HaloScan.com - Comments

Feeding the Revolution, one cellphone camera at a time. I really do wonder how much longer this BS is going to continue.
I can see for myself | 11.16.06 - 1:28 pm | #

There is NO EXCUSE for tazering that kid.
WTF is wrong with us?
Anonymous | 11.16.06 - 1:34 pm | #

Power corrupts...
danno | 11.16.06 - 1:35 pm | #

That ain't Freedom
That ain't Liberty
That's Nazi
That's For Sure | 11.16.06 - 1:35 pm | #

Using tasers to herd students. After all the data we have showing that tasers can cause serious injury and death. Hm. Sounds criminal to me.

Did you catch the cop at the very end telling the student that he would be tasered, too, if he didn't move back. This after the original "suspect" was already removed. At the very least that cop ought to be fired and brought up on charges for terroristic threats. Goose and gander.
Jeff Boatright | 11.16.06 - 1:36 pm | #

Time for another L.A. riot.
politis | 11.16.06 - 1:37 pm | #

That is a lot of witnesses for that lawsuit.
ashton | 11.16.06 - 1:37 pm | #

That was very disturbing.
Who is John Galt? | 11.16.06 - 1:37 pm | #

yeah Jeff I heard that too and thought wtf country are we in??? Bush has RUINED America, maybe it is time to move to Canada
ellie2 | 11.16.06 - 1:38 pm | #

"Torture in the name of the free, more misery for you and me..."

from "Judgement Day"
copyright 2005 Wackiavelli
Wackiavelli.com
Wackiavelli | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 1:38 pm | #

semper brutas
Samson- | 11.16.06 - 1:38 pm | #

What a bunch of loser assholes those cops are.
Like that kid was even remotely a threat.
The college keystone cops should spend AT LEAST a night in jail themselves, and also should lose their jobs.
Fucking losers.
Pete | 11.16.06 - 1:38 pm | #

[Deleted. Flame bait. Consult the commenting policy if you wish to contribute]

Edited By Siteowner
Justice | 11.16.06 - 1:39 pm | #

Did it ever occur to the policemen, having tasered the kid a half dozen times, that he might not have been able to get up? Duh...unless they were on some power trip.

Overall, excessive force from what I could see. Can't they just cuff the guy and carry him out?
Jesse James | 11.16.06 - 1:41 pm | #

That was truly upsetting.

Kerrik and Guilliani must be proud...and richer.
ezpz | 11.16.06 - 1:41 pm | #

Why use tasers? There's an overemphasis on "new and improved" now days.

Whatever happened to the cattle-prod?
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 1:41 pm | #

"That moron guy deserved every bit of the Taser!"

I would imagine a jury will decide that once and for all. Perhaps you can donate to the "officers" defense fund. Should they have been able to open fire had they not had tasers? Spread your wisdom.
ashton | 11.16.06 - 1:42 pm | #

Nice try troll.

I smell at least a civil lawsuit. That was sickening and depraved. His screams of agony chilled my blood. Was that really shot in America? (rhetorical)
John Griffith | 11.16.06 - 1:42 pm | #

one wonders how a ucla computer to the back of the head stacks up against a taser
Anonymous | 11.16.06 - 1:42 pm | #

Jesse James | 11.16.06 - 1:41 pm | #

I was thinking the same thing. They taser him a few times and then demand that he stand up???!!! Then they taser him some more for NOT standing up??? Ugh!!!
ezpz | 11.16.06 - 1:43 pm | #

Two quotes:
"Get up or you'll get tazed again."
and at the end to another person.
"Get back or you'll get tazed too."

They were in no danger from this guy-especially after he was handcuffed. Zapping him to get him to comply with orders is torture-pure and simple.
rkh | 11.16.06 - 1:43 pm | #

"Did it ever occur to the policemen, having tasered the kid a half dozen times, that he might not have been able to get up? Duh...unless they were on some power trip."

Considering that the point of a taser is to render the victim unable to move, it probably should have crossed their mind.
ashton | 11.16.06 - 1:43 pm | #

UCLA top cops:
Chief of Police, Karl T. Ross 310 825-1633 kross@ucpd.ucla.edu
Captain, John Adams 310 825-4406 adamsj@ucpd.ucla.edu
Mike | 11.16.06 - 1:43 pm | #

"People decry the police when this type of stuff happens but when you really need the police you become very thankful."

WTF, and what's your point? Are you saying we should close our eyes to police brutality because we might need them someday??
Who is John Galt? | 11.16.06 - 1:44 pm | #

Stand up? While they're tasing him-what assholes.

I hope they are arrested and tried for assault and battery. And fired.
miss_kitty | 11.16.06 - 1:44 pm | #

"Justice" (yeah right), please explain your "logic" as to why this guy should be tasered for being in the library without his ID?
Jak Crow | 11.16.06 - 1:44 pm | #

Heads should roll at the LAPD for this Bull S***! This was totally uncalled for! I hope that student sues the hell out of the LAPD.
TruthSeeker | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 1:45 pm | #

That actually made me cry. what the hell is wrong with our country? What happened? Or am I just waking up to the way things have always been?
Liberal Girl | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 1:45 pm | #

Let's hope that this student isn't declared an enemy combatant and disappeared by these Gestapo.
ezpz | 11.16.06 - 1:46 pm | #

it takes brave men to taser an unarmed
kid in a college library....

Such brave men should be serving in Iraq.
Big E | 11.16.06 - 1:47 pm | #

The cops should be immediately fired, and then brought up on charges (legal not electrical).

If the student did anything wrong it can be handled seperatly.
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 1:47 pm | #

These pigs should get tased themselves. Protect and serve, my ass.
pawlr | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 1:47 pm | #

What a peice of shit country you live in ... jeezus.
earl | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 1:47 pm | #

University Police are one step removed from security guards, only worse. They can't make it onto a real police force so they become a university cop. These guys are fairly representative of the "cops" at our local university.
Gregory | 11.16.06 - 1:48 pm | #

I feel absolutly fucking SICK watching this. I hope this makes it to every news outlet.
madcowdungbeetle | 11.16.06 - 1:49 pm | #

To be fair to the police, we don't know exactly what happened before the video was taken. There may be a context missing that would alter our perceptions. That being said, it seems that the University Police overreacted and exacerbated the matter. I'm not familiar with their policy, but it seems counter intuitive to repeadedly taser someone curled up on the ground. As was mentioned, there are many first hand witnesses to this event, so it shouldn't be difficult to find out exactly what happened and who is to blame. That's my two cents.
Oatmeal Batman | 11.16.06 - 1:49 pm | #

Sh!T is coming down in this country. I am 51 years old and I am so angry at what is happening throughout this nation.

We are in a Civil War now. There might not be Blue & Gray armies however, there are sides on this war.

Always carry a video device....always vote for "True" Freedom. The Democrats are not perfect but, They will stand up to this BullSh!t.

I don't care if this kid was or wasn't a student. This was a gross abuse of power.

Alot of these so called police are ex military. They have no people skills what so ever. No training in this regard.

Time to take a stand...
Old Dood | 11.16.06 - 1:49 pm | #

ASSULT WITH A DEADLY WEAPON

Tasers have killed at least 167 people since 1999. Here they are:

http://www.azcentral.com/special...rlist24- ON.html
KEVIN SCHMIDT, STERLING VA | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 1:50 pm | #

Also, anyone who has ever been hit with tazer (a REAL tazer), especially multiple times, know's you don't just get right up.
madcowdungbeetle | 11.16.06 - 1:50 pm | #

"These pigs should get tased themselves. Protect and serve, my ass."
pawlr | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 1:47 pm

Over and over again, while they're trying to comply. Most cops get tased once, but not while they're being yelled at and dragged around by strangers from the Gestapo...
miss_kitty | 11.16.06 - 1:51 pm | #

The police are claiming that he invited nearby students to join in his resistance. Did I miss that part?
ashton | 11.16.06 - 1:52 pm | #

"Any time the authorities start ignoring procedure because of what someone said"

Please cite the procedure of which you speak. Be specific.
ashton | 11.16.06 - 1:53 pm | #

For those of you in LA:

PROTEST POLICE BRUTALITY AT KERCKHOFF STEPS
No Taser Guns PLEASE!

Date: Friday, November 17, 2006
Time: 12:00pm - 1:00pm
Venue: UCLA Kerckhoff Steps on BruinWalk
308 Westwood Plaza
Los Angeles, CA
lauren | 11.16.06 - 1:53 pm | #

Freedom is on the march! And it looks remarkably like a goose-step.
Loonie | 11.16.06 - 1:53 pm | #

KEVIN SCHMIDT, STERLING VA | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 1:50 pm | #

Thank you for that link. And these are the ones that we KNOW about. I wonder how many more there are where the cause of death was fudged...
ezpz | 11.16.06 - 1:53 pm | #

Two words:

Kent State

How far are we from this happening again?
ShelaghC | 11.16.06 - 1:53 pm | #

Tasers should be taken out of the UC security officers hands... simple as that. Until that happens the top brass at UCLA should have their collective ass held to the fire.
No Tasers on Campus | 11.16.06 - 1:54 pm | #

Flashback 8/06: If they'll shoot an atorney...
...what chance does this guy have?
http://www.miami.com/mld/miamihe...ws/ 15228898.htm
*even on video

Fat Boy Slim | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 1:55 pm | #

That's how these tiny-dicked jack-booted fascist numbskulls get their rocks off. They're too painfully misogynistic to attract real women. So, in a pathetic act of overcompensation for obvious inadequacy in all of life, they taze the hell out of an unarmed student who is well within his rights not to obey these a$$holes. I hope this kid's family comes to own a nice little chunck of UCLA after the bodacious lawsuit. This is madness that will only end when somebody has to give up enough bank to see the stupidity of his idiot ways. As part two of the punitive action, I say we deploy these malicious LAPD rejects to Iraq, armed with only a tazer. What a bunch of vicious morons!
anan nimus | 11.16.06 - 1:55 pm | #

"To be fair to the police, we don't know exactly what happened before the video was taken..."
Oatmeal Batman | 11.16.06 - 1:49 pm

Whatever it was (not leaving the library immediately)-it did NOT require what they did to this guy. They wanted to tase him into compliance, and that's not possible when compliance="Stand Up!"
miss_kitty | 11.16.06 - 1:55 pm | #

Mortifying. In an institution of Higher Learning, where that kid is paying tons of money to be there.

Sick animals with badges, taking pleasure in every opportunity to torture and make mayhem, everyone of their hapless victims a "terrorist" in their eyes.

Stop and look upon the monstrosity we have become. I hope that kid gets paid so much in the lawsuit he can retire at 21.
sabot | 11.16.06 - 1:55 pm | #

WTF,

He was handcuffed and on the floor, but instead of carrying/dragging him out, the cops tried to humiliate him by making him stand up and walk out. Either, A, he couldn't, or B, he wouldn't. Either way, tasering him after he was in custody is abuse. I saw at least four officers who were there for the entire episode. Those guys should at least lose their jobs.
Original Bill | 11.16.06 - 1:55 pm | #

Get used to it, New World Order you know.

First they came for the....
Then they came for...
Hawk | 11.16.06 - 1:55 pm | #

Those cops are the worse of low grade morons. Who the hell did their training?

Cops use tasers to REMOVE muscular control. You CAN'T stand up after such a shock to the system. That the whole DAMN point.

Even if the cops were to pick him up and put him on his feet, he'd probably collapse like a bunch of broccoli.

I smell class action suit here. All the witnesses in the library could claim psychological damage, and those the cops threatened could sue additionally for assault.

That University better hire a good lawyer, because any jury would watch that tape and pay through the nose. Particularly if this was a student, not someone who wandered off the street.
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 1:56 pm | #

2 'tt's I know!

Welcome to the Police State:
http://www.spikedhumor.com/ artic...lice_State.html

Fat Boy Slim | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 1:56 pm | #

UCLA Campus Police...310 825-1491
Dean of Students310 825-3871

Dean is Mr.Naples

Watch Commander is Sgt. Nicks
bang | 11.16.06 - 1:56 pm | #

What a peice of shit country you live in ... jeezus.
earl | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 1:47 pm | #

Sorry folks, I was listening to that kid screaming while i typed that ...
that could've been anybody's kid.
earl | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 1:57 pm | #

I am so glad we are safe in our libraries - just follow orders and you will not be harmed. Those who cannot keep up will be shot, as incentive for others. Order will be maintained at all costs.

Seriously, I am so glad that we have started to put an end to this crap (I hope), but when do the grownups take over?
jarotra | 11.16.06 - 1:57 pm | #

"...I'm not a rent-a cop..."
common sense | 11.16.06 - 1:52 pm

Really? You certainly have the mentality of one. Perhaps you should look at a new and exciting career path...
miss_kitty | 11.16.06 - 1:58 pm | #

"To be fair to the police, we don't know exactly what happened before the video was taken..."
Oatmeal Batman | 11.16.06 - 1:49 pm"

This is true but when I last checked police carried handcuffs to deal with people should they become difficult. They could have simply handcuffed him and led him out had they felt that there was a problem.
ashton | 11.16.06 - 1:58 pm | #

The students should have fought back. I would have been busting heads.
HUH? | 11.16.06 - 1:58 pm | #

"Tasers have killed at least 167 people since 1999" So! The US population at last count is 300 million. Better yet, perhaps, we need to disband the police so we can keep people happy. So, when some criminal is robbing you...there will be no one to call. Carry your own taser or better yet a firearm.
Kyle | 11.16.06 - 1:59 pm | #

getting tasered renders one immobile, then you're ordered to stand up or get tasered again, makes a lot of sense . . .in China
common sense isn't common | 11.16.06 - 1:59 pm | #

The students just stood there in their sheeple way. Ever seen a video of the African savannah? The lions only take one at a time...
King of Kings | 11.16.06 - 1:59 pm | #

ucla is a public university...therefore the library and other facilities are open to the public at large

when did one have to start showing id to use the library?
Uncle Joe McCarthy | 11.16.06 - 2:01 pm | #

at first i thought this was just a clear case of police abusing their power. i thought the student was being a little melodramatic decrying "here's your patriot act!" not that i'm a fan of the patriot act and not that he's not entitled to a little melodrama after being tased. but then i read that student's name in the ucla newspaper: mostafa tabatabainejad. would he have been treated the same if his name had been mike smith?
apreacher | 11.16.06 - 2:02 pm | #

You know, if the government just installed remote control devices in all our heads, this kind of thing wouldn't happen.
Clavis | 11.16.06 - 2:02 pm | #

Uncle Joe McCarthy | 11.16.06 - 2:01 pm | #

"911 changed everything"

How convenient for a young dicktatorship!
ezpz | 11.16.06 - 2:03 pm | #

Again with the false dilemma. These conservative "cop supporters," merely provide the proof to Hitler's statement in Mein Kamp, that his officials could beat up on people in the streets, and the others will simply walk on by or watch it like it was entertainment.

The other students fighting are more American than these conservative Nazi-lite.
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 2:03 pm | #

At the very end - after the student has been removed from the building you can actually hear the cops say to another student, "step back or you're going to get tasered too." Amazing.

My wife works at UCLA, I'm going to find out what they are saying about this
da | 11.16.06 - 2:04 pm | #

apreacher | 11.16.06 - 2:02 pm | #

Hmmmm.....Interesting
ezpz | 11.16.06 - 2:05 pm | #

just stop these people who seem
to know no bounds. this is truly
disgusting, they need to be stopped
bugsy | 11.16.06 - 2:07 pm | #

There will come a time when people will have had enough of this police corruption and abuse...

and shoot back.
Controlled Demolition | 11.16.06 - 2:08 pm | #

The purpose of the Taser is to provide a non-lethal method to prevent an attack against the officer.

This was a clearly illegal act. The suspect was on the ground. Despite the fact that he was not cooperating with the officers, he was not threatening or attacking them. The officers repeatedly Tased him anyway.

These officers should be prosecuted for assault & battery.
.
Jaycubed | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 2:08 pm | #

Kyle,

If tasers have been shown to kill, as they have, then the user must balance risk to benefit and consider alternatives.

I wonder if you understand that for your analysis to hold any weight, all 300 million Americans would have had to have been tasered.

Something tells me you don't understand that.

Along with many other things.
Jeff Boatright | 11.16.06 - 2:09 pm | #

"And having been tazed myself, I'd much rather they taze him than hit him."

I hadn't thought of the brain damage that could occur. Thank you for pointing that out so well.
ashton | 11.16.06 - 2:09 pm | #

Maybe someone can post a link to UCLA head offices, so we can express outrage at this incident.

If the MSM can ignore the arrest of the Faux anthrax terrorist, they'll ignore this too.

We've all been guilty of using hyperbole and maybe overusing the fascist moniker, but if it doesn't fit here where would it fit?
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 2:09 pm | #

Anonymous | 11.16.06 - 2:08 pm | #

Maybe you'll have your chance to do that trick - stand up after being tased several times.
ezpz | 11.16.06 - 2:10 pm | #

Time to cut off donations to the UCLA Alumni fund. Hit 'em back where it hurts.
Anonymous | 11.16.06 - 2:10 pm | #

Tasers have been also known to cause heart attacks. They're not foolproof. Additionally, there was no cause to even hit the student unless he struck at them first, and such was not the case.
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 2:11 pm | #

Not to mention the guy keeping yelling "I'm not resisting, I....WILL....LEAVE".
*sarcasm* I am so glad that their are hard-line cops like these men to keep the drug-totting, very violent students at UCLA in order. *sarcasm*

And Thank you Mr. Uncle Joe McCarthy for asking that question. I am not a student at Christopher Newport University here in Virginia, but I have never been ID'ed before. Thats like having to show you ID before you can eat at their cafeteria.

I just reliefed that the guy beening tasered wasn't black.
Angry Black Man | 11.16.06 - 2:11 pm | #

What stereotypical college students. Get a freaking clue. He got what he deserved. Any time the authorities start ignoring procedure because of what someone said ("I said I was going to leave"), they're compromising the situation and putting people at risk. I'm not a rent-a cop, but if I walked up and told that dude to get out, and he wanted to pretend he was gonna do it on his own sweet time, I'd kick his ass all the way out the door too.
common sense | 11.16.06 - 1:52 pm | #
??????????????????????????????????????????????????

Puting other students at risk if they don´t taser this poor kid?

Man, you´re so full of shit!

This was just a kid believing that he lives in the "home of the brave & the land of the free" country and that nothing could happen to him if he hadn´t done anything wrong.

Afterwords he was just like a scared woonded animal - and these assholes wanted him to react like a fucking machine he never had a chance to become yet.

Looks like America won´t do without another sixties like movement.

Glad I live in a country with real freedom and not the freedom of cops to taser student kids!
gladnottobeamerican! | 11.16.06 - 2:11 pm | #

Get over it! This guy was sooo melodramatic. He cries out about the Patriotic Act. Makes you wonder if this was done to get attention. I agree. Lets get rid of cops, all together. Let citizens arm and protect themselves. Who needs cops! When my trusty .357 can handle the job. Enjoy this cruel world.
Zapper | 11.16.06 - 2:12 pm | #

i don't think the issue is that they were checking for student IDs, that's an understandable precaution that they only do after 11pm for the safety of the students. the issue is that a kid by the name of mostafa was leaving the library but apparently not quickly enough for the campus police. the issue is that this culture of terror has made it justifiable in the minds of those police officers to taser an iranian student multiple times for simply not leaving in a prompt manner.
apreacher | 11.16.06 - 2:12 pm | #

I just reliefed that the guy beening tasered wasn't black.
Angry Black Man | 11.16.06 - 2:11 pm | #

Based on his name, it is unclear what he background is.
ashton | 11.16.06 - 2:12 pm | #

That is just sick,a sign of what the times have become,i pray to god,the democrats clean this crap up,and I hope the rent a cops are fired.
Texasdemo | 11.16.06 - 2:12 pm | #

Angry Black Man | 11.16.06 - 2:11 pm | #

No, but it seems he was brown.
ezpz | 11.16.06 - 2:13 pm | #

Anonymous Asshat,

Have you asked yourself why they tased him?

Apparently they wanted him to stand up. Apparently they tased this person because they wanted him to stand up and he did not stand up. So they tased him. Over and over and over.

Try, try really hard, to think about what actually happened.
Jeff Boatright | 11.16.06 - 2:13 pm | #

"Makes you wonder if this was done to get attention"

You know, I drew the same conclusion from your post.
ashton | 11.16.06 - 2:13 pm | #

The students just stood there in their sheeple way.

King of Kings | 11.16.06 - 1:59 pm

They were yelling at a couple of armed cops to stop? What would you have done, Lord Jesus?
dhimmi | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 2:15 pm | #

Apparently, a student answers the phone at the Dean's office. The Police Captain's office sends you to Public Affairs to leave a message.
bamage | 11.16.06 - 2:15 pm | #

The student's name is Mostafa Tabatabainejad. (http://theamericanmuslim.org/tam.php/features/ articles/ call_for_probe_of_ucla_muslim_student_taser_incide nt/0011752)

He's Muslim.

Hmmmmm... How interesting.
erasmattack! | 11.16.06 - 2:15 pm | #

i just read the daily bruin article about the incident...one of the individuals who witnessed the event was an alumnus...i was right, you dont have to be a student to use the library for research...now one may need to get a pass, but i have been on the campus and have used the library without a pass, and without incident

if the rules have changed in the wake of 9/11 that is one thing...but i dont think that included using a taser for a non combative individual

no hearing...no trial...these cops need to be terminated and the student needs to file a suit against the university, the uc system and gov grabinator
Uncle Joe McCarthy | 11.16.06 - 2:15 pm | #

Once tasered a person can't stand. The cops know this. They get trained to use tasers.

The cops tortured him with a taser him for fun.
Weaseldog | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 2:16 pm | #

I like how the freeper creepers pop in to troll as if that's going to change anyone's mind and we shouldn't think the kid has RIGHTS in america. The kid was 100% right, power isn't a cudgel to be wielded, it's a responsibility to respect others rights. I hope these fool cops face justice for not knowing how to behave responsibly with power.
wondersnevercease | 11.16.06 - 2:16 pm | #

http://www.ucpd.ucla.edu/ucpd/co...pd/ contact.html
Daithí | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 2:16 pm | #

The Rentacops must go to jail.
HUH? | 11.16.06 - 2:17 pm | #

Heil Bush !!!!
Chuck | 11.16.06 - 2:17 pm | #

What an embarrassing event for the old alma Mater.
lost_nacf_gop | 11.16.06 - 2:17 pm | #

There is NO EXCUSE for tazering that kid.
WTF is wrong with us?
- - - - - - - - - - - -

Oh bullshit.

To quote Chris Rock: "There's a reason to kick an old man down a flight of stairs. Ya just don't do it."

If the kid was being belligerant to the cops, then the cops are justified in retaliation, they used non lethal means and they told the kid what was going to happen if he didn't comply with them.

I think they went a little taser happy, yeah and they should be reprimanded for that, but they were justified in tasing him at least the first time.

Since we don't know what happened BEFORE the video was shot it's hard to say what was going on. So don't just assume that the cops were being assholes. Yeah that does happen and when it does you need to stomp the assholes down hard - legally -. But if you're a cop and you've got some punk asshole telling you to go fuck yourself when you tell him he needs to leave you're not going to just stand there and take it either.

Your job as a police officer is to protect the public trust and uphold th e law. This includes protecting the public from authorized intruders ( which is what this kid was if he didn't have an ID and that was the law/rule for the building ).
E in MD | 11.16.06 - 2:18 pm | #

Geeze, the lizard brains have really come out from under their rocks.

Zapper, as with nearly everything in life, this is not an absolute either-or situation. What are you, four years old? The police had a lot of options here. They chose a very bad one. They performed their duties poorly. Now, does this mean we should get rid of all cops? Is anyone except you and the other Darryl Dumshits saying that? No.

Please, crawl back under your rocks, guys. You've somehow wandered into the adult section of the library and we have cops who'll taser your little asses back to the kiddie section if you don't leave pronto.

.
Jeff Boatright | 11.16.06 - 2:18 pm | #

Kyle

There is a huge difference between someone committing a violent crime, such as robbery, and showing a nonviolent resist to arrest. I would have resisted arrest to. If he was tasered only once, then the cops would have been right.

However, after being tasered and Handicuffed, the police felt that it was necessary to taser him over and over again (I counted 4 times).

And the cops can't use the excuse that they didn't know the the taser gun immobilizes you, because in training, they get tasered to show the cause and effects of if.
Angry Black Man | 11.16.06 - 2:18 pm | #

"They asked him to stand up like 10 times. He deserved it. Doesn't matter who the fuck he is, the cops are doing their jobs. If you fucking listen to tme then I doubt you get tazed. And having been tazed myself, I'd much rather they taze him than hit him."

So high-voltage, sometimes-lethal electric shock is an appropriate tool to ensure compliance with police instructions?

Since I can't comment on the "doing their jobs" bit without invoking Godwin's Law I'll just stop there.
rkh | 11.16.06 - 2:19 pm | #

I had a hard time seeing what was actually happening on that video but the sound was perfect. One thing that came over loud and clear was the request for compliance and specific warnings given for non-compliance.

Was it abuse, maybe, after the second taser probably. But why the hell did the kid not comply with the request to step outside when first asked and thereby avoid the consequences?
aquarius2 | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 2:19 pm | #

When they're in the main hall it looks like there are about five cops. All that for one kid using a computer without proper ID? Jesus, if you smack a vending machine that ate your dollar on that campus what do they do, shoot you? Those cops were way out of line and stupid (or just plain sadistic). They keep telling him to get up after they've shot jolts of electricity through his body. How's he supposed to comply? There's so much rotten stuff going out there that this is obviously trivial by comparison, but in miniature it's emblematic of how uniforms + small brains = abuse of power. I hope those cops' badge numbers were taken down.
Bob Fingerman | 11.16.06 - 2:20 pm | #

Don't do what an authorative figure says and they electricute you until you comply. That sounds a lot like torture to me.
jfbguy | 11.16.06 - 2:20 pm | #

Those kids should have piled onto those cops ant beaten the living shit out of them. I would have. fucking dicks.
President PNACcio | 11.16.06 - 2:20 pm | #

I have never seen a situation in a library that a librarian couldn't handle. I have seen ejections of semi-unruly homeless people by small women without a posse and without tasers. Just using a firm tone and an appeal to civility. Maybe it's time to turn things over to the professionals.

Does anyone see the parallel to our Iraq adventure? Security checks produced an unsatisfactory result. The perp could not prove that he was harmless. The strict letter of the law allowed for sanctions. We had the ability to use force for compliance, so instead of waiting around for further resistance to build, we used force. The excessive use of force did create the "situation" of disruption we had feared, therefore more force was required. A situation that required more force and more threats. Otherwise chaos might ensue. And on and on and on.

So now the library is secured, and the people are able to go on with their lives. And they understand failure to follow orders has consequences. Hopefully we will be able to remove armed personnel from the library some day and leave things to the librarians.
jarotra | 11.16.06 - 2:20 pm | #

apreacher | 11.16.06 - 2:02 pm

the plot thickens..
"oh its just another sand negro.. Tase him again Bubba!"

These chickenshit asshole rentacops should be fired and charged with a crime. But that won't happen. Do you think ANY cop likes arresting another cop, even rentacops for abusive actions? Hell no. In a just world, those students would have stood up to the cops, but it's just america- sit back and watch your freedoms being stolen by the fascists, your tax money being funnelled to corporations and the underpriveleged being kicked to the curb so that some rich asshole who inherited all his money from his daddy's daddy can afford to have two illegal immigrant gardeners..
Fade | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 2:20 pm | #

OMFG. People die from being tasered. This was so traumitizing to watch that I feel like I will throw up. Was this student African American?

Stand up? How could he stand up? He was incapacitated. This is horrifying.

These security officers are the types they recruit to work in Abu Graib and Guantanamo Bay. America is ugly in it's core. Brutal, violent thugs and sheeple, that's us.
Charles Granger 101 | 11.16.06 - 2:20 pm | #

Beyond just tasering the kid over and over because its fun, it also sends a message to the other students, that they can do the same to anyone they want.

They sent a message that they can torture anyone on campus for fun, anytime anywhere.

They want the students to fear and hate them.
Weaseldog | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 2:21 pm | #

E in Maryland

So you have to show ID in order to go into a library? What part of the US of A do you live in? China?
Angry Black Man | 11.16.06 - 2:21 pm | #

I just sent the links for this to Huffington Post and Michael Moore, and posted them to my blog and a progressive message board I'm on.
ShelaghC | 11.16.06 - 2:22 pm | #

common sense | 11.16.06 - 1:52 pm | #

"I'm not a rent-a cop"

From your guilty-until-proven-otherwise attitude, and your love of "procedure", I'm surprised you're not a rent-a-cop. Maybe you flunked the physical.

Anyway, you and I don't know what happened either way, other than that someone got tasered 4-5 times for being in a library without student ID.

I suppose you thing the SOB was lucky he wasn't shot. At Kent State, that was the "procedure" used on unarmed students peaceably exercising their First Amendment rights.
Annoyed Canuck | 11.16.06 - 2:22 pm | #

To all the police involved, Goddamn you all.

Yes folks, here is your fucking Patriot Act at work.

Thanks W!
Robert | 11.16.06 - 2:22 pm | #

E in MD stated:

"the cops are justified in retaliation"

And another lizard brain checks in.

E, you are truly, deeply, profoundly stupid. Please turn off mommy's computer and go outside and play. In traffic.

Police are not allowed to "retaliate", you idiot. It's not their job AND it's illegal.

Christahmighty you trolls are stupid. Do you even understand the definitions of the words you use?

.
Jeff Boatright | 11.16.06 - 2:23 pm | #

I wonder if the fact that the kid's Middle Eastern had anything to do with the excessive use of violence?
erasmattack! | 11.16.06 - 2:23 pm | #

You people make make it sound as though he was waterboarded. Dollars to doughnuts he won't forget his Bruin card again, either.
North Bay | 11.16.06 - 2:24 pm | #

Every cops a criminal
Mick Jagger | 11.16.06 - 2:26 pm | #

5 cops for one defiant kid? Gosh, they must have been bored?
Angry Black Man | 11.16.06 - 2:26 pm | #

This is absolutely disgusting. And what is more disgusting is all the trolls that have come to the defense of the police. We have become a very disturbing nation. And there are too many people on the left and right that have no problem with it.
navyswan | 11.16.06 - 2:26 pm | #

I need to preface my comments with the admission that I am shaking nearly uncontrollably hearing the events play out on the video. The audio in this case is chilling.

This isn't torture. It's corporal punishment being dispensed by officers of the law who had an assailant already under control if he was indeed handcuffed.

The inconvenience of officers having to subdue and carry off an assailant is mitigated by an additional charge or charges being brought against an offender resulting in additional penalties to be decided by a judge: resisting arrest and in some cases, assaulting an officer.

Instead of calmly removing the student physically from the premisis the officers taunted him [eg: "stand up or you get tasered again!". repeatedly], and then inflicted punishment. They caused a public disturbance of the worst kind - a beat down spectacle by those in power.

The infliction of punishement, whether a fist to the head, a kick to the stomach, a fire hose to peaceful protesters or tasering of a restrained individual is a crime. In this case it's a gross one.

The introduction of tasers into the police arsenal has had the horrible side effect of legalizing corporal punishment. In "less civilized" societies, a good flogging or caning is all that is required to call it even. This is just gross abuse.

If this doesn't result in a civil rights case brought against the use of tasers and police behavior it's a goddamned sin.

Anyone who reads In These Times [and you should] tasers were their cover story this month:
http://www.inthesetimes.com/site...n/article/2894/

A goddamned sin
Grasshopper | 11.16.06 - 2:26 pm | #

I was upset with what I heard but I could not really see on the video what was happening or what started this altercation. I do want to say that we need to give the police the benefit of the doubt and provide them support for what they do. They are keeping us safe.
Janet | 11.16.06 - 2:27 pm | #

ucla is a public university...therefore the library and other facilities are open to the public at large

when did one have to start showing id to use the library?
- - - - - - - -

My local community college is a 'public' university. But you can't be wandering around there without some sort of visitor tag or something either. That way we don't have unnaccounted for people wandering about.
E in MD | 11.16.06 - 2:27 pm | #

Tasers Kill?

11/01/06

"Holyfield, about 5 feet 7 inches tall and weighing 130 pounds, carried a Bible and a cordless house phone. He was described by a friend as a committed Baptist who never got into a scrap. But when police approached him, he struggled. They shot the teen twice with a Taser, according to the Jerseyville Police Department.

Holyfield died a day later.

Redditt Hudson, racial justice manager for the ACLU of Eastern Missouri and a former St. Louis police officer, believes the use of Tasers should be suspended.

"What a tragedy for a 17-year-old boy to be dead today," Hudson said. "We don't know enough about Tasers, and I think because we don't know enough about them it could give an officer a false sense that he is using something that is safer than it is."
Alma | 11.16.06 - 2:28 pm | #

Its time for folks to start finding a safe school to attend.
Weaseldog | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 2:28 pm | #

Add Keith Olbermann and Rachel Maddow from Air America to the list of those I've forwarded the info to.
ShelaghC | 11.16.06 - 2:28 pm | #

Welcome to the new and extra safe America!!!
True Patriotte | 11.16.06 - 2:29 pm | #

I've been to various Universities in Texas for different functions and have visited the libraries. I've never been asked to show ID.
Weaseldog | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 2:29 pm | #

When you are defending students without proper ID, you are allowing the terrorist to win.
Angry Black Man | 11.16.06 - 2:30 pm | #

some items from the ucpd report on the incident http://www.ucpd.ucla.edu/ucpd/zi...%2011-15- 06.pdf

"tabatebainejab encouraged library patrons to join his resistance." so he was an insurgent, now i get it!

"A Taser is used to incapacitate subjects who are resistant..." so is it common procedure to "incapacitate someone and then immediately demand they stand up.

also in their report they say he refused to leave, however the school newspaper said he was leaving the library when a police officer grabbed him by the arm and stopped him.
apreacher | 11.16.06 - 2:30 pm | #

Here is the article from the student newspaper:

Mostafa Tabatabainejad, a UCLA student, was repeatedly stunned with a Taser and then taken into custody when he did not exit the CLICC Lab in Powell Library in a timely manner. Community Service Officers had asked Tabatabainejad to leave after he failed to produce his BruinCard during a random check at around 11:30 p.m. Tuesday.

UCPD Assistant Chief of Police Jeff Young said the checks are a standard procedure in the library after 11 p.m.

"Because of the safety of the students we limit the use after 11 to just students, staff and faculty," Young said.

Young said the CSOs on duty in the library at the time went to get UCPD officers when Tabatabainejad did not immediately leave, and UCPD officers resorted to use of the Taser when Tabatabainejad did not do as he was told.

A six-minute video showed Tabatabainejad audibly screaming in pain as he was stunned several times with a Taser, each time for three to five seconds. He was told repeatedly to stand up and stop fighting, and was told that if he did not do so he would "get Tased again."

Tabatabainejad was also stunned with the Taser when he was already handcuffed, said Carlos Zaragoza, a third-year English and history student who witnessed the incident.

"(He was) no possible danger to any of the police," Zaragoza said. "(He was) getting shocked and Tasered as he was handcuffed."

But Young said at the time the police likely had no way of knowing whether the individual was armed or that he was a student.

As Tabatabainejad was being dragged through the room by two officers, he repeated in a strained scream, "I'm not fighting you" and "I said I would leave."

Here is the link to the whole article:

http://dailybruin.com/news/artic...es.asp? id=38960
Boring Scott | 11.16.06 - 2:31 pm | #

Tazer is the worst device of torture ever produced. It gives the sadists in law enforcement a way to torture people without (hopefully) killing them.
raker | 11.16.06 - 2:31 pm | #

UCLA just bought someone a huge fucking mansion.
Whiplash | 11.16.06 - 2:32 pm | #

Liberal parents should equip their children with a video camera to be carried at all times.

Seriously, video and the internet will be the downfall of the violent right-wing in this country. It's already started. And these cameras just get smaller and smaller.
DemocracyHatinGOP | 11.16.06 - 2:32 pm | #

Freedom is on the march! And it looks remarkably like a goose-step.

Thank you Loonie for that remark, it is apt!

Remember Kent State! Now George W. Bush has taken away the authority of governors relative to the National Guard, and can order them to action himself. How nice for the country, we can have guardsmen pulling Kent States at the behest of a madman intent of establishing a full-blown fascist state in this country. And, in spite of our Democratic success on November 7, the Military Commissions Act, and the Patriot Act will continue to be the law of the land as the legislature will be helpless to repeal them as Bush can simply veto any law he doesn't like. God are we in for some serious shit friends, cover your asses and watch your back. It is to the point where we seriously should consider whether we can trust our neighbors or not, as they may be our worst enemies.

