Did you listen to Fitzgerald?

Because your daughter lied to you it is impossible to know if she did it intentionally or accidently. In context - He can not prove intent because Libby lied.
David | Email | Homepage | 10.28.05 - 3:22 pm | #

Well, that's too bad for your fantasies, isn't it?
Dr. Sanity | Email | Homepage | 10.28.05 - 3:26 pm | #

By the way, would you care to discuss Joe Wilson's intent? You know, why he lied? What his motive was? I most certainly would, because I believe that his intent was much more despicable than Libby's. But again, neither of us can read their minds now can we? Lying and OOJ and perjury are serious charges, but they aren't what you would have liked. Tough. I feel your pain.
Dr. Sanity | Email | Homepage | 10.28.05 - 3:37 pm | #

Wonder why Fitzgerald wants to keep investigating? Oh well, if there is no "pervasive corruption" in the White House, then I guess you have nothing to worry about. But you sure seem eager to change the subject!
Byebye | Email | Homepage | 10.28.05 - 3:56 pm | #

EXAACTLY!! The man (Libby) has confirmed himself to be an idiot.

As I have noted, one would think he had better things to do than play telephone tag with reporters.

In the end, it is a tempest in a teapot.

If Sandy Berger got no more than a fine for his decidely criminal activities, Libby will get off with a hand slap- though in my opinion, he ought to have to wear a dunce cap for a year or so.

What a waste of resources.
sigmund, carl and alfred | Email | Homepage | 10.28.05 - 4:09 pm | #

By the way, after listening to Joe Wilson's statement Issued by his lawyer), I am willing to put forth the idea that Kos is the picture of mental health next to Wilson.
sigmund, carl and alfred | Email | Homepage | 10.28.05 - 4:11 pm | #

Berger is an excellent example. His crime was far worse for national security than was portrayed by the Press. This was the National Security Advisor to the President hiding classified documents in his socks and pants and LOSING SOME OF IT!! We (the public) still do not know what documents he conveniently "lost"; his trial was not even covered by the MSM, and he pleaded guilty and was given a slap on the wrist. To me this is unbelievable. Having dealt reagularly with classified material, I know how obsessive one must be in handling such documents. Yet, no "special counsel" was appointed to look into Berger's crime; no grand jury was convened to investigate the ramifications of his behavior at a time when he was working for and advising John Kerry on national security matters during a presidential election.
Dr. Sanity | Email | Homepage | 10.28.05 - 4:30 pm | #

I can't help feeling that if Libby worked for Gore during the last administration, no charges would have been filed. Ever. Under any circumstances. Even Clinton--who admitted lying UNDER OATH, was never indicted.
Anonymous | Email | Homepage | 10.28.05 - 7:25 pm | #

And, if Libby worked for Gore during the last adminstration war would be just and necessary. Even those just for image wars like the Iraq Liberation Act of 1998 which was never carried through although the NY Times editors was demanding the adminstration that it was the just and necessary thing to do. That old Kerry way of being for the war before they were against the war thing.

(The Left's political and cultural war is beginning to get on my nerves)
susan | Email | Homepage | 10.28.05 - 9:09 pm | #

> who admitted lying UNDER OATH, was never indicted.

Doesn't this all depend on what we mean by lying?

C'mon, give credit where credit is due.
ObloodyHell | Email | Homepage | 10.28.05 - 10:02 pm | #

> (The Left's political and cultural war is beginning to get on my nerves)

Bruce Willis: "Welcome to the party, PAL!!!"

;-D
ObloodyHell | Email | Homepage | 10.28.05 - 10:04 pm | #

If Libby lied under oath to the grand jury, it is in and of itself a felony. Period, end of report. And it was a likewise a felony for Clinton to lie when giving his civil deposition under oath. Same same.

No, Clinton wasn't charged with a crime, but the House managers impeached him for it. It was the Senate Republicans who didn't have the cojones to really try him in a serious manner, let alone convict him. And the Democrats meanwhile were in full defensive spin mode. Between the two, Clinton skated. At least that's the way I remember it.

