Let me be the first to say: "w00t!"
Carr seems like a classy guy, he has done a lot of great things for the program and always represented it well, but the game has passed him by. The time has come to hang up his clipboard. I wish him well in his future endeavors (likely our next AD).
Wow. It's weird, since we all knew this was probably coming, but to see it semi-definitively stated makes my heart drop a bit. I think it's good for Carr and good for the program, but next Monday will be a bit of a sad day.
GOT TO WIN THE LAST ONE HERE FOR CARR.
It is a moral imperative.
Cheesy "Real Genius" reference aside, seriously....
MUST BEAT OHIO STATE.
Assuming this is true, would the next head coach likely be announced at the same time---meaning, what's the way this usually pans out? Seems like college football hasn't seen a true retirement in ages.
Wow, that adds a new dimension to this Saturday's game, doesn't it?
But when it comes down to it, you have to line up in a three point stance and just play.
I think Ohio State wins this game in a blowout.
Is this real???????
Why would he announce this now? Why not after the game? Try to inspire the team or something? I hope no one takes this the wrong way.... but Bo's passing last year about this time didn't "inspire" the team enough.
As was said above, we all knew it was coming, but it's still surprising in some weird way. I wish carr three things, a final win against Ohio State, a final win in the Rose Bowl, and a happy and prosperous retirement. Say what you will about his coaching, but he's a good man.
Let's hope he doesn't get to walk off the field on Saturday, and instead leaves on the shoulders of his captains. He deserves it, and so do they.
To borrow a line from Brian himself: There is one thing left. Play. Fight. Win. Please.
next monday != now, griff
I want to assure you all that nothing will change when I am the head man. Look forward to see all of you at the Big House next year.
Good! now lets get a win over OSU as a farewell gift.
Has brian officially started camping out on les miles' lawn yet?
yo-
sorry, you're right, I shouldn't have said "announce this now." But how could it have been made public? This is the last thing I'd want my team to be thinking about before the biggest game of the season.
carr is a great man. i can't think of a single coach who represents his school better than lloyd. i, for one, will miss him.
i think its one of those inevitable leaks that happens in any situation with a magnitude as great as this... lloyds gotta tell people to arrange such a thing, and these things get out
Thank God, Carr is leaving. Now lets send him out with a couple wins.
Griff-
Bo's passing was a shock. This announcement is not. I think it is a stretch to compare the motivational forces behind the 2. I would think the players will know for sure before the game leaving any doubt impossible. Therefore they can focus on simply playing the game.
Best of luck to Lloyd when he moves on. Now lets go out and get us a top-notch coach!
I hope I see him on campus this week so I can shake his hand. An honorable man.
BUCK THE *UCKEYES.
Les Miles has to be the front runner. I would personally like to go after Bobby Petrino.
I agree, I have reservations about getting rid of Carr. I would prefer to see a couple of more seasons. He deserves nothing but praise for his accomplishments while at Michigan.
lol, watch this crowd wax nostalgic now...
It's not a surprise, and the leak is not a surprise. I was told as a fact that a particular professor I did research with in my grad days had retired six weeks ago, scoured the world for a confirmation, couldn't find one and figured the source was confused, and lo! received a postcard inviting me to the shindig last week.
Someone couldn't wait to tell. Lots of someones, it seems. I hope who ever coaches next is as decent a person as Lloyd Carr.
@ YO
You are a disgusting human being, not worthy of posting here.
Goodbye.
First of all, Lloyd is a class act and I'm going to be sad to see him go. And all will be forgiven in my book if he can pull this one out this weekend.
On a related note: anyone know anything about the rumor that Les Miles bought a house in/just outside Ann Arbor?
I feel sad the Coach Carr is leaving. I really like the guy. I really like the way he handles the media (don't kid yourself - none of them are friends of our players or our university and many would write anything that would gain them notariety or increase circulation). ND went out to hire the next great college coach - twice in this century. Carr was not ever the greatest X's and O's coach, but how many times has he made the school look bad by his conduct? I'll give you a hint - it does not exceed the number of national titles he won.
I hioe we get someone who will continue the tradition of winning at Michigan and someone who loves Michigan as much as Carr does.
If our next coach is half the man Coach Carr, I will consider ourselves lucky.
cool out mvm, i'm not laughing at the mgoblog crowd... just at the fact that we've spent 10 weeks saying we should rid ourselves of lloyd and now once we know he's gone for real, we all say, "but wait!"
i'm a true blue M fan with a deep respect for lloyd and will also be sad to see him go.
Despite some of his personnel decisions, Lloyd Carr has been an excellent coach at Michigan. The man has been a phenomenal ambassador of the University and has served it loyally.
When people talk about Lloyd, I am reminded of the episode of The Office when the manager of the Stamford branch (Josh, IIRC) leverages his promotion to take a senior management position at Staples. Jim, who worked for Michael and Josh says: "Say what you will about Michael Scott, but he would NEVER do THAT."
That's how I feel about Lloyd. He's a good guy with a good heart who absolutely loves and respects the University of Michigan, its history, and its tradition. He may be stubborn, but he's humble and protects his players.
So when Urban Meyer wins national titles after shady politicking and Bill Callahan disrespects Nebraska's tradition, I think of Jim. Say what you want about Lloyd Carr, but he would NEVER do THAT.
I'll miss the guy. He was as classy as they came.
Do you guys like to see blocked punts?
All I can say is "great googlymoogly".
re the les miles house in A2 rumor - if someone had access to the real estate listing of the area (the mls) and time on their hands, and the name of the buyer was not withheld from the listings, one could confirm that he bought a house in A2
MillerTime, I have used that line, in that context, to refer to Lloyd at least twice that I can remember.
And please don't hire Les Miles.
97 Alumni, I have been working that angle, to no avail so far.
I remember last year after the memorial ceremony for Bo, and the overwhelming sentiment was that for all his warts as a coach, there has been no better man to represent Michigan than Lloyd Carr. That is what will stick with me.
I remember moving to Ann Arbor as a freshman in the fall of 2002, having grown up hating Michigan's football team, I was struggling with how I was going to walk into the Big House and yell and scream for the Maize and Blue. Some friends and I wandered to the pep rally being held at the corner of South U and State (when the frat houses held it) and the area was mobbed with people. When Lloyd came out to speak he said, "we have a reputation of being a quiet crowd and that is unacceptable! I want you to show up and give your all and make the stadium as loud as I know it can be. You need to be rested. My players will be in bed by 10. You will be in bed by eleven!" With that the crowd went nuts, and that was the moment my blood turned to maize and blue. I've never looked back. I'll always appreciate Lloyd for that.
Lloyd's a great man. I can only hope to double his success. And I plan to.
@ YO
I don't think many are trying to say that now is not the time. Now is the time.
But of course we want to see the man go out a winner and try to remember the good over the bad.
It's not like there was not success during the Carr era. There was plenty, plenty of good stuff to remember.
But now is the time, things have seem to have passed Carr by a little bit.
But a National Championship and multiple B10 championships make him more than worthy and deserving of the accolades that are coming.
How long you think before a mainstream media outlet picks this up? And what do you think the odds are they actually cite MGoBlog and not "a blog"?
When you really think about it Carr isn't one to use himself as a motivator. It goes against his demeanor and shows deep down this is a good and humble man. He refused to use Bo's death as a motivator this year and he's not going to give a "go win one for me" speech Saturday. That said, the announcement is coming.
Other Chris - yeah, problem is they could decided to keep the name confidential and off the listing too. Which they probably would.
wow, it is kind of shocking and even though it is completely expected in a way I didn't expect it. He is a great symbol of the block M and will be missed and hopefully these players, his players give him the respect on the field the 17th that he deserves. HAIL blue, HAIL lloyd ... HAIL THE VICTORS.
Why did this have to leak. Now I am going to walk around all week completely flabbergasted, wondering 1) if it is true and 2) who the next coach will be
I will get even less work done than usual during CFB season. Sigh.
"On a related note: anyone know anything about the rumor that Les Miles bought a house in/just outside Ann Arbor?"
Not in Ann Arbor at least:
https://is.bsasoftware.com/bsa.is...ppid=0&
unit=283
it was barton hills or something right?
Even though the game has passed him by, I will miss Lloyd. If for nothing else his halftime interviews.
I am just hoping that w/ this timing that our recruiting isn't negatively affected. 6 weeks is a long time for other coaches to poach our recruits before Miles or whomever takes over.
Miles buying a house in AA smacks of silly Intrynet rumor. As someone pointed out on an earlier thread, you would have to believe a lot of implausible things before you could believe the house rumor. Yeah, anything's possible, but... it really seems highly unlikely.
As for Lloyd: I know even his harshest critics will miss him when he's gone. Some things they obviously will not miss, but the things we take for granted sometimes -- the upstanding and dignified way he ran the program and behaved in public, and all the like. A class act and true Michigan Man all the way. God bless, Lloyd.
you should have waited to tell us. You have too big of an influence in the Michigan Football//NCAA football media world.
MVM, real genius is the best. movie. ever.
Lloyd Carr. Head Football Coach. University of Michigan. 1995-2007.
I'll never forget Jan 1, 1998. And I have Lloyd Carr to thank for that.
Thank You Lloyd Carr.
I never thought I would want a victory over OSU more than I did last year. Until now. Please let Lloyd's last year mark him as the masterful motivator who, in the aftermath of a shocking and devastating start to a season, led his bruised and battered team to the Big 10 championship and Rose Bowl.
While he is flawed as a coach, I think back on last year, right after Bo died and in the way he dealt with the whole BCS Championship Game situation, and I cannot imagine a more dignified, eloquent person leading our university's football team. He will be missed.
Barton Hills was the way I heard it too. hmmmm.... I'm guessing he wouldn't be audacious enough to make his name public on the listing
I am irritated at Lloyd and his ways sometimes but he's truly the man. My respect for Lloyd Carr will increase multi-fold. He's not allowing his ego to bury the program like a few old coaches and he wants to take time off. We love you, Lloyd.
Does DeBord leave too? Git?
Lloyd wins this one against OSU and during the post-game handshake, has a long chat with Tressel - who had outschemed him a number of times.
If they don't have a prospective coach in mind, it'll make the off-season interesting.
Back to the game this week... these are always fun....
http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?s=1...=3154&
t=1408353
All the talk about Lloyd being a class act are on point. What irks me, is the thought of Les Miles, a lucky fool who likes to run his mouth, getting the job just because he was here before. I'm all for a "Michigan Man", but it takes more than past affiliation to be this leader we need. Bo wasn't a Michigan Man until he came here... We need a coach that can take us to the next level, while still running a tight ship. To the masses, I propose Bob Stoops. As soo as he heard of any problems with his players (even the star qb), he kicked those fools to the curb..and still managed an excellent season.
Ditto, everyone who said they had a sinking feeling in their gut. I've been ticked off at Lloyd more times than I can count....but He will be missed.
I went to the Michigan Football Camp for highschool kids back when Lloyd ran it as Moe's second in comand. Lloyd made every kid he came near feel like he was as important as the five star recruits. The guy came through the dorms and stopped by the rooms to talk. He watched the end of the NBA finals with us in our neighbors room. My point is he is a player's coach, a people person, and a down rite good guy. Let's hope the next coach has half of his charecter...(and a few more wins in the big games).
and to the rumors...Doesn't it seem logical that Miles would avoid negotiating anything until after the season?? Seems like winning a national championship might increase your value quite a bit...
Yes Josh. Being the pessimistic Michigan fan, I am now scared that we don't go into a ND level mediocrity. Damn, this sucks. This is Michigan, it won't happen... but there's this fear.
Les Miles doesn't care about LSU. Never has never will. Why do you think he has made all the crazy calls he has this year? He is going balls to the wall without a care in the world. He knows where he will be in '08.
Something to consider: If M moves in a new direction and modernizes things a bit from S&C on up...and then Paterno leaves (that could only help that particular sleeping giant)...I would forecast that the B10 is about to return to the top of the college football world. You would now have a an M program with new energy, Tressel established at OSU, Zook building what could be a monster at Illinois and rebirth at Penn State.
Big Ten about to get better I think.
Noooooo,
I am a one trick pony. If Carr retires, who can I blame for losses.
In all honesty, I thank Lloyd for doing his best and bringing us numerous Big Ten titles and the 97 national title. I am very excited about the future of our program.
I will miss Lloyd Carr, and I hope that our next coach has half the class that Lloyd does. I haven't always agreed with his decisions, but I have never been embarassed by his representation of a place I love very much, which is more important than winning and losing.
Coach Carr may drive us mad because we think we know better, but for a man who probably never thought he was going to be a Division I head coach, who made the most of his opportunity, and did something that no Michigan coach in 50 years was able to do, we should be grateful for that. It is my hope that Coach Carr's departure is coming from that he saw that Bo seemed to love his retirement years and is realizing that perhaps there is more to life than coaching Michigan football.
And while Coach Carr may not use this as a motivator, don't think that if his players know this, it won't be in their minds and hearts. They want to beat Ohio State for themselves, for their school, and for their coach. But to know that if this is the case, to send Coach Carr out of the Big House with a win, that's just one more log in the fire.
Thank you Coach Carr.
if this is true i would thank lloyd and be happy to see the program move forward. but one has to wonder about the timing. it is horrible. it gives other teams tons of time to get on our verbals. if the announcement came in january, after the bowl, a replacement could be had in just a few days. now we'll have to wait at least 6 weeks. we could be down to 3 recruits by then and the new coach might not have enough time to re-recruit. perhaps in a few years this will be meaningless, but it is questionable now.
bobby petrino? shoot me in the head.
Yeesh...
Lloyd brought Michigan the single highest peak that the program has seen in the past 60 years, by going undefeated in 1997. He's always been a pillar of class, and has become nearly as synonomous with the program as Bo. Michigan is losing a great leader and someone to be proud of.
I hope that the team does right by Lloyd, and sends him out with a win over OSU.
The server is being overloaded... what is with that today? EDSBS had the same problem earlier.
@Yostal - great point.
Moeller was Bo's hand-picked successor and was therefore assumed to be the head coach for a long, long time (well, longer than 5 years).
Carr spent almost that entire first year as an "interim" head coach. He never lobbied in public to have the tag removed. He merely went to work and tried to steer the program - reeling from the Moeller scandal - back in the right direction. Three wins over the Buckeyes and three years later, he won the AP Coach of the Year trophy and delivered us a Big Ten, Rose Bowl and National Championship. For a job he never campaigned for and probably never expected to ever get, he did pretty well for himself.
they better keep ron english on staff
\Bo's passing last year about this time didn't "inspire" the team enough.//
Why exactly would it have? None of the players on this team were ever recruited by or coached by Bo. Some of them were still peeing on themselves when he last coached. Regardless of what presence he may have had as AD, these players are Lloyd's through-and-through.
