trouble with Haloscan. It opens up whole screen-sized and I can't see my gravatar .
My sister just called to tell me that a friend of the family who had an aortic dissection (what John Ridder died of) and has been in a coma for 12 days just woke up!
Wow, that's great news!
Uncle Smokes, the problem with thalidomide is that it has potential legitimate uses.
I came across that information recently.
Multiple myeloma's one of the recent indications.
Other than having to reinstall Firefox the other day, I've never had so much as a peep of trouble out of it.
Then again, I'm on Vista.
/runs
Man, I wish Client 9 didn't mess things up for the rest of us.
-
My sister just called to tell me that a friend of the family who had an aortic dissection (what John Ridder died of) and has been in a coma for 12 days just woke up!
Wow, that's great news!
As good as the ones a few weeks ago about my neighbor not having cancer of the pancreas, after all. Though he did have to go through the awful surgery to establish that.
It's after those that I've had trouble with Haloscan. It opens up whole screen-sized and I can't see my gravatar .
For me, text doesn't wrap in the little Haloscan text window, so if I've got a really long html link, it's impossible.
I just really hate it on a lot of levels. And I don't get when people say it's "safer." How so?
"his father would liken each bite he took out of his ice cream cone to a different type of tax levied by the government."
Now that's creepy!
They might also want to check dental bridges and such made in China, since they are apparently made with lead.
Maybe we should just stop importing things from China.
The problem is the "self-reporting" nature of drug trials. The FDA just doesn't have the resources to do its own tests.
I like Firefox. Please, no browser wars
Uncle Smokes, the problem with ALL DRUGS is that it has potential legitimate uses.
Vicki....that's great news.
Meanwhile, I saw a friend last night who found out his week:
1. Her dad might have cancer.
2. One of her good friends has about a week to live.
3. She's probably going to have to put her cat down.
And....she's going thru a divorce.
Yikes!!
One word: Thalidomide
I have a Finnish friend with those flipper arms.
Echidne | Homepage | 03.15.08 - 6:18 pm | #
Ironically, thalidomide was never marketed in the U.S. because, way back then, the FDA had teeth, balls, whatever, to halt its release ...three cheers to the free, unregulated markets!
And I don't get when people say it's "safer." How so?
Not enough people bother to create worms and viruses for it, because the usage numbers are still fairly low.
Maybe we should just stop importing things from China.
and destroy the fabulous relationship we have with the Communist Party of China?
Heresy!
Flory, my heart goes out to her. What a terrible place to be in.
All good prayers and thoughts to her.
Then again, I'm on Vista.
Are you running Office 2007?
If so, you might let res ipsa know... she could use some assistance...
I said sometime last week that were it not for Federal funding of water projects in the west and elsewhere, Norquist would find it hard to fill that bathtub with water.
Vicki! Yay for your no-longer-comatose friend of the family! Best wishes. A dissecting aorta is the kind of catastrophe you don't often live through. Let's keep our fingers crossed for a full and rapid recovery.
I found it interesting that John McCain took a teensy weensy bit of criticism for his statements about vaccines and their links to autism last week.
Interesting because Sen. Bill Frist tried like the dickens to grant retroactive immunity to the drug manufacturer for any damages. Slipped legislation into unrelated bills at the 11th hour, got busted, tried again and again ...
I think Big Pharma is terrified that a definite, legally-bullet proof connection between autism and vaccine preservative will be proven. They'll be sued six ways to sundown.
My Dad is starting chemo next week...after having his lung removed and being declared "cancer-free". It was his choice, I guess; but it pisses me off that they even offered him this "just in case" bull shit.
The problem is the "self-reporting" nature of drug trials. The FDA just doesn't have the resources to do its own tests.
The FDA wouldn't if they did have resources. There is an attitude of collaboration which has to be attacked and replaced with a social-consciousness.
Not enough people bother to create worms and viruses for it, because the usage numbers are still fairly low.
Echidne
Firefox also has a "security through obscurity" thing, where any major exploits that show up can be marked confidential and ignored for five years. Not fixed, just ignored.
Of course, when MS tried asking the BugTraq folks to let them have three weeks to do patches before publishing exploits, MS were the Debil....
Ironically, thalidomide was never marketed in the U.S. because, way back then, the FDA had teeth, balls, whatever, to halt its release ...three cheers to the free, unregulated markets!
Nick Danger
Thalidomide was marketed in the US. The FDA was created in large part, in response to the thalidomide scandal.
Hit and run, sorry:
The Financial Times today has as rough a review of a book as I have read. The victim is Jonah Goldberg.
It's probably on line somewhere. The headline was something like "The F Word".
Couldn't happen to a nicer guy.
Interesting because Sen. Bill Frist tried like the dickens to grant retroactive immunity to the drug manufacturer for any damages. Slipped legislation into unrelated bills at the 11th hour, got busted, tried again and again ...
Yeah, it was during the anthrax thing, wasn't it?
Not enough people bother to create worms and viruses for it, because the usage numbers are still fairly low.
Not quite. Really, Internet Explorer is the only unsafe browser. Every other browser is pretty safe, some slightly more so than others. But Microsoft has embedded so many paths of direct access into the operating system in IE that it's a foolish thing to use.
I said sometime last week that were it not for Federal funding of water projects in the west and elsewhere, Norquist would find it hard to fill that bathtub with water.
Yes, of COURSE the California liberals support big government water projects ...
"I said sometime last week that were it not for Federal funding of water projects in the west and elsewhere, Norquist would find it hard to fill that bathtub with water."
Yes. Someone (not Grover) once said, "The first rule of plumbing is, water flows downhill, unless the hill is located in the West and there is a big pile of money at the top of the hill."
SoBeale, the data just don't support the correlation between vaccines and autism. It's very weak.
Are you running Office 2007?
If so, you might let res ipsa know... she could use some assistance...
No...I'm smarter than that.
I'm a PC guy, but I'm always dumbfounded at Microsoft's "It ain't broke, but we'll break it" attitude. I'd be fine using XP the rest of my life.
Tainted Heparin has been an issue for over 2 weeks and the FDA has done nothing. Chaney must need some more heart surgery and heparin is needed.
Otherwise we are not important.
Global economy is not really working for the US, now is it? Do you miss you dead pet from tainted wheat gluten? Does Grandma really need to die too?
I think Big Pharma is terrified that a definite, legally-bullet proof connection between autism and vaccine preservative will be proven. They'll be sued six ways to sundown.
Southern Beale
The reason that McCain took criticism, and he should get fucking piled on, is because there is not fucking link bettween vaccines and autism
I am so tired of that horseshit, and the very real risks it poses to other people's health.
sallyh,
How did it go, or should I not ask?
Anti-Communist flick on right now: an admiral reminds a pilot that if they lose Korea, then Japan, perhaps the single most physically militant anti-Communist state on the planet, will go red, and then maybe Indochina OH NOES!!!!
Indeed, P O'Neill. And utilities which provide electricity.
Echidne
Indeed. For the time being. But the technology exists now that we can use to liberate ourselves from even the subtle tyranny of the grid, the grip of the utilities.
Imagine a world in which wise people can buy and install an inexpensive device on their property that will generate all their power, with enough to spare to feed the grid and charge the batteries of their electric vehicles as well, while distilling greywater.
When will the greedy, blind warmongers learn that surpressing people's universal desire for liberation only drives their limitless creativity?
Well, the good news is that he's cognizant...how weird - the guy was written off for dead.
Really, Internet Explorer is the only unsafe browser.
I loved IE but had to stop using it because, well, it just isn't practical on the internets anymore. You get nowhere fast with IE. Dead end.
My dog, the one with cancer, is having a bad dream. He has a really sad, worried look on his face.
Poor thing.
Uncle Smokes, the problem with thalidomide is that it has potential legitimate uses. I haven't read the clinical trials data on thalidomide, but I should. It's a fairly old drug. I'm not sure what the data turned up in it, and/or if it was not reported.
Sallyh, Grandmere Poissonniere
The wiki piece talks about that that later in the article.
What I found of interest was the experience of Frances Kelsey, who rejected the drug (emphasis added):
"Kelsey rejected the application and requested the aforementioned data from the company in a letter. Richardson-Merrell resubmitted the application, but with no new information, and Kelsey turned it down again. She continued to request more data from the company and with each request the 60 day clock started again. As the end of 1960 approached and with it the holiday season (the best time for selling sedatives), Richardson-Merrell began increasing the pressure on the FDA and Kelsey. Executives and scientists telephoned and personally visited Kelsey, and executives complained to her superiors that she was nit-picking and unreasonable.
"Kelsey refused to clear Kevadon for sale in the United States until she could review satisfactory studies. She later said that the reports submitted by Grünenthal and Richardson-Merrell were more like testimonials than results of well-designed, controlled studies. (One possible reason for the lack of data could be that Richardson-Merrell's 'investigation' of thalidomide for its FDA application was organized and implemented not by scientists, but by the company's sales and marketing division.) Kelsey had also heard anecdotal reports of peripheral neuropathy as a side effect, which increased her concern about possible effects on a fetus. She continued to reject the Kevadon application. In total, the company resubmitted its Kevadon application to the FDA six times, but with no new evidence in those applications Kelsey refused approval."
Hurrah for marketing science.
Thalidomide was marketed in the US. The FDA was created in large part, in response to the thalidomide scandal.
flory
I don't think this is right. I think the FDA has been around for longer than that (the thalidomide catastrophe hit circa 1955 or so, if memory serves.) There were comparatively few incidents of US kids who suffered as a result, because only a handful of US moms had access, via friends overseas, to the drug.
There were far, far larger numbers in the UK, despite its smaller population, again IIRC.
The problem is the "self-reporting" nature of drug trials. The FDA just doesn't have the resources to do its own tests.
The FDA doesn't have to actually do the tests, just manage the trials. They can use the same firms that actually run the trials now. But someone without a vested interest should be overseeing the trials and interpreting the results.
Falling down on the cat pixels. I'm so disappointed.
.
Hmmm...Zapette rented "Once".
Any good?
According to these guys, http://www.fda.gov/oc/history/hi...fda/
default.htm, the FDA has been around since the US Civil War, 1862.
It's very weak.
Sallyh
non-existant.
Anti-vaxxers are a cult.
Right after 9/11, the FBI raided one of Grover's outfits, The Islamic Institute, because it was being funded by Saudis with connections to terrorist organizations.
Wonder why the librul media never followed up on that one? Or on the story about W having a convicted fundraiser for Hezbollah over as a guest at the White House?
The Financial Times today has as rough a review of a book as I have read. The victim is Jonah Goldberg.
I foresee a new post at Whiskey Fire.
The reason that McCain took criticism, and he should get fucking piled on, is because there is not fucking link bettween vaccines and autism
Well, I don't believe it. Deadly Immunity made a strong case for an austim-thimerosal link.
I had a bad dream this afternoon. Very vivid.
These contractors walked into my house and started knocking out walls, and they wouldn't stop.
And then the guy said, "You asked us for a quote. We're just following up."
The thing is (in real life), I had my house remodeled a year ago.
Molly, turned away at the door. The staff considers me 'toxic.' Mlle has not instructed them not to let me attend, but the staff feels that it would be 'too upsetting' and this was not the place to work out family issues.
Told that this was not family therapy, it was family education, and since I had a PhD, they felt I would be disruptive of 'the flow of the lecture.'
My dog, the one with cancer, is having a bad dream. He has a really sad, worried look on his face.
Poor thing.
So sorry, Southern Beale. But when my Hank was diagnosed with cancer I thought her life was really quite good until the very last weekend. I don't think she had any idea she was ill as long as she was not in pain. But then she was a Lab.
What is the FED and govt doing? Why can they not simply see things like "freezing" rates and principal forgiveness would do more than current action?
Dave
http://tradingsplits.blogspot.com
I'd be fine using XP the rest of my life.
Zap Rowsdower
I just bought a new computer and I made the shop put XP in it.
Hi Folks:
I spotted this comment in response to Digby's post about me. It's funny, the whole post had to do with arguing an premises and this person, anon, is playing the concern troll here.
I really don't like, nor do I enjoy, playing debating games with people who pretend they don't get it.
The argument has to do with saying that M organ being let go is bad for free speech because it's just making people "tailor their speech to please corporate sponsors".