The terrorists we should be fearful of are those within our own government, as they have bigger guns, are pathological sociopaths and will use them gleefully against us!
webegeek | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 2:33 pm | #

It's amazing to me how many people here are claiming to have been tasered, and can't even spell the word.

I can't be certain since I'm not a high-school drop out rent-a-cop, but I daresay once capacity to endure a taser shock may, like alcohol, be dependent on their height and weight as well.
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 2:34 pm | #

Anonymous | 11.16.06 - 2:08 pm | #

So, Anonymous -

Since you're an expert on getting tazed: after you were tazed, did you immediately jump right up on your feet?

This guy was tazed at least 4-5 times.

If I understand you correctly, the more you're tazed, the more agility and control you have over your body.

Who's the Asshat here?
Annoyed Canuck | 11.16.06 - 2:35 pm | #

I wish that everyone would agree that this is a shame. It pains me to see all of these people writing negative comments about the suffering this boy had to endure, regardless if you agree with his stance.

There is no doubt the police went to far. It seems that some people think you can either have police brutality and social intimidation, or anarchy.

I believe our country should demand better then that, conservative or liberal.
Rings | 11.16.06 - 2:36 pm | #

This is the most telling sentence in the Daily Bruin student newspaper:

"Neither the video footage nor eyewitness accounts of the events confirmed that Tabatabainejad encouraged resistance, and he repeatedly told the officers he was not fighting and would leave."

So all you pro-tortured, basement-dwelling, Walmart greetin' rejects ... STFU!
Boring Scott | 11.16.06 - 2:37 pm | #

"That way we don't have unaccounted for people wandering around about."-E in MD

Right, because people wandering about unaccounted for is so dangerous, that we need 5 cops and taser guns. I mean, who the f*ck do this wandering people think they are? Wandering around in our library doing God know what!!!

If you let people wander around unaccounted for, then the terrorist win. The next thing you know, people would want to sit in public bathroom unaccounted for, then they would wander around in our malls, and eat in our restautant without proper ID. I am so glad there are cops tasering people 4 times to show people that you can't wander around unaccounted for.
Angry Black Man | 11.16.06 - 2:37 pm | #

yeah Jeff I heard that too and thought wtf country are we in??? Bush has RUINED America, maybe it is time to move to Canada
ellie2

I disagree. running from it will only let it go further than it already has - and soon you won't be safe in Canada.
-----------
JFC, those horrible-horible blood curdling screams! This must be what torture sounds like. A sound I bet those guards have heard before.

Folks, I long ago realized that I don't fit in with conservative, liberals, greens, or libertarians. And I guess, I just don't understand something here. I couldn't have stood by and watched that. I couldn't have allowed that poor kid to be brutalized like that. I couldn't have allowed that crime to continue. If I had been there, I would probably be in jail right now for interfering or something else...(hypothetically speaking of course - for you lurking gov't officials)

So my question is this, "Is it right for liberals to stand around and watch while another is being brutally beaten? If so, then, I guess, I just don't fit in anywhere and perhaps ellie2 is correct and I should go ahead and move to Canada.
rcg | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 2:37 pm | #

Tasers aren't waterboarding, and the may be Wingnut pleasure devices, but they are intended to cause severe pain, incapacitation and can kill.

Waterboarding also cause severe pain, can incapaictate and can kill.

But one uses suffocation and the other uses electrical shocks...

How is inflicting electrical shocks over and over to a restrained victim, not torture?

Would you wingnuts that say it isn't, do it over and over to your mom or kids?
Weaseldog | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 2:37 pm | #

That is freaking sick. The "cops" should lose their jobs. But, I do agree with a previous comment...why were the rest of the people standing around like fear stricken neo-cons in a Mosque and not kicking the shit out of the "cops?"
CrunchyKnee | 11.16.06 - 2:38 pm | #

For overdue books they put pepper spray on your eye with a Q-tip.
bones | 11.16.06 - 2:38 pm | #

Judging by the middle-eastern name as well, what they rent-a-cops did might qualify as both civil rights infringment and hate crime.

Has anyone stopped to think that the student's delay in leaving may have been nothing more than saving his file and getting whatever portable storage he uses back?

When I was in college we had to surrender our identification while singing in to the computer lab, and getting the id back when we signed out.
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 2:38 pm | #

The tazer is used against dangerous criminals; not ingrated college students! I understand police is in need of self-defense against a berated, angry person like the UCLA student. But they should've just "strog-armed" the man and drag him out of the building. It was clear the kid was uncooperative at the beginning.. LAPD are getting a bit out of hand this week eh? Sounds like these cops were in a bad mood and laid it all on the student.
gowest272004 | 11.16.06 - 2:39 pm | #

OMG! Why didn't somebody call the REAL cops?
VJB | 11.16.06 - 2:40 pm | #

Janet | 11.16.06 - 2:27 pm | #

poor naive girl. You have not had time to grow up and realize that the cops are not your friends. I heard a story from a friend of mine here in Columbia where I live about a guy who was beat up by the police. He was guilty of trying to get in a bar while black. He was dragged into the street and beaten over and over. My friend was yelling, "Stop, stop!! Your going to kill him". She was arrested too for yelling at the cops to stop.

But, we "good semaritans" just shrug our shoulders and move on. Did you hear about the mentally ill person who was tortured to death in prison Abu Ghraib style?

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/11/1...r=1& oref=slogin
navyswan | 11.16.06 - 2:40 pm | #

The motherfucker who shoots me with a taser gun better go ahead and use real bullets because that fucker is a dead man.

We're at war people. Right here in our own country.

Every one of those cop assholes should spend the rest of their lives cleaning the toilets in the frat houses.
JAKE EMERSON IN AUSTIN | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 2:42 pm | #

Actually now that I think of it, the world was outraged at the image from Abu Ghraib, of a hooded robed prisoner with electrodes on his fingers. Supposedly he was wasn't shocked, but threatened with shocks. This student in the library was actually shocked and shocked repeatedly. Therefore by any standard it was torture.

The security the guards are supposed to give students is for ALL students. Additionally, rules of a college are administrative, not criminal. That would be like getting repeatedly shocked on a city bus because you had to hunt for your bus pass.
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 2:42 pm | #

WTF!!!?? They kept tasering the kid and then yelling at him to "Stand up!!"" Every one of those cops should be fucking fired!
gene214 | 11.16.06 - 2:42 pm | #

ysbaddaden

So you are compared getting shocked with x volts with a taser gun to drinking alcohol?

Wow! We have a genius on our hands!!
Angry Black Man | 11.16.06 - 2:42 pm | #

These cops are the type that make me glad that, when I was a kid, after the school bully pushed me down the stairs, I waited for him outside of his classroom and blind-sided him with a baseball bat.

After his trip to the emergency room, fvcker grew up to be the local sheriff. Just a bully with a badge and a gun. But that incident must have stuck to his ribs, because he never touched or came near ME ever again.
_____________________________________
SevenString | 11.16.06 - 2:42 pm | #

The frightening thing is the abject willingness, even eagerness, of people to accept a world in which officials in positions of power are allowed to inflict pain on people until they do what they are told.
Shock my Monkey | 11.16.06 - 2:43 pm | #

Those officers need to be arrested themselves. Tasering a guy who was simply reading a library book at a public university is beyond disgusting.

This is just barbaric.

How many more abuse stories are we going to hear/see out of Los Angeles before the FBI steps in an does something about it?
Brian in FL | 11.16.06 - 2:43 pm | #

Weaseldog

I take back my statement, it was torture. For my part, I was making a contrast between torture and corporal punishment because the act of deciding to be judge and jury in the act of dispensing such punishement is in essence, corporal punishment. Some southern states still allow teachers to strike a student for instance. As a disciplinary action though this circumstance does seem to fit the definition of torture.

From Oxford Dictionary:

torture |?tôr ch ?r| noun. the action or practice of inflicting severe pain on someone as a punishment or to force them to do or say something, or for the pleasure of the person inflicting the pain.

It was torture.
Grasshopper | 11.16.06 - 2:44 pm | #

Every one of those cop assholes should spend the rest of their lives cleaning the toilets in the frat houses.
JAKE EMERSON IN AUSTIN | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 2:42 pm | #

After a kegger.
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 2:44 pm | #

Here's a statement from the university president:

http://newsroom.ucla.edu/page.as...asp? RelNum=7513
JAKE EMERSON IN AUSTIN | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 2:44 pm | #

What about all of those kids standing around. It's about time that we start standing up to this kind of brutality, and taking video with your camera phone is only the beginning. That large room full of people could have charged the cops to end this inhumane treatment of their fellow student. Standing around and watching is no longer an acceptable stance to take while posting your video on YouTube. Sure, YouTube has been a great democratizing force in exposing police brutality and general abuses of power, but now it's time we rise up and take action when we see it with our own eyes!
Justin | 11.16.06 - 2:45 pm | #

Tasering a guy who was simply reading a library book at a public university is beyond disgusting.

Seems to me like a library would be their ideal target. These thugs see someone on a path to a better life through education, and it enrages them.

Stupid hates smart.
___________________________________
SevenString | 11.16.06 - 2:46 pm | #

Those fucking cops. Those students should have jumped their fascist asses and used their own tasers on them.
jimbo92107 | 11.16.06 - 2:47 pm | #

Grasshopper:

These events play havoc with emotional and reasoning. It takes time process everything.

One instance of tasering could be construed as corporal punishment. I would call it harsh and unnecesary. Even so, the police do not have the right to mete out punishment.

But yeah, tasering him over and over after he was in handcuffs, thats way over the line.
Weaseldog | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 2:48 pm | #

WILL all these macho assholes talking about charging the cops just STFU? Everyone is acting like it is the easiest thing in the world to imagine attacking two enraged, armed cops obviously unafraid of inflicting harm.

This is just BULLSHIT.
dhimmi | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 2:48 pm | #

There was somebody up above aged 51 who got thoroughly disturbed by this. I am 62 and one of my kids nearly went to UCLA. Watching this, I was ready to jump the campus cops and bite off ears, noses, or anything handy near and dear to them. Tasers be damned! These are kids! Yes, I know this is Cal, and heavy-handed police actions are to be expected. I suppose we should be thankful the poor kid didn't end up with a hundred bullet holes in him and buried in a dam. What has happened to America?
VJB | 11.16.06 - 2:48 pm | #

Shock my Monkey | 11.16.06 - 2:43 pm | #

There was a case back in the 1960's where a researcher convinced teachers to shock students of increasing intensity everytime they got a wrong answer. But the students were in on it, and faked screams and all sort of agony. The researcher was found liable for the teachers' psychotherapy. The researchers conclusion was that the average person is conditioned by our educational system to want to please authorities, even to torture.

Unfortunately, I always forget the researchers name, but he did die recently.
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 2:48 pm | #

Yes, fucking disgusting... If that kid was ligitimately a student, ID present, or not, then that was an abuse of authority... A pointless and unneccessary abuse! Sue the motherfuckers in uniform, sue the university, sue the entity that these 'campus cops' works for if its a third party private firm... Spam this utube to every congressional rep possible. Shame that university into responding properly to this ridiculous criminal behavior by brainless automatons working under color of authority. Firing those two morons asses should be step one!

I'm sick of this shit...Every five fucking minutes it seems some other scandal involving a cop of some kind in California and an obvious overreach and abuse of authority. Where the hell do these people get off thinking this is the way law enforcement is suppose to work.. And some dumbasses wonder why a lot of people don't trust cops in California anymore...

Every fjitagate, every Rodney King beating, every woman killed by a cop because they thought a potato peeler was more dangerous than their service weapon... And now campus cops throwing their weight around needlessly. And that isn't even the tip of the iceberg of police abuse of power in this state... This shit just goes on and on... Every damned day it seems...Something new and disgusting involving a cop screwing up and someone up the food chain trying to defend or minimize it...

IF law enforcement wants to the public to try and understand their perspective and have some sympathy for the tough jobs they do everyday, (and I know they do a tough job everyday with gangbanging and all other manner or crime) they totally undermine that position with the so-called blue shield of silence and the seemingly never ending cycle of beatdowns or questionable shootings that after a spell in the news all too often gets swept under the rug if its at all feasible to do and get away with ....

Hey, my understanding is, the deal is, you law enforcement men and women, are afforded a huge degree of leverage and power in this society as a cop under the premise that you people will hold yourselves to a higher standard of behavior then the frikkin bad guys you are trying to bust... This kind of shit makes you all look as bad as those bad guys you chase....

Look cops, as long as you refuse to clean your own house and reform your teaching methods, as long as you allow bad actors to infest law enforcement while you 'good' cops continue to look the other way or go along to get along, or otherwise ignore this festering desease in your midst, people are going to continue seeing you men and women in uniform with increasing skepicism and anger. Over time this is contributing to the destabilization of society... Not a fucking smart move, ya know...

WAKE UP top cops... Reform of your occupation is apparently badly badly needed....The current circumstance is breeding situations like we just witnessed on that utube and encourages idiots like the two working at security for UCLA to get jobs in law and security...

Personally, I blame too clever by half conservatives pols who like to talk tough on crime and come up with all manner of draconian measures to get votes from fearful constituents. Measures that usually don't even pass constitutional muster for one reason or another and ultimately end up in court and can't even be enforced... These types like to talk a tough on crime game while all too often working at the same time on gutting programs proven to actually reduce crime over time for some sort of phony feel good quick fix that can't and doesn't work in the real world...

All that kind of shit just encourages the type of mindset that leads to the abusive shit just like this college situation which could have been handled even with directed authority so much better.. But that can't happen in a climate that ends up with ego maniacs who as in this case probably knows full well that the guy they just tasered multiple times inside a 10 minute period is completely incapable of standing at that point...Fucking assholes with badges is how all that ends up looking to regular citizens....

REFORM!!! REFORM law enforcement practices and teaching methods before its too damned late........JD
Jack Damage | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 2:49 pm | #

I know this is Cal, and heavy-handed police actions are to be expected. I suppose we should be thankful the poor kid didn't end up with a hundred bullet holes in him and buried in a dam. What has happened to America?
VJB | 11.16.06 - 2:48 pm | #

Your in Bush country.
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 2:49 pm | #

SevenString, neocons hate intellectuals. They call them "elitists". Why do you think they hate University professors so much? They know that an intelligent person is the most dangerous obstacle in their way to power. They need the masses to be easily fooled.
Jason | 11.16.06 - 2:49 pm | #

Anyone still think this fawscist terrorist State isn't abjectly evil?

These GOD DAMNED F**KING TERRORIST PILES OF CHRISTIAN SH*T!

[deleted--do not advocate violence on this site]

Edited By Siteowner
Fredric L. Rice | 11.16.06 - 2:50 pm | #

That is the most disturbing thing I've seen in weeks. I consider myself pretty jaded, but god damn. They kept yelling "GET UP STAND UP". When he didn't they taser him again. By my count they did it about six times. It's a wonder they weren't carrying him out on a stretcher. Those things can kill.
RayCeeYa | 11.16.06 - 2:50 pm | #

This is really sad that they would use this type of force for something so menial.
Someone posted the # & email to the top cops at UCLA. For those that attend the school or live near it, its your duty as citizens to stop this kind of stupidity.
This is the type of stuff they do in a coup. This is tyrany at its worst.
Is America awake yet?! Have you guys had enough?! American's thought its government was doing it a favor by controlling the "bad guys" but the problem is that the government is now controlling everyone of you. No one is safe now. And if you thought you gave your government power so they could pretect you from those bad guys, think again. All it was doing was finding a way to rein in its population so that it could do the things they do now. You have no say now, you elected your president, he made the changes and now you live with the concequenses of your vote.
Is America Awake Yet?!!
Ingrid | 11.16.06 - 2:51 pm | #

"So you have to show ID in order to go into a library? What part of the US of A do you live in? China?
Angry Black Man | 11.16.06 - 2:21 pm | # "

Maybe he goes to UCLA, where there is a stated policy that after 11pm you have to show your ID to use the library?

Oh wait, I mean, they're all nazi-communist fascists! Beat them all up!

Yes, the cops used excessive force. Yes they should be and probably will be fired, sued, and jailed, not necessarily in that order. But this is not evidence that we live in a police state, and I would suggest that those of you who are saying it is, are being drama queens.

The fact is, the problem with America is that our overinflated sense of individualism turns the majority of us into either Dwight Schroot from The Office (The abusive cops) or smart-ass rebels with chips on our shoulders who crave confrontation (the smart-ass kid who wouldn't leave when called on a policy already in place, and which he presumably agreed to when he started paying UCLA tuition.)

It looks to me like both sides in this conflict suck. The police just sucked harder in this case.

Oh, but I guess that makes me a troll, a conservative, and worse than the nazis, all in one.
JM | 11.16.06 - 2:53 pm | #

if the article is correct and the student was leaving the library before he was even asked to present id...then something is really wrong here and the regents need to rethink policy

i hope both the iranian and ucla community have a mass demonstration this week
Uncle Joe McCarthy | 11.16.06 - 2:53 pm | #

Id like to see the build up and footage of what happend throughout the who event before I make a judgement.
CD | 11.16.06 - 2:54 pm | #

It should be illegal to taser an unarmed person.
Eric Jaffa | 11.16.06 - 2:54 pm | #

Since when did not havign a LIBRARY CARD constitute tasering? I can't believe there is even a debate going on! This is about a library card, a kid who didn't leave quickly enough, and some taser-happy rednecks.

The kid was leaving, they grabbed his arm and then he was like, "Let go!" The cops considered his demand to be released as combative. So they tasered him down, and then tasered him for not getting up.

This is cut and dried, IMHO. Excessive force.

Jesus - I hate to see what happens when students are late returnign a book. What happens then - ass rape?
mojopo | 11.16.06 - 2:55 pm | #

dhimmi, we "macho assholes" who are talking about "charging the cops"; well at least this "macho asshole" are fed up with this sort of shit. They were not real police for one thing. They were campus rent-a-pigs, who probably do not even carry guns.
CrunchyKnee | 11.16.06 - 2:55 pm | #

Wow! We have a genius on our hands!!
Angry Black Man | 11.16.06 - 2:42 pm | #

No, I've watched training films. It's hard to know how much is faked, and alcohol does not produce the pain of electric shocks, but endurance and the ability to recover can be based on height, weight, sex and age.

For example if you taser someone over 40 they are more likely to experience cardiac arrest, and you have a corpse on your hand. The same with those with implanted pacemakers. I was taking those on site claiming to have been tasered, although for the most part they couldn't even spell the word, primae facie, and working under the assumption of greater height and built. The cops in the taser training films certainly have those advantages.
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 2:55 pm | #

Fucking rent-a-cops retard cowards.

But let's hear it for the worst camera work of the year. Jesus.
Bonkers | 11.16.06 - 2:57 pm | #

Like the Rodney King case, one wonders what transpired before the beginning of the video. The video appears to have started well into the icndent. One should not pass judgment without all the facts.

The "student" appears to be acting like an EDP, and was totally uncooperative with police.

I work in a hospital ER and have witnessed numerous tasings. The person tased should be ok. It is true however that depending where and how he was tased he may suffer temporary loss of motor control of his legs and be unable to obey the command to "stand up." That should wear off withing 10-25 minutes.

I'm not defending the cops, but Im not defending the EDP either. I wasnt there.
Black Jack | 11.16.06 - 2:57 pm | #

False equivalence rears its ugly head again.

Yes, both sides "suck." It "sucks" when (you think, but you have no way of knowing) some snot nose kid with a funny sounding name doesn't show ID when ordered to.

It also "sucks" to be immobilized via two metal probes (darts) connected via metal wires from the stun gun usually penetrating your skin, and superficial muscle, causing great pain and paralysis because your muscles are receiving electrical shock, twitching uncontrollably, appearing as muscle spasms.

This is willful stupidity.
dhimmi | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 2:57 pm | #

Standing around and watching is no longer an acceptable stance to take while posting your video on YouTube. Sure, YouTube has been a great democratizing force in exposing police brutality and general abuses of power, but now it's time we rise up and take action when we see it with our own eyes!
Justin

You are correct and I am going to write a scathing letter about this - this horrible and abominable brutality must be stopped. I will not stand for this, I am pulling out all the stops.

WILL all these macho assholes talking about charging the cops just STFU? Everyone is acting like it is the easiest thing in the world to imagine attacking two enraged, armed cops obviously unafraid of inflicting harm.

This is just BULLSHIT.
dhimmi

I agree...a person could get hurt doing that.
rcg | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 2:58 pm | #

...as long as you allow bad actors to infest law enforcement....

Jack Damage

Too late, the cops were infiltrated by the USA equivalent of Iraqi resistance.
Anonymous | 11.16.06 - 2:58 pm | #

RANDOM ID CHECK.

yeh, right.
mirror | 11.16.06 - 2:59 pm | #

So a bunch of bully-boy, almost-rent-a-cops tase and taunt the fuck out of a BROWN SKINNED college student.
A student who just happened to forget his ID while working on a report or whatever at a library computer.

Ack! Anyone else smell a fat, juicy law suit?

As for the Cops-as-Daddy-Surrogate, freeper creepers enjoying the little crime and punishment spectacle on here... ever looked into starting a Snuff Film collection? I know it's kinda black market stuff, but, really, I think it'd be right up your alley.
BDIII | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 2:59 pm | #

But let's hear it for the worst camera work of the year. Jesus.

You would have had better camera work at USC.
___________________________________
SevenString | 11.16.06 - 3:00 pm | #

"Compliance is critical for the safety and well-being of everyone". Yeh, no kidding.

How frigging draconian.

Statement from UCLA Acting Chancellor Norman Abrams About Incident at Powell Library:

University police are investigating an incident late last night in which police took a student into custody at Powell Library. Investigators are reviewing the incident and the officers' actions. The investigation and review will be thorough, vigorous and fair.

The safety of our campus community is of paramount importance to me. Routinely checking student identification after 11 p.m. at the campus library, which is open 24 hours, is a policy posted in the library that was enacted for the protection of our students. Compliance is critical for the safety and well-being of everyone.

-UCLA-
Grasshopper | 11.16.06 - 3:00 pm | #

when tasers were brought into use- they were only designated for use instead of using 'deadly force', if applicable.

Carry your papers. Or else everyone will get to watch you get tortured.

By the way- How many people 'unvoulentarily' had to listen and or watch a man get electricuted a number of times? I don't see why one could not sue that. That is a tramatic experience for most.
images appear | 11.16.06 - 3:02 pm | #

Why don't the police put their steroid muscles to use instead of shocking a skinny college kid?
Miguel | 11.16.06 - 3:02 pm | #

To all of those calling me some kind of "macho asshole:" I'm on your side! Of course, making the decision to stand up to authority is difficult and challenging, and possibly even threatening; however, there were all of only 2 students that I could see who were attempting to verbally engage the cops to get them to stop, nevermind the 100+ that appeared to be in the various images. Charging the cops does not only mean attempting to attack them, although I don't think that would have been wrong in this situation. Charging the cops also means creating such a rucous, such a seen, that what these cops have done becomes unmanageable for them. That includes attempting to engage them, pointing out what they are doing is wrong, how it is wrong, and encroaching on their space to make it exceedingly hard for them to continue brutalizing this guy in the library.
Justin | 11.16.06 - 3:02 pm | #

sounds like the CLA Acting Chancellor is more worried about covering his ass.

The rat basturd
rcg | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 3:02 pm | #

Has ANYONE seen any MSM News coverage of this story?

The UCPD were clearly in the wrong, Tazers can kill, and the boy was telling he had a medical condition.

We need to make sure this gets to the MSM.
Bangkok-Bob | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 3:03 pm | #

chilling. sick
mk ultramaroon | 11.16.06 - 3:03 pm | #

They kept yelling "GET UP STAND UP".
RayCeeYa

Maybe they are just reggae fans?
CrunchyKnee | 11.16.06 - 3:04 pm | #

.WTF? Here's the LA Times account. More, I'm sure to come:

http://www.latimes.com/news/loca...-home- headlines

The officers' actions are inexcusable. Some people cannot be trusted with power, and these guys are thugs, pure and simple. If that officer's ego can't take a little razing from a college student, he has no business having a tazer or any other weapon or any power over anybody. Even assuming that the officers told the truth - which is highly unlikely, since it does look like the student was close to the exit and leaving, and no longer near a cubicle - there is no way in hell theirs is an acceptable or professional response. Cops are not supposed to escalate situations. Tazing the guy was unnecessary, and tazing him repeatedly while telling him to stand up is insane. Threatening another student with tazing when it appears he's talking heatedly but is not physically threatening is unnecessary and unacceptable. Fire them. Sue them. Throw them in jail. Let them see what it's like to not be in power, because they're too dumb and mean to be trusted with it. I know people who were hit by tear gas in the 60s and 70s on college campuses, and I sure as hell don't want to see a return to those attitudes, let alone anything approaching Kent State. This BS has to be nipped in the bud.

One positive - the other students clearly have a conscience and the common sense the cops lack.
Batocchio | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 3:04 pm | #

You kids now days are such wimps.

Im 56 years old and if this had happened in the 60s there would have been a friggin riot right then and there.
MK Ultra | 11.16.06 - 3:04 pm | #

ID's aren't wholly unnecessary for identification in schools. Female students in particular are sometimes raped in various parts of the campus. The homeless will wander in and start panhandling or sleeping in the library, and worse. Such ID rules for after 11:00 at night are sensible.

However, as I've said before, these are administrative rules, not criminal, and does not give the right to rent-a-cop to assault students. Some students are fresh out of high school, and mayn't realize the necessity to be prepared to show identification. Especially when the rules are randomly enforced as in this case.

Most rent-a-cops are unnarmed nowdays for a reason. Tasers are a form of potentially lethal weapons and I'm surprised campus guards even have them.
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 3:04 pm | #

"one has to wonder what transpired before the tape"???

According to the student newspaper account, the student had been restrained. RESTRAINED!

Whatever happened before the RESTRAINING [HANDCUFFING] AND TASERING. Didn't need to result is quite frankly moot.

If "one has to wonder what transpired before the tape", then one has to call the actions of the officers not only torture, but vengeful. He couldn't have been much of a threat to 5 officers while being RESTRAINED.
Grasshopper | 11.16.06 - 3:04 pm | #

Is it okay to post this here? I already sent a cordial yet serious plea to punish those who excessively use non-lethal weapons. But I found the Captain of the UCLA Police on the campus website.

adamsj@ucpd.ucla.edu
Johnnie Adams
wLAfadeaway | 11.16.06 - 3:05 pm | #

RANDOM ID Check=discrimation

In other words, we check whom we want to check. And if the "safety" of the students is that important, then how come they don't have ID checks BEFORE one enters the library.
Angry Black Man | 11.16.06 - 3:06 pm | #

What the fuck kind of country have we become?

People are actually defending police brutality? Unleashed upon a student in a school library because he wasn't exiting the building fast enough? All stemming from the fact that he didn't have his ID card?

What the hell is wrong with you people?

But, hey, I guess it really shouldn't surprise me too much when these same kinds of "patriotic Americans" have been discussing the benefits of legally sanctioned torture for the past year.
JC | 11.16.06 - 3:06 pm | #

Justin - I want you with me when they start filling up those concentration camps.

Speaking of concentration camps, people, why are we not demanding that they tear those abominable American concentration camps down?

"Mr. Bush, tear those concentration camps down"

should be a headline on the website and blog of every decent American man and woman.
rcg | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 3:06 pm | #

LOL!
Only in America.
Chris from Canada | 11.16.06 - 3:06 pm | #

That actually made me cry. what the hell is wrong with our country? What happened? Or am I just waking up to the way things have always been?
Liberal Girl | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 1:45 pm |

No offense but the guy was a fucking asshole. They probably didn't need to tase him but he was purposely trying to get attention. He sounded mentally ill or like he was drunk or on speed. Guys like that aren't easy to deal with but they probably should have just dragged him out instead of tasing him.

Seriously, this was a bunch of whiny college kids trying to act like this was real abuse like in the civil rights movement. They told him to stand up like 40 times.

I've been tased and it doesn't make you scream ridiculously like that.

I don't like cops in general but this guy was just screaming for attention.
theurchin | 11.16.06 - 3:07 pm | #

Isn't it a bit contradictory to tase someone to immobilze them, scream at them to stand up, and then tase them again WHEN YOU'VE JUST IMMOBILIZED THEM???

That's the definition of sadism.
nik | 11.16.06 - 3:07 pm | #

The young kid smoking a joint gets the same treatment. Not a peep from you all. An innocent family gets woken up at the point of a automatic weapon in the midddle of the night by cops looking for pot. Not a peep from you all. A black man is sentenced to prison for 10 years for marijuana possesion and a white middle class kid gets nothing for the same infraction. Not a peep from you all. THIS SHIT HAS BEEN GOING ON FOR 30 YEARS IN THE NAME OF THE WAR ON DRUGS. And now you people get upset. Your total disregard for your fellow Americans rights because "well it was just some pothead" is now coming home to bite you in the ass. Hope you are proud. You stand up for everyones rights or you stand up for no ones.
Kozmo | 11.16.06 - 3:07 pm | #

u know in the old days the kid would of just seen the rong side of a night stick and would of been draged out by his neck
n8 | 11.16.06 - 3:08 pm | #

Batocchio | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 3:04 pm | #

Thanks for that Link Batocchio
Bangkok-Bob | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 3:08 pm | #

theurchin - I don't believe a word you say.
rcg | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 3:08 pm | #

There appears to be a lot of misinformation about Tasers.

50,000 volts
Safe to use on pacemakers

Some people have died after being tased. That does not necessarily mean they died from the taser. In many case cocaine etc has been on board the victim and there have been underlying issues exacerbated by the drugs and the stress of the incident

Tasers have saved many lives. It allows police to control an otherwise dangerous EDP without any lasting injury. The New Haven CT community is asking the police to adopt tasers after several police involved shootings in 2006.

Yes, the taser can be be abused. But dont automatically throw out an effective "less than lethal" option for police.
Black Jack | 11.16.06 - 3:09 pm | #

These cops should be fired, arrested, and imprisoned for life, and while in prison, they should be tasered themselves, though more than likely, since their rent-a-cops, and people know prisoners HATE cops, they'll wind up getting the "Bubba" treatment.
Juan | 11.16.06 - 3:10 pm | #

"You're going to get tazed too."

Holy shit. So I haven't heard that this person was doing anything wrong, only he couldn't produce a valid ID when asked. If that is so, these bozos need to be fired.

Just my experience, but campus police are the worst rejects around. They are just the total losers that couldn't pass the psych test and become real cops.
Anonymous | 11.16.06 - 3:10 pm | #

What the hell is wrong with you people?

But, hey, I guess it really shouldn't surprise me too much when these same kinds of "patriotic Americans" have been discussing the benefits of legally sanctioned torture for the past year.
JC | 11.16.06 - 3:06 pm | #

I completely agree with your sentiment.
navyswan | 11.16.06 - 3:11 pm | #

But ysbaddaden, this guy was not lurking in the parking lots looking for young girls to prey on, nor was he homeless, he was at a computer in a library(like I am now!!).

You are right, though. Those were administrative rules, not criminal. Being shocked 4 times (I counted 4, others say 5) is excessive. I seen people running from cops after they did a crime that didn't get tasered.
Angry Black Man | 11.16.06 - 3:12 pm | #

If there's any actions planned against these Christofascist terrorists, I want in. Email me, please, if anyone has plans.

frice@skeptictank.org
Fredric L. Rice | 11.16.06 - 3:12 pm | #

Angry Black Man | 11.16.06 - 3:06 pm | #

When I was in college, up to 2001, they did check our ID on the way into the computer lab. But since I was a commuting student, I don't know what the rules were for the library after hours.

However, that's exactly the problem here, besides the use of torture, the fact that the checks are random. One day a student might not be checked when he forgot his ID and another day he will. This sort of inconsistency gives the impression of unimportance to the rule, for which the student shouldn't be blamed.
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 3:12 pm | #

50,000 volts
Safe to use on pacemakers

Say the pacemaker is safe to be refurbished and re-implanted, after the tasing victim dies?
Weaseldog | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 3:13 pm | #

By then, Remesnitsky said, a crowd of 50 or 60 had gathered and were shouting at the officers to stop and demanding their names and badge numbers.

Source: http://www.latimes.com/news/loca...-home- headlines

50 or 60 stood around and allowed this to continue!!! What's wrong with my fellow Americans - will you all passively be led to your slaughter? Are there no Americans left with any backbone?

elle2 - Canada is looking better and better.
rcg | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 3:14 pm | #

I think some folks here, want to see the cops tasering people more often, for traffic stops, spitting on the sidewalk, looking at them funny...
Weaseldog | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 3:14 pm | #

RCG, you know it babe.
Chris from Canada | 11.16.06 - 3:15 pm | #

I think some folks here, want to see the cops tasering people more often, for traffic stops, spitting on the sidewalk, looking at them funny...
Weaseldog

Yeah, until it happens to them.
rcg | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 3:16 pm | #

RCG, you know it babe.
Chris from Canada

LOL, thanks Chris.
rcg | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 3:17 pm | #

"Back up or you'll get tasered too."

What did we miss when the video was turned off?

"Hey! Anyone else want to get tasered? You miss, would you like to be tasered? Well then keep moving, cause I have the taser and I'm not affraid to use it."
Nicky Babs | 11.16.06 - 3:18 pm | #

theurchin - I don't believe a word you say.
rcg | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 3:08 pm |

Wow that's too bad.

You can jump to conclusions on the left as well as the right and this guy was purposely whining for all the attention he could get. If you've seen enough people on drugs and drunk you'll know it's not easy to deal with them. That being said they probably shouldn't have tased him.

I'm not sure how you can not believe a word I say since most of it was opinion,but so be it. Enjoy your day.
theurchin | 11.16.06 - 3:19 pm | #

theurchin | 11.16.06 - 3:07 pm | #

Whatever. I call bullshit on your ATTENTION seeking ass.

(sorry all for my earlier comment about the bad camera work. I was just wishing that the camera owner could have recorded better evidence for the victim, but the audio should be pretty good in any case. Anyway, jsut expressed it a bit carelessly)
Bonkers | 11.16.06 - 3:20 pm | #

hey kozmo,

ive been screaming about the war on drugs for years...but that isnt the issue here....
Uncle Joe McCarthy | 11.16.06 - 3:20 pm | #

adamsj@ucpd.ucla.edu
Johnnie Adams
wLAfadeaway | 11.16.06 - 3:05 pm | #

Thanks, I just wrote to him and to several people in both the House and Senate.
Bangkok-Bob | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 3:20 pm | #

Reposted from Americablog:

Just to be clear: I do think the officers went too far in tasering this guy multiple times.

BUT:

Sure, this guy was on State property... State property with rules that he was breaking. To all the people here saying that nobody should be asked for ID on a college campus: I'm sorry, but this knife cuts both ways... If there was a rapist loose on campus or a bomb threat, you'd be demanding that ID's be checked. Those officers are there for the protection of the students, if somebody breaks the rules, then resists arrest, they should be removed from the campus regardless of their last name/racial profile. (I never heard any of the officers using any language regarding his race, so don't jump to conclusions about this, please.)

Did the officers use excessive force? It sure looks like it from the point that the camera started rolling, but I wasn't there and I don't know what this guy did or said before the filming started to get the officers mad enough to taser him. Read the accounts again: they asked him for ID: HE REFUSED. They asked him to leave: HE REFUSED. That's closer to trespassing than free speech in my opinion. If he's a student there and he has ID which he REFUSES TO SHOW, then it seems to me that he might have some ulterior motives here. All the shouting about the Patriot Act doesn't help to change my mind about this either. I equate this guy's actions more to someone trying to commit 'suicide by cop' than to somebody fighting for his "rights"... Rights that he's purposely putting to the test to get his video on TV, maybe? And what rights are those exactly? Do they trump the rights of the officers to protect the students from a person they consider to be a threat?

What was this guys' "point" in resisting? Actions speak louder than words, the ideas behind his resistance are moot, he wanted the attention of the police/security and he got it. I'm sure he'll get on TV and get a hefty settlement after his lawsuit that the taxpayers of California will pay for, too... So maybe rethink what happened here instead of jumping to conclusions based on the popular hatred of Bush and the Patriot Act.

The fact remains that he was breaking the rules (maybe not any actual laws, I don't know) and he chose, from what I can see and hear, to antagonize armed officers and resist arrest. Not a good idea. Ever. The rules were: everyone must have ID. He REFUSED to show his ID. And that make the USA a police state?

