I do think that the church is getting a bad rap from the media, and I am willing to bet that Wright didn’t always preach like that. I also think that Wright was wrong for using the Condaskeeza (If that’s how you want to spell it) remark. For some reason that is not getting an airplay in the media.
But Obama has made his campaign about hope, words and judgment. He DID say that words and matter, but I haven’t heard much of that lately.
Another thing that I've heard on both "The O'Reilly Factor" and on Rush Limbaugh's radio show is about Wright's million-dollar house in the very-very-white suburb of Tinley Park (which is true), being funded by "poor people who go to Trinity" (untrue).
It is true that church members are funding the house. However, anyone who has actually been to the church knows this fact: the church is located in a black working-class neighborhood, but the majority of its congregants are solidly middle class. Quite a few are upper middle class and a few even rich.
There's even a running joke in Chicago (long before all of the controversy with the church) that if the church got bombed, it would virtually eliminate Chicago's buppie population.
"However, critics of Rev. Wright who have never set foot in Trinity United Church of Christ here in Chicago are wrong that Rev. Wright "always" preaches politics in the pulpit."
Amen. One can't assume Wright preaches like that every time he is at church. Maybe, that is why Huckabee somewhat defended Obama, saying that might not be what most of his sermons are like, and just maybe Obama like so many people who go to church slept through church mentally or did not really pay attention (something that goes on in every church).
Where Wright is wrong, he needs to be challenged and called on, especially now that his words are dividing the nation.
But still wrong and unfair to accuse him of preaching same way every Sunday. If he did that, I imagine even the most extremist will eventually tune him out, since no one wants to hear the same thing EVERY SERMON.
I do find Wright to be s/what buffoonish. I thought some of his statements were over the line. Strangely, I think his arrogance helps Obama separate himself from Wright's whacky statements.
The guys is loving this attention, but he needs to go away as far as I'm concerned. He reinforces my belief that he is outdated.
"Strangely, I think his arrogance helps Obama separate himself from Wright's whacky statements."
Yes.
There is clearly no coordination between them, which undermines the guilt by association thing.
"I also think that Wright was wrong for using the Condaskeeza (If that’s how you want to spell it) remark. For some reason that is not getting an airplay in the media. "
Maybe because the media don't really want to show how offensive Wright can be to women and blacks (and from what I know, even some liberal ones would be offended by that attack on a black lady regardless of her views)?
tvd,
Wright made some damning comments about Obama and him, though.
I think Wright was wrong there. What is private between them STAYS PRIVATE.
In this case, I don't care about guilt by association. This is more like a friend stabbing a friend in the back.
Wright is quickly showing the entire country that his loyalties are to self, not to the Lord or to humanity.
His aggressive back stabbing of Obama proves this, and the fact that he is trying to conjure up images that ALL BLACK CHURCHES are outspoken political stages is insulting to the millions of good, black American churches out there that are dedicated to the Gospel.
He needs to just disappear....he is KILLING Obama!!!!!!
There is clearly no coordination between them, which undermines the guilt by association thing.
tvd | 04.29.08 - 11:09 am | #
That's why Wright speaking now is a good thing. The right-wing hypocrites would have us believe Obama is under his spell as Wright mentioned.."voodoo".
If you say it oft' enough, it becomes true:
"First off, [Nation Of Islam Min. Louis] Farrakhan did in fact call Judaism a gutter religion, ...
http://liberalwarjournal.blogspo...till-
wrong.html
... Regarding the state of Israel, I said in 1984, "Israel has not had any peace in 40 years and she will never have any peace for there can be no peace structured on lying, murder, and injustice, using the name of Allah (God) as a shield for your dirty religion."
Countless times over the years I have explained that I never referred to Judaism as a dirty religion, but, clearly referred to the machinations of those who hide behind the shield of Judaism while using unjust political means to achieve their objectives. ...
http://www.noi.org/statements/ri...i12-22-
1997.htm
shay, where doth thou be getting these Raphique type Negroes from?
`
Wright represents the black church like John Rocker represented Major League Baseball.
It is problematic for Obama to have Wright on the rehab tour though. He was there for over 20 years and said he was his mentor, etc.
He may have more problems with Sharpton though http://www.nypost.com/seven/
0429...bama_108577.htm
Is dissecting every word of Jeremiah Wright, what 21st century journalism has come to?
rev. wright is a typical demagogue. he lives in a million dollar home while the poor blacks in chicago live in rat and crime infested housing projects. i would respect him if he lived among them. this n___r is a joke. even though, i'm not voting for obama, i feel sorry for him. obama should've known that when you surround yourself with a snake...it will eventually bite you!
rev. wright is a judas and a disgrace.
again, it is astonishing that we as race have gone from dr. king to slick hair al sharpton, race hustling jesse jackson and a hatemonger like rev wright.
i never believed that obama would be elected. i thought that it would be close but he would have a viable political future. rev. wright has not only guaranteed john mccain's winning in a landslide. he's also damaged obama's political future forever.
he's selfish and he has betrayed his friend for 15 minutes of fame!
Watch the language, Queen. I also deleted your potentially libelous comments about Sen. Obama.
Edited By Siteowner
.."it is astonishing that we as race have gone from dr. king to slick hair al sharpton, race hustling jesse jackson and a hatemonger like rev wright".
It's even more astonishing that you typed those words as if they ring true.
The arguments that I see on this thread are that Wright does not represent the "black church". Yet, he Jesse and Al represent the black church when you want to condemn us as a race.
queen
Have you thought about joining Hagee's church?
SB#1 I think queen needs to ask her other personality 'Linda' about that before she comes to a decision.
Maybe they will let them out of the home to go church but I am not hopeful.
roderick,
you are a freakin genius!
