NOOOOO DO NO WANT!
This is as about as distressing as anything I can imagine.
Kittens?
A poster in the previous thread made an important point - that Michigan will win under Ferentz - but God in Heaven, I cannot think of anything that excites me less about Michigan football than this, if true.
This isnt like the horror. This is a permanant horror.
Two thoughts:
If this is true, there should erupt a firestorm of protest that really brings the heat on Coleman and Martin for cronyism and failing to do their job.
If this is true, what can people tell me about his S&C, his defensive prowess. Iowa always was nasty on defense a couple years ago - does Michigan under this guy promise nasty defense in our future?
I can't believe I am asking that question. How disheartening.
Wiki says:
Many major college and NFL teams have considered Ferentz as a candidate for their head coaching jobs. However, Ferentz has publicly declined any interest in other coaching positions, opting to stay at Iowa. On November 23, 2004, Ferentz and Iowa athletics director Bob Bowlsby agreed to a new contract extension that keeps Ferentz at Iowa until 2012.
On January 2, 2006 the head coaches of five NFL teams, Green Bay, St. Louis, Houston, New Orleans, and Minnesota, were fired. There was renewed speculation that Ferentz would be offered a head coaching job with one of those professional franchices. But such speculation was soon put to rest when Ferentz stated that he was still happy with his job at Iowa, and that he had no plans to leave.
-----------------------
i know about his statement earlier about his respect for the UM job, but why would he uproot to coach a rival? He was a Fry disciple. He's not not a Michigan man. He doesn't give two shits about our program.
How in the hell could this be the sum total of our search? After Martin did such a good job with the B-ball hire I honestly do not understand this. MSC's ties to Iowa aside, I still cannot fathom this.
And if the claims that Deboard would stay are true then it really could be the end of UM as a real player in the world of CFB.
WTF?!
Ferentz is from Royal Oak. For all we know, he may be a HUGE michigan fan...that never had the chance to play/coach there.
Ferentz was born in Royal Oak, but grew up in Pennsylvania. He did, however, send one of his daughters to UM.
Bottom Line: If we keep Debord, Gittleson, and Moeller then we are screwed. Nothing else matters.
THIS IS FAKE. I POST THIS UPDATE ON MLIVE AND A BUNCH OF PEOPLE ARE CLAIMING IT"S A FAKE RUMOR.
It doesn't matter where he is from, if he isn't liked - he isn't liked. This is disturbing.
I trust this blog more than Mlive. Sorry
We have the opportunity to completely transform our future, bring excitement to the program, and this is what we come up with? Thank you for hijacking Michigan football Ms. Coleman. Could they have found a less exciting hire? Thanks for going through the process and looking at all possible candidates for the position Bill Martin.
This is Michigan, one of the premier football coaching positions in the country, and we are going to settle because of cronyism. What a joke. I guess it fits in with our culture of lowered expectations. The one good thing that could have come out of this season...the one inkling of excitement and hope we had, will be dashed.
Brian Respond
http://www.hawkeyelounge.com/sho...ead.php?
t=17076
Guys, I think people in Iowa are snickering at our gullibility right now. Relax...I foresee the arrival of an airplane from Baton Rouge in our future. Les is more.
Ferentz is a good coach. But I fail to see how he is better, in any way other than press conferences, than Les Miles. Les completely turned around a sorry Ok. St. program, repeatedly bumping off OU in the process. He has continued to kick a tremendous amount of ass in the SEC. Les would sell his soul to the devil to beat Ohio State, which is what we need. Passion and excitement...not more rock. This is totally insane.
Gingel,
I agree
One thing about Les. Did you see the way he completely mismanaged the gameclock in the 4th and O.T. against Arkansas?
MeeechiganDan - The S&C gurus at wingedhelmet.com have been leading the criticism of Gittleson for years now, and they seem to have a very high opinion of Iowa's program.
http://theiowaconservative.com/s...a3c8277&
t=17083
This is funny:
http://sports.aol.com/fanhouse/2...ichigan-really/
Ferentz has two big ten titles and also turned around Iowa's program. Les Miles has not won anything at either school. So I fail to see the how Miles has proven more.
besides, if Ferentz is hired, I've heard from a reliable source that Tacopants' younger brother will de-commit and go to LSU to play for the coach he prayed would come to UM. We can't afford to lose a 10 foot tall recieving prospect.
I am going into cardiac arrest.