Here's an idea: Don't break the rules/law and then resist arrest or run from the cops, and if they still taser you, then you've got something. Otherwise, it's just some law enforcement guys doing their jobs protecting our children.
Think, Please | 11.16.06 - 3:21 pm | #

It takes a certain mindset to be a cop. You have to be a power hungry self loving prick with little or no brains. That seems to be the norm down here in the South. These California cops are obviously lazy and using their tasers when they don't really need to. How many more deaths by taser will there have to be before this shit gets outlawed? America has become a parody of itself. Free society my ass.
griffin | 11.16.06 - 3:22 pm | #

theurchin, I beleive you when you say you've been tasered. I would believe you if you say you get tasered often.
Weaseldog | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 3:22 pm | #

Here's the UCPD's statement on this incident.

http://www.ucpd.ucla.edu/ucpd/zi...%2011-15- 06.pdf

------------------------------

Date: November 15, 2006
Re: Powell Library Incident
At approximately 11 p.m. on Tuesday, Nov. 14, a community service officer (CSO) employed by the library was performing a nightly, routine check to insure that all patrons using the library after 11 p.m. are authorized. This is a longstanding library policy to ensure the safety of students during the late night hours. The CSO made an announcement that he would be checking for university identification. When a person, who was later identified as Mostafa Tabatabainejad, refused to provide any identification, the CSO told him that if he refused to do so, he would have to leave the library. Since, after repeated requests, he would neither leave nor show identification, the CSO notified UCPD officers, who responded and asked Tabatabainejad to leave the premises multiple times. He continued to refuse. As the officers attempted to escort him out, he went limp and continued to refuse to cooperate with officers or leave the building.
Tabatabainejab encouraged library patrons to join his resistance. A crowd gathering around the officers and Tabatebainejad's continued resistance made it urgent to remove Tabatabainejad from the area. The officers deemed it necessary to use the Taser in a "drive stun" capacity.
A Taser is used to incapacitate subjects who are resistant by discharging an electronic current into the subject in one of two methods: via two wired probes that are deployed from the Taser, or in a "drive stun" capacity by touching the subject with the Taser. In this incident, the student was not shot with a Taser; rather officers used the "drive stun" capability.
All use of force incidents require an administrative review, which is currently underway.
Tabatabainejad was subsequently arrested for resisting/obstructing a police officer, 148(A)(1) of the Penal Code. He was released with a citation and issued a court date. The entire incident is under investigation and a case will be presented to the City Attorney.

------------------------------

What I find most interesting is that they explain that they were trying to "incapacitate" the "subject", and yet they also wanted him to stand up and walk out of the building on his own steam?

What hypocritical bullshit.
Wuzupdawk | 11.16.06 - 3:23 pm | #

I know some cops. I know some that are macho dickweeds on a power trip. All I have met and known personally are very professional and very well trained. Those in this incident were neither. Cops have a dangerous job, and people often do stupid things. That said, those clowns are psycologically UNFIT for this type of work. Actually I think they are lucky that they got out of that place unhurt themselves. I don't know about other people but when I see someone getting physically abused like that I look for the nearest baseball bat or tire iron. And they were way outnumbered.
The immortal z | 11.16.06 - 3:23 pm | #

"50,000 volts

safe to use on pacemakers"

Unfortunately, it kill humans!!
Angry Black Man | 11.16.06 - 3:23 pm | #

Angry Black Man | 11.16.06 - 3:12 pm | #

Rapists will stalk their victims.

However, in this case it sounds like he was only studying. I could get forgetful as hell whenever I was in the midst of term papers, mid-terms and finals. Sometimes I wonder if the only difference between a stalker, and someone who just happens to be in the area is their pigmentation.

Unless of course the campus had a recent history of violent attacks by people who weren't in uniforms.
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 3:23 pm | #

Otherwise, it's just some law enforcement guys doing their jobs protecting our children.

And if it were your child being tased, I'm sure you would feel the same way, right?
dhimmi | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 3:23 pm | #

I don't know if I would have done anything if I was there...I probably would have assumed that the kid was doing something wrong.

But...watching the video made me wish the kids there would have mobbed the rent a cops and maybe tasered them too.

Consider this...that cops have no more inherent power than any other citizen...they HAVE more at our consent.

That is we are okay with cops tasering, beating, or shooting people in order to keep public order...but the students had EVERY right to also use force to stop the cops if they truly believed the cops were acting criminaly.

Never hurts to look at the situation from a different angle.

Bobo
Bobo | 11.16.06 - 3:24 pm | #

"He sounded mentally ill"

Ohhhh! so, thats why they tasered him, because he sounded mentally ill. That is a policy at UCLA, taser all the mentally ill student. The cops was just following orders.
Angry Black Man | 11.16.06 - 3:15 pm |

I'm sorry, are u that much of an idiot? I said they should have dragged him out and not tasered him. But if you're going to react because you read only one part of someone's post there's not much anyone can do to talk to you.

By writing he sounded mentally ill I was trying to state he was tough to deal with.

I have mental illness in my family and have dealt with it on almost a daily basis for years.
theurchin | 11.16.06 - 3:24 pm | #

Think, Please...

Good blame the victim argument.

No one here said the kid shouldn't be breaking the rules.

Though you argue that the cops shouldn't have tasered him, you go on to making an excuse for torturing people, simply because the cops don't like them.

Increasingly, we're being more accustomed to the idea that being tortured can be excused for mundane reasons, like "the torturer had a bad day.", or "He broke a library rule, so its his fault they tortured him."

Sorry, but there's no good reason to torture human beings.
Weaseldog | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 3:27 pm | #

Actually that's an interesting point. We mistreat the mentally ill in this country too.

Large percentages of our jail population may be mentally ill, and at one time, they even put the mentally retarded in such cells with hardened criminals.
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 3:27 pm | #

What's a "BruinCard"?
Was he really a student?
Did he have a student id?
Was he sober?
Was he aware of the rules for the computer lab?
Did he understand what the officers were saying?
Was he a US citizen, if not did he have the appropriate VISA?
Why didn't they just remove him peacefully?
Why didn't the student leave in the first place?
Was he doing homework? Can a professor verify?

Maybe I'm wrong, and don't know the entire story on both sides, but I find nothing wrong with protecting University or public liberty property. Our tax dollars are spent when things are destroyed. And students, especially college-aged kids, can get out of hand? It seems to me that a "terrorist" would have the money, so he wouldn't need public library resources. So exactly what was accomplished by throwing him out with extreme unreasonable force.

Is it so hard these days, to be civil on both sides of this situation.
Anonymous | 11.16.06 - 3:28 pm | #

here is the la times article (with a link to the king of new media, youtube)

http://www.latimes.com/news/loca...-home- headlines

while the vid does not show what police alledge occured prior to the tasing, their recollections of what occured during the tazing do not jibe with the video

"Tabatabainejad encouraged library patrons to join his resistance," police said. "The officers deemed it necessary to use the Taser."

listen to the audio...does the student anywhere encourage others to join his "resistance"? all i hear is him screaming in pain

the campus police and ucla are totally fucked on this one
Uncle Joe McCarthy | 11.16.06 - 3:29 pm | #

Tasers should be banned as torture instruments. Cops should be thoroughly screened, psychologically, before being allowed to carry tasers-- or any other kind of weapon!-- or allowed to interface in any way with the public. I knew several people who went from their US Military police jobs directly into civilian police jobs. I swear to you that every one of them were psychopaths who carried so much personal insecurity they needed their their position of authority to defend their egos so they could feel they fit in socially. They had no self esteem whatsoever except what they got from their uniform and weapon. They were all of lower intelligence, and could only communicate with others in an aggressive manner-- every single one of them-- when they were off duty, and interacting with other people socially. They made the others in the group, which was a mix of military and civilian personnel-- those who were not military police-- uncomfortable with their hair-trigger intolerance of innocent slights against them. They were true psychopaths. They were very dramatic in their aggressive expressions against others in the group, as if to reassure themselves. The rest of us felt they were total assholes, and shortly after they started their little bully acts, the people in the group began to drift off to somewhere else, to get away from them. It's sad to think that the state feels it needs people like this to carry out police functions. As a contrast, I have known officers of the law who were genuinely humane, and who m I have never observed carrying their jobs into social functions when they were off duty, but they are few and far between in the lower ranks. The key seems to be that every low level cop I have ever known personally seems to suffer from a severe personality disorder characterized by low self esteem and personal insecurity.
anonymous | 11.16.06 - 3:29 pm | #

The bottom line is that regardless of what the "perp" did it is the police job to apprehend him and place him before a judge. Not to torture him REPEATEDLY. However you feel about how tough it is to be a cop and how dangerous it is to be at UCLA at night, even a "limp" man can be carried when you have that many officers. What good did Tazing him do but make it more difficult?

adamsj@ucpd.ucla.edu
Johnnie Adams
Capt UCLA UCPD
wLAfadeaway | 11.16.06 - 3:29 pm | #

Next time someone tries non-violent civil disobedience (which sounds like what may have happened http://www.mercurynews.com/mld/m...ws/ 16021566.htm since its claimed he went limp) how about getting a wheelchair?
Thing Fish | 11.16.06 - 3:29 pm | #

you mean to tell me that the defiant guy was so strong, that they needed 5 cops and a taser gun?

And I am so sick of people who defend this nonsense with the argument that "a cop's job is dangerous". No its not, a cab driver job is more dangerous than a cop's job. In fact, in fatalities on the job, police officer never makes the top 10. Cab driver is always #1 or close to it.
Angry Black Man | 11.16.06 - 3:30 pm | #

these "cops" are obviously not trained and on some sort of a power trip fed by personal bias and racism. some people do not belong in uniform unless its at mcdonalds...and even then they might spit in a burger because they dont like some guy
jordicruise | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 3:30 pm | #

I have mental illness in my family and have dealt with it on almost a daily basis for years.
theurchin | 11.16.06 - 3:24 pm | #

Oh, you just have an answer for everything.

Now, get a camera and a taser and have a few strangers work you over with it, post it for us, and maybe we'll start cutting you some slack and at the very least won't have to call "bullshit' on you.

Criminy, this thread has birthed Bravery-Trolls, Taser-Love Trolls, and All-World-Tragedy-Therefore-My-Assertions-Are- Unassailable Trolls.
Bonkers | 11.16.06 - 3:30 pm | #

Criminy, this thread has birthed Bravery-Trolls, Taser-Love Trolls, and All-World-Tragedy-Therefore-My-Assertions-Are- Unassailable Trolls.
Bonkers | 11.16.06 - 3:30 pm

ROFL! That was breathtaking!
dhimmi | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 3:32 pm | #

A lot of these quotes reflect the whole "patriot act" "Bush WH" kind of nonsense as a reason for this event. I am against the patriot act, but it had nothing to do with what happned to this young man. These kinds of things happen with police for time to time, under any WH, under any set of laws.
These campus police are obviously poorly trained, and poorly lead. Heads should roll at the dept. No doubt about it. They escalated this situation, not the students. They could have caused a full scale riot... and a huge altercation with their actions. People could have been killed. This is unsat police work.
Sadly, this kind of thing happens more than we like to admit to ourselves, and if there were no cameras,and this was some poor bum, think about the ouctome?
There are a lot of really good police officers out there as well. But one must call a spade a spade, these guys did a horrible job in this situation,and violated the ethics behind the authority that comes with a badge. "Protect and serve".... my ass!
ptc | 11.16.06 - 3:32 pm | #

theurchin is actually Bill Frist, who we all know is an expert at long distance video diagnoses.
JC | 11.16.06 - 3:32 pm | #

Bonkers | 11.16.06 - 3:30 pm | #

Your last statement is coming dangerously close to Coulter/Limbaugh ridiculing victims turned activists.
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 3:33 pm | #

If the student who got tasered was drunk, then what was he doing at a library. If I was drunk, the last place I would want to be is in a library.

Party at the Library!!!
Angry Black Man | 11.16.06 - 3:33 pm | #

Folks, I guess the lessons that the rethugs in here want us to learn are:

..immediately do what you are told without objection or question of any kind - for you will not be given time to explain.

...if you do object, then you must remain completely calm, you absolutely must not say anything to show that you are upset or in agony while they are torturing you or later some hateful idiots who are watching the video will accuse you of deserving to be brutalized or of being mentally ill..believe you me these lying liars are very creative and come up with all sorts of hair splitting shit to try and justify unnecessary and illegal brutality.

Man...there must be an opening/tear between the fabric of hell and earth - how else could you explain the existence of all these monsters?
rcg | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 3:34 pm | #

LOL! Good one JC
Angry Black Man | 11.16.06 - 3:34 pm | #

that's kids got such a lawsuit on his hands. he doen't need a college education with the kind of money he's gonna get. he'll be dating paris hilton soon enough.

he should give a small portion to the person who filmed this.

.
jo | 11.16.06 - 3:34 pm | #

Sorry, but there's no good reason to torture human beings.
Weaseldog | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 3:27 pm | #

Dude are you reading the stuff I write?

He didn't want to leave, he wouldn't cooperate so they should have taken him out and not tasered him.

How is taking him out of the library torture?

And apparently, according to you, I should be tasered often.

So apparently you have a little part of you that wants to be some sort of tough guy against people that don't agree with you.

I've been on this site since it started jackass. Just because I didn't overreact like a 21 year old fuck the police asshole doesn't mean I want people tortured.

Grow up.
theurchin | 11.16.06 - 3:35 pm | #

Liberal Girl - - "Or am I just waking up to the way things have always been?"

Yep, now you know what it's been like, for generations, to be black or brown in this great country of ours. This is what happens when people are bombarded with 'local news' that depicts everyone of color as sub-human or dangers to society to strike fear into people's hearts.

Once the Police are given the tools and the power to use them, they become color-blind and will use them on anyone who is perceived to be threatening their authority. Be afraid! We have to do these things to protect you. Why should you worry about this? You're not thinking of doing something 'forbidden' -- are you?

As resistance becomes greater, the next phase is the use of military force to quell 'uprisings' such as that seen in the video, since cops will be afraid to respond to a situation with anything less than lethal force. Then follows the Para-Military phase to preserve the secret identities of the trained terrorists - much like today's Iraq. Pray for our Democratic Republic.
danno | 11.16.06 - 3:35 pm | #

jo | 11.16.06 - 3:34 pm | #

Will he have to pretend to like Paris's dog?

He'll find the dog's a better conversationalist than she is.
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 3:36 pm | #

I have mental illness in my family and have dealt with it on almost a daily basis for years.
theurchin | 11.16.06 - 3:24 pm | #

I feel your pain. I have Republicans in my family as well...
Fade | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 3:36 pm | #

for every good cop there's a good criminal.
yikes | 11.16.06 - 3:37 pm | #

Your last statement is coming dangerously close to Coulter/Limbaugh ridiculing victims turned activists.
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 3:33 pm | #

Sorry, brother, I don't follow ya.
Bonkers | 11.16.06 - 3:38 pm | #

Just because I didn't overreact like a 21 year old fuck the police asshole doesn't mean I want people tortured. Grow up.
theurchin | 11.16.06 - 3:35 pm | #

No, you're just preachy, Dr Maturity.
Bonkers | 11.16.06 - 3:39 pm | #

Re:

Think, Please...

Good blame the victim argument.

No one here said the kid shouldn't be breaking the rules.

Though you argue that the cops shouldn't have tasered him, you go on to making an excuse for torturing people, simply because the cops don't like them.

Increasingly, we're being more accustomed to the idea that being tortured can be excused for mundane reasons, like "the torturer had a bad day.", or "He broke a library rule, so its his fault they tortured him."

Sorry, but there's no good reason to torture human beings.
Weaseldog | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 3:27 pm | #
___

No, Weaseldog, you are trying to put words in my mouth. Most people don't consider tasering to be "torture." They consider it to be non-lethal force, which it is.

If your daughter had been brutally raped, and the rapist was caught on campus stalking another girl and was tasered by campus police, I seriously doubt that you would equate tasering that criminal to "torture."

My point is, nobody could have known at the time WHY this guy was resisting, if he was dangerous or not, and I'm just glad that it was tasers and not actual firearms that were used.

I"m not about to make some random guy resisting arrest for reasons unknown into a martyr. But, hey, feel free to do so yourself, just don't bitch about the next time a crime happens to someone you love and the criminal gets away because the poilice didn't want to "torture" the guy with a taser.

.
Think, Please | 11.16.06 - 3:40 pm | #

Oh, you just have an answer for everything.

Now, get a camera and a taser and have a few strangers work you over with it, post it for us, and maybe we'll start cutting you some slack and at the very least won't have to call "bullshit' on you.

Criminy, this thread has birthed Bravery-Trolls, Taser-Love Trolls, and All-World-Tragedy-Therefore-My-Assertions-Are- Unassailable Trolls.
Bonkers | 11.16.06 - 3:30 pm |

Oh suck my ass. I've been donating and supporting this site since the beginning you little hop on the bandwagon bitch.
theurchin | 11.16.06 - 3:40 pm | #

This is complete and utter garbage. I usually don't post on these things, but i've had it. How can we still be allowing injustices like this to happen day in and day out? And all you ignorant wanks who sit here and try to defend the actions of these pigs...how dare you? You can't get much more un-american than that my friends. Its quite evident this is a racial issue, and one that is inhuman at the same time. Like someone else already said, if this can happen, who is say another Kent State incident won't happen? Ive seen incidents in washington at protests with even more gross abuse of power by the swine that call themselves public servants, and folks, it really is about time to stand up and wake the hell up...let's take our god damn nation back!
Chris Cronin Has had enough | 11.16.06 - 3:40 pm | #

[Deleted. Idiotic flame bait]

Edited By Siteowner
Whoa | 11.16.06 - 3:41 pm | #

I'm not a rent-a cop, but if I walked up and told that dude to get out, and he wanted to pretend he was gonna do it on his own sweet time, I'd kick his ass all the way out the door too.
common sense | 11.16.06 - 1:52 pm | #

So, 4 guys couldn't kick his ass out the door. It took them AND 5 tazes?

You moron.
BuelahMan | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 3:44 pm | #

Don't any of you find it even remotely funny that this is being debated? Whatever to the land of liberty and all of that other crap?
Chris from Canada | 11.16.06 - 3:45 pm | #

Welcome to the Fourth Reich...

PAPERS...SHOW ME YOUR PAPERS!
Dana | 11.16.06 - 3:46 pm | #

PayPal trolls!
dhimmi | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 3:46 pm | #

so If my kids don't do what I tell them I can taser them? Great logic. So when the GOP in the senate and congress don't do what the Dem's ask them I guess they will have to taser them.
goose1 | 11.16.06 - 3:46 pm | #

They asked him to stand up like 10 times. He deserved it. Doesn't matter who the fuck he is, the cops are doing their jobs. If you fucking listen to tme then I doubt you get tazed. And having been tazed myself, I'd much rather they taze him than hit him.

If they ask you 50 times to stand up, fucking stand up.

Asshat.
Anonymous | 11.16.06 - 2:08 pm | #

Will you stfu?
Will you stfu?
Will you stfu?
Will you stfu?
Will you stfu?
Will you stfu?
Will you stfu?
Will you stfu?
Will you stfu?
Will you stfu?

Now, whwre's my Taser for you, fuckstick?
BuelahMan | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 3:48 pm | #

Think, please:

Obviously, you didn't do alot of thinking when you posted that comment. Why are you equating resisting the leave a public library with rape? You are using an extreme situation to justify a non-extreme event. He didn't rape nobody, he did have a weapon, and he wasn't a threat to the police. The 5 cops could have easily carried the young defiant student out of the library. And there would be nothing to discuss today.
Angry Black Man | 11.16.06 - 3:48 pm | #

theurchin - I am throwing down the gauntlet.

I challenge you to let me taser you six times and then lets see how fast you get up and walk.

...and you had better do it quietly.
rcg | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 3:38 pm |

Well they told him to get up after the first one so you're exaggerating.

Also, mr. tough guy, I stated they should have dragged him out and not tasered him.

I said the guy was being a dick and he was.

If you want to ignore facts and what people actually write maybe you'd be more comfortable in freeperland.
theurchin | 11.16.06 - 3:49 pm | #

made me cry. that is torture. legalized torture. bull shit. that kind of shit is why the revolution is upon us. motherfucking pigs
Anonymous | 11.16.06 - 3:49 pm | #

So what happened to the cops that held guns on the black people trying to escape the nightmare of Katrina? Just doing their jobs- which apparently includes being racist pricks and not helping members of the neighboring community after a natural disaster.

No Accountability means it gets worse, not better.

I sent my emails off to the UCPD. You should too.
Fade | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 3:49 pm | #

Think- Call it whatever you like, it is unlawfull. Using a taser to get a subdued suspect to follow commands is agains the law. Where in the manual does it say you can use a taser on a suspect after he is subdued,simply because he will not comply with a verbal order to stand?
Look at the video. These cops almost caused a riot. They escalated this thing, not the students. They were way out of line. My guess is that this is going to be all over the MSM tonight or tomorrow, with police experts scrutinizing this video and crying foul. This is not the image you want to have of a force that is in place to protect the community. UCLA police... "protect and serve"... huh? You think these young people trust these officers now? Trust them enough to report a rape, or a serious crime? They taser kids who are cuffed for not following simple commands for christ sake.
ptc | 11.16.06 - 3:50 pm | #

Oh suck my ass. I've been donating and supporting this site since the beginning you little hop on the bandwagon bitch.
theurchin | 11.16.06 - 3:40 pm | #

Right! And I will just take your word on that too! You have many, many answers, Kimoslobby!

And stop trolling for dates. This is a political blog, not a place for you to get your ass sucked. Bitch.
Bonkers | 11.16.06 - 3:50 pm | #

that dud is my new fucking hero

they should of had a student revolt against the cops!
seamus | 11.16.06 - 3:51 pm | #

Re:
'...Otherwise, it's just some law enforcement guys doing their jobs protecting our children.'

And if it were your child being tased, I'm sure you would feel the same way, right?
dhimmi | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 3:23 pm | #
___

Look, dhimmi, I'll repeat again:

I"m not about to make some random guy resisting arrest for reasons unknown into a martyr.

Quite frankly, I would hope my child wouldn't be so dense as to ignore the instructions of an armed officer.
Think, Please | 11.16.06 - 3:52 pm | #

Sorry, brother, I don't follow ya.
Bonkers | 11.16.06 - 3:38 pm | #

Here the statement in question:

Criminy, this thread has birthed Bravery-Trolls, Taser-Love Trolls, and All-World-Tragedy-Therefore-My-Assertions-Are- Unassailable Trolls.
| 11.16.06 - 3:30 pm | #

I agree with your statement for the most part, but the final clause, Therefore-My-Assertions-Are-Unassailable...in response to an admission of mental illness in the family sound to me like the Coulter/Limbaugh argument. That one can't argue with victims, and that the other side knows this, and makes the victim an advocate for them.
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 3:53 pm | #

"No, Weaseldog, you are trying to put words in my mouth. Most people don't consider tasering to be "torture." They consider it to be non-lethal force, which it is."

Once, in order to subdue a person that is a threat, is not torture.

Hit someone with a taser again and again, while they are handcuffed and on the floor, is torture.

But since you think being in a library studying without an ID card is the same as raping young girls, I can see how you might confuse this issue.
Weaseldog | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 3:53 pm | #

I used to be an undercover security officer. There were many, many times I had to ask people to leave the stores I was working or even times when they physically fought with me. Funny, but we weren't given taser guns...just handcuffs and I never, ever had a problem apprehending the person...and I'm a female.

When I attended UCLA, I interviewed to be a CSO because of my background in security. These guys aren't cops, they are fellow students there, most of them making around 9 bucks an hour. They shouldn't have taser guns.

However, I will say that at UCLA there is a major problem with homeless people and various characters who make their way onto campus every single day. There is a mental health facility on campus at the UCLA med center and so you would often see people doing weird things on campus. When I was there, rapes sometimes happened in buildings overnight. This guy shouldn't have been on campus and from the sound of things, he has mental issues, BUT as I said before, the tasering thing is ridiculous. They were two large guys asking him to leave..were they afraid of a little scuffle? Man, things have changed.
Mama's Fan | 11.16.06 - 3:53 pm | #

"Tasers should be banned as torture instruments." anonymous | 11.16.06 - 3:29 pm |

Okay? That electrocution is a torturesome way to go is why most states have abolished the chair in deference to lethal injection. Yet, we can okay some rented low-grade imbicile to use one in jealousy on the college kid he resents for defiant disobediance? I don't think so. Computer says, HELL No! Those security turds could have cuffed and carted homey off to a designated holding facility until cops or parents were contacted and arrived. But, to taze that kid repeatedly is beyond comprehension and reason. That's even beyond torture to being attempted murder.

The kid smarted off to a couple of high school graduates, miffed that they have to interact with someone who will one day be able to buy and sell their pitiful butts. Yeah, kids respect no one, yada yada yo. But, kids can too easily be ignored. These rented turds set out to straighten homey out and simultaneously make an example of him to all his peers who might one day have the itch to scratch. The message delivered was that you either obey or dearly pay. People die as a result of arragant impudent security or police hubris daily. It's an abuse of power and authority, and it's just wrong. I'm down with MK Ultra. We ought all have a fist in the sky for this. I have to wonder. Had this incident occurred in the gym at the pool, would UCLA rental retards have waterboarded homey?
anan nimus | 11.16.06 - 3:54 pm | #

Incidents like this are why the internet needs to be protected and kept free at all costs.

The internet is our new guardian of freedom. From everything from exposing abusive cops, to exposing electronic and other voting problems, exposing lies of the mainstream media, exposing Bush administration lies, etc.

If it wasn't for the internet, nobody would have heard of things like the Downing Street Memo or the Yellowcake Forgery. They would think Abramoff was just a bipartisan scandal. Basically, the mainstream conservative media would dominate everything we hear and see.

Thank God for the internet.
Brian in FL | 11.16.06 - 3:55 pm | #

As a UCLA graduate I am shocked and disgusted by this video. There was absolutely no justification for the police to resort to such violent means to remove an obstinate student from a study room. The police lacked both common sense and compassion.
RHL | 11.16.06 - 3:55 pm | #

Angry Black Man | 11.16.06 - 3:48 pm | #

Actually, I think I was the first to mention rape as a reason for rules requiring after hour use of the library. I may've accidentally started a new sub-thread, because as I've also stated earlier, it sounds like this student was clearly studying.
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 3:55 pm | #

Re:
Obviously, you didn't do alot of thinking when you posted that comment. Why are you equating resisting the leave a public library with rape? You are using an extreme situation to justify a non-extreme event. He didn't rape nobody, he did have a weapon, and he wasn't a threat to the police. The 5 cops could have easily carried the young defiant student out of the library. And there would be nothing to discuss today.
Angry Black Man | 11.16.06 - 3:48 pm | #
__

And the officers are now supposed to be psychic mind readers? How would they know about this guy's criminal history, or lack of one? He was a threat, and if my child had been in that library, I'd be extremely happy right now that the threat was dealt with. Apparently you don't feel the same way.

He was RESISTING being carried out, please read the accounts which are all over the news.
Think, Please | 11.16.06 - 3:56 pm | #

mama's fan,

the guy is a student who forgot his id...and this is friggin la...you walk down the street and see something wierd happening.
Uncle Joe McCarthy | 11.16.06 - 3:56 pm | #

This guy shouldn't have been on campus and from the sound of things, he has mental issues> - Mama's Fan

Which students shouldn't be allowed on campus? The brown skin ones I suppose?

It was a troll that said he had mental issues. No report says he does. The kid said he had a medical condition. I haven't seen clarification of that point.
Weaseldog | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 3:57 pm | #

I caught that as well at the end of the tape the cop saying the other guy was gonna get tazed for being "confrontational". We are not in Kansas anymore Toto.
RJ | 11.16.06 - 3:57 pm | #

come see the violence inherent in the system!
ericM | 11.16.06 - 3:58 pm | #

Love the statist neo-nazis saying that the kid deserved it or trying to get sympathy for the pigs.

Hope they're laughing as hard as they are at this when they're getting tazed for noncompliance one day.
Damian, the Left-Hand Player | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 3:59 pm | #

Moistened binks in ponds throwing scimatars is not a basis of government!
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 3:59 pm | #

Students are the greatest threat to America and they subvert all that we stand for. In south Africa, he would have been shot with a real gun. I'm surprised he wasn't hog-tied.

I can't wait for michelle malkin to expose the terrorist plot behind the student's efforts to get himself tasered as a protest against our majestic leader, the Magnificent Rovian Potentate, Georg Walker Bush.

I'm sure the Democrats, probably that SanFran Liberal Pelosi, put that student up to forgetting his ID.

It's a shame the police weren't allowed by our glorious patRIOT Act to use lethal force. It would be a fitting example for those putrid liberals to see.

All the library records should be confiscated so we can find the names of any and all other subversive types in that college. Michelle, our high priestess, can then post all their names on her website.

I hope the new Dems in Congress and the Senate get an eyeful of that, too. I'm sure they will want to extend and enhance the powers of our George Walker Bush and make him Supreme Ruler and Protector of World Freedom for the United States and the Free world and the extended airspace for 5 parsecs.

Just kidding.
bascombe | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 3:59 pm | #

That video was so chilling. I was horrified by it. I've seen on tv when someone demostrated being tasered and he had to be held up after just one jolt.
By the way this the real Janet that usually posts here. I don't know who the one above is. It was not me. Sitemonitor can verify. I love this site and don't want anyone here to think that nutjob above was me.
Janet | 11.16.06 - 4:00 pm | #

"STAND UP! STAND UP! STAND UP!"
Those bastards just tazed him multiple times! I wouldn't be able to stand either! I'm surprised the crowd of witnesses didn't rush to his rescue!

That was -pardon my language- FUCKED UP.

Thank God for YouTube.
Tony K | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 4:00 pm | #

Therefore-My-Assertions-Are-Unassailable...in response to an admission of mental illness in the family sound to me like the Coulter/Limbaugh argument. That one can't argue with victims, and that the other side knows this, and makes the victim an advocate for them.
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 3:53 pm | #

Ahhhh, yes, good point. What I meant was that one could grab the debating high-ground on a topic merely by claiming to have personal experience with every single little bullet point made in an argument. Perhaps not my best snark ever. But I see what you mean.
Bonkers | 11.16.06 - 4:00 pm | #

sound to me like the Coulter/Limbaugh argument.
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 3:53 pm

Well, the difference here is that tehurchin was using his family history (which we must take his word on) as a defense of his positions.

The Jersey Girls, Sheehan et. al. never used their victimhood as a defense of their stances, or ever suggested that they should be above legitimate criticism. I always thought that the argument that Breitweiser (sp?) Sheehan, et al were naive or dupes was legitimate if incorrect. The personal attacks - the Jersey Girls were going to divorce their husbands anyway, Cindy was using her son's death to get rich - were what I always thought was beyond the pale.

Coulter and Limbaugh know this, of course... they just know they can get more mileage out of the "victims are not unassailable" canard. Nobody said they were. Idiots.
dhimmi | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 4:00 pm | #

Think, Please:

Please, think!! So, you are saying when in doubt, use excessive force?

How was he a threat, by resisting to leave a public library? You might have seen him as a threat to the student of UCLA, but the students of UCLA did NOT see this guy as a threat. If they did, they would not have been defending him.
Angry Black Man | 11.16.06 - 4:00 pm | #

"He was RESISTING being carried out, please read the accounts which are all over the news." - Think, Please

Yeah, being tasered over and over, makes it hard to get up and walk.

The paper says he was leaving, when they grabbed him and tasered him.

If your child were being tasered for complying with the campus cops, I imagine you'd be happy.
Weaseldog | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 4:01 pm | #

i am completely disgusted by the acts of the police in this incident. their actions were completely uncalled for. all of them should be arrested & charged with assault.
marc | 11.16.06 - 4:03 pm | #

"He was RESISTING being carried out, please read the accounts which are all over the news."

You mean that "liberal" media?
Janet | 11.16.06 - 4:03 pm | #

Bonkers | 11.16.06 - 4:00 pm | #

I felt the same way about people claiming to have been "tazered." They sounded like Rumsfield saying how he stands all day so forced stress positions on prisoners didn't sound like torture to him.

I've always seen the word spelled as tasered, but I've read a couple of reports and apparently some newspapers are spelling it that way too.
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 4:07 pm | #

RJ- yeah- that really shows how taser happy these guys were. They weren't in the middle of a gangfight - this was a University library. This could have been solved a LOT easier with a little restraint. Luckily the student wasn't hurt this time. But there have been plenty of others. In my city, cops have killed a 14 year old kid with a gun set on three shot burst. They have shot women in the back. The worst situation was when a sniper offed his own fellow officer a while back. A SNIPER. Of course this was in the midst of shooting over a hundred rounds into the house of a drunken man in a domestic dispute who WAS NOT ARMED. By the way- they managed to shoot him and paralyze him. Why? His wife, pissed off, said he was dangerous. OOO. better fire a hundred bullets into his house and shoot one of our men to show him we mean business.

It's incompetence and arrogance and cowboy attitudes. And if they go unpunished - they only breed more of the same. It's all good- until they run into YOUR kid. Then do you think Restraint is a good idea?
Fade | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 4:08 pm | #

Funny Bacombe...

How'd you get a hold of Limbaugh's Script fro Friday?
Weaseldog | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 4:08 pm | #

Mama's Fan | 11.16.06 - 3:53 pm | #

Thanks for the info Mama's Fan. Interesting that they're fellow students. I would hate to be identified as one of the CSOs in this incident and then find myself alone on campus with a bunch of other students who knew what I had done. Yikes
lisadawn82 | 11.16.06 - 4:10 pm | #

the guy is a student who forgot his id...and this is friggin la...you walk down the street and see something wierd happening.
Uncle Joe McCarthy | 11.16.06 - 3:56 pm | #

True story.

A friend and I were cruising down Hollywood Blvd, close to Grauman's Chinese Theater (where all the hand prints are on the sidewalk), in bumper to bumper traffic. Just checking the scene, when I looked over to the right and noticed this apparently homeless woman pushing a shopping cart full of gathered shit.

We were barely moving, so she was basically walking right along side of us for quite some distance, when she stopped. I was curious, and we weren't going anywhere fast, so I watched her.

She pulled a piece of paper from the shopping cart, pulled her panties down to her knees (wearing a dress), placed the paper in the crotch and took a shit.

RIGHT FUCKING THERE> On the side of Hollywood Blvd.

She promptly rolled the paper up, tossed it in a nearby garbage can, pulled her panties up (no wiping) and started walking beside us again.

Freaked me out.
BuelahMan | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 4:11 pm | #

Ysbaddaden,

I felt the same way about people claiming to have been "tazered."

Yup, pretty much what I was refering to as well, along with the other stuff (I think we know who and what we are talking about).

Heh. Rummy. That quazy guy....
Bonkers | 11.16.06 - 4:11 pm | #

come see the violence inherent in the system!
ericM | 11.16.06 - 3:58 pm

I get it. Slightly different situation here, dude.

The kid may have been being a drama queen here ("help, help, I'm being repressed!"), but AFAIK that is not yet a crime. And, as far as the video goes, it doesn't seem like he was resisting arrest.

I hafta say, if I was a kid named "Mostafa Tabatabainejad" in 2006 America, I might have a bit of a chip on my shoulder.
dhimmi | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 4:11 pm | #

dhimmi | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 4:00 pm | #

The Jersey Widows and Michael Fox seemed more than willing to debate. However, they seemed to be above attacking. It was like when John Ashcroft couldn't win an election against a former candidate's widow. He claimed it couldn't be done. While they sympathy factor would've ricochet any partisan attack, he still could've debated her on the points. Coulter and Limbaugh could've debated the Jersey Widows and Fox on the points, but they seem to know they have nothing but attack positions.

I was simply pointing out the structure of the argument that Limbaugh and Coulter use, not stating agreement.
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 4:11 pm | #

Look at the videos. The kid was limp and not resisting.

I find it refreshing that so many folks with a vigorous wife-beater attitude read Crooks and Liars. Maybe they're on a path of redemption. Unfortunately, their comments suggest regression and succumbing to the urge to smack.

Only a wife-beater would so quickly endorse stunning a college kid repeatedly because he wasn't following orders. To leave a building. To leave a library. Because he didn't produce an ID.

Well, keep browsing C & L and hopefully the urge to hit and kick and stab and bite and shoot and spit and smack and whack will eventually go away.
Doddled | 11.16.06 - 4:14 pm | #

No, I'm not arguing with you ysbaddaden... just with the point. I should have been clearer.

In any case, Bonkers's point is better than mine. It was the I-have-an-answer-for-everything business that rankled. And we don't know that he's not 100% accurate in everything he has said... it just seemed like any argument you made would be batted off the same way. "My brother in law is Iranian, and HE always carries his ID" or something like that...
dhimmi | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 4:17 pm | #

Weaseldog | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 4:08 pm | #

Way too easy. I witness several two-minutes-of-hate everyday at my workplace. It's amazingly easy to mimic a moron. It's so seductive, that form of ignorance, because it's actually fuel for any latent hatred(s).

