HaloScan.com - Comments

Its hard to make a QB throw a pick when you give their WRs 10 yard cushions 3/4 of the time and get no penetration from your front 4. Of course, there was that fumble that wasn't called. Not that there were any blown calls in that game.
Thundershaker | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 8:44 am | #

Can anyone tell me how this defense is any better than what we had with Rick Minter. I think there is a tug of war going on here between Brown(Jets) & Tenuta--this defense is light years away from what GT ran under Tenuta.

Plus we need a fiery guy like Tenuta on the sideline.

Our offense- I would expect rest of teams on schedule to go blitz crazy against us.
John | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 9:26 am | #

We were all waiting for a game in which the lack of a field goal kicker hurt us. I believe this was one.

Even with all the turnovers, I still like our chances in this game if we could have gotten 3 instead of going for it on 4th and 7 in the fourth quarter.
Hal | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 9:48 am | #

tenuta has done nothing, was surprised that we got him, these superstar coordinators never really work out when the move to a new school. its move espn hype than anything.

watching us blow that game, leads me to believe we will blow a few more. the D is just not good enough.

the D is better than before as we have bettr players and the coaches have learned a few things. not sure Tenuta added anything
belocki | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 9:50 am | #

I'm going to take issue with Mike's point that you can forgive the offense 5 turnovers because of inexperience.

Clausen's strip/fumble I can live with -- just a tremendous effort by the UNC defensive end.

What should haunt Clausen and terrify ND fans was the pick six coming out of half time. Jimmie NEVER SAW the underneath LB. Never saw him! That's fundamentals 1-A when throwing an out pattern and something Jimmie's been doing since freshman year in High School. That was one of the worst Clausen moments I've seen all year, and for me a real cause for concern.
Colorado Irish | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 9:51 am | #

Young teams need to learn how to place with intensity for four quarters. We're not there yet. Certainly better , and getting there every week. The defense lacks some of the intensity of the offense probably from a leadership void. We need a running game, a defense, a kicker with confidence. The defense needs more young recruits up front. This years class is noticibly abscent in that department.
valpodoc | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 9:56 am | #

Hal, how can the "lack of a field goal kicker" hurt you when you're 1/1 on the day. The 4th & 7 Weis already explained (and I agree w/ him): w/ that little time to go, we need a TD to win. Especially the way UNC had started to run the ball on us, we couldn't count on getting it back for another FG try (I'm not even talking about chances to make 1 or both). As much as the way that the 4th & 7 play unfolded frustrated the hell out of me, I still say go for the 1st down there.
baIrish | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 10:14 am | #

Colorado Irish,

I think that pass was a lesson learned for Jimmy. I'd rather have it happen this year than next. We need our rapidly progressing team to learn some lessons, even if it's the hard way. Sad to think that could have been the difference in the game (7 points).
KB | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 10:15 am | #

Trying to stay positive after a loss w/ so many negatives is difficult, but I'm trying. Was pleased at least w/ Kamara stepping up when the opportunity arose. I'd love for him to stay more involved in the passing game, but know it's crowded at the WR position this year. Don't think any of the current top-3 will be beaten out at this point, but at least I feel better about our 4-&-5-wide sets for now, and like our prospects next year w/ Floyd, Tate, & Kamara as a standard starting-3. Not to take anything away from Grimes, who has a nack for coming through in the clutch, but I like the balance of skills w/ Kamara (tallest, biggest, possibly most-physical?), Floyd (tall enough, great route-running/ability to get open), & Tate (small but fast as hell, great in space, fights for the ball like a guy twice his size).

On a separate note, I would love to have seen how this game would have unfolded had the ref's correctly called (or reviewed/overturned) the fumble by their receiver on 3rd & 18 (or whatever that play was), when Blanton stripped their star receiver. This one hurts...
baIrish | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 10:24 am | #

This Tenuta is crap stuff is nuts. It's going to take time to install a very complicated blitz scheme. It's coming along.

In the end, we hung with and in a lot of ways outplayed (turnovers count, were earned, and made the complete difference) a ranked team in their building. It sucks that we lost but this isn't a huge setback
Majnun | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 10:26 am | #

baIrish,

I hear you, but I disagree. With 14 minutes left in the game, down 5, you're going to get 2 or 3 more possessions. If you can get a field there, you're down two points, which puts a different kind of pressure on the NC defense.

When you're missing that dimension of your game, you become more predictable.
Hal | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 10:32 am | #

ok fine, but lets stop referring to NC as "a ranked team in their building" like we just took on LSU in front of 90k on sat nite. UNC has a very good chance to lose to UVA this week on the road. they are not a top 25 team
belocki | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 10:33 am | #

Don't downgrade NC at all. Their D lived up to the hype. Based upon results across the country, they are certainly a top 20 team, as we are potentially.
I am disappointed in run D. It seems the the other teams' back falls forward for 3 yds even when we hit him at the line. WE had a couple of near misses that turned into 7 yd gains.
The comparison by Charlie to the 2005 USC game is appropriate. This was two top 20 teams fighting down to the last play, and unfortunately we were on the short end.
Finally, I agree with the comment that Jimmy will learn from his worst throw of the year, and be unlikely to ever make it again.
canuck 75 | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 10:53 am | #