What did we tell ya?
Obama was flying too high and now he has to be put in his place.
It happens to all black men when they get too big and frighten the status quo.
They did it to MLK with the motel sex tapes and the claims of communist ties.
Then of course they killed him.
They did it Jesse by hanging Farrakhan around his neck like an albatross.
Now they're using Jeremiah Wright who HASN'T SAID ONE THING THAT ISN'T THE ABSOLUTE TRUTH to bring down Barack Obama.
The perversity of the whole thing is that you have these grinnin', head scratchin' black righties gleefully joining in the lynching.
When the architects of our republic wrote the magnificent words of the Constitution and the Declaration of Independence, they were signing a promissory note to which every American was to fall heir.
There will be neither rest nor tranquility in America until the Negro is granted his citizenship rights. The whirlwinds of revolt will continue to shake the foundations of our nation until the bright day of justice emerges
But there is something that I must say to my people who stand on the warm threshold which leads into the palace of justice. In the process of gaining our rightful place we must not be guilty of wrongful deeds. Let us not seek to satisfy our thirst for freedom by drinking from the cup of bitterness and hatred.
I have a dream that one day this nation will rise up and live out the true meaning of its creed: "We hold these truths to be self-evident: that all men are created equal."
MLK, Jr.
What did he say? He called the words of the Declaration "magnificent." He didn't say the founding documents were invalid because they counted us as 3/5 human.
What did he ask for? Citizenship rights. We have those. Did he ask for welfare, universal health insurance, increased taxes a larger welfare state?
Did he use tactics that called America evil or call for bitterness or anger or divisiveness? To the contrary.
He then invoked the founding documents as something to be aspired to and admired.
This was taken from 1 ten minute speech.
How far have we strayed?
I'm gonna start calling uptown "Undercover" for his dead-on imitation of Dave Chappelle in Undercover Brother.......
His take on life in America is the exact same as Conspiracy Brother in that movie.
The only thing missing is his extreme dislike of mayo and fried chicken references!!!
Bardo.....
GREAT POST!!!!!!
Wright ain't no MLK....that is for sure,
SB#1 I think queen needs to ask her other personality 'Linda' about that before she comes to a decision.
Maybe they will let them out of the home to go church but I am not hopeful.
Roderick | 04.29.08 - 12:26 pm | #
LOL!!!
Sounds like he's trying to use that "it's a black thing" defense but most of the black people I've talked are not interested.
"A nation that has done something special AGAINST the Negro for two hundred years must now do something special FOR the Negro."
MLK Jr.
here we go beat up our egotist pookie, fill some space. one report said like DH, let him do it now, so by Oct, he will be passe'
jd,
I also like to use this when people compare Obama's oratory to King. Just the prose of what he wrote, the references he used and the relevance of his construct make Obama look like an unpolished high schooler by comparison. I won't even go into delivery!
The hype is over his ascension to a place where no one that looks like us has gone before, but we're living in an unusual time. We have 3 legislators running, all Senators and no conservatives. No one with executive experience and the Democrat frontrunner with very little national exposure, Carter without executive experience. It is historic on so many fronts. But we need to be level headed as we contemplate our choices.
do you need a job roderick? i need someone to clean my floors....
creole & proud!
"A nation that has done something special AGAINST the Negro for two hundred years must now do something special FOR the Negro."
Hardly what Wright rants about from time to time.......
Never heard GD America from the the mouth of the great Dr. King. He actually loved most of what this country stood for, and understood that blacks, if given the opportunity afforded to them by the Constitution, could also come to feel as an important, productive, contributing group to this country.
Wright just wants to damn all white folks and ignore the great opportunity that is available to all black folks today. Meanwhile, he takes money from his middle class church members and moves out to the lilly white suburbs, the very same people that he thinks wants to still hang him and burn black babies on a spit!!!!!
He is a contridicting joke of a preacher and he is interested more in his 15 minutes right now than in acknowledging the greatness of our people in the here and now.....jsut always negatives.
Yeah, Bardo.
Slime Obama by negatively comparing him to King while preparing to pull the lever for somebody who didn't support the King Holiday?
Reminds me of when the baseball establishment trotted out Hank Aaron as an example of how a Negro should act as Barry Bonds got closer to the all-time home run mark..
Conveintly forgetting that Aaron received knapsacks full of hate mail from patriotic white Americans daily when he was approaching Babe Ruth's record.
Bardo,
You stated the real issues of this election to perfection. Three Carter's without executive experience spells trouble for our nation. THat is the real issue. As many people look to race as being an end all issue in 2008, I see the rotting nature of the Federal government to be of a much higher concern than the question of Obama being electable among white folks.
The next four years will be very long and we run the risk of losing the true direction that the founders of this nation envisioned for us.
"Reminds me of when the baseball establishment trotted out Hank Aaron as an example of how a Negro should act as Barry Bonds got closer to the all-time home run mark.."
LIES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
While Undercover may not care that children who look up to Bonds are looking up to a steroid driven freak, Aaron sure did. Aaron is ALL CLASS, and Barry deserves whatever he has coming to him for his deceit.
Selig was begging Aaron to be in San Fran for that record breaking homerun...
The class act that Aaron is declined that offer and reluctently agreed to provide that video congrats. MLB does not control Aaron...never has, never will. His ripping into Bonds was all on his own, and totally to be expected considering that Aaron was threatened and treated like crap as he acted like the true professional that he has always been. Bonds is garbage and an utter disappointment as a human being. He deserved the wrath of Aaron, I expected nothing less from him in that regard.
Where you come up with your crap Undercover is beyond me.....
