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You're opening line is too nice to the defense. A "100%" ND defense (like those in the late 60's / 70's) would have been much more effective against the run. This program will flounder until it finds the athletes on the DL in particular. When the Irish are able to stop the run, and get a pass rush, everything else will likely improve. Until then, flounder-city. (I apologize for the non-rose-colored glasses, but many seem to be picking on the OL, when, it doesn't matter as much as the above - we need an Alan Page, some Browners, and, since it's their anniversary, remember the 1947 defense (I don't but they deserve mention ;-). Go Irish.
jerry | Email | Homepage | 09.23.07 - 7:06 pm | #

The offense is going to need to score more than 14 points against Purdue.

I'll say ...
John | Email | Homepage | 09.23.07 - 7:23 pm | #

Jerry, there are very few defenses like that today. The offenses are much more sophisticated and spread out.We are thin along the Dline too, but help is on the way.....remember those old days, OLines averaged about 245 pounds and a 270 pound DLineman was huge.Now you have some LB's that are that big. The more we talk, the more you can see that we have a depth problem on both lines and at linebacker. This should start clearing itself up, very soon.
Doug | Email | Homepage | 09.23.07 - 7:46 pm | #

tOSU is Righteous:

This board is for people who know waht they are taling about.
You do not. For example: Willingham was fired in December 2004. It is September of 2007. how is that a half of decade?? You do not know simple math yet alone anything about college football.
Lush | Email | Homepage | 09.23.07 - 8:14 pm | #

And Charlie has done nothing to help in the field position by putting the offense on the field first.

He--, why do they even bother to flip the coin. I'd always let ND take the opening kick.
yago | Email | Homepage | 09.23.07 - 8:16 pm | #

I just want to let everyone know we will finish 4-12 this season at best. We have a chance in every game because there's always a chance. We will be 6-6 , maybe 7-5 next year. I am optimistic, but these trends have been pretty regular with the Irish over the past decade or so. We had a decent O-Line in 2000 and played in a BCS bowl. Great O-Line in 2002 and ended up in the Gator Bowl against NCSU. I think if we had that 2002 line in '05 or '06 we win the BCS Championship one of those years. Great line in '02 with Faine, Jordan Black and others'. We had 4 lineman drafted from that '02 line.

Anyway, the line we have now will be seasoned veterans by 2009. Not by 2008. I wish they would be seasoned next year, but 2009 is a little more realistic. They will be ready 2 years from now.

So, be ready for a little heartache Irish fans. Clausen and the receivers will look abysmal over the course of the next couple of seasons. But, will look great by '09 and the recruiting of Weis will lend to a solid O-line for each year to come starting in '09.

We are 2 years away from the ND Dynasty that will dominate the from 2009 - 2020. Get ready for a little mediocrity followed by years of domination.

Go Irish 2009. Clausen graduates after a phenomenal junior season and Dayne Christ follows with another phenomenal season.

Patience
Chuck | Email | Homepage | 09.23.07 - 8:16 pm | #

Now Reuland is transferring. Weis has lost this team without unsheathing his sword!

He has lost this team.
Joaquin | Email | Homepage | 09.23.07 - 8:17 pm | #

It doesn't matter whether we take the opening kickoff or not. If we receive, the offense can't make it to the 25 without punting. If we kick, our kicker only gets it to the 10, then it's returned past the 30, if not to our side of the field. It's a wash either way when both your offense and special teams stink.
Matt | Email | Homepage | 09.23.07 - 8:21 pm | #

For some reason Reuland is not getting any PT, maybe he isnt developing as well as Yeatman and feels it best to go elsewhere with Ragone and Rudolph coming next year.
Doug | Email | Homepage | 09.23.07 - 8:21 pm | #

On the other hand, that opening drive of MSU (drive? 60% of it was kick return) really took the wind out of our sails. Imagine if we could have had the ball first in the 2nd half...
Matt | Email | Homepage | 09.23.07 - 8:25 pm | #

Where have you seen that Reuland is transfering and to where???

I know he hasn't gotten a lot of playing time or any throws his way, but I had no idea he would be transferring.

Even if he is, how can you say Coach Weis has "lost" this team?
Jason D | Email | Homepage | 09.23.07 - 8:36 pm | #

A.M.D.G.

I'm very surprised at how down many of the posters here have been on the team and Coach Weis. May I remind some of you that there are only three schools in the country that made BCS games following the 2005 and 2006 seasons and the Fighting Irish are one of them. Compare that to a grand total of one BCS appearance combined in the regimes of Mr. Davie and Mr. Willingham. They shattered numerous offensive records and proved a lot of pundits wrong in the process. ND was an overtime (Michigan State) and a play (Southern California) away from being in the national championship game against Texas two short seasons ago. I just want to stress patience with everyone.