If they're not sufficiently motivated to run through a wall and destroy OSU this weekend after living under his tutelage for as long as five years (in the case of redshirted seniors) we'll know that his players quit on him long ago and he should've been sacked well before App State this year.
Ohio State cared enough for Earle Bruce to whip us in his last game as their coach, when they knew he wouldn't be coming back...I hope Michigan's kids are up to the task to return the favor this time.
Bo was at Michigan from 1969-70 season through the 1989-90 season. Carr, from 1980-81 through 2007-08. The guy belongs on the Mt. Rusmore of Michigan coaches next to Bo, Crisler and Yost.
He should announce before the Ohio State game and give them the emotional lift. On second thought that did not work out too well with what I expected would be an emotional lift due to the Bo passing last year. Nope unfortunately, it is going to require DeBoerd and English having lucid moments and the team actually out executing its opponent.
Lets stop comparing Bo's passing to Lloyd's retiring...seriously
About a year ago in Alabama, my father-in-law was aglow with a rumor that Spurrier's wife was looking at houses in Tuscaloosa.
If you signed - or in the furture sign - a letter of intent to take a football scholarship at Michigan and you are the type of person who needs some sort of external motivation to get up for the Ohio State game, Big Ten and Rose Bowl dreams on the line or not, there is something wrong with you.
http://mgoboard.com/blogmedia/
vi...dLloydLloyd.mpg
I just think that video ought to be mentioned whenever Carr's legacy is discussed.
Get over yourselves, Carr retiring is the best thing to happen to your crappy program in the last 7 years. As a Buckeye, I am obviously sad to see him go...he is officially Tressel's whipping boy and will always be remembered as such!!!
It's not going to happen but wouldn't it be nice if just before Saturday's game we learned that the game would be played at Carr-Schembechler Field at Michigan Stadium?
Yes, I think that's how much he has meant to Michigan football.
Wishbone wrote: " Assuming this is true, would the next head coach likely be announced at the same time---meaning, what's the way this usually pans out? Seems like college football hasn't seen a true retirement in ages."
1) last "true retirement" that i can recall in college football (of any signficance, that is) was barry alvarez, a mere 2 years ago.
2) Carr's successor will unequivocally not be named at the same time the retirement is announced. recall that alvarez got some flack for naming his successor rather than going through a selection process. Bill Martin will interview several candidates in a national search (and will do so in a way that appeases the BCA). Carr's successor will likely not be named until after the bowl season, imo.
If this is really the case I can't imagine it won't be announced earlier. There's no good way to avoid the questions. "No Comment"="Yes" Can't lie either, the cat is outta the bag.
Anyway, good luck to Lloyd, a classy guy. He did own us for the Cooper Years and it will be fun to see next year how the BIG GAME works out!
Robert -- douchebag.
I haven't read any of this thread yet (I will), but why are all the threads about this on the Wolverine being deleted? Very strange.
I echo all the comments praising Carr. As much as he made me tear out my hair on the field., he never embarrased our great tradition.
That said, I have two thoughts:
I think the coaching staff will be trying as hard as the players come Saturday. Look out playcalling!
I wonder what this does to that monster recruiting weekend. I hope those boys wait a while to see someone like Miles come on board.
No need to make personal attacks...don't get pissy just because you can't beat the Bucks anymore!
Bill Cowher. Start spreading the rumors and maybe it will happen. Best coach with the best credentials out there. No doubt he can coach at the college level. What recruit would not be pumped to have Bill Cowher and his Super Bowl ring in their house and telling them to come to Michigan. This next hire is enormous for the future of the program. Have to get a proven coach! BILL COWHER! The excitement would be insane.
robert = douchebag
Mark Synder of the Free Press reported earlier this season that Carr is basically going to pick his successor (whenever that happens)
obvious candidates: Les Miles, Ron English, Mike Debord... sigh.... does any Michigan fan want to see Debord or English become the head coach, or leave in general... I really don't.
what about Gary Moeller... haha just kidding.
EEKS + YO = bitter fags
Robert, Carr is 6-6 against OSU. Did I miss something?
I will be sad to see Lloyd go. He was a class act, his players loved him and he gave so much to the community and the program. Hopefully his replacement will live up to the high standard he set.
Lloydball has taken it's lumps here in recent weeks, but it was a special brand of football when it work. See 1997.
Yes actually you did...see below:
"he is officially Tressel's whipping boy and will always be remembered as such!!!"
where's brian and his anti-troll spray when you need him
I will miss Lloyd. And with next season promising to be fairly ugly by Michigan standards, so will a lot of UM fans.
@ Robert
Sad and infantile. History began in 2001 I suppose. Your world view is small, weak, and WRONG.
Carr is nobody's whipping boy. You, on the other hand, are the the ultimate whipping boy...a douchebag with all the attributes of Jim Tressel's other fluffers.
can we please stop paying attention to posters from other teams, be they msu, wisky or now o$u? we're michigan. we went to michigan b/c we are smarter than they are. they went to their school b/c they couldn't get into michigan. let's act like it.
Carr will not choose his successor. He will likely have lots of input, but Bill Martin will make the call.
Robert - your hatred for all things Michigan has been noted. Please move along we wish to discuss our feelings for our coach.
We got your central point - Carr is 1-5 versus Tressel. If you don't have anything else to say please just refrain from posting.
can we stop posting o$u while we're at it?
Robert-
So you only count 1/2 of Lloyd's career? But what about Cooper being Carr's whipping boy? Do we look at only 1/2 of a coach, the half that suits you?
You are an excellent example of what low academic standards get you in the way of brainpower.
I will echo what has already been said: although I knew that this day was quickly coming, I sit at my desk completely shocked at this news. Before I go on, let me preface by saying that I am an "unabashed" Lloyd Carr apologist.
Lloyd took over the program in my second year at Michigan, and the first thing that struck me about the man was his class, dignity and love of Michigan. As a kid, I grew up a Michigan fan in New York, despite the fact that I had no connection to the University. I remember watching the games on TV and thinking that this was the proudest team in college sports and that M represented more than just tradition and pride, but a way of life.
When I first heard Lloyd speak, I though, "this man is the perfect coach for this university." Lloyd embodies - perhaps more than anyone before him - all of that pride, tradition and greatness that makes Michigan different. While many criticize his coaching, Michigan's winning percentage during LC's tenure is the highest in the B10 and among the highest in the country. Michigan consistently competed for the Big Ten championship, often was in the national championship picture (as recently as last year), won a national championship (and I don't want to hear a THING about 1997 being a split) and ALWAYS, always made us proud to be fans.
I, for one, am greatful to Coach Carr for the amazing ride that was 1997 - my greatest sports memory to date was storming the field when Michigan beat Ohio State to clinch a Rose Bowl birth. More than that, though, I am grateful to Coach Carr for making Michigan football something that I can ALWAYS be proud of. I hope that Coach Carr remains actively involved in the program, and guides us into the future with his passion, pride and impeccable character.
Whoever takes over next, be it Les Miles, Jeff Tedford, Brian Kelley or any of the other names on the list, I know that they will have enormous shoes to fill.
Go Michigan, Go Coach Carr! Hail to the Victors!!!!!
Robert,
Fellow Buckeye here. While I wouldn't be buying Carr a brewski anytime true competitors appreciate a good opponent. I check in here occasionally because there is 1) Brian's cool stuff 2) generally less 3rd grade level shrieking and 3) a more active intelligent conversation than most places. If you don't realize Carr was a good coach OVERALL then go to an OSU board and type your fingers into carpel tunnel syndrome.
I tend to think had he fought for it--"it" being the second slot in the BCS Championship Game last season--it is possible Michigan would've received (and warranted) their rematch. Yet, he was one of the very few that did not believe in the sort of grandstanding so common in today's society, or at least to Mack Brown, circa 2004.
He never lost sight of the fact that his football team represented the world-class university, secondary in important unlike too many other places to name, for two, my alma mater in Lexington and my filial-piety-inspired school in Columbus.
There are many reasons why the Michigan football program (let alone university) is superior to its Big 10 rival to the Southeast: Lloyd Carr is one of them. I know the feeling of UM fans: you want a coach with a different mentality, perhaps more speed and a less predictable playbook. Maybe this affords you multiple national championships, just take care not to lose what you've worked for over a century to achieve, and look only at Nebraska, and the blood on their 1995 championship ring.
As ever, go Bucks, but perhaps my 38-27 pick seems even more appropriate now.
A fond farewell to Mr. Carr, whose legacy surely lives on in the players he nurtured and coached.
Balas on Huge: (Huge cites MGoBlog, btw)
no confirmation. lots of 'smoke.' also says there was alot of 'smoke' last year, and the texas RB year (had they won the RB, he may have retired). a retirement would not surprise him, of course.
he also says the job is Miles' to take (his opinion). he says Miles has already made his money, etc and Michigan is where he wants to be. money won't be an issue w/ him.
Ha! What is the lasting legacy of Cooper? He is all but forgotten in Columbus simply becuase he couldn't beat you scuMbags. If you really want to get into academic standards please see the dozens of posts in this very string from your "fellow wolverines" that are littered with grammatical errors and misspellings. Carr is a joke. Just like your school.
@ Robert
If you are trying to be pathetic you are doing a great job.
robert FUCK YOU
yea, carr never beat osu, what a legacy....typical tOSU
That was beautifully written, M.E.G.
Robert,
You are a jerk-off, and you need to go back to the flee-infested Columbus sewer that you crawled out of. I understand that this may be tough for an OSU fan to understand (but I will type slowly, if that helps), but we are not impressed with Tressel. The man has no character or class. While this makes him the perfect man to coach douche-bag U (aka tOSU), as Michigan fans, we strive for someone we can be proud of. And, of course, it doesn't hurt that Lloyd won a national championship and a slew of big ten titles.
Robert,
Ack, you are an embarrassment. I've got to love "Just like your school." while you're busy pointing out grammatical errors?!!!!!
Go away. Now.
Brian, the IQ screening device is not working. Robert's posts keep showing up.
Hey, guys, don't stoop to his level. He's a joke, knows it and is trying to bait employed people.
Hey, I happen to think Tressel is a man of class. Big time. Some disagree, but let's not do that.
Holy Crap I almost want to cry over this announcement. But I'm the same guy who was calling for his head after App State...arrrrggghhh the confusing agony!
Isn't it nice that Carr isn't leaving because he punched a 21 year-old kid? Or because his team got in multiple fights while being dismantled by South Carolina in a bowl game? When was the last time our entire fan base turned on a coach and got him canned? Moeller was an unfortunate situation but it was nipped in the bud before it could spiral into all-out hatred.
It's not surprising that tOSU fans like Robert think the way they do. Whether they went to school there or not, they're united by the fact they have no class. I hate to rag on the quality of the academic institution, but um... I think no class sums it up pretty well. Thank you for stopping by, Bobby.
Robert:
That's awesome. You're the grammar police for the "enemy" message board. Your mother must be proud. I'll go pull her out of the mud bath she's probably taking Porky, your pet pig, and let her know for you.
Grammatical errors on message boards should definitely be moved into US News and WSJ's (that's Wall Street Journal for you, imbecile. I know they don't deliver that in Columbus since 99% of the people couldn't read most of it, but it's a fairly intellectual paper) rankings system.
You are a class act (that is sarcasm by the way, not that I expect you to know what that means either).
Brian Kelly in 2008! The man for the job.
Tressel is a man of class. I never stated that Carr wasn't one. I simply pointed out that he can't coach anymore and that you are all a bunch of uneducated, one-toothed, sister-humping scumbags.
Don't feed the trolls.
It's been great guys, really. I'll let you all get back to your day off; since you all work the night shift at Ford. Dumbfucks.
What-say we all just ignore him?
Ford......get real, Toyota pays better.
Robert, as a (fellow) Buckeye, let me just offer one word to you: shutty.
We get it. Stop being a moron. If you want to pee on people's legs, there are plenty of crappy Michigan blogs where you can do so. This isn't the place.
Now I have seen it all. An OSU fan calling us "a bunch of uneducated, one-toothed, sister-humping scumbags."
Everyone, as tempting (and easy) as it is to respond to this tool, let's not allow him to ruin what has otherwise been a classy outpouring of respect for Lloyd Carr. Seriously, if we do not respond, he will probably go away. In fact, the public library will probably close around 5 and he will no longer have internet access (sorry, couldn't pass that one up).
It's like watching a car wreck...hard to ignore the ugly reality.
Tom, you are welcome here anytime. Buck fans like yourself and Son of Jorel make this board even better. Thanks.
Yes, Robert, I am a decided OSU partisan that admires the university and football program of its most contentious rival, guilty as charged.
Yes, many of my best friends spent some time, in one form or another, on campus, but they are not in any sense my school.
I remember 1993, 1995, 1996... I remember them well. In fact, last week's game against Illinois visibly distressed me.
I thin Tressel has helped, but the power of football program over the university troubles me, in some ways his recent BCS blitz has further distanced the team from the school--all that $$$ and all that pressure to keep bringing it in.
It leads to Lawrence Phillips and Maurice Clarett, and, yes, two rings, to name but two programs in the last quarter-century when television rules changes forever altered the business end of college football.
I'm not saying you have to emulate the University of Chicago seventy years ago or the Ivies fifty years prior, but something better at Columbus is needed.
Yes, we, have the best winning percentage since 1950, a tremendous accomplishment, but does it really mean as much as it could? Or were decisions made, consciously or otherwise, to allow for such an impressive record?
You may very well get Les Miles but I doubt they'd FORMALLY interview him until after the BCS game. He's a bit busy now.
I will be starting a "L-loyd Car-r" (clap clap clap clap clap) chant at the beginning of the second quarter this weekend in the student section. Will also create a facebook group outlining this. This man has represented our university with class, dignity, and grace, and embodied a sort of toughness that I, for one, appreciate. Farewell to a great Michigan Man.
Who are we kidding. We can't live without each other. You hate us. We hate you more. If you think that the shit-talking on a board like this actually means anything, then you really are ignorant. I'm sure you are all great people, even though you are Wolverines.
The truth is, we validate each other's schedule every year. Without you, we would never have a meaningful conference game. The same holds true in reverse. So, if I offended anyone, I'm sorry...just keep in mind that I started this all debating Carr's record against Tressel. It is you all in your time of sorrow that turned this into a personal attack forum.