I’m troubled with Pastor Wright being an issue to begin with. In the first time in our history, a Presidential candidate is taken to task and having to answer for what their pastor has said. More importantly, for what their pastor said on day(s) they were not in attendance at the church.
The racial angle that’s being exploited by white conservatives and the media at large is sickening.
We’ve had Presidential candidates within the last decade who’ve made speeches at institutions that banned interracial dating. We’ve had right-wing political pundits and candidates who stood in support of a treasonous, traitorous, rebel flag. These same individuals cry out about a lack of patriotism demonstrated by Obama. Or they say Wright hates America by saying “God Damn America”. However, white conservative understanding of white southerners need to affectionately fly a treasonous flag NEVER brings the same amount of scrutiny regarding patriotism to GOP candidates or white, Christian conservatives.
We can have discussions about Obama and his relationship with a former Weather Underground member. Yet, the GOP candidates actively court white radicals who want a Confederate States of America. This is done without any outrage.
Why? At the end of the day the reason why any of this is an issue is because Obama is African –American, Wright is black and the GOP faithful want to scare white folks so Barry won’t win.
I wonder if all of this Wright craziness would have resolved itself a long time ago if the press would have been more objective in their reporting of Senator Obama from the beginning.
The media allowed itself to get so wrapped up in the historical context of this candidacy that they have actually impeded the senator's run. We can only sit tight and see what history holds, but the media that chose to shield their candidate of choice, have only made his load heavier.
I wonder if all of this Wright craziness would have resolved itself a long time ago if the press would have been more objective in their reporting of Senator Obama from the beginning.
They've more than compensated for any real or perceived lack of objectivity. Matter of fact, they've outdone themselves. Their reporting and attributing guilt by association with a pastor is historic and without question a first in modern day politics.
In 1934 the Federal Register (every law on the federal books, ever single one) was 2,735 pages. That year, Roosevelt's Economic Recovery Agency added 10,000 pages. So what's up with the trivia Bardo and who cares?
We add 800,000 liberty eroding pages each and every year to the Federal Register and no one knows what's in it. Christopher DeMuth wrote a lengthy article 2 years ago for the American Enterprise Institute about the threat of overregulation and out of control governance. It scared the hell out of me.
We are losing the very thing that made us the greatest nation on earth. Ours is the only country in the world established and founded on the principle of liberty! I hear the nay sayers, unless you were a land owner and a white male, it didn't apply. Take a look again at what Dr. King wrote and said up thread. Magnificent!
The left, and sadly jd, you're right, we only have the left to choose from this time, wants to subvert more of your freedom to bring it under the control of a tyrannical central authority. Universal health insurance, the demonization of corporations, especially oil and pharma. But the real threat is government, especially the federal government. Look at what's happening to food and oil prices, almost entirely because of governmental interference in the markets. We must stop the madness before we no longer have the ability to communicate in forums like this.
i'm not voting for obama but darn he's good looking...
"Why? At the end of the day the reason why any of this is an issue is because Obama is African –American, Wright is black and the GOP faithful want to scare white folks so Barry won’t win."
While I think some of that is true SB, I really think that a lot of citizens are very turned-off by such radical language, especially when it is repeated all day every day in little sound bites.
As much as I am floored by how much hate was manifested in Wright's words, he is not enough of a reason for me to not vote for Obama should the proper circumstances present themselves.
American's with pride in their country had every reason to be offended by the words of a man who seems to be living at a pretty high level because of the opportunities that this GD country has given him.
It would be like me giving you a gold bar, and shortly after that you are damning me for that gold bar. It just does not jive well for anyone who appreciates the many blessing that this country affords all of us if we work hard and remained focused on our goals.
"Look at what's happening to food and oil prices, almost entirely because of governmental interference in the markets."
What utter h___t.
"Ours is the only country in the world established and founded on the principle of liberty!"
That countenanced slavery and apartheid for 75% of it's existence.
watch the language, Steve
Edited By Siteowner
"Yet, he Jesse and Al represent the black church when you want to condemn us as a race."
I have also seen white conservatives say that they don't believe those speak for blacks as a race. Like on fox is that Wright and his followers are not of the black church mentality but more of the far left mentality, that includes black and white alike.
"Their reporting and attributing guilt by association with a pastor is historic and without question a first in modern day politics."
You forgot that the liberal media use guilt by association on Christian conservatives with Falwell as if he speaks for all of us, long past when we got tired of him.
Hagee is considered a heretic by many in Christian conservative circles (me included).
[quote]There's even a running joke in Chicago (long before all of the controversy with the church) that if the church got bombed, it would virtually eliminate Chicago's buppie population.[/quote]
Indeed a whole lot of Consumer Co-Conspirators who heard Wright make the claim that the USA is STEALING Oil because it feels like it has a RIGHT TO the world's oil would be injured as such.
If a CHRISTIAN knows that he is receiving STOLEN GOODS because his PASTOR TOLD HIM SO in the sermon (the CD audio is available if he is not in church that day) but continues consuming....is he PATRIOTIC to God's will?
Frat,
I feel ya. I want a debate on the issues because on substance, I don't like any of those we have left. McCain gets a very slight and severely grudging nod from me at this point because he won't make promises he can't keep on Iraq and because he's not as likely to raise taxes and he doesn't believe in subsidies and wants to cut spending.
All of them believe in man made climate change. All of them want amnesty for illegals. All of them think government is a solution.
I also think of who is worse than the other, I say Hagee is worse than Wright at the race baiting. Just that Hagee race bait in directing it at fellow Christian conservative believers accusing them incessantly for years of antisemitism because they don't hold to his over the top endtimes beliefs. No way am I feeling sorry for him now that he is on the receiving end of charges of antisemitism from liberals.
