Goddammit, LM, I could hug you! This is a GREAT thread kickoff.
I am so sick of hearing about what a terrible dictator is Castro, that I could puke.
It WOULD be great if he, and Raul, etc., would hold elections, but after all that the U.S. has thrown at Cuba; the exploitation, the assassination attempts on Castro, the embargo, etc,...it's hard to blame the old fart for not wanting to let the CIA stick their dick up Cuba's ass again.
Want to talk "dictators"?
One fucking word: BATISTA!
The speil that Cuba was a paradise until the Satanic Marxist from Hell, Fidel, fucked it up, is the purest of horseshit. It was, as you point out, two things: a sugar cash cow for U.S. interests to milk, and a mob whorehouse and Casino, in Havana...
When Castro took over, the first thing he did was run the mob out, those of them that had not already left.
Pre-Castro, the U.S. controlled 90% of the Cuban economy through the sugar industry.
It's no accident that the lobbying group that spends the most money bribing congress to make sure that there's no rapprochement with Cuba, is the American Sugarbeet Growers Association.
You just KNOW their concerns only have to do with liberating the poor, downtrodden, Cuban people.
(nnnngggg...need big angryface here...)
Great article LM (and as someone also spending time in bed with whatever's going around NYC, specifically empathetic to how I heard the news). I also know Cubans out in Union, and the one thing that seems to disconnect is what exactly they want "back."
...seethe here in the U.S. for half-a-fucking century... anxiously await the moment they can return... while feasting on the untold riches of the country's being open again to all manner of resource-filching, and investment-slash-kleptocracy.
Sadly, this is too true.
While I agree with you about the shriveled old white men and the brutal exploitation, I'm absolutely certain there's a whole new band of brutal exploiters rubbing their hands in anticipation. Bush mentioned his desire for fair markets. Simply put: We busted Iraq in the mouth. What do you think we're gonna do to you, bitch?
The girl won't get away this time, and her murder will happen before our eyes.
Well hell....there goes my opus on Cuba on my blog. Ain't no way I can do better than that.
Interesting comment about exile/emigre politics here.
Over here in San Jose, CA, we kind of have the same obsession with anti-Communism and knee-jerk resistance to ANY sort of rapproachment with the old country in the Vietnamese American community. Or you get called names for not being There is a young, Vietnamese American city council representative, Madison Nguyen, who is taking a lot of flack from her fellow Vietnamese here over the name of a Vietnamese business district in east San Jose - they want to call it Little Saigon, where Ms. Nguyen had worked out a compromise to "Vietnamese Business District", something like that. After all, there are a lot of non-Vietnamese who also live in the vicinity --- like Latinos. She's been getting all sorts of grief, insults, threats, and was pointedly NOT invited to the Tet parade.
There are protests and a hunger strike in front of San Jose's City Hall over the "Little Saigon" issue. Hey, what about the energy and time that can be otherwise devoted to working to improve the schools, public safety, job creation, and other services?
In that aspect the Vietnamese resemble Cubans, and not necessarily for the best...hopefully over time this will change.
Technically, Castro hasn't resigned, but has decided not to serve another term.
silverkris,
Remember how excited some Vietnamese-Americans got last year (IIRC) when the White House website mistakenly displayed the South Vietnamese flag for a few hours? They really thought that Bush was going to overthrow, or at least undermine, the free-market, US-friendly, theoretically communist Vietnamese government.
I've never understood the relationship we've had with Cuba. I've also never understood the dividing lines that emerge over the island.
I'm not talking about the emigre v. exile issue but the political capitalist v. socialist division over what kind of ruler Castro was.
Every discussion I've ever seen on the web ends up with shouting over what kind of place Cuba really is without any objectivity, nuance or real analysis of the place or it's people.
I believe we need to end the embargo and establish a much more respectful relationship with Cuba but I have a feeling that will never be if people on both sides of the debate see Cuba as an extreme as either a socialist's wet dream or a commie-pinko paradise.
Very good analysis LM. I think though that with other suitors around, the U.S. can forget about ever having that same old 1950's relationship with Cuba. Even after the embargo is lifted and once Castro goes. These suitors are Venezualan Oil (nice and slinky which makes the ecomony just purr), European investment (nice Euro you have there), Canadian tourists (enjoy the beach amigos and thanks for those resort developments)and even Israeli agriculural specialists (My you guys know how to get things growing). Want to hop into my bed Uncle Sam ? Sorry you are 50 years too late, my bed is already filled up.
