Perhaps we shouldn't let Eliot Spitzer get away with being a hypocrite (which is how is strikes me, and which is how he always struck me), but do we let the media and our whole society get away with it?

Consider this, right now, the only people anywhere who are criticized publically for having extra marital affairs are members of the Clergy and politicians. Granted, neither of these groups should do this, but then, neither should anyone else.

Right now, one of the major networks puts on a show weekly in which a major female character is shown having a heart warming and charming extra marital affair. We can rest assured that a plot device is not going to be interjected in which she decides, in "Lipstick Jungle", that she's engaging in an immoral act, and causing another to engage in one as well.

I suppose this is a glass house argument, but if Eliot Spitzer is going to be criticized for disregarding his marriage vows (and he should be), then the critics will have to agree that marriage vows mean something, and that illicit sex is bad. Until they, perhaps they have no room to say anything.
Yeoman | 03.11.08 - 12:44 pm | #

To follow up, I can't help but be amused by Kimball's phrase "expensive taste in tarts." Hypocrisy aside, and immorality aside, eee gads, that's a pricey call! Spitzer, therefore, not only is a hypocrite, but one with a shockingly sense of bookkeeping.
Yeoman | 03.11.08 - 12:47 pm | #

I do regret that Dawn is not in the headline-writing business these days, the possibilities here seem endless.
Zorak the Mantis | 03.11.08 - 6:33 pm | #

The latest news is that Spitzer has been doing this for over five years. Maybe the so-called "women's groups" and "feminists" have been all over this -- if so, I haven't heard anything from them. Usually, they know how to be heard when they want to be, but I've heard nary a peep from them about this latest gross exploitation of women by a Democratic male politician. Come to think of it, I don't hear much from them about human trafficking.

The best comment I've seen is from Lisa Schiffren at NRO --

once you are talking about big time prostitution — and this service went as high as $5500 an hour — you can bet organized crime is involved. In general with prostitution, there is no way to ensure that at least some of the women aren't coerced at least some of the time. . . . Why do they have to be kidnapped, tricked and often drugged and beaten and kept against their will? Because very few women and girls really want to be prostitutes — with the violence and violation of self that prostitution involves. . . . There were some interesting stories out of Germany a year or two ago, noting that, since brothels were legal, young women without skills whose welfare benefits had run out, were being encouraged by their social workers to take jobs as prostitutes. In fact, they were being coerced, with the threat of cutting off any state support. Refusing to be a whore was (is?) being treated no differently than refusing to be a janitor or a maid or any other unsavory but honest labor.
Bender | Homepage | 03.11.08 - 11:43 pm | #

The item Bender notes about the German social workers is truly a horror. More and more we see that, as societies stray from their Christian roots, the governmental institutions originally created by those who, often unconsciously, were hoping to effect Christian charity through the government, work towards the opposite end.

On Spitzer, the more you learn about this story, the stranger and stranger it becomes. What on earth was he thinking?

I can't begin to think of a rationalization for his behavior. Was it the drug of power, in the old school monarchical sense, that the King can do no wrong? Or does he have some sort of odd sexual addiction?

So far, the best explanation I've seen is the one Dawn placed below. Evil corrupts, and you can't support evil without surrendering to it. There's no "cafeteria evil", if you will. So, just as supporting the Nazis for economic reasons in 1933 Germany leads to 1943 mass murder, it would seem supporting abortion leads to dabbling in human bondage. Or at least for Elliot it did.

Ick.
Yeoman | 03.12.08 - 10:23 am | #

Yeoman, I don't see how you can make that assumption. Even if your premise about no "cafeteria evil" is correct, that still doesn't automatically lead back to supporting abortion as the cause for him hiring a high-priced call girl (who, for all we know, might love her work). Maybe he's done tons of other evil things. Anyway, I think your argument is a stretch.

Bender, there's quite a bit of intelligent discussion going on in feminist circles about this. (I won't link because I know they're sites Dawn doesn't approve of.) If it's important enough to you, you should consider providing your viewpoint, since I'm guessing NR is not high on the list of sources they would regularly consult.
Terezia | 03.12.08 - 10:39 am | #

it would seem supporting abortion leads to dabbling in human bondage. Or at least for Elliot it did.>>>

I'd better get those women I have chained in the basement out of there now, if I go by Yeoman's 'logic.'
Neil C | 03.12.08 - 11:19 am | #

I meant Bender, sorry Yeoman!
Neil C | 03.12.08 - 11:20 am | #

Nope, it was Yeoman..Dawn, delete this and one line just before..thanks!
Neil C | 03.12.08 - 11:21 am | #

Terezia, my argument was a stretch. Or an illustrative exaggeration. I'd note, however, that that seems to be the basis of Dawn's prediction that something like this would occur.