If anything Christian conservative believers he defamed for over a decade should pile on him, if we choose to be not Christ-like and seek revenge.
[quote]Sounds like he's trying to use that "it's a black thing" defense but most of the black people I've talked are not interested.[/quote]
Angie: After listening to the Warren Ballentine (and his Obama campaign 3 hours) I see that there are two types of Black Democrats:
1) Those who believe that THERE IS NO "Not the right time to talk about this". What better time to challenge WHITE FOLKS on their racist behavior in killing Native Americans and stealing the land? (This was said by a caller - of course this caller did not mention if he is now a DEED HOLDER to this land today that someone else STOLE so that he might purchase it in a laundered fashion)
2) There is a second type of Black person who wants OBAMA TO BE ELECTED more than they want to TALK ABOUT THIS ISSUE and thus risk pissing WHITE FOLKS OFF and thus torpedoing Obama's candidacy. Though we hear Steve and others frequently talk about "Black Sellouts" - someone who promotes his political interests over BLACK INTERESTS - for some strange reason those people who equate OBAMA'S ELECTORAL SUCCESS with BLACK ADVANCEMENT will never be called as such. In their view if it is POPULAR to promote your political party's interests over your RACIAL INTERESTS.....and no one will dare call you on it then YOU ARE NOT A SELLOUT
The entire show was a mirror image to the RIGHT WING WHITE MALE talk shows. Where as they condemn the right wing for their exploits they don't get that they are a mirror image of that which they condemn in their adversaries.
As a Black man who is not a Democrat as I look around in our communities where these people have the most POWER it is clear that they can't claim that they are working in BLACK PEOPLE'S BEST INTERESTS. They are using politics to fight their racial and ideology proxy fight.
Ok folks, the game has changed, just now!
Obama has thrown Wright under the bus drove over him, backed up, hooked up a chain to his still warm body and drug him down Lakeshore Blvd.
So those of you that defended Wright and support Obama, listen to his statement first and then tell me where you stand!
Hillary's chances were just raised to 49%!
Obama saw his campaign struggling and just like he did his grandmother, he ditched Wright!
This brother is imploding, I really do feel bad for him now.
Time to jump all over Hillary now!
Craig,
I don't Obama on this at all.
Maybe he has changed since he became senator and get exposed to the real world that is not the world that his pastor wants to claim is the world he railed against at the pulpit.
I do think Wright and those who defend them marginalize themselves by refusing to own statements he make, play context got twisted game (when they won't do that for anyone else that is not on their side of the issue), divert blame by saying other pastors do it, too, continue to avoid dealing with where people get offended at (and not just on anti-American statements, but on where different ethnic groups get offended), and refuse to provide evidence for outlandish claims made.
JB - I’m troubled with Pastor Wright being an issue to begin with.
---------------------
I agree. Obama was on Chris Wallace this weekend and talked about the war and other important issues, but Monday morning, and now Tuesday, the news is all Rev. Wright.
He comes across as very self-important and prideful. Even if they were taken out of context, the attacks were on his words, not the black church. But he wants to make it seem like its the black church, so his attackers an be seen as attacking some authentic blackness.
85% of what he said NPC was ridiculous, but he did make a few good points. However, they are overshadowed by the rest. And am I wrong or did he not pimp his upcoming book?
He's ticked off Sharpton and now he's going to tick off Wright supporters.
He knows he can't win even getting 90+% of the black vote. He's trying to get his non-racial bona fides back. I wonder if the campaign was in collusion with Sharpton and Wright?
What about the Farrakhan supporters, he ditched them too.
And that is where Wright differs from those like Falwell and Robertson. The latter two, as bad as they are at times, don't hide behind others do it, too, excuse. They don't hide behind people need to look at all their sermons or go to their churches to understand what they say (which is elitist argument employed by Wright).
They own what they say, and in some cases, actually apologize for what they say.
. "It was an opportunity for a very well-prepared pastor to teach America about the foundations of racism and for it to live up to its doctrines," Anthony Evans, president of the National Black Church Initiative, told Journal-isms. "They picked on the wrong man. He represents for us the finest example of what a prepared Black preacher is all about."
You haven't been right about Obama once.
Why should we start paying attention now?
Larry Murphy, a faculty member at Garrett-Evangelical Theological Seminary in Evanston, Ill., said Wright "acquitted himself well. He framed the questions in the appropriate categories, because this is, in fact, not an issue of Rev. Wright. It really is an issue of the larger African American experience" and the responsibility of the Black clergy to respond to the events of the times.
SB1, you hit it out of the park.
What's pathetically shameful is how the perpetuation of White fear of Black men is a generations-old ploy, yet it still works.
" In 1934 the Federal Register (every law on the federal books, ever single one) was 2,735 pages. That year, Roosevelt's Economic Recovery Agency added 10,000 pages. So what's up with the trivia Bardo and who cares?
We add 800,000 liberty eroding pages each and every year to the Federal Register and no one knows what's in it."
Only if you proceed from the premise that the rule of law and what it entails restricts freedom. I can't get there with you.
"85% of what he said NPC was ridiculous, but he did make a few good points. However, they are overshadowed by the rest. And am I wrong or did he not pimp his upcoming book?"
Heck, I read some of his sermons, and he makes good points in all of them, to get people to hear what he has to say, but blows it by damaging things he say that not only is hurtful to his own soul but that of his whole church.
tvd,
Don't!
"What's pathetically shameful is how the perpetuation of White fear of Black men is a generations-old ploy, yet it still works."
The problem with these arguments is that Wright offended alot of different people. He didn't just offend whites. He offended patriotic black conservatives. He offended Jews. He offended Italians. And if he is not careful, he could have offended women, especially black women who look up to Condi Rice (on top of his sexist statements about a missing victim).
