I'm surprised Steive Breaston's traitorous hands are not on notice.
Refresh my memory - why is Morgan Trent On Notice?
Funny thing about "Tuna." I went out on a couple of dates with a Kurdish woman who was named - wait for it - Tuna. Spelled as so. Literally one of the best bodies I've ever laid eyes (and by "eyes", I mean hands) on. But the whole thing about her being named ... well, Tuna ... a bit too much.
So I think it should not be Tuna that's on notice, but Tuna's parents. Oh, the coitus we could have enjoyed.
Nitpick - Hart said "could have" (or "could've"), not "could of."
Holy sh*t! Spain has been set free!
Tuna's in? I'm out.
http://stanford.scout.com/a.z?s=...18&p=2&
c=663958
More Harbaugh Madness from BearsInsider.com (Cal-Berkley's scout site). They tag him pretty good and make him look like fool. Which he is. And he should have his degree revoked. And Bill Martin should sign Stanford to a 25-year contract so we can beat him 90-3 every season. That should dig into his recruiting ability.
http://stanford.scout.com/a.z?s=...18&p=2&
c=663958
Harbaugh might just want to keep his mouth shut about academics in general.
lol Harbaugh, PWND! again.
brian, i remember that interview with carr before the notre dame game this year, and his reaction to bernie smilovitz's (!) question about retirement was noticeably different than his normally dodgy answers that, when read from a newspaper, lack the ability to convey what he really is feeling. and his long-thought out answer of "I've got a plan," seemed to suggest exactly how you described it - going out on top. so for me, it seems like the results of this year, more than anything, will determine what Carr does.
I can't wait for 25 years from now, when Mike Hart is the head coach of the University of Michigan football team. There's no doubt in my mind that it's going to happen, and I'm giddy with excitement. I love the kid.
...I find jh to be interesting,but pointless...lets move on!
Stanford would hurt Michigan's SOS too much to be worth playing, but I'll sure as hell be hoping for USC to break the 100 pt barrier, followed by Pete Carroll Choke-Slamming Harbaugh at Midfield.
Scalz1, recall that Steve Breaston caught a touchdown pass on the last play of his collegiate career.
Refresh my memory - why is Morgan Trent On Notice?
Um... the last two games of the year?
re: Spain. #*#$! I knew I had forgotten some seething hatred or another.
Breaston is a microcosm of Michigan program. Silent, unselfish and dazzled us with big plays.. but dropped a few catches when it really mattered ( like how M dropped the last 2 games). I'd link to RBUAS's Breaston write-up..but after reading, you'd immediately cry and I am sparing you that.
JH : should STFU
Mike Hart : we are really proud of someone so "patriotic"(?!) though his comments are a bit over the top.
LC and Chad : said it perfectly.
I'd prefer to see Petey C put the 'Baugh in the Figure 4 or drop the DDT on him.
harbaugh's stanford model works much better.
the players are not adulated when they are at stanford and not hired after they graduate by any of the people who didn't adulate them.
Gnarls:
I love him, too, but damnation, Mike, win your last two games before running your mouth, particularly about the Buckeyes. Go 0-8 in your last two games for your career, and I put a big friggin' asterisk by your name and your legacy.
Keep slamming Harbaugh and Corwin now, boys. You'll be worshipping them when they come back to coach little Ann Arbor's football team.
Yes...Harbaugh is well on his way to returning to Ann Arbor as coach. All he needs to do now is go on record discussing how overrated the Big House is as a college football venue and he's a shoo-in!
Mike, win your last two games before running your mouth
Yes, because it was all Hart's, fault that we lost to tOSU, Texas, USC and the like.
It's about time somebody bitch-slapped JH and I can't think of two better guys than Hart and Morris, basically clones of each other, to do it. Harbaugh used to be my favorite player as a kid. Now he's the reason I have to root for USC against someone besides ND.
Morris to Harbaugh, "You're nothing to me now, Fredo."
I'm out here for Michigan, and if we go out and win every game and our bowl game, and every other Big Ten team loses every game, it doesn't bother me.
Goddamn, Mike. If you play half as good as you talk, you're easily going to win the Heisman. Every time the press quotes him, I love him a little more.
Also: this season is going to f-ing suck if we're gonna be subject to the "when is the other shoe gonna drop" treatment from the media.
link
Brian, just wanted to point out that you might be taking Hart's quote out of context. (Not that there's anything wrong with that, it's your job now!)