I'm sure there a number of rhetorical arguing games this person is playing, and I suppose I could identify and answer each one. And I think that it might be a good thing, because these arguments must be addressed for the people who call themselves liberals and are in fact concern trolls.
Maybe they really ARE worried about the poor right wing screamers ability to say their piece, but I doubt it.
Here is the post I'm talking about.
http://www.haloscan.com/comments...4135150/
#743668
If any of you who enjoy taking on concern troll are interested in taking apart this comment please do. I'd be interested in your response. I learn alot from how people take apart these kind of comments.
Told that this was not family therapy, it was family education, and since I had a PhD, they felt I would be disruptive of 'the flow of the lecture.'
Jeebus. I'm so sorry.
♥ ♥ ♥ ♥ ♥ Sallyh! ♥ ♥ ♥ ♥ ♥
♥ ♥ ♥ ♥ ♥ SoBe! ♥ ♥ ♥ ♥ ♥
Hugs, all around.
.
It's very weak.
Sallyh
non-existant.
Anti-vaxxers are a cult.
I haven't seen any strong research to suggest a connection, either. The only possibly relevant thing I've seen had to do with the possibility that certain children might be supersensitive to vaccinations because of their genetic makeup, but I don't know of any actual studies on that.
My dog, the one with cancer, is having a bad dream. He has a really sad, worried look on his face.
Poor thing.
Southern Beale
These contractors walked into my house and started knocking out walls, and they wouldn't stop.
And then the guy said, "You asked us for a quote. We're just following up."
The thing is (in real life), I had my house remodeled a year ago.
Vicki, Who ♥ Al Gore | 03.15.08 - 6:31 pm | #
that damned reverend wright again!
Really, Internet Explorer is the only unsafe browser.
Nothing inherently unsafe about IE.
There are more and more explouts for Firefox now, as it becomes more popular, and the false sense of security that this kind of thing lends is not going to help.
Ironically, thalidomide was never marketed in the U.S. because, way back then, the FDA had teeth, balls, whatever, to halt its release ...three cheers to the free, unregulated markets!
Nick Danger
Thalidomide was marketed in the US. The FDA was created in large part, in response to the thalidomide scandal.
flory | 03.15.08 - 6:26 pm | #
That thalidomide was never marketed in the United States was largely due to the stubborn skepticism of FDA's Frances Kelsey, M.D., Ph.D., whose doubts about the drug kept it out of American pharmacies. Assigned to review the thalidomide application, she fought a dogged defensive battle, blocking and parrying every attempt by Richardson-Merrell to gain approval until the news from the European countries made approval unthinkable.
Kelsey was particularly interested in fetal safety because during the 1940s she had worked on the antimalarial drug quinine and had noted that embryos lacked the ability to metabolize quinine. But she had other concerns. She wanted to know how the drug behaved in the human body. She wanted to know about its stability, about its effect on human metabolism, about its basic chemistry and pharmacology. How the drug worked in laboratory animals was not enough; she wanted to know how it worked in humans. Years later, she recalled that, "... at this time there was growing concern regarding the exposure of the fetus to drugs and other substances to which the mother was exposed during pregnancy. ... Furthermore, the harmful effects of German measles during pregnancy had been recognized ... . The recognition of peripheral neuritis developing particularly after long-term use of thalidomide raised in our mind the question as to what effect the drug might have on the fetus who might be exposed to it for up to nine months."
Kelsey wanted to know the answers to questions that often were not asked in those days. Neither Chemie Grunenthal nor Richardson-Merrell, the American licensee, could or would answer her questions, and so the drug went unapproved in the United States.
Long honored for her role in blocking the approval of the drug, Kelsey, who still works for FDA as dep
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&
c...79JqEw4MPtn3tVA
Me love internet
made a strong case for an austim-thimerosal link
Thimerosal is the preservative used in vaccines. So it's not the vaccines themselves. But as JR said, there's no provable scientific link.
girl around the corner from us had brain damage which occurred her parents suspected following a vaccination.
normal until then.
two other children had no reactions.
Molly, to be honest, I'm almost amused, I shouldn't be, but I am
I just bought a new computer and I made the shop put XP in it.
We bought this laptop a little over a year ago. It was before MS was offering the "downgrading" bit.
It's fine for what we do, I guess. I use XP at work, but Vista has a better version of Solitare on it. Pays for itself right there! 
the FDA has been around since the US Civil War, 1862.
David Derbes
Yes, but just a single chemist working for the U.S. Department of Agriculture. That explains how Lydia Pinkham was able to mass-market her miracle vegetable compound in the late 1800s when it was really 80% Jack Daniel's.
Not to worry, the families of the people who die can sue them...
Ummm, well ... see, there was this little Supreme Court ruling recently ...
Southern Beale
Gasp!! My defibrillator is malfunctioning. I'll sue....
Buried the poor road-hit feral cat out back. Thank god the ground has become soft enough to dig up with a shovel. mrs leibniz threw in some friskies and wished it a better life next time around.
According to this site, http://www.fda.gov/fdac/
features...201_kelsey.html
10,000 children were born with deformities from thalidomide. 17 were in the US.
This woman, Frances Oldham Kelsey, seems to have been the reason why. God bless her.
Hmmm...Zapette rented "Once".
Any good?
Zap Rowsdower | Homepage | 03.15.08 - 6:30 pm | #
--------------------------------------------------
------------------------------
Very!
The only possibly relevant thing I've seen had to do with the possibility that certain children might be supersensitive to vaccinations because of their genetic makeup, but I don't know of any actual studies on that.
Echidne
the mitochondrial disease thing? No substance.
The only thing parents have to worry about is a "bad reaction", either allergies or related issues. Those happen immediately, and no medication is completely safe for every person on the planet. And those don't have anything to do with autism
their attitude was, no wonder they're so toxic. They think they know everything.
Sallyh
Yeah, you PhDs think you're so smart, with all your worries about your children trading sex for dangerous drugs, and having vicious, abusive partners.
Typical fucking ivory-tower elitists.
Leibniz, you and the missus are good people.
sallyh,
Well, amusement is a good response.
"You're too smart for therapy!"
The victim is Jonah Goldberg.
Doughy Pantload was one of the "sources" the National Enquirer quoted in their hatchet job against Obama.
Pantload, the New York Post and some douchebag who's head of the GOP in Tennessee. I guess he's upset because Fred Thompson did so badly.
Leibniz, I wish your kitty a peaceful journey over the Rainbow Bridge.
That thalidomide was never marketed in the United States was largely due to the stubborn skepticism of FDA's Frances Kelsey, M.D., Ph.D., whose doubts about the drug kept it out of American pharmacies. Assigned to review the thalidomide application, she fought a dogged defensive battle, blocking and parrying every attempt by Richardson-Merrell to gain approval until the news from the European countries made approval unthinkable.
Fuck that science stuff. What was her position on abortion and the NRA?
The only possibly relevant thing I've seen had to do with the possibility that certain children might be supersensitive to vaccinations because of their genetic makeup, but I don't know of any actual studies on that.
Echidne
There's some stuff on metal metabolism that's interesting...can't recall the authors, though.
...to be honest, I'm almost amused, I shouldn't be, but I am.
You should ask them for a job!
I'm out, the groceries aren't gonna shop for me.
Peace.
Fuck that science stuff. What was her position on abortion and the NRA?
And who did you vote for in the last presidential election?
Thimerosal is the preservative used in vaccines. So it's not the vaccines themselves. But as JR said, there's no provable scientific link.
puppethead
Yeah, and there's also no themerosal, in some countries for over a decade.
Effect on autism rates = nada.
Does anyone remember Curly, LarryElvis...?
.
The only thing parents have to worry about is a "bad reaction", either allergies or related issues. Those happen immediately, and no medication is completely safe for every person on the planet. And those don't have anything to do with autism
My younger sister "won" one of those rare lotteries and got bacterial meningitis from the vaccination. The odds were then about one in four million. She is fine and the next child was vaccinated, too.
I had a dream the other night that SP died, and we didn't tell anyone or talk to each other about it. In the dream, I was screaming for Thers--that might even have been out loud, actually.
Thank god the ground has become soft enough to dig up with a shovel.
All I can see to shovel is the snow.
peanut allergies are interesting in the sense that everybody is excited about being 'peanut free' (rightfully so) and nobody wonders
where the fuck did all the peanut allergies come from?
because we all ate peanut butter and jelly sandwiches when i was a kid and unless timmy and tina were dropping off like flies secretly it didn't bother anybody
Thimerosal is the preservative used in vaccines. So it's not the vaccines themselves. But as JR said, there's no provable scientific link.
Yes, I know that. And they've stopped using it, tho the replacement preservative is thimerosol based, IIRC.
If there's no link why has Frist tried to hard to get the drug companies immunity?
Molly, Missy's head counselor feels that our educational levels make our child feel inferior. We're supposed to apologize for having gotten more than an AA in addiction counseling?
As I said, it is to laugh
My younger sister "won" one of those rare lotteries and got bacterial meningitis from the vaccination. The odds were then about one in four million. She is fine and the next child was vaccinated, too.
Echidne
Yeah, it sucks to "win" those lotteries, but the alternative is a whole lot worse. But, again, that isn't anything to doi with autism, the bugaboo of the anti-vaxxers.
Fuck that science stuff. What was her position on abortion and the NRA?
leibniz
And who did you vote for in the last presidential election?
Sallyh, Grandmere Poissonniere
Are you or have you ever been a book reader?
That expression: "drown it in a bathtub" gives me anxiety. What a horrifying metaphor.
There's a lot more asthma now too--no idea why, but there are lots of theories.
I personally like the one that we're too clean.
where the fuck did all the peanut allergies come from?
because we all ate peanut butter and jelly sandwiches when i was a kid and unless timmy and tina were dropping off like flies secretly it didn't bother anybody
juan no no nsensical |
There has to be something in the growing process.
Some chemical being introduced into it.
If there's no link why has Frist tried to hard to get the drug companies immunity?
Southern Beale | Homepage | 03.15.08 - 6:38 pm | #
If there's no link why has Frist tried to hard to get the drug companies immunity?
Southern Beale
Why is OJ not in jail for murdeing Nichole?
where the fuck did all the peanut allergies come from?
A good friend of mine has a son with a peanut allergy. Severe... if he gets near a teensy bit of peanut, he has to go to the ER.
Peanut is in everything. She can't even take the kid to a pizza parlor without making the waiter check the flour on the pizza dough.
It's fucking crazy.
That expression: "drown it in a bathtub" gives me anxiety. What a horrifying metaphor.
Is that you, Andrea Yates?
Hmmm...Zapette rented "Once".
Any good?
Zap Rowsdower | Homepage | 03.15.08 - 6:30 pm | #
Very!
juan no no nsensical
Depends on how you feel about atonal, self-serving music done with maximum angst and minimal talent. . . .
Why is OJ not in jail for murdeing Nichole?
What does that have to do with anything?
It gonna be great when one of us is in the White (not for long HAHA) House and extract the revenge that has waited so long. We had a discussion about whether white children should be punished along with their craKKKer parents, according to Rev. Wright Jesus says that guilt is based upon skin color so they are the devil too and must be destroyed also.
I personally like the one that we're too clean.
Molly Ivors
I'm convinced that's a major problem. Anti-bacterial soap products have been banned from my house. And it turns out studies show they do nothing anyway, except create resistant strains of bacteria.
But yeah, kids need to wallow in dirt to build their immunities.
Okay, off I slink to warmer climes.
♥
Jeffraham! I is visiting the Rainy Day Boys as we speak
Some chemical being introduced into it.
Terry C. Hussein
Generally, allergies develope with exposure. There is a whole lot more "hidden" peanut (cooking oil, etc) now than when we were kids.
So most of the heparin supplied to the American market came untested from China?
And why did they want to cut drug importation from Canada?
Well, there's no thimerosol in anything up here any more, IIRC. i used to clean my contact lenses in thimerosol-laced solution, not that I knew it was in there. It's been gone for years.
Peanut is in everything. She can't even take the kid to a pizza parlor without making the waiter check the flour on the pizza dough.
It's fucking crazy.