Does this mean that Russel Crowe won't give any more pre-game talks to the team?
Please take Tedford off our hands!
Lloyd Carr is the best coach Michigan has ever had....including Bo. His biggest failures are that we as fans are bored with him and he trusts "his guys" a little too much.
I think it is time to shake things up at Michigan and this is probably the right time for him to retire. But I think we're going to miss him more than anyone will want to admit.
And the thought of a hot-shot NFL guy coming in to improve things scares me to death. Ask Nebraska and Notre Dame how that has worked out for them.
Someone posted about a possible naming of "Carr-Schembechler field." I don't think that is a realistic possibility, BUT: if I recall correctly, the University was looking for two donors to name two concourse towers in the redesigned Big House after.
Wouldn't it be cool if they named the towers Carr Tower and Schembechler Tower?
I was actually just talking to a group of fairly successful alum, and was toying with the idea of trying to put together a petition for this. While I doubt that we could raise the $10 million (I believe) that the University is looking for from the namesake, perhaps a grassroots effort, with a large number of signatures and a decent amount of pledged donations, could get the University to consider it. As a true fan, I know that my heart would swell with far more pride walking into Schembechler tower than Smith Tower (or, worse, Ford Motors tower).
Brian, if you are interested in getting involed in this idea (which I have now floated to about 25 alum, all who were very interested in assisting), let me know and I will email you.
Excellent!! he is able to leave with some dignity after winning 8 in a row, and just because by most accounts he's a "good guy" doesn't mean that one man should be bigger than this program. There were allot of "good guys" who struggled to build Michigan's program which he has been tarnishing by losing many, many big games. All of this pro Carr sentiment seems derive itself from the fact that allot of you put one Lloyd Carr before the success of Michigan.
Losing a bowl game and to OSU year after year is not success and is not what I want Michigan to be known for.
The sing-song chant that is so popular works best with four syllables, and "L-loyd Car-r" sounds awful. I prefer "LLoyd Carr! Superstar!" in the "Go! Blue!" style call-and-response across sections.
Take Tedford Please!
@ gobluemich
don't forget me, I am wonderful and have a hairless 'taint thanks to the wonders of brazilian waxing by Ping Ho
In keeping with the "grass roots" spirit, we at TOSU will be spearheading a "Keep Lloyd in Ann Arbor" petition. Good Times!!!
Do us a favor and take Tedford!
@ Robert,
And we in Ann Arbor will be spearheading a "free Clarret" movement, so you can once again be proud your great champion.
I wonder if bill would like us to "take Jeff Tedford"?
Alright, if we're gonna go that way with it:
"The cycle continues. In January of this year, two University of Michigan football players were arrested for aggravated assault and battery on another Ann Arbor student. 19 year old Christian Richards, a reserve defensive back and 19 year old Carson Butler tight end from Detroit were charged."
Bring on Brian Kelly!!!
OSU can't seem to win anything without felons like Clarett or NCAA violators like Troy Smith.
And now Malcolm Jenkins will probably be allowed to play even though he assaulted
an Illini player AFTER the game on national television.
Buckeye fans should be proud of guys like Robert. They represent the finest of Buckeye Nation....completely oblivious to facts, completely void of anything resembling class.
Hire Tedford Please!
Living in Florida now and getting intimately familiar with SEC wonks, I just have to say I am in no way sold that Les Miles is THE guy unless it is based somewhat on the whole "Michigan Man" idea. He's been successful, yes. LSU is #1 for God's sake. If you look at the Meyer-Tressel tracks, however, Brian Kelly is on a similar ascent. He is the makeover this program needs, IMO. I find it much easier to get excited about the prospect of Michigan's football future with a dynamic head coach taking the reins.
Lloyd, you're the best. Classy in good times and mediocre. I will never forget the "paragon of integrity" rant nor your halftime interviews. Priceless.
Let's beat the Buckeyes. Go Blue.
There you go MVM; make it personal again. That worked out well for you last time jackass.
Christian richards - dismissed from the team. Carson Butler - suspended and no reinstated until after he was acquitted.
You act as if Maurice is still on the squad. We cut ties with him; much like you guys did with your two thugs.
@ Robert
Convenient to cut ties after you use your star running back to achieve a national title. He was the best player on that team. Your championship will forever be tainted. Just like the Fab 5 was stripped of their final 4 appearances, OSU should be stripped of its pseudo-championship. BTW---Troy Smith was a cheater too. Your two best players of the Tressel era were as dirty as the Vest himself. Deal with it.
Clarett was violating NCAA rules in a big way before Tressel was cornered and had no choice but to let him go.
Richards is back in Cali having been booted. Butler was exonerated in court and allowed back. M also booted Germany for his idiocy.
Haven't heard of anybody getting the boot from OSU lately. Even the Henton the whoremongerer has been allowed to practice and they also let a weed dealing punter back onto the team also.
Robert, Robert, Robert....you are inviting personal attacks because you are a douchebag. What do you expect?
STOP FEEDING THE TROLL. He should atleast have a shred of dignity to not create havoc in a rival's comment board bidding adieu to a coach who has coached for 20+ years.
Please, please stay.
While I don't agree with what Robert's saying, UM fans need to look at the post-game scrum and see what actually happened before making blanket assumptions based off of what Maurice Clarett did in 2003 and beyond, and pretending that somehow relates to what Malcolm Jenkins does in 2007. Malcolm Jenkins was headbutted by an Illini player, got up, and conked the Illini player on the head with an OPEN FIST. No one was hurt, the whole thing lasted seconds. Basically, the Illini wanted to celebrate at midfield where OSU players usually pray after every game. OSU players pushed them back, some Illini retaliated as if it were a fight (No surprise from a Ron Zook-coached team) and a couple OSU players laid out open-handed punches in what may be considered self-defense. Malcolm Jenkins, did nothing, Brian Robiskie was helping someone up. Do some research, UM fans, the media tells me you're better at it than we are, us helplessly stupid, barbaric OSU fans.
Let's all agree then; our programs would be far less successful without the high-talent, questionable-character guys that litter the two rosters. All the coaches can do is hope that their influence will keep guys out of trouble.
In C-bus they are called "libaries".
Let's not agree Robert.
OSU would not be successful without high profile punks, not under Tressel anyway.
M has been successful, will continue to be successful without these low quality people.
This is a Lloyd post!!! God, we are easily taken down into the muck.
Well, looks like you're gonna have to change the name of this site to lloydcarr'sretiringpartVIII.com. It's also nice to know that Rivals is constrained by journalistic standards in ways that you aren't. Rivals, of course, being the site the Wall Street Journal goes to when it wants a refresher on journalistic ethics.
http://michigan.rivals.com/showm...5492525&
style=1
"Malcolm Jenkins, did nothing, Brian Robiskie was helping someone up."
HA HA HA.
You guys are hilarious.
Dumbfucks all of you. Go fuck your sisters and suck on some more Lloyd Carr sausage. The night shift starts in a few hours!!!!
I'm torn here. On the one hand, it's great to hear intelligent commentary from Buckeye fans like pecoshelga and M. E. G. who truly respect The Game.
However, my world makes more sense when mouth-breathers like Robert step in and reinforce all of the beliefs I have about tOSU fans. Then I start to wonder - is nearly all-consuming disdain, disgust and condescension the true essence of the rivalry after all?
I'd like to think I'm one of the enlightened ones who really understands the grandeur of The Game, but then I remember that I was jumping up and down with glee last Saturday night as Illinois bitchslapped the Bucks, swearing and cackling at the old woman with those stupid goddamn Buckeye beads who looked so deliciously devastated (and probably went home to her trailer with a handle of Early Times in tow).
I sure respect pecos and M.E.G. as people, but this is not the week for respect; it's hate week.
Tressel is a slimy fucker (please review his tenure at Youngstown State if you have any doubts, and also remember that no Lloyd-coached team has ever gotten into a brawl at midfield like those classy Bucks did on Saturday); Robert couldn't get into Michigan if he gave Mary Sue head until her suspiciously blond hair turned gray; and Michigan v. OSU quite simply represents All That is Good vs. All That is Soulless and Wrong.
GO BLUE. BEAT THE MOTHERFUCKING BUCKEYES.
MVM, you've stooped to simple trolling. Act like a "Michigan man" is supposed to and act with some class. I won't even bother to respond to you otherwise.
Robiskie was trying to help an old woman cross the field after the game I heard.
And Jenkins was only trying to level the playing field against an Illini player who killed his grandma last week. Also, he was only trying to protect the "O" at midfield because it is the sanctum of God and only OSU players who are going to pray can go there after the game.
aaron: we dont need brian kelly running the swinging gate unsuccesfully in the biggest game of the year... what a mess that was.
Yes Robert,
Because the Tressel influence was so positive on the players he coached at Youngstown State.
I give it to you OSU fans, you are willing to look past all flaws so long as The Vest beats Michigan. Congrats, he is a hell of a coach, in terms of preparation, strategy, game calling, and recruiting. But his history, dating back to Youngstown and now at OSU is lined with dirt and corruption. He destroys Carr as a tactical coach. But doesn't hold a candle to Lloyd as a human being and teacher of young men.
Right, and all those dollars that fatten the Felonious Five's wallets went directly to charity, didn't they, MVM?
@ poguemahone
M paid dearly for Webber's actions. Banners taken down, money returned, hoops program in dumpster for 10 years.
OSU never seems to pay much of a price though. I wonder why.
Gingell:
I have agreed with almost every damn thing you've written for about a week now. It's awesome. I don't really have a point, just, uh, keep on ... keep truckin.
@ AAB:
WOW. Rivals is an internet forum full of speculation and rumors. Anything considered "news" has to be support by a link to a real journalist.
But somehow they won't allow a blog to be posted because they do not want to be a launching pad for other forums.
So, they don't want to be a base for readers to head to other sites with their precious "hits"?
Two things scream out between the lines of that post.
1. We don't want to create traffic for other Michigan sites. Please only discuss rumors here.
2. We knew about the Lloyd stuff first (months ago).
I lost a lot of respect for that John Borton with those "guidelines"
Please, enlighten me, MVM. Is the NCAA biased towards Ohio State? We've had banners taken down, a hoops program that sucks, and had to pay back our former hoops head coach when we reacted too harshly to his own personal charity. Please.
My on-field rankings:
Fielding H. Yost: 165 wins (.833), 10 Big Ten titles, 6 national titles.
Glenn E. "Bo" Schembechler: 194 wins (.796), 13 Big Ten titles, 0 national titles.
Lloyd Carr: 121 wins (.756), 5 Big Ten titles, 1 national title (subject to OSU and Bowl game this year).
Fritz Crisler: 71 wins (.805), 2 Big Ten titles, 1 national title.
Harry Kipke: 46 wins (.631), 4 Big Ten titles, 2 national titles.
Bennie Oosterbaan: 63 wins (.650), 3 Big Ten titles, 1 national title.
Gary Moeller: 44 wins (.758), 3 Big Ten titles, 0 national titles.
Bump Elliott: 51 wins (.547), 1 Big Ten title, 0 national titles.
As a "coach" and an embodiment of what our University and team stand for, however, Lloyd Carr is my #1. I don't know how to compare the teaching of men (although I suspect Bo is #1 and Lloyd #2), but Lloyd personifies the combination of class, winning, education, and priorities that our program means to the college football world (or at least to we alums). I will take Lloyd's record for my program any day, if it means avoiding Weis/Meyer/etc. He has made our tradition stronger, and for that we all owe him a debt of gratitude.
If the rumors are true re retirement, our program is in for major change a la 1969 (with Lloyd serving as the "I support the new guy" bridge no matter the hire, just as Bump did for Bo). We will get tougher and faster, but I worry about our character and tradition (not worry, but doubt it can remain as high as it is in the hands of anyone other than Carr).
Go Blue. Beat the Buckeyes.
I'm one of those who thinks we'll probably miss Carr. I don't love predictable running on first down. But I like it a whole lot better than NCAA probation, .500 seasons more frequently than every 20 years, or even just on-field TD celebrations. We have a lot to lose with this choice.
While we're looking ahead, is Paul Johnson someone who ought to be considered?
OSU receiving illegal benefits = charity.
Beyond reproach these OSU guys.
I would submit to you that OSU is a far more corporate athletics program than any other collegiete program. Hence they HAVE to win and will get away with more than others.
OSU is in fact a gigantic athletic program with a community college attached to it for the purpose of maintaining amateur status.
I live here. 18 television programs every week with Tressel's fluffers pimping OSU. About 30% of the Columbus Dispatch dedicated to OSU football crap...centerfolds and all!! 1460 The Fan propagandizing the greatness of all things OSU sports.
Way over the top for any college program. Is stupid. And corrupt as hell.
Poguemahone:
In the aftermath of The Mo Chronicles, the NCAA was poking around Columbus to figure out how all these players were getting paid $25/hour for landscaping jobs that didn't require "landscaping," "work," or "attendance." However, because the NCAA does not have subpoena power, everyone in Columbus just circled the wagons, and it blew over. In Ann Arbor, there are enough people who care about the integrity of the program that if something like that were to ever happen, as it did with the basketball program, there would be people around who would blow the whistle and cooperate. In Columbus, where the sole reason for existence is Buckeye football victory at all costs, this might never happen. I seem to remember a story about an OSU professor who was threatened when she tried to come clean about the pressures exerted on her by the University to help football players pass their classes. If this happened in Ann Arbor, the alumni would riot.
At Michigan, we are proud of a university and a football team, in that order. At tOSU, it's football uber alles.
All these Lloyd tributes by my fellow Michigan fans are approproiate and spot on......but i think somebody should throw a kudos out to our fearless leader Brian for not only breaking the story, but having the Les Miles-likes cojones to to actually run with it.
As a former journalist (albeit a burned out one who does not have the heart, figuratively or literally, to re-enter the field), I know how hard it is to mine sources and break real news..and it is much harder if you're a non traditional media outlet, like a blog...you're probably on pins and needles hoping this does not blow up in your face....even if it does, we'll still show up for your UFR's, anlaysis and bball live blogging.
Wait a minute, our record sucks when you live blog, so just scratch that last item :)
Now, back to your regularly scheduled OSU-UM flame war!
Carr's tenure at UofM has been one of CLASS. We better be ready to go through a couple of rough years while a new coach recruits players that fit his system.