In the audio, before the quote you analyze, he also says "you're not just going to come in and be a COORDINATOR at michgan. He could of... coached at Stanford for a year and come to Michigan." Who's not to say that he was just referencing a hypothetcial assistant coaching position to "move up the coaching ladder", instead of thinking that he slipped up and let the cat out of the bag about LC's retirement....
KMD, that's how I heard him too. First, there is no way, as much as I love him, Michigan is sharing Carr's specific plans with Hart. Second, it just makes sense about high profile job in a high profile program.
*** First, there is no way, as much as I love him, Michigan is sharing Carr's specific plans with Hart ***
Carr certainly might have shared Carr's specific plans with Hart.
I thought the most relevant item in any article today was the Morris/Harbaugh phone discussion -- where it became clear that Harbaugh wouldn't have said these things if Bo was still alive. That means he's not only wrong, but he's gutless.
And the Fredo comment is dead on. Harbaugh took sides against the family. He better not go fishing in Lake Tahoe.
"I love him, too, but damnation, Mike, win your last two games before running your mouth, particularly about the Buckeyes. Go 0-8 in your last two games for your career, and I put a big friggin' asterisk by your name and your legacy."
To give Hart credit, he is quoted in the Carty AA News article tonight as acknowledging his legacy will be tarnished if OSU and a bowl opponent don't show up in the loss column this year. I think he's got his head screwed on straight.
"Oh, the coitus we could have enjoyed."
I've always found that word faintly, clinically repellent, suggestive of some medical condition involving digestive organs. Sounds to me like Tuna deserves a better phrase than that.
......
I went over to the UM track for a few laps late this afternoon. Just as I pulled in the Hoover St. entrance Coach English was exiting in his Mercedes convertible, and he was on his cell ripping some unfortunate soul a new one. I had my windows up so I couldn't make out any words, but Coach E was loud enough that there was no mistaking he was extremely pissed off. Whether the dry cleaners screwed up his shirts or somebody is messing up their cover-2 I don't have a clue, but even more telling than the volume was the look on his face. I don't think I've ever personally seen a more angry/scary facial expression in my life. You do not want to get on the wrong side of this guy.
I hope he was able to calm down on the drive home, or Mrs. E's gonna make him sleep on the couch.
Proctor, I can think of few players I would blame less than Mike Hart. Still, a bit of advice regardless: don't run your mouth until you win your last two games.
WTF? Hart rushed for 142 yards and 3 TDs against OSU last year. What was he supposed to do, play defense?
What exactly was so offensive about what Mike said post-game vs. OSU? I've watched the interview a million times, he gave more credit to OSU more than anything else.
I'm a big believer in Michigan stoicism, Les Miles gives me the vapors, etc. -- but reading Hart this fired up in public was thrilling. I don't want it to happen every day, but it's refreshing to read someone so impassioned about the program and the school. We could use a little more of this from time to time.
Brain=Mark-May-Wannabe.
I see your ratings must have dipped, since you bring up ND in an article that has absolutely nothing directly to do with ND:
"I don't have a problem with this. When your school is harder than Notre Dame, football players tend to cluster in the easier majors."
Except where you do mention where ND has used this in recruiting.
Here's a very well thought out rebuttal to your dumb-ass arguement about higher grad rate=lower academic integrity: http://www.ndkgreen.com/index.htm
Plus, your statement below just proves the point about UM's interest in graduating players (unless this was a quote from someone else):
In addition, many football players come from bad high schools and are not admitted for their intelligence but rather their physical ability. Can we stop pretending that a random liberal arts degree is more useful to these players than their status as Michigan football players? We all want them to graduate, to show that they can function in the world well enough to get a degree, but they're learning more about how to succeed in the world by participating in a highly regimented athletics program than by writing a paper on Foucault."
All class.
"Except where you do mention where ND has used this in recruiting."
What the fuck does that mean??
Also, what is an arguement?
Did you really go to ND? Or middle school?
"I don't have a problem with this. When your school is harder than Notre Dame, football players tend to cluster in the easier majors."
It's nice to see that even when dealing with an issue that is solely about UM (comments from a former UM player, about the UM program), you still ahve to throw a nice dig in at ND. Your pre-occupation with ND does seem a bit unhealthy, and you might want to work on it.