USC was 6-6 in 1999, 5-7 in 2000 and 6-6 again in Coach Carroll's first season of '01 and ND had defeated them in three straight contests. The Trojans routed Iowa in the Orange Bowl the next season and claimed a co-national title in 2003 and the outright crown in '04. Their record from 2002 (one year after their paltry 6-6 effort) until now is 62-6 and they've never finished lower than fourth in the final Associated Press Poll in five seasons.

Notre Dame can and will have a similar pattern of success. SC had a lot of talented up and coming players (as do the Irish) and Carson Palmer finally remembered in '02 that he was the most talented quarterback in the nation and finally started playing like it.

Will we go 11-2 next year? Who knows? College football is such a volatile mix from year to year but we'll definitely be much stronger, better and more experienced. I believe we only have three scholarship players on offense in John Sullivan, John Carlson and Travis Thomas who will run out of eligibility at season's end. The Irish are the sleeping giant of college football. When we do awake from our slumber (in '08 or '09) we will be a tough out for any squad including those mighty Trojans who grew up from such humble beginnings...
Terence M. Stanton | Email | Homepage | 09.23.07 - 8:39 pm | #

Reuland was/is the 4th string tight end.
Pat | Email | Homepage | 09.23.07 - 8:40 pm | #

I am mad as hell and cannot take it any more. How can Weis be losing with all those 5-star players recruited by Ty?
Lush | Email | Homepage | 09.23.07 - 8:41 pm | #

Pat, is he transferring? Sometimes player come in with big reputations and dont make it...depends on the competition they are used to playing.If a young man doesnt want the competition he should transfer, best bet is go to a 1AA or II school where he might get to play.He wont have to sit out a year either.
Doug | Email | Homepage | 09.23.07 - 8:45 pm | #

"How can Weis be losing with all those 5-star players recruited by Ty?"

Lush - You are kidding, right?

Ty had exactly one 5-star recruit in 2003-2005. (I consider '05 to be Ty's class). Victor Abiamiri.

In the Davie/Willingham year of 2002 they had zero 5-stars.

How about 4-star or better recruits:
Ty in 2003-2005 = 13 total
CW in 2006-2008 = 40 total
Anonymous | Email | Homepage | 09.23.07 - 9:16 pm | #

Plenty of smoke Doug, but we would all be best served to hold off until something official comes out.
Pat | Email | Homepage | 09.23.07 - 9:19 pm | #

Annonymous--I not only was kidding but was also being sarcastic and critical towards those on the trash Charlie bandwagon! Your post is dead right on!!
Lush | Email | Homepage | 09.23.07 - 9:27 pm | #

tOSU:
Given that Iowa, Louisville, Appalachian State and Maryland lost this week, should there coaches be fired? Beamer gave up over 40 to LSU, should he be fired? You really have no clue what you are talking about.
Lush | Email | Homepage | 09.23.07 - 9:30 pm | #

Lush he is a Buckeye fan that should tell you everything you need to know. I know you won the NC in 2000whatever, on a phantom pass interference call. Notre Dame lost two national championships, one on a phantom clip, and the other because they didn't think Bobby Bowden could ever win one on his own, so ND got screwed again. No wonder we may be just a tad arrogant. Whadda ya think?
Jerry | Email | Homepage | 09.23.07 - 9:34 pm | #

Reuland leaving is no more noteworthy than Moody leaving SC.

Stocked at th position, with reinforcements on the way.

It has everyone on edge only because we can't do anything on the field. We don't like the way it "looks."

Truth is if we were undefeated, he would have no fewer reasons to transfer.
Okiedomer | Email | Homepage | 09.23.07 - 9:38 pm | #

by someone else. I can't take credit:

The specific complaint from Domer fans is that, during his last two recruiting classes combined (2003 and 2004), Ty Willingham brought in "only" eight 4-star prospects and one 5-star prospect; during that time, the Domers also signed twenty-one 3-star prospects and seven 2-star prospects (using Rivals rankings).

Well, during those same two years, the 54 non-BCS schools signed a combined sixteen 4-star prospects and one 5-star prospect. Yes, that's a total of one hundred and eight recruiting classes that yielded just seventeen prospects who graded out higher than 3-stars. But Notre Dame has talent issues because of Ty Willingham's two allegedly weak recruiting classes....

To go a bit further, the entire 13-team MAC signed a combined fifteen 3-star prospects and one 4-star prospect...

The entire 8-team Sun Belt Conference signed a combined twenty-one 3-star prospects and two 4-star prospects...

And the entire 9-team WAC signed a combined thirty-one 3-star and two 4-star players.

During 2003 and 2004, the following twelve teams did not sign a single recruit with a ranking of greater than 2-stars: Ball State, Buffalo, Eastern Michigan, Kent State, Ohio University, UTEP, Idaho, Louisiana-Monroe, Florida International, Western Kentucky, Army, and Navy. Another thirteen teams signed only one or two recruits with a ranking of greater than 2-stars. Those twenty-five teams signed a combined nineteen 3-star prospects and two 4-star prospects.

