Please stay on topic. Please don't be asses.
If guns are outlawed, only
policemen will have guns.
Think about it.
If some officer pulled that crap on me I would make it my life's mission to make their's a living hell. No shit.
I could hardly wait to get to the bottom of the article to thank you for posting this summary of where this country is heading . . . in order to protect "those in control" and all who they can convince to acquiesce.
The old bumper sticker: "Question Authority".
I have nothing to add; merely outrage to vent.
We should remember that many members of that reserve MP unit at Abu Gharib, including BG Karpinski were law enforcement or corrections officers in civilian life.
What's that old saying again? Let me give it a moment. Oh, yeah. Something about "Power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely".
In the first video you showed, did you watch all four of the clips on that page? The one where he actually tazers her is not the beginning of the incident, the page just defaults to a clip starting right before he zaps her, probably to make it look worse than it really was.
In the previous clip, after he first pulled her over, she was very combative and uncooperative. I think the cop had ample reason to expect her to be less than cooperative if he tried to arrest her. She was driving a busted up car with an expired license, hence the need for an arrest. So what were his options?
She wouldn't get out of the car when asked, or even when threatened with a tazer. His options were to grab her and pull her out of the vehicle, or tazer her. I think you can make a pretty good argument that physically pulling her out of the car could potentially result in far greater injuries than a tazer would be expected to.
Trying to restrain someone who does not want to be restrained is very difficult. You need four people to do it without hurting a person, one for each limb. And even then someone's likely to get hurt. This cop was just doing his job, and he shouldn't feel obligated to even get kicked in the shin, much less have his eyes scratched at or something, just because this woman felt like she deserved to be allowed to break the law.
Shawn,
He tazed her within less than 40 seconds of coming up to the window. That's not reasonable.
shawn, are you for real? it is obvious that the officer was not in danger and neither was the public. simply a dickhead who was so insecure about having his authority "questioned" that he had to taser a woman.
I've seen the video of the woman getting tasered, and I have to say she was at fault. When a police offier gives you an order, you damn well better follow it if you don't want to get hurt. That means you put the bloody phone down, show them your hands and get out of the car when ordered to do so.
Had the woman simply done as told, without hesitation and without getting combative, she would not have been tasered. Sure, it was painful, but that was pain she could have spared herself if she had used common sense.
How long would you give her Digby? 1 minute, 2 minutes, 5 minutes? I don't know enough about the case, but 40 seconds is plenty of time to put a phone down and get out of a stopped vehicle.
About 40 seconds to eat a donut???
saw the movie "crash" last night and the odd thing to me was how desensitized the audience was to scenes of police brutality. we've seen it so many times before that even this sort of thing hardly stirs up any outrage.
"40 seconds is plenty of time"
In a non threatening situation, with the door open, and both hands visible and without apparent threat? Womam was not combative. Taser was use offensively to force compliance. If that's following procedure, remind me not to live in that jurisdiction.
You give it long enough that you feel sure that you are in danger. The authorities are simply not allowed to use pain to get people to cooperate. That's against the law. They can only use it in self defense. It is their job to cool the situation not escalate it, as the cop in that video did.
If he had thought she was going to hurt him or someone else he had a right to defend himself. Otherwise he should have done what cops have been doing forever --- calming the situation. Tasers are making it far too easy for cops to forget that essential part of the job and they use it to control people rather than protect themselves. There is a distinction. One is legal and constitutional, one isn't.
Dealing with police is emotional and nerve racking for many people. Sometimes they lose their heads. It is the job of the authorities to rise above that, assess the situation and use force only when necessary to prevent injury or death. That's their job. Or it used to be.
I've been pulled over and cited for speeding twice in the last three years. Once in the midwest and once in the Northeast. On both occasions I was going less than 10 mph over the posted speed limit and was ALMOST within sight of a sign showing a speed limit 5 mph higher than the zone I was clocked in. On one of these occasions the cop was situated at the bottom of a steep hill. OBVIOUS speed trap arrangements.
Nonetheless, on both occasions I pulled over immediately after the cop put on his lights. On both occasions I was respectful, did not argue, kept both hands within sight of the officer at all times and produced all requested information in a timely manner. On both occasions the officer was intensely verbally combative, physically aggressive and I was treated with contempt and at every opportunity.