Hal, was it really 14 minutes to go? That would make it the drive immediately following Sexton's TD run to put them ahead, & that seems like very little turn-around from what I remember. I thought it was under 10 min to go (which is admittedly still a decent chunk of time), but I could very well be wrong. If it was that much time, then I agree - go for the points. Even if you miss, you're no worse off than if you don't convert the 1st down [would've loved a fake-fg at that point, actually... if it'd worked, of course]. Also true that lack of kicking game can make us more predictable.
However, I don't know about assuming you're gonna get 2-3 more possessions. Say 12 min to go, you get the FG. You need a defensive stop, big time. Say you get it, that'll take 2-3 min away & you get the ball back w/ under 10 to go. Give it 4-5 min for us to score (no hurry-up yet), and you'll get at most 1 more after that. Of course 3 would be possible w/ a turnover, big return, unusually high amount of plays going out of bounds, etc, but I'd say at that point in the game you only bank on 1-2 more possessions. Getting nit-picky on you, sorry.
Damn this one hurts. Hoped ranting about it might help... boy that was dumb, it's just making me relive it all. Sigh...
baIrish | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 11:00 am | #

everyone is killing the ND schedule, but according to Sagarin, ND is at 29th hardest schedule.

others at:
texas 43
penn state 74
bama 38
ok 32
ok st 94
osu 40
TT 105
utah 72
byu 121
cal 55
missouri 87
g tech 89
lsu 66
fsu 127
bc 126
belocki | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 11:11 am | #

For the anti-Tenuta clique, no blitz scheme will work without a front line that can neutralize some of the offensive line. It's not question that the DL is the achilles heal this season. There is a lot of young DL talent on this roster, but they are mostly freshmen. The 2007 OL showed us what happens when you rely too much on youth.

Let's all hope a year in the weight room and to acclimate to the college game can prepare Johnson, Cwynar, Nwanko, I. Williams, Lewis-Moore, Newman and H. Williams to the point where they can disrupt the OL enough to allow our speedy linebackers to do some damage. (apologies if I forgot any young DL)

Without the front getting some push, it doesn't matter what scheme you run. With the exception of maybe Kuntz, the older DL are clearly outmanned out there. Hopefully we see a maturation like we have seen this year with the OL.
Anonymous | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 11:12 am | #

Now, I am by no means excusing the INTs. But at the start of the game, NC rushed three(!) and dared Clausen to beat them. And he was picking them apart with 8 men in coverage.

Putting this all on Clausen is somewhat misguided.

And I agree, they go for it on 4th and 7 no matter what the situation with the kicker is, IMHO.
Broom | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 11:18 am | #

baIrish,

You're right about the timing of that 4th Q possession -- it ended around 12:00, not 14:55 [I misread the ESPN drive summary], and your other points are all valid. I guess what I'm saying is that I'd like to have the option to kick a 43 yard FG. Right now, it seems like it's not much of an option, and that makes us more predictable.

I was at the game, sitting in the end zone. Agreed that this one hurts.
Hal | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 11:26 am | #

Anyone else think that with the success we had witht the no-huddle, we should maybe run that more often? Not the entire game, but it seems that we've done pretty well when we've used it this season.
erin | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 11:30 am | #

Is Tenuta being wasted?When we played Ga. Tech he blitzed every play from every angle. I didn`t see that many on Saturday and we let a mediocre QB beat us.
Irishjh2 | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 11:37 am | #

Anyone else bugged by the poor performance of the replay people?

The system failed on the two biggest plays of the game:
1. The unreviewed 3Q fumble by NC should have gone ND's way [the drive eventually resulted in a TD for NC.]
2. The reviewed 3rd down catch by NC should have essentially ended the game, but the replay officials overturned the on-field call. I'd equate this one to the Grimes catch in last year's Stanford game -- just astonishing that anyone could see fit to decide the video provided indisputable evidence that the on-field call was wrong.

I hate to sound whiny, but what the heck do we have replay for if not to get game-changing calls correct?
Hal | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 11:38 am | #

I'm willing to give Brown and Tenetua more time. We lost arguably our two best defenders in Laws and Walls, plus Zibby to boot. If you remember correctly even Weis's first good recruiting class was devoid of defense. (Ironically, its overwhelming strength was at O-line. Oops!). So the defense, talent-wise, is about where our offense was last year. I think they are coming along. Once those young guys along the d-line add some muscle, we'll see improvement. Guys like Blanton and Filer will continue to improve with age as well.

Ditching Brown and Tenetua at this point is extremely premature.
Steve | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 11:40 am | #

Went and looked at play-by-play on cnnsi. The 4th and 7 was at 11:57 in the 4th Q and ball was on the UNC 27.

Yes, no question we stayed down by 5--as opposed to getting within 2--then is due to our kicking woes.

JC
jc_angelo | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 11:51 am | #

I have to give North Carolina credit. They played the whole game, and never stopped coming, even after some early demoralizing big play give ups.

A lot of us were hoping Sexton would look like a guy who shouldn't be first string, and help us out with some turnovers, but he didn't. The Tar Heels have lost a close one this year, and won some close ones, including a comeback vs. Miami, so full credit to them for being a gutsy, well-coached team.

I hope to see ND put together four intense quarters on the road in a couple of weeks. That'll be the next desirable improvement.