Not only is it a random jab, it's a laughable assumption. Since when is UM "harder"? By what metric are you judging the schools? You can't just make up information and pass it off as fact. I have heard your twisted logic before, and it's no truer today than it was 2 months ago. The fact that UM graduates fewer players does not mean it's harder. There is no causal relationship there. There are any number of factors other than perceived difficulty of the school that can result in the same outcome.
Most of these kids are being given the best opportunity of their lives by being able to play football at Michigan. They can't all be smart enough to get biology or engineering degrees. Any degree from Michigan is an achievement and will set them up nicely for a future outside of the NFL - whether it be additional schooling, teaching or coaching.
The fact is, these kids are here because they can play football. Similarly, art and music students get accepted based on their skills in those very specific fields. Are all art and music majors going to become famous artists/musicians? Not likely. And that may not be the goal of all, but I fail to see how either of those degrees is a better foundation than what many football players are achieving. In fact, I could argue that art/music majors are less prepared after graduation since their possible “dream” job is attached to their major, while football is separate, giving a football player two opportunities for success.
These kids are simply taking a chance on a dream. If it fails, then they fall back on something more “realistic”. As far as I know, you’re eligible to teach with any 4-year degree. A unique understanding of football is certain to provide coaching opportunities. And a Michigan degree will get you into graduate school where you can focus your studies more specifically and adamantly. How has Michigan failed a student when they provide a clear shot at realizing a goal, and a substantial back-up plan if that should fail?
If they are indeed being forced into “easier” majors, then that is wrong. They should be advised, and then free to do what they wish. Ultimately it is the student’s choice whether to focus on football or school, but advising a student athlete to select a less challenging major at Michigan so as to balance the two should not be used as a criticism of the athletic department or university.
As a Nuclear Engineering & Radiological Sciences major at Michigan, I know that I'm not guaranteed a job when I graduate. Does that make my degree worthless? You simply put yourself in the best position to be successful and hope you get an opportunity.
"bunkered down" VS. "hunkered down"
"bunkered down" 24,700 (view)
"hunkered down" 482,000 (view)
GoogleBattle winner is "hunkered down"
i'm gonna chime in on the whole "nd being easier than michigan" thing. the fact is that many prestigious private schools (ivy-league) make it fairly easy for their students to graduate with loose curriculums and even looser grading policies/practices. honestly, if i saw the nd football graduation rates (as well as those of undergraduates in general) i'd have to assume that nd was one of these schools.
unfortunately for you (and the relatively few slackers at nd), this could not be further from the truth under the dome. i still don't know how i managed to graduate from nd in 4 years, but i can assure you that it wasn't with any help from the administration or professors going easy on me ... and i had a decent number of classes with lots of athletes, including football players. they did not receive any kind of special treatment and almost never missed class.
often times, domers, subway alumni and the media will shove the "nd student-athlete as character guys who take school seriously" angle down the throats of every other college football fan who doesn't root for stanford (not a ton of those anyways). the incredulity of these kinds of broad statements, coupled with the "holier-than-thou" attitude of the statements, are a significant reason why nd is so despised and resented by the rest of the college football universe. i can't do anything about the "holier-than-thou" aspect of the problem, but i can certainly attest to fact that these kinds of statements are not bs. nd consistently recruits high-character, hard-working football players that can read and write, love their mamas and get placed into an environment where it is simply really uncool to be the kind of person who doesn't take care of business. it's specifically because an nd education is pretty tough (and the administration takes an unhealthy sense of pride in how tough they have to be) that our guys don't slack in the classroom ... that, and there is a relative dearth of legitimately hot girls on campus to distract them.
don't assume nd must be an easy education again, because i can assure you it is anything but. people that go there (including athletes) are all just really hardcore about succeeding in everything they do.
*please refrain from comments about how the crappy grammar and syntax of this post must be evidence of nd being easy ... that is all
did you ever stop and think that maybe ND appears hard to you because catholics are stupid?
I live in Europe, so I'm unfortunately a bit late to the party, but two things:
1) As mentioned, Brian's claim that UM is harder than ND is ridiculous. Not for the notion--in certain majors (engineering, math, hard sciences) there's an excellent chance it is. Perhaps even as a whole. But you imply that UM is OMG-so-much-harder that those poor ol' (dumb?) UM football players just don't have a prayer in any majors other than the easy ones. And that's a joke of an argument. Or worse, it's true, and UM should not have accepted them when they cannot expect to succeed in at least a reasonable portion of the university's programs and instead will just be used for football. I don't choose the word 'used' lightly, nor do I think that's what is happening, but it is one reasonable extension of Brian's own argument. At best, in this scenario coaches are being disingenuous when they tell recruits they can major in business, or architecture, etc. knowing full well that only 6 of 49 upperclassmen have declared for something other than General Studies or Kinesiology.