I'm going to shower as soon as I get home and scrub my fingertips really hard.
bascombe | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 4:17 pm | #

Shouldn't the cops have been tasered in the library too?

It sounds like they were talking above a whisper.

Sssshhh...
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 4:18 pm | #

Those cops could have picked him up. That was completely sadistic how they handled that. I encourage everyone to get involved with this issue and stay involved until there is justice in favor of that student. Do not let this fall down the memory hole.
Frank M | 11.16.06 - 4:19 pm | #

ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 4:11 pm | #

correction! Ashcroft lost against the dead man! AFAIK
bascombe | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 4:20 pm | #

It's simple;
Asked for student ID and did not have it(he was a student).
Gathered his stuff together but was not leaving fast enough for the staff who called police.
Was walking out when the police arrived and an officer grabbed his arm.
He said 'don't touch me' which the police considered resistance so they tasered him.
You know the rest.
trevjr | 11.16.06 - 4:20 pm | #

When a place gets crowded enough to require ID's, social collapse is not far away.
RAH | 11.16.06 - 4:21 pm | #

Most Universities and colleges have stretcher like devices to carry down the handicapped during emergencies and the elevators are off limits. Couldn't these cops have found some of these?
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 4:21 pm | #

Sssshhh...
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 4:18 pm | #

As bad as that video is, I smiled when I heard (near the end of the clip, when everyone was freaking out in the foyer, or whatever) one person "shhhhh'd" the crowd.

Hilarious, after what just transpired.
BuelahMan | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 4:21 pm | #

I'm really shocked at the number of people who have showed up on this thread to defend these Nazis. It's really disheartening. I'm still shaking from watching this and I don't ever want to watch it again. I'm appalled.

Methinks the hired trolls were anticipating this story showing up on the lib blogs and were ready to come out in force.
Charles Granger 101 | 11.16.06 - 4:22 pm | #

AFAIK
bascombe | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 4:20 pm | #

Is that that duck in the insurance commercials?
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 4:23 pm | #

The taser incapacitates its target.

To complain that the target then doesn't walk is insane. If you want the person to walk, don't cripple them first.
Jeffrey Davis | 11.16.06 - 4:23 pm | #

Well they told him to get up after the first one so you're exaggerating.

Also, mr. tough guy, I stated they should have dragged him out and not tasered him.

I said the guy was being a dick and he was.

If you want to ignore facts and what people actually write maybe you'd be more comfortable in freeperland.
theurchin

Okay, I'll give you 1 second in between each taser shot to be up and moving fast quietly out the door. Now are you ready to prove your claims? I'm certainly ready to prove mine. AFA my being a "tough" guy, well, hehe, that very well could be.
rcg | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 4:24 pm | #

Methinks the hired trolls were anticipating this story showing up on the lib blogs and were ready to come out in force.
Charles Granger 101 | 11.16.06 - 4:22 pm | #

Don't worry, they'll be gone soon to watch online David Berg's beheading.
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 4:25 pm | #

Here's the email for the chancellor
Norman Abrams: chancellor@conet.ucla.edu
Mike | 11.16.06 - 4:27 pm | #

AFA my being a "tough" guy, well, hehe, that very well could be.
rcg | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 4:24 pm | #

Oh I dunno, a little MSG here, and maybe a nice little fruit based marinade there...
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 4:27 pm | #

I have mental illness in my family and have dealt with it on almost a daily basis for years.
theurchin | 11.16.06 - 3:24 pm | #

So, what do you think about this article, or do you think the police were just doing their job?

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/11/1...r=1& oref=slogin
navyswan | 11.16.06 - 4:28 pm | #

lawsuit, lawsuit, lawsuit.....
Phillip | 11.16.06 - 4:30 pm | #

The CSOs reported him. The Campus Police grabbed him by the arm as he was walking out and tasered him.
Weaseldog | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 4:31 pm | #

I just sent this letter to my senator and congressional rep. Many of you may want to consider something similar:

Dear Senator [...],

I recently viewed this revolting video of 2 UCLA Police Officers repeatedly Tasering an unarmed, non-threatening student sitting in their library. http://www.crooksandliars.com/20...red-in-library/

Simply for not complying with their demands, he was repeatedly shocked with 50,000+ Volts of electricity. When authority figures use violence to generate compliance upon the unarmed and non-threatening, it is torture. It is my belief that the Bush Administration has brought in a new and ugly age in American civil life: The Age of Torture.

I am aware that this is not normally an issue for Senators, and certainly not for Senators from a different state to handle; however, this incident, along with many others, has begged the question regarding the use of Tasers, torture, police brutality, and the protection of civil rights in modern American life.

Please inform me what, if anything, your stance and position is on federally sanctioned torture, abolishing police brutality, and protecting civil rights in the age of the Taser and the Bush Administration. Also, please inform me if there is any legislation that you currently have on the table that is designed to increase the protection of civil liberties in our imperiled nation.

Sincere thanks,

[...]
Justin | 11.16.06 - 4:31 pm | #

i gotta get me a camera phone....
Uncle Joe McCarthy | 11.16.06 - 4:32 pm | #

Wow, those computers in the library must be REALLY important. Someone must have been waiting to use it. That's IMPORTANT, worth harming a kid over. I mean, he didn't have the proper card to be there. He might have broken the computer or tried to watch porn or something. That's a serious issue.
Pat | 11.16.06 - 4:33 pm | #

I am pretty dissapointed the outrage for the rising fascism in this country is not high enough yet to have triggered the students in the library into a killing frenzy by witnessing such a insanly tyrannical act of authoritarian aggression...
rduke | 11.16.06 - 4:34 pm | #

charles...if you want disheartening...go read the multiple youtube threads

we reside in a country filled with sheeple
Uncle Joe McCarthy | 11.16.06 - 4:34 pm | #

Nothing like a piping hot serving of sheeple pie.
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 4:38 pm | #

Pat | 11.16.06 - 4:33 pm | #

Maybe he was trying to access the White House's web site that teaches how to build a nuclear bomb.
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 4:39 pm | #

Police brutality is as old as the first club. The Patriot Act didn't birth it.
The taser is just the latest "advance" in technology.

Why they didn't simply grab him by the collar and "escort" him the way any bouncer in a bar would is the mystery.

Actually, the greater mystery is how they battened onto the guy in the first place. Were they walking through checking everyone's id?
Jeffrey Davis | 11.16.06 - 4:40 pm | #

Think, Please | 11.16.06 - 3:56 pm |,

I don't get the "assume every suspected after-hours unauthorized library user is a rapist" argument. But even without getting into that, the "suspect" was limp and handcuffed (according to news reports, eyewitness accounts, the video, and the cops' report), and the cops tasered him for not complying with orders. That is abuse of power and battery. And it doesn't make anyone's children any safer.
Original Bill | 11.16.06 - 4:42 pm | #

"[...] And if they go unpunished - they only breed more of the same. [...]" - Fade.

Punished? some PDs evidently recruit for the psycho profile that reacts this way. It happens way too often.
danno | 11.16.06 - 4:45 pm | #

..immediately do what you are told without objection or question of any kind - for you will not be given time to explain.

...if you do object, then you must remain completely calm, you absolutely must not say anything to show that you are upset or in agony while they are torturing you or later some hateful idiots who are watching the video will accuse you of deserving to be brutalized or of being mentally ill..believe you me these lying liars are very creative and come up with all sorts of hair splitting shit to try and justify unnecessary and illegal brutality.

Actually, this is the standard that cops insist upon. And it is not a reasonable standard in routine contact with civilians. That's the problem.

FYI to everyone, all UC campuses that have their own UC police have real police. These are real cops with guns, etc. and those were the guys doing the tasering.

CSOs do not have tasers and are not authorized to use any kind of force. The CSO is probably most to blame here, in terms of how he went about dealing with the student at first, and I do hope the CSO program comes under some serious scrutany for this incident.

Also, I do hope that if a staff librarian is on premises, that CSO policy will be amended (and should already include) notification of any staff (not student helpers, staff). This incident would not have occured in the manner it did had day-time staff been present.
CW Skinner | 11.16.06 - 4:45 pm | #

On second viewing I got angry at the spectators not interceding.

I'm just old and cranky and grew up when people went out in the streets and threw stuff at the police.

There needs to be a balance of power...when a cop feels secure enough to threaten SPECTATORS there is a real problem.

Bobo
Bobo | 11.16.06 - 4:47 pm | #

These fascist "police" constitutes a far greater threat to UCLA security than anything else. These god damned Christian mother fuckers without a doubt singled out their victims based solely on skin hue.

The people in that library would have been well within their Constitutional and moral rights to defend the man being tortured and to apply force against the fascists enough to stop their assaults.
Fredric L. Rice | 11.16.06 - 4:48 pm | #

you know, I heard people say this kid over reacted or was a drama queen or whatever and can I just say...

Ann Coulter

Michelle Malkin

Glenn Beck - I mean he asked an elected official to defend himself as not being a traitor simply because he was Muslim.

I have heard more racist bs since the Towers fell and the war started than I can believe. This kid has spent a majority of his young adult years in this country while we have extremists on mainstream media calling for Muslim elemination and saying hateful and ignorant things about the Middle East and Islam. And you wonder why he might feel oppressed and put upon. He's walking around with that weight every day.

Personally I think his ire was justified. And even if it wasn't that still does not excuse the actions of the UCPD.
Liberal Girl | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 4:49 pm | #

Well, at least this kind of stuff will get filmed a lot more, since everybody and his brother has a camera or cell phone camera. I just hope it causes enough outrage to cause change. I'm worried that documenting abuse will become so commonplace that even filming it will be met with indifference.
Pat again | 11.16.06 - 4:49 pm | #

Were they walking through checking everyone's id?
Jeffrey Davis | 11.16.06 - 4:40 pm | #

They wouldn't have checked my id, because SuperEgo would've have given them what for!
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 4:51 pm | #

I am pretty dissapointed the outrage for the rising fascism in this country is not high enough yet to have triggered the students in the library into a killing frenzy..

Um. Not me, actually.

I don't even want to see them tazed. I don't wish the kids beat the cops up. I know it's a dorky thing to say, but two wrongs don't make a freaking right.

I just want CSOs not to taze kids. Period.
Valentinian | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 4:52 pm | #

The CSOs didn't tase that kid. Real (Tm) police officers did the tasing.
Weaseldog | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 4:53 pm | #

Pat again | 11.16.06 - 4:49 pm | #

Our next reality program, Cops Out of Control.

The one most violent will become national celebrities.
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 4:54 pm | #

Not CSOs, campus police, my mistake.

Also... there are phones with video cameras that can record six minutes of full motion? JUST HOW LONG DID I SLEEP LAST NIGHT?
Valentinian | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 4:55 pm | #

Here's a description of what the CSO's at UCLA do and how much they get paid. Looks like it was Campus Police that did the deed and not the CSO...which makes it even more horrible. (I could understand a CSO screwing up like this because they aren't really trained like a cop would be). These guys are cops who can't apprehend someone without the help of a taser. That's just scary. They have no business being cops.

http://www.ucpd.ucla.edu/ucpd/cso/
Mama's Fan | 11.16.06 - 4:56 pm | #

"University Police are one step removed from security guards, only worse. They can't make it onto a real police force so they become a university cop. These guys are fairly representative of the "cops" at our local university.
Gregory | 11.16.06 - 1:48 pm "

Here at the University of Florida, our PD is a state organization, same level as a state trooper and fully accredited. I would be VERY surprised to learn UCLA's cops arent the same.
Jon | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 4:57 pm | #

bluemah,

the incident you report i have seen over and over again

when the board wanted to put out porta potties all over the city, they were attacked...but that would have stopped incidents like the one you saw

la is one fucked up city
Uncle Joe McCarthy | 11.16.06 - 4:58 pm | #

How many wake-up calls do we need? Our country has transformed into a vicious police state helmed by our Dear Leader Bush. Expect more of this sort of treatment in the name of Homeland Security. I mean even the moniker "Homeland Security" sounds like Nazis.
CC | 11.16.06 - 4:57 pm | #

At this rate with UCLA cop riots and Homeland Security approval requirements for travel, can you imagine what a stewardess would do to you if you requested an extra bag of peanuts?
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 4:59 pm | #

At least the cops didn't throw a pie in his face.
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 5:00 pm | #

next time that happens, i hope that the crowd will join together and kick some security monkey ass.
bozo | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 5:03 pm | #

The police are criminals!
Franklin | 11.16.06 - 5:04 pm | #

"Asked for student ID and did not have it(he was a student).
Gathered his stuff together but was not leaving fast enough for the staff who called police.
Was walking out when the police arrived and an officer grabbed his arm.
He said 'don't touch me' which the police considered resistance so they tasered him.
You know the rest."

That is utter madness. It's just straighjacket crazy to taze a person for perceived deliberate slow compliance. The kid's folks need to take UCLA and the rent-a-pig contractors to court. To repeatedly taze that poor kid makes no sense at all. Those rental morons can't possibly come up with an excuse for what they did. One of them made damn near two of the kid. They couldn't handle that one scrawny child, loaded down with books? If that's the case, those two jokers weren't qualified to do the job, and should have been gone weeks back.
anan nimus | 11.16.06 - 5:04 pm | #

Two words: Kent State.
Students with a political point to make, and authorities with the adrenalin pumping. What would you expect?
mr.ed | 11.16.06 - 5:04 pm | #

And another lizard brain checks in.
E, you are truly, deeply, profoundly stupid. Please turn off mommy's computer and go outside and play. In traffic.
...
...
Christahmighty you trolls are stupid. Do you even understand the definitions of the words you use?

Jeff Boatright
- - - - - -

Look pal, first of all, if you're going to resort to childish name calling in your retorts you've already lost your argument. You wanna debate my statements? Fine. I'm up for it. But namecalling isn't a valid way to do so. I'm not some kid on the playground that's gonna be intimidated by your 'wit' in calling me names.

Secondly, I'm not a troll. I've been posting right along with everyone else on this blog and most of the time I agree with the liberal and centrist point of view. Especially about Bush and his PATRIOT act SS crap. In this case though, everybody's automatically jumping to the conclusion that the police in this case are EVIL STORMTROOPERS FOR BUSH because the student decided to bellow 'Here's your Patriot act' while he was being dragged out. Which is a load of paranoid claptrap.

Police are not allowed to "retaliate", you idiot. It's not their job AND it's illegal.

As a matter of fact, cops are allowed to defend both themselves, the civillians in the area and any property that could be damaged. If a subject is not complying with their orders, they escalate the level of force. Why not go ask a few of them before you start throwing 'idiot' around.

They are not allowed to use deadly force unless the offender is using deadly force. But if the circumstances warant it, which you CAN'T tell from that video, since it wasn't pointed in the direction of the cops or the kid when the first incident happened, then they can taser you in order to get your compliance. Are the cops just supposed to stand there and just keep repeating 'Stop... Don't do that' over and over forever?

Were you standing next to the kid when it happened? No? Then you know nothing about what happened before the student with the cellphone started filming.

You don't know if the belligerant student had a knife or other weapon, if he struck or threatened a cop or if he started threatening students or destroying property because the film doesn't show what he did to get the cops attention in the first place. So don't come out with this I'm more intelligent than you crap.
E in MD | 11.16.06 - 5:06 pm | #

Back when I was college aged this wasn't what we meant by getting buzzed.
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 5:06 pm | #

Guy's lucky he just got tasered. (I'm not being sarcastic.) Year and half ago Bassim Chmait was killed for much less.

I'm still unaware if there was any justice for Chmait.
Thing Fish | 11.16.06 - 5:06 pm | #

It looks like these students were doing nothing but standing around!
Pick up a chair or a brick and DO SOMETHING kids.
SpringH | 11.16.06 - 5:06 pm | #

The apologists for the cops here make me sick. Suppose it was you, or your kid? It could happen.
Dave L | 11.16.06 - 5:08 pm | #

I am glad that I live in a country with so many hyporcites.

This drama queen deserved what he got. No respect for rules or the law . He's lucky that he didn't get Rodney Kinged!!!

Immature people. Typical college students whose mommies and daddies have fat wallets who put them in these schools and then feel that their sons or daughters can do what ever they please.

Total hypocrites...
Anne | 11.16.06 - 5:08 pm | #

E in MD | 11.16.06 - 5:06 pm | #

Actually lizard-brain need not be construed as an insult. It comes real close to reptillian brain, which according to brain researchers is where the limic system is connected, and our fight or flight response located.

Fight or flight responses are a part of our survival drives where resides much of our libidos as well.
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 5:10 pm | #

..."During the altercation between Tabatabainejad and the officers, bystanders can be heard in the video repeatedly asking the officers to stop and requesting their names and identification numbers. The video showed one officer responding to a student by threatening that the student would "get Tased too." At this point, the officer was still holding a Taser.

Such a threat of the use of force by a law enforcement officer in response to a request for a badge number is an "illegal assault," Eliasberg said."...

http://dailybruin.com/news/artic...es.asp? id=38960
Who is John Galt? | 11.16.06 - 5:11 pm | #

Anne | 11.16.06 - 5:08 pm |

Coultergeist? That you?
Ryan | 11.16.06 - 5:11 pm | #

Looks like we've had another shift change at troll center.
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 5:11 pm | #

He's lucky that he didn't get Rodney Kinged!!!

Wow, nice troll. Come up with that one all on your own, did you?
Valentinian | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 5:13 pm | #

[deleted] Do you believe in rules?! All you kids need to learn that YOU NEED TO OBEY LAWS! He should have just left or got his id..it's they're job!! But you selfish, attention seeking students don't think of that? Noooooo!! only ohh what statement can I make..Just obey the rules and it'll be an easy place for everyone..[deleted]

Site Monitor: Please keep your tone civil. We're in discussion, not flame wars.

Edited By Siteowner

Edited By Siteowner
Jiga | 11.16.06 - 5:13 pm | #

Here at the University of Florida, our PD is a state organization, same level as a state trooper and fully accredited. I would be VERY surprised to learn UCLA's cops arent the same.
Jon | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 4:57 pm | #

This is true in Colorado as well. The campus police have the same authority as state troopers -- over and above city police.
Alma | 11.16.06 - 5:13 pm | #

This crap happens all the time to blacks and latinos. You hacks consistently look the other way, so know the redcoats are coming for you. Enjoy.
Happens All the TIme | 11.16.06 - 5:14 pm | #

Now even after reading some news stories I don't know all of the exact details in this situation, but let's be honest, multiple tasings for a kid who wouldn't leave a library quickly enough is just uncalled for. Tasing the kid while he's cuffed and on the ground is uncalled for. Threatening to use the taser on people who just want to take badge numbers is uncalled for.

If the guy doesn't have an ID, escort him out and just stress that it's school policy. I understand not knowing if this guy's armed or a threat or whatnot, but damn, that was just plain stupidity on the part of UCPD. This will be an interesting story to follow.
Master of the Flying Guillotin | 11.16.06 - 5:16 pm | #

the "suspect" was limp and handcuffed (according to news reports, eyewitness accounts, the video, and the cops' report), and the cops tasered him for not complying with orders. That is abuse of power and battery

Actually, it's torture.

This isn't the first time I've seen cops getting off on electrocuting someone who was never a threat, same as any thug in a third world dictatorship.
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Grand Moff Texan | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 5:16 pm | #

He should have just left or got his id..it's they're job!!

Uh, actually he was trying to leave when they began torturing him.

Thanks for playing.
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Grand Moff Texan | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 5:17 pm | #

I don't wish the kids beat the cops up. I know it's a dorky thing to say, but two wrongs don't make a freaking right.

I just want CSOs not to taze kids. Period.
Valentinian

You miss the whole point and that is that stopping the cops from torturing and possibly killing that poor kid is not a "wrong."
rcg | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 5:17 pm | #

Happens All the TIme | 11.16.06 - 5:14 pm | #

I've been wondering about that too. However, in this case your ire is misdirected. The student wasn't exactly your more Euro-American types. This would make the cops rule breaking either a civil rights violation or a hate crime or both.
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 5:18 pm | #

Angry Black Man

You want somebody wandering around your house that you don't know about? How about when he starts mouthing off to you? What would your reaction be then?

Now imagine you're responsible for the safety of 5000 students at a major university, that like every university has assorted nutjobs, pyromaniacs, rapists, bullies and assholes running around in addition to students who are just there for an education. For all you know, the mouthy one's gonna start getting violent.

Do I think these guys were justified in tazing this student 4-5 times ( it's a little hard to tell ). No. But tazing him once ( perhaps even twice ) might not be beyond the scope of the normal duties of a law officer.

If they were just zapping him because they were being dicks, yeah they should lose their jobs.

BUT YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT WAS HAPPENING BEFORE THE FILM CLIP.

So coming off with a knee jerk judgment of 'OMG all cops are evilz!' is just as bad as George W. Bush deciding to invade Iraq based on shotty evidence like the Yellowcake documents.

Until we hear from other witnesses and the cops themselves, you won't know what happened either. This is why we have a court system and don't let people decide the fate of others on some message board.
E in MD | 11.16.06 - 5:18 pm | #

If this was actual police I don't think I'd care. These CSOs were out of line, the student was a screaming cunt who decided to yell and whine instead of simply leaving quietly (or taking that first zap and then getting these assholes FIRED).

--Discretion is the better part of valor kids.--

Police officers almost HAVE to taser you anymore if you're dumb enough to refuse to move from just about any position because guess what?

If they have to scuffle with you physically and they hurt you (i.e. you fall on your fat face and break your nose), they're legally liable!

Thanks to dipshits who scream police brutality when police look cockeyed at them and ask them to leave property they don't own...it's actually legally SAFER FOR THEM TO FUCKING TASER YOU.
Fabricated | 11.16.06 - 5:18 pm | #

Witnesses say the student was tasered even after he was handcuffed. That is illegal use of force. These cops should be arrested.

Jiga, YOU deserve to be tasered for your idiotic post. You're obviously an ignorant inbred redneck Repuke.
Tom3 | 11.16.06 - 5:18 pm | #

Umm...I guess the Powell library abides by the Powell Doctrine...
Tom Delay | 11.16.06 - 5:19 pm | #

Immature people. Typical college students whose mommies and daddies have fat wallets who put them in these schools and then feel that their sons or daughters can do what ever they please.

No...nobody should have been treated that way over a pass.

Ultimatly the student and the cops are equal citizens and neither has a right to hurt the other.

We tolerate the cops hurting people in the interest of the public good.

But when the cops go beyond what is acceptable to us then THEY BECOME THE CRIMINALS.

In this case the cops became the crinimals with the repeated tazering and behavior toward rightly outraged FELLOW citizens.

Bobo
Bobo | 11.16.06 - 5:19 pm | #

Fabricated, you're full of shit.

Tasers have killed about 150 people since 1999. They are NOT safer, either physically or legally.
Tom3 | 11.16.06 - 5:20 pm | #

BUT YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT WAS HAPPENING BEFORE THE FILM CLIP.

Actually, we do.

Please go read up on the matter.

Thank you.
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Grand Moff Texan | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 5:20 pm | #

Hey Kyle, it isn't either-or.

We can have a police that use their brains. The man was not doing anything wrong. If they needed to do anything they should have just let him sit there while they called in about 20 more cops AND university officials. They should have tried to discuss the situation, and find out what the situation was. The man was not doing anything truly wrong.
King of Kings | 11.16.06 - 2:06 pm

Or perhaps, in a nice voice, asked him to leave and come back with an ID. If he didn't comply, they'd write him up. First he isn't doing anything illegal -- nor can he actually be trespassing on Public property.

Even if he was committing a crime, the "authorities" do not have the right to punish. He has to be a danger to others in order to use force -- unless we've lost that right as well.

>> I thought he was a little melodramatic at first... but I don't know how much a taser hurts. I'm a little paranoid as well -- it's funny how, when Ronald Reagan was in office, and now Bush the beast, there is so much to be afraid of.

I'm surprised nobody used the argument that he could have been holding Nuclear secrets, so by coddling people, we enable the terrorists -- blah, blah, blah.

I knew cops like this, and they did nothing about real crime -- they just didn't like uppity students.
VitriolAndAngst | 11.16.06 - 5:20 pm | #

>> I suspect that what most of the NeoCons are fighting for, is just the right to have a war. The REASON for Iraq, or the Patriot Act -- is superfluous to them. They just want to bring back the violence, because they get off on it. IN their minds, this man represents every hippy they didn't like, or sissy-boy they wanted to beat up. He is guilty, because he is powerless. The more Liberals "complain" about violence, or protecting the innocent, the more NeoCons hate them. They think it is weakness, and so like a junk yard dog, they growl.

Read some of the NeoCon blog sites -- they never met a peace activist they didn't hate. They are all bad. And when not totally upset about a UN mandate not being followed, or a mysterious chemical the UN found -- they bitch that the UN does nothing to solve problems and is useless.

WARNING! NOW I'M GOING TO WAX PHILOSOPHICAL...

NeoCons just want violence. And protecting "society" is just the excuse. Does one of them complain now, that crime is up -- especially violent crime? Do they care that abortions and teen pregnancy are up? No. They are excited that we can punish more people. Every one of them is ready to confront any social problem with more violence -- they are all Dirty Harry. No metrics or actually studying what creates crime need be bothered with.

And we are going to see a huge crime wave in the future. Half of our population lives on $30,000 or less -- more like scrapes by. "No Child Left Behind" is forcing schools to kick out poor performing students. To solve the Urban Legend of the Welfare mother, it's harder to get public assistance. Great. Now I realize, that it is debilitating that some people grow up in poverty, and on welfare, and do not get a "can do" attitude. But it is also almost guaranteed, that policies that break up families because being married stops the government assistance is also a cynical and thoughtless trick.

The same "authoritarians" who must fight the war on crime, because otherwise, people would have drugs (and totally forgetting the recreational use they had in college, for which they never got a sentence) -- shrug their shoulders at suggestions that our CIA ships the majority of it in the country. Ollie North is a national hero -- but a "freelancer" who has a bag of pot gets 20 years. Go figure.

It's all crap. These NeoCons don't care about the struggles of the people who end up on the wrong end of society. They just want an "enemy" to fight -- to give themselves purpose.

And they call themselves Christians.

The Story of Barrabus is a story about choosing violence over faith. Most likely this story was not historically true -- because Barrabus fostered armed insurrection against the Romans, for which that Authoritarian society would never have offered clemency;
http://atheism.about.com/od/bibl...k/a/ mark15b.htm
But on the face of it, the parable shows that the Priests, urged the people to condemn Jesus, because he was a threat to their power.
Another story I read, concerning gospels that were NOT adopted by the "Roman" Catholic Church... suggests that Judas turned Jesus in, not for the silver or because he didn't believe -- but because he was forcing God's wrath against the Romans. He believed that if God saw that his son was being brutalized by the Romans, he would smite them.

So Judas had all the faith in the world, about the power and reality of Jesus -- but he did not have faith in Jesus's message of peace and charity. That was his true sin. He betrayed the cause -- not the man.

NeoCon's are just like Judas, because of a threat, or some tyranny they imagine, the always choose to have faith in power -- rather than in the power of showing compassion for other people. They constantly suggest that the "enemy is not human, and does not respect kindness." Either they are Judas, making someone else "sacrifice" for the greater good (9/11), or they are Barrabus, urging violence to achieve peace.

They obviously didn't get the news, that on 9/11, Iranians were protesting the violence that hit America, and were the most upset--"We are all America today," they said. This did not make the news, because they "story line" they found sold more adds was; "we are at war." And war is a racket -- we've hit a million innocent people. Have we even gotten a dozen "bad guys?" Not sure, these trials aren't public so they can keep us secure (hide their incompetence).

Personally, I am not a Christian -- I think it takes both Power and Compassion -- because, while followers can be moved by compassion -- too often the leaders are not, the New Testament doesn't have much to say about Psychopaths who ARE actually incapable of empathy. A person can choose to be the "Status Quo Christian" -- who is fooled by the Country Clubs of Jesus, to send them money and not question. That sort of "faith" suggests that you believe so much in the garbage you are told, that you are absolved of guilt. While the "good faith" is that by setting an example of charity, humility, and compassion you can change people--church is just a place to strengthen that commitment -- not to get marching orders. A real Christian, would have sent flowers to Bin Laden, and probably would have been more successful in diffusing any power or influence he had than the violent Country-Club Christians of the Religious Right.

>> Sorry to take this so off topic. But I think this addresses the main heart of the matter; mainly, that we have "Authoritarians" who have no interest in "solving" anything. They want the police to beat people and they want to stay in Iraq -- so that desperation and ever more dangerous enemies, can justify the rage and hatred they already feel towards people not like them.
VitriolAndAngst | 11.16.06 - 5:21 pm | #

Dear Tom3,

Read my fucking post and try again. Jesus.
Fabricated | 11.16.06 - 5:21 pm | #

You want somebody wandering around your house that you don't know about? How about when he starts mouthing off to you? What would your reaction be then?
____________________________________

Didn't Birch Barlow ask that question?
____________________________________

... is just as bad as George W. Bush deciding to invade Iraq based on shotty evidence like the Yellowcake documents.

Until we hear from other witnesses and the cops themselves, you won't know what happened either. This is why we have a court system and don't let people decide the fate of others on some message board.
E in MD | 11.16.06 - 5:18 pm | #

I agree about the legal system, but did we have video of yellow cake that wasn't in Iraqi urinals?
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 5:22 pm | #

I've been wondering about that too. However, in this case your ire is misdirected. The student wasn't exactly your more Euro-American types. This would make the cops rule breaking either a civil rights violation or a hate crime or both.
ysbaddaden

Indeed.

The joke among cops is that whites get maced, non-whites get tased.

I guess this guy wasn't white enough.

Come to think of it, the only videos I've seen of police torturing people like this, the victims were black. In the case of sherrif's deputies using Q-tips to put mace under someone's eyelids, the victim was white.

Looks like all that training paid off after all.
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Grand Moff Texan | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 5:22 pm | #

.
.
.

Are the campus cops *real* cops, or just semi-glorified security guards?

I wonder if this will make the national news tonight...

The vid totally freaked me out... listening to his agonizing cries of pain. Just so over the top for a college library.

Had to do a search on cnn.com to find the article about this -- they totally played it down, like the kid was being difficult & the "cops" were just doing their jobs. Another example to me as to how the MSM does not report the facts. (Their zero-coverage of Colbert's 'speech' at the press dinner was my first example.)

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ejri | 11.16.06 - 5:23 pm | #

The U.S. can feel good to know that all those guys you sent to Iraq who have killed and maimed people for their oil are now returning to insure that your own lives are by the book. Don't fuck up or they may have as much remorse for you as they do for a dismembered Baghdad cabbie.
Griffin | 11.16.06 - 5:23 pm | #

Waaal, rcg, the original poster was calling for the cops to be killed.

The cops were way out of control. I would like to see this handled legally, not (as yet) through vigilante justice, which is what a mob of civilians restraining a peace officer would be.

Make no mistake. I'll join you all on the barricades if it comes to it. I just don't think we've reached that point yet. Almost, but not quite.
Valentinian | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 5:23 pm | #

Yeah, I can see it now, one guy hammering in the nails, and the other guy holding Jesus, saying, "Well, he should've followed our orders."

Ta...
ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 5:23 pm | #

The video demonstrates nothing except lots of screaming and yelling. The officer says "stand up" DOZENS of times. Who's to say the police weren't completely within their rights? If the police ask you to produce an ID...you show it. Don't have one and they ask you to leave? Guess what? Your ass is leaving. Care to get sassy or take your time gettin out? You run the risk of getting man-handled. This college kid may have just learned a simple fact of life....you mess with the bull you get the horn.
lame | 11.16.06 - 5:23 pm | #

you werent even there grand texan..It looked like all those stupid kids were going to start a riot for that pussy who kept screaming...Just leave when you're supposed to and dont cause a scene. Why do you have to make a statement? Obey the rules and the world will be easier for everyone. I've been tasered and it's not that bad..That guy is a total drama queen..obviously with the energy he had to continue screaming his pathetic statements. I would've threaten them all with a taser too if that pathetic crowd started forming..
Jiga | 11.16.06 - 5:24 pm | #

.
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Oh, and THANK GOD for blogs & hand-held cams! (Otherwise, Allen would be a Senator.)
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ejri | 11.16.06 - 5:24 pm | #

Or perhaps, in a nice voice, asked him to leave and come back with an ID. If he didn't comply, they'd write him up. First he isn't doing anything illegal -- nor can he actually be trespassing on Public property.

This happens on our campus all the time. Even homeless people get escorted off of school property, not tased.

Then again, I've known some of the cops around here (went to school with two of them) and they're not idiots. Maybe it's a California thing?
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Grand Moff Texan | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 5:24 pm | #

BUT YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT WAS HAPPENING BEFORE THE FILM CLIP.
E in MD

...and neither do you.

So why are you so quickly picking sides and making such critical judgments based on possible hypothetical evidence that may or may not exist and yet which you also ASSume will be to be contrary versus the significant evidence that you have seen?
rcg | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 5:25 pm | #

Immature people. Typical college students ...

Total hypocrites...
Anne | 11.16.06 - 5:08 pm | #

Still pissed off at that 660 score on the SAT and couldn't get into the junior college of your choice? It's obvious you wouldn't understand the sacrifices 95% of the students make to attend college just so they can better themselves.

So why don't you go back to spitting into your customer's Big Macs and let the adults talk.
Boring Scott | 11.16.06 - 5:25 pm | #

Also, 150 deaths / number of times tasers have been legally applied over 7 years = Statistically insignificant number.
Fabricated | 11.16.06 - 5:25 pm | #

you werent even there grand texan.

No, but I've read the police account in the press and you haven't.

I would've threaten them all with a taser too if that pathetic crowd started forming.

I've formed posses of complete strangers to stop brutality before, and we would have hammered your ignorant ass.

You just want him tased because you don't like the political implications of what he said, regardless of the situation. You're just a pussy who wants other people to torture people you don't like.

No one's afraid of people like you.
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Grand Moff Texan | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 5:27 pm | #

Till it's YOUR kid, Fabricated.

Peaple aren't Goddamn statistics.
Valentinian | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 5:28 pm | #

There must have been at least 20 people there. They should have jumped the cops.
AL in Mpls | 11.16.06 - 5:28 pm | #

[Take it down a notch]

Edited By Siteowner
Grand Moff Texan | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 5:29 pm | #

Thats it. I give up. Goodbye and good luck.
aussieboy | 11.16.06 - 5:30 pm | #

>> If this was actual police I don't think I'd care. These CSOs were out of line, the student was a screaming cunt who decided to yell and whine instead of simply leaving quietly (or taking that first zap and then getting these assholes FIRED).

--Discretion is the better part of valor kids.--

Police officers almost HAVE to taser you anymore if you're dumb enough to refuse to move from just about any position because guess what?

If they have to scuffle with you physically and they hurt you (i.e. you fall on your fat face and break your nose), they're legally liable!

Thanks to dipshits who scream police brutality when police look cockeyed at them and ask them to leave property they don't own...it's actually legally SAFER FOR THEM TO F******** TASER YOU.
Fabricated | 11.16.06 - 5:18 pm

>> I kind of agree with Fabricated's assessment. The student seemed to want to take offense. And I'm sure there is a lot of legal pressure on cops. I think we both agree, that whether the citizen in question is a jerk or not -- it doesn't change the responsibility of the Authorities in this matter.

But yeah, he sounded like a real whiner -- which I imagine, is why the CSOs wanted to keep tasering him. Whimper and cry, and Authoritarians want to beat you more.

I just found the AUTHORITY UBER ALLES crowd's reaction to the event interesting. They feel most frustrated by any attempt to stymie the ability of police to induce brutality -- whether or not it prevents crime or controls a situation.

>> But I hardly think this guy was damaged in any permanent way. I just think they wanted to Taser him -- that's where the problem lies.
VitriolAndAngst | 11.16.06 - 5:30 pm | #

UCLA top cops:
Chief of Police, Karl T. Ross 310 825-1633 kross@ucpd.ucla.edu
Captain, John Adams 310 825-4406 adamsj@ucpd.ucla.edu

This was posted before but i thought it should be put up again. i just wrote a letter to these guys. I encourage everyone else to do the same. be polite.
jt | 11.16.06 - 5:32 pm | #

"Till it's YOUR kid, Fabricated."

It's me and my kid's bad luck then. Accidents fucking happen.
Fabricated | 11.16.06 - 5:33 pm | #

[Consult the commenting policy if you wish to contribute]

Edited By Siteowner
Jiga | 11.16.06 - 5:33 pm | #

Try that on one of MY fellow students, and I'm not gonna photograph you, I'm gonna break my foot off in your ass.