I respect the fact that traffic stops can be one of the most dangerous things a cop does, but I think it says a lot that on two separate occasions in two distinct geographic locales I was treated like shit for a VERY MINOR ROUTINE INFRACTION even as I was being respectful, compliant and contrite in EVERY regard.
I know that I am occasionally an asshole to people in situations that are far less fraught with danger than pulling someone over and issuing them an expensive fine. But I like to think that if it was my job to do such things and that I'd received hours and hours of training on how to do such things and I encountered someone as contrite and compliant as myself, that I would be businesslike and professional at the very least.
On both occasions I came away thinking that it's no wonder people hate cops. The only thing missing from my experiences was being required to yell "THANK YOU SIR, MAY I HAVE ANOTHER?" I suppose I should be thankful I wasn't tasered.
Ok, I'll preface this by saying that there are many incidents of police brutality, and I believe that many police officers are corrupt enough to do what you said...
However, the "40 second" issue is a bit misleading as the whole stop had been going on for several minutes with her being very combative and refusing to comply to anything that the officer was asking her to do.
That being said, it is a little difficult to know if she was posing a threat, though I'd doubt it. If she was posing a threat (ie, she had a weapon), I kinda doubt it from the body language of the officers. Tazing her seems excessive. Again, it is hard to tell because we can't really see the woman while she is in the car.
But, it is so very immoral for the officer to taze her again. She was on the ground unable to move, and he tazed her for another five seconds.
The use of force in the first place is hard to judge, but the second use is absolutly hideous.
saw the movie "crash" last night and the odd thing to me was how desensitized the audience was to scenes of police brutality.
There isn't any actual brutality in that movie, is there? Just abuse of power and sexual manhandling.
Geez, I'd have just tasered the goddamn cell phone.
One issue for a legitimate political party (which will probably
end up not being the democrats)
would be a careful study of police
procedure as taught at police
academies and in police departments.
If this behavior is carefully taught,
(as I suspect it is), then a program
of systematic disinfection of
police departments and police
academies would be in order.
What's the big deal ? Hell , we been in a police state since the patriot act pased . The day after it passed the Calif. Highway Patrol were pulling over people and searching their vehicles , for " being in a know pot producing area " . No other reason given and multiple arrests made . POLICE STATE folks , get used to it , it's here NOW .
w3ski
How can anybody defend this kind of routine police brutality -- and BRUTALITY is what it is in too many cases, not defense or "necessary" force. It's out and out thug-brutal behavior, unnecessary and counter-productive in the long run.
Police almost always have non-lethal, non-brutal alternatives when faced with obstreperous, lippy, or non-compliant individuals. They don't have to hit. They don't have to shock. They don't have to shoot. And not so long ago police were routinely trained on how to gain compliance without physical force. It is a technique, it takes some time, and it takes skill and patience, but it works.
To bad some Americans think that it's more important to comply with authority than to live in dignity and freedom.
No wonder it's been so easy for the fascists to take over.
That really got to me because she made the same sounds I did when I was in the worst pain I'd ever experienced. The EMTs pissed me off because they asked me questions in the ambulance and when I didn't immediately answer in the same time frame someone NOT in severe pain would have, they snapped at me like I was some drug addict. At least they didn't zap me.
The attitude is the same though. What is it? Impatience? Stereotyping? What?
"Until they get pulled over by a cop in bad mood who goes from 0 to 60 in 30 seconds and determines for whatever reason that you must be physically subdued."
This struck me. I'm reading Bill Kristol's famous 1993 memo which says the Republicans can kill Clintoncare with impunity because 80 percent of people claim to be happy with their health care coverage. The wife, brilliant as ever, points out that this is probably the same 80 percent of people who have never become particularly sick.
"No wonder it's been so easy for the fascists to take over."
And they have. It's that simple.
"POLICE STATE folks , get used to it , it's here NOW ."
Yes.
saw the movie "crash" last night and the odd thing to me was how desensitized the audience was to scenes of police brutality
I saw the movie the other night also. I sure couldn't tell how desensitized the audience was. How the hell could you?
It's stupid not to just go along with a police officer's routine when you're pulled over. I've got a problem with authority too and with the police mentality, but whether you like it or not, they are the authority in such situations, so the best thing is to just play it cool.
Obviously, this woman has some serious attitude problems that may have been due to any number of things. Her incessant whining and wailing after the tase indicated to me some serious mental or character disorders.
I don't think it's all that helpful or instructive to generalize or extrapolate from this incident as to the degree to which this is or is not a police state.
