Well said, Dale (as always).
I'd like to note that there are people -- real, live, breathing people whom I've met -- that believe everything that fellow believes about Catholicism.
The difference is that those other folk believe it in all good faith and innocence. Conversations with them usually begin with something like a shared praise of the Lord, followed with tentative "but how can you believe Catholicism when Pius XII made his horse into a cardinal?"
It's the heart that makes the difference. Shea's interlocutor was relishing his "SAVED" fore-head stamp with a brilliant, bitter, and spite-filled malice that virtually guarantees his "appreciation" of Catholcism was tailor made to create a justification for his bile.
My experience (including being the Catholic president of a mostly Evangelical college fellowship) is entirely in harmony with yours, Dale.
The Catholic presence on these New World shores is not exactly new. It would be great if more Catholics and their pastors figured out that Evangelicalism is, more or less, the still-living part of Protestantism in this "Protestant country."
It is a universally acknowledged fact that the Evangelicals lead the field in pro-life apologetics. I learned everything I know from Scott Klusendorf. And their favorite sources are often the pre-Conciliar English Catholics. Scott loved to quote Chesterton. Having been in the pro-life movement for several years now, I can tell you that most of the prots I have met in the biz are far far better Catholics than most of those sharing a pew with me at the local suburban "faith community celebration." I'm not saying we don't have differences, but I'd rather talk religion with them than with any paid employee of the Canadian Catholic Church in any chancery office in the country.
My experience is personal. The Evangelicals I know well share much of the same beliefs as I, both religiously and politically. We have a difference of opinion on what "being saved" means. For the most part, they are very respectful of my faith, but on occasion there may be a snide/oblique remark regarding saints, Mary or the pope. I interpret this as frustration (or maybe just a bad day!) on their part, and I'd like more Catholics to think of this possibility first and NOT that they are just wanting to trash you. I do my best to be patient and not be reactionary and I explain the Church's position on these matters. When I don't know something, I am truthful and I say, "Thanks for bringing that up, I'm a little embarassed I don't have an answer, but I'll get back with you." They may believe me to be damned. This doesn't bother me and, in my opinion, it shouldn't get any other Catholic uptight -- we have the Assurance of the Faith! I know for certain they pray for me and I them. We all agree that our prayers are heard by the same Father. This is the very best I think we all can do. We are not the Holy Spirit.
And don't forget, I'm a shrill-shrieking Trad, the sworn enemy of "conservative" Catholicism. Makes you think hey?
Makes you think hey?
Hilary,
You're good at that. That's why we love you, shrieking Traddie that you are.
My experience from the Other Side is nearly the same -- back in my Evangelical, Chick-track-reading days, I thought one of the best arguments against Catholicism was that Catholics sure didn't seem to believe it ... but even then I'd've rather talked religion with a beliving Catholic (if only I could have found one!) than a libPiskie or "cultural catholic" any day.
peace,
Come on, Dale. What's the matter with a little ululating from time to time?
I think the aftermath of John Paul II's death proves your point nicely Dale, with the rational:nutjob ratio of evangelical responses about how you described it.
And let's not act like the nutjobs only reside on one bank of the Tiber, as described by Rich.
To which I reply, given that ours is still an overwhelmingly Protestant nation overwhelmingly populated by Protestant citizens (at least in mindset, if not practice):
According to the Pew Research Council amongst the varios branches of Christianity, Protestantism leads Catholicsism by 53-23 percent. I wouldn't call that overwhelming. Catholicism is still the largest individual denomination of Christianity in the US.
There are many more Protestants, but I wouldn't call it overwhelming.
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