Stupid campus rent-a-cops drunk on power.

Like terrorists are hanging out in LIBRARIES? Gimme a break.

And UCLA is a PUBLIC state university, and that was therefore a PUBLIC library, and you shouldn't have to "show your papers, comrade" just to read a damn BOOK.

I'm tired of these gestapo tactics.

And SHAME on the 30 or more people who just STOOD THERE watching, instead of INTERVENING and PHYSICALLY STOPPING the cops from treating another human being like that.
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5by5 | 11.16.06 - 5:35 pm | #

[Let's get back on topic and knock off the flame war. OK?]
[note to siteowner: still too much? Yes]
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Edited By Siteowner
Grand Moff Texan | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 5:37 pm | #

Well, apparently I'm replying to stuff that's over the top, which only makes more work for the siteowner.

Ooops.
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Grand Moff Texan | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 5:38 pm | #

"It's me and my kid's bad luck then. Accidents fucking happen." - Fabricated

Now its an 'accident' that he got tazed over and over while handcuffed and begging on the floor?

Folks, eyewitnesses have reported in. the kid was leaving they grabbed him. He got shrill. They tased him. Put him in cuffs and tased him again and again.

Tasing is supposed to prevent you from standing up. You lose motor control. Thats what tasing is for. Cops know this.

They were not CSOs.

They were well trained police officers.

Pay attention peeps. Eyewitnesses are giving consistent accounts of what happened. Go read the posted links.
Weaseldog | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 5:40 pm | #

OK, so all I said in the deleted comment was basically that we have the 2nd Amendment for a reason: an armed populace was supposed to be a break on the tyranny of the state.

I have no sympathy for underclass morons who justify un-American brutality by regurgitating stupid maxims (that other people thought up for themselves) like "you mess with the bull, you get the horns."

I'm an American, not some damned slave. I don't think that some guy with an associates degree and a badge is my master.

Everybody got that?

Have I been banned yet?
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Grand Moff Texan | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 5:40 pm | #

Well Regulated Militia, not "armed populace"

Learn to read, my friend.
Ryan | 11.16.06 - 5:42 pm | #

Shocking video, which explains, and maybe excuses, the overwhelming ratio of emotion to logic in these posts. I agree that the police were out of line here, but, as others have pointed out, to attribute it somehow to an incipient police state is nonsense. Sillier still is the reactionary pile-on in response to perfectly reasonable points made by "Think, Please" and "theurchin." If you can't handle any kind of critical thinking being applied to the discussion, then you really don't have much call to demean the intelligence of the cops, since you are pretty much a knee-jerk mental conformist in your own right (just on the other end of the spectrum).

Also, please GOD nobody act in reliance in any way based on the "legal opinions" expressed in this thread. You might as well just make some shit up for yourself; it'd be more accurate than almost all of what has been said in here about the law. My favorite: apparently, under California law every witness has a "class action" suit for "psychological damage." Wow. Just wow. I'm surprised you didn't go ahead and file suit on your own behalf, since you watched the video. Makes nearly as much sense, unless California law is utterly and totally off the deep end compared to the other states' majority (or minority) rules.
Anti-Screed | 11.16.06 - 5:42 pm | #

why the fuck did everyone just stand around and not take the fuckers out??
Anonymous | 11.16.06 - 5:42 pm | #

Thanks, siteowner, I'm really not trying to make more work for you.

I think I've said what I have to say and I've shown the pro-facist types around here the respect they deserve:

zero.

If you won't stand up for your freedom, why should I?
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Grand Moff Texan | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 5:42 pm | #

Listen to that kid, sounds like hes being tortured. :|

Fuck you police.

Stand up, how fag!!!!

Soon we will rise up, not much longer.

What kinda affect do you think this will have on this kids life?

They did what they could, to me, thank god there were no tasers back then.

I am so sorry Kid. I beg these people to stop this unconstitutional crap, please stop.
KuciNiCh | 11.16.06 - 5:43 pm | #

Well Regulated Militia, not "armed populace"

Learn to read, my friend.
Ryan

Learn to read the various drafts of the 2nd Amendment and the debate surrounding it if you want to tell me what it means. You haven't so you can't.

So, I'll say it again: the consensus of the framers was that an armed populace was a break on tyranny. That is the meaning of the words in the 2nd Amendment.

Just like we use the words of the framers to show the Christaliban what the Establishment Clause means, remember?
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Grand Moff Texan | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 5:44 pm | #

"fabricated: Thanks to dipshits who scream police brutality when police look cockeyed at them and ask them to leave property they don't own...it's actually legally SAFER FOR THEM TO FUCKING TASER YOU"

This site's for you:
http://www.unknownnews.org/ 06111...inkybadges.html

Yea, police brutality is a joke..and everyday civilians are never harassed, or abused, because generally speaking, cops are perfect. Perfect human beings with guns, and a commonly occurring power-complex.

No wonder alot of police are pro-bush..they're totally into that authority worship.

I'll bet a hundred bucks that "Fabricated" is also of the variety that says "If you don't have anything to hide, you dont' have anything to worry about"

Until,that is...even when you don't have anything to hide, such as when I ran out of gas in a Columbus Ohio 'ghetto' near the OSU campus at 3:30 am..had just moved for a contract IT job..two officers instead of helping, threatened that they'd better never catch "someone like me" there again..I was white, and there were only 2 reasons "someone like me" would be there..drugs, or hookers. This was at the same time Columbus was the SECOND city nationwide to be sued by the Justice Department for police brutality/misconduct.

The kid in the video, was a K I D. Old enough to know better, but that does not excuse multiple taser hits, especially when there are 5+ cops around, to drag his butt out after he couldnt' stand up.
JoshDestardi | 11.16.06 - 5:45 pm | #

They should have just dragged him out... tazer should be reserved if someone is fighting back, which this kid clearly wasn't.
King of Mean | 11.16.06 - 5:45 pm | #

to attribute it somehow to an incipient police state is nonsense

Indeed. The torture was going on at a very personal level, and is not some kind of nation-wide program.
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Grand Moff Texan | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 5:46 pm | #

im afraid to study!
Slayer | 11.16.06 - 5:46 pm | #

After my first protest against the torture bill I have witness first hand on police brutality. I will have a chance to be heard on that. When I see this I can beleive that this is a nationwide thing. I have known ex-officer threatening my life if I spoke about his affairs. I emphasise that he is an ex as this behavior is not tolerated everywhere, and that there are good cops and bad cops. We need to protect the good cop from the bad. But lately seems to be more of the bad, and if the good one don't speak out we may have another civil war brewing, just as it happens in Germany. People will take this to the street if this continue. Get active and nip this in the bud before it spread.
paranoia | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 5:47 pm | #

why the fuck did everyone just stand around and not take the fuckers out??
Anonymous | 11.16.06 - 5:42 pm |

Because crime in response to crime isn't okay. They wouldn't have stopped anything, and they would have turned the cops into victims.
Ryan | 11.16.06 - 5:47 pm | #

Anti-Screed, critical thinking has hit a new low, if those are the examples. In fact it reads a misdirection, not critical thinking.

Bringing for instance, a rape analogy into this discussion, has nothing to do with critical thinking. Its designed to hit an emotional hotbutton and disengage critical thinking.

Appealing to the primitive monkey brain in all of us, is not a technique for critical thinking.

I think what you mean to say is, "They said things I agree with and you hurt my feelings when you disagreed with them."

But thank you for playing.
Weaseldog | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 5:48 pm | #

why the fuck did everyone just stand around and not take the fuckers out??
Anonymous | 11.16.06 - 5:42 pm
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"Modern taser-type weapons fire small dart-like electrodes with attached metal wires that connect to the gun, propelled by small gas charges similar to some air rifle propellants. The maximum range is up to 10 meters (30 feet). The `pulse' models are designed to bring down a subject wearing up to a Level III body armor vest."
from Wikipedia.com
hello | 11.16.06 - 5:49 pm | #

Paranoia, I agree. I've known good and bad cops.

Cops are people too.

The cops that tased this guy, and the cops that didn't stop it, all need to find new careers.

Then hire new cops that don't fit their psychological profile.
Weaseldog | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 5:50 pm | #

"You want somebody wandering around your house that you don't know about? How about when he starts mouthing off to you? What would your reaction be then?"

That doesn't even make sense. UCLA library is a public library. My house is private property. Can't compare the two.
Angry Black Man | 11.16.06 - 5:50 pm | #

Why is it that 2 untrained bouncers can throw any violent, obnoxious drunk out of any bar in America, yet 5 trained officers can not carry a handcuffed, allegedly mouthy college kid out of an f-ing library?
Boring Scott | 11.16.06 - 5:50 pm | #

Idiots! the cops were protecting you! oh police brutality, police brutality..the kid should have just left..He didn't care that he put YOU his fellow students in danger did he? He put himself, cops and the other students in danger instead of just walking away and doing what he was told..HE didn't care about the students either!!! Get it?! He cared about making a scene and starting a riot..Very mature let me tell you! That kid has ALOT to learn.
Jiga | 11.16.06 - 5:50 pm | #

Fabricated | 11.16.06 - 5:33 pm

Spoken like a true NON-Parent.
Fade | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 5:51 pm | #

Also, 150 deaths / number of times tasers have been legally applied over 7 years = Statistically insignificant number.
Fabricated | 11.16.06 - 5:25 pm |

>> I agree. But we've invaded two countries, and spent a Trillion $ for about 3,000 people being wrongfully killed.

Do we do this against bathtubs that kill that same number every year?

How about the 10,000 accidentally killed in drug busts.

Or the 110,000+ dying from bad prescriptions?

About 200,000 from motor accidents.

Statistically, the only thing terrorizing America is our government and our media. The chance of getting hurt by Al Qaeda is so much less than any other factor in our lives. We don't worry enough about real threats -- like French Fries, but we get in a tizzy because they were "foreigners."

So, yeah, Tasers are safe. I'm sure that most of those deaths, however, were from weak hearts or Police abuse.

>> Anyway, you don't taser someone for not having an ID -- nor for being a pain in the ass or refusing to leave a school. From time to time, I forget my wallet -- I'd hate to be thought of as a criminal instantly for that.

When cramming for exams in the Computer Lab, I was lucking I remembered to bathe. After a few days of junk food, caffeine, and sleepless projects -- the average student is a hair trigger from becoming a killing machine.

>> I don' t want to see a lawsuit out of this mess. Just drop these sorts of charges on police -- as long as you allow me as a citizen to kick their ass from time to time.

If you give someone power and authority -- that means there is a greater onus of responsibility on their actions.

And I support the police -- just not the bad ones who makes little incidents like this into situations. Anyone who wasn't a thug and a moron could have gotten that kid out of there -- no problem. My sister had to deal with violent retarded adults in more dangerous situations -- and she is 5'4" tall.

>> and not that I don't want them to have their day in court -- but my first impression is that, these are bullies who were itching for a chance. And some whinny kid set them off. Not very professional on their part. -- but I don't think they should lose their jobs or get the campus sued. They aren't very different from the 90% of campus security anywhere else who can't get a job in the police force.

A public apology and a campus discussion on violence and the responsibilities of students would do wonders to diffuse the tensions. But going to court on this is either going to intimidate the Cops or the students. And of course, they college, sensing yet another liability, will enforce some really stupid rule like; "no studying or being in the computer lab for more than 4 hours." So that they can do SOMETHING that annoys students.
VitriolAndAngst | 11.16.06 - 5:52 pm | #

Jiga the troll. There was no danger in this library. Just a few cops indulging in one of the job's perks- abusing minorities.

Real Cops don't have to resort to this crap. Those men don't deserve to be police.
Fade | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 5:53 pm | #

He put himself, cops and the other students in danger instead of just walking away and doing what he was told..HE didn't care about the students either!!! Get it?!

No, and neither do you, apparently, because that's not even what the police say happened.

You're playing out some drama in your head, you don't know or care about any of the fact here, you're just wasting bandwidth with your personal problems.
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Grand Moff Texan | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 5:54 pm | #

Real Cops don't have to resort to this crap.

Word. We don't have that kind of trouble here because our cops don't need to escalate a situation ...

... just to feel like the men they're not.
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Grand Moff Texan | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 5:55 pm | #

E in MD,

Did um's feewings get hurt? Boo hoo.

If you make ridiculous statements, you'll get ridiculed.
Jeff Boatright | 11.16.06 - 5:57 pm | #

Weaseldog: line up the "OMFG!!!11!!! NAZIS!!!!1111one!!" posts versus those with the audacity to point out very simple facts, and align them into logical (read: non-over-emotional) arguments, and tell me who's displaying poor critical thinking.

As for "they said things I agree with and you hurt my feelings when you disagreed with them..." Let me be clear from the start, I only reply to this comment out of boredom and procrastination. All I really need to point out is that there is nothing in my post to lead anywhere near that interpretation. In fact, putting words in my mouth like that only proves my point that there is a strong chord of reactionary groupthink running through this thread. In your case, we can add projection. What other grounds do you display in your post for criticizing my comment, other than that you disagree with it? As for whether that hurts your feelings, I don't presume to say (unlike you).

As for the rape "analogy," this is where you really show what I'm talking about. Thank you. Nobody made a rape analogy. The point made was that the IDs are checked to prevent problems like rape. When the further point was made that if the story were a string of rapes, we'd all be calling for checking IDs, that was not a "rape analogy," that was a call to put things in perspective. Which is, obviously, a tenet of critical thinking. Ignoring what was actually said in order to make some nonsensical point about "monkey brains" is not.

P.S. "Thank you for playing" should probably be the subject of a new Godwin's Law.

THX BYE!!!!!!1111one!!!!
Anti-Screed | 11.16.06 - 5:57 pm | #

"Heads should roll at the LAPD for this Bull S***! This was totally uncalled for! I hope that student sues the hell out of the LAPD." --TruthSeeker

The first truth you should seek is that this wasn't LAPD.

UCLA is my alma mater. But let me tell you a story about Westwood, just down the street. At the start of the illegal Iraq adventure, a Sheriff (who are also not LAPD) whacked a kid and was video'd doing it.

The civil courts are still in session, and that Sheriff did not like the results. The same for the Uni cops. There will be a swift repudiation of this action, and a painful lawsuit for the university to help them make it stick.

Why did they use the TASER? Couldn't wait to try out their new weapon. Don't forget Kerik -- this is just another example of how the Rapepublicans get rich on violence.
Paul in LA | 11.16.06 - 5:58 pm | #

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"And UCLA is a PUBLIC state university, and that was therefore a PUBLIC library, and you shouldn't have to "show your papers, comrade" just to read a damn BOOK."

I agree, 5by5.

What the campus cops did was indefensible & insane.

If I ever do a protest, even just a peace rally, I'm taking a mini-cam. These authoritarians are simply out of control.

The UCLA cops BEHAVED LIKE THUGS. What THEY did was *criminal*.

THAT STUDENT pays THEIR SALARIES. Those cops work for *him.*

He is an American Citizen! And they brutalized him! Oh, the irony -- top protect us from terrorists, the cops behave like terrorists.

Who needs that kind of protection?

If we would actually *dialogue* with those who hate Americans, and perhaps not shit in their countries, then perhaps they wouldn't hate us & terrorize us.

To quote Maya Angelou, "brutality is NEVER acceptable."
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ejri | 11.16.06 - 5:59 pm | #

"retaliate" is what you wrote. Now you're saying "defend themselves".

Again I ask: Do you even know the definitions of the words you're using?
Jeff Boatright | 11.16.06 - 5:59 pm | #

Hoo boy, he linked to an incident where a dirtbag cop abused his power, that sure sent me reeling. I better just pack it up and go home.

Oh wait, that DOESN'T mean screaming and cursing at armed officers until they tase you is a smart thing to do. Who'd have thought that authority figures actually had authority? I thought I just obeyed the law out of politeness.

Were the taser hits at the end excessive and fucking dirty? Yeah they were. These douchebags should be severely disciplined if not fired for continuing the tase a subdued subject.

Yeah, they should've just beat his ass to subdue him when he started screaming hysterically and acting hostile instead of simply getting their badge numbers, leaving, and then taking that shit up with the people over them. Good old fashioned violence is obviously safer than a taser.

Both parties were out of line. I'm sorry that doesn't support your kneejerk reaction of government/authority hatred. There's a smart way of dealing with assholes like those officers in a civilized society and it's not to wail and become physically hostile.
Fabricated | 11.16.06 - 5:59 pm | #

Just did a quick google on this and a news article stated he had his backpack on and was in process of leaving when police grabbled his arm and then ....
Also, he informed police he had a medical condition. Also, when a female student requested police name and badge #, she was threatened with a tasering. Hope the kid sues the bunch of them -
Ms. M | 11.16.06 - 6:00 pm | #

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OMG, Fabricated, I'm so glad you're not a Diplomat or Ambassador or anything. The world would surely end.
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ejri | 11.16.06 - 6:02 pm | #

"UCLA library is a public library." --Angry Black Man

UCLA's 10-something libraries are NOT public because they are on campus, which requires permission of the Regents for entry, though generally the public is welcome to use the libraries. Use of the libraries is a privelege, not a right.
Paul in LA | 11.16.06 - 6:04 pm | #

"OMG, Fabricated, I'm so glad you're not a Diplomat or Ambassador or anything. The world would surely end."

What does that have to do with ANYTHING?
Fabricated | 11.16.06 - 6:04 pm | #

"
"It's me and my kid's bad luck then. Accidents f**king happen." - Fabricated

Now its an 'accident' that he got tazed over and over while handcuffed and begging on the floor?

Folks, eyewitnesses have reported in. the kid was leaving they grabbed him. He got shrill. They tased him. Put him in cuffs and tased him again and again.

Tasing is supposed to prevent you from standing up. You lose motor control. Thats what tasing is for. Cops know this.

They were not CSOs.

They were well trained police officers.

Pay attention peeps. Eyewitnesses are giving consistent accounts of what happened. Go read the posted links.
Weaseldog | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 5:40 pm
"

>> I don't think that was what was being said. 150 deaths with perhaps tens of thousands of "taserings" means that it is not VERY dangerous. Purposely tasering someone who is handcuffed and under control is abuse. And of course, if you wanted to, you could probably induce a heart attack.

And of course you are right on that point -- purposely tasering someone over and over is wrong -- and I don't think you or "Fabricated" are arguing that.

I think there are enough eyewitness people and the Video shows enough to know that the Cops (if you say so) were out of line. It doesn't really matter what they kid said -- and he never presents a threat at any time (not that we could see that much) -- but the way the cops are calmly standing around, and calmly jamming that taser in his armpit (ouch!) suggests that the THREAT was only from them.

Hopefully, this is not a trend. I'd be more worried about police like these, than someone stealing my stereo for a fix.
VitriolAndAngst | 11.16.06 - 6:08 pm | #

"And UCLA is a PUBLIC state university, and that was therefore a PUBLIC library,"

Incorrect. Look down the next time you cross over into UC property. You will see that it is not public land.

"If I ever do a protest, even just a peace rally, I'm taking a mini-cam. These authoritarians are simply out of control."

Don't exaggerate. The university cops are not all to blame because a few officers did this.

"The UCLA cops BEHAVED LIKE THUGS. What THEY did was *criminal*."

That's unlikely. What they did was, however, actionable in a civil court.

"THAT STUDENT pays THEIR SALARIES. Those cops work for *him.*"

Also incorrect. The cops work for the Regents.

We don't live in a socialist country. You might want to write that down somewhere so you can remember it.
Paul in LA | 11.16.06 - 6:08 pm | #

This was caught on tape....think how much bullshit just like this doesn't get taped.
TheOneRocker | 11.16.06 - 6:09 pm | #

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"What does that have to do with ANYTHING?"

Clearly you lack peace-making skills.

When one (or two, or three) is more powerful then someone, they practice restrain. It is the civilized thing to do. They don't beat the weaker person over the head; they don't lord their power over them.

Tasering ought to be their last resort. If they truly want a peaceful result, they would elicit it. It's possible -- it can happen. Just ask Dr. King or Gandhi. They changed the world, and the course of history, without a single weapon.

These cops responded with their egoes. Had they checked themselves, they wouldn't be receiving national attention right now. But they just couldn't bite it... they had to escalate.
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ejri | 11.16.06 - 6:11 pm | #

"...I better just pack it up and go home...
Fabricated | 11.16.06 - 5:59 pm

I'm sure no one here will stop you. You're not forced to be here, and judging from some of your other comments, you are not liking it here or anyone who posts a comment that doesn't conform with your narrow view of the world.

Faced with circumstances like that, only a fu*kwit saddo would stick around. So if the shoe fits, I'll guess you'll keep posting goofy 'tell the liberals off' bullshit.
miss_kitty | 11.16.06 - 6:15 pm | #

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Paul in LA, I respectfully disagree. Yes, I do believe we should have mini-cams handy when dealing with these out of control cops. And yes, I do believe the cops in this case behaved like thugs.

And, yes, I do believe you are a bit snide. I do not have hard evidence to support that statement, but it is my opinion & I'm sticking with it.
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ejri | 11.16.06 - 6:15 pm | #

"Clearly you lack peace-making skills."

Then both the kid and the cops obviously lacked them as well.

What is so hard to understand about simply cooperating, getting badge numbers or a good look/picture of them, leaving, then going to the proper authorities to lodge a complaint?

Is there something wrong with that?
Fabricated | 11.16.06 - 6:17 pm | #

"Just a few cops indulging in one of the job's perks- abusing minorities." --Fade

That is highly unlikely. UCLA has 40% Asian freshmen and is a very diverse campus.

Also worth nothing is that this took place in the computer area, which is a restricted privelege reserved for students. Non-students using computers may keep students from access.

That's not to justify the escalation of force, but rather to say that if they had simply manhandled him out of the area he was told to leave (and then probably off campus), none of this would be news.
Paul in LA | 11.16.06 - 6:17 pm | #

Because crime in response to crime isn't okay. They wouldn't have stopped anything, and they would have turned the cops into victims.
Ryan | 11.16.06 - 5:47 pm

Agree with this, especially the last part. There may be a time for uprising, but a bunch of kids Tuesday night at the Powell ain't the time.
Valentinian | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 6:19 pm | #

The multitude of similar kind of incidents, which have successfully been dealt with without tasers, proves that the authorities were escalating the incident unproportionally.

The fact that you don't have to be physically involved lowers the limit for taser use in mundane situations like this. i guess it must feel like having a remote control.

The kid fought back, to have peace, not to physically harm anyone. Sure, he made things worse too, but the consequences are revealing. The incident resulted from the chain of bad decisions.

There will always be some individuals who enjoy controlling others, and who get masked in uniforms and credentials, and it's important to not let them be consumed by themselves. it's important to care and have a dialogue. If we never question the rights of the authorities on us, there will never be a truly free society, but a prison instead.
jay | 11.16.06 - 6:19 pm | #

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"What is so hard to understand about simply cooperating, getting badge numbers or a good look/picture of them, leaving, then going to the proper authorities to lodge a complaint?"

On the flip side: what is so hard about the cops chilling out, being reasonable, & providing leadership rather than tasering an unarmed college student & almost causing a riot?

People have been killed by tasers. Is it really worth it??
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ejri | 11.16.06 - 6:20 pm | #

FYI - Here are some intelligent people who share my sentiments..

they should have tasered the rest of those lame ass students..

and that dumbass should have just stood up.

and what iranian-exchange student is walking around not carrying identification? fucking moron.

If you were in another country(like Iran) as a student and didnt have your passport or id they would put you in fucking prison.. end of story.

that kid was trying to make stupid political point "heres your patriot act!" uh.. dude.. these are local cops.. not fucking federal agents.

And if the patriot act carts off visitors to my country that don't have ID... and don't know how to respect cops when they ask for ID...well, more power to it.

I am ARMENIAN.. I get stopped at every damn airport and practically stripped searched for everything..

And I am glad

bipolarbear 10
Nov 16,2006 | 3:46.39 PM

The police clearly said to stand up OR you will be tazed again. The moron did not LISTEN!! I know people want to prove how they are being abused but come on...He just had to stand the fuck up and things would have been fine! Stop thinking the police are the assholes! Look who they have to deal with on a daily basis! Is anyone happy to see a police officer?!

Elle
The kid should have stood up. I'm so tired of people complaining about "justice" when he is completely disobeying authority. If there was more respect for authority, it wouldn't be such a problem. Hell to to No on the "where are our rights" students. Get over yourselves.

tula
Jiga | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 6:21 pm | #

"Faced with circumstances like that, only a fu*kwit saddo would stick around. So if the shoe fits, I'll guess you'll keep posting goofy 'tell the liberals off' bullshit."

Uh, I consider myself a liberal kiddo. I've voted Democratic or Libertarian since I turned 18.

I hate angry, undisciplined, needledicked government employees just as much as anyone else, but I don't blindly lash out with kneejerk government hatred while at the same time reaping the benefits of being in what's supposed to be a civilized society.

All government are coercive institutions. We AGREE to let the government coerce us into doing/not doing things in order to be a part of it.

Do I lose my membership card now or what?
Fabricated | 11.16.06 - 6:23 pm | #

Paul in LA, I respectfully disagree. Yes, I do believe we should have mini-cams handy when dealing with these out of control cops."--ejri

Have them as you will.

I'm an LA street protester with something like 400 protests under my belt in the last five years. I deal with the LAPD, CHP, Sheriff, and other cops on a regular basis, and WE DO NOT SEE ANY MAJOR PROBLEMS.

I was just up in SF for a march three weeks ago. I talked with an ANSWER organizer at length, and was surprised to hear that they had also not had problems with the SFPD, which has a terrible reputation.

UCLA is a fairly civilized place. So is Los Angeles, and apparently so still is San Francisco. Trying to amp up a few incidents into a general pattern is falsification of the evidence. NATIONWIDE, there is a problem with the use of TASERS, and it is a NATIONWIDE problem. Local cops, however, are not a major problem--TASERS are the problem.
Paul in LA | 11.16.06 - 6:23 pm | #

"
OK, so all I said in the deleted comment was basically that we have the 2nd Amendment for a reason: an armed populace was supposed to be a break on the tyranny of the state.

I have no sympathy for underclass morons who justify un-American brutality by regurgitating stupid maxims (that other people thought up for themselves) like "you mess with the bull, you get the horns."

I'm an American, not some damned slave. I don't think that some guy with an associates degree and a badge is my master.

Everybody got that?

Have I been banned yet?
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Grand Moff Texan | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 5:40 pm |
"

>> No, that is not what the 2nd amendment was about. "The right to bear arms" and to form a militia because America was founded in a country occupied by another people -- namely Indians, and we also had British troops, and crooks and such and it was a long way to an outpost of forte for some protection. There was some discussion about not having a standing Army in America (because then countries go to war -- like we do, every generation). Sweden trains citizens to fight, and they all have weapons but no standing army (if I've got my facts straight on this) -- that, more than neutrality, prevented the Germans from invading during WW II.

What the "founders" put in place to prevent tyranny was the election system -- and all the checks and balances of power. That it lasted 200 years until George Bush is pretty good. But if you could sneak a video camera into one of Dick Cheney's meetings, that would do a lot more to preserve your country's Liberty than any violence.

You aren't going to win with that -- they will just drag you away and call you a lunatic. Fox news would report that a Left Wing Radical Blogger is siding with Al Qaeda -- and that's the last anyone would hear from you.

>> But hey, I know how you feel. If I could, I'd love to punch out some jack-boot, but I'd be the one getting arrested -- not the police who were tasering a student. The courts are not friendly to anyone moving against authority. It seems like a good idea, but 2 years in prison for assaulting an officer.

I agree with others.... this isn't a police state issue -- it's just some police, who got out of hand like police have done since the beginning of, well, states that have police.
VitriolAndAngst | 11.16.06 - 6:23 pm | #

Paul in LA,

You're the kind of sociopath who looks at someone being tortured and blithers on about nitpicky shit like whether the "regents" are in control or not (lame), instead of stepping in and stopping the violence. You have no conscience and no guts. And PS, since the governor established the university, it IS a public university, even if they post nifty little signs about "private" property. As long a they are accepting tax dollars, as a taxPAYER I have a say in how they behave.

The rent-a-cop's actions were straight up authoritarian BULLSHIT, and someone SHOULD have kicked their ass for it.

The man they were torturing was a STUDENT who's money was paying their salaries. Without student money, universities don't exist. REGENTS don't exist.

Students should be able to expect -- AT A MINIMUM -- that they can go to the frickin' LIBRARY and not be electrocuted by the Junior KGB while they try to study.

This "police-state uber alles" sentiment in this country has gotten COMPLETELY out of hand.

IT. MUST. STOP.
5by5 | 11.16.06 - 6:23 pm | #

Just a few more - You have ALOT to learn in life! Hence the unfortunate incident..

fuck that kid - stand the fuck up asshole
carry your damn student id with you - you fucktard
shit - taser him again - the po po did the right thing - except they stopped - they need to finish the damn job.

jesus 13
Nov 16,2006 | 3:52.24 PM

NEWSFLASH: You have to obey the police

Jewel-Lee 14
Nov 16,2006 | 3:56.16 PM

that guy what he deserved, he wasn't leaving like he said. they asked for his id......he would not show them and still wouldn't leave.
he only got tasered when he wouldn't comply........btw i have been tasered more than once and still got up, the effects do not last long.......most ppl just think all cops abuse their power.

kevin
Jiga | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 6:24 pm | #

"On the flip side: what is so hard about the cops chilling out, being reasonable, & providing leadership rather than tasering an unarmed college student & almost causing a riot?

People have been killed by tasers. Is it really worth it??"

I will say it again: Those cops are assholes and were out of line. If they were obviously itching to try out their new toy or over-reactionary douches, it came down to the to be the better person and leave.

He chose not to and the situation escalated.

I'll say this again as well:

Discretion is the better part of valor.
Fabricated | 11.16.06 - 6:25 pm | #

"If there was more respect for authority, it wouldn't be such a problem." --Jiga

INCORRECT. If you will talk to the Freshman Dean of Students at UCLA, you will not find them accusing the students of a lack of 'respect for authority.' This is not the 1950s.

Computer equipment is expensive, and use of it by non-students is a definite problem, especially during finals (UCLA is a quarter-system school -- not much in the way of midterms).
Paul in LA | 11.16.06 - 6:27 pm | #

"btw i have been tasered more than once and still got up" --Jiga

Was this when you were doing your serial rapes? Or was it when you were doing the shoplifting gang thing.

Hilarious winger 'evidence.' Torture is no problem. Heck, I hit my thumb with a hammer once -- the pain goes away.
Paul in LA | 11.16.06 - 6:29 pm | #

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"He chose not to and the situation escalated."

Riiiight. Just like Saddam chose not to agree to inspections, and Dubya had no choice but to bomb the hell out of Iraq.

Gotcha.

Again, you are no diplomat.
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ejri | 11.16.06 - 6:29 pm | #

Maybe it just me. If I were that student A civil suit would never satisfy me.
Al | 11.16.06 - 6:29 pm | #

[Let's tone it down.]

Edited By Siteowner
Paul in LA | 11.16.06 - 6:29 pm | #

[Knock off the flame baiting]

Edited By Siteowner
Jiga | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 6:30 pm | #

"Paul in LA, You're the kind of sociopath" --5by5

I am not a sociopath. You are, however, a liar.
Paul in LA | 11.16.06 - 6:32 pm | #

I have never had anything but good experiences with police, and whenever I have needed them they were there. I hate when you have assholes like these that contribute to the bad image police have. It's always the psycho cops, that brutalize people, that create a universal image of police.
Watching that video was one of the most disturbing things I have seen in a long time.
There was no reason for them to continue to taser that guy, BEFORE OR AFTER, they had him in custody. It's obvious he didn't pose a threat. I know people will disagree and say that we didn't see what happened beforehand, but multiple witness accounts state that all he did was not leave immediately.
I hope he sues them for police brutality.
I have forgotten my ID before, and thankfully I have had decent people to deal with.
citrus | 11.16.06 - 6:32 pm | #

What's interesting is all the people saying the main thing is obeying the police. Since when did the primary function of the police become making people obey them?

The primary function of the police is to protect the public from lawbreakers. When the public is literally standing a few steps away from the police begging the police to stop... Since when do police protect people even if the people ask them to stop?

Well, I'm sure all you people on the internet know better than those people who were actually there asking the police to stop.
U R SAFE | 11.16.06 - 6:32 pm | #

Siteowner, I'm a UCLA grad. I do not like having my fellow students accused of being 'liberal' because they use a library.

[Understood. Try to keep it civil as we are not interested in moderating flame wars. Thanks]

Edited By Siteowner
Paul in LA | 11.16.06 - 6:33 pm | #

I just want CSOs not to taze kids. Period.
Valentinian | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 4:52 pm | #

Agreed. Had there been a mob, we might've seen a few dead kids and maybe a few dead cops. Is that how we want justice to work? Don't give the cops a reason to think what they did was justified (and this kid did not).

From what I saw, the crowd did a good job. They confronted the cops and followed them out. One kid shot the video. They witnessed the whole thing. Now these cops will likely get fired and may go to jail.

Had they rioted, do you think we would be hearing at all about the one kid getting unjustly tasered, or do you think the reports would instead be about how the students brutally attacked police?
Slaw | 11.16.06 - 6:12 pm | #

>> I was trying to make this same point as well... if the kids had acted for their own "vigilante justice" -- they'd be the issue, and they'd end up in jail. The issue of police violence would never have been heard... you can't challenge the status quo that way.

If they were really messing up that kid -- it would make more sense to talk very calmly to the police and inform them of legal action. Because if you get violent with them -- they are just going to react by getting even more violent. Even if you can "give them a whuppin'" -- they have the guns. It would just get ugly, real fast.

So, it's a great example how violence, and war, don't really solve anything. The message gets lost, and it turns into a big mess. Usually, the good and the innocent get hurt the most.

>> And why is everyone jumping on Fabricated so much? Let's not act like everyone is a troll because they disagree. It really demeans valid criticisms.
VitriolAndAngst | 11.16.06 - 6:33 pm | #

For all you folks that know nothing about tasers or police, here are a couple of facts. One: Most(I can't say all,because I don't know all) have policies that state that tasers are to be used ONLY against violent individuals and for officer safety. Tasers are NEVER to be used to make a person comply with an order. Why? Because after a person's nervous system is attacked by a taser, he physically can't comply. Once a person has been tasered, the officers are supposed to cuff him and carry him away. The ENTIRE purpose of tasering is to incapacitate the individual and get him on the ground so he can be cuffed safely.

What the campus cops did here is so far outside how officers are trained, it's hard to believe that they received ANY training regarding their use. Even if the student didn't immediately leave, that is no reason to use possibly deadly force. Simply walking next to the person and being polite generally is most effective. If that doesn't work, a simple thumb hold or arm hold is most effective.

What these cops did was to escalate the situation rather than act to diffuse the situation. Further, the cops were never threatened or faced any sort of threat. Also, there appeared to be at least 3 cops there. Any cop should be able to subdue any normal sized person without any problem. 3 cops could have easily cuffed and arrested the kid.

Tasers work by giving a significant electric jolt to a person. Electricity acts to make the nervous system go haywire. It's akin to overloading an electrical system but without a breaker system. The body runs on a consistent level of electrity which keeps our nerves working. When that system is overloaded, the whole system is disabled and it may take awhile for it to recover. Tasering somebody and then telling them to stand up is idiotic as well as torture.
Dick (no, not that one) | 11.16.06 - 6:35 pm | #

"...Do I lose my membership card now or what?"
Fabricated | 11.16.06 - 6:23 pm
I don't know. Do you?
As for "...I hate angry, undisciplined, needledicked government employees just as much as anyone else, but I don't blindly lash out with kneejerk government hatred while at the same time reaping the benefits of being in what's supposed to be a civilized society..."
What makes you think that which APPEARS to you to be "blindly lash[ing] out with kneejerk government hatred..." is kneejerk at all? It sounds to me that the people here who have said these cops are asshole and the kid shouldn't have been tased a bunch of times know what they're talking about.
Any time a non-liberal sees liberal or left wing reaction to a human or civil rights violation, it is immediately considered "Kneejerk"-an unconsidered opinion by the 'outsider.'
Ever stop to think we think about shit like this a lot and are consistant in our beliefs? I don't think so.

I certainly recognised the Libertarian bent in your commentary. Democrat, not so much.

You just sound like you hate it here.
miss_kitty | 11.16.06 - 6:37 pm | #

You must forgive the trolls. Violence titillates them. They worship authority. You should see the ecstatic look on their faces when they train their kids with shock collars. You have the feeling they want them to get out of line so they can turn up the voltage.
Al | 11.16.06 - 6:40 pm | #

I believe this sort of behavour by the police and security is much more common than we hear about in the news. Here's something from the
http://fwweekly.com/

You’d be surprised how difficult it can be to get information via the Texas Public Information Act when the city thinks it might be embarrassing. Or maybe you wouldn’t.