2) In the past Brian has mentioned that he believes that UM does as much as it can to help its students (but by golly, it's so hard even with support systems a large percentage of them still cannot graduate, even from the easy majors). Yet 19 of 20 juniors have not even declared a major! They're getting such great advice and attention that exactly one out of twenty juniors has so much as a clue as to the subject matter he'd like to focus on for life after football. That's great prep--clearly they're well on their way to graduating! Bully to ol' UM! (Here's a hint: you're probably going to declare for General Studies, like 18 of your 29 senior classmates.)
Brian, you cannot seriously be this blind to the fact that there are serious problems in the academic side of your football program. Yeah, it's painful to get called out in the national media, particularly so by an alum and former great and when UM is not scraping the bottom of the BCS barrel by any means, but things are worse than your post suggests. I note that you and others (including Carr and Hart) fail to offer substantive rebuttals to Harbaugh's claims, instead falling back on attacks on him personally (he's bitter, he's no Michigan Man) or suppositions that UM is just harder, or has more integrity than every other school in the NCAA. (Not to say such rebuttals are wrong or don't exist, or that Harbaugh's right--he's self-serving and removed from the program. But still, the absence of anything approaching facts is notable.)
This academic integrety claim, I note, is not exactly bolstered by your own statement that being a student and getting a solid college education in an area that interests the student should be secondary to memorizing a playbook and doing workouts in a highly-regimented athletics program. No doubt football and other sports teach valuable life skills, but should th
No doubt football and other sports teach valuable life skills, but should the once-in-a-lifetime opportunity to take advantage of the faculty and fellow students at one of the best universities in the nation really deserve the flip treatment you give it in your post? Which is it: UM is God's gift to undergraduate institutions or a degree from UM is less valuable than playing football? And why can't more players get the benefit of both?
Despite my over-the-top sarcasm here, I'm truly curious to hear your thoughts (and other commenters') on UM. I use the extreme tone because I am trying to accentuate how dumb or ignorant of the facts this argument is from an outsider's perspective. Please note, this post has nothing to do with ND other than to state that UM is not OMG impossible harder than ND--or for that matter certain other schools marrying football and academics, such as BC--so please save your flames (or maybe just tone them down). I'd be happy to get into why ND's high grad rate does not reflect a 'lack of integrity' another time (and in fact, have in other comment threads on this site), but for now am more curious about UM. Thanks,
-brian
carc, kgh10 and Crime:
Mike played great. Doesn't matter. Keep the pie-hole closed. You don't say after losing to someone that you really were better or that you should have beat them. I walk into Ohio State every week and still to this day, on the door of the operating room where I go, is a Dispatch article slamming Mike Hart's comments.
And you don't say, as Hart did this week: "We definitely would have beaten the Buckeyes," Hart said. "Florida was a great team. I don't know what would've happened. We couldn't even beat USC (in the Rose Bowl). But there's no doubt in my mind we would've beat the Buckeyes."
Is this a mystery to people why this is stupid? SHUT UP!
Here is a primer on what to say: "The Buckeyes are a great team. We battled them mightily last November and came up short," Hart said. "We hope to have a better showing this Fall."
This is a classic case of making excuses for a beloved family member. When David Boston opened his mouth, there were no one calling his comments "refreshing" or "thrilling."
Simple rule: don't give someone who pwns you and endless stream of bulletin board material.
This whole discussion is a joke. Do you really think that there's a large variance in the academic demands placed on kids at any of the top football schools? Give me a break.
- These schools are all trying to recruit the SAME KIDS. There are no "Notre Dame" kids. As so many domers have gleefully pointed out, this year ND has taken numerous kids who were Michigan leans. So ... these ND wonderkids would have been Michigan kids, if things had gone slightly differently.
- There are surely some really, really dumb kids that ND/Mich might steer clear of. Sure. But look at the top boards (Rivials, Scout, ESPN, whatever). The top kids get offers from the top schools. Period. Smart doesn't win, I'm afraid.
- There may be more PRESSURE on the kids at ND to finish their degree. But so what? By the time I was in college I was an adult. I knew what I wanted. If the kids who have no shot at the NFL also don't feel like finishing a degree (so that they have a chance at gainful employment), that's their fault.