Having admitted that it is a stretch, however, I will state again, once a person engages is serious sin, and excuses it, the door is open to all sorts of serious sin, and excusing that. If I can excuse abortion, why can't I excuse euthanasia? If can excuse those, why can't I excuse prostitution? And so on.

People can, and do, pick their vices selectively. But then, most people aren't at a vice buffet. If only cake is on the menu, you'll have cake. But if one of the choices is pie. . .

Same deal here. If I can kill some, why not more, or all? If aborting the results of regretted sex is okay, isn't the regrettable sex okay too? If it is, why not pay for it?
Yeoman | 03.12.08 - 11:32 am | #

Yeoman - that would be because there are coherent moral systems other than the Catholic one, and if one adheres to such a coherent moral system there are boundaries. Just because they aren't your boundaries doesn't mean they don't exist.
Tapetum | 03.12.08 - 11:47 am | #

How sad is this?? What a stunner.

I just feel sorry for everyone involved - from Spitzer on down (and I have never been a fan of Spitzer).
June | 03.12.08 - 11:49 am | #

Tapetum, there are other moral systems, to be sure. But there are also plenty of rationalizations disguised as moral systems. A person always need to be careful to distinguish between the two.

Likewise, there's always those who believe there's two systems. One for "them", and one for me. I sort of suspect that's what happened to Mr. Spitzer. It's often the case that those in power feel that they're a bit exempt for one reason or another. That's a disguised rationalization itself, but one of the oldest ones. The common man must do this, but as I'm uncommon I need not. . .
Yeoman | 03.12.08 - 12:11 pm | #

June, it is sad. And very strange as well. Sad for Spitzer, and sad too for his family. Even sad for the provider of the "services", so to speak, who is in a sad business indeed.
Yeoman | 03.12.08 - 12:12 pm | #

Until we stop electing college graduates, the situation cannot improve. Anybody that has attended college is suspect. The graduates are convicted, and should be treated like any other felon and denied the right to vote, if not the privilege of holding office as well.

This goes ten-fold for ivy league schools. Those kids already know everything by the age of 15, and only get together to join in conspiracy with one another against the local communities that gave life to them and nurtured them. They are set off on a course of endless wandering, no longer worthy to be trusted with a spouse and family, let alone a government.
Philip | 03.12.08 - 1:52 pm | #

Until we stop electing college graduates, the situation cannot improve.
Neil C | 03.12.08 - 1:58 pm | #

I meant to add, I guess our current president fill Philip's theory.
Neil C | 03.12.08 - 2:10 pm | #

Yeoman, I agree absolutely! It is sad all around - right down to the call girl(s).

Prayers needed all around.
June | 03.12.08 - 5:18 pm | #

Is it any surprise to anyone that "Kristen" was/is being grossly exploited, having come from a broken home and, despite her pimp charging $1,000 per hour, having trouble paying her rent --

Ms. Dupré said by telephone Tuesday night that she was worried about how she would pay her rent since the man she was living with “walked out on me” after she discovered he had fathered two children. She said she was considering working at a friend’s restaurant or, once her apartment lease expires, moving back with her family in New Jersey “to relax.” . . . She left “a broken family” at age 17, having been abused, according to the MySpace page, and has used drugs and “been broke and homeless.” “Learned what it was like to have everything and lose it, again and again,” she writes. “Learned what it was like to wake up one day and have the people you care about most gone.

Don't tell me that this is a victimless crime or is merely harmless sex between consenting adults.
Bender | Homepage | 03.12.08 - 9:27 pm | #

More and more we see that, as societies stray from their Christian roots....

What Christian roots?

I believe the commenter was speaking specifically of Germany, but plenty of perfectly decent countries don't have Christian roots -- and need them no more than the proverbial fish needs a bicycle.

Philip, you obviously have a keenly intuitive grasp of the Ivy League demographic.

Back to Spitzer -- what bothers me most about the whole thing can be summed up by the basic code of living even my five-year old understands: the guy made a poor choice.
L. | Homepage | 03.12.08 - 9:31 pm | #

More and more we see that, as societies stray from their Christian roots....

What Christian roots?>>

No Christian roots in my family and my parents and grandparents were upstanding citizens!
Neil C. | 03.12.08 - 9:38 pm | #

"But, my path has not been easy. When I was 17, I left home. It was my decision and I’ve never looked back. Left my hometown. Left a broken family. Left abuse. Left an older brother who had already split."