Please tell me this is wrong.! I dont wish to have Les either but this is worse. Talk about hiring Sabans little brother...PLEASE you money grabing p/s martin tell me it isnt true.....Bo preached THE TEAM THE TEAM and to go with someone who is for MYSELF MYSELF.. and to keep debored and yes I spelled that right. next thing your gonna say is goss is coming back...ughhhh
I don't know what's happening, but I refuse to believe that a program of Michigan's stature would offer the job without completing due diligence with the rest of football-coaching-America. If true, this is about as hasty as it gets. I can't believe Martin (and whomever else making these decisions) would be this unprofessional. It simply doesn't fit.
What time is the rally to protest the hiring, if it does indeed take place? 30 minutes before the press conference? There should be an organized protest.
What am I going to do with a set of devalued season tickets every year? It certainly wont be worth going to the games after he turns us into nebraska.
I still feel that wretched bitch, Coleman, had a hand in this.
I _WILL_ picket in front of her house if this is true.
Good god how awful and waste of $'s...just hire Jim Grobe and be done with it.
Everyone stop assuming there wasn't due diligence. The AD knew Lloyd was retiring for a long time and has probably been conducting a search for a while behind the scenes.
The troubling thing is that there probably was a search, and Ferentz was the chosen candidate. That is ridiculous.
Good thing Sue Coleman doesn't have a previous relationship with Charlie Weiss.
I still think this bullshit
Yeah, I feel like someone just threw a bucket of ice cold water on my nuts - just before pouncing on Nelli Furtado. I feel neutered...
Okay, okay. Three minutes of simple internets searching convinced me of the folly of such a rumor.
Martin isn't planning on hiring Football Amaker after all...
I say we hire WAYNE FONTES!!
Jason, I think Brian's making it clear that that Iowa troll is NOT the source of all this speculation. That guy is just claiming credit for it all.
I am searching too... that is why I posted the above link. Somethings going on - but the good news is there is no ESPN buzz on it.
Until I see an AP news wire stating Ferentz was offered and hired, this nothing but a bunch of internet bullshit.
If rivals has indeed jumped on this story too, it proves that they are no more reputable than this blog....specifically since Brian prefaced the story by saying it may be a rumor.
TheMile thanks.
I think Brian might get burned on this one, disclaimers or no.
Seems to be untrue if you read all that's out there. I just wish it weren't Brian on this, because his track record is so good.
There were admittedly a few trolls out on the Michigan Rivals board from our site. However, the poster mentioned in this blog entry is of surpassing credibility, and was conceding that he may not have it right.
It would be incorrect to cast aside the entire rumor because of the trolls.
Les Miles=JFK
Kirk Fernetz=Jimmy Carter
'nuff said
this is true... but like I said, if the MSM isn't reporting it. There isn't much to report.
Maiz... I agree LMAO
Les Miles = BMW
Kirk Ferentz = '69 'vette (as in CHEvette)
LMAO!
Can we get lloyd to be president of UM. He'd do a way better job than Mary Sue? Lloyd may not know coaching as well as we'd like him to, but he can sell Michigan better than anyone!
I'd rather have Brian "get burned" on this than have Kirk Ferentz as our next coach.
My oh my how quickly we switch from "Les Miles' wife just bought a house in Barton Hills" to "Oh God Kirk Ferentz is the new coach and UM is going to hell."
Let's hope that 50% of rumors are true. And in this case, the former is true and not the latter.
But wait...maybe the Miles family actually did buy a house in Barton Hills...but they just want to winter in Michigan, and continue coaching at LSU? Sounds plausible.
so...the only source is some iowa message board and some random guy that says he has sources in Iowa. Yeah, and I have some ocean land to sell you in the Sahara Desert.
I dunno why I am staying up and reading this shit. Nothing definite is going to happen for at least a day or so. We certainly are not going to see anything definite tonight.
Guess I am just so pissed at this possibility that I can't let it go. God help me.
Hehe. I now officially believe NOTHING. Except that there are 265 visitors online right now...
268 and counting. We are all LOSERS!!!
Wolverine-
I try to laugh at the prospect of Ferentz so I don't cry about it.
btw-
Les Miles- MacArthur
Ferentz - BeaArthur
Can we get lloyd to be president of UM. He'd do a way better job than Mary Sue?
Better yet, can we get rid of Lloyd? Give him his money and get his "Old Guard" out of there.
276...