To Irishdevil, people hate ND precisely for the reasons you mentioned: the holier than thou attitude. Fact is, there's nothing to be holy about--except touchdown Jesus. So, go nuts with that.
In Brian's defense, I don't think he necessarily meant to say that Michigan is a "harder" school than Notre Dame. I think what he really meant is that Michigan is a "better" school than Notre Dame.
Hopefully that clears up the confusion a bit.
Brian, FYI-ordered the book last Thursday on-line from Maple Street-came in yesterday. Nice work. Still haven't seen it in the Birmingham Borders.
Brian Ward:
"But you imply that UM is OMG-so-much-harder that those poor ol' (dumb?) UM football players just don't have a prayer in any majors other than the easy ones. And that's a joke of an argument. Or worse, it's true, and UM should not have accepted them when they cannot expect to succeed in at least a reasonable portion of the university's programs and instead will just be used for football."
It isn't a joke of an argument. While its possible to be a varsity athlete at UM and excel in engin, math, bio, architecture, etc, its rarely done and exceedingly difficult. That isn't a function of intelligence--its a function of time. Those are full-time majors that require extensive late-hour/weekend study. A varsity athlete simply doesn't have the time in the day.
As for whether Michigan should have accepted them in the first place, I think Brian has that covered: "Can we stop pretending that a random liberal arts degree is more useful to these players than their status as Michigan football players?" Brian isn't "blind" to a "problem"--he simply doesn't see a problem.
Neither do I. I graduated from Michigan with a degree in PoliSci and played sports in my spare time; football players graduate with a degree in sports and study in their spare time. The difference isn't an indictment on the standards of the University, as much as it is a reflection of the priorities of the University: That is, Michigan accepts and molds kids who are athletically gifted and kids who are academically gifted.
You ask why more players don't take advantage of both the academics and the athletics. The simple answer: Most do. General Studies may have been a BS major at ND, but at Michigan is a serious degree--recipients have to take something like 60 credit hours of upper level content in a certain number of academic disciplines.
Those who choose not to? I dunno, but I have a hard time seeing how that's the university's problem. The university devotes a massive amount of resources to tutoring athletes. While several of my non-athlete friends washed out of school, my athelete friends benefited from a massive support system within the university.
The most you can say here is that the University admits kids who can't hack it in the most difficult majors. The thing is: The same can be said for me, and a sizable majority of the Michigan grads with degrees in liberal arts. Most of US couldn't hack it in Engin or Business.
Gnarls-
I appreciate your attempt with humor and sarcasm, but no, it doesn't clear it up. Why? Because there is no information to back up that statement either. According to measures of undergraduate ranking, ND is "better". USN&WR rankings may be flawed, but they are the only objective standard there is.
Now, if you want to argue that UM's grad programs are better, that is true for many of them (some ND would be stronger in, specifically Theology/Philosophy).
I am sorry for OT:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_...h?
v=_eZvxS4Hwvw
Dennis Dodd interviewing Chad Henne.
And the interesting part is we are expanding our O with Shotgun. Though Henne qualified it with a "bit", but I do hope they regularly use it.
Brian u have to be about the most respected/infamous college football blogger out there. I think more nd fans visit your site than there own. Always fun to know u can get so many people worked up with just the "flick of the pen." As for the debate with respect to the intelligence of the student athletes from these two schools, let's just wait and see which team is "smart" enough to figure out how to win this fall!!! GO BLUE!
I am afraid that if smartness were the criterion we'd be beaten by ND for there is no one in the field as smart as Charlie Weis.
Weis is so smart that the Top 2% of Mensans call themselves Weisians.
Hart was born April 9, 1986, or about six months after the '85 OSU game which he should download now:
http://mgovideo.com/details.php?
...8f5cb79d44689ee
It seems to me that both of them should choose their words more carefully.
who's comparing Hart to Boston? that's pretty, pretty, prrrrretty PRERRRetty, pretty stupid. a guy on one team thinks he can beat the other team. wow, how damning. there's nothing in that statement that downgrades the other team. it's confidence from a member of one team. just b/c you lose, that doesn't mean you've lost your right to speak what you truely believe. i highly doubt that anything Mart said is BB material....wow a guy on their team thinks they can beat us....well they can. i bet Hartline et think they can beat M too...hold on!!! STOP THE PRESSES....he thinks what!!111!!??? shocking...
what do you want everyone to turn into, lou Holtz?