In addition, Cincinnati, currently in the Big East, signed only a pair of 3-star recruits during the time in question, and zero 4- or 5-star recruits. Yet the Bearcats were able to win their first three games of the season, including a 34-3 annihilation of Oregon State, a solid PAC-10 program (they beat Southern Cal year, remember? And Dame lost to Southern Cal by twenty points....).

And finally, Boise State, the team that went 13-0 last year including a win in a BCS bowl game (something that Notre Dame has never done, despite the more-or-less automatic bid), had a grand total of four 3-star recruits and forty-two 2-star recruits combined for the classes of 2003 and 2004. The current cream of the WAC, Hawaii, managed to work its way into the top 25 with only seven 3-star prospects and thirty-five 2-star prospects.

And yet Notre Dame is the worst team in college football in 2007 because of a lack of talent?

talent is NOT the issue. the issue is COACHING. ND players aren't getting any. you have a senior center who can't even snap the ball! is that Ty's fault too?

edit: i just thought that i'd add that Ohio State's secondary consists of one junior, two sophomores, and two redshirt freshmen. only one was a 4 star, two were three stars, the stud of the group, Malcom Jenkins, who will be a first rounder next year was a two star, and the starting nickel back was a two star.

good coaching = good players = good teams
Baby Jesus | Email | Homepage | 09.23.07 - 11:06 pm | #

Jerry:
How about 1989, too. We beat the No. 1 team but because we lost to Miami in that sh*thole, they gave the NC to the Hurricanes. OSU was so high & mighty last yeear and gets blow out with a star player getting injured celebrating -- LOL
Lush | Email | Homepage | 09.23.07 - 11:09 pm | #

Baby Jesus:
You are another one who has no clue what he is talking about. You sound like an OSU fan who loves the likes of Akron and Youngstown State, will go to Happy Valley and lose (again) in a white out and go up to Michigan and lose in a maize out. And all of this with a graduation rate among the lowest in college football. Are you Buckeye Proud??? LOL
Lush | Email | Homepage | 09.23.07 - 11:13 pm | #

Why make it an either/or? I think BOTH Willingham and Weis suck. Let's review the past six games again:

Loss to USC by 20 points.

Loss to LSU by 27 points.

Loss to GT by 30 points.

Loss to PSU by 21 points.

Loss to UM by 38 points.

Loss to MSU by 17 points.

You're telling me that this is the best we can do, crappy talent or not? Is Weis really a "genius" or just a guy in the right place at the right time? I don't see New England struggling without him.
John S. | Email | Homepage | 09.23.07 - 11:15 pm | #

John S.

Where were/are these teams ranked and are you saying that ND had or has the talent to beat all of them--it was/is just a matter of coaching?
Lush | Email | Homepage | 09.23.07 - 11:24 pm | #

Baby Jesus -

Holy crap - Thant's some nifty data work. Kudos.

And I would feel pretty good about ND's chances against those non-BCS teams. Bring on the Zips. Bring on the Hilltoppers. Army & Navy will be good ballgames this year.

If they played those teams they would not have the worst year to date results. Instead they would merely suck, albeit with a 2-2 or 3-1 record.
Anonymous | Email | Homepage | 09.23.07 - 11:34 pm | #

John S.,

The day Weis sealed up his first recruiting class (which was essentially 30% his,70% Ty's), I sent this email to my brother: "We are going to have an absolutely BRUTAL year in 2007."

I'm not very smart. It was just so obvious, even then, that we were screwed for this year.

Since you're so eager to beat the drum against Weis, answer me this: Can you name a realistic coaching prospect for ND who would have a better record than Weis after three years with these players?

We've got some problems to fix--no doubt. And they're likely going to take a full season to work out. But I think it's a little soon to be hitting the panic button.
Hal | Email | Homepage | 09.23.07 - 11:38 pm | #

weis winning with willingham's players in 05-06, coaching genius. weis losing with willingham's players in 07, willingham's fault. i don't get the logic.
Anonymous | Email | Homepage | 09.23.07 - 11:56 pm | #

weis winning with willingham's players in 05-06, coaching genius. weis losing with willingham's players in 07, willingham's fault. i don't get the logic

1) Willingham couldn't win with his own players.

2) Willingham's one good recruiting class graduated last year. This year's seniors and juniors, were, in the estimation of most recruiting experts, the worst recruiting classes for ND in the last 40 years. Plus, they were small classes. When your rivals are recruiting classes of 20-25, and you only recruit 14, you're at a disadvantage from the outset.