Should innocent, law abiding citizens be treated such a manner? No. Should really stupid people with serious attitude problems be? Probably.
"Men are not governed by justice, but by law or persuasion. When they refuse to be governed by law or persuasion, they have to be governed by force or fraud, or both." "George Bernard Shaw"
Anyone notice the runing time of the tape. Thirty five seconds seems like such a short time to decide to draw a weapon, any weapon, and harm another human. Especially in light of the potential charges.
I come from a family of police, and I've got real issues with the folks defending this sort of behavior among law enforcement officials.
Argumentative or no, she was clearly no threat. Just a bitch. She deserved some form of reprimand for disregarding the policeman's orders, but where I come from a verbal warning would be the rule. Phsyical harm of any sort is-or rather, SHOULD BE-out of the question.
Please, to the defenders of that poor cop who was forced to tase that hideous girl who was poised to viciously attack with her mighty cell phone, think about how you might feel having such a thing done you for no other reason than you had a bad day and didn't give said cop the respect he felt due.
It is interesting that resorting to violence is such an acceptable way to solve problems like the one shown in the video. It is interesting how often the presence of police intensifies rather than defuses a situation. It is interesting how often a black cop is put forward to justify brutality by white cops against black suspects. It is interesting how many of the cops I have known cite the authority of being able to carry a gun and a badge as the primary motivation for choosing their career – as opposed to the “serve and protect” mandate offered in mixed company.
For a couple of years I worked restoring the Rutherford B. H. Yates house in Houston as it was being turned into a museum. It was the first black printing shop in that city and part of a federally preserved historic district called Freedman’s Town, so named because it was founded by freed slaves. However, Freedman’s Town occupied prime real estate in the shadow of Houston’s downtown skyscrapers. The shit that the police did to the people of that neighborhood, so that the ward could be cleared for “urban renewal” and under the protection of euphemisms like “city under siege” and “zero tolerance” policies, I would never have believed had I not seen it with my own eyes. This level of violence by police toward blacks is far from out of the ordinary, although usually invisible to a great many Americans. Did you all notice the woman in red in the video entitled “The Traffic Stop”? What do you make of her behavior?
Digby writes: “Evidently, because the officers had been tased in their training they believe that it isn't "that bad."”
I suspect that this sort of attitude and subjectivity is what you might expect, and that can lead to torture, when what constitutes “severe physical or mental pain” gets ramped up under the policies and authority of the Administration. Rumsfeld said it best in his hand-written note on General Counsel Haynes’ “Counter-Resistance Techniques” memo: “However, I stand for 8-10 hours a day. Why is standing limited to 4 hours?”
Perhaps the adage that is applied to soldiers can be applied to cops as well: “There are no bad soldiers, only bad officers” (Napoleon); or the Chinese proverb version, “Under a good general, there are no bad soldiers.”
“Ah, calling it your job don’t make it right.”
“Them poor bosses need all the help they can get.”
– Cool Hand Luke
Digby, I hate to be picking a nit, but it does occur about 3 min into the situation, not 40 sec. as the 3rd clip implies.
That said, it's difficult to pick a side here because her actions are pretty inexcusable. Unfortunately her only real threat comes in being a loudmouth, Grade-A bitch. The officer probably felt at least a little threatened by her relentlessly ignorant attitude (but if you watch Cops that's nothing new) and was left a little on edge when she opened her door upon pulling over. But she was unarmed, and as you pointed out, the officer made absolutely no attempts to calm the situation. The Taser seemed to be used in place of anything else he may have learned in police training. So while the knee-jerker in me feels she got what she deserved, I feel the police-state comparison rings true. And, to a degree, it's the questionable aspects of cases such as this that will allow steps taken toward a police state to go unchecked, so the rest of your post is spot-on.
I can't view the video now, but I can tell you that, where I live, a man died because he was tasered while at the police station.
It might even appear that tasering at the police station had been SOP...or maybe not.
But the reason I say that is because I know a guy who got pulled over for speeding (40 in a 30 mph zone at two in the morning.)
This is a guy who looks like a middle-aged average joe, no tattoos or long hair or any other thing. He's also not physically imposing. He's probably no taller than 5'5".
He refused to take a breathalizer test, so he was taken to the police station. He had contraband herb in his pocket, which he put into his mouth (imo, that herb should not be illegal anyway, which plays into my view of this event, too.)
anyway, the police tried to open his mouth, but he wouldn't cooperate. The guy, remember, is at the police station, with no one but officiers around. So, they jerked his arms back (damaging ligaments that required medical attention) and threw him face down on the floor.