From talking with folks in the Upper Midwest about Cuba... they just want to sell them grain and other ag products. Because of the Big Muddy and how transportation works Cuba would be a perfect market. All people got to eat, even Communists.
The politics of the deal are stupid beyond belief. Here we are selling off America to the Communist Chinese without a whimper from the Rightists, yet talk about doing business with Cuba and you would think we were selling children to them. I think on the scale of who has fucked up their own people worse, the Chinese have the Cubans beat by a mile. I never heard of the Cubans killing dissidents, selling off the internal organs and then charging the family for the bullet.
The real politick of the situation demands the US recognize them as full members of the world community and tell the Florida whackjobs to sit down and shut up. LM has it right, this more about the emotions of the issue than the facts.
What people got to understand about Cuba is it was part of the Great Republican Imperial Experiment of the Spanish American War. That war like this war was built upon a tub of lies, but was sparked by a coal dust explosion blamed on tricky Spanish sabateurs. The net effect? Hundreds of thousands of dead Filipinos in our Pacific domain. A Cuba with a Constitution written by the victors telling the Cuban people that the US can and should come in and rape them whenever we want(wonder where Gitmo came from?)- a large island full of people to exploit and abuse.
Three years after Castro came to power they had Soviet nuclear missiles primed and ready to go, with Castro apparently goading his Soviet patrons to light the world on fire if one US GI touched foot on Cuban soil. Angry Ex indeed. And this is why the future of Cuba is not in our hands. The Cubans can liberalize their regime without a grand collapse like the Soviet Union, because in many ways they already have.
Cuba is a tourist destination for a lot of people except Americans. It has gotten rid of a lot of its hard money restrictions. And for all the hemming and hawing in DC about how Castro is anti-Freedom(TM), the economic sanctions are placed there by the US.
The US policymakers don't want a Cuba that can be controlled by an anti-US party AND be successful in trading with the US. The effect of a positive example would be too much for them. So instead the CIA supports people like Orlando Bosch who blew up an Air Cubana flight with 77 people on board back in the '70s. Our freedom fighters are their terrorists though right?
Cubans really need a hard money infusion, industrial goods, and a clear path to the future. They won't get this under the CP or an imposed regime from the outside. My hope is that Obama, who wasn't even born when this thing was started, can have a running dialogue with the new leaders of the Cuban CP on liberalizing certain parts of the society and economy and in return ending the disastrous embargo. I don't see Clinton or McCain being able to approach this issue from a new angle. Obama might be able to do that.
Well said, Wengler. You fleshed things out nicely.
Much appreciated,
LM
They could have really changed Cuba at any time, via normalizing relations.
One thing that people have to realize, is that the Cuban people will not accept a return to the old days. Under NO circumstances. What did you think kept Castro in power all these years. His beard? Being a despot can only get you so far, after all.
So the exiles will not get Cuba handed to them on a golden platter. Not going to happen. Nor SHOULD it happen. It has to be remembered that the Cuban people had a legitimate beef..still do really. And while it's the official policy to try and get the exiles land back, it's way past counterproductive.
It IS the problem.
It's more than that with the emigres.
You have to understand that Cuba has a heritage of Spanish rule.
For 300 years, when the British Crown got too autocratic, the refrain was, "This isn't Spain".
Spain bought into divine right big time, and it got passed down from the Spanish crown to the despotic successors of the crown.
A coup was OK, because that was just the man at the top changing, but Castro, he broke up the estates, and gave them to the peons, some of whom were n***ers (IIRC, Cuba is now majority Afro-Cuban).
That is an affront to God, and cannot be tolerated.
Baltogeek & Karmakin,
From experience I can tell you there are many Cuban-Americans who simply don't fit the Gusano stereotype. Like many Cuban exiles world-wide (including former members of the Castro Government) they left more in sorrow than in anger. One family I know found the Miami scene quite unwelcoming circa 1970 for that very reason.
I have a colleague who's been back & forth to Cuba many times in recent years, someone who's also lobbied the US Gov. on their ridiculous visa restrictions for Cuban artists (a great tool for denying a people their own pipeline to American citizens). For years now he's been insisting that Little Havana's old guard has been losing support within that community, that the new generation isn't buying their dream of a glorious return to the past.