MVM, I'm from Columbus as well, but apparently you've never been in Gainesville, Knoxville, Tuscaloosa, Detroit or any other city within 10-20 miles of a football powerhouse. All of those cities have the same qualities you mention with regard to the local media. You're singling out Columbus for no reason. There's nothing "corrupt" about what OSU does with regard to the local media, and if you honestly believe there is, then submit some proof other than saying "look at Tressel's YSU days!" As far as this corporate B.S., I'd like to see some facts you've gathered from the research skills you learned in your time at UM.
Plus, if you want to call a coach giving some of his own personal wealth to a disadvantaged kid with family trouble "illegal benefits", be my guest. IIRC, the kid in question played little to no B-Ball for OSU, mostly mop-up duty if anything.
I've always worried that the post-Carr era is going to be like the PRC between Mao and Deng: lots of instability, unrest and blood, followed a few years later by reform and progress. (Ken Lieberthal > Jim Tressel)
Assuming 1.) that Brian is correct, and 2.) reports about Lloyd not liking Les Miles are correct, the timing of this is very smart on Lloyd's part. He'd force Miles either to pull a Bill Frieder, or to lie.
STW, do you have any legitimate sources at all?
So, really, I want to know: How does an Ohio State fan rationalize Tressel's Youngstown tenure? Did he find Jesus and a sweatervest once he got to OSU or something?
Who the f*** cares what tOSU did to get its championship? Stop feeding the troll!
I, for one, am deeply saddened by this rumour, although the writing is obviously on the wall. Coach Carr is the best personification of what I think the University aspires to be. A great world-class university with a heavy dose of humility.
I just hope he does not have to go out with a loss against tOSU. Win one for the best coach the University has ever seen. (And may the next coach be even better.)
Brian,
I support "jamie mac"'s comments. It took balls to post this.
Please let us know the fall out (if any) you receive.
I don't think Carr has any more press meetings before the OSU game, so this was well timed. He shouldn't have to answer any questions about it. And it won't be given any credit by the "real media." So, it should all work out.
But that said, I bet feathers are ruffled.
Gainesville, Knoxville and Tuscaloosa are pretty small places compared to Columbus. They are basically college towns.
Columbus is not small, hasn't been for a while. It is the largest city in Ohio and it is quite ridiculous to be centered around a college sports program.
Detroit is nothing like C-Bus in its treatment of Michigan. Half the writers at the Free Press HATE Michigan. Read Drew Sharp.
In C-Bus a writer would be fired if he wrote a negative article (a seriously negative article) about OSU.
Woody Hayes, Tom Landry, Joe Paterno, the game changes and can make great coaches waning days sad to watch. Carr was a good coach and a class act. Tressel just has his number like Carr had Cooper's. I understand Franchione and Calahan will be looking for jobs soon. They would look good in maize and blue. GO BUCKS!
There is nothing more that can be said about the man that Coach Carr is. There is not a better man in the coaching ranks as Carr. Maybe better X's and O's coaches but none a better person than Lloyd. Not many men can say they've accomplished what Carr has done in his time as the head coach at a major college football team. I will miss Carr and wish him nothing but the best.
Carr's press conference transcript is up...
(not that I'm looking for tea leaves or anything)
http://mgoblue.com/
document_disp...cument_id=26064
lets be honest: CFB is about winning, and this game has taken big time talent and made them seem nothing but average.
The players do not play with the same determination as their counterparts south of them.
It's time for him to hang it up. Classy, sure, good coach, not really.
It's easy to justify Tressel if you're a Buckeye. It's easy to justify the later portion of Tom Osbourne's tenure at Nebraska too. It starts with W and rhymes with bins. It's the same anywhere--and probably would be here as well, like it or not.
Everyone thinks that they're a good person--I've justified the Fab Five to myself plenty of times.
That said, cheating will always be rampant in college football--we'll just have to hope to win clean, just like everyone else would like to.
I want a clean program, but we're not any more able to say the Wolverines than most teams are.
By the way, beat the Fucking Buckeyes--I hate those guys.
This is a stupid tangent. OSU is not dirty, any more than any other major program. We've had a ton of run-ins with the law in the last year; hell, Brian has a label for it: LEGAL ARRRGH ( http://mgoblog.blogspot.com/sear...l/legal%
20arrgh ). Why some Michigan fans keep insisting on this as the defining issue between the two programs is beyond me.
I think Tressel is a great coach and a great man. I have heard him speak on theology and his faith and respect him. He knows this tradition. It so happens that the world of college football is surrounded by people with no perspective - can you say Ed Martin?
Give it a rest. Let's hate the Buckeyes for valid reasons, not our illusions of purity.
Nice "sources". By "sources" you mean a post on a premium message board that said this week could have some big news sometime and everyone jumped on it saying Carr was out? You guys are a joke of a website if all you do is recycle what people close to the situation say and pawn it off as your own. Its good that people think they get the real info for free here but in reality they get a bunch of guesses with guys that have "sources" Name your sources if you think you have inside information. You guys are hacks.
Moron, do you think for a second Brian would publish that if there were a sliver of a chance it was untrue?
don't feed the trolls...
focus on the game. apparently lloyd will be doing just that...
"I think the truth is that there are no excuses.
There's just the game."
Let's calm down the hero worship. Lloyd has a solid record--but Bo and the immortal moderator at M Zone are our best coaches.
@ Brian Blows--
Unlike the premium message boards, Brian has to make damn sure he's right before posting this stuff. No one's locked into a subscription to read his site, he goes as far as his credibility takes him.
hmmm..... (more PC transcript)
"A lot of the guys said they want to win this game for you. How important is it for you to send them out as winners against Ohio State? ... "I think this program going back to Bo and probably before that, but certainly Bo built this program based on 'team.'
"And we share those great moments together, and they're special, and that's why you do all the work and put everything you have in terms of your heart, your mind, and your soul into trying to win. And if it doesn't work out that way, then you lose together.
"So for me, it's about Michigan. And I think for the guys on this team, on this staff, it's about Michigan.""
sorry if this was stated above, but thats A LOT to read to find something, but would lloyd retire after the season or after the fuckeye game?
Henne and Hart are gametime decisions. I can't see Hart being held out of this one...can anyone else? As for Henne, I just don't know. One things for sure, with Mallett vs. OSU, we're in for a world of hurt. A world.
@Brian Blows......um, "regular" media folk constantly report stuff w/ unnamed sources or the familiar 'people close to situation' tag......why call Brian out for something his brethern in the traditional media do all the time.....and, really, traditional media is there just to regurgitate press releases and talking points, they are a sham and a shell of what great journalism used to come out of our dailies a generation ago.
Brian represents the growing new media movement.....if this blows up in his face, he will write a mea culpa, which is more than regular journalists or talk show hosts do when their info proves bogus.
Clear eyes, full hearts, can't lose...
Applies to this game, if in fact Carr is retiring. It is a sad occasion mostly b/c we don't know what will follow. Tradition upheld, in every sense of the word? I love that I never have to defend our coaches for shady activities (unlike tOSU). I would hate to have to start... Can you imagine if we had something like the Franchione newsletter? My god, the shit would hit the fan and cover everyone's face...
@ Brian Blows
Awww is someone from Rivals or Scout all upset about Brian scooping this?? wah wah wah
Thank you, Michigan Dan. You put into words what I've basically been trying to illustrate: Michigan isn't above anyone when it comes to "dirty". OSU is certainly no angel, but it isn't Miami, Florida State or Colorado.
"I don't understand why the questions about your future persist. You want to be at Michigan next year, do you not? ... "The only thing on my mind is this game.""
(sorry for repeated posting of transcript details... just for ease of reference)
You know, I was with the rest of the bandwagon lusting for Les Miles but when I actually read the headline, my heart sank a little bit.
My first Michigan game (I was nine at the time) was against Virginia in '95, coincidentally, Lloyd's first game.
I can't imagine how emotional it's going to be in that locker room before the game, and what he will say to the kids before they go out.
Alex, I'm with you. I am ready for a change but I still very much like Lloyd Carr and will be sad to see him go. There has been so much talk about it but seeing that headline made it real for the first time. I really hope he gets to ride off the field on the shoulders of Long and Kraus after a victory against OSU.
Michigan's near-death penalty (forfeiting every win, B10 titles and banners, etc.) for the basketball team was self-imposed, in the hope that the NCAA would view the self-punishment as sufficient. No other university has or would have done the same.
That's the "Michigan difference."
Thank you Meeechigan Dan. No more troll feeds people!
I skimmed the Carr interview and he didn't answer the "ya leavin?" question. I take that as at least a "likely, I'll decide for sure Sunday" or a "yep". If you aren't leaving you say so. (Unless you are Nick Saban or any other classless liar.)
I honestly think Carr would bench Hart if the doctors question whether he would seriously aggravate the injury. He has been around long enough to realize it isn't worth a pro career or a several-level drop in the draft if he is likely to reaggravate it and end up on the sidelines or worse. Tressel said in his conference today that Hart has as many yards as Beanie Wells and Beanie plays every game.
I just finished watching Michigan Replay/Buckeye Weekly. Both coaches are top of the line when it comes to class. I think we can all attest to that.
That being said, I wish all the buckeyes the worst of luck with everything but injuries. Here's to a healthy Michigan win.
Anyone who is up for a bar crawl Friday night, I imagine I will be starting at the Heidelberg for happy hour. Can't be free nachos and wings with 2 bottles of $2 Arcadia Ales.
restating: kudos for the announcement. i, for one, will read irregardless (ha!) of the voracity (ha ha!) of this post.
that said, i wouldn't bet against it....i've always thought this was the last year...ever since 2003/4 or so. and Carr has been, over his 13 year career, a GREAT coach. there is no debating this.
and i would very much like to hear of any shite brian takes for this. i don't need names (i can figure that out myself), but still. no one @ scout, rivals, or any local media outlet is too happy about this. scoop!
Alex, and the others that had that "sinking heart" feeling---I couldn't say it any better. I will however, make an attempt--and please pardon my stream of consciousness style...
I have watched Michigan football ever since I was able to reach the tv controls, but my formative years coincided with Lloyd's start. His influence on the university, the young men he coached, and the fans is unquestioned. He never tired of raising money for great causes, never worried that he wasn't compensated the way other big program coaches are, NEVER embarassed the University of Michigan, always said the right thing (even when he said it was a "stupid question"---he was right), and even though he never played at Michigan and wasn't from Michigan---he will ALWAYS be exactly what Bo always wanted -- a MICHIGAN man.
His Press Conference quote to me, even if I am taking it out of context, says it all:
"So for me, it's about Michigan. And I think for the guys on this team, on this staff, it's about Michigan."
Here's to Lloyd Carr for Athletic Director--because from here on out it has to be about Michigan.
here here detUmich
Alex,
Ironically that was also my first game and on an every weireder note I was also nine years old then.
I have known nothing but LC as the coach of michigan football, he is the ultimate in class and is the definition of a michigan man. Ive been wanting Les all year but it will be tough to see LC go.
GO BLUE or if Les comes then GEAUX BLUE
I realize nobody is actually still posting tonight, but i'm trying to remember my first M game. It was against Miami (the real one). we were up until late and then gave it away at the end. I can't find any database that gives me the answer, but i'd appreciate anyone giving me the year this occured. Late 80's early 90's . Thank you.
http://www.cfbdatawarehouse.com/...s.php?
year=1985
I'm guessing the September 17, 1988 game against the Canes, Miami 31, Michigan 30?
Mine was September 25, 1993, Michigan 42, Houston 21. My first game as a student was on my 18th birthday against the Illini, which was pretty cool.
@Patrick.....that game was in september 1988. Miami scored the last 16 points to beat us w/ carlos huerta kicking the game winning.
We had lost to ND in the Reggie Ho game the week before. Both of these losses sting to this day, but dont they all!
Miami and ND spent much of the season #1 and #2......and were ranked such after our Miami loss......people said we were the best 0-2 team in the land......nobody was saying that about us this year.
'88 team won the big 10 and won the Rose Bowl over USC....Mike Taylor was the starter most of the year at QB, but due to injury Demetrius Brown started the Rose Bowl.....Leroy Hoard MVP of that game, IIRC.
1) I don't think we have a ton of room to talk about thug players in a season where we finished in the top half of the leaderboard of the Fulmer Cup. Granted, that's unusual, and Lloyd usually booted those guys off the team, or handed out suspensions for minor run-ins, but they were doing this stuff nonetheless.
2) Lloyd was a credit to the University. Sometimes the game just ends up passing a coach by on the X's and O's (Lloyd & company can still recruit) -- look at what's happened to Florida State, for example. But he never embarrassed the University and always represented all of us well, and for a while was an excellent coach (and still isn't too shabby). I hope he's still involved in the athletic department, I'm guessing asst. AD, as he still belongs in the Michigan athletics family.
@ jamie mac & Yostal,
Thanks guys. I still have the foam helmet that doesn't fit anyone. 1988 makes sense, b/c i can barely remember (YOB: 1979). It paved the way for me eventually getting my grades to the level of M. I too was saddened (despite my frustration) by Brian's post.
@ Meechigan Dan re: Tressel's integrity.
I submit the following:
http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/ne...tory?
id=1920867
http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/ne...tory?
id=1919258
Just saying...
88 - Michigan - Miami. A classic heartbreaker. Stirs the emotions just thinking about it...
Go Blue. I'm not sold on any particular replacement for Carr. I don't want Tedford, I'm luke warm on Kelly (sounds like he's basically a used carr salesman), and Les Miles seems like a fool at times. I will hope this rumor is not true, but I suspect it is.
My advice though, would be to let Carr participate in choosing his successor. He's at least earned that much.
FYI, Miles voted for Florida over Michigan in last years NC game. I say the best would be for LSU to end up in the Rose against Michigan and then we can have a LIVE interview for the job.
My first game was at home against Notre Dame -- September (4th?), 1999.
I grew up a mid-range Irish fan and had my enrollment deposit in the mail to ND, when a last-minute plea by my uncle, a Michigan alum, swung my decision.
Being in the marching band, I was cleansed of my ND loyalty two weeks prior to the game. When the incoming students met with the veteran band members and we played The Victors, I had tears in my eyes and KNEW...
Hence, Lloyd has been my coach since my redemption. I'll take his departure a little hard and hope he'll have me over for a beer sometime.
"Kelly (sounds like he's basically a used carr salesman)"
He's a winner wherever he's coached - much like our Beilein. Used car salesman is Pete Carroll -- "i'm jacked.. the kids are pumped!"
if true, Coach Carr will be remembered as an outstanding coach and representative to the University and his profession.