Getting back to Libby, it was really stupid of him to lie the way he apparantly did here, and doing it blatantly. And I've heard that Libby is anything but stupid, and in fact he is a very shrewd lawyer in his own right. The word circumspect is used to describe him too. If that's the case, ya gotta ask yourself why he'd do it. Was he protecting someone, taking the all arrows in the chest on behalf of someone else? Who might that be? What would Occam's Razor predict?
jaybird | Email | Homepage | 10.28.05 - 11:51 pm | #

Clinton didn't really lie. YES I admit he was not forthright. But he was asked if he had sexual relations with "that woman"...and he said he didn't. Well, you know what? I still considered myself a virgin, even after I got my first BJ.

Anyways. Libby, part of your heroic and Godly Republican administration, has been caught telling lies. And don't even try to play this off like it is no big deal, because he faces up to 30 YEARS in prison. Even rapists don't get that much.

And what do you think will happen once Libby sings? Are you nervous, at all?

Funny how you all can't rebut this for ten seconds without bringing up Bill Clinton or John Kerry. Sorry, but this is about *you*. Where, exactly, is the integrity that you promised to restore to the White House? I thought Clinton was ancient history...now you need to bring his name up for everything you do?

Under Clinton, the welfare system was reformed, the economy was booming, and the rest of the world loved us.

Under Bush? NOTHING is as good as it was under Clinton, unless you are a rich mother fucker, in which case you would eat poor peoples' babies if it meant more money in your stock portfolio.
Mitzell | Email | Homepage | 10.29.05 - 3:57 am | #

You mean like Marc RICH and his association with Saddam's starvation of Iraqi children.


And yes I will say that Libby committed a crime for lying to the grand jury about a crime that was never committed.

Anyway, after two years and millions of dollars later....we still do not know who leaked Plame's name. Personally I think it was Wilson but this is just my opinion.

Listen dude, if you shot your wad while you had your BJ you had sex. OK. Just because you had your dick in her mouth does not negate the fact that you screwed her.
susan | Email | Homepage | 10.29.05 - 7:32 am | #

> Clinton didn't really lie. YES I admit he was not forthright. But he was asked if he had sexual relations with "that woman"...and he said he didn't. Well, you know what? I still considered myself a virgin, even after I got my first BJ.

That is outright BS. "Sexual Relations" is a far more generic, all-encompassing term than "intercourse". Only someone who is LYING would attempt to make any effort to claim otherwise.

Phone Sex is a form of "Sexual Relations".

Further, I realize I may be incorrect on this, but if he swore to tell "The Truth, The Whole Truth, and Nothing But The Truth", then clearly such prevarications are in violation of that oath -- as the intent of the question is blatant and obvious. No one but a cheap PoS would attempt to claim anything else.

You might tap dance around it without lying: "...I wouldn't call anything we did 'Sexual Relations'..." (it would be, but you don't have to call it that. You can call it "phreaking the wingo", if you want....). Clinton did not do this. He LIED.

> Anyways. Libby, part of your heroic and Godly Republican administration, has been caught telling lies. And don't even try to play this off like it is no big deal, because he faces up to 30 YEARS in prison. Even rapists don't get that much.

It's about the same level of deal at this point as Clinton's and according to YOU that is "no big deal".

> Funny how you all can't rebut this for ten seconds without bringing up Bill Clinton or John Kerry.

This would have to do with something called a "double standard" -- one for the Left, one for the Right.

Clinton LIES outright? NBD!!

Scooter LIES outright? HANG 'Im!!!

Berger's Pants magically fill with CLASSIFIED DOCUMENTS? "Bad Berger! Bad! BAD!!"

Behave and demand consistently and we won't feel the need to bring up the others.
Inferno Sanguinante Dell'OH | Email | Homepage | 10.29.05 - 10:10 am | #

> Under Clinton, the welfare system was reformed, the economy was booming, and the rest of the world loved us.