"Obama told reporters Tuesday that Wright's comments do not accurately portray the perspective of the black church.
"The person I saw yesterday was not the person that I met 20 years ago," Obama said of the man who married him."
The same people will still rush out there to protect the hatred behind Wright's words. Even if the Great Prince has flogged the messenger at this point.
http://www.breitbart.com/article...&
show_article=1
tvd,
This is the rule of lawyers not the rule of law and there is a very real difference.
When we need to pay lawyers to interpret our interactions and pay fees to engage in ordinary conduct, then we've gone from the rule of law to the tyranny of the law or over-regulation!
"If a CHRISTIAN knows that he is receiving STOLEN GOODS because his PASTOR TOLD HIM SO in the sermon (the CD audio is available if he is not in church that day) but continues consuming....is he PATRIOTIC to God's will?"
I agree with alot of your posts.
But this one I have to say is putting to much on any human being, not just Wright.
One can criticize US policies, and though we as a nation may at times benefit from those policies, and thus enjoy the fruits of those we consider unjust that does not mean we should not speak out against what we feel is unjust.
So I don't think that is being fair to Wright here.
Ronnie,
"What's pathetically shameful is how the perpetuation of White fear of Black men is a generations-old ploy, yet it still works."
What's even more shameful is how these conservative house negroes are gleefully endorsing and perpetuating it.
"What's even more shameful is how these conservative house negroes are gleefully endorsing and perpetuating it."
In other words blame those who are offended by the words, rather than the one who says the offensive words.
No wonder Wright and his supporters are so marginalize. It looks like Obama don't want anything to do with them by the time it is said and done. And why would he want to get himself marginalized too?
Is Wright wrong? Is Obama right?
Is this a campaign tactic to get it out of the way and change the narrative now? Will this stem the tide and stop the bleeding?
How do you who supported Wright and Obama feel now?
It looks like we're witnesses a domestic dispute on national television. Wright was upset that Obama condemned his words during his speech in Philly, so he took a while to put his thoughts (such as they are) together and decided to get back at Obama. He's going to go anywhere he can (in addition to pimping his upcoming book) and say things that the news media will take snippets of out of or in context, which they will then relate to Obama as if he's saying it too. Wright may be wrong, but he's not stupid. He knows the more he talks, even if it is in anger at Barry, the worse it goes for Obama and the less anything of substance that Obama says about the economy, etc. will get out there.
McCain has to be near orgasm over this. Although he's over 70, so he probably doesn't get those anymore.
Is Obama now not black enough again? Is he non-racial?
There are so many twists to this.
I think Obama four years from now will be even much tougher candidate to beat than this year, because this year is a big learning experience. And in four years, the memory of past associations will fade, provided he learned his lessons.
He has potential to be a dominate force in politics for years to come.
Angie,
McCain is fumbling for the Viagra in his medicine cabinet right now, but don't worry, he'll figure a way to screw it up too.
Angie,
If it is a ploy by Obama and Wright to get even conservatives like me to feel bad for Obama, it is actually working!!!!
"In other words blame those who are offended by the words, rather than the one who says the offensive words."
Oh really.
Why are CS and Bardo so offended by what Wright says but actually DEFEND the racist filth of Pat Buchanan?
Some of you negroes need your friggin heads examined.
"McCain is fumbling for the Viagra in his medicine cabinet right now, but don't worry, he'll figure a way to screw it up too."
Yep, party of fake conservatives and screw-ups.
steve,
Is Obama right or is Wright right? Is Hillary your girl again? Did Obama lose his black card this week, jumping over Sharpton and ditching Wright? Is he loyal to Wright like he was his grandmother? I have so many questions!
"Why are CS and Bardo so offended by what Wright says but actually DEFEND the racist filth of Pat Buchanan?"
I didn't see them defend Pat, and I don't know which words you have in mind.
But let's suppose he said some racist filth. And let's suppose Pat and his defenders excuse that by saying others especially blacks do it, too. Let's suppose they also use the excuse that their words got taken out of context in soundbites and one would have to hear everything they say every time they go on air to understand them. And let's suppose they use the argument people are doing this to Pat to play on black fears of white racists.
How would you deal with such lame excuses?
Now, get why no one is moved by the excuses given by Wright and his defenders?
n______s are so crazy! they will destroy each other everytime. all whites have to do sit back and watch!
i feel sorry for obama.
email the dnc and offer support to obama that's the only way he can get the nomination.
mccain 2008!
Why are some people still focused on Rev. Wright and his comments? People need to let it go and focus on more important issues like the high gasoline and food prices. Most citizens are hurting by the bad Economy that's taking place in the United States and the trillion dollar deficit we are in.
Craig Bardo: Hillary's chances were just raised to 49%! Obama saw his campaign struggling and just like he did his grandmother, he ditched Wright!
Slow down, Craig. He merely denounced Rev. Wright's comment. He did not disown the guy.
"I didn't see them defend Pat, and I don't know which words you have in mind."
Take my word for it. THEY DID.
"But let's suppose he said some racist filth."
HE DID.
"And let's suppose Pat and his defenders excuse that by saying others especially blacks do it, too."
Then I would challenge them to produce a quote by any prominent black media figure or politician that even comes close to vileness of this crap.
http://www.humanevents.com/artic...le.php?
id=25634
You're welcome to try as well.
Show me the Wright comment that compares in any way to this filth that you BLACK MEN endorse.
Cause you obviously won't condemn it.
But falling all over yourselves attacking Wright.
un-friggin-believable.
Let's suppose they also use the excuse that their words got taken out of context in soundbites and one would have to hear everything they say every time they go on air to understand them. And let's suppose
condaskeeza? Say it ain't so.