Then they tasered him three times. Unlike the claims, tasers do leave marks. He had three "burn" marks from the tasers that a friend photographed for him.
The taser made him shit his pants.
The police officers put him in a cell and did not let him have a change of clothing, and made fun of him for shitting his pants.
This was all, please remember, over a speeding ticket on a nearly deserted street, one of those where you routinely go 40 in a 30mph zone.
and because he refused a breathalizer.
They basically made a deal that they would ignore the herb if he would ignore what they did to him.
He was charged with resisting arrest.
Sure, he broke the law. But doesn't this seem a bit excessive?
This happened before the other guy died. When the "authorities" were investigating that case, this guy did not come forward because he was afraid he would face worse charges.
Picture your Mom in there, a little addled maybe, and then you'll get it.
If she (or anyone else like her) hadn't been doing something wrong, she would not have been tasered. That is all. Return to your homes.
The taser is typically used in a NON-life threatening situation. The term is "resistance without action" -- in other words, the victim had the temerity to hesitate or to ask a question.
Cops are trained to respond with a higher level of force in each encounter. Were the cops truly in fear of physical contact with the victim, the taser would NOT have been used.
Tasers are arbitrary and discretionary, mostly used by sadistic bastards with badges and guns who get a kick out of making people writhe on the ground in pain. Kind of like that choke-hold that killed, another favorite of cops.
Isn't it about time we blew off this deification of cops?
So cops are tasered as part of their training?
Anyone know how to train a torturer? Check your psychology books. Step 1: torture them.
Police work isn't even in the top 10 most dangerous jobs:
http://jobsearch.about.com/gi/dy...sjobs/
index.htm
...The number of people who died at work in 2000 is 5,915. This includes people who died of a heart attack while sitting at their desks, as well as those who died in the course of specific duties, such as a cop gunned down by a bank robber. But while police and firefighter deaths make the news, neither job is among the most fatal, the Bureau of Labor Statistics (BLS) reports--at least not in a normal year.
America's Most Dangerous Jobs
Job Number Of Fatalities Fatality Rate*
Timber Cutters 105 122.1
Fishermen 52 108.3
Pilots 230 100.8
Structural Metal Workers 47 59.5
Extractive Occupations 69 53.9
Roofers 65 30.2
Construction Workers 288 28.3
Truck Drivers 852 27.6
All Occupations 5,915 4.3
All data for calendar year 2000. *Deaths per 100,000 employed. Sources: Bureau of Labor Statistics, U.S. Dept. of Labor
I really don't get how people are having trouble understanding this.
Being mouthy is not grounds for assault by electric shock.
It's really that simple.
"The bitch was asking for it" is not an excuse.
here is what I found most interesting.... the woman apparently knew exactly what a Taser was, yet refused to get out of the car when the officer warned her that he would Tase her.
The woman was acting in a manner I would consider irrational/confrontational --- she had obviously been speeding (and what kind of idiot passes a cop car on the right!?!?!) then denied it when confronted with the facts and was extremely belligerent. This to me is sufficient to cause the officer to be concerned for his safety, and when one views the whole video (including the part preceding the "linked" part, when the officer is very calm in the face of this woman's belligerance) the sequence of events does justify (at least to the extent that he should not be disciplined) his initial use of force.
The second Tasing is a different matter entirely, and reflects an extraordiarily bad level of Taser training or discipline. In this instance, one cannot judge the officer's actions unless one knows for a fact that he was trained in the effects of Tasers, and ignored that knowledge.
Folks, this is what the second amendment is for.
Torture. Justice denied in trial.
Pick up a fucking gun and take care of it yourself. You are not a slave.
.
I realize that police officers face a lot of danger. And this woman was driving with a suspended license. (They didn't know this when they jolted her, however.)
Digby, do you know this for a fact? because we know that the officer had taken her license and registration back to the police car --- at that point the video is cut, and the next segment has the officer returning to the woman's car to order her out. He had NOT told her to get out of the car the first time he spoke to her, and in fact made her close the car door.
This strongly suggests that during the "cut" the officer checked her license, and found out it was suspended, and that the woman should be arrested. There is simply no other explanation for his ordering her out of the car --- this was a simple traffic stop that would have ordinarily resulted in a ticket and the woman being allowed to drive away. (I was stopped in Boynton Beach once --although it was decades ago -- for a moving violation, and was given a ticket without being told to get out of the car.)