My first game was the opener in 2000 against Bowling Green (I believe when Navarre tied a school record with 4 TD passes in his first game). I grew up in East Lansing and was a strong MSU fan. My feelings towards Michigan were still lukewarm after I got accepted until I walked into the Big House for the first time. I was hooked from then on. I also remember my first thought after the game was over was, "It's nice to cheer for a winner now" :)
First game: Jan 1, 1998 in Pasadena, CA. Needless to say it was an unforgettable experience.
Lloyd Carr is all class and he will be missed. It's comforting to know that he'll be sticking around in some capacity.
Judging by how many comments this is going to generate we might as well call it the "Lloyd Carr Retirement Open Thread."
I think a lot of the reasons why I like Lloyd are summed up in this comment at his press conference today (when questioned about his interpretation of the call on crable's second personal foul):
"It wasn't an interpretation, it was a bad call... And the reason, if I might defend my behavior, the reason I was so adamant was because I was certainly expecting that play to be run again. So what, are we going to have a 15-yard penalty every time they run the option? ... Because when we run the option this week, I do not want Henne hit like that."
While I've felt like we've needed to go in a different direction in coaching for a couple years now, Lloyd has always been a class act and a great representative of U of M. I actually hope he will still be associated with the program despite no longer being in the coaching role.
I will miss Carr's approach to the program, not his approach to the game. Hopefully the next coach is also the type to stand up for his players...and hopefully he is more polite with the media. Also, I hope the next coach is more concerned about coaching his team on gameday than he is about abusing officials. Those guys on Saturday were bad but at least they weren't from the Sun Belt.
Lloyd Carr is a good person and all that. You do have to admire his charitable work and his probity of mind. Nonetheless, the disdain with which he treated the press and other persons outside the program shows an arrogance that takes away form much of the good. Few other coaches in America come off as poorly as Carr does when confronted with the press and at times this put a damper on the program and reeked of hubris. When a person retires we tend to only look at their best attributes, but a closer look shows that he was flawed much like the rest of us. The confounding theme is that he was at times generous and classy but also supercillious and contemptuous.
Bill Martin will neither confirm nor deny:
http://blog.mlive.com/
wolverines..._speculati.html
Which means it's a sure thing.
I'll pre-face this with the fact that I'm a Buckeye. I live in Ann Arbor and I think LLLLLoyd has done a fine job at a proud Big Ten school. I find it hard to cheer for UM, but I will in some cases because I'm also a Big Ten fan. I, like most, have been sorry to see the recent slide in the conference performance and hope see the top tier teams: UM, Penn St., MSU, Iowa, return to glory. I just want the SEC and Pac-10 to shut up. I hope UM won't go the path that a Nebraska or a Notre Dame have gone down. I like to see a good game and a heated rivalry every November. Les Miles or a "Michigan Man" would certainly help that out, but whoever you get to replace Carr, I just hope he doesn't run the team into the ground.
And remember, Nick Saban is always taking offers.
Re: Recruiting.
Assuming that this all does turn out to be the case, it will be interesting to see what kind of role (if any) Lloyd keeps in the athletic program. He can certainly write his own ticket for anything short of AD - the question is will he want to?
If he stays as an assistant AD or some sort of adviser to the football program, I think that'd be a big help in keeping the recruiting class together.
Now if only the new coach can hire someone that can do a better job with the O line...
Mine was '95, I was on a college visit to the school (obviously ended up going, to), and got to see Timmy Biakabatuka eviscerate the Bucks with 300+ yards. I think that game was the single thing that made me decide to enroll.
Bama fan here but I've always liked Mich. A school with lots of class that is/has been enhanced by Lloyd Carr. He will be missed. As for Miles, well I want Lester to stay right where he is. He will eventually run LSU into being a mediocre program. If I were a Mich. fan, I'd be gunning for Tedford or maybe Paul Johnson (as a long shot). Here's to hoping you guys beat the crap outta OSU. Overrated with a pathetically easy schedule. Any group of fans that can idolize a thug like Woody Hayes deserves to lose every game.
Saturday. Make plays.
@Zach:
First, except for the "LLLLLLLoyd" - a fairly decent post from a buckeye. However...
Michigan is in no need of a "return to glory." We were undefeated and ranked second in the country at this time last year. We've had a down season, but we've been to 3 of the last 4 Rose Bowls and are playing on Saturday to get to a 4th out of 5.
Don't lump us into a category with MSU, PSU, Iowa, and Notre Dame and talk about returning to glory. Lloyd is retiring. He's not resigning. He's not being fired. This isn't a program that needs to be resurrected.
last three comment threads have to be a record for most posts in a back to back to back set of articles. anyone else read through them all yet?
MillerTime is on the money. if you look at the big picture, Michigan has been one of the top programs in the country before and during carr's tenure, including a national championship, a 30-some year bowl streak, etc. sure, the playcalling can be paleozoic at times, but having watched Michigan football since the tail-end of the Bo era, its all i've ever known. coach carr has done the program and the university proud and i hope the next guy does this tradition justice.
Zach,
You're the man!
I live in PAC 10 land and fly my Buckeyes flag on my house and I got T-P'd last year, which my neighbors thought had to do with my OSU flag. Yeah, whatever. I remember high school.
PAC 10 and SEC are good at the top but thinner as divisions than they or the national media think. I think we'll see Illinois or Wisconsin as #3 in conference beat SEC #3's and certainly PAC 10 #3. We shall see.
One thing I haven't seen touched on here which hurts us both: the big 10 has GOT to start to seriously think about the schedule and the huge layoffs we are ALL facing before bowl games. It is a ball and chain to have these huge layoffs when the other guys (Big 12, SEC, whatever) are only laid off about 4 weeks. Get with it Big 10, you are not an island. Archie Griffin had an ESPN interview the other day and stated pretty much the same. He remembered from Nov 17th-ish to Jan 1st being a long time!
so I am hearing scuttlebut that Miles negatively recruited michigan by stating Carr had a life threatening illess....it would be hard to believe any "Michigan Man" could do that to his own, and if true then I would not want that person in charge of the program...
Message for Robert:
Fuk Yoo.
What if Miles was just telling them the truth that was not being revealed elsewhere? Then what would you think?
(I don't have any inside information -- this is hypothetical.)
Scuttlebutt on Miles has always been that he's a dirty recruiter and flirts with the line on NCAA standards. Always hard to say for sure because this is stuff that gets discussed among coaches and isn't transparent from the outside; for all we know this angle could come from someone with an ax to grind. I know Brian flipped his opinion on Miles, but I find it unimaginable that Michigan would hire the guy.
Maybe Russell Crowe will be our new coach, so that Lloyd can still motivate from the sideline
Re: Miles, it has to be considered the source of the rumor. It has long been assumed that Carr didn't like Miles. I don't think it's that big a leap to say that those close to Carr feel the same way. So if the source of the Miles dirty recruiting rumors is people close to Carr and the program, I think that those rumors need to be taken with a large grain of salt. Brian has stated as much in the past.
Oh its all coming together now.
Michigan wins Saturday, goes to the Rose Bowl. Oregon to the MNC game. WVU wins the Big East and gets picked by the Rose Bowl, because OK has to go the the Fiesta Bowl.
Lloyd goes out proper-like in a four hour long flash of brilliance never before seen by college football fans. The post game interview goes something like this:
"Coach Carr, how did you get your team so prepared to stop the spread-option and really dominate today when that style seems to have had you completely bedeviled until now?"
"Aw hell, stopping that crap is easy, we could have..you know, the thing is...you just need... now the quarterback is a runner in that offense. So he's a runner first, and now you have two guys back there that can run, so we worked all month on....the thing about the spread is you have to be able to contain a mobile quarterback, and we were able to do that today. Graham played lights out today, Jamar...Brandent, I think Donovan Warren got better today...I think Brandon Graham had probably the best game of his career there. You know, we could have been doing it all along if we tried. But that's not football......"
(Coach Stripling streaks into view behind Carr)
"Go to hell you pinko commies!!!!! I got your spread right here muthafuckas!!!!"
Errr, the source of the rumor has to be considered.
other chris,
i assumed it was true when I posted it, how could someone make something like that up...
even true I find it disgusting, reprehensible.....it sounded like it came from a very informed source, even more so then this blog.
I didn't mean to say that Michigan needs a return to glory; I phrased that wrong. I hope the other teams in the Big Ten can return to glory and that it's not at the expense of UM with a new coach. Michigan has had great seasons recently, even when they lose to tOSU it is in a close game. I really hope they don't bring in an ex-NFL guy like Nebraska or ND. I don't particularly think Miles is a great coach from the little of his work I've watched -- what other coach with half a brain throws that pass when the field goal wins the game???!! However, you can't argue with his success (except maybe that atleast part of it is SEC-media inflation).
LES MILES/HOUSE Rumors: Okay, so I saw this posted near the beginning of the thread and thought I would comment. I heard nothing of this either, until last friday, when my father, an attorney with an office in the ann arbor area, mentioned that Les Miles had just bout a house in Saline. Now, my dad is not the type to read message boards or post or anything like that, so there's no way he got the information from there. Hearing it from him then and seeing it hear now makes me wonder if there is some legitimacy to it. Either way, I think it's a foregone conclusion that Miles is our next head coach. So lets enjoy it.
haha. Brad . 2 things..
* Lloyd didn't say "tremendous"
* commies quote was by Steve Szabo
I still don't know about the house rumor. I mean, false rumors have existed a long time. Remember when word got around by mouth? A long time ago I know, but it was just as inaccurate then as now. No reason to assume Les Miles is the coach still.
Dear God Bill, have you gone mad?
Do Not Pursue Tedford.
Do Pursue Pete Carroll
Those bastards in Saline don't let you search by the name of the property owner.
Not even mentioning the fact that, yes you got to 3 of the past 4 Rose Bowls, but you lost them. Especially the ones to USC, gotta rep against USC. Hopefully, tOSU can the next two years, we have them scheduled in a home and home.
I just turned on for the first time today. Lloyd's leaving. Surreal. Expected it all year, but didn't believe it. And even after 12 years, I can't figure out wether I hate him or love him. Nice guy & all, but crap. What the hell was he? Awesome? Suck? I can't tell.
what other coach with half a brain throws that pass when the field goal wins the game???!!
Charlie Weis against Navy?
A different first game tale: I grew up in Ohio as a "mild" Buckeye fan, as my father possessed a master's degree in psych. from (name of school redacted). I visited Ann Arbor as a peripatetic hippie (redundancy, of course) just in time for the 1973 Hash Bash, fell in love with the town, and moved there later that summer.
My first game experience was the infamous UM - tOSU travesty. I was not yet a Michigan fan and, riding my bicycle on the way to the game, could not figure out why no one was out and about anywhere except near the stadium. The main thing I remember about that day, except for the rather somber weather and the repulsively political outcome of the AD vote, was Michigan's utter domination of the second half and, of course, the failed field goals.
I must confess that I did not become a true fanatic for a couple of more years, but, if my wife's testimony is true, I have long been in need of some kind of serious rebalancing when it comes to Michigan football, a fact of personality that may never change, and that leads me to both honor Lloyd Carr for the excellent man and very good coach that he has been as well as to fervently hope that we will see some out-of-the-box thinking on the part of our Athletic Department.
I just keep thinking that if they can hire Beilein, there may yet be hope for joy in Mudville ...
The comments about Urban Meyer and speculation that Michigan last year "deserved" and would "risen to the occasion" or some other laughable wishful thinking are just pathetic. Michigan wasn't half the team the Gators were last year. And its that sense of entitlement that screwed Michigan this year as well.
I gained more affection for Lloyd Christmas when he gave that press conference with Russell Crowe. He may be an idiot, but he is a class act.
Jim Tressel, meanwhile, looks like an SS officer. Think about it, its true.
Illinois beating the perennially overrated OSU (that should be their name: tpoOSU) shows exactly why you should want Les Miles to be your coach. SEC athleticism and attitude--what the Zookster brought to Champagne--dominates the tired old Big Ten. But I doubt Miles will take the job.
Carr, now emphasizing Henne and Hart are game day calls. He is too predictable. He plays with the media. We all know that Henne and Hart were never going to play fully against Wisconsin, and we all know that unless Henne is bleeding from both eyes and Hart has a fracture in his one good leg, they are both going to play the entire game on Saturday. It's on Boys. We're going to walk all over the Bucks this year. I guarantee that old Lloyd has something up his sleeve for this one. It wouldn't suprise me if our lack of focus at the beginning of the year was due to focusing on the Buckeyes from the start and assuming that we could still win our other games with less preparation. After Oregon and App State, the message was clear and we went back to one game at a time until wham, last weekends game was a lost cause. This team, Henne and Hart, Crable and Long especially have been preparing for this game since the end of the game last year. We didn't play well in the Rose because we were preparing for this game. So, no excuses Carr is going to go out owning Tressle 45-17.
And then we can say in Carr's record agains tressle, Carr has more points for than against. Right now Carr is down 21, but after Saturday he will be up by 7 points if we win 45-17
Definitely going to miss lloyd. i kept quiet while everyone tossed out cheap shots aimed at carr all year. i hope everyone remembers where this program was headed when lloyd took over. without him, we would have been the first powerhouse to fall from grace, before alabama, nebraska, etc. instead, he took a handful of years to bring us a national championship.
and speaking of 'bama, lloyd never once neared ncaa violations or probation.
regardless of what the next coach achieves (or doesn't achieve), we should all thank lloyd for his years in A2.
Now lets send him out with a win. Go Blue!!
I wonder what kind of reception a Michigan coach who finished better than 6-6 against OSU, 5-7 in bowl games and 2-10 in his last 6 years worth of OSU/bowl contests would receive? I wish I could lose more than 50% of the biggest battles I face in my job and still be considered a legend worthy of having a field named after me when I retire.
Lloyd was a fine man but geesh, he was adored by Ohio State for crying out loud. Good luck Lloyd, it was an ok run, thanks for running a clean program. Next season will bring more anticipation than any before it in the last 20 years.
Let's please replace Gittleson first and foremost...our guys continue to be outclassed physically. Please hire a real speed coach. Please hire a real offensive line coach and new coordinators (who also understand the spread offense and how to defend it).
A new era begins...let's just make sure Mike Debord is on another planet.
I wonder what kind of reception a Michigan coach who finished better than 6-6 against OSU, 5-7 in bowl games and 2-10 in his last 6 years worth of OSU/bowl contests would receive? I wish I could lose more than 50% of the biggest battles I face in my job and still be considered a legend worthy of having a field named after me when I retire.
Lloyd was a fine man but geesh, he was adored by Ohio State for crying out loud.