I’m troubled with Pastor Wright being an issue to begin with. In the first time in our history, a Presidential candidate is taken to task and having to answer for what their pastor has said. More importantly, for what their pastor said on day(s) they were not in attendance at the church.
I'm troubled by this too. It seems that they need a comfortable theme to fall back on. That is, one that is partially felt by white America.
"Is Obama right or is Wright right?"
Obama is doing what he has to do to stay viable with the white voting public.
This is the kabuki dance all blacks must play when they try to go national.
The "denouncement" game where you have to prove to white folks that you are not "angry" like most of the other blacks.
Just one of the many advantages of being white in America.
[quote]But he wants to make it seem like its the black church, so his attackers an be seen as attacking some authentic blackness. [/quote]
Classic Cynthia McKinney 101
Dayum, I'm missing a good one. I'm gonna sit on the sidelines cuz I am worn out from a day school.
[quote]They did it to MLK with the motel sex tapes [/quote]
Kinda like the movie "Ricochet" with Denzel, huh?
[quote]
They did it Jesse by hanging Farrakhan around his neck like an albatross.[/quote]
Nah - I think it was the BABY that did Jesse in. I guess he forgot to ask his girl friend if she was down with "Roe V Wade" after inspecting her to make sure that she wasn't wearing a wire.
The thing that's funny is that people see disagreement between two black liberals like it's some crazy conundrum -- the two men have a disagreement.
If nothing else, this cuts against the idea that black liberals are not independent thinkers.
I think Obama has the same problem as the Clintons do. They don't choose their friends very well. Remember how the Clintons keep getting into scandals besides the Clinton infidelity scandals? People they are involved with were poor characters. The Clinton characters, to be sure, were not great characters either. But when they surround themselves with bad characters, it dragged them down.
Same thing with what happens with Obama, when he associates himself closely with the wrong people.
"Nah - I think it was the BABY that did Jesse in.
Didn't know Jesse was a POTUS candidate when his love baby was born.
Where'd you here this CS?
"Dayum, I'm missing a good one. I'm gonna sit on the sidelines cuz I am worn out from a day school."
Al, don't tell you are a fan of pro wrestling! lol
Steve,
You miss my point. No excuses like the ones shown are suffice regardless of WHO did it to WHOM.
"They don't choose their friends very well."
Oh you gotta be kidding me man.
Now it's just the liberals with shady friends.
Bush did business with the friggin Bin Ladens and get's a total pass from the press.
Both McCain and Bush's brother Neil were neck deep in the S&L scandals.
You righties are getting delirious now.
Thuyen, did you read the Buchanan link?
Ready to defend it?
Because I know you're damn sure not going to condemn it.
Steve,
Bush and McCain are righties?
Talk about lowering the bar!
I know of no person -- not Dr. King, not any rabbi I have ever met, and certainly not any other politician -- who would go into an African American church -- Dr. King's Church -- on Martin Luther King Day and devote a significant portion of his speech to acknowledging and then decrying the continuing existence of anti-Semitism in sectors of the black community. That is precisely what Barack did last year. Some might make that speech at an AIPAC convention, but I know of none to do it to an all black congregation. Similarly, in my 51 years, I have heard many rabbis use the story of Passover to talk about religious intolerance against Jews; yet none has lectured on racial and religious intolerance within the Jewish community by forcing us to acknowledge, for example, that the elders at our seders still use derogatory yiddish words for African-Americans. I do not mean to suggest the "moral equivalence" of the language or to argue whether racism in the Jewish or other white communities is more or less prevalent or better or worse than anti-semitism in the black or other non-Jewish communities. They are all worthy of condemnation and most of us know it. But I know of no one -- let alone a politician in a presidential race -- other than Barack to so eschew self-interest and expediency by raising the harder side of the question to the less receptive audience.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/
ho...or_b_95924.html
Kinda puts our right wing race-baiters in perspective now...
Doesn't it?
BTW - Great post SB!
Shay,
"I am outraged by the comments that were made and saddened by the spectacle that we saw yesterday," Obama told reporters at a news conference.
"The person I saw yesterday was not the person that I met 20 years ago," Obama said of the man who married him.
Obama said he heard that Wright had given "a performance" and when he watched tapes, he realized that it more than just a case of the former pastor defending himself.
"What became clear to me was that he was presenting a world view that contradicts what I am and what I stand for," Obama said.
"I gave him the benefit of the doubt in my speech in Philadelphia explaining that he's done enormous good. ... But when he states and then amplifies such ridiculous propositions as the U.S. government somehow being involved in AIDS. ... There are no excuses. They offended me. They rightly offend all Americans and they should be denounced."
If you say so!!!
Did he use tactics that called America evil or call for bitterness or anger or divisiveness? To the contrary.
Craig Bardo 04.29.08 - 12:35 pm
MLK SAID AMERICA GOING TO HELL: Memphis, Tenn., March 18, 1968
"And I come by here to say that America, too, is going to hell if she doesn't use her wealth. If America does not use her vast resources of wealth to end poverty and make it possible for all of God's children to have the basic necessities of life, she, too, will go to hell."
Martin Luther King
shay, you must be paying your Negroes to be this IgKnut of our history; for surely they are not doing it on purpose.
`
Thuyen,
"Bush and McCain are righties?
Talk about lowering the bar!"
Talk about a deflection and a moondance!!!!
LOL!!!!
You don't fool anybody pal.
NSangoma
There is a difference between warning America is going to get condemned like King did and like Jefferson before him did and like evangelical preachers later on do. Wrigth goes a bit beyond that and say God already condemned America and presumed to know when. Falwell is also guilty of that, but he apologized (does not make his sin any less bad but at least he took responsiiblity for what he said).