I'm kind of surprised that officers are routinely issued Tasers. There was a case in the NYPD a couple of years ago involving an emotionally disturbed man who was shot by police after he began to swing a hammer at them and pepper spray failed to stop him. One of the big questions was, well, why didn't you Taser him? The answer was that only the sergeant was issued a Taser and that it was left in the car (there was very little time to get it). They just don't carry them around.
I recently had occasion to get shocked by household current (I was installing lighting in an old house and couldn't figure out which was the live wire). I just brushed the wire, but my god. After I was finished with the lighting, I crawled into bed and stayed there all day. Can't imagine 50K volts.
And don't forget the old cowboy who refused to give the cop (pig) his driver's license (he was just standing by the road, not driving). He had done nothing and was not a suspect and no crime had been committed. The S.Ct. said it was fine to hog tie the guy and haul him off to jail for dareing not to respond to the cop who asked for his license.
Bastion of freedom? Pathetic joke is more like it. Ken Lay will never feel the sting of a tasrer.
There is NO LEGAL OBLIGATION to be respectful to cops.
Sorry, but being bitchy isn't a threat. Being mouthy isn't a threat. Saying "I'm going to kill you" or "Come over here and I'll kick your ass"? THAT'S a threat. Being disrespectful is not.
Yeah, the police officers' jobs are dangerous. They chose those dangerous jobs, knowing that their first and foremost obligation was to protect the rights of American citizens, not to protect their own safety or their own egos. If they don't like it, they should quit.
This is America. We shouldn't have to bow and scrape to people with badges.
Tasers are lethal.
Did thw woman stop her car from running? A cop here tried to grab the keys out of ignition for a kid out goofing up. The kid took off with him halfway in the car, it drug him a while and nearly ran over him.
So he is on procedure for that, unless she is alreasy out of the car.
Does she have priors to justify more force?
Bad registration and tags is usually saved for people running junk , but since he already checked her ID this would not be justified. It wasn't a potential carjack getaway scenario.
Sad indeed. That it has gotten to the point you have to act certain way or face tasers. So much for due process , or even for the first amendment.
Anyways the cop that that faced a situation like that here ended up working for halliburton in the former republics, Kosovo-Bosnia needs mercenary cops.
He made as much there in three months as most cops can claim in over a year.
Perhaps if we paid cops more their job performance could increase. They spend a ton of money training them already. When you have suitable backup on payroll to control a situation this happens less as well.
Really the victim seems like a less stable psych profile, the chances of her being armed or a threat outside the car are not great.
Let her taser the cop a couple of times and call it even. Hell she will probably trade that priviliege for a script of valiums.
This was a catch 22, damned if you do or don't. It all depends on priors and whether she was out of the car. The edit probably dealt with her being told to get in or out of the car, force outside is justified if she isn't ordered out.
I've seen the video of the woman getting tasered, and I have to say she was at fault. When a police offier gives you an order, you damn well better follow it if you don't want to get hurt. That means you put the bloody phone down, show them your hands and get out of the car when ordered to do so.
Had the woman simply done as told, without hesitation and without getting combative, she would not have been tasered. Sure, it was painful, but that was pain she could have spared herself if she had used common sense.
Xeno | 06.05.05 - 10:50 pm | #
How long would you give her Digby? 1 minute, 2 minutes, 5 minutes? I don't know enough about the case, but 40 seconds is plenty of time to put a phone down and get out of a stopped vehicle.
Double B | 06.05.05 - 11:09 pm | #
Wow. You guys are breeding yourselves some good Good Germans over there.
"it's her own fault that the policeman tortured her, she shouldn't have been rude to him."
This was a catch 22, damned if you do or don't. It all depends on priors and whether she was out of the car. The edit probably dealt with her being told to get in or out of the car, force outside is justified if she isn't ordered out.
she was speeding (in a car with a broken windshield and a broken brake light) --- and her license had been suspended. If you watch the ENTIRE video sequence (not just the one that Digby linked to) it appears that the reason the cop asked her to get out of the car was in order to arrest her for driving with a suspended license. She had been extremely belligerant (and the cop remarkably tolerant) the first time he went to the car (to get her license and registration).