Anonymous | 11.12.07 - 9:51 pm | #
Bo was 5-12 in bowl games and 11-9-1 against Ohio State.
Lloyd was 5-7 in bowl games and 6-6 against Ohio State.
Lloyd also won a national championship, which Bo never did. I think it's time for Lloyd to hang them up, but he certainly deserves the credit he's receiving.
On a lighter note, any possibility we can have Charlie Weis as our next coach? I'd love to have a "decided schematic advantage" each time we take the field.
"In his first 6 seasons, he won 1 National Title, 3 Big Ten Titles, and went 5-1 against his arch rival."
This describes EXACTLY both Jim Tressel and Lloyd Carr.
Buckeyes, enjoy it while it lasts.
Speaking of coaches, what do people think of Loefler? Do you think his hands are tied cause of Debord. Is he just all hype and can recruit?
I don't know about him anymore. I think he would be worth keeping, rather have him as the link from Carr to the new coach more than anyone else.
Loeffler couldn't carry DeBord's lunch box if that tells you anything. NEW BLOOD!
As a recent post indicates Bo + Carr = 27-34-1 in OSU and Bowl games. Is that record good enough to give the job to someone in the immediate family?
I knew I'd last longer than my dear friend Lloyd....longer w/ Big Fresh!!!
-JoePa
We have all been talking at least since Appy State that it was fait accompli that Lloyd was leaving at the end of the year. I expected that he would stick around to spite anyone who thinks he should go.
Brian is not one to print baseless rumor so I trust this information, but I am still a little surprised that he is retiring.
I expect Les Miles to be named the new Michigan coach by the end of January after perfunctory interviews are given to Mike Deboerd (who will be Lloyd's choice), Loeffler, Moeller Ron English and Corwin Brown.
Prior to hiring Beilein, I had little faith in Martin, but I really think that even if he were tempted to keep it in house, the fact that Les Miles will accept the job lets him off the hook for not giving it to one of Lloyd's cronies. Forget Tedford. I think Miles will be the only out of house candidate inteviewed.
I think the bowl records get messed with a bit, especially in Bo's case, because you have to remember how many times they would go out to play in the Rose Bowl only to face UCLA or USC in what was basically a home game for them. That doesn't really help matters -- if both teams are good you would expect the home team to win a good chunk of those games
I want to thank Lloyd and will help support a naming of the stadium after him. He is a great man. He is one of the great leaders that I have ever known as a role model. There are very few of them in the public eye currently. He made Urban Meyer look like a teenage punk last year. The contrast in interviews was classic. I can't even look at a Florida game without chuckling. He will always be remembered in this household long after he in gone. He is second to Bo only.
Hey Old Fan, yesterday you mentioned I had "lost credibility" b/c I said in one of my posts Navarre was a Top 10 recruit. Please read the attached. Scroll down to the prep part.
http://mgoblue.com/bio.cfm?bio_i...el=3& season=227
We have known for some time, at least a year and a half or so, that this was coming. I've expected that Lloyd would retire with this class -- that he wanted to see through Jake, Hart, and Henne. It will be sad to see Lloyd go.
I remember the last play of the Virgina game like yesterday. In the Northeast corner of the endzone Dreisbach to Merc. That was a hell of first game, and forshadowed so much of what was to come. After Lloyd's first three seasons, I was one who said, if we lose four games again its time for him to go.
Since then, Lloyd has led Michigan football a national championship, rose bowls, orange bowl, top 10 finishes, and continually in the national title picture. I think it's been a great ride.
And, while some of you don't see it this way, I look at Lloyd as a great coach. I remember Bo. I remember Mo. I have been a season ticket holder since 1988. Moeller had an offensive philosophy that many of the posters on this board would yearn for. We thew the ball a lot. We were pretty darn aggressive. But, do remember how many delay of game calls we had?
And for Bo, the man was a great coach, and a great human being. A fiery competitor. Not afraid to say it like it was, even in public. Lloyd is, to me, every bit the coach that Bo was.
I have led a relatively charmed life. But right up there in the top moments for me are our victory over OSU in 97 and the Rose Bowl win 1/1/98.
On top of all of these football accomplishments, Lloyd Carr is a tremendous person. A tremendous human being. I will miss Lloyd Carr. I wish him the best as an assitant a.d. I hope his health holds out and that he is maintains a prominent and recognizable position with the U, as did Bo.
On Friday night, before the game, raise a glass of your favorite beverage to Lloyd and remember the great games and great times he has brought to all of us. After the game, raise a glass to Michigan's victory over tofu and yet another Rose Bowl.
Go Blue. Thankyou Lloyd.
Let me try that again...
http://mgoblue.com/bio.cfm?bio_i...el=3&
season=227
Honors and Rankings ... selected honorable mention All-USA by USA Today ... named to SuperPrep Magazine All-American team ... rated the No. 69 player overall in the country by Prep Football Report and as No. 5 pro-style quarterback nationally by the publication
Guys, can anyone link me or send me a higher quality version (better than the first link which results from a Google search) of a Hail to the Victors .mp3?
a k a r p o @umich.edu
Thanks
WOLVERINES!!! KNOW THY ENEMY!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1...h?
v=1h_lxJHL9Ac
If this is indeed true, then i want to thank Lloyd for all he has done at UM, and for the way he lead young mean and helped prepare them for life.
Thank's Lloyd. Go out in style!
BEAT THE BUCKS!!!
Interesting comment above about Les Miles negative recruiting with "Lloyd having a health issue" and then other Chris' comment of "What if Miles was just telling them the truth that was not being revealed elsewhere?".
I say this because late last week a fellow employee at work came to me. This employee is a passionate, but very level headed and well spoken tOSU fan (actually was an i dotter), and his brother lives in Detroit. He always loves to talk UM/OSU/B-10 to me. He came to my desk one day last week and said that his brother had heard (friend of a friend, 2nd hand info) that Lloyd was sick. He asked me if I'd ever heard anything like that. I said that I hadn't heard even an inkling of that, but that doesn't necessarily mean anything, as I only read certain sites and do not pay subscription fees for "Inside Info". I figured that if something like that was out there, it would be pretty hard to keep under wraps.
Has anyone else heard anything that relates to Lloyd's well being or health? Not trying to give fuel to the rumor machine, just honestly asking if there was ever any scuttlebutt out there that I may not have seen at some point? I'd hope that Lloyd's health is fine...
Go Blue!
Woof, Coach Carr was good but naming the stadium after him? You'll sleep on that and rethink I am sure.
People, people remember we are ALL HUMAN and since we all have had a job, a boss and a life (except you 3rd grader spitters from both sides I see here, unfortunately) a good or great person has his/her run and then, uh, goes to average then (unless you're Joe Pa or named Bowden) somebody screams for the hook. Some get the hook prematurely, some not, some resign some have a comeback which is always brief. This is life.
No injuries to you, we shall beat you fair & square.
Lloyd owned us until Tressel, now the tables are turned and next year they may start to turn again. Who knows???
@ jvocke
I've heard Parkinson's for years now, but nothing other than that
eek, excuse my punctuation and english, I meant preview but I'm tired...
@ jvocke
Sometime in the past year (and I can't remember if it was the end of last year or the middle of this one), a relative of mine said she had heard something similar about Carr being ill.
Coaches:
Les Miles is going to be the coach unless he turns it down---BOOK IT.
If no Miles, Marty turns to:
1) Brian Kelly, U-Cincinnati
2) Norm Chow, Tennessee Titans
3) Rich Rodriquez, West Virginia
@jvocke & andrea
I can only believe that if more than one person heard it and it was true, THOUSANDS would have heard it. I heard a couple years ago that he had a brain tumor. It was from some buckstache trash gloating over a win.
@pecoshelga
We lost this weekend without our star QB and RB. What's your excuse? Don't be so sure of your Buckeyes just yet.
I've never really liked Lloyd as a coach, but he's got class, and I hope he goes out with a win on Saturday.
@mgobleu
You may still be without both your starting QB and running back.
Our excuse? Since everybody has 'em: we have a 1st yr QB and hey, this was our rebuilding year where you guys were gonna fight it out with Wisc for a Nat'l championship or at least the Big 10 title, remember? And I think Illinois is an improving team. Does 8-3 look familiar?
If we don't shore up the running defense, pass rush, etc and Hart starts I'll worry. But not until then.
I do realize you have been hobbled and still look pretty hobbled.
You will be outcoached Saturday. Sorry, but Bo died last year and the result was the same despite high emotion. I flew back for the game and sat with my brother the Traitor (er, your fellow fan).
Oh, and what's interesting is that home field has made little difference in the last 20+ years of the rivalry.
the house he bought is in barton hills. he recently (last week) became a member at barton hills. this is from a creditable source.
@Mike
I like Norm Chow getting a mention. People overlook him way too often. Someone really needs to give him a chance as a Head Coach, he's earned that. That being said, Les Miles is my first and second choice for Michigan.
Blue Faithful
I wasn't saying Loefler should get the HC job, just asking the question if you thought Loefler should be asked to stay on and be the OC.
So I see I have 1 vote for NO lol
Norm Chow is like 60 already.
Loeffler - Yes, stay on. Blue chip QBs love him. If you can pull in Henne and Mallett by yourself along with developing numerous other NFL bound QBs and when Tom Brady credits you as part of his success, you've gotta be for real.
As for him being OC...I'm gonna go with no, but I hope he still has an integral role in the offense still (and especially with the QBs, obviously).
Fat Bastard I can't get through all the posts tonight but I hope there were more like yours.
Coach Carr has given all of himself to the University and to the kids he's led. It's never been about him, though his critics, even those from the early years who hated the man from down river, have always made it about him. He has never promoted himself though in July ESPN named his team over the last decade the 6th best in the country.
He is not Bo, he is not bigger than life but his accomplishments are as big as the mythical standards so called fans beat him over the head with. He ego did not hold the University hostage for bigger contracts or flirtations with other jobs. He did not seek the spotlight that lesser coaches have used to enrich themselves.
If this is indeed it for the best coach I have watched lead my beloved Wolverines, it is a sad day. And to all his critics who wet themselves in excitement over the latest hot shot without an 1/8 of his experience, I say go to hell.
You won't have any idea on asst coaches who stays/goes until the new head honcho is picked. Then there are interviews, some go, others asked to stay. Depends on whether its a changing of the guard or the new revolution.
And it depends on the type of head coach, ie: Tressel was a quarterback coach so old quarterback coach gets the hook without much thought. Many will see it coming and are already sending out feelers as we debate...it's probably more of a corporate environment than we realize. If you are in marketing, you can probably relate to all this pretty well. You're the Toast of the town: but then, stockholder scapegoat 5 years later.
All I have to say to Coach Carr is Thank You. He kept Michigan's standards high in all aspects. He was not only a coach to his players but a father. He graduated not only top notch football players but top notch men. Coach Carr was a blessing to the Michigan program in disguise. He kept the Michigan Man standard alive. It is this standard that puts Michigan far above the rest when it comes to character. Best wishes to you Coach Carr, I would love to see you as the next AD. Go Blue! and FIGHT LIKE HELL FOR MICHIGAN!
If you Michigan fan want a name that strikes heart into the fear of every Buckeye CFB enthusiast, you go with Norm Chow. He developed Carson Palmer into the 3rd best overall QB in the NFL, and along with your assistant coach who developed Brady, he could turn Mallett into the destroyer of worlds. I'm just sayin'.
Hiring anybody 60 or over to coach college football at a top 10 school is simply dumb. Guess I better tear up that HR supervisor application before the EEOC get me (actually I was my company's EEOC officer for a year, yeech.)
Sorry, but this job belongs to an up-and-coming guy.
However, if you want that route, Dennis Erickson's year lease on a house near Arizona State is due up soon. His record this year is the same as Miles, plus he has Big 10 experience. His bags are always packed, ready to go And boy, does he have a lot of baggage!
KGH10. How could Tom Brady credit Scot Loeffler for his success? They went to school at the same time. Loeffler graduated in 1997 and Brady graduated in 2000. Loeffler took the QB Coaching job in 2002. I doubt Brady owes anything to Scot Loeffler with the exception of not taking away any snaps from him in practice. He may be a decent recruiter as evidenced by Henne gushing about him when accepting the offer but his coaching skills are suspect at best. On the one hand there is Navarre, and the other is Henne. Whether or not Mallett turns out to be a decent QB is still TBD as well. I say bye-bye Loeffler.
One thing I'll remember from this season was the former players greeting the team as they got off the bus before the ND game and Aaron Shea stopping Coach Carr to shake his hand.
"He's the best coach I've ever had in my whole career," said Shea. "I wish him luck, and I truly love that man."
http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.d...0688/1054&
imw=Y
Eight wins removed from the context of that moment, everyone here should go back and read what they posted about Coach Carr that week and compare it to what Shea had to say (and what you're saying now). It seems clear to me that people outside the program have no idea what's really going on inside of Schembechler Hall or how much Coach Carr means to the program and his players. I wonder how many of LSU's players would say they love Les Miles.
Any truth to the rumors of the game being pushed back to 3:30 for TV?
If my memory serves be right, both Brady and Griese (somehow he is still playing) were coached by Stan Parrish as QB coach. I know he wasn't very popular as an offensive coordinator, but you can't argue what he's done with quarterbacks. Nate Danis at Ball State might turn out to be something special. I know it's just a MAC school, but it is the same MAC school Michigan almost lost to last year.
Jeff Tedford isn't coming here. Not if there's a God in Heaven. He's won nothing, anywhere. I welcome our soon to be new, ballsy overlord.
I'm just stunned at the crap that's coming out of WolverRoudy.
This guy can't be for real.
Graduate Assistant BLUE FAITHFUL. He worked a lot with Griese, Brady, Henson, Navarre, Henne, and now Mallett. The last two guys he recruited, and he just picked up another Elite 11 QB (Weinke). Say what you want about Chad, but he is a SMART quarterback. If anything holds him back the most, it's his body, not his mind, as he is one of the least talented athletically out of all recent QBs (except for Navarre, probably). Look at Gutierrez too, he played ONE year in college football at a small program, and he has taken snaps in the NFL already. Now, unless he's supremely talented, most of what he learned about the quarterbacking position was taught by Loeffler. It's not like he gained anything from massive amounts of competitive game experience. What he did with Navarre was obviously amazing, considering what Navarre was early in his career until the end...you cannot, absolutely cannot attribute that solely to experience.
And please, before you knock my research, try doing a bit of yours BLUE.