Well, except for all those terrorists he was allowing Saddam and Osama to build a powerbase and financial structure for.


... and those starving people in Iraq who weren't getting any food...

... and Randy Weaver...

... and any member of the Branch Davidian...

... and Elian Gonzalez ...

... and Vince Foster ...

Did you know, the FIFTIES were an idyllic time for ALL Americans! We should reinstate Eisenhower!
Inferno Sanguinante Dell 'OH | Email | Homepage | 10.29.05 - 10:21 am | #

Hey Doc, how you doing.

I have a rough time concluding Libby is that dumb. Honestly - it makes no sense. My view is he was so focused on making the case he did not leak to the press (just confirmed reporters' comments to him) that he did not keep the sequencing right.

I postulate Libby's memory (like mine) is not temporal, but highly accurate. What I see is Libby saying he told reporters nothing about what he had heard from all those meetings, to show he did not leak or confirm the facts. He misled by pointing to other reporters. Confirming reporters told him something is not confirming Valerie's position.

What Fitz has done is use his defense that he did not leak the information to reporters by retelling his misdirection, as proof that misdirection was aimed also at the grand jury.

Not buying it. I can see the grand jury and Fitz so confused on what happened (as we all are) before I would see Libby stupid enough to lie about this stuff.

What is your take on the variations in memory when it comes to mating facts with dates?

More here

http://strata-sphere.com/blog/in...hp/archives/ 861

Cheers.
AJStrata | Email | Homepage | 10.29.05 - 10:28 am | #

And yes I will say that Libby committed a crime for lying to the grand jury about a crime that was never committed.

I catch your point jaybird, but I don't think that's what has happened here. Lying CAN prevent the truth from coming out, but does not always do so. There's a lot of evidence collected other than what was gathered from Libby. Fair point, though.

It took me a minute to guess whether Mitzell's comment was a parody. I had to wonder at the part about how the rest of the world loved us.

Let's browse around the world on that one -- Eastern Europe, better relations now than under Clinton; India, better -- there's a billion people right there; Pakistan, better; China, about the same; Russia, maybe a slight improvement; Central Asia, much better; France, already bad, now slightly worse, ditto much of Western Europe: however, Ireland, better; UK, same; Denmark & Italy, better.

Africa mixed, mostly much better; Pacific Islands, slight improvement generally; SE Asia, mixed, probably slightly worse.

South America, mixed, but generally worse; Central America and the Caribbean, mixed but slightly better; Canada slightly worse; Mexico slightly better; Japan, better; Austalia, same; NZ slightly worse; Lebanon, better; Jordan, better; Qatar, Bahrain, better; other Arab nations, same.


Except maybe, you might detect some improvement in our relations with Afghanistan and Iraq.

Don't confuse our deteriorated relations with the UN with our relations to the actual nations in it. And I think deteriorating relations with the UN is a good thing, BTW.


Before being highjacked, we were going to see if there were someone more opportunistic and hypocritical than John Kerry, with the hope of getting our hostess to eat a piece of medical equipment. I think Kerry scores too many points for prominence alone. I suggest Howard Dean and Robert Byrd.
Assistant Village Idiot | Email | Homepage | 10.30.05 - 12:14 am | #

Dean is hoping that by consistently
repeating his cluelessness
he will somehow
gain in stature(Napoleon Complex).
gumshoe | Email | Homepage | 10.30.05 - 3:10 am | #

Doc Sanity:

Ever considered John F Kerry as the separated-at-birth twin of Married with Children's Al Bundy?

"I was a Football Star in High School. Once I scored Three Touchdowns in One Game."
-- Al Bundy

"I was a War Hero in Vietnam. Once I scored Three Purple Hearts in One Tour."
-- John F Kerry
Ken | Email | Homepage | 10.31.05 - 4:27 pm | #