Is Wright wrong? Is Obama right?
Is this a campaign tactic to get it out of the way and change the narrative now? Will this stem the tide and stop the bleeding?
How do you who supported Wright and Obama feel now?
Wright *and* Obama???
Knowing that the conflation strategy depends on an ignorant and intellectually-challenged electorate, I wonder you (and Thuyen) would try and sell that here?
"You don't fool anybody pal."
Deflection?
That's funny- that's the whole ammo the last four months used by Wright camp.
Deflect by saying his words are taken out of context from soundbites when he does not provide what the actual context is.
Deflect by using that argument but we all know his camp won't do same for others who they disagree with.
Deflect by saying other people do it so somehow it is ok for them to do it.
Deflect by ignoring where people point out he said offensive words against ethnic groups.
Need I say more?
Deflect is the name of your game and each and every defender of what Wright said.
"Knowing that the conflation strategy depends on an ignorant and intellectually-challenged electorate, I wonder you (and Thuyen) would try and sell that here?"
Sell what? McCain is not much of an improvement over either Hiliary and Obama.
A choice between Obama and Hiliary is like a choice between a root canal and a tooth pull-out.
[quote]"A nation that has done something special AGAINST the Negro for two hundred years must now do something special FOR the Negro."[/quote]
The Kneegrow who, after WITNESSING the history of what was done to him is a FOOL to expect his long time adversary is going to ever FULLY RESTORE HIM to his previous form.
(Double this insanity if the Kneegrow has no clue as to what his PREVIOUS FORM was. When he is "left all alone" to operate all by himself as he was in the past - he'll say that it is UNFAIR that he was "LEFT BEHIND" by his former oppressor. He will continue to compare himself to his oppressor who now "lives in the suburbs" rather than ever attempting to build up to that same level by organizing his own people organically.)
Ronnie,
I'm only "conflating" those who support Obama so much that they defended Wright. Now that Obama has thrown him overboard completely, how do you feel about that intense defense of Wright?
"Deflect by ignoring where people point out he said offensive words against ethnic groups."
Where? when?
"I'm only "conflating" those who support Obama so much that they defended Wright. Now that Obama has thrown him overboard completely, how do you feel about that intense defense of Wright?"
If Wright is innocent of what he is accused of then those who defend Wright will have to say Obama is a liar. If Obama is telling the truth, then I will folks fill in the blanks here.
Craig,
As I said before....Obama "merely" denounced Wright's comments. He did not disown the man today. I stick by that one.
The Real Jeremiah Wright
What if the only thing you knew about Thomas Jefferson was that he owned slaves?
What if, instead of the video of the I Have a Dream speech, elementary school students were taught that Martin Luther King Jr. once said, “My government is the greatest purveyor of violence in the world …”?
What if the single piece of information you possessed about Nelson Mandela was that he co-founded a terrorist organization called Umkhonto we Sizwe (abbreviated as MK), which stands for Spear of the Nation?
With apologies to William Blake, if you believe you can see the world in a grain of sand, you better make sure it is the right grain.
So, how well do the twelve words we know about Jeremiah Wright define the man, the nearly four-decades of ministry, the church he built, the denomination it belongs to, the black community, and whatever else we think he might represent? Are those words the right grain of sand?
The Bill Moyers interview with Wright last Friday night went a long way towards illuminating other dimensions of the man. My father – no fan of lefty politics of any stripe – called me after watching the segment with some surprise in his voice. Perhaps he was expecting Wright to cite Stokely Carmichael as his most important intellectual influence instead of Martin Marty, who is probably the most distinguished scholar of religion in America and the very model of thoughtful moderation.
It was Marty, no doubt wearing his signature bow tie, who inspired Wright when he was a student at the University of Chicago Divinity School to take over a failing church on the far south side of Chicago and make it relevant to the community it was serving.
“Do you know anything about Jeremiah Wright other than those twelve words?” my dad asked.
“A little,” I said. A grain or two of sand’s worth.
When I first moved back to Chicago in late 2001 to start the Interfaith Youth Core, it seemed like I heard Jeremiah Wright’s name mentioned every place I turned. All kinds of people – rich folk and poor folk, traditionalists and progressives, young people and old people, black and white, believers and atheists – told me I had to go see him preach.
Nobody said anything about radical politics or hating America or stirring up a race war. The one word I heard used in reference to Jeremiah Wright over and over again was the word that Martin Marty used to describe his ministry: “Hope”.
Sometime in late 2003, I woke up at the crack of dawn on a Sunday to make the long drive down to Trinity from my condo on the north side of Chicago. I arrived an hour early for the service, and still wound up in the balcony.
I remember feeling that the sermon was smart and moving, and I thought Wright had earned his reputation as a man who sent of signals of transcendence with his words.
But here is what I remember most about that morning: At the end of the service, Reverend Wright read aloud a letter that a young woman had sent him. She had grown up in the congregation, was now studying for a PhD in Oceanography, and was writing to thank Reverend Wright and Trinity for all they had done to support her.
This is what we’re about, Jeremiah Wright said, waving the letter from the pulpit, proud enough to be her own father. The congregation cheered wildly.
Maybe that’s the grain of sand that best describes the world of Jeremiah Wright.
http://
newsweek.washingtonpost.c...iah_wright.html
Fascinating, the folks who have been to his Church, and know his works have atotally different view than the Faux News racists...
Not surprising at all.
"Where? when?"
Garlic nose remarks about Italians. Calling Israel apartheid state and printing out Hama hate literature against Jews with bizarre accusations like Israel has race bombs being developed against Palestinians. Using the death of Christ as not only chance to slur Italians, but also to use it as proof of world and truth is based around "rich white men" keeping "poor black men" down. It is no longer just a criticism of America thing. It is a divine racial war thing.