Southern Beale
I have a friend with a child in the same condition. They found that Dominos had actually used peanut butter in the sauce as a thickening agent. . . .
I personally like the one that we're too clean.
I like that one, too.
I personally like the one that we're too clean.
Something to that. I probably shouldn't clean the bathroom, after all.
If there's no link why has Frist tried to hard to get the drug companies immunity?
Southern Beale | Homepage | 03.15.08 - 6:38 pm | # [kill][hide comment]
IIRC, he pushed for that before the autism link was refuted.
I personally like the one that we're too clean.
Molly Ivors
I'm not so sure about that.
We didn't have all these anti-bacterial crap when we were kids. We had plain soap and water.
Maybe being "too clean" is playing havoc with our immune systems.
somewhere between frist's friends in the chemical/drug/industrial strength insanity dept. and
the new-age therapist who is going to wash your aura with vibrations from the mayan book of the dead
lies some harrowing journey to truth
Generally, allergies develope with exposure. There is a whole lot more "hidden" peanut (cooking oil, etc) now than when we were kids.
JR, kerosene and a match | Homepage | 03.15.08 - 6:41 pm | # [kill][hide comment]
Thai food - lots of peanuts and peanut oil. Anybody know if the Thai population has the same allergies?
"Since 1991, when the CDC and the FDA had recommended that three additional vaccines laced with the preservative be given to extremely young infants -- in one case, within hours of birth -- the estimated number of cases of autism had increased fifteenfold, from one in every 2,500 children to one in 166 children.
"Even for scientists and doctors accustomed to confronting issues of life and death, the findings were frightening. "You can play with this all you want," Dr. Bill Weil, a consultant for the American Academy of Pediatrics, told the group. The results "are statistically significant." Dr. Richard Johnston, an immunologist and pediatrician from the University of Colorado whose grandson had been born early on the morning of the meeting's first day, was even more alarmed. "My gut feeling?" he said. "Forgive this personal comment -- I do not want my grandson to get a thimerosal-containing vaccine until we know better what is going on."
"But instead of taking immediate steps to alert the public and rid the vaccine supply of thimerosal, the officials and executives at Simpsonwood spent most of the next two days discussing how to cover up the damaging data. "
There is something very weird going on about allergies, whether to peanuts, gluten or whatever. Whoever figures it out will get a nobel prize.
dave c, they don't have anyone with anything higher than an MSW on board, and that's the two directors.
I don't know why the nut allergies seem to be more common. My dad was an allergist and dermatologist (and, not to boast, really good at it.) He told me thirty years ago that the nut ones were extremely dangerous.
One of the strangest cases involved a young woman at, IIRC, Brown University, who always asked about ingredients. At a Providence restaurant she ordered a bowl of chili, and it killed her, because she never thought there might have been nuts in it. This would have been roughly thirty years ago.
What does that have to do with anything?
Southern Beale
Because juries are more easily swayed by anti-science, so long as it's properly dressed up, than real science, in general.
Also, it is fairly hard to get a "fair trial" when the major media outlets push this horseshit for years.
I personally like the one that we're too clean.
this one does not apply to me. ADHD and housework do not go together.
Molly, Missy's head counselor feels that our educational levels make our child feel inferior. We're supposed to apologize for having gotten more than an AA in addiction counseling?
Ha! We have a Substance Abuse Counseling major at my school--they're almost all ex-users or people with bad family damage from drugs or alcohol.
Still, it's funny when you ask someone their major and they say, "Substance Abuse."
lies some harrowing journey to truth
Indeed.
They found that Dominos had actually used peanut butter in the sauce as a thickening agent. . . .
Beowulf Schaeffer-Revolutionar
Ewwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww!
I like what my sister once said about Domino's pizza.
She said you may as well toss the pizza and eat the box.
Mercury - scientifically proven to be dangerous.
Thimerosal - mercury-based vaccine preservative known to be highly toxic.
Manufactured by Eli Lilly, a company with a long history of covering up bad results caused by its prodcuts.
Conclusion, no scientific link between vaccines and autism.
Maybe being "too clean" is playing havoc with our immune systems.
It's wise to remember that bacteria are always one step ahead of us--smaller, faster, and smarter.
What does that have to do with anything?
Southern Beale
Because juries are more easily swayed by anti-science, so long as it's properly dressed up, than real science, in general.
Also, it is fairly hard to get a "fair trial" when the major media outlets push this horseshit for years.
JR, kerosene and a match | Homepage | 03.15.08 - 6:43 pm | #
F.D.A. officials said Friday that they had not inspected the Chinese workshops where the raw heparin ingredient originated. The workshops used pig intestines to make raw heparin, a product that eventually ended up at the Chinese plant,
and you just know the conditions in those 'workshops' (ahem, back yard shacks) produced heparin under the most stringent sanitation standards.
anybody wanna discuss downer cows...
I read one study which found that children who went to daycare tended to have fewer severe allergies later on than those who did not. The speculation was that the various childhood bugs children share with each other somehow may provide future immunity.
the estimated number of cases of autism had increased fifteenfold, from one in every 2,500 children to one in 166 children.
The number of diagnosed autism cases hs risen. But way bck when only the most profound=ly affected children were labelled as autistic. There is a real scientific debate going on as to whether there is even a rise in autism cases at all, or whether it's just an artifact of better diagnoses.
I probably shouldn't clean the bathroom, after all.
This is, of course, the logical conclusion.
Hey, Molly (and Eschacon organizers) - you've got mail!
"Peter Pan Throwdown Hoedown" [Part 1]
it ain't no lie i love peanut butter
jelly and tater chips i just might have a-nutter
perfect bachelor food it always makes me happy
then conagra gave me salmonella tennessee
(ugh...from georgia no less)
well they knew for six months about poison peter pan
to recoup the losses they had a great plan
dump it all at half price let the chumps beware
perhaps some old folk die but then these days who cares
(except maybe their families)
pay off your pardner dough see dough
collect your pittance when you pass go
allemande to the right on pass the jail
bow to the stock price and go to hell
(say hi to reagan when you get there)
Molly, trust me, I'm not knocking AA degrees, and I'm a monstrous believer in CCs. But Monsieur and I have been treated with hostility and mistrust from the start. Mlle was the one that gave our educational levels, not us.
And why should that make her feel inferior? She's 22 freakin years old!
And why isn't cyclamate used as an artificial sweetener aside from the fact that it tastes too much like sugar and you can cook with it and stuff? (I know, if you drink 350 cans of soda a day you might develop tumors - if you drink 350 cans of milk I am pretty sure you will develop something bad)
"Peter Pan Throwdown Hoedown" [Part 2]
told the local news about the scam
they were nice about it but did not give a damn
i could join several lawsuits
but i don't care about collecting loot
i wanna see these poisoning suit-wearing mofos in jail
(ain't gonna happen but what the hell)
might makes right and money is mighty all right
my shallow pockets make me wanna give up the fight
just bend over and take like a lamb
what will come of this deregulation sham
an attack of flaming ford pintos driven by flipper babies on ambien
(oh man don't wanna be around when that shit hits the fan)
my guess is genetically modified peanuts interacting with something else (mercury in fillings?) (the air?) (pesticides in wheat?)
have created allergies
I have no proof other than
the egyptian book of the dead
of course
I read one study which found that children who went to daycare tended to have fewer severe allergies later on than those who did not. The speculation was that the various childhood bugs children share with each other somehow may provide future immunity.
Echidne
That makes sense.
There is something very weird going on about allergies, whether to peanuts, gluten or whatever. Whoever figures it out will get a nobel prize.
leibniz♘☮ | 03.15.08 - 6:42 pm | # [kill][hide comment]
It's not just allergies, it's autoimmune problems in general. They're all on the rise.
Also, the vaccine hypothesis for autism was a reasonable one, IMO. It was a sensible question to investigate.
Spocko, not sure if you are engaging us here or encouraging us to comment at Digby's place.
The corporate world is already limiting free speech, big time, in response to right-wing pressure groups, or due to the fact that the communications groups themselves are owned by right wingers. Sounds like the concern troll (if that's what it be) is saying that it's unseemly and dangerous when the left plays this game too.
What's the alternative? For the left to keep their mouths shut and stay under the radar?
What's the logic? If the left lays low, then it won't occur to the right to exert pressure on sponsors? It's already happening. What you have done is move us one step closer to a level playing field, that's all. It doesn't set a precedent, right-wing pressure is already happening.
Conclusion, no scientific link between vaccines and autism.
Snow (D-SC)
Epidemiology concludes that there is no connection.
Because in those counries that have not used mercury in childhood vaccines for over a decade there is not difference in autism rates from those that only recently discontinued it.
That is called evidence.
OT:
We got our property tax statement today, and the valuation statement. The county is projecting that our house will be worth 20K less next year. That's crazy.
Then again, I'm taking it with a grain of salt. They've been known to screw these things up.
"Peter Pan Throwdown Hoedown" [Part 3]
heart attacks and autism deadly baby seats and sleep driving
dogs and cats starting to die there's lead in your lunch box
pretty soon a day in the park will cost you a week in detox
(just try not to breathe for a while)
when will this end when will we learn there's more than making money
on a stock return deregulation is the free trade curse
who will spend the money when we're all end up dead or worse
(coffin futures are up)
so i didn't get justice i only wrote this song
a kinda lame response to so much wrong
wish i had a better ending but that's how it goes
i didn't win today but tomorrow who knows
I'm convinced that's a major problem. Anti-bacterial soap products have been banned from my house. And it turns out studies show they do nothing anyway, except create resistant strains of bacteria.
I use Ivory soap in the shower, but it's damn hard to find (the liquid kind, that is). You don't see ANY non-bacterial dishwashing liquids.
Are there still children labeled as "slow" who don't have Down's Syndrome? Are there still special classes like when I was in grade school, or is it all now diagnosed as ADHD, dyslexia or autism?
if you drink 350 cans of milk I am pretty sure you will develop something bad
Cud?
just bought a new computer and I made the shop put XP in it.
We bought this laptop a little over a year ago. It was before MS was offering the "downgrading" bit.
It's fine for what we do, I guess. I use XP at work, but Vista has a better version of Solitare on it. Pays for itself right there!
Zap Rowsdower | Homepage | 03.15.08 - 6:34 pm | #
By trade, I'm a geek in a medium sized hospital IT shop. (We manage about 3000 workstations and servers)
Vista Sucks. Don't get a PC with it. Microsoft has effed up bigtime. We have no plans to deploy Vista anytime soon. They, MS, say they're gonna pull XP from the market in June. Don't bet on it.
I don't know that the link HAS been refuted. And I worry about my animals. The dogs are supposed to get rabies shots every year, but a simple titer test can show if they still have the antibodies in their bodies. But the county won't let you submit a titer test result to get a license, you still need to give them a rabies vaccine. Well, they don't NEED it.
I don't know that we NEED all this crap.
Also, the vaccine hypothesis for autism was a reasonable one, IMO. It was a sensible question to investigate.
Phila
yes, it was sensible to investigate it.
But when it was found to be a false hypothesis the anti-vax cult kept yarfing, and we re still living (and some dying) becaue of *that* horseshit.
dave, annoys the shit out of me. I used to like Ivory Liquid for dishes. Now it has antibacterial additives!
the anti bacterial soaps create new chemical hybrids on skin when they interact with other things
i read one article where chlorine is created
if you drink 350 cans of milk I am pretty sure you will develop something bad
Udderly ridiculous.
I use Ivory soap in the shower, but it's damn hard to find (the liquid kind, that is). You don't see ANY non-bacterial dishwashing liquids.
Sure you do. At least, you can at the health food store.
iHe told me thirty years ago that the nut ones were extremely dangerous.
I have been allergic to nuts my whole life, I can't tell you the number of times I have been in the ER as a result.
Anaphylactic shock is no fun.
FWIW, I suspect that the level of allergies hasn't changed so much as that people who would have been dead in "the good old days" are surviving & we are discovering their allergies.
In one of James Mitchner's early novels, he notes that the diplomatic corps established in Afghanistan after WWII was sick all the time & the Afghans never seemed to have any illnesses at all -- someone pointed out that with an infant mortality rate of nearly 90%, the Afghans who made it to adulthood were hardy indeed!
is it all now diagnosed as ADHD, dyslexia or autism?