In other words the old narrative ain't working -- sound familiar?
My friend also says that the old guard's spent so much energy demonizing these New Thinkers that they've actually made their case for them.
Sound familiar?
looks like Obama is going to sweep this thing (if the terr'ists don't strike again beforehand), then hopefully we will see real friendships develop with people the old way has shit on so many times. BTW - trying to post a link to this great story, but for some reason blogger won't LET me. Wonder if they are old guard and you pissed em off? I'll try again in a while. It's a nice sunny (chilly) day here at the beach in SW Washington state usa, and I should get back outside...
Peace, eh?
I think a few commenters have some insights and certainly LM does.
I note that LM doesn't invest too much in praising Fidel. He puts down Batista and his pals big time.
Expresses no admiration for policies that the US has recycled for 50 years.
So, I agree with the sentiment.
BUT there are a whole lot of people who would like to enjoy Cuba for what it is, a beautiful island, very underpopulated, agriculturally potent, surrounded by warm seas and breezes and inhabited by Cubans, perhaps the best part of it all.
The whole world of political crap prevents that.
And if there is anyone out there that sincerely believes that Fidel is Mr. Wonderful or that the current dynamic of isolation is not part of his plan you have not been paying attention.
The pity is that we have gone along with his schemes.
The moment he and Raul lose their grip and the population decides they have had it with the 24/7 chotaria and Communist Party domination, I'll move to Santiago de Cuba that same afternoon.
My friends have heard me say this for 28 years.
I'm still waiting. Fidel will probably outlive me; I have not made a pact with the devil.
I am not Cuban. Yet.
RC...after spending a lot of time around the chicago cuban population i can tell you...they look like her when they are in their 20's add 150+ pounds before they hit 40.
He hee hee. While participating on one of the Carter clusterfuks, the Mariel Boatlift, I was approached by A Miami-Cuban acquaintance who offered the observation that he "never knew Cuba had so many blacks." Yep, he was of the white exile class that fled Fidel in the early '60's. Gawd, they led some sheltered lives down there, what with the giant haciendas, and the multitude of servants. Of course it was all JFK's fault for not providing air support to the Bay of Pigs invaders, a "secret" operation we all read about in the local papers months before it happened. Nevermind that Fidel had the invasion mopped up before the "need" for air support was evident, thanks to his extraordinary intelligence network consisting of the Miami Herald (or as we liked to call it, "The Miami Geraldo."). Thus, except for little Hialeah, they all vote Republican. Of course, none of the 3rd generation intends to return to Cuba, no matter what.
"looks like Obama is going to sweep this thing (if the terr'ists don't strike again beforehand), then hopefully we will see real friendships develop with people"
It's really ridiculous how much you expect from this guy, without having any reason to believe that he's even caring about this...
Gray, Old Friend should our next President turn out to be Senator Obama and even come close to my expectations of his abilities... will you admit your cynicism was unfounded? I'll certainly admit if he disappoints and in fact work to get him out of office.
Did I hear some sort of squeaking noise...?
The most amazing thing in all of this is that the embargo has absolutely no effect on the (admittedly evil, undemocratic, dictatorial) regime and makes the ordinary cubans suffer economic hardships.
The embargo is really hurting the people of Cuba, not its rulers.
The politics of the Cuban embargo have an inertia now, with no one daring to raise a (logical) contrarian voice and saying that it simply does not work.
The Cuban exile lobby also shows the world how incredibly vulnerable America is to a well organized, ethnic (or religious... or one issue) voting bloc - it stifles all discussion, all questions, and simply... the Cuban embargo became an immutable law, which no one questions - it simply is.
http://americangoy.blogspot.com/...ed-
example.html
I've been trying to remember Lucy's last name all night. Thanks.
Too damned lazy to Google.
I always thought that America's Cuba policy was an extension of the monroe doctrine. or to put it another way, the US wants to destroy Cuba because it threatens to be a good example to others
Here’s something I posted elsewhere in defense of my assertion that Castro has been a great leader whom I rank with Nelson Mandela. (I'll bet that Mandela agrees*):
“I think we disagree over whether the US and capitalism are forces for good in the world.
That the US has always had good relations with numerous authoritarian governments, but not with Cuba, is not accidental, it’s structural. Those governments (the oil monarchies are prototypical) are compradors, mediating exploitative relationships that cannot be ratified in free and fair elections. Cuba’s stance on property and profit seeks to protect its people and resources from exploitation. Even more, Cuba is an insistent voice against exploitation. Cuba can’t conduct free and fair elections because Uncle Sam would put its thumb on the scales. Reagan and Negroponte’s contra war against Nicaragua is the model.