MSM: Lou, do you think you can beat Navy?
Cheater: well, i'm not sure, they are a good solid football team, yadda yadda yadda.
david boston said 'michigan is nobody'.....etc. no comparison.
David Boston: "If our offense and defense is clicking, we should win by two or three touchdowns."
Carr's response wins:
"I agree with David Boston. I think Ohio State should be two- or three-touchdown favorites."
Hart hasn't said anything nearly like that yet, and Carr has always done a good job making sure his players don't. I wouldn't be surprised if Hart DID though.
Also, ND fans are so predictable. Brian knows exactly how to push their buttons and get them to flip out with a single sentence. The remark was never intended to lead to serious discussion about the rigors of ND/UM academics; it was meant to piss off ND nation. And, as if on cue, it succeeded admirably. Point MGoBlog.
I disagree with your dissection of Hart's interview. Hart specifically mentions a coordinator job when he talks about Harbaugh and Michigan. Hart talks about not being able to "just come in and get a coordinator job at Michigan".
Hart was not inferring that Harbaugh could have been the head coach at Michigan after one year at SDSU or Stanford.
DanK, why are you being obstuse about this? Yes, Boston's comment was more egregious, but both comments are worthless. Do not lose to an opponent and immediately say you think you should have won. Is this complicated for people? Of course, we want our boys to "think they can win, hurrah!" That's not the point. It is classless not to give an opponent that defeats you credit. PERIOD.
Mike, you don't play video college football where what you think counts on the scoreboard. What he thought should have happened...guess what? It didn't happen.
Be classy, give credit to opponents and, if you despise them, beat them on the field and then give them credit again. Actions, not words. That's Michigan football.
"I walk into Ohio State every week and still to this day, on the door of the operating room where I go, is a Dispatch article slamming Mike Hart's comments."
I'm pretty sure this says more about OSU medical "professionals" than it does about Mike Hart. When the doctor walks in, does he say, "Hi Everybody!"
The myth of Notre Dame's academic "superiority" is never ending. Irish supporters like to use their "rigorous" standards as a defense as to why they are no longer among the elite of college football.
But the truth is their standards are no more demanding than two dozen other schools out there.
Notre Dame is a football factory, just like everyone else. They proved that when they turned down the Big Ten for admission, even though their faculty voted overwelmingly to join the conference and its academic research arm, the CIC. Football is number one priority there, and nothing else is close. Without football, they would be just another small midwestern college like Wabash or Wooster.
Hart also talks about JH coming to be a coordinator. He never mentions head coach.
IrishRugby,
ND stronger than Michigan in theology/philosophy grad? Ok, to the theology. But a big WTF on the philosophy.
http://www.philosophicalgourmet....com/
overall.asp
And that site's generous to ND by counting theology as philosophy of religion.
Domers:
You are living inside a glass house if you think all Notre Dame football players are "high-character, hard-working football players that can read and write, love their mamas and get placed into an environment where it is simply really uncool to be the kind of person who doesn't take care of business."
We know that can not be true for all Notre Dame football players. Maybe most players, but not all. The same thing is true with Michigan football players.
In terms of education, what exactly is your suggestions for Michigan football players? Take harder majors? Please, if I knew I could make it in the real world with a degree in knitting, I would do it in a heartbeat. Football players are not alone in taking the road of least resistance.
Not everybody goes to Michigan because it offers a "once-in-a-lifetime opportunity to take advantage of the faculty and fellow students at one of the best universities in the nation". Some students (including some football players) just want to get a Michigan brand. And that's okay. The only thing Michigan can do is to make sure that they take something useful along the way. And I think Michigan is doing a decent job. Can it do more? Sure, and I'm as sure as I can be that the athletic department is always trying to do more for their athlete-students.
notre dame fans seem to be the only group in the country willing to scream "we didn't say anything bad about you! why did you have to insult us?!" it's a rivalry, folks. trash talking is allowed and encouraged. deal with it.
MDan, i think hart did give credit to osu in the same interview at the end of the game last NOv 18. but he also spoke his mind WITHOUT downgrading osu, or the way they played.
i for one, am tired of the 'company line' espoused by 99% of all athletes. the thing is, Hart did just that, AND spoke from his heart, WITHOUT calling osu 'nothing' or whatever. and there's not ONE more thing Hart could have done to win that game....so he can say whatever the hell he wants, within reason...which is what he did.