Bad Art
I'm sure there's a whole laundry list of conditions associated with developmental disability.
Cud?
Molly Ivors | Homepage | 03.15.08 - 6:47 pm | #
the Crips and the Cuds have taken over our neighbourhood
The dogs are supposed to get rabies shots every year
Here the shot is only every fourth year after the first two.
There is a real scientific debate going on as to whether there is even a rise in autism cases at all, or whether it's just an artifact of better diagnoses.
JR, kerosene and a match | Homepage | 03.15.08 - 6:45 pm | # [kill]
You're stretching things here. While diagnosis has gotten better, there's absolutely no way it accounts for the entire increase - which includes unmistakable severe autism, as well as more subtle ASDs - or even the majority of it.
Mrs. ibrahim al-jafaari stop the insults and so will I.
Bugs | 03.15.08 - 6:09 pm | #
But you'll probably still insist on posting your monuments to stupidity.
SoBeale, it pretty much has been refuted. A lot of studies have been done since the original hypothesis was proposed, and none of it indicates linkage.
Science is never done, of course, but this has been a heavily studied question, and the evidence does not support the vaccine-autism link.
We're also anti-antibacterial. When I was a kid we would eat dirt sometimes for some strange reason.
The county is projecting that our house will be worth 20K less next year. That's crazy.
Interesting. I would think as property values decline the county would keep mum, so you'd be paying a higher tax.
I read one study which found that children who went to daycare tended to have fewer severe allergies later on than those who did not.
I remember a German study from several years ago that found that children who had contact on a regular basis with farm animals had fewer allergies.
All this autism, allergies and asthma are the result of prayer being taken out of public schools.
/right wing fundie dingdong whackjob
You're stretching things here. While diagnosis has gotten better, there's absolutely no way it accounts for the entire increase - which includes unmistakable severe autism, as well as more subtle ASDs - or even the majority of it.
Phila
Like I said, there is a debate. I haven't seen enough good work on the subject ot make a personal call.
I remember a story once about snot-nosed children of the past. The point was that perhaps there were many more allergies then, too, but that they were not regarded as anything serious.
This doesn't explain something like the peanut butter allergies, of course. But might explain hayfever and such not actually being more common.
Sure you do. At least, you can at the health food store.
Southern Beale
Mine is called Nature Clean, it doesn't cost much more than the name brands, and they sell it locally. See if you can find it, dave.
dave™ has an answer.
Vista Sucks. Don't get a PC with it. Microsoft has effed up bigtime. We have no plans to deploy Vista anytime soon. They, MS, say they're gonna pull XP from the market in June. Don't bet on it.
XP might hang on, but according to a friend who does IT work, he can no longer get Office 2003 from his suppliers - it's all 2007 from now on.
Individuals can probably find a copy on eBay, but when corporate set-ups need a new copy or license, it's Office 2007.
I read one study which found that children who went to daycare tended to have fewer severe allergies later on than those who did not. The speculation was that the various childhood bugs children share with each other somehow may provide future immunity.
Echidne
That makes sense.
Terry C. Hussein
And all these parents wrapping their children in cotton wool, and using antibacterial soaps on every damn thing are just preventing their kids from developing a functioning immune system.
Not to mention helping create the next generation of superbugs.
Rather than saying "stretching things," I should probably take the more Eschatonian path of saying "That's utter bullshit."
The crane collapse in NYC is a perfect metaphor of the unraveling of the social fabric. A high-rise condo worth many millions is being built on the cheap, as with so much of the luxury construction frenzy in New York. Codes are violated, crane falls and kills a bunch of regular New Yorkers in their homes. There are cranes like that all over Manhattan. More people will die as a result of the unbridled, out-of-scale construction of homes for millionaires. Not nice, but true.
That is called evidence.
It is called circumstantial evidence. Lilly gets the benefit of the doubt when independent studies conclude there is no link. Not before.
Mrs. ibrahim al-jafaari stop the insults and so will I.
Bugs
You don't get it.
We don't like you.
We want you to leave.
Please take the hint and go.
i have no proof whatsover but my gut feeling is that all this chemical shit does cause reactions
i dont trust industries that exist for profit to tell me the truth or the scientists they pay
but that's my bias
i'm also dubious that 'jen' at the health food store is an expert on anything other than banana bread
but possibly some naturopaths are
SoBeale, it pretty much has been refuted. A lot of studies have been done since the original hypothesis was proposed, and none of it indicates linkage.
SHOW ME YOUR DATA!!!!
Kidding!
I'm just glad I don't have kids. The amount of vaccines a kid is now required to get from birth to when it's in first grade, well, it's astonishing. We never had that many shots.
Oh, anyone remember when they'd put mercury in your fillings?
Science is never done, thank god.
Remastering done by John R.T. Davies.
dave™ has an answer.
I love getting non-spam mail!
Rather than saying "stretching things," I should probably take the more Eschatonian path of saying "That's utter bullshit."
Phila
And then I could take the Eschatonian path of inviting you to suck on the sexual member of a diseased bovine.
I would think as property values decline the county would keep mum, so you'd be paying a higher tax.
We're weird folk here in the Twin Cites. We're a-ok with paying higher and higher property taxes. We know that ours are going up about 15% this year, and most of us are fine with it. It's that whole "quality of life" stuff you keep hearing about.
The county is projecting that our house will be worth 20K less next year. That's crazy.
They know about your secret plans to leave refrigerators and junk cars in the yard.
but possibly some naturopaths are
Yes, but you have to be careful. A good one is worth their weight in gold but they should have a medical degree. I wouldn't trust what a health food store stock person said.
I looked into the studies on autism and vaccines at one point, but didn't get very deep into the field. One study which looked well done argued that much of the increase is in more sensitive diagnosis and in paying attention to milder forms of autism, but it also argued that there has been an additional real increase in the incidence rates.
The same study stated that the vaccine hypothesis wasn't supported by the evidence that was available.
Echinde---Thanks for reminding us about Norquistism, which is at the heart of modern-day Reagan conservatism. Progressives should always emphasize that what's going on with China is actually Bush wet-dream capitalism. After all, if a few kids die from lead-laden toys, the market will adjust as consumers decide whether or not to continue buying such products. Why should Big Gumint interfere with the free-flow of goods into the marketplace. Also, don't forget that the "Lochner" era horrors that the Bushies despise include such intrusions as a prohibition against child-labor, government inspections of food and drugs, etc. Welcome Back, Caveat Emptor, and so-long the legacy of FDR, Cardozo & their fellow-travelling ilk.
A high-rise condo worth many millions is being built on the cheap, as with so much of the luxury construction frenzy in New York. Codes are violated, crane falls and kills a bunch of regular New Yorkers in their homes.
Heard an interview with a witness on the radio that said the crane wasn't "attached" to every floor like is required, and had been like that for a while.
And all these parents wrapping their children in cotton wool, and using antibacterial soaps on every damn thing are just preventing their kids from developing a functioning immune system.
Not to mention helping create the next generation of superbugs.
flory
We didn't have any of that anti-bacterial crap.
And I'm the oldest of six, so, in the first grade, when I got measles (Halloween) and chicken pox (Easter), the three siblings I had then got them, too.
Like I said, there is a debate. I haven't seen enough good work on the subject ot make a personal call.
JR, kerosene and a match | Homepage | 03.15.08 - 6:51 pm | # [kill]
OK, there's a debate between people who know what they're talking about (i.e., people who diagnose and treat autism), and people in other fields who are advancing a basically illogical theory that stands up to very little scrutiny.
but possibly some naturopaths are
juan no no nsensical
Naturopaths are experts at parting fools from their money, IMO.
Diagnosing liver disease by how long you can keep you arm extended?
Hahahahahahahahahahaha!
off to eat indian food now.
three cheers for tumeric and coriander
Molly, what about the battered sofa?
We replaced our sofa 8 years ago. I'd leave for work in summer, kids sitting on my battered sofa smoking cigarettes and hanging out. Come home from work, they're all still there. It was like white trash hell here until Large Item Pickup came around.
They know about your secret plans to leave refrigerators and junk cars in the yard.
Heh...I wonder if they know about the cinder-blocks to hold up the rusted chassis.
Told that this was not family therapy, it was family education, and since I had a PhD, they felt I would be disruptive of 'the flow of the lecture
Those damned stats profs, always deviating your standards.
(that's nuts!)
Hahahahahahahahahahaha!
JR, kerosene and a match | Homepage | 03.15.08 - 6:54 pm | #
now why did I 'suspect' you'd have that opinion about naturopathss?
I love getting non-spam mail!
Well, I do have this twenty million dollars I need to move out of Nigeria.....
We have overcome so many diseases in the past 100 years that people who should be dead are now alive to complain about their allergies and asthmas. You are unnatural. Die Zombies, die!
people in other fields who are advancing a basically illogical theory that stands up to very little scrutiny.
Phila
Like epidemiologists and statisticians?
There is a rise in the absolute number of autism cases, no doubt, but how does that translate to rate?
Well, I do have this twenty million dollars I need to move out of Nigeria.....
If I hadn't cashed that UK lottery ticket today...
Sallyh and Southern Beale,
Under the current administration I simply do not believe anything that they say: they have lied so frequently about so much what is truth anymore?
In the schools I have noted the rise of social disorder diseases. It is unmistakable. Certainly we recognize them better now than ever before but there are simply more of them. Every year that I have taught the children have come to us more out of control. Last year we had a six year old we actually had to call the parents to come and control - frequently. This little girl was simply beyond the school's ability to control. She threw furniture at children. She pushed her arm through a door. Screamed and cursed at the teacher and principal. We had to physically restrain her and that is a dangerous area for the schools to go into. We called her parents. If they were not available, we actually called the police to find them.
What is true is that the nature and frequency of these asocial diseases like ADHD, ODD, and ADD are increasing every year and the schools are having a difficult time dealing with them.
If we had an FDA and CDC that had some integrity left, we might have a chance. At this point they do not.
I'd also avoid chemical in my home cleaning supplies. I wash my wood floors in vinegar and water -- it's good for the floors, and I don't have to worry about a bunch of toxins ending up on my skin. And, i get to screw Johnson Wax and all the other big corporate sucks selling Mr. Clean.
Heparin and similar pharmaceutical precursors should not even be legal for import into the USA. There's no reason it can't be produced domestically, and there's an overwhelming pattern of bad faith on the part of Chinese suppliers when it comes to quality, safety and oversight. It's a disgrace that the manufacturers are eager to jeopardize Americans' lives by using cut-rate Chinese suppliers in the first place, but if the manufacturers aren't willing to exercise even the slightest degree of responsibility, I have no problem with the FDA doing it for them.
now why did I 'suspect' you'd have that opinion about naturopathss?
juan no no nsensical >
Because I'm the resident skeptic?
Heh...I wonder if they know about the cinder-blocks to hold up the rusted chassis.
I'm looking for one of those for the front garden focal sculpture, too.
What people fail to understand is that modernity has given rise to as many diseases as it has succeeded in wiping out.
Not to mention helping create the next generation of superbugs.
flory | 03.15.08 - 6:51 pm | #
The world is overdue for an pandemic, kill off about 90% of the population and the human race just might make it another 150 years. Otherwise, we're all dead.
Reminds me that i need to read The Stand again.
Because I'm the resident skeptic?
JR, kerosene and a match | Homepage | 03.15.08 - 6:57 pm | #
you're a gemini aren't you?
The children of Liberal Mountain get good and properly dirty at least once a day. And then they get dunked in the tub.
Smaller families probably also means that kids don't get the same exposure to mild viruses to build immunity as previous generations.
Every year that I have taught the children have come to us more out of control.
Beowulf, EVERY teacher I know says the exact same thing.
Something is going on. Maybe it's the TeeVee.
What people fail to understand is that modernity has given rise to as many diseases as it has succeeded in wiping out.
bill
Name three.
Because I'm the resident skeptic?
Might be more linked to financial ties.