I loved that play where Tate turned an INT by NC into a reception inside their ten. What a gamer!

A little more luck, and Rudolph might have grabbed that pass that tipped off Floyd's hands in the end zone. Next time, it'll go ND's way.
Joe Subway | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 11:52 am | #

I was there as well. Overall, the Irish are definitely improving and was a great game to watch. We are competing, don't forget how painful last year was... or watch Michigan..

Blame Clausen all you want, but without him we are not even in the game.

Lack of kicker definitely hurt and think play calling would have been different had we been able to "get in position" for 3 in the 4th as opposed to going for 6. On O, not sure why we didn't throw down the middle in the 2nd half...

I think our biggest weakness is our lb's.. how many tackles do these guys have compared to our safeties...if the dl isn't tackling the rb then it's safeties.. where are the guys in the middle. Same with slants, should we not have a lb step in front of one of those.. seems like that is just way too easy and has been all the way back to san diego state..

overall, we are young and improving. Clausen is the real deal and has great receivers to go to.. Defense needs some consistency, seems very random and not well thought out.. There qb was hurt at the end of the 1st half, and yet we never got to him or seemed to try in the second half. These guys expected blitz every play and just killed us with quick outs/slants and we never adjusted..
jmc | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 12:01 pm | #

This game was one of the few cases where I'm comfortable saying "Take away the turnovers and Notre Dame would've won."

The first half is in the books. We had 6 drives in the second half and 4 of them were turnovers. NC scored two touchdowns off of those. Except for the turnovers, ND had no trouble eating up yards in the second half. I can't see NC pulling it out without the turnovers.

DISCLAIMER: This is just a thought exercise, NC came out and took the game away from us. They deserve the win.

Fingers have to point at Clausen's mistakes, but he's been playing well and building confidence - a situation where a young player will tend to overstep a bit, while they find the balance of confidence and care.

So I spent my month's allowance of profanity on the defense in the second half. After years of being bailed out by the offense or special teams, this would have been the time for them to return the favor and stop a few more drives.
obediah | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 12:19 pm | #

I am seeing all kinds of negative comments from the past lost. This is a young team guys(and gals?). Yes it is discouraging to come out of half time and throw an interception. Obviously Clausen has not suddenly morphed into Brady Quinn rerealized. He did similar things with Rudolph earlier in the game. North Carolina saw that, made a halftime adjustment and that is that. Personally I am unsure why we called that play coming out of halftime, true the pass set up the run, but our next possession the run got it done. Seems like we could have done that sooner, but who knows.

Despite some previous conversation to the contrary this is a game I maintained from the beginning of the year that we should win, but won't. Is it discouraging to snatch defeat out of the jaws of victory? Most certainly. But to what outcome would you have this year? We aren't and should not go to a BCS bowl, though with the continued improvement each week that is a real possibility for next year. Yes it has been frustrating that only certain parts of our team show up for a game (in this case the offense showed up, for the most part and the defense was lackluster). The mos encouraging thing in my mind is not the performance on he field, but something Charlie talked about after the game. The emotion on the players after the game. Not of self-sorrow, but of anger and frustration at a game they should have one. Coach Holtz talked about it: "We had a group a guys who waned to in but didn't know how, then we progressed to a group of guys wanted to win and learned how to win and then we progressed to a group of guys who knew how to win, but didn't always exhibit it." Last year we were the first, this year we are the second. They are learning to believe that they should win. There will still be peaks and valleys this season. We are still on track to be 7-5. I am looking forward to an exciting rest of the season. Go Irish
Matt B. | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 12:23 pm | #

erin, we've been using the no-huddle since the second half against MSU.

Hal, the overturned UNC catch is significantly different from Grimes. In the Grimes case, they had to assume facts not in evidence (whether or not his hand was under the ball, it couldn't be seen definitively and was plausible that it was) in order to overturn. In the UNC case, they had everything they needed in order to make the call, and the only judgment involved was whether the guy went to ground as part of making the catch. Once that decision was made in the affirmative, the rules dictated that it was an incomplete pass.
Mr. Wednesday | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 12:25 pm | #

Remember: We barely beat Stanford at home, and it was barely only because of a poor second half. With the obvious exception of Purdue, are we being outcoached at half-time? UNC seemed to be in the right place at the right time on the first play from scrimmage. Also, we now seem to feel that Charlie has at least part of the offense ticking, but it has taken great talent and time (remember last year?). We have new coaches and young talent on defense, but we'll probably need more time to get it clicking. We need more time on both sides of the ball. This game gave us a realistic look at who we are right now.
flannercock | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 12:33 pm | #

Just checked the stats.

472 yards in total offense, one punt, and we led in time of possession... turnovers killed us, no question.