3) Look at the stories about who is actually doing well for ND this year. Most of them are freshmen and sophomores. Part of Weis's first two recruiting classes, which were top 10. The one he's working on now is currently Number 1, and will probably end up as a top 5 if they all stick to their committments.
DJ | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 12:49 am | #

To further illustrate the point, here are the players whom Willingham recruited in 2004-2005 that are still on the team:

Schwapp
Grimes
Scott Smith
K. Washington
Sharpley
Lambert
Ferrine
Jabbie
Bragg
Justin Brown
Crum
Vernaglia

That's the entire list. Would any one of these guys start for a Top 25 team?
DJ | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 12:52 am | #

We are terrible on so many levels. Part of it is due to Willy, but most of it Weis. Believe me, when we go 0-8, and we will, talent won't be the issue against teams like Navy and Stanford who give us a run for our money.

If OL was such a problem when Weis came on board in 05, then recruit 10 bodies for all I care b/c the position is that important. Bottom line is Weis FAILED to recruit a quality DL until CB arrived. So he has more than his share of flaws too, and right now, we are watching an inexperienced head coach grow up.

Stop complaining, making excuses and just go, hit someone and get better!
Matt | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 1:15 am | #

Anybody going to broadcast the Purdue game?
Judge60 | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 1:23 am | #

Baby Jesus

talent is NOT the issue. the issue is COACHING. ND players aren't getting any. you have a senior center who can't even snap the ball! is that Ty's fault too?

We're putting grandma in a "senior center" Maybe they have a coach there to teach her fundamentals so she can get a position on the O line. :-))
GB | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 2:08 am | #

All I want to know, seriously, is how everyone here is writing this off completely when NDs current classes were ranked 40, 38, 8, and 8 from senior to freshmen. How do you end up ranked DEAD LAST in offense and wherever the hell you are on defense with those classes? That is pathetic. I don't have any innate hatred for Notre Dame, but blaming this on recruiting alone is absurd. Have you ever seen a big time program field a team as pathetic as this one?
Scott | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 2:57 am | #

Judge60 -
ESPN will broadcast.
12:00 ET
What a novel time to play a fall football game.
Subway Alumni | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 6:31 am | #

Lots of blame to go around. As the season progresses, it's becoming less Willingham and more Weis.

I don't care about talent lavels; at some point you have to question the lack of fundamentals.

There can be no more Willingham excuses next year. None.
gwzimm | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 7:49 am | #

DJ,
Thank you for posting that list. That should end the debate right there. You know, most freshman and sophomore O linemen typically don't even have the strength to be a starter, much less the knowledge and skill level.
Shadow Hawkins | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 8:40 am | #

You know, most freshman and sophomore O linemen typically don't even have the strength to be a starter, much less the knowledge and skill level.

True, but Sam Young started as a freshman, and played respectably. He has noticeably regressed. This is troubling (and for those keeping score, no one blames Willingham for this).
DJ | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 8:48 am | #

Listen up the few of you who somehow can't fathom how bad Willingham's recruiting classes were!

That class was ranked 40 BEFORE over half the class quit the team.

Class is dismissed.
walterthump | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 8:55 am | #

DJ that's because he was the pup on the line, while the rest were Seniors who had much experience. A poster at NDN whose friends with Bob Morton said Morton said he had to tell Sam Young what to do on every play.
walterthump | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 8:57 am | #

Charlie Weis on a Hungerstrike?

OMG hilarious:

http://www.thearch-info.com/ Spor...ger_Strike.html
Jeff Peters | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 9:07 am | #

Notre Dame managed to score first in two of their four games this year. Granted, both resulted from miscues by the opposing offense, and Notre Dame went on to lose both games.

I just wanted to put one positive thing out there.
Joe Subway | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 9:11 am | #

Just a thought - Get Charlie, Jr. off the sideline and get rid of the Super Bowl ring.
NDMA90 | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 10:10 am | #

David Bruton is a much better safety than Z. Did you see how he came over the top for the interception? Walls is going to be great. Get Lambert out and replace with McNeil. Sharply looks better than Clausen on passing plays. Clausen looks confused. Sharply should have been the starter from day one.
ndfan | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 10:37 am | #

I really think some hacks are mad that Weis didn’t travel back in time and change the OLine situation. I am certain fact that Willingham failed at recruiting or that every other D1 coach would be ofer at ND this season has zilch to do with Weis today. People would still go after Weis’s coaching abilities even if he were limited to Pop Warner talent with an imaginary OLine. I wish some people would find something else to comment about on Saturdays.
rem | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 10:39 am | #

Replace varnaglia with Neal. Smith should be a starter. They both have great pass rush ability (see saturday)
Grimes is the best receiver. west has not done anything, replace with kamara. Get Tate on the field. Play the freshman and sophomores
ndfan | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 10:45 am | #

Again Lambert was beat by the MSU receiver. Great safety play prevented a score. If that had been Z he would coming running into the picture after the MSU player was celebrating
ndfan | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 10:47 am | #

Sharpley is worthless. He only looks "decent" because he was thrown in when MSU was holding back the dogs. Ill take my chances with Clausen. He performs well with what he has, and the only way he will learn is from being hit and looking confused. Clausen is the man for now, and the man for the future.