Got a PC with Vista about a year ago. Kept popping up every couple of weeks with a message that my copy of Vista was illegal. Every time it did that I had to do a phone-based verification, which involved listening to a computer voice read me about 100 numbers to be entered in a series of boxes. Took up lots of my cell phone minutes and lots of my minutes minutes. (you don't get them back at the end of your life)
Then it wouldn't run Corel programs that were designed for XP. When I installed some software, it seemed to eat it -- couldn't even find it on the software list to uninstall. Then it wouldn't let me do system recovery or backup disks. And anytime I'm asked to run a Windows Vista update, it asks me whether or not I want to "cancel or allow". Hey, Windows Vista started the damn update, don't you think the OS would know that?
Had to do a complete system restore. Lost god knows what in the process.
Now it's back to telling me that I can't make system recovery or backup disks.
The problem is, if I downgrade to XP I can't use the Windows Media Center Vista programs that I bought the machine for in the first place.
I know, boo hoo hoo, never shoulda touched Vista, shoulda stuck with XP, shoulda bought a Mac, etc.
Does anybody know, are there some Windows Vista class actions suits out there?
One study which looked well done argued that much of the increase is in more sensitive diagnosis and in paying attention to milder forms of autism, but it also argued that there has been an additional real increase in the incidence rates.
That sounds about right to me. The simplest way to refute the more extreme form of this claim is to note that a significant percentage of the excess cases didn't require more sensitive diagnosis.
The world is overdue for an pandemic...
West Nile! Bird Flu!
it was supposed to make Donald Rumsfeld rich, don't forget...
The crane disaster was inevitable. Any New Yorker in the shadow of a crane will now sleep less comfortably. The real estate bonanza in NY is a race to the bottom. Now people are dying.
modernity has given rise to as many diseases as it has succeeded in wiping out.
bill
Name three.
Obesity
Fatness
Fatitude
bill, so how come there are so many people and most of them in the developed nations are living to such old ages?
Because I'm the resident skeptic?
JR, kerosene and a match | Homepage | 03.15.08 - 6:57 pm | #
you're a gemini aren't you?
juan no no nsensical
Irony!
.
Name three.
Cancer.
Auto-immune disorders.
shorter attention spans:
food additives'
food dye
electronic entertainment; video games
tv
sesame street with instantaneous insanely fast editing
Because I'm the resident skeptic?
JR, kerosene and a match | Homepage | 03.15.08 - 6:57 pm | #
Is that really what you think?
'Cause that seems pretty credulous to me.
you're a gemini aren't you?
juan no no nsensical
No.
*raspberry*
A friend of mione went to a naturopath. He had to keep his arm extended as long as possible, then the guy tried to sell him $500 of pills.
What people fail to understand is that modernity has given rise to as many diseases as it has succeeded in wiping out.
bill
AIDS
"Nothing recedes like progress."
-- ee cummings
I'm just glad I don't have kids. The amount of vaccines a kid is now required to get from birth to when it's in first grade, well, it's astonishing. We never had that many shots.
I wasn't able to get most vaccines because of an inherited medical condition.
Yeah, I'd probably die of smallpox if I were to get it, and the measles or the flu might put me in the hospital or kill me, but the vaccines would also possibly kill me or put me in the hospital, so I guess it all just works out in the wash.
Well, I'm out for a pint. Be back later.
instantaneous insanely fast editing
I watched "The Shining" last night and enjoyed (once again) Kubrick's sparing use of quick cuts. Modern films give me eine headache.
And then they get dunked in the tub.
I read that as drunk in a tub.
I mean, I know about Thers and stuff, but...
shorter attention span:
chem trails!!!!!!!!!!!
no wait i mean'
fast food
Obesity
Diabetes
Asthma
All this autism, allergies and asthma are the result of prayer being taken out of public schools.
...and of Teh Gay.
Name three.
Cancer.
Auto-immune disorders.
I doubt that cancer qualifies. People are living longer than in the past, and that gives cancer more time to surface. Some types of cancers have gotten much more common, sure, but some types have gotten much rarer.
Cancer.
Auto-immune disorders.
Southern Beale
T-rex got cancer and arthritis.
Laptop battery is kaput. Gotta recharge. Later, folks...
Name three.
Cancer.
Auto-immune disorders.
Southern Beale
The vast majority of these people would have died of smallpox , infections or TB when they were 25 or younger. Cancer is a statistical disease and people are living long enough to get it. Things mutate over time.
chem trails!!!!!!!!!!!
Dennis Kucinich, is that you?
.
MRSA
The world is overdue for an pandemic
bird flu is mutating.
"HONG KONG: One of China's top doctors has said that the H5N1 bird flu virus has shown signs of mutation and can kill human victims more easily if treatment is not given early enough, newspapers reported on Tuesday"
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.c...how/
2856072.cms
West Nile! Bird Flu!
No, I mean a real pandemic like Captain Tripps.
A friend of mione went to a naturopath. He had to keep his arm extended as long as possible, then the guy tried to sell him $500 of pills.
Hee! I took one of those evening courses when I tried to take as many weird evening courses in order to write about them (are you a psychic? was one).
Bird Flu!
it was supposed to make Donald Rumsfeld rich, don't forget...
Southern Beale | Homepage | 03.15.08 - 6:58 pm | # [kill][hide comment]
Randi Rhodes used to go on these rants about how bird flu was a hoax "because it had hardly killed anybody."
That's about the time I stopped listening to her. Not only was her take on it staggeringly ignorant, but she was passing up a perfect opportunity to argue against for-profit healthcare and factory farming.
The real estate bonanza in NY is a race to the bottom. Now people are dying.
People in NYC have NEVER died before on account of people trying to get rich, right?
...And then they get dunked in the tub.
...
Molly Ivors
"Aw, Ma! I don' wanna take a Norquist!"
I have a friend who believes all MDs are frauds and charlatans, but will buy any damn thing the latest naturo-sacro-yogi-homeopath-herbalist tells her to buy.
I can't understand it.
Cancer and diabetes, I'm sure, have been around forever.
Ben Goldacre has this kick ass website called Bad Science, and one of his running gags has to dso with this awful pseudoscience marketed to schools. It is in a nutshell Rajio Taiso wrpped in Scientology. It involves taking little breaks in class to do physical exercises -- which is perfectly sound -- but it justifies this with pure garbage about how you are physiologically changing to become smarter through these things. It is totally true that jusdicious use of exercise breaks will help concentration and is a good idea anyway (and it's actually an old Japanese idea called Rajio Taiso, not whatever these British morons are calling it) but it's funny to see the pseudoscientific unnecessary justifications and the heated defenses by its large following.
T-rex got cancer and arthritis.
And he kept telling Velociraptor to get offa his lawn.
Does anybody know, are there some Windows Vista class actions suits out there?
Chichimec
Indeed there are. Google "David Pogue Vista", read the NY Times story, and join the crowd. I believe the anti-Vista memos originating at the highest levels of Microsoft, e.g. Jon Shirley, only came to light because of these suits.
Good luck!
AIDS
Terry C. Hussein
Perhaps a modern disease, but how, pray tell, was it caused by "modernity"? It jumped from simians in a under decidedly non-modern conditions.
"Aw, Ma! I don' wanna take a Norquist!"
He's lucky. According to Kinky Friedman, a shit is a "Bork."
Put Jour Money Where Jour Meow Ees.
Blue Gal, of Blue Gal in a Red State, could use a leetle push to help her over a rough patch. Eef anyone feels like sparing a few of their hard-earned dolares, I am sure she would appreciate eet, and I know that I would as well.
gracias
Now, back to that maldito Bergman film.
żWho knew that Swedes could be so dreary, eh?
Pffft.
I have a friend who believes all MDs are frauds and charlatans, but will buy any damn thing the latest naturo-sacro-yogi-homeopath-herbalist tells her to buy.
I love that episode of "Seinfield" when George drinks that tea and his face turns purple.
I guess the many autoimmune disorders are the modern epidemics.
Asthma, allergies, aids, etc.
I was thinking of getting a lightning rod for my house, but as I've looked into the options it turns out the science behind needing them is unclear in the modern world.
Seems the lightning rod idea that Benjamin Franklin came up with was good at protecting houses from fire, but modern building techniques negate the need.
It's a disgrace that the manufacturers are eager to jeopardize Americans' lives by using cut-rate Chinese suppliers in the first place, but if the manufacturers aren't willing to exercise even the slightest degree of responsibility, I have no problem with the FDA doing it for them.
Dr. Wu
Manufacturers are profit making enterprises. They're always going to look for the least expensive option...as they should.
The problem is, without adequate safety regulation and enforcement, the true cost of going the Chinese route is not reflected in the price they pay.
If they knew that selling contaminated Chinese products was going to cost them hundreds of millions in fines, they might think twice about it.
MRSA
puppethead
Old disease, new resistance.
"HONG KONG: One of China's top doctors has said that the H5N1 bird flu virus has shown signs of mutation and can kill human victims more easily if treatment is not given early enough, newspapers reported on Tuesday"
Kill them more easily? Jesus, it has something like a 60% CFR as it is.
We need to worry about it becoming more infectious, not more deadly. IIRC, the 1918 pandemic had a CFR of only 3% or so.
spork_incident | Homepage | 03.15.08 - 7:02 pm | #
step into the light!!!!
When I was a tyke, anytime somebody came down with the mumpes, chickenpos, measels, etc., I got sent over to spend the night.
Interesting
Seems my name is popular tonight
but possibly some naturopaths are
juan no no nsensical
Naturopaths are experts at parting fools from their money, IMO.
Diagnosing liver disease by how long you can keep you arm extended?
Hahahahahahahahahahaha!
JR, kerosene and a match | Homepage | 03.15.08 - 6:54 pm | #
This proves you know very little about Naturopaths. They are highly trained, 4 years post grad, just like M.D.s. They are fully licencied in some states, like here in Connecticut, and can even proscribe drugs in other states (Washington) If you want to ignore many forms of healing,cures and prevention that aren't made, distributed or provided by the Medical-Industrial complex, be my guest. The Alopathic (M.D's) world seem comfortable doing so. That's why we have the most expensive medical system in the world.
There's no way to evaluate bill's claim of a disease tradeoff because back in the day you would just fucking keel over for no apparent reason and the smartest person alive had no idea why.
Later, y'all
Peace.
The vast majority of these people would have died of smallpox , infections or TB when they were 25 or younger.
Bad Art
TB killed a lot of people years ago.
Let's see, my maternal grandfather died of it (five months before my mom was born).
My mom's maternal grandmother lost two husbands to it (her first husband at 37, her second - my great grandfather - at 35) and her daughter at the age of 24.
Perhaps a modern disease, but how, pray tell, was it caused by "modernity"? It jumped from simians in a under decidedly non-modern conditions.
I saw a recent documentary on HBO, IIRC, that posited the theory that Belgian or French immunologists in Africa used Chimpanzee tissue while manufacturing a vaccine in the 1940s or 1950s. The vaccine was subsequently injected into thousands of Africans. It was compelling. I doan know if it was B.S.
żWho knew that Swedes could be so dreary, eh?
Pffft.
ˇEl Gato Negro! | Homepage | 03.15.08 - 7:05 pm | # [kill][hide comment]
Bergman's an utter drag, in my book.
I somehow doubt all the gubmint bailouts expected by the Brooks Brothers suit set now that they played the free market ponies and lost would really fit into a bathtub either.
I have a Norquist every day.
Whaaat?
.
Bear Stearns is glad that the Fed Gov had a big bath tub. They are glad but they won't be grateful.
Remember the puke caterwauling about importing safe, tested drugs from Canada? Good times.
When I was a tyke, anytime somebody came down with the mumpes, chickenpos, measels, etc,/i>
I thought it said chicken poos.
Measles and mumps are vaccinated against here; and chicken pox is an optional vaccination. My kids both suffered through chicken pox and it wasn't fun. I'm glad they didn't have to go through mumps and measles.
"HONG KONG: One of China's top doctors has said that the H5N1 bird flu virus has shown signs of mutation and can kill human victims more easily if treatment is not given early enough, newspapers reported on Tuesday"
More and more good things just keep coming out of China.
Bergman's an utter drag, in my book.
Phila, Pizen Sarpint | Homepage | 03.15.08 - 7:06 pm | #
but but but but........it's art!!!
and now off to eat south indian vegetarian to cure
my allergy to
the pillars of atlantis
oops. missing tag.