A monopoly on political power is always ‘bad’, but in the case of the Cuban CP it’s arguably not ‘wrong’, because that power has been used to mobilize economic resources for human development and solidarity with the least of our brethren. Consider what Enron, Exxon, Halliburton, Blackwater, and Citibank have done with their power. Democracy is a non-negotiable goal, but absent universal electoral norms, and social and economic equality, it’s just a misleading word.
Cuba has certainly suffered during the embargo, but it doesn’t follow that Cuba’s economic theories are inferior. If the good guys with the superior system had won the Cold War, a lot more peace and prosperity should have broken out worldwide by now. The trends aren’t good. The 'free’ market is accessed by cash, and half the world has no money or virtually none. Billions are un- or under-employed, and slogging along without the benefit of labor-saving technology. Have the Wall Street frat boys provided a satisfactory explanation for the causes of and cures for the housing/credit/solvency bubbles?
Capitalism is neither optimal nor humane, and given the scale of today’s weaponry, economic competition is no longer practical even for the winners. The way to go is communism, or to be gentler to today’s ear: economic sharing and cooperation via a robust public sector.”
[Following Gag Halfrunt’s note above that technically Castro hasn't resigned, it’s not yet clear that he’ll resign as chair of the CCP.]
* http://
www.newsfromnowhere.org.u...ISBN=087348729x
"Here’s something I posted elsewhere in defense of my assertion that Castro has been a great leader whom I rank with Nelson Mandela."
Simply - NO.
By that standard, Mussolini was a great leader because he made the trains run on time.
Castro is a dictator, who uses secret police to squash dissent and arrest/torture people at his whim.
He is still 1000 times better than the corrupt Batista, but that does not make Castro GOOD.
Well, IME the hard-right never-say-die exile Cuban American sentiment decreases proportionally
1) the farther you get away from South Florida
2) by later generations
As the old 1960s refugee exile population fades away, there is more diversity in terms of political ideology or thought. Younger C-A's are less likely to care about the old CANF outlook. More recent arrivals from Cuba are likely to still have close ties with relatives in the old country, and very concerned with the recent restrictions on travel to Cuba by people visiting relatives.
Moreover, Farm Belt state officials are lobbying to sell ag products to Cuba, and many do (all cash basis).
So change is in the air, it may not happen right away, but it will happen over time.
So there's hope yet.
‘Dissident condemns Cuban prisons: "Imagine what it's like to live in a penal population with delinquents, murderers, unscrupulous people of all types," said Mr Alvarez. He described the high-security prison where he was held as being plagued by mosquitoes with severe humidity.’ http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/ameri...cas/
7251142.stm
The prisoners, released this week, had been convicted of participating in the 2003 Bush/Cheney regime change op. Mosquitoes. Humidity. Confined with undesirables. Compared to US standards, they seem to have been coddled.
Excuse me Watson, but there are extremely large numbers of prisons and prisoners in Cuba and if you care to do the research {very easy to do} you will be impressed at how large and thorough the state apparatus is. I was.
And about the mosquitoes: Ever heard of Dengue Fever or West Nile? I think that is what the gentleman is talking about.
Yeah, Alvarez is probably a white collar political criminal who dared to tell the wrong pal that Raul and Fidel are worse than Bush, and then he had to go live with the dregs of society and be virally played with by mosquitoes.
I'll grant you this much, he is damn lucky he isn't doing any time in the Dominican Republic. Google that while you are at it.
moonglum, whatever in the world are you referring to?
Unusual & great post on post revolution Cuba - even with the predictable whining about Fidel that follow. Liberal exceptionalists like to do that, which is laughable considering the U.S.A., from the Cuban perspective, has always sought to shove its one party corporate brand of democracy down its throat. And return the freedom to live in squalor and indignity to that island in paradise.
While we’re googling, we’ll find numerous allegations of the US using dengue in bio-warfare against Cuba.
The Dominican Republic is in the capitalist camp. Uncle Sam made sure of that back in 1965.
Speaking of prisons in Cuba, I haven’t seen an allegation of prisoner mistreatment that matches what’s being done in our name at Guantanamo.
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