Bruton and McCarthy are miles ahead of our lb's in tackles -- 56/54 to 34 for Crum and brian smith.... any other team have their safeties as leading tacklers???
jmc | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 12:35 pm | #

There has been considerable banter here regarding the inablility of the D to come up with more sacks given the increased propensity to blitz. Opposing teams have found a fair amount of success finding the "hot" receiver on short routes, many of which are slant patterns run by the wide receivers. Our corners have been using head up or outside-in technique, giving their wide receivers free release from the line of scrimmage, providing an instantly open "hot" receiver in a passing lane vacated by the blitzing linebacker. Maybe someone who has more knowledge than me can enlighten me as to why our corners are allowing their receivers to release freely to the inside. It would seem to me that if our corners take away the quick slamt, it may make the blitz more effective.
Oak | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 12:57 pm | #

The slanat is the toughest route to cover. If the receiver runs the route correctly he drives the corner off and has him on his hip, either interference or a catch. If the LBs are blitzing that clears the hook zone. The slant is a quick pass designed to be thrown between the corner and a LB, if there is no inside coverage it can usually go for a big gain. Your corner can try to jump the route but has to be careful to not come over the back of the receiver. I think you saw another slant that Crum got called for interference, had he turned his head it would have been a good play.
Doug | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 1:30 pm | #

The ground cannot cause a fumble, but it can cause an incompletion. The rule was explained on another entry. If a receiver leaves his feet to catch a pass, he must possess the ball when he hits the ground. If he catches the pass on his feet he must maintain control through a football move (i.e.) a step or two.
Doug | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 1:33 pm | #

For the first time in a long time, I feel like we can compete every week. That's a much better feeling than the sense of dread last year as each new Saturday rolled around, and not nearly as good a feeling as I'll have this time next year.

The question occurred to me this morning: suppose this year's team played last year's schedule (with the opponents at their strength back then, such as BC with Ryan, U-M with their o-line, etc.). What would the results be? My intuition was that they would possibly have a better record, and would definitely have competed better against the opponents (no 38-0 blowout at Ann Arbor). I wish we'd get there a bit sooner, but I think we are getting there.
DJ | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 1:43 pm | #

UNC has lived and died by the turnover margin this season. I just wish that with a lead, Notre Dame would have gotten a "little" bit conservative and just played keep away and pinned UNC deep. I think it was obvious that UNC couldn't march all the way down the field and score, but they continue to get turnovers and were aided in field position. I think if that game were played again, Weis would have used field position to his advantage a bit more; especially with Sexton at QB.

Jesse W.
http://www.churchofcowherd.com
Jesse Wojdylo | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 1:45 pm | #

Off-topic, I just had to pass these ridiculous stats along:
"Cierre Wood poured in five touchdowns and 314 all-purpose yards as Santa Clara (5-0) rocked Kilpatrick 50-8. He rushed for 198 yards and just eight carries. That’s a 24.7-yard average."
kmf | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 2:30 pm | #

Our safeties are getting all the tackles because the linebackers are out of position to stop the run. As we are constantly blitzing our backers, the only people left to make a play at the second level are the safeties. The continual ineffectiveness of our blitz is becoming hard to swallow. Yes, we're disrupting some throws, but with the number of blitzes we run I would like to see more of them result in something positive for our D. Too often it just looks like the blitzers run straight into the waiting blocker.
Erik '04 | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 2:33 pm | #

If someone had said last Saturday morning "your defense will give up no more than 19 points" we'd all know we were in for an Irish win.

Our offense stopped scoring for us at the half, and consistently gave UNC points/great field position after that. Look at the final numbers -- our "horrible" defense did a much better job did than Carolina's.

Our offense, indisputably, lost this one; our offensive coaching was 'Butch-slapped,' coining a phrase.

Our 'O'coaching is a league or so behind Butch Davis. Michigan was down 19 to a Top-10 team, and came back to win. Before you mock them, UM is all frosh and sophs, too. We never come back to win, in fact, we blew a huge lead a few days ago.

Some Einstein mentioned canning Coach Brown and Coach Tenuta. Obviously a trolling USC or UM fan. We knew last year that our small line would put intense pressure on our LBs -- I'll take a 16/19 point D-performance, anyday, versus a Butch Davis team.

As for "two Top-20 teams" going at it -- what year are we talking about? We are a 35-45 team (solid at that level) -- UNC is 'close' to Top -25 (23-to-27).

Our QB helped us implode. He's doing a great job this year, but not so after the first half last Saturday. He also had no help from the sidelines. We'd lose to Wisconsin -today - if we trailed 19-0 at the half.

One last look at the defense. My God, how you guys are tearing up CW as much as you did Ty, for failing to recognize our upcoming needs and recruit for our DL.

You ARE tearing him a new one for that, aren't you?
FightingGrandmoms | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 2:34 pm | #

How do you apply the turnover theory to the 2002 Irish -- great defense for turnovers early in the season, then POOF. nothing.
RighSaidEd | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 2:37 pm | #

Looks like Ainello finished Tate for the year...

http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/foo...ov=ap& type=lgns

UNC should have missed him more on Saturday... don't understand why we make every qb look like a Heisman candidate???
jmc | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 3:04 pm | #

I seem to recall Brady Quinn throwing a bonehead interception in the rain at MSU a few years ago. The only difference was that we came back and won the game. The defense helped us out a bit in that game. Not that I don't think that Clausen threw a very bad pass, just that he is a sophomore and and will make a bad pass or two every now and then. I still like how he has improved this year.
Anonymous | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 3:06 pm | #

"We'd lose to Wisconsin -today - if we trailed 19-0 at the half."
____________________________________

What a stupid way to measure a coaching staff. Are the coaches not to blame for getting down 19 points to begin with?