It's a disgrace that the manufacturers are eager to jeopardize Americans' lives by using cut-rate Chinese suppliers in the first place, but if the manufacturers aren't willing to exercise even the slightest degree of responsibility, I have no problem with the FDA doing it for them.
Dr. Wu
I somehow doubt Cheney's pacemakers were manufactured in China.
a bubbly bath tub to stinky. (I don't give cokes since the Carville commercial.)
Any of you guys see Daily Show with Norquist last week? Stewart called him a gullible sucker and Norquist could do nothing but smile and nod... it was great.
Both Norquist and that torture justifying guy got reamed by Stewart. It was fucking beautiful.
If a republican was sucking my balls while I beat my beat and I squinted would I be considered chinese?
IIRC, the 1918 pandemic had a CFR of only 3% or so.
Phila, Pizen Sarpint
That low?
Both my grandfather and a great aunt died in that epidemic.
shit, that was beat my meat
Here's the link to the Daily Show:
http://www.thedailyshow.com/vide...grover-
norquist
Stewart has had so many wingnuts on that I stopped watching.
It was compelling. I doan know if it was B.S.
Harry Doghiney
A fair bit of evidence to the contrary, so I'd call bullshit.
This proves you know very little about Naturopaths. They are highly trained, 4 years post grad, just like M.D.s. They are fully licencied in some states, like here in Connecticut, and can even proscribe drugs in other states (Washington)
The wife went to one in NYC. Worked wonders. Not 'cause he had some ancient wisdom or powerful aura, but because he figured out the underlying problem that was causing various problems, and prescribed drugs to deal with the condition rather than the symptoms. He was also able to recommend some physical therapies for pain relief, and some vitamins etc for general health. Nothing at all new-agey about it, IIRC...not even any herbs, so far as I recall. And yeah, he was fully licensed and able to prescribe.
Any normal doctor should've been able to do the same, I guess, but none of 'em ever did.
I somehow doubt Cheney's pacemakers were manufactured in China.
Stinky
shit, i bet his are platinum.
speaking of crappy chinese product. mcclatchey had a piece this past week about steel not meeting chinese standards for construction purposes. doesn't the u.s. import lotsa chinese steel....
“About 22 percent of the tested products failed tension tests. Buildings with such steel would not be able to withstand major earthquakes, the bureau said.
“Forty-eight percent of the tested material had inadequate amounts of carbon. Shortage of carbon can cause steel to break easily, officials explained.
“The bureau would not reveal where the steel was in use.”
http://washingtonbureau.typepad....g-as-
steel.html
That low?
Both my grandfather and a great aunt died in that epidemic.
flory | 03.15.08 - 7:11 pm | # [kill][hide comment]
You can doublecheck, but I'm pretty sure that's right. Under 5%, definitely.
Actually, the Chinese do have a lot of traditional herbal medicines that are beneficial, but their activity is closely related the methods used in preparation. They aren't good at making pharmaceuticals to US FDA requirements. (I work as a consultant to a lot of generic companies that look to source their APIs in China, but they often run into quality and compliance problems.) Chinese are pretty good at doing chemistry, though, and those are not necessarily related skills.
My dick is 97% carbon which proves that I cannot be chinese
Stewart has had so many wingnuts on that I stopped watching.
Aye.
He recently said to Madeleine Allbright that a McCain presidency would be OK because he was such a national security expert. She looked horrified and smacked him down.
I don't get his fascination with McCain.
So I just discovered Hecate shares a birthday with Phil Lesh (of the Dead) and Sly Stone.
Now there's a trio!
IIRC, the 1918 pandemic had a CFR of only 3% or so.
Phila, Pizen Sarpint
That low?
Both my grandfather and a great aunt died in that epidemic.
flory
I saw a TV show about that and I mentioned it on a couple of the local RootsWeb.com lists that I'm on (genealogy).
I had people telling me about how they'd lost family members in it, and how Philadelphia lost 1,300 people in a week. One fella told me that his grandmother told him all about it, that coffins were stacked up outside the Catholic cemetery and that priests had to work as grave diggers, etc.
I read a terrific book about it called "The Great Influenza" by John Carroll.
IIRC, the 1918 pandemic had a CFR of only 3% or so.
Both my grandparents lived through that, in NYC. They would have been around 9 years old.
In other news, Victor Davis Hanson is a mongrel idiot.
He recently said to Madeleine Allbright that a McCain presidency would be OK because he was such a national security expert.
Say..................what???????????
Dang...thirty bucks for "69 Love Songs"?
I mean, I'm sure it's totally worth it, but I just can't plunk that down right now...
Evening, rational people.
You, too, JR.
If a republican was sucking my balls while I beat my meat and I squinted would I be considered chinese?
The Jester
You'd be considered Chris Matthews.
I read a terrific book about it called "The Great Influenza" by John Carroll.
Terry C. Hussein
I read that book too. I certainly came away with a much higher impression of fatalities.
In case anyone is interested in this controversial documentary, here is a blurb:
The latter hypothesis is the subject of a documentary that premiered in the United States last week at the Tribeca Film Festival in New York City. The Origins of AIDS, directed by Peter Chappell and Catherine Peix, follows the evidence laid out by British journalist Edward Hooper in his 1999 book, The River. In it, Hooper proposed (based on nearly two decades of research) that one man's part in the race to create the polio vaccine launched the AIDS epidemic.
Any normal doctor should've been able to do the same, I guess, but none of 'em ever did.
Phila
Which is too bad.
But thta naturopath wasn't practicing what is usually described as naturopathy.
Like "homeopathy", it's used as a marketting label that gets used broadly becuse of it's popularity.
Both my grandparents
People usually have four.
In other news, Victor Davis Hanson is a mongrel idiot.
Phila, Pizen Sarpint
Well, yes......
Had the Vietnamese known what they were releasing on the world by imprisoning McSame would they have done it again?
According to the CDC's page on the 1918 pandemic, "case-fatality rates were >2.5%, compared to
If a republican was sucking my balls while I beat my meat and I squinted would I be considered chinese?
The Jester
You'd be considered Chris Matthews.
"Hah!"
Oh well...I'm just buying "i" instead.
There's some good stuff on that album, fer chur.
Oops.
According to the CDC's page on the 1918 pandemic, "case-fatality rates were >2.5%, compared to [less than] 0.1% in other influenza pandemics."
I think H5N1's CFR varies by region from 40 to 80 percent. Something like that, anyway.
"In 1984, Howard B. Beckman, M.D., and Richard M. Frankel, Ph.D., reported in Annals of Internal Medicine that, on average, doctors interrupt patients only 18 seconds after they begin to speak."
http://www.managedcaremag.com/
ar...listening.shtml
Research this year shows that doctors now listen to patients for an average of 23 seconds before interrupting (though only 2 percent of patients get to finish their opening statement.)
http://www.wnbc.com/health/10037...816/
detail.html
Hey, 5 seconds worth of improvement in 24 years, what more do you want?
must. resist. crack. den.
There have been so many advances in medicine over the past 100 years that if you were reading these comments on Eschaton back then there would only be about 8 visitors online.
Hey, 5 seconds worth of improvement in 24 years, what more do you want?
Chichimec
My GP and I usually talk about our respective dogs. Uninterupted.
must. resist. crack. den.
Culture of TrÜth
Yer an addict.
Don't even bother trying to resist.
must. resist. crack. den.
(passes pipe to CoT)
Hi, I have the jowls from hell.
I don't get his fascination with McCain.
Harry Doghiney (D-TX)
he was a manly man who withstood torture; that in stewart's quiet moments knows he would never be able to do.
joe scarborough actually said as much about himself recently.
They flap back and forth while I fellate my friend Georgie
Resistance is futile.
Or feudal... I can never remember which.
http://www.thedailyshow.com/vide....-2&
byDate=true
At 2:01, Jon Stewart asks M. Albright it she would be OK with president McCain because he has the experience she requires of a presidential candidate. I may be being unfair to J.S. on this particular exchange, but I still am tired of seeing wingnuts on his show. He gives them platforms they don't need.
My doctor always asks after my dad (also a patient of his) and likes long silences where he sits and considers me.
The pace took some getting used to, but I like it now.
But thta naturopath wasn't practicing what is usually described as naturopathy.
Usually in whose experience? It's a pretty broad, mix-and-match sort of a field (which is one problem with it, granted).
My GP and I usually talk about our respective dogs. Uninterupted.
JR, kerosene and a match
You are lucky. The last doctor I visited had a cartoon up on the wall showing a patient saying to a doctor, "I already diagnosed myself on the internet. I just came to you for a second opinion."
Message: Hey, patient, STFU, don't participate in your own survival, just accept what the doctor says.
I ended that visit when I said to the doctor, "Would you like to hear my symptoms?" and she rolled her eyes and grudgingly said, "okay, go ahead."
Still looking for an MD who will listen without interrupting (hey, I only need about 45 seconds, most of the time), though I have found a DO who is very good at listening.
But the real jowl action gets going when I suck off Abramoff. He's a REAL man.
Serfs are feudal. Resistance is futile.
There have been so many advances in medicine over the past 100 years
that if you were reading these comments on Eschaton back then there
would only be about 8 visitors online.
Dear Master "Theodore Roosevelt Sucks Eggs": In your missive of the 22nd you implied that our motives in the liberation of our little brown Phillipine brothers were less than pure. It pains me to have to voice my concern that some people might come away with the impression that your careless choice of words was positively Bolshie or Anarchistic. Naturally I have written to Attorney General Palmer...
I think H5N1's CFR varies by region from 40 to 80 percent. Something like that, anyway.
Phila, Pizen Sarpint
Hasn't there been less than 200 bird flu deaths in the last 8 years?
Serfs up. Resistance is down.
Both my grandparents
People usually have four.
Snow (D-SC) | Homepage | 03.15.08 - 7:19 pm | #
Ewwwww! Must be from West Virginia and his parents were siblings.
Learned of an essential website from today's Winter Soldier testimony:
http://aliveinbaghdad.org/
People usually have four.
The other two (my father's parents) died before I was born... I always forget about them (but since I never knew them...)!
Tough crowd.
Well, crap. You guys finally have debates on things I can contribute to (bacteria and vaccines), and I'm late to the party.
Very scientific.
A great quote from todays testimony from an Iraq vet:
"The only war our government has waged well is the propaganda war on the American people."
.
There have been so many medical advances over the past 100 years that it just may be possible to remove Hillary Clinton's head from her ass without severe rectal damage.
Bill sure hopes so.
Well, crap. You guys finally have debates on things I can contribute to (bacteria and vaccines), and I'm late to the party.
Gromit
Well, take a shot anyways.
Usually in whose experience? It's a pretty broad, mix-and-match sort of a field (which is one problem with it, granted).
Phila
According to the usual definitions. It's a bag of mixed woo with a couple of bones (like herbalism, which *can* be effective) and environmental medicine (which is neglected by some doctors) thrown in.
Otherwise it's stuff like chiropractic, the thing with the arm, eyes blinks, etc.
I read a terrific book about it called "The Great Influenza" by John Carroll.
Terry C. Hussein
I read that book too. I certainly came away with a much higher impression of fatalities.
flory
The documentary I watched stated that many more American soldiers died from the flu pandemic than from combat.
Hasn't there been less than 200 bird flu deaths in the last 8 years?
The numbers are smallish, but bigger than that, I think. (Wiki says 234.)
The problem is that if a strain does mutate to make interspecies transmission easier, the high mortality rate would be terrible.
Spanish Flu came from horses, IIRC.
(like herbalism, which *can* be effective)
JR, someone's namestealing you.
"You don't see ANY non-bacterial dishwashing liquids."
Dr. Bronner's Sal Suds.
I use it for dishwashing, but it's a general purpose detergent. Wash the floors, the clothes, the dishes, et al.
Get it at your local DFH co op.
I wonder if El Queda aren't sitting around in caves in Northern Pakistan right now licking the cloacae of ducks and chickens trying to breed a new fatal epidemic to send home with our boys from Iraq.
Flory, my grandmother and her oldest son, my uncle, died from it. My mother was 5 when she lost her mom and her big brother.
My uncle had been drafted and was off to fight in the Great War. He was in Fort Smith, Arkansas, a hundred or so miles from his home town, and fell ill. His mother was sent for, and they both died of it.
Spanish Flu came from horses, IIRC.