Go Irish
bmg | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 11:00 am | #

I have to agree with you about getting Golden Tate on the field. Hes got tremendous speed, amazing hands, and he is going to break one of those kickoff returns for a TD sooner or later. He needs to get some gametime reps in with Clausen. I see a new Quinn to Stovall, Manning to Harrison in Clausen to Tate.

Go Irish
bmg | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 11:02 am | #

baby jesus--I've been a Boise State fan for quite some time know (being from Boise and all). The problem with your argument: Boise State has beaten ZERO BCS teams on the road. Ever. I'm pretty sure that the victory over Oklahoma is their only victory over a ranked opponent.

Notre Dame goes 10-3 beating the Tennessees, Michigans, UCLA's of the world.

Boise State beats Idaho and Wyoming. Its a hell of a way for them to gain confidence

Now, I think BSU's team from last year might beat this year's ND team. Not sure about this year's (saw them get dominated by UW, especially on the line).

Yes, Charlie has made some pretty major mistakes coaching this year, but more in the order of unfamiliar circumstances (working with 19 yo's as your best players) vs. fundamental mediocrity.

I think the issue is less how good the players are left from Ty, even though they are pretty awful, and more how FEW of them there are. When you have 19 yo's do EVERYTHING for your team, with no one who's been there before to really lead them, exccessive mistakes are going to happen. Especially when you play however many top 25 teams we're facing.
yak | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 11:08 am | #

There is nothing that is going to stop the bloodletting this season, guys. There's no shame in it, everyone knew this would be a tough (bad) year. At least we have a young team.

(I do feel bad for the seniors though)
DayBreakBoys | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 11:08 am | #

I really think Weis is valuing the intelligence of the players over the fundamentals of football. Football players are usually dumb for a reason: they don't need to be intelligent to play football well.

What is the one of the most essential elements of football? PHYSICALITY. There are very few players on the team, IMHO that have shown the pure determination to hit someone. Laws, Aldrige, Hughes, Kuntz, and occasionally Zibby are all that come to mind. The new Frosh linebackers looked good too for a bit Saturday. But when it comes to the OL, they're up there playing patty cake.

How many ND players have been hurt during camp? I'm struggling to think of any. I want to see broke bones, torn ACLs, concussions, etc during the offseason. Get them used to being physical, and they'll play that way during the game. Look at the difference between last week and this week. I thought the physicality was definitely improved. Not great, but improved.

As for the regression of Sam Young, did he focus on beating the crap out of people during the offseason? No. He worked on his footwork. He "fine tuned" his game. The only fine tuning he needs is a lesson in brutality.

Another example of intelligence vs basic fundamentals was the Minter defense. You have to think about 10 things before you can move on defense. Did it work? No.

How can some of the dumbest people in the world end up being great college football coaches? They leave the creativity up to art majors and teach the kids how to hit.

I'm not saying that there isn't a place for creativity and intelligence on the football field. But it should only be practiced when the fundamentals are ironed out.

I want to be scared of everyone that plays for ND. I want to be in awe 30 times per game at a bonecrushing hit put on by anybody.

Charlie is learning. I think he finally learned this last week. Up to this year, he didn't have to teach much hitting experience to the players. Ty (unfortunately?) taught this to them. Charlie never really had to teach players in the NFL how to hit. But he will adapt, and I think in the end (is there an end in sight?) will make him a better coach.

Any thoughts?
Keenan | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 11:09 am | #

know being now, that is.
yak | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 11:09 am | #

Zibby, Zibby, zibby. David Bruton is the best safety on the team, and he hits.
ndfan | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 11:24 am | #

I am one of the optimistic ones. That being said, I think Clausen needs to show more. To the more technically informed- Why do we not throw the 10 yard out that takes 2-3 secs? Why can the receivers not find those soft spots that seem to be there in every other game I watch on TV?
Does anyone else think Zibby is underutilized? He is actually in on very few tackles. Maybe he should be a ballhawk or blitz on every play.
Good news was that the best players on the field were freshmen plus Aldridge. This week we'll see the pass defence tested. I think they will measure up.
canuck 75 | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 11:27 am | #

I think Charle knows he blew it in training camp. He focused on fine tuning without realizing that many of these young guys didn't even know the basics. Ty left a bare cupboard and Charlie made it worse. I think he learned his lesson. Nobody expected (realisticly) BCS bowl this year anyway. Lets take our lumps and move on. If we stink again next year, then let the calls to fire Weis begin. We hired a first time head coach that learned a pretty tough lesson that college kids are not pros.
Bill | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 11:27 am | #

Charlie did misjudge the magnitude of his team's situation entering this season but he did know that he would have a problem bringing these younger kids up to speed on time. While Charlie was telling the press last winter that a 9th and 10th senior were petitioning to return for a 5th year, the fact of the matter was that, behind the scenes, Charlie was practically humping Chase Anistasio, Casey Cullen, Nick Borsetti and, I think, Ashley McConnel to return for another year. At the time, I questioned why Charlie would press so hard to return players who, though solid special teams players, were really on the periphery of the 2005-2006 teams. Now I know the answer.
Don E. Brook | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 11:34 am | #