And Michigan sure followed it up with some nice performances against Illinois and Toledo AT HOME.

Great coaching...
Bryan | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 3:18 pm | #

Canuck 75, no way we're a top-20 team. Just being honest. Go Irish! - Dozier
Dozier | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 3:19 pm | #

How can you blame four turnovers in the second half on the coach? Clausen moved the team from the 17 to the 11 in a little over a minute. We had 4 and 7 at the 29. We punted once the whole game.
Doug | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 3:40 pm | #

USC had 5 turnovers, 4 of them committed by Sanchez, yet still shut out their opponent. Why? The defense stepped up and made plays.

I would be interested in seeing a class comparison of our starting defense vs. our opponents' or others such as Florida. For a young defense, the Gators looked mighty impressive against LSU.
OC mj | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 3:41 pm | #

Anonymous - I was going to post the same thing about Quinn's interception against MSU. It looked (in my memory at least) very similar to Clausen's interception. It was a bad pass to be sure but I don't see it as "cause for concern" as Colorado Irish said. Even great QBs make bad plays every once in a while.
Steve R | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 3:50 pm | #

I don't see why everyone is so bummed. We got second place. Second place is a set of steak knives.
indy | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 3:59 pm | #

I seem to recall Brady Quinn throwing a bonehead interception at home against MSU in 2005. Very similar, right after the half, pick 6 for 20-30 yards, ND lost the game in OT. If Jimmy can be as good as BQ (which I hope) I won't complain at all....
Iowa Irish | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 4:01 pm | #

It's Clausen's own fault for being absolutely perfect in the previously two games. I for one expected, nay demanded an mistake-free remainder of the season from Jimbo. The kid's got a lot of nerve to come out and look almost human at times on Saturday.

I'm gonna let it slide. This time.
Joe Subway | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 4:32 pm | #

I think by the end of the year we will be a Top 25 team if not in the Top 25. It will just take some impressive wins.

Also there is alot of football to play left.

I mean I am not really worried about the UNC game anymore... Everyone knows we could have one but didnt.

We should have one....but thats something that happens to a young team. You cant complete the whole game.

I am sure we will be BEAST by the end of the year
Mexican Irish | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 5:07 pm | #

Also... You cant have a blitz happy Defense with out a Defensive line.

So the Blitz isnt working because of our D line. Its nobodys fault really. They will get better.
Mexican Irish | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 5:09 pm | #

Going to echo some of the previous comments...during last year's debacle, it was tough to see improvement in the team from week 2 to week 12. I'm not sure if the team that took the field against Stanford last year was any better than the team that took the field against Michigan that same year. This year, I think we're seeing improvements in the team from week to week. That alone provides some optimism for the future.
ND Alum | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 5:31 pm | #

you spell it "won"
Anonymous | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 5:47 pm | #

Mr. Wed., Doug,

I stand corrected on my rant about that ruling on the NC 3rd down catch. I'll say this, though: if that wasn't a catch, they need to change the rules, because you can't control the ball much more than he did.
Hal | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 5:52 pm | #

If your a Brady fan.
He is going to play tonight.
Mexican Irish | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 5:55 pm | #

can we go one thread without mentioning Willingham?

after ND beats them by four touchdowns next week, maybe we can put all that crap to bed.
Schultz | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 5:56 pm | #

I was probably a little hard on Clausen -- after all he's unquestionably been the bright spot in the 2008 season. It's just alarming to see such a blatantly bad decision. I certainly hope he learns from it.

Agreed that a major concern is our defense's inability to get key stops. I have a nickname for #40...unfortunately he's yet to give me a reason to stop using it. Mo Crummy.
ColoradoIrish | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 5:57 pm | #

ColoradoIrish, have you ever made a blatantly bad decision in 4 seconds or less? I can assure you it wont be his last. Check his year against Quinn every year until he graduates. I love Brady, but I think Clausen may be your all-time leader in every quarterbacking category. With the receivers he has I look for him to break Theismann's single game yardage record and every seasonal and career record.
Doug | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 6:09 pm | #

I thought you blitzed because the D line didn`t put pressure on the QB.If you have a great D line that gets to the QB you don`t have to blitz.
Irishjh2 | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 6:17 pm | #

The biggest disappointment is the last 37 seconds. ND hhad the ball on the 34 and never went short. Clausen stood and stood and ran out of bounds burning the clock.
I thought some quick short passes at that point would have put us in striking distance (the ten or five) with 10 seconds or so. No matter what, turnovers, etc, the last 40 seconds were the worst!
Dan | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 6:30 pm | #

Well we would've been at the five with 3-4 secs left if Floyd hadn't tried to lateral ... so I don't see how that closing drive was THAT bad.
John | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 6:53 pm | #

USC had 5 turnovers, 4 of them committed by Sanchez, yet still shut out their opponent. Why? The defense stepped up and made plays.

OC mj | Email | Homepage | 10.13
-----
-- OC mj, so did ours, holding a superbly coached team to a dozen or so points. Why'd we lose? What didn't we have? (hint: somewhere in the middle of my first sentence:)

JC will end up one of our best - his learning process cost us biglast weekend.