In early April 2005, Eric Hammock died in Fort Worth after being stunned by Taser guns 25 times for a total of over two minutes of shock in a nine-minute period. The only crime Hammock had committed was momentarily driving onto private property. He left when told to. Seemed pretty arrogant for the city to require citizens to file an open-records request in order to get information about the case, but the Weekly filed. And when the documents were turned over, they included the computer-generated records from each Taser used in the incident, showing how often and how long they had been discharged. But reporter Peter Gorman also noticed something else: The two officers who had blasted Hammock for so many excruciating seconds had also used the weapons at rather amazing rates on other days. One had used the weapon 10 times in a half-hour on one day in February and 14 other times in a two-and-a-half month period. The second officer had discharged her Taser 30 times one day and on 12 other occasions in the two months leading up to the day of Hammock’s death.

We checked with the police department’s public information officer: Are Tasers routinely discharged for training class or to check their power? No. So what was the explanation for that many firings of potentially lethal weapons? Were all of those instances in which the Tasers were used on people? To blast tin cans in the backyard? The Weekly submitted another records request, for what are called the “use of force” records for the two officers during the period in question.

And what did we get? Stonewalled. The city appealed to the state attorney general for permission to keep the records secret, and the AG agreed. Among the long list of reasons the city gave: that the records included instances of Taser use on kids between the ages of 10 and 17, which meant they could be kept confidential under juvenile codes, and that the release would be embarrassing to the officers “as they included information on mental disorders.”

It was all couched in legalese, of course, but the gist was that if the records were released, the citizens of the city might get upset with the officers’ rampant Taser use. Which is why we wanted the records in the first place, of course.

So, that protects kids and cops from being embarrassed. But how does the ruling protect kids from being injured by (possibly) Taser-happy cops (police, by the way, now can carry the weapons in Fort Worth schools). And how does it protect the public?

Way to work toward an open government, boys. Instead of a turkey, you get a serving of electrocuted Secret Squirrel. Enjoy it in private. In the dark. With your Taser strapped on.
Larry | 11.16.06 - 6:40 pm | #

Man, I have been reading so much writing in favour of those pigs, it makes me sick!!!

The USA! The Land of the brainwashed puritain freaking assholes!!!

"...if he would only have done what he was told to do!?"...

Have you all been licking a police ass for so long so you forgot what freedom smells like?

This is a crying shame and still there are people who aprove it?!?!?!

Please, stop spreading this kind of democracy!!!

We kinda like it the old way -in my country if a cop behaves like a pig, you can tell it in his face and he still remains your public servant.

Wake up, America!!!

This is really horrible!!!

You don´t need to "fight them over there"! Just don´t let them win "over here"!
gladnottobeamerican! | 11.16.06 - 6:41 pm | #

Paul in LA:
First, UCLA, like all UC schools is public property and the public is invited to use the libraries everyday, all day, up until 11:00 at night. That is when the library is closed to the public and is only open to students (hence the ID check at 11:30).

Second, computer use at the libraries by the public is not a problem. All students are required to have a computer to attend classes. It would be rare to see a student without a laptop in the library.
Boring Scott | 11.16.06 - 6:42 pm | #

... Both parties were out of line. I'm sorry that doesn't support your kneejerk reaction of government/authority hatred. There's a smart way of dealing with @ssholes like those officers in a civilized society and it's not to wail and become physically hostile.
Fabricated | 11.16.06 - 5:59 pm |

>> I would say that responsibility is on the people with Authority. When a cop walks into a situation, they don't know WHY someone is acting up. The best response is to diffuse a situation. The kid could be on drugs, lost a parent, or just a jerk -- it doesn't matter. Unless he is a threat, then they cannot act this way.

Though I think some of your earlier points are valid -- I just don't think you get the whole "Peace Officer" thing. Their job is to protect property and keep the peace -- not to beat up smart ass kids.

Almost anyone with training and the desire to keep the peace could have dealt with this situation. Like I said, my sister, who is 5'4" has dealt with larger, stronger, and crazier individuals without having to beat up a one of them at a facility for Retarded adults. So the "Walker Texas Ranger" scenarios are mostly fantasies and excuses by people who just want to beat someone up.
VitriolAndAngst | 11.16.06 - 6:42 pm | #

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"Since when did the primary function of the police become making people obey them?"

Excellent point -- thank you.

The kid broke no law. He was a student in a library. He got tazed. Hmm...

Only Foley's buddy Hastert would see nothing wrong with that picture.
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ejri | 11.16.06 - 6:43 pm | #

Class-action lawsuit! Quo warranto, hit 'em where they LIVE, in the pocket.

What fucking nazi shite.
kablooie | 11.16.06 - 6:43 pm | #

"Siteowner, I'm a UCLA grad. I do not like having my fellow students accused of being 'liberal' because they use a library.

[Understood. Try to keep it civil as we are not interested in moderating flame wars. Thanks]

Yeah, but you'll admit them's fighting words.

Final point: IF this was a student, then the escalation has the additional edge of going on his record. He may be expelled. Doesn't seem to be any clear identification of the student/non-student yet.
Paul in LA | 11.16.06 - 6:43 pm | #

Cowards!

They should have beaten the cops to death!!!

"Officer's we want your information".

We are all terrorists in the eyes of the police.
Jay Severin Has a Small Pen1s | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 6:44 pm | #

"It sounds to me that the people here who have said these cops are asshole and the kid shouldn't have been tased a bunch of times know what they're talking about."

I see a lot more screeching about how tasers are evil and somehow these incredibly deadly weapons, and suggestion INSANE things like ATTACKING THE POLICE.

This isn't directed at the people who thought the cops were dicks and the kid was stupid.
Fabricated | 11.16.06 - 6:44 pm | #

Both parties in this are wrong.

Clearly the guy could have stood up to make his life easier, no matter what the officers' tactics. I'm sure he was angry and dazed, but I'm equally sure, from the strength in his voice and his movements, that he was capable, but in passive resistance mode. It is foolish to allow yourself to be tasered if you have a choice.

Also true is that these cops were talentless and unprofessional with an oppositional person. We are not in a police state, and lack of compliance doesn't give them license to escalate to that level of pain and potential harm. Any good, honest cop would agree that the level of threat involved did not necessitate tasering. They were simply playing with their new toy on a live human being.

This video shows these officers lack skills and judgment. They ought to receive retraining and severe reprimands. And someone ought to check their attitude before allowing them to use a taser again.
Viajero | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 6:44 pm | #

Clearly the guy could have stood up to make his life easier...

Sorry, but everything I've read is that he was unable to stand up.

I cannot disagree with the statement "It is foolish to allow yourself to be tasered." That seems self-evident. What makes you think he "allowed" himself to be shot repeatedly with 50,000 volts?
Valentinian | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 6:48 pm | #

"Paul in LA: First, UCLA, like all UC schools is public property"

That is incorrect. 'Public' property, like a sidewalk is free to use. UCLA, and all the UC's is by PERMISSION. That permission is freely granted, but it is a privelege, not a right. As you can prove for yourself by looking down when you cross the property line on Westwood Ave.

"and the public is invited to use the libraries everyday,"

Key word: INVITED. Permission is granted. It can also be withheld, and ANYONE who is not a student can be asked to leave or escorted off-campus at the whim of the UCPD.

"Second, computer use at the libraries by the public is not a problem."

Yes it is, which is why the Research library (YRL, which is what I mostly use) makes it clear that terminals are for priority use by students.

"All students are required to have a computer to attend classes. It would be rare to see a student without a laptop in the library." --Boring Scott

Which is why the library terminals are mobbed around the clock, right? If you look on the wall at the Powell computer center, you will find a clear statement of these facts, I am sure.
Paul in LA | 11.16.06 - 6:50 pm | #

[Deleted. Flame bait. Consult the commenting policy if you wish to contribute]

Edited By Siteowner
Anne | 11.16.06 - 6:52 pm | #

Fabricated | 11.16.06 - 6:44 pm

OK I got you there-insane shit like attacking the police-That does NOT sound well-thought out (I was here earlier, left a for a few hours and missed the middle commentary. It must've gotten heated in there.) That IS kneejerk-but not liberal or left (and I realise you did not characterise it as such-my bad inference took it there)

miss_kitty | 11.16.06 - 6:53 pm | #

"Clearly the guy could have stood up to make his life easier, no matter what the officers' tactics."

Bill Frist speaks.

You cannot generalize about such things. The student (let's say) may have been IN SHOCK. The student may have been handicapped (there are quite a few handicapped students at UCLA). And all such insults to the nervous system have variable responses. Some people flat out DIE. Others are disoriented. And quite a few probably burst out crying.

Use of a TASER in a computer room full of expensive electronics is also something that I would consider unwise on its face.
Paul in LA | 11.16.06 - 6:54 pm | #

wow..that kid ws getting fried.the campus police have some issues w/power....but I have a feeling KO will do this one on his show tonight.Well....at least they didn't shoot him.........like they did at Kent State...diff situation I know but......
mudshark | 11.16.06 - 6:55 pm | #

"Most of these people were most likely SPOILED brats while growing up who have never experienced "discipline" in their life."--Anne

HILARIOUS. As I said, FORTY PERCENT ASIAN FRESHMEN. Those are some of the most disciplined students on the earth.

UCLA is not a primitive university. Have a look at the academic excellence you are suggesting comes from no experience of discipline;

"UCLA is one of the most selective schools in the nation and, along with UC Berkeley, one of the two most selective schools in the UC system. In 2005, 47,248 prospective freshmen applied to UCLA for entrance in Fall 2006, more than any other university in the United States, and 12,081 applicants were accepted—a 25.6 percent acceptance rate. The average weighted GPA and SAT score for an admitted freshman was 4.27 and 2010, respectively" -- wikipedia

If you can get a 4.27 GPA without discipline, please invent a Peace Ray at the UCLA Particle Physics lab. We need your genius.
Paul in LA | 11.16.06 - 6:58 pm | #

"OK I got you there-insane shit like attacking the police-That does NOT sound well-thought out (I was here earlier, left a for a few hours and missed the middle commentary. It must've gotten heated in there.) That IS kneejerk-but not liberal or left (and I realise you did not characterise it as such-my bad inference took it there)"

The kind of stupidity I was railing so hard against isn't liberal...it was just stupidity.

It also so happens to give liberals a bad name and gives ammo to hacks like Sean Hannity/O'Reilly. Everyone shares a certain amount of culpability in things relating to them, and while it isn't always fair, it's true.
Fabricated | 11.16.06 - 6:59 pm | #

"Riiiight. Just like Saddam chose not to agree to inspections, and Dubya had no choice but to bomb the hell out of Iraq.

Gotcha.

Again, you are no diplomat."

Nice strawman. You're obviously no debater.

Dubya had a lot of choices and he flat out made the wrong one. Saddam could have agreed to inspections and Bush could've simply done things the diplomatic way through the U.N.

Neither party is innocent. You're not getting it.
Fabricated | 11.16.06 - 6:33 pm |

>> That's off topic -- and a completely untrue account of recent history.
Paul Bremmer was forced to leave, because the State Department told them US bombs were on the way. Saddam complied with the UN resolutions -- for the record.

Paul Bremmer reported there were no WMDs. But that was a UN issue -- not a US issue. And the UN, if you remember, did not vote to go to war.

Then you have the "Downing Street Memos" where basically, the British were told that the US is determined to strike on Iraq -- so find a good excuse.

I've heard reports from some pilots that the US was already bombing Iraq 6 months before the declared hostilities. And there is also the matter of a plane being painted like a UN air ship to provoke and incident -- that is on the record.

So, I'm sure this student "could have" had a gun, and Saddam "could have" had WMDs. But there was no evidence given. The reaction was not commensurate with the situation. And as it turns out -- neither were a credible threat. So I suppose the two incidents have a lot in common after all.

>> By the way, the inspectors that Bush sent in for Iraq War II, reported that their best intelligence suggests that those "baby food factories" Clinton bombed were actually the last of Saddam's WMD facilities. They said it was death blow to Saddam's efforts and so after that he gave up. So all the quotes about Clinton saying "Saddam has WMD's" and then the strike on the factories, and the inevitable politicking by Republicans saying; "How dare Clinton attack innocent people." -- were taken out of order, and parts were conveniently forgotten.

Everyone accuses Clinton of bombing innocent factories, then saying there were WMDs -- which of course absolves Bush's war of choice years later after intensive inspections show that the radio-controlled toy planes are not drones, and the that even if there was Serin Gas buried in the desert -- after 12 years it might give you a headache.

But of course, that is another detail of reality the Bush cheerleaders conveniently forget. The only POSSIBLE threat Saddam could have had was nuclear (because all the Chemicals Rummy gave him had by now expired to useless toxins) -- and that leads us to the Yellow Cake stories and Valerie Plame.

>> So anyway, there is "no there, there." It's all a phony argument and a convenient lie to create chaos and profit. But, like these police, some people just love war, and will support any excuse.
VitriolAndAngst | 11.16.06 - 7:00 pm | #

To all the trolls out there:heres to you guys getting pulled over some night and not being able to find your ID......if anything remotely close to this happens to you......don't bitch..
mudshark | 11.16.06 - 7:01 pm | #

"I have to disagree that the right to bear arm is for our protection against tyranny of the government. One of the reason that the Democrats have not push for banning guns. The Constitution was set up so that the Governement would fear the will of the people and not the other way around. The check and balance was set up so that if monster were runnning the Government that the people could check them from ruining the country."

Read the amendment. Sorry man, the citizenry is allowed to be arm to defend themselves against the government. It couldn't possibly be more explicitly stated.

That comma in there is not there so you can catch your breath.
Fabricated | 11.16.06 - 7:01 pm | #

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"Please don't call the police when you are being kicked, punched, robbed, carjacked, raped, etc. "

That's their job -- which we pay them to do -- to maintain law & order. The UCLA kid broke no law. The disorder arose from the cops actions. Just because the cops are paid to protect us against rape & carjacking, does not give them carte blanche to taser unarmed kids.

"Since you don't trust or care for the police. "

No reasonable person here is saying they don't trust or care for the police. Clearly, the UCLA cops misrepresentered their profession. They could benefit from some improvement courses, but by no means do I distrust all cops.

"Call your parents, so that they can come and rub your tummy and comfort you."

I wish I could. Really, I would love nothing more than that... buy mom died many, many years ago.
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ejri | 11.16.06 - 7:01 pm | #

Trivial example... I used to live on a farm with an electric fence. We had a really crappy controller, and a lot of times I got shocked. It used to drive me freaking CRAZY.

First (duh) it's painful. 12V car battery voltage at a few hundred amps is not a whole lot, but it stings. Secondly, it seemed like it did something to my nervous system, so in addition to being hurt, jacked on adrenaline from the surprise, I was momentarily in a put-your-fist-through-a-wall rage.

This little story is just to provide a little context for the people who are (TOTALLY irrelevantly IMHO) bringing the kid's behavior up as a factor in this.

Getting shocked freaks you the fuck out.

Again, it doesn't matter, as having a bad attitude should not earn you 50,000 volts. But I think it is totally understandable that he was agitated in addition to being outraged and upset at being singled out.
Valentinian | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 7:02 pm | #

the most horrifying thing is nobody helps this poor guy; what a bunch of downright cowards! fascism worked in germany because no-one had the guts to whack the fascists in the face. same here; welcome to fascism, america, you obviously deserve every inch of it. I can smell the stench across the ocean.
gabriel stetter | 11.16.06 - 7:05 pm | #

VitriolAndAngst, nice summation. This is an emotional issue -- and, hell, it should be -- but we do ourselves no service by turning every issue we are upset about into one big mush. UCLA is not Abu Ghraib.

That being said, there's a drift towards authoritarianism in the country which is real (note the sudden proliferation of Law-and-Order Trolls on this thread), and worth bringing up in connection to what happened.

Bush sets the tone. If torture is OK to keep our nation safe, maybe roughing up a mouthy kid with mocha skin and a funny name is OK to keep campus safe.

"Slippery slope" arguments are overused, but you can't deny it's getting a little slick out there...
Valentinian | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 6:43 pm |

>> Very balanced post -- I think you win second place today!

>> I of course, should win first, but nobody is paying attention to my brilliant discussion of the "Faith in Violence" post I made previously, where I talked about NeoCons having the "Faith of Judas." I still have chills -- where is my Blog Pulitzer?

>> I wonder what would happen if I did win a pulitzer for a post -- would it be the property of the Blog, who retains some rights due to some disclaimer and "publishing" or would it be the author's pulitzer?

I'm sure that isn't an issue on any Freeper site.

VitriolAndAngst | 11.16.06 - 7:05 pm | #

Paul Bremmer was forced to leave, because the State Department told them US bombs were on the way.

Ummm... Paul Bremer was the second head of the CPA, the US occupation authority. You may be thinking of Hans Blix, or as Kim Jong Il calls him, "fucking Hans Brix."
Valentinian | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 7:05 pm | #

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Not trivial, Valentinian. Good point.

Oh -- and I'm so glad the cops are protecting the library from kids who study without their IDs handy & don't leave promptly!! I can sleep tonight.

I don't live there, but it's my understanding there are more productive things for the cops to do in LA...
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ejri | 11.16.06 - 7:07 pm | #

"welcome to fascism, america, you obviously deserve every inch of it. I can smell the stench across the ocean." --gabriel stetter

Then you are where fascism was BORN.

Stench this.
Paul in LA | 11.16.06 - 7:08 pm | #

Paul in LA | 11.16.06 - 6:58 pm | #

Even as a USC grad, I completely agree with this post!
Boring Scott | 11.16.06 - 7:13 pm | #

Wholly crap. As a foreigner I just don't get 1) why with so many officers there they couldn't just pick him up and carry him away, 2) why when obviously it was causing trouble they continued to use the tazer, 3) the rest of the students were so docile and didn't kick up a massive stink (did anyone call the real police and an ambulance in case he went into arrest?), 4) this doesn't ammount to assault, they had no cause for such a response, there can be no justification, surely they see jail time for this?
Anonymous | 11.16.06 - 7:13 pm | #

"The UCLA kid broke no law."--ejri

You do not know that.
Paul in LA | 11.16.06 - 7:13 pm | #

The guy seems like a nut/asshole and the cops seem like assholes/nuts.
CD | 11.16.06 - 7:14 pm | #

...
Final point: IF this was a student, then the escalation has the additional edge of going on his record. He may be expelled. Doesn't seem to be any clear identification of the student/non-student yet.
Paul in LA | 11.16.06 - 6:43 pm

>> Um, no.
The reaction of the police does not affect the culpability of the accused.
In fact -- by infringing on his civil rights, they could jeopardize any case that they might bring against him.

Forced testimony, illegal search and seizure and other police abuses (not reading someone their rights) -- penalizes law enforcement by having a case thrown out.

That is, unless that law has been thrown out by Authoritarians who stay awake at night worrying if a petty criminal doesn't get punished or a CEO does.
VitriolAndAngst | 11.16.06 - 7:15 pm | #

I have to disagree that the right to bear arm is for our protection against tyranny of the government. One of the reason that the Democrats have not push for banning guns. The Constitution was set up so that the Governement would fear the will of the people and not the other way around. The check and balance was set up so that if monster were runnning the Government that the people could check them from ruining the country.
paranoia | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 6:59 pm |

>> Hey! That's what I just said... only differently.

But fighting off tyranny, does have a heroic appeal to it.... not that it would work out too well. The media would just show some lunatic getting shot in a gun fight.

>> And what happened to all the NeoCon's fighting for that poor man at Ruby Ridge? The FBI was trying to arrest him... but strangely, they didn't make the argument that he should have just complied... I suppose it was the "tyranny of a Liberal government" that was outraging them then.
VitriolAndAngst | 11.16.06 - 7:16 pm | #

" 3) the rest of the students were so docile and didn't kick up a massive stink"--Anonymous

The cost of attendence at UCLA is not trivial. Most students are busy trying to get a diploma, not trying to start a riot.

You obviously don't know my alma mater. There will be a full investigation, including by the pretty proactive student government.
Paul in LA | 11.16.06 - 7:16 pm | #

After being arrested for absolutely nothing several times I FOR ONE DON'T TRUST MOST COPS....they have to earn MY trust...Just so you know...I was walking down the street minding my own biz and a car pulled up next to me (3 diff times)..the doors opened I was grabbed and thrown in the back.And released the next morning.No paperwork no court dates ...nothing.And no I was not intoxicated!OH YEAH...No Miranda either...so yes I don't trust the police....
mudshark | 11.16.06 - 7:16 pm | #

Wow. Just, wow.

For the eventual lawsuits, at least there are obviously plenty of witnesses. And it is obvious that those schmucks are absurdly poorly trained as public saftey officers. They didn't get the escalation plan correct, they froze at crisis, and they obviously had no idea how to handle a crowd. And that's before you recognize that this is not a random street situation. Really a black eye for UCLA's administration.

I wonder if any of the UCLA Law alum bloggers would be interested in this incident?
fishbane | 11.16.06 - 7:18 pm | #

BTW, we are talking about a student here:

Mostafa Tabatabainejad, a UCLA student, was repeatedly stunned with a Taser and then taken into custody when he did not exit the CLICC Lab in Powell Library in a timely manner. Community Service Officers had asked Tabatabainejad to leave after he failed to produce his BruinCard during a random check at around 11:30 p.m. Tuesday.

UCPD Assistant Chief of Police Jeff Young said the checks are a standard procedure in the library after 11 p.m.

"Because of the safety of the students we limit the use after 11 to just students, staff and faculty," Young said.

Young said the CSOs on duty in the library at the time went to get UCPD officers when Tabatabainejad did not immediately leave, and UCPD officers resorted to use of the Taser when Tabatabainejad did not do as he was told.

A six-minute video showed Tabatabainejad audibly screaming in pain as he was stunned several times with a Taser, each time for three to five seconds. He was told repeatedly to stand up and stop fighting, and was told that if he did not do so he would "get Tased again."

Tabatabainejad was also stunned with the Taser when he was already handcuffed, said Carlos Zaragoza, a third-year English and history student who witnessed the incident.

"(He was) no possible danger to any of the police," Zaragoza said. "(He was) getting shocked and Tasered as he was handcuffed."

But Young said at the time the police likely had no way of knowing whether the individual was armed or that he was a student.

As Tabatabainejad was being dragged through the room by two officers, he repeated in a strained scream, "I'm not fighting you" and "I said I would leave."

Here is the link to the whole article:

http://dailybruin.com/news/artic.../ artic...es.asp? id=38960

(Oh yeah I forgot...

sucks! I'm stuck all the way over here now!)
Valentinian | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 7:19 pm | #

This isn't the first time I've seen cops getting off on electrocuting someone who was never a threat

Electrocute? I thought the guy lived...
wrong word | 11.16.06 - 7:20 pm | #

"He may be expelled."

>> Um, no.
The reaction of the police does not affect the culpability of the accused." --VitriolAndAngst

'Culpability' is not the issue. The Dean can remove students over WHAT THEY JUDGE TO BE sufficient cause, and refusing direction by the UCPD may be sufficient cause. My point was that the 'student' may be in additional trouble even though he was Tasered.

As I posted above, UCLA turned away 35,000 applicants for undergraduate admission in 2006. There is no dirth of persons happy to take this kid's place.
Paul in LA | 11.16.06 - 7:21 pm | #

http://www.latimes.com/news/loca...-home- headlines

A third incident, a new video
A cellphone camera captures UCLA police using a Taser on a student who allegedly refused to leave the library Tuesday night.
By Amanda Covarrubias and Stuart Silverstein, Times Staff Writers
November 16, 2006

The latest in a recent spate of cellphone videos documenting questionable arrest tactics surfaced Wednesday, this one showing a UCLA police officer using a Taser to stun a student who allegedly refused to leave the campus library.

Grainy video of the Tuesday night incident at UCLA's Powell Library was broadcast Wednesday on TV news and the Internet, prompting a review of the officers' actions and outrage among students at the Westwood campus.

The footage showed the student, Mostafa Tabatabainejad, falling to the ground and crying out in pain as officers stunned him.

According to a campus police report, the incident began when community service officers, who serve as guards at the library, began their nightly routine of checking to make sure everyone using the library after 11 p.m. is a student or otherwise authorized to be there.

For the Record: In a earlier version of this article, a quote from Mostafa Tabatabainejad read: "Here's your Patriot Act, here's your use of power." The corrected quote reads " "Here's your Patriot Act, here's your ... abuse of power."

Campus officials said the long-standing policy was adopted to ensure students' safety.
Medical Diagnosis By Video | 11.16.06 - 7:23 pm | #

Ya know, I typically lean right. I have no hatred for cops, in general.

However, it would have been really, REALLY hard to not start bashing one of these cops with a computer monitor. God, this is one of the worst abuses I have ever seen.

I hate to say it, but it would have pleased me to see those fifty kids beat the snot out of those cops. Sure, it would have meant more tasers and an escalation. But you know what? Sometimes you just have to stand up for what is right.

And this is wrong on every single level I have. I'm not one to typically advocate violence, mind you. But this kid was literally being tortured...over computer use.

Yes, he should have left immediately. But you know what, even if he lipped off to the cops, there is NO cause for this.
Dikk | 11.16.06 - 7:23 pm | #

Paul Bremmer was forced to leave, because the State Department told them US bombs were on the way.

Ummm... Paul Bremer was the second head of the CPA, the US occupation authority. You may be thinking of Hans Blix, or as Kim Jong Il calls him, "fucking Hans Brix."
Valentinian | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 7:05 pm

>> Thanks for the accuracy check. I was writing from memory -- it was Hans Blix who was asked to leave by our State Dept. for his own safety. The point is -- WE kicked him out, not Saddam.

I just don't want to Google every 5 seconds -- I'm not getting paid to do this. I wish I had a better memory, but my head is so stuffed with jerks and crooks in the Bush Crime Syndicate, it would be a full time job to keep the mass of mob-like characters straight.

Jeez, 6 years ago were such simpler times; there was Monica, Ken Starr, Linda Tripp -- maybe only 30 characters who HAD TO KNOW. Now 30 people wouldn't even get you through a discussion of Abramoff.
VitriolAndAngst | 11.16.06 - 7:24 pm | #

just a thought:

providing you can soak the person holding the taser, they should end up shocking themselves.

of course they may just move on to pulling a gun if you throw a bucket of water at them, but if the arm holding the taser and the taser itself are wet, that person is liable to get a bit of a surprise when they pull the trigger.
peter | 11.16.06 - 7:25 pm | #

...Campus officials said the long-standing policy was adopted to ensure students' safety.
Medical Diagnosis By Video | 11.16.06 - 7:23 pm |

>> Yeah, because without this police protection, someone might get poked in the eye... ;-0

Sorry, I had to say it. Kind of ironic, eh?
VitriolAndAngst | 11.16.06 - 7:27 pm | #

Tazers should be used instead of lethal force, not as behavior modification or punishment. You use a tazer instead of shooting someone with a gun. When someone is threatening you, not because they won't follow an order. He was cuffed. They could have called for back up if they needed it.

Those cops were totally out of line and should be off duty immediately.

Good for the students for documenting what happened and trying to help the student.

Those cops are in big trouble.

I bought an cheapo $80 point and shoot digital camera at Costco and this video makes me think I should have it with me at all times.

I live on a street where drivers get pulled over frequently and I always pay attention to make sure no one is being abused. Cops need to know we're watching them because some of them are assholes.
esther | 11.16.06 - 7:28 pm | #

Why didn't the cops just reason with the kid? Ask him when he intended to leave. Explain to him why the policy was in place. Eventually, the kid probably would have come around.
Isn't there other means of checking his identity than a card? WTF
Al | 11.16.06 - 7:32 pm | #

I just wanted to write "fucking Hans Brix!"
valentinian | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 7:34 pm | #

'Culpability' is not the issue. The Dean can remove students over WHAT THEY JUDGE TO BE sufficient cause, and refusing direction by the UCPD may be sufficient cause. My point was that the 'student' may be in additional trouble even though he was Tasered.

As I posted above, UCLA turned away 35,000 applicants for undergraduate admission in 2006. There is no dirth of persons happy to take this kid's place.
Paul in LA | 11.16.06 - 7:21 pm | #

I'm sure the taser incident lawsuit will be expensive to the college. The unwarranted expulsion lawsuit will also be very expensive, and there will be no dearth of highly-educated lawyers happy to sock it to the assholes who would do such a thing.
Slippytoad | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 7:35 pm | #

i hope that cop dies on a cold street by a homeless man wacked out of his mind.
Pigs make me ill | 11.16.06 - 7:37 pm | #

At the very end the cop told the man in the white t-shirt, who had been asking for badge numbers, "Back off or you are gonna get tased too" did you hear that bullshit? Do the police not understand that they work for US!!!!
Christine | 11.16.06 - 7:38 pm | #

I guess we should all base our opinion on a single crapy video.

I guess the guy who got tazed was being nice and civil and showed his ID when asked.

I guess we should focus on isolated incidents of police brutality to smear cops everywhere just like the klan does with blacks.
devilsadvoc | 11.16.06 - 7:34 pm

That last little reductio ad absurdum aside, it's true that we do not know the sequence of events before the video started. You want to provide us with a scenario that would justify tasering a kid multiple times while he was lying on the ground?

I'm all ears.
valentinian | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 7:44 pm | #

Fabricated, Jiga, and E in MD are clearly not familiar with proper and appropriate police procedures and I would hope they skip jury duty indefinitely.
The police had a duty to enforce the law and de-escalate the situation regardless of whether the alleged perpetrator (AP) was hollering, wiggling, reciting poetry or speaking in tongues. If he was handcuffed, he was checked for sharps and weapons as part of proper procedure. Had they simply removed him to a cop car, the police would have been correct.
Tasering a restrained AP is illegal, against procedure, and puts the police officers at greater risk because it aggravates the AP and generates sympathy in onlookers. Threatening onlookers with further violence is a strong sign of lack of control of the scene and an admission of weakness that puts officers at risk. Maintaining command presence at a scene requires the officers to not lose control, not lose their cool, not respond personally to comments made by the AP and eyewitnesses/onlookers, and not to prolong the AP's presence on the scene.
Tasing the AP while restrained or not resisting and in front of onlookers is just as bad as that gentleman at Abu Ghraib with the hood, standing on the box, being threatened with electrocution. Typically cops will take an AP they dislike away from the scene and someplace controlled if they are organized about their brutality.
Some dipshit hollering in the library and being escorted out is a minor incident. Tasering an alleged perpetrator who has already been restrained whether or not he is cooperating fully or passively resisting is criminal, immoral, and unethical as well as sadistic, and doing so in this case has embarrassed the university and put the student body on notice that their campus police are unprofessional, sadistic, and unable to follow their own standards and procedures.
Biff Spaceman | 11.16.06 - 7:46 pm | #

Biff Spaceman | 11.16.06 - 7:46 pm

Nice. Informed, rational, calm.

This is why I read and post blog comments. Occasionally there IS a pony buried in all the crap!

Seriously, thanks Biff. That's good background.
valentinian | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 7:50 pm | #

"provide us with a scenario that would justify tasering a kid multiple times while he was lying on the ground"

valentinian inciting a riot isn't cool even if you're doing it while lying down.

Not to say that's what he was doing but that would justify it.
devilsadvoc | 11.16.06 - 7:51 pm | #

I would like to know more about this man. If I was him and they told me to leave I would have agreed but would have tried to finish whatever I was in the midst of doing. I would have reacted just the way he did after being tazed: angry, outraged at authority and then defiant.
I am a white woman and grandmother of 8 and I would have shouted the words "Patriot Act", "abuse of power" and a lot more "f**ks" than he said.
But then I wouldn't have been tazed, would I have?
justcurious | 11.16.06 - 7:54 pm | #

If those four thugs with badges couldn't pick him up and carry him out like they do with protestors, then they shouldn't be cops.

Sick. Just sick.
YinRising | 11.16.06 - 7:57 pm | #

why the fuck did everyone just stand around and not take the fuckers out??
Anonymous

Because crime in response to crime isn't okay. They wouldn't have stopped anything, and they would have turned the cops into victims.
Ryan

WRONG! In many states it is legal to commit a smaller crime to stop a larger one. And I can prove I am correct here. I cite the acquittal of Amy Carter and Abbie Hoffman in the 1980's.

And to those of you who would stand around doing nothing while someone is being tortured and perhaps tasered to death, because you think that defending others (and perhaps even yourself) is wrong or that you are worried about getting in trouble with the law - you ought to be ashamed of yourselves for such cowardly behavior - for Unlike the hateful and Evil Republicans, you know better.

@ Grand Moff Texan - I'm disappointed that I didn't get to hear all of your excellent and insightful comments.
rcg | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 7:59 pm | #

"a governments greatest enemy is not a country outside its borders,but the citizens within" Thomas Jefferson.
this is a nation of laws,
police officers are the arbitrators of siad laws.
this is also a nation of RIGHTS,civil liberties afforded by the constitution.
there are many,many good,professional police officers.
the officers in this video,unfortunately are not one them.
i have seen some pretty lame,and flawed logic arguments on this thread.
so lets break it down.
1.ucla had imposed a random I.D check after 11pm at the university library.to protect students.check.
2.a young student is approached by a campus cop and asked to provide I.D.check.
3.student refuses(reason unknown).check
4.campus police asks "alleged" student to leave the premises.check.
5.student allegedly still refuses.check.
*note*i say allegedly due to the following;according to witnesses student was grabbed by the arm by a UCP officer as he was exiting library,so there is a discontinuity in timeline here.
6.student shouts at officer"get your hands off me" and then"dont touch me",we dont see what actually transpires,but we can hear the discourse.check.
7.we hear the young man scream in pain,obvioulsy being tazed.check.
*note* at this point,the officers may possibly still be within their boundary of law,because we cannot see in the video what is actually happening.
8.we hear,between sobs of agony,the young student espouse"how do you like you patriot act?" among other statements.check.
*note* according to the officers,during this time,the young man was attempting to recruit assistance in his resistance.this is not substantiated by the video.
9.other students have gathered,and are becoming agitated at the officers,demanding that they stop tazing the young man.while in the background we can hear the officers commanding the young man to stand up,after repeatedly tazing him.check.
10.after repeated tazing,and amongst the young mans screams of pain,we hear the officers almost condescendingly ask the young man to stand up.at this point we can see the young man being dragged by his handcuffed hands.check.
11.we see an officer walk up to a student by-stander and threaten to taze him if he doesnt "move along".check.

now,anybody who can watch this video and continue to defend the position of these officers is either a dim bulb,or so indoctrinated in the righteousness of an authoritarian government,that to point out such blatant abuses of power would be a waste of time.
to those that find this abuse reprehensible,and dont know what to do to help prevent further abuse.i have a recommendation that is very powerful,and works almost 100% of the time.
of course there are rules in place,watchdog groups and even legislators who can be contacted.lawyers can be hired,the courts are a valuable resource.
but if none of these avenues are prudent at the time,i suggest this;
find the names of the offending officers,their addresses,their churches,where their kids play baseball..whatever.get very piece of information you can on the offending officer.
well,you ask...
"what are we going to do with that information enoch?"
well,im glad you asked.there is a thing called civil disobedience,but there is also a thing called "public domain".
make signs up,and boldy pring the officers offense,lets say...oh..
"YOUR DADDY ELECTROCUTES MUSLIMS KIDS FOR FUN"
or..
"ABUSE OF POWER OFFICER LIVES HERE"
just a few ideas.
another good idea is to print multiple copies of the officers crimes and hand them out just as his church is letting out.
as long as you do NOT use made up facts(slander),and do not overstay a protest too long in front of his home(harrassment).
keep it factual in anything you put to print.and if your going to house sit,and you use signs,do not overstay(stay just long enough to have the neighbors take notice).if you dont use signs,then you can stay much longer.
check with your local laws before engaging in any of these practices please.
but i will tell you this,it works,and it works WELL.
we had a correctional officer in my town,who had forced teen girls to..um.."pleasure" him.since there was no evidence,just the word of the girls,he walked.oh,he got a slap(suspended for a week)but the girls(there were 5 of them) were humiliated.
its amazing what happens when you tell the officers neighbors,church members the local 7/11 clerk,just what kind of man they were friends with.
he lasted a month,then packed up and moved.
i have known many a good,decent police officer in my day,and i have also seen the most depraved and mysoginist,it is the latter that gives the hard working,professional law enforcement a bad name,and it chips away at the hard earned trust that the good cops work at each and every day.
always remember,there are WAY more of us,than there are of THEM,and they know it.
solidarity my brothers and sisters,that is the key.
hope you will all come see me at
http://www.throwawayyourtv.com/
till next time...peace
enoch | 11.16.06 - 8:00 pm | #

been a cop 20 years now and if i've learned one thing it's that college kids dont think they have to listen to cops,,or their parents. well.. if you dont listen to me its gonna be pepper spray, 50,000 volts, or a steel baton in that order. IF NONE OF THE ABOVE WORK YOU RE GONNA GET SHOT W/A 9 M.M. A little back ground may reveal his psychiatric problem,, but listen up boys n girls. its a harsh world for those that don't listen....oh.. n i consistently vote DEMOCRATIC.
burt | 11.16.06 - 8:03 pm | #

This is what will happen. Anyone who is on campus and is trying to assemble or organize any sort of student rally against the patriot act, or demonstrations against the military commissions act, or speaking freely against the war, or anything the new reich is doing to make us safer and more free.