MRG: you're close....When the doctors walk in they say, "Fuck Michigan, Everybody!"
Also, ND fans are so predictable. Brian knows exactly how to push their buttons and get them to flip out with a single sentence. The remark was never intended to lead to serious discussion about the rigors of ND/UM academics; it was meant to piss off ND nation. And, as if on cue, it succeeded admirably. Point MGoBlog.
ding ding ding ding ding!
The only sign I see when I enter the OR at OSU hospital says, "All employees much wash hands."
A couple of points for the Domers:
1) ND is a top-tier undergraduate school. I didn't really understand Brian's dig either, but have some pride for Christ's sake and don't take the bait on a little dig on a football blog. I, for one, don't give a flying fuck what anyone says about UM on a ND or OSU blog, and would never waste the ATP to type a retort. You're all better than that.
2) We recruit mostly the same players, so I think the discussion ends there. Our programs our eerily similar.
if there is one thing that will insure the permanent success of this blog, it is the overreactive tendencies of the ND trolls. all brian has to do is insert the words Norte Dame, at random, to lock in a hit count that's 50% more than any other post(save UFR).
Brian writes, literally, 2 words about ND (Notre and Dame). subsequently, a half dozen domers flock to write paragraph after paragraph. whose obsessed again?
MDan...I disagree with his recent comments, the ones about OSU you posted above. However, after the game, the post-game presser, he said, and I quote, "we didn't win today, they beat us, they were better than us." "We didn't score enough points on offense, we lost." "We should've got them the first time around, but we didn't so that's our fault."
Why would it be a "whole different game." Mike said, "we would've taken advantage of our opportunities, offensively and defensively"...nothing about OSU being inferior.
When being asked about the home field advantage, Mike said, "It's a huge advantage, but there's no excuses...the crowd energizes them, but that's no excuse at all."
Then Mike goes on and talks about how he thinks OSU and Michigan are still the top 2 teams in the country "regardless of what anyone says."
He gave a lot of respect to OSU, didn't make excuses, and talked about how his OFFENSE didn't put enough points on the board, he didn't even throw the defense under the bus (and we all know that was really who was more to blame). I read the recent comments, written in a Cleveland newspaper by a Cleveland based writer...surprise, surprise. I'll take that FWIW.
Not saying the writer made up his quote, but they could've easily taken it out of context. I did disagree with that comment about how he thinks they "definitely" would've beaten OSU in a rematch but not sure about Florida. I wasn't cool with that, but after the game he gave a lot of kudos to OSU...I don't know how you can compare the two with Boston though.
yes, brian -- if you wanna incite a message board debate and piss off domers, repeat a bs statement like you did for the second time so that we think you actually believe it ... but pissing off another schools fanbase with one-sentence blog comments isn't exactly a challenging sport
js -- i'm not saying that every nd recruit is an angel who cares as much about school as he does about football and women. some guys even turn out to be total pricks, but since you had to look so far back to find an example of one you should be able to see that they are few and far between at nd. check the fulmer cup standings for reference on that as well.
also, i don't know about all of michigan's recruits but looking at the top 100-150 recruits list, the ones that nd recruits are actually relatively few and scattered all across the board. there are some nasty athletes that i kinda wish we were going after, but we're not -- and with weis' confidence, you can be assured he's not ignoring these guys because he doesn't think he has a chance, he's ignoring them because of grades and/or character. not all our guys are smart, but the coach has to able to convince admissions that they will be able to succeed (ie graduate) from nd. they talk to teachers, counselors, parents and coaches and basically just want confirmation that the guy is "a good kid who works hard." so we've got guys like zibby who, trust me, is not the sharpest tool in the shed -- but he's graduating and starting charities already. we had guys like chris zorich, who was not a student of much in high school and didn't have high sat scores, but after an nfl career went back to law school. we had guys like julius jones, who, after being suspended for academics (something that probably wouldn't have happened at most programs), is at least the kind of person who cared enough to get his shit together, take classes at arizona state to earn his way back into nd, then graduated (instead of just finishing his collegiate football career elsewhere)
yes, every program is trying to get the same high-quality guys. nd just does a better job of picking out the academically borderline players from the bunch that they know will be successfully indoctrinated into the notre dame culture of work-ethic and service. i'm sorry it sounds like tired bs and that talking about how our guys are character guys is sickeningly annoying ... but it's freaking true so learn to accept it as a legitimate and relevent point to be made about the program and maybe we'll stop trumpeting it all the time. (i know neither of those things will happen, but had to make my point)
kgh, good points all. I do not consider Mike in Boston's class or even to be a trash talker per se. For all the good he said, though, he said the other, which isn't needed and not even true. Let the good stuff out there and resist the temptation to say, "but we're better." That's all. The second position is more classy than the first.