This is so classic for women who gravitate to the sex industry, even evidently the high priced end of it. Enjoying it?? More like, reliving abuse. Even if they say they are enjoying it, I'd guess that is because saying it's great is alot less humiliating than saying "this is all I'm worth." And even if a woman DID enjoy it, it still would be wrong, because to prostitute one's self does violence to human dignity, in this case, one's own. And as in this case, as in so many, this stuff does not respect marriage, wives, children, etc.

Of course there is a correlation between support for abortion and thinking there is nothing wrong with prostitution or the sex industry. They both do violence to women and they both turn a profit on women's emotional or financial desperation. They are also industries that no one would want to see take advantage or his or her own daughter.
Joanne | 03.12.08 - 10:37 pm | #

Neil C,

That old drunkard? Oh, I thought he had repented of that long ago. He's almost clean now; it would have been better had he, like the old master, made a clean break of it on leaving in the first place.

L.,

all demographics are intuitive for those of us who lack godlike powers.
Philip | 03.12.08 - 11:19 pm | #

They are also industries that no one would want to see take advantage or his or her own daughter.

Well, sure -- no parent wants to see anyone "take advantage" of their child. And such industries, as they now exist, are often underground, and even the legal fringes are populated with shady characters and organized crime. So it seems like a no-brainer that it wouldn't be the parental profession of choice, no matter how libertine the parents!
L. | Homepage | 03.13.08 - 12:17 am | #

It's often the case that those in power feel that they're a bit exempt for one reason or another. That's a disguised rationalization itself, but one of the oldest ones. The common man must do this, but as I'm uncommon I need not...

Bingo. I think you've hit the nail on the head squarely there, Yeoman.
Anonymous | 03.13.08 - 10:26 am | #

Oops, that last comment to Yeoman was from me.
Terezia | 03.13.08 - 10:26 am | #

Hi Dawn,

Here is a really depressing piece from a former booking agent for an escort service. What a sad, cynical existence these people (the hookers, johns, booking agents, etc.) inhabit. Here's one telling excerpt (emphasis mine):

One high-powered New York attorney explained it to me like this: “Of course I love my wife. Escorts have nothing to do with that. She comes to my hotel room and I don’t have to know her name, because they all use fake names like Amber and Kimberly. I don’t have to worry about how she feels or what she wants. It’s a simple exchange: I give her a thousand bucks, we have a good time for a couple of hours, she goes away and we never have to see each other again.”

Then they got addicted to the money and the lifestyle. And then one day, usually between the ages of 25 and 28, once they’d developed that knowing, experienced look that clients instinctively disliked, they found that themselves in a classic bind: they were addicted to high living but could no longer pay for it; they had no marketable skills; and years of late nights and lazy days had left them with no self-discipline. What to do? The really smart ones pulled themselves together and, with the help of a sympathetic client, started some kind of a business. Others married rich, cynical, older men in a sort of paid-wife arrangement. Those were the most common stories. I did not inquire into the fate of the girls who sort of faded away. I did not want to hear about their loneliness and poverty.

Others married rich, cynical, older men in a sort of paid-wife arrangement.

What a world, indeed. I know a number of women who ended up in arrangments such as the ones described above, who are not technically prostitutes.
L. | Homepage | 03.13.08 - 3:46 pm | #

"they had no marketable skills;"

This is a major factor that keeps women from leaving sex-related work. The "addiction" to high living or supposed lack of self-discipline I'm not sure about. That can't apply to ALL of the women who work in the sex industry, but obviously prostitution, porn, stripping, etc don't help a woman build a resume that is going to be attractive to prospective legitimate employers.

You bring up something else interesting too, Susan, namely that the sex industry is one of the few industries where women tend to be paid, after a certain point, inversely to experience!
Joanne | 03.13.08 - 9:57 pm | #

"You bring up something else interesting too, Susan, namely that the sex industry is one of the few industries where women tend to be paid, after a certain point, inversely to experience!"

That general truth probably also explains why Diablo Cody - former stripper and Oscar-winning writer of Juno attracts so much petty envy!
Her success is not meant to be the wages of sin!
Jody Tresidder | 03.14.08 - 10:25 am | #

I don't know anyone who's envious of Diablo Cody, but I guess to be honest (and hopefully without sounding too harsh), I also don't think I know many people who would call her life so far a great success.
Joanne | 03.14.08 - 9:26 pm | #