No, no - that's Spanish FLY!
The documentary I watched stated that many more American soldiers died from the flu pandemic than from combat.
Probably true, in WWI. Most soldiers in the present war will die from sorrow.
JR, someone's namestealing you.
Elias
Not at all, Herbs are drugs. Just like Big Pharma, you have Big Supplement.
Except Big Supplement doesn't have to do any testing at all, so their profit margins are waaay higher.
The documentary I watched stated that many more American soldiers died from the flu pandemic than from combat.
Dr Mrs Gromit's grandfather came home from WWI in a troop ship, and over 100 died on the flu en route.
Any normal doctor should've been able to do the same, I guess, but none of 'em ever did.
Phila
Which is too bad.
But thta naturopath wasn't practicing what is usually described as naturopathy.
Like "homeopathy", it's used as a marketting label that gets used broadly becuse of it's popularity.
JR, kerosene and a match | Homepage | 03.15.08 - 7:19 pm | #
Homepathy and Naturopathy are two diffent things. A Naturapath may be trained in Homepathy, but so might a European trained M.D. But then again we all know medical care in Europe sucks. Not like our medical care as provided by the envy of the world medical-industrial complex.
hey peeps.
Well, crap. You guys finally have debates on things I can contribute to (bacteria and vaccines), and I'm late to the party.
Gromit
I like these kind of threads because they are pretty much troll-free.
The subject matter is WAY over their pointed little haids.
The documentary I watched stated that many more American soldiers died from the flu pandemic than from combat.
Another horrific fact from an interview I just heard with a Winter soldier is that there are more veteran deaths from suicide than from in theatre.
Chris T,
Your gravatar of the FSM looks like a fat woman with huge red breasts.
Clearly, I need to get out more.
"Allopathic" is a codeword, in that it's a term invented by homœopaths to refer to conventional medicine. I'd run from anyone who uses it.
Over the next few months the United States is at risk for contracting the "Asshole Flu". It comes from believing the mendacious grunts and lies of politicos like Hillary Clinton, John McCain and Steven LaTourette.
Gromit, not too late at all!
I study a strain of MRSA in order to learn to predict mathematically how resistance occurs.
Needless to say, this is slow going. But I love it.
i don't know if you all have seen this:
Prominent Kos Poster Goes "On Strike" against Hillary Hate
This is an open letter to the progressive blogosphere...
I’ve been posting at DailyKos for nearly 4 years now and started writing diaries in support of Hillary Clinton back in June of last year. Over the past few months I’ve noticed that things have become progressively more abusive toward my candidate and her supporters.
I’ve put up with the abuse and anger because I’ve always believed in what our on-line community has tried to accomplish in this world. No more. DailyKos is not the site it once was thanks to the abusive nature of certain members of our community.
I’ve decided to go on "strike" and will refrain from posting here as long as the administrators allow the more disruptive members of our community to trash Hillary Clinton and distort her record without any fear of consequence or retribution. I will not be posting at DailyKos effective immediately. I will not help drive up traffic or page-hits as long as my candidate – a good and fine DEMOCRAT - is attacked in such a horrid and sexist manner not only by other diarists, but by several of those posting to the front page.
if i personally find it too much to bear, that's my problem, but apparantly many other progressive blog posters feel the same way that i do, so i wanted to publicly state my support of alegre in her movement to restore civility among democrats. alegre's manifesto has already reached the pages of the NYT
i appreciate that hillary's hardball campaign tactics are painful to many sensitive souls. to use this as an excuse to mimic the worst right wing rhetoric against the clintons is utterly out of scale and doing every bit as much to tear the democratic party apart as anything that hillary could have ever said. i note, however, that there seems to be considerably less of it on eschaton in the last few days.
something is seriously wrong with the progressive blog-o-sphere if suggestions that posters criticise a fellow democrat in a civil tone, rather than with venom, are shouted down angrily. 'defending' barack obama by sounding like rush limbaugh dishonors his promise to rise above the bitter partisan rhetoric of the past, transcend party divisions, and have a transformational effect on american politics.
.
Just got some chocolate pound cake, but from the health food store.
They use eggs from only self actualized hens in it.
According to my colleague, who is ABD in biology and an amazingly learned and smart person, all flus are bird flus.
I don't know anything about biology, and am ashamed to admit it.
Spanish Flu came from horses, IIRC.
No, no - that's Spanish FLY!
dave™© |
Or is it the Spanish Flea?
I love my iPod Touch.
I just sent my first email from it. And I bought a whole album from it. And it changed my underwear!
Clearly, I need to get out more.
Molly Ivors
Is Thers into his Saint Paddy's day stupor already?
Dr Bronner's hemp oil castille soaps are awesome and clean everything except glass. They are endorsed for daily asswashing use by such paragons of respectability as ourselves and Overcompensating cartoonist Jeffrey Rowland.
Except Big Supplement doesn't have to do any testing at all, so their profit margins are waaay higher.
JR, kerosene and a match
A Naturapath may be trained in Homepathy, but so might a European trained M.D.
I will not use a doctor that is involved in homeopathy. I have relatives in the EU, and none of their dctors are into homeopathy.
I love my iPod Touch.
I just sent my first email from it. And I bought a whole album from it. And it changed my underwear!
I chatted one up at Costco yesterday but it remained non-commital. It didn't even buy me coffee.
And it changed my underwear!
Mrs. Zapette will be grateful
Molly doesn't your youngest have a birthday coming around?
"Allopathic" is a codeword, in that it's a term invented by homśopaths to refer to conventional medicine. I'd run from anyone who uses it.
Run far, run fast.
Well, take a shot anyways.
OK, here goes..
Vaccines and autism = bunk
Bacterial drug resistance = huge problem
Bacteria smarter than people? Yes
Antibacterials in soap = not a problem
Sallyh's experience with rehab knuckleheads = sucks
Gotta go check on the chili. It will be beyond awesome.
I remember a lot of hairy nether regions smelling of Dr Bonner's peppermint liquid soap when I was a young hippy.
Well, the first instance of Spanish Flu (so called because the King of Spain was one of the first prominent people to die) was a group of soldiers at Fort Leavenworth. The horses dies, and they burned their carcasses, but because of some freak of the weather, this huge cloud of smoke covered Leavenworth and just kind of sat there.
Then when those guys shipped out, it spread like crazy.
Try that again, Elias, with closed tags.
Tacitus Voltaire | Homepage | 03.15.08 - 7:37 pm | #
Well thought out and written, but then I'm a member of a cult so what do I know.
Why do you think she bought it for me, Sallyh?
David, to be honest, I know little of viruses. Bacteria, yes. Viruses, no. My tiny brain never got wrapped around viruses.
Allopaths of course are the followers of alligators.
Barack put it best when he said "I want my bitches to be bodacious but not loquacious".
Who proved once and for all that dixieland jazz was danceable?
Pigs.
The "Spanish Flu", that is.
Hence the hysteria over the "Swine Flu" in 1976.
.
The documentary I watched stated that many more American soldiers died from the flu pandemic than from combat.
The US was in WWI for only about a year and had very light casualties compared to the other combatants -- IIRC something like 1 in 1500 of men of military age (18-40). The British casualty rate for the same group was 2 in 7 wounded, but recovered; 1 in 7 killed; and 1 in 7 maimed for life.
I’ve decided to go on "strike" and will refrain from posting here as long as the administrators allow the more disruptive members of our community to trash Hillary Clinton and distort her record without any fear of consequence or retribution.
CANCEL MAH FUCKING ACCOUNT!!!!!
virgotex,
Monday. It's easy to remember when they fall on holidays.
My tiny brain never got wrapped around viruses.
Sallyh
Then stay away from the prions....
Except Big Supplement doesn't have to do any testing at all, so their profit margins are waaay higher.
JR, kerosene and a match
I don't know what the hell happened to that last post.
Anyhoo,
JR, I'm with you on that. That's why I try to research the companies I use as much as possible focusing on their history and quality control, etc.
Gromit, I really am somewhat amused by it.
Just so my baby gets well. She's been there going on six weeks. Her husband is trying to get her into a sober living house. Insurance is going to run out anyway, and once the dinero disappears, her rehab isn't going to give a rat's ass about her.
Wikipedia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_flu
One theory is that the virus strain originated at Fort Riley, Kansas, by two genetic mechanisms — genetic drift and antigenic shift — in viruses in poultry and swine which the fort bred for local consumption. But evidence from a recent reconstruction of the virus suggests that it jumped directly from birds to humans, without traveling through swine.
Bacteria, yes. Viruses, no.
Sallyh
How about those Archaea?
The guys keep heading out to shoot hoops....seems sunny then bam, another downpour.
Gromit, I really am somewhat amused by it.
I like your attitude, young lady.
"Allopathic" is a codeword, in that it's a term invented by homśopaths to refer to conventional medicine. I'd run from anyone who uses it.
animus | 03.15.08 - 7:37 pm | #
An evidence based decision, no doubt. Your study was funded by the AMA?
That's why I try to research the companies I use as much as possible focusing on their history and quality control, etc.
Elias:
Also research the product.
For instance, it turns out that supplementing with vitamin E actually increases your chance of getting lung cancer.
Well, shoot. I thought it was the burning horses.
The horses died, and they burned their carcasses, but because of some
freak of the weather called GOD, this huge cloud of smoke covered Leavenworth and
just kind of sat there. And all because somebody masturbated.
I've always been interested in virii.
Neither alive nor not-alive.
Is there a philosopher in the house?
.
JR, what kind of slut do you think I am?
and once the dinero disappears, her rehab isn't going to give a rat's ass about her.
Truer words were never spoken. It's a racket.
Then stay away from the prions....
JR, kerosene and a match | Homepage | 03.15.08 - 7:42 pm | #
Prions are amazing. Simple proteins that seem to mimic life but I've read articles where that has been debated.
CWD is wiping out the Wisconsin deer population in a number of counties.
hail
Monday. It's easy to remember when they fall on holidays.
Molly Ivors | Homepage | 03.15.08 - 7:42 pm | #
well, he'll be driving in no time at this rate.
An evidence based decision, no doubt. Your study was funded by the AMA?
Nick Danger
Usual tinfoil gambit... anyone who disagrees is part of a conspiracy.
Bacterial drug resistance = huge problem
Bacteria smarter than people? Yes
"And God said, bacteria shall inherit the Earth!"
The guys keep heading out to shoot hoops....seems sunny then bam, another downpour.
NTodd brings his own weather system where ever he goes.
We're burning horses?
That isn't right.
.
Prions are amazing. Simple proteins that seem to mimic life but I've read articles where that has been debated.
it seems tha some prions perfom useful functions, it's just when they go wild (cancer, anyone?) that they cause disease.
I remember a lot of hairy nether regions smelling of Dr Bonner's peppermint liquid soap when I was a young hippy.
...and that tingly feeling when spreading it on nether regions. Good times, good times.
Spork, I'm not a philosopher. But many organisms are parasitic in order to survive, as are viruses. I'm going to lean towards the 'alive' distinction.
We're burning horses?
That isn't right.
wait, is this a continuation of the melancholy and sentimental foods of the past thread yesterday?
I've always been interested in virii.
spork_incident
I'm going to have to kill you now.
[/Latin wonk]
"And God said, bacteria shall inherit the Earth!"
I teach genetics of antibiotic resistance to medical students. Very scary stuff.
Gromit, KY comes in menthol.
I learned this from a porn actress. Really.
I'm going to lean towards the 'alive' distinction.
Sallyh
Depends on the definition. The one I've been exposed to as "standard" is "reproduces, adapts and metabolizes"
Viruses only score two out of three.
One of the addictive facets of this joint is that if one sits quietly and listens/reads, one learns a whole hell of a lot about many things.
I remember a lot of hairy nether regions smelling of Dr Bonner's peppermint liquid soap when I was a young hippy.
I still use it...
I love getting in a hot hot bath with a little peppermint or eucalyptus doc bronners. Known as the snow monkey bath in my household.
many organisms are parasitic in order to survive
That explains Wolf Blitzer.
.
Gromit, I knew we were soulmates!
CWD is wiping out the Wisconsin deer population in a number of counties.
I think it's in fourth place. Starvation, autos, hunters, CWD.