I read this blog almost as much as I read the ND blogs that are out there, and this is definitely one of the better ones around. Brian obviously knows what he's about.
So, my original point is even more right on. Why be so self-conscious about your blog's popularity that you have to include ND in a topic that certainly did not need it, just to try to get a few more hits.
I understand if you want to bring up the woodshed beating you gave us last year, and also to minimize the victory ND had in 05 (when UM was ranked #3) since you went on to 7-5 that year and were more overranked than we were last year (based on record anyway). Bring up strength of schedule, or how you have two legit Stiff-Arm trophy candidates this year.
For Christ sake, argue about who has the better stadium, game day experience, band or uniforms. To bring this academic BS into the ND-UM business when it was initiated by comments from a Michigan Alum who is now at Stanford is 1) total bushleague and 2) boring as the beginning of the season is just under a month away, and 3) just plain gay.
At least #3 is understandable, as it is Brian.
Okay, I want to apologize. Even though none of you bothered to give a serious response to my questions (sorry if I missed someone), I was curious to see where UM stands. I'm interested in the macro issue of player development in college football. Brian and UM draw my more micro posts because he posts thoughtfully on it from time to time (not including that silly 'integrity' argument). I am just as concerned with UGA (my parents' alma mater) as UM or other schools. I also picture UM as a place that would aim higher than your average BCS institution. Sorry that so many of you didn't understand my underlying interest, perhaps I should have toned down the first post.
Anyway, I looked at several BCS schools, and used the US NWR rankings as a proxy for school difficulty. It seems that the highly-ranked (academically) football schools fall into two distinct categories regarding grad rates: private and public. That's where I feel the apology is owed. Amongst public schools, UM does a tremendous job of graduating its players. This difference is a legitimate way to explain why UM's grad rates seem so low to me, and also perhaps explains why Brian and many commenters are fine with UM's degree of success in graduating players.
That said, I still think UM could do more for its student-athletes. A GS degree from UM is better than no degree. Still, few if any recruits came in saying that it is what they want to major in, and most could be matched to a more specific major of their interest with academic counseling. Granted, some just want to play football, and even those without NFL chances might be happy with any UM degree. But the football staff could encourage (more) students to follow those initial dreams, or identify them in the first place. (This is hard for coaches--Bob Davie, for example, benched NFL-bound Jabori Holloway because Jabori insisted on maintaining his computer engineering studies, which required a lab forcing him out of practice once a week. So yeah, under the wrong coach ND is no different.) While engineering and the like may indeed be too time-consuming for football players, and some might not want to put in the work necessary, I don't see why more players cannot get 'normal' majors suited to their aspirations. (Yes, I realize GS is a tailored curriculum, but Okham’s Razor would suggest that the high number of players taking this path use it more as a road of least resistance than a challenging course of studies.)
(Side note: since Brian used high other schools' grad rates to suggest UM has more integrity in grading/graduating its players, I cannot resist pointing out that UM has much higher grad rates than almost all its peer public institutions. Obviously, I don't really think UM is pulling an Auburn to inflate its grad rates any more or less than ND, BC or Vandy are. I just think the whole 'integrity' argument is hogwash.)
i wouldn't say the GS degree is easier than another degree a priori. i think it's simply more flexible that most degrees in terms of scheduling classes. inevitably, a typical major will have a few upper level core courses that are offered once a year (say in the fall) at a specific time. these create major conflicts that can probably be avoided with the GS degree.
Brian,
I think you need to listen to the Hart clip again. Hart states that "he's not just going to come in and be a coordinator at Michigan. He could have coached at SD the Stanford...."
Hart is not necessarily implying a HC change at Michigan in a year. Harbaugh could have been a OC/ DC.
Does anyone know what Stephen Colbert said about Morgan Trent? Or did he just appear on the board?
I don't know about what Colbert said, but Pat Forde said this: http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/c...36&
sportCat=ncf
Nicely put, Pat. For a guy that is somewhat of a douche, nicely put.
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