So here we have a case of an extremely belligerant woman, with a suspended drivers license, driving dangerously (51 in a 35mph zone...). And a cop with a job to do....prevent this woman --- with a record of (apparent) repeated moving violations --- from continuing to drive illegally and irresponsibly by arresting her. And the woman IGNORES his repeated demands to put down her cell phone and get out of the car so that he can arrest her.
What are the cops choices when confronted with a belligerant person caught in a criminal act?
Sorry, but being bitchy isn't a threat. Being mouthy isn't a threat. Saying "I'm going to kill you" or "Come over here and I'll kick your ass"? THAT'S a threat. Being disrespectful is not.
the woman was resisting arrest. She knew she had a suspended license.
Yeah, the police officers' jobs are dangerous. They chose those dangerous jobs, knowing that their first and foremost obligation was to protect the rights of American citizens, not to protect their own safety or their own egos. If they don't like it, they should quit.
the cops job also includes my right to walk and drive on public thoroughfares without being killed by idiots like this woman. She was speeding --- and she was driving illegally because he license had been suspended. That cop had the responsibility to PROTECT everyone else in Boynton Beach from this woman....
From today's Sacramento Bee is an indication that use of Taser's is not harmless.
Man shot by police with stun gun dies
The death is the fourth in less than two years involving capital law enforcement officers and Tasers.
I don't doubt that there are some circumstances under which cops should use a Taser, just as there are some times when use of a service revolver is called for. But Tasers are not harmless and their use shouldn't be taken lightly.
Thank god those officers had those taser guns. What ever would they have done in the face of that "belligerant" woman? And we can officially dismantle the part of the justice system that includes judges and prosecutors and presumption of innocence--the officers can just punish any of us on the spot who they determine are breaking the law or their orders, any way they choose. It would surely cost less tax dollars.
The Supreme Court has found that unless someone is told that they are under arrest and have been/are being read their rights, they are free to go. Maybe someone should tell the police officers. IIRC, they didn't tell her that whe was being put under arrest until after she asked, AFTER both taserings. Nice. What rule of law? We don need no steenkin laws.
Several commenters here have explained that it's important not to wait five minutes when you're arresting someone. Others have explained that you have to taser someone to stop them killing pedestrians. These people are what is known as liars. You have, right here in the comments section, the New Fascist American thinking in all its shame and squalor.
Folks, if the cop had waited an hour before arresting her, no harm would have been done to pedestrian or policeman. Let alone five minutes. She wasn't going anywhere. The worst that would happen is the judge would throw the book at her (quite rightly) for wasting police time.
We, and our law enforcement officials, put up with the delay and annoyance of this kind of citizen assholery routinely in civilised countries: you could too, it'd be quite painless. Why you need to vicariously beat, pepper-spray, or electrocute your fellows for not being submissive enough to authority, I don't know, but I know that as individuals, each one of you is sick. Get professional help... please.
To second derek, I have to say I was unaware of the strong feelings many commenters apparently have about strict enforcement of speeding violations.
Right. Abolish stun guns. Hit 'em with the real thing and none of these arguments will come up.
I find the officer's decision to taser the woman completely indefensible. I say this as someone who has never had anything other than cordial and helpful interactions with police, even when I was on the wrong side of things.
I don't know what the exact penalties are for speeding and driving with a suspended license in the state of Florida but I'm pretty sure they don't include a gratuitous double-tasering. Yes, the woman was rude and non-compliant. However, she was not violent and gave no reason for the officer to use the amount of force a taser represents.
Those of you who have defended the officer's actions, did you actually watch the whole video? A few seconds after she was tasered, while she is prone on the pavement writhing in pain, the officer shocked her again because she didn't roll over when he told her to. Then, at the end of the video, the officer starts talking about how the woman shouldn't have 'taken a swing' at him or 'started a fight'? Did you see a fight? I didn't. Way to play for the cameras Officer McNevin!
A second question for those who saw nothing wrong with this: How much force are police justified in using against people who non-violently resist arrest? I'll give you my answer: close to none. When police choose to inflict pain on non-violent people it's an abuse of power and, yes, torture.
To second derek, I have to say I was unaware of the strong feelings many commenters apparently have about strict enforcement of speeding violations.
this wasn't about enforcement of a speeding violation, but of enforcement of the laws concerning suspended drivers licenses. The officer was extremely respectful of this woman until it was determined that she was subject to arrest --- which is where the video linked by Digby starts (but that segment of the video leaves out the first interaction between the officer and the woman.)
