A fascinating portrayal. I think the ushers point will be borne out widely across England and Wales.
Let the mood be now.... Brilliant and so so true. We want more We want more ... Bravo .... Encore !!
Do the good looking but not so bright para legal but pretends shes a fully qualified brief next.
I'm interested to know more about the chairman-winger dynamic. Conducting the hearing by oneself should clearly be avoided, as it is incompatible with the composition of the court, but stopping every five seconds to discuss things can hardly be the most convenient practice.
Any thoughts, Bystander?
It would be a pleasure and an honour to appear before you
Oh, have we got Normans. Oh yes indeed. They should be removed from the chair for incompetence, but of course that never happens.
Magistrates court is so glamourous ;)
And the Youth Court (where I know you don't sit) is whole other ballgame with another set of characters - bolshy 12 yr. old who has watched too much American TV, desperate "can't do a thing with him" Mum, "it's not his fault" solicitors, "he's easily led", and so on and so on.
Some missing...
Mr.Hapless the Motorist is basically a decent chap and has never been in a Court before. A speed camera has flashed him doing 37 mph on a straight empty road when the council bureaucrats told him not to go over 30. He fondly imagines that the Mags are also decent chaps like something out of Dixon of Dock Green.
Oh dear: New Britain, public choice theory, management consultancy, money-grubbing incentivisation and sleazy corruption of the public realm have rather passed him by.
Little does he know that the Mags' Court is now a member of the prosecuting Speed Camera Partnership and in their pay. He is about to be tucked up good'n'proper.
In time he will hear the principle of nemo iudex in causa sua on the Internet and come to despise the Mags even more than the Police.
Mr.Clueless JP is sad type who failed in business and couldn't get into politics so joined up to gain the illusion of being near the power that eluded him. Typically a throwback to the 1960s, he believes he is a progressive radical, and only reads the Guardian.
He has never heard of nemo iudex in causa sua, and even an extended session with the Cluebat™ will not enlighten him. Traditional Principles are subservient to political correctness anyway.
He is very excited about the prospect of getting some money out of Mr.Hapless who is obviously selfish and overprivileged unlike the deprived victims of an unfair society he usually sees.
Mr.Sharp the PACG Management Consultant has dropped in to see how his Speeding Fine Hypothecation scheme is working out and to count the profits. He pays the Mags & the Police their share of the loot then transfers his slice to a Blind Trust in the Caymans before taking the private jet to Barbados for a spot of R&R with senior politicians. He will get a lordship in due course.
Mr.Atkins the McKensie Friend is bold, handsome, noble, principled, and dashing, (or so my mum says). Cursed with an eidetic memory and a habit of reading obscure texts like the ECHR article 6 "Right to a Fair Trial" and Magna Carta, he has not only heard of nemo iudex in causa sua but also understands; [after that unfortunate incident with Mr.Boot in 4B when he sa he does not kno the passive pluperfect of "amo amas amat ..." and does not care. Chiz chiz.]
A bit behind the times, he actually believes that the British people should be governed according to their laws and customs as the Queen promised in 1953. He hopes that one day the Mags' Courts will recover their propriety and once again bear true allegiance.
The General Public is more cynical and doesn't believe honour and propriety will be restored. Spin, Sleaze and Corruption will rule for the foreseeable future. They're all at it now, there is no point voting. The more enterprising souls are getting out.
Doom.
How about Mr.Bitter and Twisted who has been caught speeding and doesn't like it?
Plenty of shoplifters feel the same way about their lawbreaking as the Mr. Toads do about theirs.
Excellent Bystander! Loved it! Please give us more soon!
To be fair to Mr Hapless, shop lifting is an absolute moral offence (see 10 commandments for details) whereas speeding is a relative offence created by bureaucracy using arbitrary limits defined in the 1930s.
"speeding is a relative offence"
Oh no it ain't. It is an offence for which you can be fined, given points or disqualified. Speed limits are the law of the land, and you break them at your peril.
Bystander:
'Oh no it ain't. It is an offence for which you can be fined, given points or disqualified. Speed limits are the law of the land, and you break them at your peril.'
And that neatly encapsulates the argument about moral or legal imperative...