Right out of the theology of Cone.
"There will be neither rest nor tranquility in America until the Negro is granted his citizenship rights."
"Let us not seek to satisfy our thirst for freedom by drinking from the cup of bitterness and hatred."
MLK, Jr.
From the same speech and same passages as above.
What was he asking for? Citizenship rights and freedom! That's all we need!
Release the bitterness and hatred because only the person that harbors it is harmed!
"The Kneegrow who, after WITNESSING the history of what was done to him is a FOOL to expect his long time adversary is going to ever FULLY RESTORE HIM to his previous form."
EXACTLY!!!!!
Thus why my mother to this day still says that I have to be at 150% each and every day that I work on a job or work in school.
White man has never given me anything, nor should they have to. All of a sudden they are going to change because Undercover is on BR talking smack?????
I trust myself to chase my dreams more than any white man to give me those dreams.
Basics folks....basics!!!
"Al, don't tell you are a fan of pro wrestling! lol"
Thuyen, I was once a fan of pro wrestling but the last thing I remember was when "Classy" Freddie Blassie wrestled along with guys named Bruno Sammartino and Ivan "The Russian Bear" Putski. Then one day everything changed. Bob Backlund was the WWF champion. I heard Vince McMahon stopped announcing and was replaced by a guy named "Mean" Gene Okerlund. Is that true?
I find it funny people use the Moyers interview (which is controlled interview) I should add to "prove" Wright was distorted. If only Wright was actually asked to explain his statements that were so offensive. Only thing is Moyers ducked on those questions.
The interview was not an interview. It was bogus at best and really a chat between friends avoiding the controversy to make each other look good.
[quote]One can criticize US policies, and though we as a nation may at times benefit from those policies, and thus enjoy the fruits of those we consider unjust that does not mean we should not speak out against what we feel is unjust.
So I don't think that is being fair to Wright here.[.quote]
Understood Thuyen.
But should we allow Wright (and Steve and BET Uncut) to continue to damn the White folks in the North during Slavery for using the COTTON picked by the enslaved African while claiming that they are AGAINST SLAVERY and have never picked up a whip as their proof? While failing to make note of their consumption in kind today?
Some of these White folks not only were IN the Military but were FOUNDING MEMBERS. Why is it that THIS does not vaccinate them from criticism?
BT.....
I saw his entire speech before the NPC....and the hate and anger was very, very evident.
He sounded just as crazy in that entire speech as he does in the little thirty second sound bites that are on CNN or FOX.
Yet you only look at FOX, when CNN and MSNBC are playing those same soundbites over and over again in one loop. Same as FOX!!!!!!!! Even you engage in the game of half truths and omission when it suits your needs, as I have shown here.
"Only thing is Moyers ducked on those questions.
The interview was not an interview. It was bogus at best and really a chat between friends avoiding the controversy to make each other look good."
It provided balance to the unrelenting negative coverage of Wright.
I had no problem with it -- there are plenty of figures I consider reprehensible that get similar softball treatment.
"Garlic nose remarks about Italians. Calling Israel apartheid state and printing out Hama hate literature against Jews with bizarre accusations like Israel has race bombs being developed against Palestinians. Using the death of Christ as not only chance to slur Italians, but also to use it as proof of world and truth is based around "rich white men" keeping "poor black men" down. It is no longer just a criticism of America thing. It is a divine racial war thing."
Israel IS an apartheid state.
(Psst, Thuyen let me clue you in on something. In Israel, Palestinians are official second class citizens)
As for the rest of your outrage, it always kills me how you black righties are ready to jump in front of a moving train for your beloved white folks but actually endorse anti-black rhetoric.
Still no comments on Buchanan's rant, eh?
But he gives me "garlic nose".
You can't make this stuff up?
"I heard Vince McMahon stopped announcing and was replaced by a guy named "Mean" Gene Okerlund. Is that true?"
Actually, Vince, who owns WWE, is part of the show now. I have not watched WWE in quite a while, but I do know he is for a most part a heel now. His kids Shane and Stephanie (who is wife of Hunter Hearst Hemsley and a fine one at that) are involved, too.
I started watching wrestling at the time right after Randy Savage had turned on Hogan during tag match with Big Bossman and Akeem, over Miss Elisabeth, and at the same time Ric Flair got powedrived through a table three times by Terry Funk after he won a title match in best two out of three against Ricky Steamboat. So I started watching both WWF and NWA/WCW at the same time.
[quote]"What's pathetically shameful is how the perpetuation of White fear of Black men is a generations-old ploy, yet it still works."[/quote]
Indeed and Fiddy Cent, The Game and NWA have a wall full of gold records for their innovation to CASH IN UPON this White Fear of the "snarling Black man".
Indeed Steve you are correct. It still works.
" "The Kneegrow who, after WITNESSING the history of what was done to him is a FOOL to expect his long time adversary is going to ever FULLY RESTORE HIM to his previous form.""
Whole pile of straw there.
Black people are not, nor have they ever been, sitting around waiting for restoration.
Especially since we have to fight tooth and nail to get white people to even admit there was ANY wrongdoing EVER, and that if there was, it wasn't just a blip on our pathway to sweetness and light and racial harmony. P6 has an excellent comment to this effect.
Let's look at some of the venom from the Reich..errrrr... right...
Ax what you can do for your country
by Nancy Lee Wolfe
We remember the 60s when the social change which continues today began in earnest-- riots, draft card and bra-burnings-- those were the days. However, Rev. Wright established a new battleground by mocking JFK’s Boston drawl. It seems sad that the struggle for equality and