The woman's actions, and record, were sufficient to signal to the officer that she represented a possible threat to himself and/or a flight risk --- and a high-speed chase through a residential neighborhood.
Let's clear up a few things:
- The "4 minutes" is irrelevant to the issue at hand (and not unsual for a traffic stop). The woman was not asked to exit the vehicle until the officer discovered her license was suspended; she was tasered 36 seconds later.
- The woman was not talking on the phone about her plans for Friday night. She had called a friend because she didn't trust the police. We don't know the backstory there.
- The woman was being an asshole. But the officers's sarcastic and abrasive attitude certainly didn't help diffuse the situation. I can sympathize, but that's simply unprofessional. It raises the question of whether his motives were personal.
- It's obvious from the clip that the officers do not believe a taser causes significant pain and that she was being "melodramatic." That's a indication that they took the decision to deploy the taser lightly. That's frightening (see Abu Gharib, "fraternity pranks").
- The woman obviously has a warped sense of entitlement when it comes to speeding. But her disrespect for the police is obviously due in part to her experience as a black person. We as a society have a gigantic problem that we still refuse to face.
Had she been a cute, white suburban housewife, I doubt this incident would have occured. If it had, I can guarantee we'd be seeing this in nonstop loops on CNN, not just the local newspaper.
All of you sick little nazi police state enthusists who support this sadistic police officer will be tickled to know this case is not at all an isolated incident:
http://whatsinalunchbox.blogspot...r-
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Rule number one.
Get out of the car before you "Question Authority."
[Amnesty International] -The use of electro-shock weapons in such circumstances appear to breach international standards set out under the UN Code of Conduct for Law Enforcement Officials and the Basic Principles on the Use of Force and Firearms. These require that force should be used only as a last resort, in proportion to the threat posed…the US has [also] ratified the UN Convention against Torture and the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights (ICCPR), both of which prohibit torture and other cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment. The UN Human Rights Committee…states that “the aim of the provisions of ICCPR is to protect both the dignity and the physical and mental integrity of the individual…[this] relates not only to acts that cause physical pain, but also to acts that cause mental suffering to the victim.
what I take away from this video is to never open my window more than necessary to hand out my license or talk.
Then close it.
Lock doors before officer approaches car.
Wow. Made my white skin crawl. I think the woman was wise to at least get a witness on her cell phone. And cell phones have recording capability?
Since when does a traffic stop mean a nonconsensual S&M experience?
That's "any cell phones have recording capability?" Previewing is good. So, do it, self.
I was recently pulled over by the local pd. When I didn't respond fast enough, the cop opened the door & hauled me out of the car. When I didn't immediatley pull my hands out of my pockets (the cop already had me wrapped up & my hands were trapped), the cop bounced my head off the hood of my car a few times. When he pulled me up, I was bleeding from a couple of cuts above my eye. When the cop saw the blood running down my face he swore a blue streak, because now he had to arrest me. He didn't want to be bothered. He was just pissed I didn't comply fast enough.
As I've said many times before, the only difference between the cops & the gangs is the color of the badge.
BTW: A passenger in the car had a crack pipe. They let that person walk away from the scene. They arrested me for possesion. They let me go the next afternoon. No charges filed, no court.
After listening to her, I was running out of patience myself. By the time he hit her with that mild zapper, I would already have shocked her 4 or 5 times. Just how much crap is the guy supposed to put up with? Once he said "You are under arrest" she should have complied. If she wanted to contest it in court, she could have. 'Nuff said, and I will send my City Council a letter urging that the police buy tasers.
Wow. Dave, I am glad that you are a free spirit. That being said, should you and your crack pipe buddies wander into my neighborhood, I hope the police knock you senseless. I worked 30 years to get my wife and children out of the inner city. Idiots like you only encourage people to go back to living on total government dependence when their world finally collapes in drug abuse and prison.
Gretchen, I find it funny that libs constantly call people nazis for making arrests of libs, but that they don't see anything wrong with arresting people for being anti-government when a leftist is in power. They also see nothing wrong with there being speech and thought police when someone says something politically incorrect. Then again, the nazis were socialists, were they not? They are still with us, only now they use attorneys instead of guns. Thank G-d that I am old enough to be dead when the socialists finally take over here...the only place it has not failed as a system of governence yet...but of course, our own leftists will do it so much better. All they need is just a little bit larger 'voluntary contribution'from each of you...And you think the officer is bad!
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