(Barney Fife pulls up his Tasser belt) THEY'LL BE NO RALLIES ON THIS CAMPUS. I'LL TELL YOU ME....snfff...
YOU WANNA BE NEXT!(shaking) Yeah, I didn't think so...snfff.

ANDY, you start letting these people think for themselves. It's all over for us...Got-a-stay on Top-of-um (several karate chop moves)Don't you worry Andy (Fast draw of the tasser)
Those people want to excercise their rights...Wait til they get a load a me...snfff
wethepeople | 11.16.06 - 8:03 pm | #

inciting a riot isn't cool even if you're doing it while lying down.

See, that was the weird part of the UCPD statement. If it was true that "Tabatabainejad encouraged library patrons to join his resistance," (which the eyewitnesses dispute), how is tasing the guy supposed to defuse the situation?

If there was a riot about to start, bringing the taser out would probably have been the tipping point.

(Sorry, I just keep laughing at the sentence "Tabatabainejad encouraged library patrons to join his resistance." That is so Pythonesque: "Arise library patrons! You have nothing to lose but your late fees!")
valentinian | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 8:05 pm | #

My initial reaction to this story was: I KNOW this guy doesn't have blond hair and blue eyes.
barrelhse | 11.16.06 - 8:05 pm | #

Hey, KO is going to talk about this on Countdown tonight.
Terry | 11.16.06 - 8:07 pm | #

"Those cops are in big trouble."

Unlikely.

The real issue is the protocol for using the TASER. That's where the focus on this should go -- not on claims that these individual officers are Hitler's Henchmen for (probably) obeying policy and protocol.
Paul in LA | 11.16.06 - 7:32 pm |

>>I'm not a Cop, but I'm just guessing, "protocol" doesn't include a handcuffed non-threatening individual who is walking too slow.

I really sucks that we have to debate torture like this were a vague issue.

Talk about "moral relativism." I'm not a Christian -- I'm a Unitarian, and I think each and ever person at my congregation would say; "that's wrong." Without hesitation.

It's wrong, and I think anyone who doesn't "get that" is a deeply flawed person -- nothing personal.

>> The "Debate" about invading Iraq, or torture, is sort of like saying there is a debate about Banks. The Bush Crime Family position would be that "we liberated the money from the bank," -- and the MSM would report "the controversial removal of money from the bank has many people discussing its merits." While, I would be considered the fringe, wacky left conspiracy theorist by saying; "hey, he robbed a bank!"

>> Yeah, it's an uphill battle being a sane descent human being these days. Where did you people come from ... and is there a cure?
VitriolAndAngst | 11.16.06 - 8:14 pm | #

"...oh.. n i consistently vote DEMOCRATIC."
burt | 11.16.06 - 8:03 pm | #

Sure you do.
citrus | 11.16.06 - 8:17 pm | #

Okay, I can understand the reason the UCPD carry tazers, and I can even understand their use as a NON-LEATHAL weapon to subdue an overly rowdy student, But THIS DISGRACE is just absurd. They Had the student IN HAND-CUFFS, and they were continuing to tazer the kid just because he wouldn't get up!!!

Once they had those cuffs on him anything more is sheer brutality, and those officers should be held accountable for that.

I say tazer them each for every time they tazered that kid after they had him cuffed.
D-L | 11.16.06 - 8:19 pm | #

... If there was a riot about to start, bringing the taser out would probably have been the tipping point.

(Sorry, I just keep laughing at the sentence "Tabatabainejad encouraged library patrons to join his resistance." That is so Pythonesque: "Arise library patrons! You have nothing to lose but your late fees!")
valentinian | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 8:05 pm |

You remind me of the Holy Grail scene, where some peasants are beating wet rags against some rocks. When introduced to King Arthur, the peasant debates his assumed leadership position; "... well, that's all assuming that, as part of the proletariat -- I voted to make you king."

"You didn't vote for me to be the king, I was the one chosen by the lady of the lake to wield Excalibur!"

"Well, if some tart in a pond were to give me a weapon ... I don't think I'd be putting on airs."

"... that's it!"

"Help, help, I'm being repressed!"
>>>

"This is your Patriot act for you!"

"Shut up or I'll Tase you again! Sit down!"

"Ow!"

"Stand up!"

"I can't"

"Quit crying you baby, it's just a flesh wound."

>> OK, now it's starting to just get completely ridiculous.
VitriolAndAngst | 11.16.06 - 8:20 pm | #

Officers held accountable in America? Unlikely.
Matt k | 11.16.06 - 8:24 pm | #

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/ 20061...cameraphones_dc
AshWilliams | 11.16.06 - 8:27 pm | #

everyone including crooks and liars needs to get the damn story right. the kid was not simply refused entrance cause he didn't have an ID. he went outstide for a cigarette and they wouldn't let me him back him since he let his ID in the lab. he explained to them that his ID was in the computer lab. i'm a student here. i was there.
jm | 11.16.06 - 8:29 pm | #

hey john boy this aint the Waltons. tasers are reserved for nut jobs ok?? its either that or broken bones or bullets. some of you people are in lala land. as for four cops carrying him well we just don't carry people who can walk. wah wah wah!!! i still vote democratic too you whinin' weenies.........
burt | 11.16.06 - 8:30 pm | #

inciting a riot isn't cool even if you're doing it while lying down.

See, that was the weird part of the UCPD statement. If it was true that "Tabatabainejad encouraged library patrons to join his resistance," (which the eyewitnesses dispute), how is tasing the guy supposed to defuse the situation?

If there was a riot about to start, bringing the taser out would probably have been the tipping point.

(Sorry, I just keep laughing at the sentence "Tabatabainejad encouraged library patrons to join his resistance." That is so Pythonesque: "Arise library patrons! You have nothing to lose but your late fees!")
valentinian | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 8:05 pm | #

Well if someone is verbaly trying to start a riot valentinian how do you force them to stop?

FTR I agree it is Pythonesque.
devilsadvoc | 11.16.06 - 8:35 pm | #

everyone including crooks and liars needs to get the damn story right.

Agreed.

So the story is, he went outside for a cigarette and couldn't get back in? So then what? The cops dragged him INTO the library, tased him for a while, then dragged him back OUT?

This story just got a LOT more interesting. Where did you say you were a student again?
valentinian | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 8:35 pm | #

Holy shit. Just when I thought I could handle anything the internet could throw at me. In my cynical, European mind America has ages ago come to be a hypocritical fascist police state. But neverheless, this video truly and deeply shocked me. And I don't care what the kid did before that or whatever justification the apologists can come up with for this, and I don't even care about the aftermath of 9/11, or the threat of terrorism, that was just simply uncalled for. This is not police or even uni police, these are monsters. Not human. And I also wanted to crucifiy the guy who shot this, alongside with tens of others for just standing there, doing nothing. I wanted to start throwing stuff at my computer screen, and they just stand there? And I'm not even an American citizen, this just disturbed me on a human level. The onlookers should have been even more disturbed, shocked by the shrieks of a dying democracy, and they just stand there??
All I know, once I manage to digest this, I'll be laughing even harder every time Bush mentions words like democracy or freedom. Thanks, but no thanks, president Bush. Thanks, but no thanks, America.
Anonymous | 11.16.06 - 8:37 pm | #

I'd start at 15 million and settle for 10. You abuse, you pay - videos work both ways these days.
paul miller | 11.16.06 - 8:43 pm | #

Yeah, well, Euro-nonymous Dude... wish I could disagree with you but I am not a proud American today.

We are now the Land of Go Along to Get Along. It's how we got into Iraq, and how a cocoa-coloured boy ended up on the floor of the library of one of our best universities with 50,000 volts going through him while a bunch of other kids watched...
valentinian | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 8:45 pm | #

jm,

everyone including crooks and liars needs to get the damn story right. the kid was not simply refused entrance cause he didn't have an ID. he went outstide for a cigarette and they wouldn't let me him back him since he let his ID in the lab. he explained to them that his ID was in the computer lab. i'm a student here. i was there.

So how did the kid get back inside to get tasered? They got teleporters at UCLA? (MIT maybe but UCLA?)
Thing Fish | 11.16.06 - 8:46 pm | #

I called and spoke to the police operator (thanks for the #) and they said they had been receiving a huge volume of calls. I left msgs. w/the Chief & Captain and I will call back until I speak to somebody.

What fascist cowards, hiding behind their horrible little ray-guns.
kablooie | 11.16.06 - 8:48 pm | #

ysbaddaden | 11.16.06 - 4:23 pm | #

--------
no, that was a correction.
bascombe | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 8:58 pm | #

Get this, two of the officers received a "Meritorious Service/Taser Award" by UCLA several weeks before this incident.

http://www.today.ucla.edu/people...pplause-061107/

"The Meritorious Service/Taser Award was presented to Officers Joseph Eubank, Ethan Shear, Kevin Kay and Dan Jermansen for successfully subduing a patient without harm after he threatened staff at the Neuropsychiatric Hospital with metal scissors."

Un-Freaking-Believable.
Reason | 11.16.06 - 9:06 pm | #

"The Meritorious Service/Taser Award was presented to Officers Joseph Eubank, Ethan Shear, Kevin Kay and Dan Jermansen for successfully subduing a patient without harm after he threatened staff at the Neuropsychiatric Hospital with metal scissors."

Un-Freaking-Believable.
Reason | 11.16.06 - 9:06 pm | #

So they didn't deserve the award?
devilsadvoc | 11.16.06 - 9:08 pm | #

enoch,

Your *note* on 5.student allegedly still refuses.check. Is explained in LATimes article:

When Tabatabainejad, 23, refused to provide his ID to the community service officer, the officer told him he would have to show it or leave the library, the report said.

After repeated requests, the officer left and returned with campus police, who asked Tabatabainejad to leave "multiple times," according to a statement by the UCLA Police Department. (emphasis mine).

If UCPD was so concerned about student safety then why, after not identifing a person in the library, the officer left?
Thing Fish | 11.16.06 - 9:09 pm | #

LET'S SEE THE LIBRARY VIDEO MONITOR RECORDINGS
kenneth patchen | 11.16.06 - 9:10 pm | #

If UCPD was so concerned about student safety then why, after not identifing a person in the library, the officer left?
Thing Fish | 11.16.06 - 9:09 pm

I think the CSO left and called UCPD. Which would probably be standard procedure. Unfortunately in this case, it was the wrong move.
valentinian | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 9:12 pm | #

Tasers are supposed to be used in place of the service revolver, to prevent life-threatening injuries that would be caused by use of the firearm. They are not intended as an aid in restraint when the officers are not in danger. They are not to be used to make the officer's job of restraining easier, but to spare the life and limb of the restrainee.

Something like that.
bg | 11.16.06 - 9:13 pm | #

In my younger years if I were at that school I would've kicked them cops down the stairs. F'in pricks. They almost had a riot on their hands because of their incompetence. They had no right to do that to a student. They will be in trouble in court with this tape. Rodney King all over again...even worse. Hope they fry. Taser em to death.
ksg0 | 11.16.06 - 9:17 pm | #

I said earlier my wife works at UCLA and I would check with her about it. The staff is pretty shaken up and concerned. But coincidentally, the staff had a meeting with the campus police today about what to do if they had an unruly student. The first thing the officer said was, "we will tazer them, we will not hesitate to taser them." The idiot said that in a meeting at UCLA at 1pm TODAY. The staff found the policeman to also be very arrogant. So there you go.
da | 11.16.06 - 9:18 pm | #

The University pays these-- wanna be but aren,t good enough to be cops-- $8.50 an hour and puts a weapon in the hands of these incompetent bastards that has been proven to explode peoples hearts? My question is who is the criminal here these rent-a-cops or the University? Tommie27
Tommie27 | 11.16.06 - 9:19 pm | #

That actually made me cry. what the hell is wrong with our country? What happened? Or am I just waking up to the way things have always been?
Liberal Girl | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 1:45 pm |

This kind of thing, unfortunately, happens a lot.

What stereotypical college students. Get a freaking clue. He got what he deserved. Any time the authorities start ignoring procedure because of what someone said ("I said I was going to leave"), they're compromising the situation and putting people at risk. I'm not a rent-a cop, but if I walked up and told that dude to get out, and he wanted to pretend he was gonna do it on his own sweet time, I'd kick his ass all the way out the door too.
common sense | 11.16.06 - 1:52 pm |

If that's procedure on a college campus, the procedure should be changed.

And no one deserves to be repeatedly electric shocked or otherwise have his ass kicked for being uppity; I don't know what he did before the video, but that's what you're implying - that he disobeyed them snidely, so he deserved to be physically brutalized.

I don't care if the kid was a snot-nosed anarchist who flipped them off and told them to go fuck themselves. There were multiple officers there, and that kid didn't look too big. Cuffing his arms, and possibly his legs, and dragging him out could have easily sufficed, and they probably wouldn't even have needed the cuffs.
Karen | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 9:19 pm | #

sweet jesus.

That's it.

THAT is what Zimbardo demonstrated.
THAT is police groupthink
THAT is Milgram's work on compliance.

THAT is what Psychology was supposed to help prevent.

THAT is why the APA should not be involved in Military Research.

BlueBerry Pick'n
can be found @
ThisCanadian.com
"Silent Freedom is Freedom Silenced"
BlueBerry Pick'n | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 9:24 pm | #

as for the goober insinuating he was tased for being other than white,,,well i saw a black cop there trying to pick up that thoroughly non-compliant shit for brains and he still was not compliant. so...50,000 more volts until even a "skinnerian" rat gets it right.
burt | 11.16.06 - 9:27 pm | #

This is so disgusting. That even one person posting here can rationalize what those rent a cops did is beyond me.
Hattie | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 9:28 pm | #

That's (...) to say that if they had simply manhandled him out of the area he was told to leave (and then probably off campus), none of this would be news.
Paul in LA | 11.16.06 - 6:17 pm |

Correct.

Instead they tasered him.

Several times.

While he was already 'subdued'.

What's your point?

.
jay walker | 11.16.06 - 9:29 pm | #

For all the statist trolls saying that the kid was "noncompliant", try getting up after you get tasered, you morons.
Damian, the Left-Hand Player | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 9:57 pm | #

I haven't read my of the posts on this thread, but I wanted to tell you all that I know a young lady who uses to go to UCLA and she said that the library is where many of the Persians like to gather. It was like a hot spot for those who weren't old enought to go to the clubs.
I thought this was relavant to the subject.
GalfromCal | 11.16.06 - 10:07 pm | #

This is unbelievable, I am an attorney, I want to refer this case to a colleague who handles police abuse cases

Sam Plunkett 310-218-8340
Sam Plunkett | 11.16.06 - 10:07 pm | #

valentinian | 11.16.06 - 9:12 pm,

Yes one of many mistakes.

Myself I didn’t catch the ‘community-service’ before officer at first. Is that something below campus police? There’s been a lot of assertions about what was believed happened. Here’s mine (and if I’m wrong I’ll donate $10 to C&L):

My prediction is CSO will turn out to be some MILF or other relative hottie that the kid blew off when asked for ID. CSO goes off to campus police. Who return to show the kid how to respect a woman.

Another possibility is the kid found himself and others "Muslim" looking being asked an inordinate number time for their IDs by a random check by these CSOs. In which case I’d suspect their more of the barney fife or pimply-faced kid type for the community service "officers".

But for something like this, especially after 2 recent police abuse incidents in LA. For these “officers” to act so reckless. Just makes me suspect that sex is involved some way.
Thing Fish | 11.16.06 - 10:08 pm | #

BTW, why don't they have to prove that this young man was not a student before trying to eject him from the library? I know with most Colleges there is a KEOSH in the library were they could look up the students name.
He is a UCLA student
GalfromCal | 11.16.06 - 10:10 pm | #

We are seeing more and more of the US morphing into a police state. It takes a tazered victim around 15 minutes to regain strength. This kid was hit several times as witnessed by his screams of agony. Olbermann interviewed a UCLA editor about the episode. She verified that after the first shock, the student yelled at police that he had a medical condition.

Welcome to the 4th Reich, citizens! Things like this are all part of the grand scheme of things, things that Bush and his cronies engineered.
Captain USA | 11.16.06 - 10:11 pm | #

Sam Plunkett | 11.16.06 - 10:07 pm | #

I believe the ACLU is on this one
GalfromCal | 11.16.06 - 10:13 pm | #

If I heard right tonight on Keith Olbermanns countdown, he said the rent a cop campus police randomly asked for the student's ID and he didn't or couldn't produce it. That's when the rent a cops called the LA police who did the agonizing tasering. I guess this will shake out soon as to who did what and when.
Captain USA | 11.16.06 - 10:21 pm | #

Karen | 11.16.06 - 9:19 pm,

Agree with you response. Any time I see that "got what he deserved" statement all I can say is Pft!

This incident reminds me of that business up in Humboldt County, with the swabbing pepper spray in peoples eyes.
Thing Fish | 11.16.06 - 10:22 pm | #

I know the difference between the UCLA and the ACLU, the drug war is one of the biggest contributors to this problem.

http://www.pot-tv.net/archive/sh...howse- 4380.html
KuciNiCh | 11.16.06 - 10:34 pm | #

*look of shock and disgust*
Voice Of Reason | 11.16.06 - 10:45 pm | #

I would taser everyone of those cops if that were my son. How dare those pigs abuse their power. Give me a taser, and let me give each pig a dose of his medicine. Sickening...
John adams | 11.16.06 - 10:45 pm | #

I work in that lab, and I can tell you that the two cops involved are some the nicest, sweetest people you can meet. I've pulled plenty of night shifts and have been witness to a number of mentally disturbed people camping out in the library. I've been threatened on more than one occasion with physical abuse and rape, and only continued to go to work knowing that the campus cops have my back.

The only reason they check ID is that after 11:00 pm at night they want to make sure that only students are in the library studying. They don't check when you enter the door because many students camp out all day and when you have a library open 24 hours a day, that sort of system becomes meaningless.

The campus cops were only called AFTER the student became abusive towards staff and the CSOs. That he got tazered once is not surprising, that he got tazered more than once is sad and admittedly over the line, but don't misconstrue the escalating mistakes by both parties as a sign of the times. It is not. It is simply that: a mistake.
uclagirl | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 10:51 pm | #

used to work in "administrative services" and knew the chief of UCLA police. not a particularly nice person, and not very concerned about the students. it was a den of unhappy, miserable people jockeying for very little power. doesn't surprise me that under that kind of leadership something like this happens.
former UCLA employee | 11.16.06 - 11:00 pm | #

work in that lab, and I can tell you that the two cops involved are some the nicest, sweetest people you can meet. I've pulled plenty of night shifts and have been witness to a number of mentally disturbed people camping out in the library. I've been threatened on more than one occasion with physical abuse and rape, and only continued to go to work knowing that the campus cops have my back.

The only reason they check ID is that after 11:00 pm at night they want to make sure that only students are in the library studying. They don't check when you enter the door because many students camp out all day and when you have a library open 24 hours a day, that sort of system becomes meaningless.

The campus cops were only called AFTER the student became abusive towards staff and the CSOs. That he got tazered once is not surprising, that he got tazered more than once is sad and admittedly over the line, but don't misconstrue the escalating mistakes by both parties as a sign of the times. It is not. It is simply that: a mistake.
uclagirl | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 10:51 pm | #

A mistake is tasering once when not needed. Not 4 times. That's plain criminal. Your nice cops are gonna lose their jobs. Lucky a riot didn't happen.
ksg0 | 11.16.06 - 11:02 pm | #

Damn, this is the first time I've seen this today. I can't watch the videos at work. The military blocks that stuff.

Once a suspect is hand cuffed, law enforcement should never have to use this kind of force except in extreme circumstances and this kid doesn't count as extreme. The cops definitely abused their power. You can tell they were nervous about having all those college students around. It wouldn't have taken much to just bum rush the cops and beat their asses.

Wouldn't this be some sweet justice? Strip the cops to their bare asses and march them back to their precinct in front of their own squad cars.
AF_Comm_Guy | 11.16.06 - 11:07 pm | #

uclagirl | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 10:51 pm | #

Just because you work in the lab and have never had difficulty with these two cops doesn't mean that they are not capable of committing such an abuse.

Were you there on Tuesday night, are you a male, are you a person that is typically profiled? There are just so many variables here and your simplifing it to a mistake, because these cops are nice, just doesn't stand on it's own.
Compared to their action on this video I would not give much weight to what you have witnessed by these cops before.
I mean no disrespect, but their actions were more than a mistake, that was abuse of power!
GalfromCal | 11.16.06 - 11:08 pm | #

Order your's now and be prepared.

Ask for the special Student Discount.

http://www.beststungun.com/
Flipper | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 11:12 pm | #

I work at UCLA as well and I can tell you that I've often heard these two cops to make racist statements and to say how they were going to make an example of some rag head. Okay, I made all that up. None of it is true, but I hope I have proven my point.
rcg | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 11:16 pm | #

this is directed at burt,
the cop of supposedly twenty years.
many of my friends are detectives,and police officers.
i had to call them to quote your comment.
the 4 i was able to talk to(its a bit late here) all concurred that you were either a liar,or a local yocal sherrif.
either way,if you ever abused your powers on me,or my sons.
you would find me at your house,your church and most likely in court.i would make sure everyone in your family and neighborhood knew the facts on your abuse as an officer of the law.
you should be ashamed of yourself to condone such an abuse of trust.
because THATS what it is!'an abuse of trust.
people count on you,to be professional,and to have good judgement.they count on you to be level-headed in a time of crisis.normal,everyday people count on you to show discretion,and good judgement.
which the police in this video obviously did not.
i have taught my boys since a young age to respect authority,especially the police.
but respect and trust are earned.
if you believe that tazing a hand-cuffed young man,already in custody,REPEATEDLY,is not an abuse of power,and is just a reality,in your words "its a harsh world out there".
well,yeah..i guess it would be with police out there with your flippant attitude towards public trust.
i really just have to think that you are a fraud,and NOT an actual officer of the law.
to think that you actually are a cop just saddens me,and im sure my retired detective friends feel the same way.
shame on you burt,
shame.
enoch | 11.16.06 - 11:16 pm | #

And people wonder why I have such a murderous, pathological hatred of cops in general.
jurassicpork | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 11:35 pm | #

I think America is officially a huge fascist shithole. I am sooooo glad to live in a sane country.
Ramone | 11.16.06 - 11:47 pm | #

I think that kid has a right to sue. Tazers are to be used in situation where the suspect is threatening to hurt himself or others. It is used so that the cop doesn't have to use a gun. It is a weapon used when other means of intervention do not work. I can't believe being asked to leave the library constitutes a threatening situation. Where's the ACLU?
Jeanne | 11.16.06 - 11:56 pm | #

Tasers. Electroshock therapy for the masses.
Thing Fish | 11.16.06 - 11:58 pm | #

why didn't the students fight back, they need to take control!!!!!!!!!!! fuck these rent-a-cops. i hope they've lost their jobs, and are arrested, and tried. this is a fucking shame!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! no fucking excuse for this SHIT!!!!!!

welcome to bush amerika!!!!!!
TS | 11.17.06 - 12:01 am | #

Welcome to Amerika, where innocent students are now tortured into compliance with university rules. This incident is a complete violation of this student's rights.
I am ashamed to admit I live in this country.
bill | 11.17.06 - 12:06 am | #

Looking at the YouTube comments is scary, lots of people are defending the cops, way too many. I guess after they plugged Amadou Dialo 41 times for taking out his wallet, I shouldn't be suprised,...

You people read 1984, right? You realize you were supposed to STOP that from happening, not help it?
Johnny Thief | Homepage | 11.17.06 - 12:23 am | #

Another thing. I heard a kid ask for a badge number several times. Why wasn't the ID visible enough for the witnesses to file a complaint? These 'cops' were obviously freaked out by a situation they created and were tazing that kid to get him to move so that they could get out of there. They obviously lack training. Idiots. If I was the commanding officer I would be furious.

Also if I was a parent of a student thinking of going to this school I'd be telling my son or daughter think again. No kid of mine would go there.

So, just out of curiosity, what do they do with the students with tourettes syndrome?
Jeanne | 11.17.06 - 12:24 am | #

Half of these apologists have never HEARD of Thoreau nor of civil disobedience. These FAKE COPS just screwed themselves. The school is TOAST if they don't cough up these GOONS to the mob.
Jesus Christ | 11.17.06 - 12:25 am | #

Don't forget that 9 to the head for that guy mistaken for a terrorist in London.
Thing Fish | 11.17.06 - 12:26 am | #

The behavior of the rent-a-cops cannot be justified. PERIOD! Many thanks to whomever provided the e-mail addresses for the administrators of the creeps involved. I put the info to good use and CC'd everyone above them from the Chancellor down, and the library administrator as well.

Couple this instance of, "Papers! Vee must have you're papers!" abuse of authority with the most recent outrage from W & Co. where a valid passport isn't if THEY say so. You MUST get permission to travel!!! Can't leave, can't return home - unless 'authorized' to do so. Mother may I ... ?

This is not the country where I was born.
Alvin in Los Angeles | 11.17.06 - 12:40 am | #

SITEOWNER, I suggest you kill this thread. Troll bait, nothing useful here.
Dave L | 11.17.06 - 12:52 am | #

Welcome to Bush's Amerika.

America is starting to become more and more like Nazi Germany or the old USSR.

"Papers please."

If you do not have your papers, you are tased, beaten, and taken to Guantanamo. It makes me sick.
Nation of Chimps | 11.17.06 - 1:39 am | #

Liberal Girl | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 1:45 pm | #

Me too... It broke my heart! Though I was pleased to see other students trying to help as best they could...

I hope each and every one of the officers is locked up for years, and UCLA pays through the nose for that.
Elizabeth | 11.17.06 - 2:05 am | #

chancellor@conet.ucla.edu...........
that is the chancellor at ucla's email address. he needs to hear about it. I don't care if ten million people have already written him, he needs to hear more about it. i am sure we will get the name of the badass about 6 min 30 seconds in. he will be pissed because of all the media outlets at his front door. he deserves the bad publicity. video cameras are a bitch, aren't they.
Devin Kelley | 11.17.06 - 2:08 am | #

Do NOT shut this comment section down. Dave L - why are you afraid of opinions? I might have to call you a pussy if you can't handle reading opinions. You don't like what people have to say? Ok - good for you. Go read something else.
mojopo | 11.17.06 - 2:19 am | #

That incident really upset me... I can't believe it! I wrote a letter and sent it to the all the people listed on the police stations website as contacts. The letter reads as follows: November 16, 2006
To whom it may concern,
I am writing this e-mail to express my upset and disgust at the level of force and tactics that your officers used when dealing with the student at Powell Library. Taser guns and any use of force should be used as a last resort, only if someone is in danger of hurting themselves or others. Although the student in this case did not follow all of the rules set forth by the library, the use of excessive and aversive force such as electric shock seems not only unethical but certainly illegal. Administering a shock, regardless of its intent to 'move' someone or incapacitate someone has a debilitating effect- thank god this student didn't suffer from a heart condition, if he had you would most likely have a death investigation underway at the point due to the multiple shocks he was administered.
Why did your officers engage in a power-struggle with a student who had not threatened them with violence?
More importantly, would your instinct have been to deliver multiple painful shocks to the student who was in the library without a library card? Surely, the department has not become so desensitized to violence that it can justify the acts of these officers as ethical behavior and standards of practice.
Wouldn't it have been more responsible to have arrested him, by use of cuffs, and escorted or carried him out of the building? The use of electric shock is a terrifying display and abuse of authority. I look forward to reading your agencies report on the incident and following-up with the ACLU and others to ensure that such acts of flagrant abuses of power don't become a theme for CA and this country.
Sincerely,
Trevor | 11.17.06 - 2:30 am | #

SOMEONE SHOULD HAVE TAKEN OUT A GUN AND BLOWN THE FUCKING COPS AWAY!

THIS IS BULLSHIT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

...
TONY RIO | 11.17.06 - 3:08 am | #

Trevor,
What the cops did is not illegal, just poor judgment on their part. But they have only themselves to blame for letting the situation get to that point. While their actions weren't criminal (well threatening to tase the guy who asked them for their badge number was), they certainly demonstrated dangerous incompetence. At the very least, UCLA needs to hire a new batch of rent-a-cops (assuming that's what they were... I've heard they might have been LAPD, which would explain everything).
michesmith | 11.17.06 - 3:16 am | #

Trevor you don't know what the fuck your talking about. The cops are not there to dish out punishment. Which is exactly what they did. Actually what they did is torture. If 3 of these pussy cops can't subdue an individual without resorting to repeatedly tasing him/her then they are not worth a damn anyway.

I hope UCLA gets the shit sued out of them and perhaps they will wise up and take the tasers away from the campus pigs. And these were PIGS that did this. Scumbag shitball PIGS.

Eventually I hope we get the torture weapons out of all the police hands. Hwever we the people are a long way from taking our country back. Time will tell.
HEh | 11.17.06 - 3:28 am | #

Dave L, are you one of them there government types that don't want that footage to get out to the masses?

There was a time when police or security would just drag a person off of the premices, not anymore now that Torture is legal, thanks to little satan bush.

You wait people, this shit will happen more often in the future.

Remember Kent State?
American Psycho | 11.17.06 - 3:32 am | #

Just another college punk getting owned
Anonymous | 11.17.06 - 3:33 am | #

this may have been mentioned earlier, but wtf didn't everyone there charge the fucking police and take control and save the student?
Sarah Deere, Shrill One | Homepage | 11.17.06 - 3:33 am | #

and we might want to think about the many detention camps that have been constructed in this country by Hallilburton, eh?

WTF are they for, who are they for? Any ideas?
Sarah Deere, Shrill One | Homepage | 11.17.06 - 3:34 am | #

Those policemen are lucky they didn't get the shit kicked out of them...this time.

Anger the youth on our college campuses, smart move. You almost have to wonder if they enjoyed torturing that kid?

Maybe that is suppose to be a warning to the rest of us??
American Psycho | 11.17.06 - 3:35 am | #

I remember roughly two months ago I was watching CNN and on the bottom of the screen on the news bar read the following:

The supreme court has ruled that the government has the right to detain indefinitely any "non-resident" regardless of his race, creed, color or religion.

I thought WTF is that all about? I didn't hear anything else about it on any of the cable news stations and didn't hear any politician speak out against it.The ruling quietly passed
by without a peep.

So how does that now affect the Military Commissions Act passed 2 months later? People keep saying that the supreme court will over rule the government, but it seems that the supreme court quietly already backed the government 2 months ago.

Now what does non-resident mean? Today it could mean an illegal immigrant, but what about in the near future, say May, 2008.

That is when we will all have to purchase a National ID card/Drivers license, which will be embedded with
RFID chips, which will contain all of our personal information and also gives the government or police a way to track where each individual goes and each individuals transactions.

What if Americans refuse to participate because they say it's an invasion of their privacy? What happens if christians refuse to participate because of what the book of Revelations say's about the Mark of The Beast?

Will all of those who refuse be be considered "non-residents" then? Will the government round them up and detain them indefinitely?
American Psycho | 11.17.06 - 3:49 am | #

Well Sarah if you think about it. First there was:

The Patriot Acts 1&2.

Then the supreme courts quietly passed ruling that "non-residents" could be detained indefinitely.

Then there was a the ruling that now allows the police to bust down your door without announcing themselves and without a warrant.

Illegal wire tapping.

Torture becoming legal.

The death of Habeos Corpus.

Then the Military Commissions Act.

With all of these rulings and laws being passed or revised it sure seems to me that the government is almost expecting and preparing for mass chaos, protests and riots in our country.
American Psycho | 11.17.06 - 4:02 am | #

This is to Burt. If you were to tazer, baton, or shoot my child because he or she didn't obey you over showing a student ID. I would hunt you down and butcher you like the pig you are.
Al | 11.17.06 - 4:08 am | #

What did he expect? A group of people in uniforms demanded his papers and he didn't produce them. He's lucky he wasn't put in a camp and gassed.
Aon | 11.17.06 - 4:41 am | #

"This is your Patriot Act". Thank God I'm not an American in today's America. Australians - don't let John Howard strip us of our civil and democratic liberties as the Bush Administration has done to America.

Speak, write and vote your outrage about aggression disguised as authority. Every time.

For poor Mostafa: write Acting Chancellor Norman Abrams to express your outrage at:
chancellor@conet.ucla.edu
nsimpson | 11.17.06 - 4:52 am | #

Apparently. This guy got tased at least 5 times and I think perhaps twice more. Only on the second third time was the microphone close enough and the crowd quiet enough to hear the clicking sound of the stun gun.

Since when do cops need a stun gun to carry somebody off. That guy was no threat to those officers. Even after he was stunned several times, he still never gave a hint of violence.
archerofloaf | Homepage | 11.17.06 - 5:09 am | #

Sent to UCLA's Acting Chancellor Norman Abrams:

"Dear sir,

We are writing to express our outrage after viewing a video of this event on youtube:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W...CdNgoC0cE& eurl=

We have been watching America's obsession with unnecessary escalation of violence and abuse of authority for many years. Now we see it has come to the Universities. The actions of your campus 'police' (mind-boggling concept in itself) are indefensible, particularly in repeating the taser assault several times in several minutes. It is our understanding that taser 'incapacitates' a person - at least, that's what your statement says. We wonder exactly how the student was expected to stand up and leave the library after being paralysed by electrical pulse through his nervous system and muscles? It's astonishing that his chilling screams of agony managed to garner the volume they did after receiving such a hideous assault.

We reflect that had it been a black American who had been subjected to such treatment, LA would be on fire tonight.

We also reflect that the UCLA students who witnessed the event did not protest against it to a degree that common humanity would seem to demand. Is it the UCLA's intention to produce people who are so timid in themselves and so afraid of questioning the powers-that-be that even several of them could not prevent or end the assault as it was happening.

We look forward to seeing Mostafa vindicated in court. Justice would also seem to demand that UCLA pay Mostafa hefty compensation package that may go some small way towards alleviating the life-scarring effects of the event this unfortunate Muslim student experienced this week. After all, what does he pay his student fees for?

We welcome any reply you may care to make to us.

Sincerely,

Christian and Natalie Schladetsch
Melbourne, Australia"
C & N Schladetsch | 11.17.06 - 5:19 am | #

""Those cops are in big trouble."

I wrote: "Unlikely. The real issue is the protocol for using the TASER."

That was before it was clear that the officers had threatened students when they asked for his badge number.

THAT'S the end of those officers. And this is not a novel behavior. Once recently when a local cop refused to provide his card or badge number, I then moved to demand that they do, until they did. Even that is highly offensive and a great shame on those officers. But to threaten students when they demand that PROMISED information in any encounter with UCPD -- well, those cops or that cop has just lost his career and may well go to jail.
Paul in LA | 11.17.06 - 5:43 am | #

Aren't libraries univeraslly to be quiet?

Sorry folks, I'm for the fuzz on this one.

I am a loud liberal. And I love libaries and the freedoms they embody. And generally, I hate cops.

I am rather amazed at not only how strongly I felt that the loudmouth was the trouble maker who was out of line, but I am also disturbed that so many posters here felt sorry for the shmo.

I just really, REALLY dig peace. If an individual is gonna go disturbing the peace like that, it had better be for a morally, intellectually defenisble cause. Hell, I'm so tired of being trampled for being Mr.Niceguy that I mighta kicked the punks ass myself just for insulting our intelligence that he had some so-called right to be so obnoxious.

If anybody has any follow up info. on just wtf point the punk was trying to make, I will be prompt to apologise for misunderstanding.

But from what I heard and saw, the punk was acting like RUSH LIMBAUGH- making alot of narcotic-induced, pseudopatriotic freedom babble long past funny to any sober folks.

California is still too weird for me. I suppose they will lionize this guy like O.J. Simpson or Rodney King.
Just Jim | 11.17.06 - 5:49 am | #

"We reflect that had it been a black American who had been subjected to such treatment, LA would be on fire tonight."

That is incorrect. There would be a large protest.

Please note that this WAS NOT LAPD. The Rodney King incident was not a TASER incident-- it was a beating.