None of us will really know if CW truly misjudged the situation coming into the year. What is he going to do - tell the world, and his players, that they suck and don't have a chance in hell against this schedule with this many holes in the roster and so little depth that live scrimmages could mean you are down to a walk-on starting on the OL? Many of us who thought this team could overcome those issues were the ones who misjudged, no doubt about it. There are clearly issues beyong the talent, ST coaching for example, that will have to be fixed. But I have faith that CW will make those changes. Firing Minter showed us that CW has the requisite balls. I think we are probably looking at 5-7 this year, but a very, very bright future still. This recruting class is key. If they can get an additional OL or two and keep the guys they have, you will be looking at a contender in 2009-2010. Everyone should have known that eventually we would have to pay for the sins of the fathers (preceding regime). This is it. Mea culpa, mea maxima culpa.
Thundershaker | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 11:55 am | #

I have been reading numerous posts, articles, etc. on why ND is terrible this year. One consistant response has been the lack of recruiting by Ty.

This certainly is accurate as numbers do not lie.

One question may I ask, where was Kevin White when Ty was not recruiting players? We certanly knew Malloy did not care, if not encourage poor recruiting.

Has anyone asked this question to Whie, and if so did he he respond in understandable English?
Peter | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 12:38 pm | #

In other news, I'm disappointed that our two offensive touchdowns haven't been converted to videos and linked on the BGS Video Wiki thing.
Doug | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 1:03 pm | #

5-7?!

5-7?!

What FIVE teams will Notre Dame beat in its remaining EIGHT games?

What TWO teams will Notre Dame beat in its remaining EIGHT games.

5-7 ... that's funny ...
Pipe Dream | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 1:07 pm | #

Keenan's got it spot on. And we can all take a lesson. Toughen up out there Nation. Thicken up your skin. Stare straight ahead. Watch for signs of improvement. Think happy thoughts.
Fitzwater | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 1:34 pm | #

At this point ND Football is like a dilapidated house due to the previous owners' neglect. You don't refurbish a property like that overnight.

Quick fixes (JUCO transfers, easier schedules, etc) are not an option here, so I'm more than willing to take my lumps this year (and next year, if needed) if it means that we're building a solid foundation for future seasons.

Fans need take a deep breath and relax so that Charlie can make his adjustments without the sniping. There are differences in the college game which he is learning and will be applied going forward.

In my opinion, the biggest thing that is needed is a better off-season strength & conditioning program. I'd love to see ND's NFL alums show up at the Gug in the summer to lift with the players.
Irish_Angst | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 2:52 pm | #

I'd love to see ND's NFL alums show up at the Gug in the summer to lift with the players.

That would be nice, but I think NFL teams prefer their players to lift at the team's facility so that they can supervise their lifting.
DJ | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 3:07 pm | #

Keenan, I agree- your post was exactly right.

Where the f*ck is the nastiness Weis talked about when he arrived? I have seen no evidence of it, and it has NOTHING to do with talent.

Hopefully,Weis learned the lesson that in the NFL it's

1. Scheme
2. Execution
3. Fundamentals (which are a given)

and that college it's

1. Fundamentals
2. Execution
3. Scheme

If you don't have 1. (which unlike NFL players, college kids DON'T have), Execution and Scheme become meaningless.

I'm tired of blaming the former coach (I don't want to even say his name anymore). 5 first quarter turnovers against UM was INEXCUSABLE and that falls squarely on CW's shoulders. He knows it too.

I'm still with him and will always bleed Blue & Gold. But there MUST be improvement this year. Also, Irish_Angst, I completely disagree with you- there is ABSOLUTELY NO REASON we should be taking lumps next year. CW will have 3 full classes on the '08 Irish and with the schedule we have, nothing less than 10 wins will be acceptable.
Anonymous | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 3:28 pm | #

Wow, it turned ugly in here over the last 2 days.

It's like the gameday comments section [to which I'm guilty of contributing]
jaisn | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 3:36 pm | #

I didn't realize that part of his buy-out required Ty to teach fundamentals and technique.

You know that CW has got to be pissed; when his own coaching staff is finally in place, guaranteed we won't see the pathetic errors of this year!

And that damn Ty "guaranteeing" we wouldn't lose to MSU again. At least CW always lives up to his word.

Go Irish

Oh, and Keenan: football players are dumb? Every one that I knew, at Notre Dame, ended up a doctor or lawyer, if they didn't continue (or, after they were through) playing on Sundays.
Bill H. | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 3:39 pm | #

Good God, the wackos and schaudenfreude types are certainly out in force. Y'all be sure to come back in a couple of years to spew this crap when we've completed the turnaround.
IdSoonerBeIrish | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 4:01 pm | #

Chuck,

RE: "I just want to let everyone know we will finish 4-12 this season at best. "

I know this is a teardown season, and will seemingly go on forever, but 16 games? The way they are playing, 12 losses is a possibility.