A Naturapath may be trained in Homepathy, but so might a European trained M.D.
I will not use a doctor that is involved in homeopathy. I have relatives in the EU, and none of their dctors are into homeopathy.
JR, kerosene and a match | Homepage | 03.15.08 - 7:39 pm
J.R, How many Naturopaths have you been to see? or know. Or is your daddy a multimillionaire Cardiologyst?
JR, hence the controversy. I lean towards alive, with reservations.
One of the addictive facets of this joint is that if one sits quietly and listens/reads, one learns a whole hell of a lot about many things.
Darn tootin', Diane.
Like, just now, I learned that I shouldn't apply Dr. Bronners to burning horses or else I'll get Spanish bacteria.
Or something.
I remember a lot of hairy nether regions smelling of Dr Bonner's peppermint liquid soap when I was a young hippy.
And sandalwood soap.
J.R, How many Naturopaths have you been to see? or know. Or is your daddy a multimillionaire Cardiologyst?
Nick Danger
More tinfoil.. yeah, I'm part of a conspiracy.
A conspiracy to spread reason.
I teach genetics of antibiotic resistance to medical students. Very scary stuff.
Gromit
so explain why antibacterials in soap isn't a problem...I've always thought it was.
wait, is this a continuation of the melancholy and sentimental foods of the past thread yesterday?
I didn't see yesterday's thread but my tortollini is looking rather glum.
.
...and that tingly feeling when spreading it on nether regions. Good times, good times.
One should not use tea tree oil shampoo on one's pubic hair.
Don't ask how I know this.
I lean towards alive, with reservations.
Sallyh
Well, the thing is that there really isn't a distinct line between alive and not alive. So it's a tough call.
I'm going to have to kill you now.
[/Latin wonk]
Where did I go wrong?
Really.
.
I have relatives in the EU, and none of their dctors are into homeopathy.
You know who else had relatives on that continent? Hitler, that's who.
JR, and still the source of endless debates.
A conspiracy to spread reason.
Like me, you're worse than Hitler.
Gromit, KY comes in menthol.
I learned this from a porn actress. Really.
(This, people, is why I come here.)
Was she learning statistics for her next career, or applying it somehow to her current profession?
Or are you the one preparing for her next career?
many organisms are parasitic in order to survive
That explains Wolf Blitzer.
...or most of Faux Noise.....
Well, the thing is that there really isn't a distinct line between alive and not alive. So it's a tough call.
Bullshit, I watched The Twilight Zone.
Dr Bonner's peppermint liquid soap
Dilute! Dilute! Okay!
.
One should not use tea tree oil shampoo on one's pubic hair.
Shampoo or soap?
KY comes in menthol.
I learned this from a porn actress. Really.
My lovely wife informs me the best "lube" is silicon-based.
I suggested a brand should be developed called "Horta Lube" but she didn't get it...
gov't should be used to remove all risks and rewards from life
Oh, I owe K&Y two cokes!
.R, How many Naturopaths have you been to see? or know. Or is your daddy a multimillionaire Cardiologyst?
Nick Danger
More tinfoil.. yeah, I'm part of a conspiracy.
A conspiracy to spread reason.
JR, kerosene and a match | Homepage | 03.15.08 - 7:51 pm | #
Ignorance is cool. No conspiracy implied.
You did avoid the question, however.
One should not use tea tree oil shampoo on one's pubic hair.
Don't ask how I know this.
Molly Ivors
Oh, dear....I bet that hurt.
Gromit, she was the half sister of one of Mlle's former loser bf's.
She announced this loudly one day while we were in the Walgreens. I was like, o-kay...
Would anybody here mind if I shot haloscan and put it out of its misery?
Gromit, KY comes in menthol.
In the novel Trainspotting, a fellow is about to have anal sex with a woman, but the only lubricant he can find is Ben-Gay.
Hilarity ensues.
I suggested a brand should be developed called "Horta Lube" but she didn't get it...
And a good thing, too.
.
You know who else had relatives on that continent? Hitler, that's who.
and mimi!
It was shampoo, k&y, though I think it might have had peppermint oil in it, too.
Dilute! Dilute! Okay! Dial this phone number and we're all-one! All-one! All-one!
Would anybody here mind if I shot haloscan and put it out of its misery?
Shoot luby while you have your gun loaded.
Hasn't there been less than 200 bird flu deaths in the last 8 years?
1Watt, Hermit | Homepage | 03.15.08 - 7:27 pm | # [kill][hide comment]
Nothing to do with anything. Currently, it's very hard for humans to catch. If that changes even a little bit, things'll be very different very fast.
To be fair, a few virologists don't think it has the ability to become more infective in humans. Seems better to prepare for them being wrong than right, though.
Where did I go wrong?
Really.
.
spork_incident
"virii" would be a plural of "virius" a word that doesn't exist.
'evenin'
The word 'allopathic' was invented by Samuel Hahnemann, the inventor of homeopathy. It's been used ever since as a pejorative for ordinary, proven medical practice. It isn't a neutral term, and has no other provenance.
It's important to remember that homeopathy originated when medicine was cursed with an unreliable, untested pharmacopoeia and was often to little avail, sometimes it even made things worse. So homeopathy wasn't, when it was invented, much better or worse than medicine. Since, there have been an advance or two in medicine. Homeopathy, however, hasn't advanced worth a damn; there isn't a single study that shows it's worth shit; its fundamental theory of chemistry and drug interactions hasn't manipulated or illuminated nature even a little, and is contradicted in every pharmacology lab in the world daily.
Would anybody here mind if I shot haloscan and put it out of its misery?
Let me hand you the gun.
.
JR, and still the source of endless debates.
Sallyh
Who says that science is boring?
and mimi!
Mimi lives in Switzerland! You know who else lived in Switzerland? Gehlen!
(Gehlen was sort of the great Nazi spy mastermind who was part of Paperclip and weaselled his way into the Cold War and comfortable survival in the CIA.)
life is like farts, you think you've got it all figured out, then one give you a big surprise.
Would anybody here mind if I shot haloscan and put it out of its misery?
Are you having problems? Weird... I'm not, and we're not that far apart...
Dilute! Dilute! Okay! Dial this phone number and we're all-one! All-one! All-one!
k&y,bloodfeastislandpansies! | 03.15.08 - 7:57 pm | # [kill][hide comment]
All one or we're none!
I bet you've never sent away for the stuff they don't put on the bottles...like the anecdote about their pet cat who committed suicide after being anally raped by another male cat.
You did avoid the question, however.
Nick Danger
You didn't ask one.
Mimi lives in Switzerland! You know who else lived in Switzerland?
William Tell
"virii" would be a plural of "virius" a word that doesn't exist.
True enough.
What's the proper Latin plural?
(I'm really asking.)
.
Sallyh, is the atmosphere as dark and lowering at your place as it is here? It's really freaky, as if one hellaciously bad storm is about to break in.
Homeopathy, however, hasn't advanced worth a damn; there isn't a single study that shows it's worth shit; its fundamental theory of chemistry and drug interactions hasn't manipulated or illuminated nature even a little, and is contradicted in every pharmacology lab in the world daily.
Sez you!!!
Who says that science is boring?
It's the gossip that keeps me going somedays
Are you having problems? Weird... I'm not, and we're not that far apart...
dave™©
About every third time I refresh, it only refreshes about half the thread.
Ixnay on the imimay!
Or...
Countdown to her appearance in 5,4,3...
head on, apply directly to the penis. It works as a homeopathic lube too.
Diane, we had hail, thunder, lightning, heavy rain, and now light rain.
Scared the hell out of the doggie.
About every third time I refresh, it only refreshes about half the thread.
I've had that problem before, but not now.
Like I said - weird!
What's the proper Latin plural?
(I'm really asking.)
.
spork_incident
Maybe "viri". (IIRC, the plural of "vir" is "vires", so there's no danger of confusion.)
"I love getting in a hot hot bath with a little peppermint or eucalyptus doc bronners."
I mainly use the peppermint Dr. Bronner's, however, when I feel a cold coming on, I'll use the eucalyptus. It really helps keeping the lungs and sinuses clear. At least while the hot water is flowing.
For instance, it turns out that supplementing with vitamin E actually increases your chance of getting lung cancer.
Ah, there's conflicting studies on that JR. Look, megadosing with any supplement is playing with fire. What I always recommend is to use 1/2 of the RDA if you're supplementing. I always error on the side of less is better.
About every third time I refresh, it only refreshes about half the thread.
That was happening to me earlier.
I blame Dick Cheney.
.
Dilute! Dilute! Okay!
Which reminds me...while preparing this huge lab manual one time, I had to compile all the cautionary information for the chemicals etc. Many pages of very fine print. At one point, I added "Don't drink soap! Keep out of eye! Dilute! Dilute! OK!"
No one ever mentioned it, oddly enough.
Phila, Pizen Sarpint
WE MUST HAVE THIS FASCINATING CAT RAPE NEWSLETTER!
Sallyh, just had the hail and a roll of nearby thunder. The cats are not amused.
Well, maybe I'll absent myself from this felicity for a while until this blows over.
Oh, I almost forgot: Bonus Critter Blogging is up.
Maybe "viri".
Wrong
I blame Dick Cheney.
.
spork_incident
Bastard!
It's not enough he's ruined the whole fucking world...now he's gotta screw with haloscan?
so explain why antibacterials in soap isn't a problem...I've always thought it was.
The stuff that goes into soap is a chemical that kills bacteria through a mechanism that's more like what alcohol does than like what penicillin does. Bacteria can't develop or acquire genes that result in high-level resistance to the stuff in soap (or to alcohol).
In contrast, bacteria can easily pick up antibiotic resistance plasmids that contain 20 or more genes for high level resistance to different clinical antibiotics all at once. So a bug can go from fully susceptible to all antibiotics to completely resistant to all common antibiotics in about 30 seconds. Now THAT's scary. Thank dog for the immune system.
That said, the antibacterials that go into soap don't contribute anything to your heath, either. So I'd prefer that they just leave it out. It's there for marketing purposes alone, so far as I can tell.
What's the proper Latin plural?
(I'm really asking.)
spork_incident
There isn't one, it's a collective noun.
But it is a neuter, so, treated as a neuter 2nd it's "vira", treated as a neuter 4th it's "virua"
Flory: is that going on The List?
meanwhile, Obamagasmics in utter panic as the MSM beats their messiah Hussein about the head and shoulders for his 20-year close affilation with a vicious racist pastor named Jeremiah "God Damn America" Wright...
"superdelegates, Rezko, Michigan, Florida, now this!....."
who says life ain't fair?
What's the proper Latin plural? [of virus]
There isn't one. It's a neuter second-declension noun ending in -us, which is a weird category made up of non-countable nouns (which basically never appear in the plural).
"Viruses" is fine in English.
Yo. I have discovered sheets up north.
Dilute!
There isn't one, it's a collective noun.
But it is a neuter, so, treated as a neuter 2nd it's "vira", treated as a neuter 4th it's "virua"
Right
Gromit, as I said earlier, bacteria are smaller, faster, and smarter than we are. We're always trailing them. Sometimes I get the feeling they're laughing at us, but this is only after many, many hours after staring at the computer and feeling very, very fuzzy.
Homeopathy, however, hasn't advanced worth a damn
That's nonsense. Modern industrial techniques have given us the ability to dilute homeopathic compounds as never before!
And what about advances in printing and advertising, to say nothing of the Internet? Those little sugar pills won't sell themselves, you know.
hey sallyh: howyadoon?
Well, shiver me timbers, there's a whole Wikipedia entry on the plural of virus.
.
I'd say viruses.
(And, no, viri don't have peni)
bacteria are smaller, faster, and smarter than we are
Someone else said bacteria were smart upthread. I have no idea what this means....
So I'd prefer that they just leave it out. It's there for marketing purposes alone, so far as I can tell.
Gromit
Well, I feel better about the stuff being all over the frickin' place then.
But it is all marketing. The 'scared mommy' demographic, and I do wish to hell they'd leave it alone.
Thanks for the info.
Flory: is that going on The List?
Sallyh, Grandmere Poissonniere
The List has a voracious appetite.
ProfWombat, turned away at the rehab center!
Now that it's happened, I confess to being mildly amused.
Maybe "vi