The ethnicity of the student isn't clearly involved in this incident. However it is true that UCLA has a very low black enrollment -- it has been going down since Connolly used the Initiative to install more racism in the system.

Los Angeles is the most integrated city in the world, but that doesn't mean it is free from racism. But these officers would have probably done the exact same thing to a white kid, a Samoan, or an Italian.
Paul in LA | 11.17.06 - 5:51 am | #

Just Jim, those actions of threatening students and refusing to identify themselves when asked are firing offenses in the LAPD (and probably the UCPD) for a reason.
Paul in LA | 11.17.06 - 5:54 am | #

"I would hunt you down and butcher you like the pig you are." --Al

Marvelous righteousness, Al, but consider for a moment that if you are that offended you probably have a crusade ahead of you, because these TASERS are all ove the country, and they ARE being used.

Time to donate more money to the ACLU.
Paul in LA | 11.17.06 - 6:03 am | #

We also reflect that the UCLA students who witnessed the event did not protest against it to a degree that common humanity would seem to demand. Is it the UCLA's intention to produce people who are so timid in themselves and so afraid of questioning the powers-that-be that even several of them could not prevent or end the assault as it was happening.

I have to disagree with you. Those kids should be praised for their behaviour. They did not react to violence with violence, a very large group got up from their studies and followed the police, many of them recording the incident on their phones, many more challenging the actions of the police. This has probably done more to 'educate' those students about the political realities of their country than any course work ever could.

Violence would have only vindicated the actions of those police. Those students were no threat to anyone, and the actions of the police so obviously completely unwarranted. Bravo to those students who, in an unplanned moment, spontaneously reacted just as decent, law-abiding American citizens should have reacted.
nonny mouse | 11.17.06 - 6:03 am | #

Oh, and help put Rumsfeld on trial for torture:

http://tinyurl.com/3ruof

These officers are part of the grand continuum of abuse flowing from that font of inhumanity.
Paul in LA | 11.17.06 - 6:10 am | #

Nonny mouse, it's also the empowered behavior, depending on what happens next. I suspect tomorrow's protest will be quite large.

Once the officers refused to identify themselves and threatened the innocent students, they clarified the evil of their abuse of power. At that point, let the lawyers show the officers their error in court.
Paul in LA | 11.17.06 - 6:15 am | #

"The real issue is the protocol for using the TASER.

>>I'm not a Cop, but I'm just guessing, "protocol" doesn't include a handcuffed non-threatening individual who is walking too slow."

I was saying that THOSE PROTOCOLS are the issue. I didn't say that I agreed with them. I don't think TASERS should be standard equipment.

"I really sucks that we have to debate torture like this were a vague issue."

Torture? I think you're unaware of what the standards of police action are in your community.

"Talk about "moral relativism." I'm not a Christian -- I'm a Unitarian, and I think each and ever person at my congregation would say; "that's wrong." Without hesitation."

Yeah, and so what? The police departments in most areas do this sort of thing or its equivalent on a regular basis. And the Supreme Court in general has supported similar police activity, including in the recent gross expansions of the police power.

That is REALITY. It's not my personal fault.

"It's wrong, and I think anyone who doesn't "get that" is a deeply flawed person -- nothing personal." --VitriolAndAngst

Who are you talking about? Of course it's wrong, and there are a great many wrongs. Have a look at your own local police force policies some time.
I'm just saying that the addition of TASERS has come with protocols for their use. IF those protocols allow for the use of TASERs to subdue resisting suspects, then the behavior of these cops in that degree may not have landed them in great trouble legally.

The SCOTUS just said that cops don't have to announce themselves before banging down a door, using stun grenades, and shooting your dog. You and I both agree that's wrong. But what are their protocols for doing it -- because that is the standard against which the current batch of cops is going to be judged, decency notwithstanding.
Paul in LA | 11.17.06 - 6:29 am | #

Sometimes it's hard to remember that there are some fine, effective, calm, cool, collected cops out there. In fact, I'm not at all proud to say that I've been on the wrong side of the law of a few that were smarter than me, cooler than me, and more generous than I deserved -- likely because they had the confidence and control of a good cop. Unfortunately, there aren't enough and those who are would never take a stand against a bad cop. There are too many bad cops and too many otherwise decent cops that just ignore abuse and wish it away. The cop that stands against it is Public Enemy #1 until he's forced out of the service for good.

Time to get rid of them and take our chances with law-breakers.
KDP | 11.17.06 - 6:46 am | #

"And I am so sick of people who defend this nonsense with the argument that "a cop's job is dangerous". No its not, a cab driver job is more dangerous than a cop's job. In fact, in fatalities on the job, police officer never makes the top 10. Cab driver is always #1 or close to it.
Angry Black Man | 11.16.06 - 3:30 pm |"

I did a study of "most dangerous jobs" back when I ran c*pkiller.*rg (letters replaced because some porn spammers bought the domain when I stopped running it). Commercial fishermen have the highest on-job fatalities of any group. Retail managers have the highest homicide-related fatalities of any group. Cops are pretty low on either list (in the teens, as I recall). Campus rent-a-pigs like these fuckups are going to clock in at around 0 on-job fatalities currently, but if they keep these tactics up I expect that number to rise significantly.
Steve Pordon | 11.17.06 - 6:50 am | #

No way I say next time the students should act!!!!!--10 on 1--
We out number them we all out number them!!!
They work for us , they dont rule us, time to stop the bullshit.

Just remove those nazi fucks from school property by all means possible.!!

Students don't let that happen again in your sight. ;|
KuciNiCh | 11.17.06 - 6:54 am | #

Students Respond!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R...h? v=R4_s4Un0TkI
KuciNiCh | 11.17.06 - 6:57 am | #

In Canada, all police officers across the country are required by law, to follow the Use-of-Force Continuum. That is - they have the legal authority to only use force that is ONE STEP higher than the force they are confronted with. They also have to continually assess the situation, plan a course of action and act with every escalation of force.

The force escalation steps are as follows:

1) Co-operative (the suspect is listening and complying with police commands)
- Police can only use tactical communication.

2) Passive resistance (the suspect goes limp when the officer is trying to handcuff them and has to be physically carried out of the premises)
- Police can only use empty hand techniques, such as grappling and using pressure points on the suspect's body (no weapons at this point).

3) Active resistance (the suspect is twisting and turning to actively get out of police restraints)
- Police are authorized to use soft impact techniques, such as police batons, flashlights etc. to detain a suspect.

4) Assaultive (the suspect is punching and/or kicking the police officer)
- Police are authorized to less-lethal weapons such as mace, rubber bullets or TASERS.

5) Serious Bodily Harm or Death (the suspect has a weapon with intent to use on a civilian or police officer)
- Only at this point are police allowed to use firearms to subdue the suspect.

According to these guidelines, were the police justified in using force reserved only for those suspects actively punching and kicking police officers on a guy who was complying with police orders to leave the premises?

FUCK NO!

The highest level of force that the police were confronted with was that the student was complying with their demands, albeit slowly. He explicitly said that he was leaving the premises and his actions indicated he was doing so. The guy wasn't even passively resisting as the police were able to handcuff him to escort him out; it seems to be at this point when he was first tasered. The police escalated the situation without reason and used force that was THREE TIMES over what they were legally mandated to do. This person was not a threat to anyone in the library, was not physically abusive to the officers nor did he have any weapons. That is a textbook definition of abuse of police power. This, along with the video footage (which was really disturbing and fucked up) and the testimony of the witnesses present should present a pretty solid prima facie civil case in front of a jury. The cops broke the law without legal justification, not the student.

yeah Jeff I heard that too and thought wtf country are we in??? Bush has RUINED America, maybe it is time to move to Canada
ellie2 | 11.16.06 - 1:38 pm | #

So my question is this, "Is it right for liberals to stand around and watch while another is being brutally beaten? If so, then, I guess, I just don't fit in anywhere and perhaps ellie2 is correct and I should go ahead and move to Canada.
rcg | Homepage | 11.16.06 - 2:37 pm | #

No, Canada is full. But you guys are cool, I won't taser you if you come up without ID

I"m not about to make some random guy resisting arrest for reasons unknown into a martyr.
Think, Please | 11.16.06 - 3:40 pm |

We didn't turn this guy into a martyr. The cops with the tasers did.
Paula | 11.17.06 - 7:59 am | #

Why can't anyone just relax for a second? Every problem or conflict can not be remedied in a blink of the eye. Guns and force are rarely the answer to any problem. This reminds of all the high profile conflicts of late: Waco, Elian Gonzales, Iraq, always guns and trouble. What happened to waiting and talking? Let's put this back in perspective. What could he have done? Was this a best solution? Did the response to the probem cause a bigger problem? It is difficult to admit, but we just can not always get our way.
kindablue2 | 11.17.06 - 9:03 am | #

It comes down to one simple thing if the kid would have pulled out his ID this never would have happened.

He was trying to show off and not produce what he was told to produce for what ever reason and after the fact would not comply with officers.

This is not the cops fault it is his. They had every right to do what they did they were doing there job.

If you do not comply with them and then do not leave when you are told to you should not expect any less.

Think of it this way if I get pulled over for speeding and I start mouthing off to a cop and giving him a hard time (even though I am in the wrong) I am going to get a ticket. If I comply and show respect I may just get a warning. If the kid would have remained calm and not over reacted to them asking for his ID this would have never become an issue.

Unfortantly to many people have lost resepect for the police and quite frankly for others.
BC | Homepage | 11.17.06 - 9:19 am | #

If a group of police officers can't restrain someone under most circumstances without recourse to using weapons, they aren't tough enough for the job.
sulphurdunn | 11.17.06 - 9:30 am | #

I'd like to see that cop try to stand after getting Tased, what like 6 times? Asshole.
WaltTrombone | Homepage | 11.17.06 - 9:36 am | #

I'll tell you what... those "cops" are damn lucky they weren't jumped by the crowd and beaten to death.

Morons. Maybe they should be taught how to do their job. They obviously have no idea. When you can't handle one unarmed disorderly college student guilty of nothing more than not wanting to leave a room, that's pretty sad.
A. J. Arno | 11.17.06 - 9:46 am | #

Call me reactionary, but I would've jumped the cops and started swinging.
mcnab | Homepage | 11.17.06 - 9:50 am | #

one more re-post (i promise this will be it!)
PROTEST INFO RE TORTURED UCLA STUDENT
***PROTEST PLANNED at Noon on Friday November 17, 2006 on Kirchoff Steps at UCLA.***

CALL UCLA NOW and raise HELL
Telephone: 310-825-2151 Fax: 310-206-6030 (chancellor@conet.ucla.edu)

***PROTEST PLANNED at Noon on Friday November 17, 2006 on Kirchoff Steps at UCLA.***

SO EFFING SICK!!!
jayne | 11.17.06 - 9:54 am | #

The power of images.

We need a modern day "water cannon on the Negros" event to wake the American people from their stupor on abuse of power and the encroachment of a Police State in America.

These Gestapo-like tactics will serve to radicalize and mobilize college students, who will be our future leaders. The myopic Right Wing ought to think about that before blindly supporting Authoritarianism.
LesserFool | 11.17.06 - 10:00 am | #

VitriolAndAngst | 11.16.06 - 7:16 pm | #

That fighting off tyranny line reminded me that Pat Buchanan once said how his favorite movie was Braveheart. However, in 1992 he delivered a speech at the Republican Convention that led me to believe the audience would start singing Deutchland Uber Alles.
ysbaddaden | 11.17.06 - 10:14 am | #

In the past year, I've read of in an incident in the Dallas Morning Nudes where federal agents (I'm not sure what branch), entered a library and was insisting on seeing what people were reading on computer screens and what sites they were on. They were ordering people off the computers.

The librarian called the local cops, and the cops ordered the feds out of the library for disturbing the peace.

I guess we can be glad the cops didn't taser the feds.
ysbaddaden | 11.17.06 - 10:16 am | #

So why are you so quickly picking sides and making such critical judgments based on possible hypothetical evidence that may or may not exist and yet which you also ASSume will be to be contrary versus the significant evidence that you have seen?
rcg

--- -- - - -

Because the 'significant evidence' doesn't show what lead up to the altercation with the police and unlike a lot of people who seem to be replying to this posting - my mind isn't just going to fill in the blanks.

Yeah to me it looks like the cops were excessive, but I wasn't there.
E in MD | 11.17.06 - 10:35 am | #

E in MD,

Did um's feewings get hurt? Boo hoo.

If you make ridiculous statements, you'll get ridiculed.
Jeff Boatright
- - - - -

Nice... I feel so property chastised for stating my oppinions. I guess I should go join the Republican glee club now since assholes like you don't want me in their club.
E in MD | 11.17.06 - 10:40 am | #

What the fuck is that? I'm amazed the crowd didn't rush the rent-a-cops. Heads damn well better roll.

Reportedly (following the link) the student was...wait for it...Arab-American.

Big fucking shock. Disgusting.
Doug Tarnopol | 11.17.06 - 10:43 am | #

Just Jim
----

Better watch it dude. You have a dissenting oppinion and that's not allowed on here. Everyone must agree with what the herd says or else!

Next thing you know Angry Black Guy and Jeff Boatright will be showing up to call you names because they aren't smart enought to counteract your oppinions and we're all 5 year olds on the playground.
E in MD | 11.17.06 - 10:44 am | #

Horrifying, but apparently all too common. No, really. Check out the links:
First there's Amnesty International, who are calling for more study of tasers and a moratorium on using them: http://web.amnesty.org/library/ i...engamr510302006

According to AI, many uses involve a combination of taser shocks with pepperspray or restraint (like people who are already cuffed). Some departments condone use of the taser when a person doesn't comply with the officer's requests. (as in "I'd like to see you ID") and also: "most of those who have died have been unarmed men who did not appear to pose a threat of death or serious injury when they were electro-shocked - a pattern seen in taser use across the country." Not just one video, but many many times. A request to leave the library seems pretty ridiculous, though!

Second, there's recommendation that 'drive stun' be avoided: http://www.policeone.com/writers...ticles/1188331/

The author adds: "I ask you to consider the difference between “compliance” and “control.”
Perhaps you’ve noticed the same thing I have. The problematic TASER incidents—ones that cost you headlines, internal investigations, and lawsuits—are frequently incidents where the officer is trying to achieve compliance with the officer’s directions, as opposed to trying to achieve control of an actively or aggressively and physically resisting suspect.
This is a very dicey subject! Each agency makes its own policies. If there is a use of force continuum, each agency gets to decide where to place each tool and tactic."

So I think we all need to push very hard to have the department review it's "use of force continuum," particularly with respect to tasers. I think there are some useful links above.

Third point: the numbers from Florida, where they actually studied taser use: http://www.palmbeachpost.com/ loc...taser_0530.html
to summarize: used over 1000 times in 6 months. Used on
6 people older than 65
3 women who said they were pregnant
57 people high on drugs
272 people multiple times
In more than 1/4 of the cases it was used to get compliance from passively resisting people!
... and another interesting fact: the 50,000 volts is for the darts. The 'drive stun' option is NOT supposed to incapacitate for very long, it is only designed to CAUSE PAIN. and yes, without leaving any marks. Apparently having a total body cramp inflicted for 5 seconds gets most people to comply.
For those interested in rule of law, I ask: WHY oh, why do we allow these poorly trained, underfunded, racist "police" to carry these weapons that are perfectly designed for torture? The video tape should make us all aware of this problem, which is apparently what Mostafa had in mind. http://www.latimes.com/news/local/

So now we jsut have to these torture devices out of university libraries, train the police to be more 'color neutral', and convince people that 'just follow the rules and nothing will go wrong' only works for the white males, sometimes.
chemical | 11.17.06 - 10:45 am | #

There are many missing pieces to this puzzle story:

-- Did the student refuse to leave the library because he couldn't or wouldn't provide ID? We can plainly hear the student shouting, "I told you I would leave!"

-- Why didn't his fellow students come to his aid? They were threatened with tasing by the police. They would have been handcuffed and arrested too. It was more important to video what was happening... seeing is believing. I'm sure the students were overwhelmed with the horror they were witnessing. Also in '05, the Bushites instructed the military to be prepared for citizen riots and insubordination. I read all of the gov. papers. Wow, what they have in store for us!

-- Did the student leave his ID in the lab as stated further up in this thread? We should find that out.

-- Did the police have the right to act as they did? If they claim that was the case, this country is in worse condition than we ever thought.

-- Will the truth of this episode come out? Probably not the whole truth. The episode will be spun, riced and diced by the UCLA board.(Do you believe me or your eyes spin)

The student appeared to be incapacitated merely by handcuffing his wrists behind his back. Why was he tased even once? These hotshots wanted to assert authority through cruelty. They all have psychological deficits... little man problems no doubt. I'd like to see their lifetime rap sheets. We might see things like "referred to juvenile court for setting a neighborhood dog on fire," etc. A good lawyer can find things like that out.

Bottom line is these creeps surely can't be human. There is absolutely NO EXCUSE for treating a human being in that manner no matter how much anyone wants to spin it.
Captain USA | 11.17.06 - 11:02 am | #

Better watch it dude. You have a dissenting oppinion and that's not allowed on here. Everyone must agree with what the herd says or else!

Next thing you know Angry Black Guy and Jeff Boatright will be showing up to call you names...

E in MD | 11.17.06 - 10:44 am | #

I've had differences on this subject with ABG and others on this thread and we discussed it out on the merits. That's all this site asks.

And how is asking, "...call you names because they aren't smart enought to counteract your oppinions and we're all 5 year olds on the playground...."
raising you above the playground?

I know you are, but what am I?
ysbaddaden | 11.17.06 - 11:05 am | #

Illinois Teen Shouting for Jesus Dies When Police Taser Him
Tuesday, October 31, 2006 AP

JERSEYVILLE, Ill. — Authorities are investigating the death of a 17-year-old boy who died after officers in this St. Louis-area community shot him twice with a stun gun while he carried a Bible and cordless telephone, shouting "I want Jesus."

Roger Holyfield died Sunday night at a St. Louis hospital, a day after the former Jersey Community High School's confrontation with police.

In a statement obtained Tuesday by The Associated Press, police in this community about 40 miles north of St. Louis said Holyfield would not acknowledge officers who approached him, continuing to yell "I want Jesus."

Holyfield became combative when officers tried to calm him, then was shot with a stun gun after ignoring their warnings to comply with their commands, police said. He was shot a second time when he continued struggling, police said.

Holyfield vomited at the scene and was taken by ambulance to a local hospital, then was flown to St. Louis' Cardinal Glennon Hospital, where he died shortly after 8 p.m. the next day, police said.

[do they mean to tell us that several officers could not physically commandeer a 17 yr. old boy?] Wake up America!
Captain USA | 11.17.06 - 11:23 am | #

Notice at the end the "cop" says to the kid, "back up or you'll get tased too".
Keith | 11.17.06 - 11:28 am | #

Hey OMNI, get tased a few times and see how easy it is to move.
Keith | 11.17.06 - 11:28 am | #

This idiot was obviously playing to his audience with his pathetic girl screaming. All he had to do was to comply with the officer's legal request and everything would've been fine. He refused and got the business end of a taser.

Lesson learned.
OMNI | 11.17.06 - 11:23 am | #

????????????????????????????????????

You´re either a paye dtroll or a very, very, dumb person!!!

Taser is supposed to make you infit to move for at least a whilöe - then how is this kid supposed to stand up after a numerous tesering?

Oh, I guess i am just loosing my time - anybody her who writes in favour of those pigs is just an arrogant and ignoramnt pig himself.

Lick my old-european ass!
gladnottobeamerican | 11.17.06 - 11:31 am | #

JERSEYVILLE, Ill. — Authorities are investigating the death of a 17-year-old boy who died after officers in this St. Louis-area community shot him twice with a stun gun while he carried a Bible and cordless telephone, shouting "I want Jesus."

What's wrong with the young people today? We we're shouting, "I want my MTV."
ysbaddaden | 11.17.06 - 11:33 am | #

Well, a little longer ago we were just happy to have our T Rex
gladnottobeamerican | 11.17.06 - 12:00 pm | #

oh god, another waste of time!

the UCPD is now an agent of Bush? give me a break! They've been 'abusing' outspoken students and non-students on campus for DECADES. This is nothing new.

given the psychos that often show up in UC Libraries (like the convicted sex offender who was caught assaulting people at UCSC 2 years ago - http://www2.ucsc.edu/police/ comm...alert091204.htm ), i can't say I blame them.

People whine when they use deadly force, people whine when they use non-deadly force.

don't second guess peace officers automatically. If this guy was abused, he'll get his day in court.

so stop making a big deal out of this.
losing faith | 11.17.06 - 12:09 pm | #

gladnottobeamerican | 11.17.06 - 12:00 pm | #

Oh yes, give me a little of that Bang a Gong (Get It On).
ysbaddaden | 11.17.06 - 12:10 pm | #

T Rex, that Alice Cooper wannabe wanker.
ysbaddaden | 11.17.06 - 12:11 pm | #

I'm devastated that the students did nothing more.
__earth | Homepage | 11.17.06 - 12:15 pm | #

cause a riot would have REALLY helped matters...

that's thinking, earth. got kids?
trashman | Homepage | 11.17.06 - 12:26 pm | #

I'm not sure what the students could've done. If a riot broke out the authorities would never blame the police.

Were the police ever blamed for the police riot in Chicago outside the 1968 Democratic convention? Even if they were, it was probably as contributors to, not the sole cause.

We'll have to keep an eye on this situation, because if the student with the sudden perm is here on a student visa, he might find himself suddenly deported over this.
ysbaddaden | 11.17.06 - 12:26 pm | #

"Taser is supposed to make you infit to move for at least a whilöe - then how is this kid supposed to stand up after a numerous tesering?

Oh, I guess i am just loosing my time - anybody her who writes in favour of those pigs is just an arrogant and ignoramnt pig himself."

*sigh*

More insight from the Eurotrash sector...try to use logic and intellect in your argument, and refrain from calling people names like "ignoramnt", that way you won't sound like an illiterate imbecile.

You stupid, foolish child.

Oh, and if a police officer gives you a lawful order (which they did), you are required to comply. If you fail to comply, you might get tasered. He got what he deserved.

Again, and again, and again.
captainomni | 11.17.06 - 12:55 pm | #

Eurotrash, use logic, illiterate imbecile, stupid foolish child, ignore the question about how to stand after you've lost muscle control...

And this is using logic and intellect, how?
ysbaddaden | 11.17.06 - 1:08 pm | #

I am 61 years old and you might think I would say something different, but I will tell you ...

THIS SCENE IS NOT America ! This is not what America is about, and if we - you and I do not stand up and take this country back NOW it is gone.

Whoever these people are in "authority" in this UCLA situation need to be fired - immediately removed from their positions, and never work in anything related to what they are doing here - never again.

This young man was a STUDENT - not some "enemy combatant" or so-called terrorist.

If this were my son, and it easily could be, I would be in their faces right now this morning, and they would either be gone or I would be in jail - no middle ground on this folks.

We had damn well better identify who is the ENEMY and lock them up, or else it us US who will be locked up.

James M Booth
Redmond OR USA
James M Booth | 11.17.06 - 1:15 pm | #

ysbaddaden:

The student is American born with Arabian heretage. He speaks perfect English, no accent.
Captain USA | 11.17.06 - 1:24 pm | #

mostafa tabatabainejad. that's a persian (iranian) sounding name.

iranians are not arabs.
trashman | Homepage | 11.17.06 - 2:07 pm | #

Thanks Capt. USA, that's one of the things I was wondering about, and the story didn't say, unless I somehow overlooked it.

I believe it was the May issue of US World & News that had a report of local cops getting out of hand with their new found powers under the Patriot Act. Now this situation in California may be seperate of that issue, but only tangentially. Once cops get used to a new method it be SOP.

Are US News & World commie?
ysbaddaden | 11.17.06 - 2:10 pm | #

My understanding is Iranians and Iraqians are both Persians.
ysbaddaden | 11.17.06 - 2:11 pm | #

However, Arab or Persian aside the key is the student was an American. That shouldn't make a difference, but it does.
ysbaddaden | 11.17.06 - 2:13 pm | #

I had been always wondering what domestic terrorism was,but as soon as I saw that film everything became clear to me.Congratulations for the this fake democracy.thanks God I m not living in this Busch-prescibed democracy.
Keivan | 11.17.06 - 2:34 pm | #

Nice of that one cop to threaten the female student for asking his name & badge number.

...why do people worship the police in this country?

Reminder, the police (LEOs) are not legally obliged to protect anyone...so you're on your own.
Karl Rove II | 11.17.06 - 2:37 pm | #

My understanding is Iranians and Iraqians are both Persians.
ysbaddaden | 11.17.06 - 2:11 pm | #

Wrong, a majority of Iraqis are Arabs..a minority are Kurds.
Karl Rove II | 11.17.06 - 2:39 pm | #

Norman Abrams Chancelor at UCLA

chancellor@conet.ucla.edu
ysbaddaden | 11.17.06 - 2:46 pm | #

This is the most disgusting thing I've ever seen. The guy is in handcuffs and they keep tasering him. They could of easily just picked him up and carried him out. The cops will be fired and hopefully imprisoned for their actions. I hope that guy sues for everything he has coming. I wish the students observing had intervened. They should of overpowered the police. Once a cop commits a crime, he isn't cop anymore in my opinion. Just another criminal in need of a take down. The badge don't make someone above the law. It's high time we stop being afraid of "authority" and giving these thugs in uniform our automatic respect. I'm not saying all cops are thugs, just some of them. We've all encountered power hungry pigs before, that's the kind I'm talking about. That's the kind we are observing on this video. Next time something like this happens, I hope the crowd will intervene.
Conservative slayer | 11.17.06 - 2:53 pm | #

Who Would Jesus Taser?
ysbaddaden | 11.17.06 - 2:59 pm | #

Hey BC, you state if he had just shown his id, this wouldn't of happened. Did it ever occur to you that he might not of had it with him? So if he didn't have it with him, how could he produce it for the power hungry pigs? Also the video shows he is handcuffs when they keep tasering him. He was in custody, all they had to do was carry him out. They choose to torture him and I hope they burn in hell for it.
Conservative slayer | 11.17.06 - 3:52 pm | #

What struck me is that those bystanders simply allowed that kid to be tortured. Reminds me of old Nazi propaganda films where the Brown Shirts beat up old Jews for the fun of it, and then claimed that they were impotent to do anything about it.
Henry Miller | 11.17.06 - 3:54 pm | #

Con slayer:

I think the fellow students were leading by example by not physically intervening. As I said above, the Bushites can't wait for some civil disobedience. The US military have been practicing (so called) civil disobedience control since '04 or '05 at Bushy's request... how the military is to control protests, dissent and riots. I've seen the govt' papers and have since lost the link. They were scary and mindful of the Old Soviet Union. So you see they have all the bases covered in advance of any possible retaliation against them or local police. What kind of minds think and plot that way?
Captain USA | 11.17.06 - 3:55 pm | #

Ooops, above comment meant for Miller
Captain USA | 11.17.06 - 3:59 pm | #

REX-84

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rex_84

"Rex 84, short for Readiness Exercise 1984, was a plan by the United States federal government to test their ability to detain large numbers of American citizens in case of massive civil unrest or national emergency. Exercises similar to Rex 84 happen periodically. Plans for roundups of persons in the United States in times of crisis are constructed during periods of increased political repression such as the Palmer Raids and the McCarthy Period. For example, from 1967 to 1971 the FBI kept a list of persons to be rounded up as subversive, dubbed the "ADEX" list."

The US Constitution, void where prohibited by law.
Karl Rove II | 11.17.06 - 4:00 pm | #

I guess, Jeff Boatright, would rather see his mom repeatedly mugged and beaten by some thug...because WE all know he won't be calling the police. They are evil and should not be call because they tasered some poor college cretin who wanted to be a MAN among the UCLA sheeple.
Kyle | 11.17.06 - 4:00 pm | #

Iranian Arab communities are known to be in five locations.
1. In Kuwait along the Kuwait/Iran border.
2. In Iraq along the Iraq/Iran border and especially in the city of Basra.
3. Three provinces along the Persian Gulf: Khuzestan, Bushehr, and Hormozgan.
Most Iranian Arabs live in the southern regions of Iran with the majority living in the southwestern province of Khuzestan while others live along the coast of the Persian Gulf.
Captain USA | 11.17.06 - 4:13 pm | #

Kyle, the police have no legal obligation to protect you...or anyone else.

We're on our own...dial 911 and die.
Karl Rove II | 11.17.06 - 4:48 pm | #

After everyone has said their two-cent worth, and has vocally expressed outrage at either the students or the police, is it possible to sit back, take a deep breath, and count to ten? Whew….there…

What the student did at the library was wrong.

Even though UCLA has graciously allowed the public access to their library (no – its NOT public property), they have deemed it safer for the students to restrict access to students only after 11:00 pm. Like they’ve been doing for the last couple of years, at 10:45 on Wednesday, they announced that student Community Service Officers would be checking IDs. At 11:45 the student at a computer terminal was asked by these two CSOs to show his ID. He said “Fuck Off!” They told him that if he didn’t show his ID he would have to leave. He did neither. Perhaps he was busy and needed some more time, perhaps he had a big chip on his shoulder, and perhaps he was just having a bad day. Never-the-less – he refused to leave so the CSO called the UCCP, and minutes later they showed up. At this point, the student had already packed his bags and was starting to leave. So far, the student was just being belligerent, and he was still wrong.

If that’s all that happened, the student newspaper may have just reported that some jerk of a student caused a ruckus in the library, and no one but those in the library at the time would have heard of the incident. Again, at this point, the student was wrong.

Escalation…

Having been told of a uncooperative student in the library, the UCCP may have rushed in, asked again for the student to leave, and followed him out screaming and yelling. Bad student. They may have grabbed his arm, and while he fell limp screaming and yelling, they may have applied physical pressure and carried him out the library. Bad student. If the student started screaming and yelling and KICKING, they may have handcuffed him, picked him up screaming and yelling, and arrested and prosecuted him. Bad student.

Unfortunately, that’s not what happened.

What the UUCP did do, was grab the student by the arm, at which point the student fell limp, screaming and yelling. What was wrong, is that at this point they used the “drive-by” contact taser…and you know the rest of the story.

It appears that neither the Sherrif’s Dept (who trained the UCCP), the LAPD, nor the UCCP have definitive regulations regarding the repeated use of tasers on un-cooperative suspects. So be it. The question here that no one seems to be asking is “At what point is it OK to use a taser on a hand-cuffed suspect in custody?” Given the lack of definitive regulations, and thus being the officers’ discretion, at what point does the use become excessive?

Was the student hand-cuffed before being shocked the fist time? If not, I could possibly give the benefit of doubt to the officer (not likely, but possibly). But the student was obviously restrained before the second, third, and forth application. I can see no reason, benefit, or justification for these applications of injury other than – “he was screaming, and yelling.”

Reportedly the officers told the student 20-40 times to stand up – AFTER being tased. Compliance with those particular verbal orders are arguably ridiculous, and refusal can not be used as justification. The only logical explanation is that the officers overreacted with undue and excessive force that escalated the situation. They were wrong.

Which offense is more egregious? Written regulations or not, the greater offense lies with the officers. They’re duty is to protect – not escalate. Therefore a civil suit is likely, even though the student WAS WRONG.

That’s all that happened. While it might serve some social commentary as to the police and society in general being immune to the implications of escalation of violence, Bush did not assault this student. This was not a political rally. Further division of political persuasion need not be expanded as well. What took place was a miscarriage of police force in a library caught on video. As shocking as it was (and I am shocked and upset)…I for one will count to ten…again.
Taarak | 11.17.06 - 5:27 pm | #

I love how every poster on this board is practically ejaculating that they are so excited to attribute some misuse of authority to "Bush's Reich."

"What's that? A college rent-a-cop went beserk and tasered a beligerent student! Boo-ya! Take this Mr. Bush!"

You guys are like sports parents who blame the ref when one of the kids punches another. What if every single cop involved voted against Bush. Or the Patriot Act. This has NOTHING to do with politics. This has EVERYTHING to do with the fact that the officers involved acted wrongly and overly aggressive to the situation. By placing the blame on the current administration you are, in fact, taking some of the blame off of the officers and redirecting it onto Bush.

NOT EVERY PROBLEM IN THE WORLD CAN BE ATTRIBUTED TO REPUBLICANS. Violence, death, greed and misuse of power is as old as time.
Dirk Praline Jr. | 11.17.06 - 5:46 pm | #

No not every problem in the world can be attributed to republicans. Just most of the problems in this country. The state of race relations is an example. The GOP's Southern Strategy (appeals to white racism) was in full display this last election. Remember what ads they ran in Tenn? We have a health care crisis in this country, 50 million don't have health insurance and can't see doctors if they are sick. Yet the repugs block any attempt of universal health care system. One that would make sure every person can see a doctor and btw would save everyone money. We spend more then any other country on healthcare and get worse results. That's because of republican greed. I could go on but most of the problems in this country are do to republicans.
Conservative slayer | 11.17.06 - 6:46 pm | #

This video is so funny I could not stop laughing here this little sissy wine and cry.

Booo hoo they will not let me in the library funny as hell
CB | 11.17.06 - 9:41 pm | #

Glad not to live in the USA.

What a joke of a free and democratic country!
FromOldEurope | 11.17.06 - 11:32 pm | #

Why dont you all get a life? He should go live in Iraq or Iran if he doesn't like it here. See how far that attitude gets him..Disrespectable!! Get out! What is wrong with this generation? No respect for authorities or others or who they endanger in the process. This should be a lesson that you have not lived life yet..this behaviour will take you nowhere!
American Society is losing its | Homepage | 11.18.06 - 12:00 am | #

here's to "al", the young lion who'd hunt me down if i'd done this to his boy. you're more a sheep than a lion Al,,baah baah baah.
you should have taught your boy manners or provided better psychiatric care or library etiquette??
burt | 11.18.06 - 12:22 am | #

Cops that do this stuff need to be punished within the full limit of the law. 9 out of 10 cops are good guys and I have a few friends that are cops. But even they say that guys like this need to get busted down because they give cops a bad name and make their jobs harder. The kid was already under control when they tased him repeatedly then tell him after he is down to get up or he will get tased again. The whole point of tasing someone is to put them down, not make them get up and walk around. They had a major brain fart. These cops are idiots and deserve to be fired and thrown in jail for a while to think about it and be made an example. End of story.
Anonymous | 11.18.06 - 5:06 am | #

Are these the taste of things to come?

Was this kid a hard core criminal and therefore he had this coming to him? I don't think so.

This is what I think. This kid was the right person to experiment with, because probably these cops never had the chance to use the Taser. It was a thrill for them, and later when they go to trial, they will claim they "were following orders". Remember Nueremberg?
garcia | 11.18.06 - 5:53 am | #

Call them up and demand to know why they did this and what they are doing to hold these officers accountable and demand that taser use be stopped. Deluge them with calls.

University of California, Los Angeles Police Department
Chief of Police 310 825-1633
Karl T. Ross
crazylikeafox | 11.18.06 - 10:59 am | #

Mostafa should have done what he was told to do when he was told to do it.

Fuck Mostafa Tabatabainejad, fuck him up his stupid ass.
Correct Liberal | 11.18.06 - 11:08 am | #

No one has ever confused me with a fan of cops. My personal disgust and mistrust of cops is why cop lovers at Panda's Thumb made me so revolted that I blew PT off last year. However, it is stupid - not naive, stupid- to think that pain is not, or should not be part of a cop's tool kit. What do you do when someone refuses to comply with the law? Should you just kill them right away? No. You use pain to force compliance, and if that fails you do actual damage up to and including death. That is the legal standard in the USA.

There have been a spate of recent campus rapes in the LA area, mainly at Cal State Long Beach, but there have been other attacks in the area. The UCLA cops (California State Marshals actually) are likely on a higher alert than ordinarily. It is the law that after 11 PM people in the library are required to show campus ID.

The student refused to show identification, and refused to leave the area. The cops over reacted, but I wasn't there- nor were any of you.
Gary Hurd | Homepage | 11.19.06 - 4:44 pm | #

I'm sorry... I thought that I just read that someone compared this whole taser thing to... NUREMBERG!?!?! Wow. My debate teacher always told me that the first person to equate someone to the nazi's loses... Well, guess what?

What a bunch of pansies we all are to even begin to think that it is correct and apt for us to compare our country to that of Nazi Germany. I swear to God, I hate hippies so damn much.
Dirk Praline Jr. | 11.21.06 - 3:26 pm | #

'"maybe it's time to move to Canada"

You would be welcome to move to Canada, but beware, our present gov't are a bunch of Bush bootlicks.
Dare | 11.23.06 - 12:07 pm | #

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