Go, Irish! Keep the Navy streak!
Anonymous | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 4:38 pm | #

8-4
fred | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 4:53 pm | #

p.s. schadenfreude
fred | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 4:55 pm | #

Sam Young looked better last year... why?

perhaps cuz last year they let him just hit people and now he's rebuilding his technique? maybe...

OR!

last year charlie made sure he gave assignments where young was part of a double team 70% of the time or more. either with a guard or a TE.

if memory serves me correctly, specifically Stevenson and Carlson. decent mentors and aids, no?

this year its "ok young...time to be a big boy and handle someone all on your own."

of course he's gonna look bad for a while.
John in Ky | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 4:56 pm | #

Regarding 4-12

We're going to go 4-8, and then we're going to be invited to all 4 BCS bowl games.

It's going to be brutal, but it will build another library....
Gallaher | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 5:03 pm | #

Si.com has posted that konrad reuland has decided to transfer.
another transfer | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 6:12 pm | #

Reuland's transfer is disheartening given what else is going on but:

Carlson; still here
Yeatman; sophomore
Ragone; freshman

no harm done.
rustydevil | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 6:20 pm | #

Can I get a comment on this please???
Somebody out there. get off Zibbys jock.

David Bruton is a much better safety than Z. Did you see how he came over the top for the interception? Walls is going to be great. Get Lambert out and replace with McNeil. Sharply looks better than Clausen on passing plays. Clausen looks confused. Sharply should have been the starter from day one.
ndfan | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 6:32 pm | #

Brains and brutality need not be exclusive. Stupid football players aren't better because they are more violent. Stupid football players are a liability.
I understand what Keenan is saying, and I agree 100% with the sentiment that ND's players need to become way more physically tough in a hurry. Their intelligence is not keeping them from becoming nasty. It seems like they are not being coached nasty. Bull in the ring, and Oklahoma drills, goal line, drive blocking on the boards, or under the chutes. Death Row. These are drills that prepare your ass for contact.
My experience with football for 30 years has been that the first thing a college player needs to learn is HOW TO TAKE AN ASS KICKING. Then after the player is sufficiently brutalized, yet intact, you teach them how to ADMINISTER AN ASS KICKING. This usually takes an entire freshman season, and then sometime around the fifth or sixth contact practice of Spring ball, the kid suddenly "gets it". If CW hasn't been allowing for thoroughly brutal practices, then it is my opinion that even Juniors and Sophs could be somewhat stunted in their toughness I.Q. or development. If that is the case, the culture surrounding the program needs to change yesterday, and an Old School approach implemented immediately. You can't practice everyday in shells. Full pads is imperative and cracking heads must be as second nature as tying one's cleats. Hitting is an acquired taste and art. We aren't born wanting to hit somebody, but with instruction it becomes something that is really quite enjoyable, in its own primitive way. Hitting must be practiced to be perfected, and a football player's psyche cannot properly develop until the player has first learned how to take a whipping, and then how to give one.
Voice in the Wilderness | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 7:07 pm | #

Trivia time:

1. JoePa has been PSU's head coach for 42 years? How many NCs has he won being undefeated? One.

2. Since 1940, how many NCs has Michigan won outright? None.

3. In the last 45 years, how many NCs has LSU won? One. How many has Ohio State won? Two, one with a felon. How many has Michigan State won? None. How many has Texas won? Two. How many has Tennessee won? One.

How many ND fans would be happy with those results?
Lush | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 8:02 pm | #

Lush, ND holds themselves to a higher standard.
champ | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 8:44 pm | #

So what's the story with the Reuland transfer? Since he played in several games last year and I presume 4 games this year, does that mean he will have two years of eligibility available to him? Any idea as to where he might transfer?
Knoxville Irish | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 8:51 pm | #

Exactly what higher standards are you guys referring to? You guys need a chill pill. Yes, you're getting hammered every week but the bottom line iks that in the next three years you'll be in the BCS yearly with the solid classes coming through and everything will be rosy again in South Bend!! Just try not to act so holier than thou. You've won a title once in like thirty something years just like everyone else in the Midwest.
Byron | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 9:00 pm | #

Byron:
If you are going to criticze, do it with FACTS. ND's last NC was 19 years ago. Where did you learn Math? At Ohio State? This holier than thou crap is getting old. It's people like you who bash ND for everything under the sun but when ND publishes its graduation rates, refuses to admit a Maurice Clarett or refues to capitulate to Urban Meyer's demands for a "look the other way" admissions policy, you call it holier than thou. Get real!!
Lush | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 9:12 pm | #

I hate to see Reuland go. I was pretty excited when we got him.
Shadow Hawkins | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 10:21 pm | #