Bryan - bet I know who you're voting for this election. I see that your man uses the same 'context ethics' as you did in re-posting my reference to Wisconsin (19-0). Glad we'll be able to refer to you both with the same adjective in 3 weeks.

Go Irish
FightingGrandmoms | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 7:02 pm | #

"Well we would've been at the five with 3-4 secs left if Floyd hadn't tried to lateral ... so I don't see how that closing drive was THAT bad."
i don`t see it that way.It was THAT bad..
Great blog,keep up the good work!!

Mark Santo
sawspike | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 7:41 pm | #

I still can't believe the non-review on the 3rd an 18. There was quite a while (over 30 seconds) between that play and the next. If not the replay booth, who on Weis' staff dropped the ball with the "Tell Coach to Challenge"? I thought it was a clear catch and fumble; it certainly deserved a slow-motion look from the refs.

But them's the breaks...
Matt '09 | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 7:45 pm | #

Hal, my personal feeling was that going to ground wasn't part of making that catch. I think the two feet down should have been enough to decide that it was a catch. But the officials disagree with me, the ACC disagrees with me (reaffirmed that the right call was made), and apparently, similar calls in another college game on Saturday and a pro game on Sunday suggest that it really was called correctly.

Doug, note that there is no "football move" language in the rules. There never has been in college, and they took it out either this year or last in the NFL (replacing it there with possession for "a discernable period of time" or something along those lines).
Mr. Wednesday | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 8:04 pm | #

I have a question:

Why, after 4 years of CW's reign, we have a field goal kicker that misses 75% of the time; a kicker that can't kick the ball beyond the 10 yard line; a defensive line that gets man-handled on a regular basis; an offensive line that is, well, suspect. In every class, CW bypasses a couple of scholarhips that could have been used to store-up the d/l or o/l (although that means that the coaching staff would have to develope talent) and gives a couple of scholarships to walkons. Now, don't get me wrong. I love to see walk-ons get scholarships. After all, that is what I love about ND. But, the team we end up with is a bunch of freshman, sophomores and walk-ons playing. It's inspiring, but it won't produce a NC for us.
Anonymous | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 8:56 pm | #

On the point of the Clausen turnover to start the second half - anyone catch Charlie's on field interview at the end of the first half?

From memory the question was - what needs to occur coming out in the second half?

From memory response was - last game we came out in the second half and went three and out. We have to do better than that.

One can bet that Charlie / Jimmy's Monday meeting may emphasize that three and out progressing to turnover is NOT going in the right direction...

I think there is little doubt he will learn from this experience.

Overall Jimmy's performance is continually improving and the offense while still making mistakes is clearly showing progress

Go Irish!
jk'72 | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 9:03 pm | #

4 - 2 record after six games? I'll take it after last season. A few other thoughts:

- There were two passes in the first quarter that should have been picked off by UNC, so the pass at the start of the second half should not have been that shocking. It sure hurt, though.

- I was disappointed in ND's coverage teams. Weis said in his press conference that Bruton was nicked up, such that the coaches kept him off of the special teams. He and Anello have been a solid complement to each other.

- How many D-linemen have been lost in the Weis era? There were at least two big-name recruits. It seems like there have been a couple dismissed from the team, too. Overall, the Irish have better depth on the roster than sometime in the Davie era, but the lines still have to get much better.
Louie | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 10:48 pm | #

It's interesting to see the wide variety of opinions posted, and I have some of my own.

No way should Jimmy be banged on. He is a good quarterback-on his way to being great. I think he is a lot closer to being Brady as a senior than to being his freshman self. (He'll be better than Brady by midway next year btw.) He had some bad tosses, but it is something that can be learned from. Also, when you put the ball in a qbs hands to that extent, bad throws will happen (see Chase Daniel vs Oklahoma State).

The coaching staff getting blamed to the extent that some of you are is off base as well. Their job is to put players in position to make plays-that is it. Then, it is up to the players. Charlie and his staff do this (with the possible exception of the extremely soft coverage Sat) for the most part. Also, you have to be blind to not see that they are improving each week. Some units aren't progressing as fast, but Charlie keeps bringing guys in. There are plenty of other coaches that haven't had guys develop as well as they should (Pete Carroll has had some extremely over rated defenses, as well as Bob Stoops. Jim Tressel is a great coach, but his team isn't progressing either.)

Also, someone said that Charlie ignored defensive line needs in early recruiting classes. He didn't. He went after guys like Ben Martin and Martez Wilson. He didn't sign them, but don't slap him by insinuating that he failed to recognize a need.
www.southbendblarney.com | Email | Homepage | 10.13.08 - 10:53 pm | #

southbendblarney

Pete Carroll has had some extremely over rated defenses.

I would take almost any of Carroll's defenses over any of CW's defenses, especially this year's Trojan D.
GB | Email | Homepage | 10.14.08 - 6:07 am | #

I'm already anxious about the Pitt game. I know the next game is Washington and they shouldn't overlook them, but I seriously doubt Washington will be in any position to win without Locker. I hope we can have at least one quality win this year.
bs0ng | Email | Homepage | 10.14.08 - 7:36 am | #

I was sitting in the end zone and watched Anello come down on a kick, coming right at me. Two guys were blocking him and he was knocked virtually out of bounds and yet he cam back in and nailed Tate and Tate was out of the game....great play.
jbarthel | Email | Homepage | 10.14.08 - 8:24 am | #

Jbarthel-we must have been sitting right next to each other. I was amazed at that play as well. I was watching Anello come down with two guys on him and they pushed him out of bounds. I then looked over and watched Tate catch it and get hit. I couldnt believe the first guy to the ball was Anello. If the other guys had one-tenth of the heart of Anello, they'd of made All-American by now.