"It's the same quality that has made Brady the most successful Michigan product ever, despite his lowly draft status. Brady was two years behind Griese in Ann Arbor and served as Griese's primary backup when the Wolverines won the 1997 national championship. There was a reunion of that team last March that Griese attended along with Brady and Michigan quarterbacks coach Scott Loeffler, also a reserve on that team.
Griese recalled how Loeffler would stay after practice and work with Brady every day to make sure he was getting the repetitions needed to hone his skills for the next year, when he would be the starter."
Loeffler was a prized QB recruit as well, but IIRC, suffered a bad shoulder injury and was beat by other QBs (Griese, Dreisbach). Instead of getting playing time, he learned a lot about the position and passed on his knowledge in working with Griese all the way to Mallett. There was even talk of him coaching within the Patriots organization. So when you look at his track record of QBs he's taken under his wing, and the guys he has recruited...I'd say that the notion that his coaching is "suspect at best" is...well, suspect at best. So basically, to let him go could be a major disservice to the position in the future. If anything, he's helped give the QB U lable a stability only few could hope for, and I'd say that's worth keeping around.
EEKS,
Yes, I only realized my Szabo-Stripling mixup on the walk to the train, so I didn't fix it. Anyway, tremendous pickup there.
BKLM,
Really? You want to live with that comment. I figured you would hope that it would go away. It's no big deal, just hought it was funny tht we woudl stoop to such depths to make a point. Navarre was a top ten recruit? Ok, it is yours. This comment is all yours. This retirement should be your shining moment, you should be revelling in the retirement you have been calling for the past months. Enjoy it. Meanwhile, a little history.
http://www.madison.com/tct/sports/250985
"Navarre originally committed to Northwestern but changed his mind when Wildcats coach Gary Barnett left for Colorado. Navarre called the UW to see if it was interested, but the Badgers already had commitments from Wille and Jim Sorgi."
I repeat, he called Wisconsin to see if he could play for them and they said no. They had Jim Sorgi. That's right, Jim Sorgi. Navarre was a decommit from Northwestern and then a stone no from Wiscy. They have a habit of turning down top ten recruits since they are so loaded at QB with top ten talent.
And while he didn't make all state his senior year, he was all - conference. So you got that going for you.
http://www.azcardinals.com/team/...bio.php?
PRKey=6
So, he was only recruited at quarterback by Northwestern, and was honorable mention all state (with several other selections after the fourth team). We gave him a late offer when we realized how thin we were with our Henson promises. Top ten recruit? Top ten in the state of Wisconsin, that I'll buy. I am sure there is a publication that will verify that for you.
You are ok with me. I take back my vote of lack of credibility. I love the persistence.
link to quote: http://www.suntimes.com/sports/
m...mully24.article
JW - Correct about Stan Parrish, and Stan taught Loeffler a lot I would assume. I agree Parrish's track record is impressive when including Griese, Brady, QB coach for Brad Johnson in his Super Bowl winning year, and Jim Everett even though he kinda sucked but still had a long NFL career. Only difference is that Parrish has moved on to a larger role in coaching, there's no way he'd come back just to teach some QBs. Loeffler is young, and ours, and was taught everything Parrish knows from the man himself. Again, definitely worth keeping around I'd say.
Also, maybe somebody can help me too. I was just a little kid when I saw my first M game sometime in the mid-'80's I think, I don't remember exactly. I do know it was the Notre Dame game. Michigan came out of the tunnel first and I loved their helmets so they became my favorite team immediately.
Then ND came out and the announcer was all excited, yelling, "The paint is dry!" I guess meaning that their helmets were freshly painted. It made no sense to me for them to bring it up, since their helmets were so boring anyway.
Michigan lost but I still loved them. I have been scouring ESPN Classic M-ND replays for years to try to figure out what year that was, but none of the games make any sense. Can anyone possibly link that quote to a year?
thanks
The Death Star has been destroyed and the emperor with it........I'm not going to be all nostalgic about the past. We lost to Appalachian State, a respectable high school team, with an entire sideline of players that have at least outside shots of playing professional football. Getting my heart ripped out by a total failure to prepare a team was enough for me. I look forward to the future. I sincerely hope for all of us including Carr and the players that he goes out on a winning note. He does not go from being the bane of Michigan football to the hero just because he is leaving...or does he??? Maybe we should commend him for saving the future of the program.
A New Hope...apparently you just started watching UM football this season or maybe since 2005. I suggest looking at what a coach has accomplished throughout his career, not one short-minded rough patch. But hey, if that's the way you see it, then don't give him glory. I love the man and what he's done in his time here, but just like any knee-jerk game thread...we often fail to see the whole picture until we evaulate the entire game. The whole picture of Lloyd Carr is a nice one. I prefer to save the sarcasm for a less appreciative fan base that cares little about integrity, tradition, and WINNING (believe it or not).
Old Fan: My point was that the recruiting services are often wrong and should not used to justify why a recruit can't fail. My example and COMMENT was that Navarre was considered a top recruit by some recruiting services (e.g. Super Prep). I sent you the link
http://mgoblue.com/bio.cfm?bio_i...el=3&
season=227
because it supports my comment. SuperPrep (Allen Wallace) had him ranked as the #5 Pro-Style QB in the country. Superprep is now scout.com. So "yes" I want to live with my comment because it was correct.
Look, I know Navarre was terrible and that was my original point. No one wanted him and Michigan made him their QB for 3-4 years. And those were lean years with Navarre at the helm.
A rough patch and the summary execution of 128 years of tradition are two different things. I am tired of everyone living in the past. Joseph Stalin made the Soviet Union into a world power. Hitler brough Germany from the ashes of war to the greatest military power on earth in the 1930s in less than a decade. Early success and prosperity does not make these leaders look better. The end result were two most imfamous leaders of the 20th century. I am not saying by any means that Carr is equivalent to these monsters. I am sure that Lloyd Carr is a fine person and for that I thank him. As a football coach and his ability to evolve with the sport he was miserable. Early success/prosperity does not forgive later shortcomings. Lloyd should have retired the moment he realized the game had passed him by...his humor in his press conferences the last few years showed he knows he is a dinosaur. I wish him the best in his retirement and thank him for it.
I agree with New Hope. New day, new blood. And KGH10, like I said in my earlier post, Loeffler made sure Brady got more repetitions at practice so on some level I'm sure that did make Brady a better QB. But Griese saying this about Loeffler at a reunion, is not the same as Brady saying it himself. Do you have a source that specifically shows where Brady credits Loeffler for his success? If not, then I don't see your research proving much at all.
Here's an article I stumbled across myself when seeing if anybody else shared a similar opinion of Loeffler:
http://www.sealclubbers.com/2007...ing-lloyd-carr/
To some of your other arguments, IMO Stan Parrish was not a good coach, neither was Malone, neither is DeBord. You're raving about Parrish like he was a stud coach and his disciples like Loeffler are somehow blessed. I'll give you the MNC as the crowning point of Parrish's time at UM (although defense played a much larger roll than offense in winning that MNC) and I'll concede that Griese overachieved at Michigan (for which Parrish could claim 2 years of influence) but the whole QB controversy between Henne & Brady always held Brady back IMO. That's why he was merely a good college QB who went on to become a fantastic NFL QB. (Most of the HOFers - e.g. Marino, Elway, Steve Young, Aikman, Staubach - were fantastic college QB's too). Henson is a toss up. Not too many fans consider Henson a great UM QB. And Navarre's recruitment and sticking with him was largely on Parrish.
As you can tell, we see things VERY differently.
Again, you must not give a crap about what Bo did either if that's the case. All Bo did was lose bowl games and was a bit over .500 vs. OSU. He also failed to win a national title in his many years here, and that was in the years of limitless scholarships and less parity than today's game. So he should've retired years before he did because the game must've passed him by. Well I thank my cotton pickin' maize and blue heart that he didn't..I think we all do.
@kgh10
Obviously I meant "QB controversy between HENSON (not Henne) & Brady always held Brady back IMO."
haha awesome....that article is all about how all of our problems rest with the QB coach. How insightful. Sure, I'll take that guys' word for it. Anyway, so my quote doesn't mean anything b/c it's Griese saying it? No credibility towards the coaching Brady received under Loeffler? I'll take Griese's word over some guy who thinks UMs problems fall on the QB coach and that Henne had all this time in the world to throw the ball in the USC game (uh did you see our O-line in that game...pwned). Not the fact that our D sucked the big one or anything. Henne's protection in the Rose Bowl was almost as bad as the protection Mallett had this past weekend. Certainly a great reference.
Also, I never said Stan Parrish was a great overall coach...but to deny his influence over the position of WUARTERBACK (which is what we're talking about here) is baffling to say the least. Not even just at Michigan, but at any level of his QB coaching, he's found success. And as JW posted above, Nate Davis a true Sophomore at Ball St. is turning into a pretty good QB in his own right.
"Not long ago, New England quarterback Tom Brady tried to get him to join the Patriots staff. Yeah, Brady thinks that much of Loeffler."
http://www.sportingnews.com/
your...478cce99ac7a332
"The designation period ends Feb. 23 . . . According to published reports, the Patriots have inquired about former Vikings defensive assistant Chuck Knox Jr. and current University of Michigan quarterbacks coach Scot Loeffler as possible additions to their staff."
http://www.boston.com/sports/art...ension_quickly/
So maybe it's not an exact quote from Brady, but this many people cannot be making up the fact that he thinks that highly Scot and his coaching. Why else would a 32 year old QB coach go to New England if Tommy didn't think he played a role in his development? So what makes one think he doesn't deserve any praise for the QBs his coached and tutored? Enough that he should be tossed? Is it possible that none of what he's done or possibly accomplished is enough to say he's a good QB coach and that there's a better one out there that would come here? I cannot understand how that is a reasonable assumption. Again a UM backup for 4 years played in the NFL after getting any meaningful playing time one year at Idaho St. and that means nothing? The guys he recruited and the guys he developed or had a hand in developing meant nothing? That makes not one bit of sense to let a guy like that go...especially when considering who we'd have as a replacement, like there's a ton of omg shirtless QB coaches out there.
DP from www.michiganagainsttheworld.blogspot.com said this of Loeffler in his time as a team manager who spent a lot of time w/ the team during Brady's years:
"I worked with Loeffler when I worked with the QBs at Michigan in 98-00. He is an am
lol BLUE I figured that out, but thanks for the edit. And also about the Henson/Brady thing, that could've easily been Carr. It's his call which QB plays, the QB coach just coaches them...they don't make the call about who plays. When Carr promises Henson he'll play as a freshman, it's Carr's responsibility to get him in the game, not the QB coach or grad assistant. To blame the stunting of Brady's growth as a result of shared time w/ Henson, that's not on a QB coach or grad asst.
OOps the DP quote got cut off...here's the rest of it:
I worked with Loeffler when I worked with the QBs at Michigan in 98-00. He is an amazing teacher of the position, and a great offensive mind...I really just can't say enough about his understanding of the game. He is the guy who really took Tommy to the next level while he was at Michigan, and is the guy Tommy credits for a lot of his current successes. Top QBs come to Michigan now to play for him. He's the main reason we landed Chad Henne, and if he sticks around, we'll be landing super-recruit Ryan Mallett here in the next couple of months for the 2007 class."
"Stan Parrish was our QB coach, but Loeffler worked hand in hand with him, and especially Tommy, during the 1999 season. He was officially in charge of the scout team, but those responsibilities were mainly delegated to Dennis Coyle, a lower level GA, so that Loeffler could continue to work with Brady and Henson."
As for his influence over Mallett, Ryan doesn't exactly strike me as a player who is so easily coachable. Maybe that's a false assumption because I'm not an inside source or anything, but if he's not soaking up everything the coaches/veteran players are teaching him, he's not going to benefit from them. Sure he's got all the physical talent a QB coach can hope for, but if he's not easily coachable mentally speaking, he's not going to play smart football unless he's innately genius (which is obviously not the case here). That could be a reason why he doesn't play with his brain and makes really, and I mean really bone-headed moves.
As for Henson not being a great UM QB...a lot of people were expecting him to be, but he left prematurely. Before he left he was obviously very talented and could've been great had he stayed...that's a common sentiment throughout nearly EVERY UM outlet I've ever read/heard. In his first year as a full starter, I thought he was pretty successful. Made very little mistakes (4 INTs), 18 TDs in 9 games, 61.6 completion %, and he didn't even play the whole season b/c of injury. So basically, it's revisionist history suggests he's a _ick for leaving us for the big bucks and the MLB, in turn hangin w/o a good backup. AKA we kind of hate him, regardless of what we thought of him as a player. We're more pissed that he left us with 1 or 2 more horrible seasons that we had to spend with Navarre. I could be wrong, but wasn't it Henson that said he would only go to UM if we guaranteed him early playing time and that no blue-chipper would be recruited behind him? Sure that's a gamble that Parrish went for, but Henson was a highly prized recruit and a great scrambler..not to mention, many of our QBs up until that point were drafted baseball players (including Tom B, Clayton Richard, some others), so it seemed like a reasonable gamble.
I'm still skeptical that the immediate Carr retirement stuff is anything more than rumor. I'm sure, Carr being Carr, that the last thing he'd want is for the focus to be on anything other than the game and the players, although I can't imagine that very many people would hold it against him if he announced before the game.
However, Carr has to know, or should, that if he goes around telling various people (aside from Martin) in the Athletic Dept that he's retiring, word is just going to leak. There's always some goddamn blabbermouth around who can't keep a secret.
When it does get out, Carr and everybody else is going to have to spend time responding to and denying the speculation from the media, which is already happening.
So now Carr has the worst of both worlds: he doesn't reap any psychological advantage from a pre-game announcement, and he still ends up with constant, rampant, public speculation prior to the big game that he personally will have to deal with after all.
Korea Blue,
I am not a big Miles fan, but in the smackfest that was the prelude to the Alabama-LSU Saban Bowl, the LSU players' comments sounded like they REALLY believe in him and care about him.
He doesn't have to tell anyone other than Martin. However, to retire from this august institution, you have to go through a lot of paperwork. Which involves a lot of minions. Some of whom can't keep a secret if their lives depended on it.
The good thing about a leak is it gets information out there that creates intangibles that may work in your favor, and you can say things like "I just want to focus on The Game" with a completely straight face.
It breaks my heart down here in columbus when someone says Tressell owns carr.
My son and i are staunch supporters of michigan football and lloyd carr. last year we started thinking maybe it;s time for a change.