Then again, I also predicted that Zach Frazer would lead us to our first NC in two decades. Go figure.
Shadow Hawkins | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 10:22 pm | #

Voice; Recall Stan Smagalia(sp) a Faust recruit, who Sweet Lou Holtz wasn't particulary endeared with saying:
Paraphrasing; When did you know you could play. "First play as a Freshman when I kicked a 5 star receivers ass."
jim masterson | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 10:53 pm | #

So to the boyz of bgs;
Jrs. 14
Sophs. 25(?)
Frosh. 18

Total. 57 Scholarship players.
Transfer from NU. 1
5th yr. Lambert, Crum, Vernaglia. Who else. 3

Grand Total= 61
Room for 24 to reach a full 85.
jim masterson | Email | Homepage | 09.24.07 - 10:57 pm | #

GOALS FOR THE REMAINDER OF THE SEASON:

1. charlie needs to learn how to coach on the college level this year

2. let the players gain experience

3. use goals one and two with new recruiting class

4. now that there is a handful of Ty's guys remaining, Charlie can play guys HE recruited and knows what they can do

5. play better this crappy year
gdomer | Email | Homepage | 09.25.07 - 2:32 am | #

6. have a seance to wake the echos disturbed from this year, since they have obviously passed out drunk trying to drink away the pain of a winless season
gdomer | Email | Homepage | 09.25.07 - 2:36 am | #

ndfan. It is what it is. I've been saying since the end of last season that Bruton was the sleeper of this team. He tore up the special teams last year in tackles. I expected him to be the special teams captain this year only to learn that Charlie did away with the special teams captain.

I don't agree about Clausen. He will be fine. Remember Quinn his first season?
Don E. Brook | Email | Homepage | 09.25.07 - 8:15 am | #

Anyone else notice that fewer starters did speacial teams duty on Sat.? I was at the State game, and I saw very few jerseys I recognized on kicking teams.
Hal | Email | Homepage | 09.25.07 - 8:55 am | #

Thanks to the owners of this blog for keeping us all interested in ND football despite this disastrous season. BGS is the only bright spot right now. There certainly aren't any on the field (or the sidelines). Thanks guys!
Bob | Email | Homepage | 09.25.07 - 10:14 am | #

Don E Brook. Thanks for the recognition of Bruton. i think McNeil should replace Lambert (he sucks)Neal and smith should play a lot more. Did you see how they consistently beat the offensive tackles?
ndfan | Email | Homepage | 09.25.07 - 10:22 am | #

Mark it down. Bruton will be an All American before he is done at ND
ndfan | Email | Homepage | 09.25.07 - 10:25 am | #

I just read in today's Chicago Trib. that soph. Konrad Reuland has decided to leave school. Does anyone have any information?
Mary | Email | Homepage | 09.25.07 - 10:30 am | #

Just read this in the LA Daily News:

http://www.dailynews.com/sports/...orts/ ci_6989746

Possible transfer: Former Mission Viejo High tight end Konrad Reuland was given his release to transfer from Notre Dame, and one of the schools with high interest is UCLA, according to sources.

Reuland's father, Ralf, was asked if the interest was mutual.

"Oh, yeah. That was one of the top schools for him before he decided on Notre Dame," Ralf Reuland said. "(Notre Dame) just wasn't a good fit for him. Konrad really wasn't happy. It's more than just football. The losing had nothing to do with it."

The preliminary plan for Reuland, who is a sophomore, is to attend a junior college for a year, earn his associate's degree, and then enroll in a four-year school.

However, a move to UCLA this fall is not impossible. UCLA does not begin classes until Thursday, and a player has until the 12th day of the quarter to enroll. It is unlikely Notre Dame would release Reuland to UCLA before the Oct. 6 matchup with the Irish, but he could be released after the game. That would still give him time to enroll at UCLA.

The 6-foot-6 Reuland played in seven games last season, and played in three of Notre Dame's four games this season. Ralf Reuland said his son would still have three years of eligibility left.
Mary | Email | Homepage | 09.25.07 - 11:13 am | #

I don't think Reuland can be released to a team on our schedule.
piyachi | Email | Homepage | 09.25.07 - 11:59 am | #

Hal,

I think CW mentioned in his post PSU presser that the starters who also played special teams had gotten winded because they were doing so many sprints downfield on punt coverage and whatnot. Therefore I think his plan was to limit that if we were in the same situation. Particularly the defensive starters.
Erik '04 | Email | Homepage | 09.25.07 - 2:29 pm | #

Erik,

Makes sense. I didn't see that in the PC. Thanks.

Hal
Hal | Email | Homepage | 09.25.07 - 5:35 pm | #

Actually, Lush, Michigan State has had a NC in the last 45 (in 1965), not "none" as you claim. And Texas has won the NC four times in the last 45 years, not "twice" as you claim. So before you go instructing others to "do it with FACTS," you should take your own advice first.
big george | Email | Homepage | 09.26.07 - 11:46 am | #

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