You're Welcome.
Adam B. | Email | Homepage | 10.14.08 - 8:38 am | #

Guys,

I am appalled at the criticism being hurled around here. Did everyone (or the majority anyway) forget that we were 3-9 last year? You don't go from being 3-9 to the BCS. It just doesn't happen. Personally, I would rather have this team appear in a winnable bowl game and win that game so that bowl game success becomes what is expected by the members of this team.

I agree that the defense isn't looking spectacular, other than the play of Bruton and McCarthy. But to call for Corwin and Tenuta to be canned is absurd. Also, calling out Weis for not recruiting D-linemen is also an egregious display of ignorance. Last year, since it seems that everyone forgets (even though when I mention it everyone will act like they know), Weis signed Cwynar, Lewis-Moore, Johnson, Newman, Hafis Williams, and the tweener Fleming, who has great pass rush skills we saw against Stanford. Now, all of these players are FRESHMAN. The defensive line is one of the toughest positions to learn at the collegiate level. They need time both physically and schematically before they can actually step up and become big time college players.

Now, once these players are ready to make steady contributions on the field and give the opposing offensive lines plenty to deal, then the gaps will open up for the blitz schemes to wreak the havoc we saw out of Georgia Tech.

I am disappointed in the great majority of the posters on this board. While we should have won this game, it is a game from which much can be learned, and this is the season to learn lessons the hard way, rather than in the next year or two when I feel that this team will start to distinguish themselves in their traditional place as one of college football's elite.

P.S. On a side note, just to see what everyone thinks... I know that everyone keeps saying that Neal is too short for OLB and too small (weight) for DE. What does everyone think of moving him to MLB? He has the ideal LB size (6'2", 245), adequate speed, and should theoretically be much more adept at shedding blocks than the typical LB with his experience along the line.
unbelievable | Email | Homepage | 10.14.08 - 9:16 am | #

I have not heard anyone comment regarding this, but if I am duplicating an earlier comment, I apologize in advance. I thought that one critical play occurred early in the fourth quarter on the play where Jimmy Clausen threw an attempted fade to golden Tate. UNC's defensive back jumped tooo early, but when he did, Golden unfortunately stopped and jumped also. Given where the ball landed, I believe it would have been a TD if Golden had kept running. He's still somewhat raw as a receiver and yet thrilling to watch -- it can only get better!
seymour 85 | Email | Homepage | 10.14.08 - 10:12 am | #

Someone needs to post a Mike Anello highlight reel on YouTube.
Mike81 | Email | Homepage | 10.14.08 - 10:24 am | #

seymour-- If the corner didn't jump early that ball would have been picked. I think Golden saw the same thing, stopped his pattern to play defence and then unfortunately saw the ball fly by him. One of those damned if you do damned if you don't sort of plays. (just what I thought I saw)
VicPaul | Email | Homepage | 10.14.08 - 11:30 am | #

I thought this game showed good progression. We certainly made some dumb mistakes (FIVE turnovers!!!), but we're also becoming more and more fun to watch -- that last drive was a thriller (no way we could have done that last year).

Unlike the Mich State game, this one we should have won on the road. Facing a tough, athletic D-line, Clausen almost throws for 400 yards.

Things are pointing up. This is going to be a really good team. Let's show some patience people.
clear and present danger | Email | Homepage | 10.14.08 - 11:34 am | #

Can anybody tell me exactly what the HELL a "tarheel" is, anyway?
gwzimm | Email | Homepage | 10.14.08 - 12:16 pm | #

Good point vicpaul
Majnun | Email | Homepage | 10.14.08 - 12:27 pm | #

GB-
"I would take almost any of Carroll's defenses over any of CW's defenses, especially this year's Trojan D."

Well, defense is Pete's specialty, and they have been good (still over-hyped though) since he's been there.

Charlie is an offensive guy and (I'm willing to give 2007 a mulligan, due to mistakes Charlie has made as far a being a first time head coach, and acclimating to college from pros) largely has had a huge impact on that side of the ball. The defense is behind, I think Weis made the right call by hiring Brown and Tenuta-coaches who I would think kids want to play for. (Oh, Carroll's offenses have not been so spectacular since Norm Chow left either.)
www.southbendblarney.com | Email | Homepage | 10.14.08 - 12:31 pm | #

The exact etymology of 'tarheel' is unclear, but it's thought to have its roots in the fact that Carolina has vast pine forests, and so the inhabitants of the area would inevitably have tar from the forest floor stick to their heels.

In the American Civil War, North Carolina troops earned the reputation of valiantly sticking to their ranks under fire "as though they had tar on their heels sticking them in place".