I believe the game has passed lloyds brand of play and it's time for a change, but what a great man and memories we will have of lloyd.
we never attended school in ann arbor but have been a fan since 1969, my son was born 1970 and is true blue. lloyd has given us much joy the way he handles winning and losing, he'll be remembered as a legend and should be sent out thusly!!!
it's a new era fo football and michigan needs to catch up
thanks for the memories lloyd
"recall that alvarez got some flack for naming his successor rather than going through a selection process."
Alvarez didn't get flack because he didn't interview outside candidates - he got flack because he didn't follow the PC policy of posting the job opening like it was a requisition for a tenure-track professor of plant science. He also didn't interview any minority candidates and that got on the university's nerves.
But why should he have had to go through any of that crap? He's the athletic director, he had a guy on his staff he trusted to take over and it was his prerogative to give him the job. (He's a minority himself too, which should shield him from criticism he's greasing the skids for white guys.)
Reposting this as my previous post is buried:
http://mgoboard.com/blogmedia/
vi...dLloydLloyd.mpg
It's a video that needs to be seen when talking about Carr's legacy.
haha TheMile, I actually cannot see the vid for whatever reason, but I can read the title of the vid as "LloydLloydLloyd" which leads me to believe this is in his 100th win vs. Iowa in their pink visitor lockerrooms. All the players are gathered around Lloyd singing "Lloyd! Lloyd-Lloyd-Lloyd!" to the tune of the opening part of "Eye of the Tiger." If it is that vid...I absolutely LOVE it, the players look so happy as does Coach Carr.
haha Chad and Leon Hall can barely contain themselves in that vid...too cute. I actually had that vid saved...couldn't find it for a while, but yay.
I love Lloyd and always have. He will be missed by a fan who grew up with him at the helm.
Two things:
1. @ BLUE FAITHFUL
I find it interesting that you say Malone, Debord, etc. weren't/aren't good coaches. Over the last 15 years, Michigan's NFL output of offensive players is probably unparalleled (Edwards, Jansen, Brady, Griese, Hutchinson, Terrell, Perry, Thomas, Breaston, Backus, Long, Henne, Hart, Manningham, etc., etc.). Some of them may not be great NFL players, but most were at least high draft picks. We may have qualms with much of the playcalling, but to say they are horrible coaches is harsh and seemingly uninformed.
2. @ Brian
No offense, because I love your blog and everything. But I would have preferred it if you kept the retirement news to yourself, at least until after the OSU game. If it's true, he probably hasn't announced it for a reason, and I think he deserved to announce it on his own terms. It's a testament to your integrity that almost everyone on here believes his retirement to be fact because you said so, but I just think it should have been handled differently.
kgh10: Yup, that's the video. Hope it goes up on YouTube one of these days so people can see it easier.
Magnus: I agree with your point #2.
Magnus,
Brian isn't an agent of Michigan's athletics department and I don't think he should blindly behave like one. He's an independent medium, which means he should continue communicating information when he deems it relevant and truthful. What's more, I don't think this issue, whether Carr announced it to nobody or somebodies or everybody or whether the news has leaked from somebodies to everybody or even if it's totally untrue, will have anything to do with the final score of Saturday's game against Ohio State. Additionally, if this is true and did leak from a staff meeting, then this is Carr announcing it on his own terms. He's been around long enough to know how long that information would be contained. I'm not sure of the timeline, but I'm guessing this came from a staff meeting early yesterday afternoon, a staff meeting conveniently scheduled after Carr's final obligation to the media before Saturday (meaning he'd not have to answer questions about information he knew would leak).
Finally, I think we in the Michigan community woefully overestimate the role we play in Carr's life when we react to a hypothetical "retirement" press conference as being the personally meaningful portion of Carr's retirement process. The meaningful part for him would be when he talked to his wife, boss, players and employees. He'll have taken care of that long before word could have leaked. Brian isn't taking anything from Carr by diminishing the surprise that might come from Carr's public announcement because that's the part Carr would dread. I've spent time with Carr and suspect he'd probably secretly thank Brian for doing some of the laborious part of this for him.
There's nothing worse than an independent blogger or message board moderator who restricts content to issues deemed appropriate by the object of attention. Well, maybe there are worse things, but those people still piss me off.
Keep on keepin' on, Brian.
Magnus, disagree w/ your point 2, FTR.
it's news. actually, it's just confirming old news.
gnrgoblue, b.i.n.g.o. == bingo
Lloyd Carr is a nice man, and a good man, but he is not an intelligent man when it comes to football. His departure will be a blessing to this team, assuming that we hire a coach that is not currently affiliated with the program.
Does anyone think the problems at USC will come to a head and burst, and Pete Carroll will jump ship before it all happens, say, at the end of this season? Think he'd coach at Michigan?
If Carr doesn't like Les Miles, then Miles can never be our coach. It'll never work.
Derek, the only school with more wins over the last 10 years is Ohio State.
So kindly fuck off about Carr's intelligence.
Magnus,
I wish he would have kept it to himself as well, but I understand why he didn't. If Brian ends up being the one who blew the lid off of this story, that is a tremendous victory for mgoblog as well as the perceived credibility of blogs as a news source.
Ultimately, the attention makes him money and gives him a straight-up advantage over premium ($) sites, which keeps us coming back. You saw how huffy Rivals got yesterday. This is a good thing.
Also because we all would have spent every comment thread getting into long-winded discussions and speculation. At least now we have something to base it on.
At keeping this information to himself:
Absolutely Not! gnrgoblue said it perfectly
Earlier in the day this post went up I had already heard that Carr was going announce his retirement. I am a nobody with no connections and I was already hearing the rumbling. In terms of blogs, Brian may very well get credit for this scoop--yeah for Brian. In terms of leaking information that should have been kept quiet--that cat was already out of the bag.
Yesterday, my sons and I visited a Smithsonian. In honor of OSU week my 2 year old wore his Breaston/Mallett jersey and me my M sweatshirt. Of course, someone harrassed me about AppySt. He wouldn't let me take the jersey off for his nap. Instead he put it on backwards which seemed appropriate for a Mallett jersey. He wouldn't let me take it off when I put him to bed that night and he carried it with him to school today. He's only 2 so he cannot really understand the significance can he? Maybe he's just trying to claim the jersey from his brother. Maybe he was born a Wolverine.
I think the essence of Carr's success is his LOVE. This is a man who genuinely loves his players and his school. When things are goin rough, if there is love, then you will muster the strength to weather some incredible storms. And you never, ever give up. His kids have always fought tooth and nail for Carr because they truly love him like a father. Carr worked tirelessly because he loves Michigan so much. This was not a job for him.
And it's that presence of genuine love that has made Michigan Football a constant success over the last 39 years.
And considering this essential ingredient is why I want Les Miles to be the next coach. For him too, this would not be a job. It would be a labor of love.
TheMile...I'm working on it. Should be up sooner rather than later.
imafreak - loved that story, so adorable
Mike Debord better not be a canidate. He did such a great job at CMU. IF we want a old CMU coach go get Kelly.
Les is More!
http://youtube.com/watch?v=-_k_XC6fwjE
Lloyd lockerroom video after 100th win.
Hey Chimpy, I see you throwing around the F*bombs again (10:43am). You're a bright fella aren't ya? Stealing some peoples handles and swearing at others.
\the whole QB controversy between (Henson) & Brady always held Brady back IMO. That's why he was merely a good college QB who went on to become a fantastic NFL QB.//
>
I've been saying consistently that I want to punch Lloyd Carr right in the neck every time I watch Brady play in the NFL. Especially this year.
\All Bo did was lose bowl games and was a bit over .500 vs. OSU.//
>
This is absolutely correct. And he had a losing record against Earle Bruce. And PROBABLY a losing record against Notre Dame (during a period including Gerry Faust's tenure for God's sake).
Coach Carr gets a bad rep (which is not entirely undeserved) because of the way his losses have occurred.
If Michigan and OSU are considered to be two programs essentially equal in terms of on-field performance (as great rivals should be), then it is only natural that no one side should have a pronounced advantage for an extended period oftime...there should be an element of give-and-take...Cooper's run was an anomaly, as is the tail end of Carr's.
As for bowl games, Lloyd started out like a house on fire...the law of averages probably dictated that his opponents in bowl games catch up to him, too. For what it's worth, Carr's record against SEC schools was pretty damn good...maybe UM and LSU should just trade coaches and call it even?
Hey, someone mentioned above the possibility of The Game being moved back to 3:30 for TV. Is there truth to that? I'm making a 4.5 hour drive to the game from Illinois...so I'd sure like to know if it's going to be 3 hours later. It probably won't make a huge difference as I plan on being there for GameDay anyway...but it's the difference between waking up at 5:00 and waking up at 7:00!
Anyone with info...please advise!!!
Les Miles will be our new coach and if Lloyd does announce his retirement next week then I'll bet the Les announcment comes within two weeks of that. Face it, Les has been waiting his entire career for the Michigan job to open up. As far as recruiting goes I can tell you that in an issue of the Wolverine magazine two weeks ago our 4 star commitment Boubacar Cissoko did say that he will withdrawl his verbal and look at possibly Illinois if Lloyd and Ron English do not return.
ahh the Wolverine magazine...so credible. Cissoko isn't going anywhere, he's said that much a numerous amount of times. Not knocking you king g, but I heard that a month ago, and all I've heard since was exactly the opposite. I trust Rivals with very little after the amount of slip ups they've had.
@kgh10. A couple of your sources support your claim so I'll concede that it's possible Brady thinks Loeffler was involved in his development. Still haven't heard it from the horse's mouth.
It only slightly changes my opinion of Loeffler which is based on personal interaction from my days at UM and what I've seen on the field in the past 8 years since he's had his hands in the program. I would argue UM gained its QB notoriety with the run of Harbaugh, Grbac, Collins and Griese - all which became starting QB's in the NFL. Scott Loeffler had nothing to do with these guys and Brady, a highly recruited QB from California, the cornerstone of your argument, was in school with Loeffler for part of his time. After Brady, it's Navarre, Henson, Henne, and Mallett. I do not put these guys in the same league as the guys that came before them. They all came in as very highly recruited/ranked QB's and none has left/will leave having lived up to the hype they came in with, IMO.
When I think of UM QB's today, I think tall, immobile, white guys with huge arms who regularly throw into the backs of their lineman. While this description is certainly not all-incompassing of their abilities, no one can deny that QB's Scot Loeffler has mentored while the official UM QB coach all fit this description in varying degrees.
So, your argument has moved my opinion of Loeffler up from being a bad QB coach to somewhere in the middle of bad and decent. Still not good IMO.
As a Buckeyes fan, I'll definitely miss Carr. That lunatic Les Miles will sure make the rivalry interesting.
Thanks LLLLLOyd. Hate to see you go. OSU owned you.
Carr is as class as they come. My freshman year at UM was 89-90 (Bo's last year). Carr, the ultimate "Michigan Man," carried on the legacy with integrity. He didn't moan like a whiney bitch ala Urban Meyer when the controversy arose last year over who would play in the title game. I can't argue that our program may not be quite as edgy or dangerous under Lloyd as it could be under another coach, but we won big ten titles, a national title and the respect of all who surveyed us along the way. Thanks coach.
CAUP '91, you had me right up until that last graf. I don't give a shit about Les Miles right now, and reading about him kind of wrecked the comment for me.
But not totally.
What you said is pretty damn right. Lloyd isn't the kind of coach who inspires worship from his fans. He's not some piece of statuary or even some revival preacher.
He's just a man who has made Michigan football his life's work, and done a great job at it. We should all be such successes.
If this is true -- and I'm skeptical, especially about the timing -- it will be a sad day for Michigan football.
Tom from CO,
I don't think I stole my handle from anyone, at least not intentianally.
Say, are you going to be back for The Game? I'd love to meet up and settle our differences.
There is no other option. He had to move on.
the house he bought is in barton hills. he recently (last week) became a member at barton hills. this is from a creditable source.
Anonymous | 11.12.07 - 11:43 pm | #
Confirmation anyone?
CAUP '91 said:
========================================
And considering this essential ingredient is why I want Les Miles to be the next coach. For him too, this would not be a job. It would be a labor of love.
========================================
This is likely why Les Miles has already been hired. With Lloyd's ok. For those of you who say that Les wouldn't be hired without Lloyd's blessing, you really need to think that through. Lloyd was an assistant coach for a long time. He loves the University of Michigan. He is paid pennies compared to big name coaches, and has performed far better than most. His players love him. He understands the tradition of the UM and cares deeply about it, contrast the Creyer, Weis, and others who are in this for themselves.
This is exactly the reason that Lloyd would WANT Michigan to hire Miles. There are almost assuredly differences between these guys -- from Jai Eugene, to negative recruiting, etc. etc. But do not underestimate the ability of Lloyd to cut through the crap and get to the the important factors: Les is a Michigan Man. He knows the Michigan tradition. When he tries to sell players to come to UM, he will be speaking from his heart, as does Lloyd. This would, to me, be the type of thing that would lead Lloyd to recommend Miles for the job.
I do not personally know Lloyd. but I have followed Michigan football for years. One thing that I think any of us who closely watch Lloyd could agree with, is that Lloyd would want a coach who understands what being a Michigan Man is all about. Les Miles is such a person.
Oh, and Blue Faithful:
You've got to be kidding about Loeffler. The guy is one of if not the best quartebacks coach in the country, period.
We'd be lucky to keep him on staff next year. And, even so, we'll be lucky to keep him around as he starts to get more and more calls to move up to NFL and/or coordinator positions elsewhere.
DAMN! OSU was just getting used to being dominant!
ChimpA, Please leave your email here. I will coming to A2 and would absolutely LOVE to meet up with you.
does anybody remember an article on lloyd carr's lighter side from a few years ago? it mentioned his cameo as the lone ranger and an incident involving a soft-serve ice cream machine. I know there is this one: http://www.vindy.com/content/
spo...35057315452.php
and this one:
http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs...0396/1131&
imw=Y
but the one i'm looking for isn't those two.
Anyone else mention Jon Gruden form Tampa Bay. I know he has said in the past that coaching Michigan is his dream job.
Tom,
reach me at 3179979917
Not sure anyone will read this 1 of 365...366...367...posts, but...
I've not been the biggest LC fan over the years since I started school at UM in 1998, but he is the only UM coach I've ever known and it will be tough to watch someone else on the sidelines, regardles of their accolades and accomplishments. I'm not gonna lie...I'll probably shed a tear.
Why would anyone want to follow in his footsteps. Its a losing program, and he has set the seeds for losing to OSU for a long time. A hard rut to get out of. Not likely an admirable job to take on.
Hey Dave, you're a loser.
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