The belief that 'Justice' is the same as 'fairness' is delusional.
Wonderful Bystander! I think I have already seen most of these in the few observations I have done to date.
How about "Turned over a New Leaf Tony"?? You must have seen a few of them?
atkins,
Shut up and take your punishment like a man. Speeding is a crime, no-one claims that it is as bad as murder, rape or burglary but it's still a crime and you were caught.
I got done for 37 in a 30 zone three and a half years ago. I didn't set out to break the law I just didn't keep as close an eye on the speedo as I should have done. It's just one of those things, you pays your money and you takes your chance.
That's enough speeding thanks. I'm not having another thread hijacked. I'll put another motoring thread on in a while, and you can all let off steam then.
Can I plead guilty to being Percy Pinstripe in my first few months of being on my feet.
A few weeks in however, you realise that the bench can spot the difference a mile of and it has nothing to do with the width of one's chalkstripe.
My visits to the Magistrates' Court are rather infrequent now. I am only sent there to represent Mr Middle Class I shouldn't be here because courts are only for criminals which I am not because I am wearing a tie He usually rants on at me about everything bar the offence with which he has been charged.
Happy days.
Blimey Bystander, you'll cop it on Monday a.m. Just wait until your little lot catch up with you!
Jerym; Careful. I'm sure it can be arranged!!!
"Downtrodden Girlfriend is often called Donna."
It wasn't me, guv. I look 40 because I nearly am 40. I get to bed before midnight and rather like my wines; although I am partial to an ice cold pint of farm cider, especially in a field, by a running river, on a warm summers day. I don't have any kids, and my hair is scragged because I work so hard I haven't got the time to get to a hairdresser. I don't wear mascara because on local government wages, I can't afford it; it's as simple as that. My eyes would be glassy, and mouth drooling, probably over jealousy of the defendants in handcuffs. And if my boyfriend, relatively high up in the international banking industry, were to decide to do anything noughty, it would probably be something a good deal more serious than a couple of years in nick.
(not aimed at you, of course! we know that you are respectable. Everyone here is, apart from ..... no, I shan't say)
Edited By Siteowner
Cricky, where do you sit, Bystander? We'd go bust if we paid Counsel £75 for a simple hearing!! We pay £50 for remand hearings and £90 for a full days trial.
Other than that it all looks pretty spot on to me.
>[Donna's paramour] is taken back down, having been remanded in custody as a prelude to a stretch of a couple of years.
As you can only hand out a year at a time, does the presence of a Donna require sending the chap on to Crown Court then? That seems a little harsh, even if having a Donna shows bad taste.
Looking forward to reading the duty probation officer pen pic... unless, of course, they aren't in your courtroom for long enough to be noticed?
Without wanting to debate the pros and cons of speeding offences....
(rest of post deleted. No speeding stuff means no speeding stuff.)
Edited By Siteowner
phatboy,
£90 for an all-day trial? You tight bastard!
What about Mr "I came to watch the court because i am old and have nothing better to do"? A close relation of Mr or Miss "i came to watch the court because i think it will look good when I apply to university"
In my reletively short time on the bench, I've only encountered one chairman who it was really hard work to sit with. He was undoubtedly a "No-Bail Norman" who was also constantly moaning about... well, about just about everything, actually.
He has, thankfully, since retired.
Clearly i have spent too many years hanging about courts (in a professional cpacity i hasten to add) because i recognise each and everyone of these..... And even better none of them are me!
More please Mr Bystander!
When will you get to a description of the court Probation Officer? Soon I hope.
Nearly retired police prosecutor -
My middle age spread has rendered my uniform redundant, but I can't be bothered replacing it for the short time before I retire. The usher helps when I cannot hear the names of matters, as I mumble my way through the summary of charges and consent to all adjournments. Handing over the entire prosecution file to defence counsel seems to expedite matters.. When's tea-time?
wild-west magistrate
I'm a plain speaker and give it straight to punters. Each morning while court is full, I put th on remand for a few days to teach 'em all lesson. Seriously believe that pronouncements to a polite audience of barristers and punters about replacing biology classes with life-skills drug education will actually reduce young offending.
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