So, like the term "fighting Irish" the term seems to have been at one time kind of a pejorative which developed into a term of admiration owing to bravery displayed during the war between the states.
Joe Subway | Email | Homepage | 10.14.08 - 1:04 pm | #

Unlike last year, at no point in this game did I feel ND would not or could not come back. I even felt good toward the end when we got the ball back with 1:30 or so to go.....and we came close.
jbarthel | Email | Homepage | 10.14.08 - 1:55 pm | #

Since I was in an area where BOTH ABC and ESPN decided to show the stupid Ohio State game, I missed much of the 1st quarter including the TD drive. Is NBC.com going to have the quarter-by-quarter replays, or is that just for home games that were shown on NBC? Any idea where I can catch a replay of the 1st quarter?
Erik '04 | Email | Homepage | 10.14.08 - 1:57 pm | #

Look at the expression on Clausen's face in the picture above as he realizes he's been stripped and an extra large Tarheel is about to eat the ball.

Looks like a great silent movie comedian's take on the situation.
Joe Subway | Email | Homepage | 10.14.08 - 2:03 pm | #

This is completely unrelated and a bit premature, but has anyone taken a gander at the 2009 schedule? Wow...

Not a single game on the schedule I don't consider winnable. In fact, I'd say ND will be favored in all but one (and they might even be favored in that one).
Josh | Email | Homepage | 10.14.08 - 2:16 pm | #

Wanted to supplement the notion that some folks are being somewhat overly critical of the D in this game. Only gave up 22 points. Not great, but not bad. Indeed, just as against MSU, they played well enough to allow the team to win. Problem was that the O didn't complement that, and indeed the pick 6 they gave up ended up being the deciding detriment to getting a first road win (and a first win against a ranked opponent in forever).

Looking forward to the BYE weekend (have a legal conference all day on SAT so would be jonesing if ND actually had a game), and looking forward to seeing what lessons will end up being learned from the two road games so far.
IndyEsq | Email | Homepage | 10.14.08 - 2:19 pm | #

In my next life, I'd like to be a sportswriter. That way, I can formulate opinions with little to no evidence to support them. Then, I can change those opinions on a whim with no repercussions.

Pat Forde, "scourge of humanity" (to take a page from his book), is now describing Ty Willingham's tenure in Washington as 'apocalyptic'.

Who else remembers Forde's weekly diatribe the last two years, accusing ND fans of being terrible, awful human beings for calling Ty a bad coach?

(I know, I shouldn't continue to subject myself to his articles yet I can't avoid them.)
kmf | Email | Homepage | 10.14.08 - 3:15 pm | #

What's all this "we don't have a kicker" stuff? The kid had made a very good kick in the first half and it was a perfect time to cement his newly-gained confidence by bringing us to within 2 with almost 12 minutes to go.
ND67Aquajock | Email | Homepage | 10.14.08 - 5:33 pm | #

KMF, to your point I have a literary question for you:

In the final canto of dante's inferno the devil's three heads are chewing on Judas, ______, and ______??

Give up? The correct answers are Mark May and Pat Forde.

Although I would've also accepted Ty Willingham and Omar Hunter
ColoradoIrish | Email | Homepage | 10.14.08 - 7:14 pm | #

Aquajock, that's a good point. I was less than thrilled with the third-down play that preceded the decision (it looked a lot like the 4th down play; a pass to a spot well behind the first down line).

As for Pat Forde, I'm proud to say that I sent him an indignant email two years ago and have not read a column since.
Louie | Email | Homepage | 10.14.08 - 8:54 pm | #

How is BYE doing with the spread?
FightingGrandmoms | Email | Homepage | 10.14.08 - 9:03 pm | #

AquaJock,

I hear you on the kicker thing. I'm happy he made that one, and I hope it leads to more of the same.

But it's pretty clear that the lousy recent history of the FG unit factored into the 4th and 7 decision. Weis said he was going for it regardless. But if he had a kicker who was, say, 10 for 12 on the year, do you think he makes the same decision? I don't.

I'm not slamming Walker in any way. I root for him like hell every week, and I feel pain for him and his family when he misses. He kicks the snot out of the ball and has very little tailing action on it. If he gets it together, he'll be a killer weapon.
Hal | Email | Homepage | 10.15.08 - 10:11 am | #

Hal,

I'me sure he was looking at history, but in this situation, with lots of time left, it would have been the perfect time to see if the first field goal was a fluke or if the kicker had regained his head, and, therefore, his rhythm. Now the kid has to wonder what he must do to be a part of the package, and his confidence is probably down again.

I think he needs a pick-me-up and I intend to contact him with support. i hope we can get a lot of folks to do the same before the next game. That may be a great time to get him some real-time "reps" without jeopardizing the result.
Anonymous | Email | Homepage | 10.15.08 - 12:01 pm | #

unbelievable, Weis's DL/LB recruiting in his first two full classes was inadequate. That's undeniable. It's better that it happened out of trying and failing rather than failing to try, but the end result is still failure.

The most recent class offers some hope that he's righted the ship in that area, but one class isn't enough; he's going to need to keep bringing in good players.
Mr. Wednesday | Email | Homepage | 10.15.08 - 3:51 pm | #

Colo Irish -- posts like yours are why I love Blue Gray Sky. I'm pretty sure you could read M Go Blog, Bucknuts, etc. from now until God invites you home without finding a Dante reference. Awesome!
Love Thee Notre Dame | Email | Homepage | 10.15.08 - 9:02 pm | #

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