perhaps you should consider a new name change - like "Stretch"
1. Nash - agree
2. Kidd - agree
3. Wade - not a PG, but ok
4. Paul - maybe in a year
5. Parker - agree
6. Bibby - nope (see Kings)
7. Hinrich - nope (see Bulls)
8. Shaq - agree
9. Duncan - agree
10. Garnett - agree
11. Amare - agree
12. Wallace - equal impact of Pierce
13. Brand - equal impact of Pierce
14. O’Neal - equal impact of Pierce
15. Bosh - nope (see Raps)
16. Miller - nope (see Kings)
17. Lebron - agree
18. Iverson - equal impact of Pierce
19. Dirk - equal impact of Pierce
20. Artest - come on now
so we agree on 8
Bottom line, Paul Pierce is a top 10 player in this league - like it or not.
I don't really have a dog in this fight, but I think Jeff is seriously undervaluing Iverson and Nowitski, these guys are unquestionably better players than Pierce and definitely more impact types. PO on the other hand I think overvalues Hinrich (who I completely love, and would trade Pierce for, but is admittedly not a true impact player) Bosh, and Miller. Also, there is no question that in terms of on the court ability, Artest is much better than Pierce, it's the question of "Does he make yr team better" with the off the court stuff that would give me pause.
I think the more important question is, "can we trade Pierce now for players and/or flexibility that will put us in a better position in 2 years then we would by simply hanging on to Pierce." IMHO, there are several trades that could accomplish this, but it's going to be a huge PR hit and a big demand on the fan base. Personally, I STRONGLY believe if we can move Pierce for Heinrich or Deng and the Knicks pick, we would be in much better position for the future than by simply hanging on to Pierce. The ugly truth is, we have a derth of talent everywhere except for the 2/3, and that is the position easiest to replace. I like Pierce, but I would strongly disagree that he's a top 10 talent (simply take those 8 you both agree on and add Kobe and McGrady to start the process of dismissing that) and he's hardly irreplaceable. Give this team an all star PG, develop Jefferson and replace Pierce with a Larry Hughes caliber talent, and we're in much better shape.
PS - Jeff, do you read the Whizznut? I noticed he isn't on your links, but as a Wash DC guy, you'd probably find him funny.
I think AI could potentially hurt the C's more than anyone on the list, but that's just me. How is Nowitzki that much better than Pierce? He doesn't play defense any more than Pierce does. I'm too lazy to look up the stats, but I'd imagine his assists are about even with Pierce as well.
Here's another question. Put Pierce on some of these other teams - do they get worse?
Whatever, its a silly arguement. I'm not going to convince PO and he's only interested in petty insults.
I've seen Wizznut. I like it but it's not a daily read. I prefer TrueHoop and JE Skeets.
Jeff, this is fun site, you can do better than calling me “stretch.” Any type of body part would be funny, loosen up a bit.
I won’t argue every player we disagree on, but seriously, you don’t think Ben Wallace, covering everyone’s ass who lets their man glide by, has more impact than PP? You start a team with a guy like that. Pierce’s scoring can easily be replaced, and Wallace gets every rebound in sight (negating the loss of Pierce’s great rebounding). A starting team of BW,AJ,RG,RD,DW beats a starting team of MB,AJ,PP,RD,DW.
The only question would be if AJ could guard AJ without fouling.
Nowitzki is a 7 foot dead-eyed shooter who can rebound and fuck up team defenses with his hard-to-clasify, Bird-like game (minus the passing). Pierce is a very, very good NBA swingman.
That said, the stats are interesting
Nowitzki career 21.5/8.5/2.5, 46.5%
Pierce career 23.2/6.6/3.8 43.8%
In both cases, we concede that neither play defense. If you take out both of their first two years their scoring jumps to like 25 a game. I'd say in terms of being an impact player, a 7 footer who can shoot and rebound is more valuable than a quality swingman, particularly when you have fairly similar production/stats. Just my opinion. As for Iverson, I don't care for his game, but his name is regularly mentioned when people talk about the best player in the game, and as much as we all like Pierce, he's simply not in that company.
Iverson is a complete team, and believe it or not he makes the rest of his team better. It wasn't always like that for him, but he has come around and now is #8 in the league in assists, #1 in scoring, #3 in steals, etc...
Iverson makes a team. Pierce is a good player. Huge difference.
Personally I would take most of those players over Pierce. The bottom line is that we have had Pierce for many seasons, and haven't won shit. So let's trade him. See what we get. What? Are we not going to win a championship trading him? We aren't going to win with him either. By the time we are ready to compete he is going to be too old. Let's get someone in here younger with huge potential. I would gamble the future on young players... Oh wait we already are.
Doc Rivers zone defense is has more orifices than that gay cowboy movie.
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