And the loser parade continues...
ferentz becomes the new head coach and im going to cheer for florida state or miame fla so at least i can go watch a losing program in nice weather.....
ferentz has got to be a joke.....he and debord combined make about 1/2 of a coach
OMG! Still climbing. Bets on 300; any takers?
Bea Arthur (As Maude or Dorothy Zbornak?) lol.
But seriously, the way I took this new post is that Brian is crediting a new claim on the same message board that admitted they made up a rumor to get Michigan fans going. Am I correct in taking it that way? Or am I reading wrong?
While I've been an enormous critic of Bill Martin for quite some time, and I have very little faith in the man for sticking with Lloyd as long he did, there's no way this can be true. Even if they wanted to hire Ferentz they would wait longer than a week. Otherwise it would look like they didn't do their homework, especially with such an unpopular hire. While Ferentz absolutely fits Martin's "clone of Lloyd" search criteria, the timing is too close to Lloyd's resignation for me to take the bait. I call bullshit. If UM hires Ferentz then I'll concede that Magnus has been right about something, anything at some point during one of his posts. That's how bad this hire would look to me.
Awww.... crap.
I just don't get this. IF (big if) the offer is true and IF KF accepts, doesn't U-M know what the reaction will be amongst the boosters? I will tell you this. I have given money to U-M in the past, but if they try and tell me this shit sandwich is tasty, I am done with them. BM said he still had 20 candidates to look at and there are no confirmed interviews with ANYONE. This is not a thorough search, and this is NOT the "best coach in America". Fuckers (if true)!
I thought he had 30 on his list...
I e-mailed Bill Martin and asked him not to hire Kirk Ferentz.
I got an e-mail back. I'm not sure whether it was him, a secretary, or what.
But it said, "Thank you for sharing your views with me. Bill"
if (KFerentz==NewCoach)
{
Hurt = AppState+1
}
\I'm going to cry until my eyes bleed.
Magnus,
I emailed him too and got the same response. He's not reading them I am sure of that.
Yeah, he's probably not reading them.
I was just surprised that I got a response of any sort.
If this is true, and I sure as heckfire hope it's not, someone's gotta do something about Mary Sue.
She singlehandedly set the basketball team back years by holding onto Amaker as long as she did. And now she's bringing in her buddy from Iowa?
This is ridiculous. This guy doesn't bring a SINGLE positive to the table:
- no UM ties (let alone ties to the State of Michigan)
- no track record of success
- no track record of recruiting
- one of highest salaries in college football
If UM wants a "standup guy" to coach UM football, regardless of track record or coaching talent, let me be the first to throw my name into the ring. I'm sure you'll love me, Mary Sue. We'll go pick up some whippets at Sergeant Peppers.
Les Miles- Yosemite Sam
Ferentz- Casper
During the fall of my soph year at UM in the 2400 section of Couzens Hall (circa '90), there was a pal of ours who didn't speak English very well. Instead of saying, "You suck," he'd say "You sucks."
Well, if Ferentz takes the helm at UM, I can officially say that we will officially "SUCKS."
Ergo, my new battle cry against Ferentz is, "Please don't make us sucks...hire MILES!"
Bassmrod, LMAO.
Mgoblue, if I remember right, he said he started with 30 when Lloyd said he was going to retire, and that the list is now down to 20. Seems like there was more work to do than can be accomplished in 6 days. Nothing about this rumor makes sense except that we are jaded Michigan fans and we know it *could* be true. Plus the MSC connection with Ferentz is troublesome. She could have just said "make him an offer" and BM's detailed search was screwed. And since Lloyd is a fan of KF, he probably would be fine with it. Guess my point is, this does NOT sound like BM. But who knows if he is calling the shots?
And I thought my Pats possibly blowing it against a much inferior team was really bad news tonight.
Thank god I'm almost drunk.
Seriously, this would be a side move, at best. And it would be none too surprising.
People, I got the same response from my e-mail. I suggest we keep loading them up. If the rumor is really an exaggeration of the fact that Ferentz is going to be interviewed, it would be nice to have a fanbase implosion on record.
Serenity now...serenity now...
I will say this Brian...
I have more faith in you when your sources are from Michigan insiders...guys that you know and have worked with etc. You went out on a limb here with info from outside sources, and it may come back to bite you. In many ways this may be karma. Everyone was so proud of you after the whole "Lloyd retirement thing" and you were acting a bit self-important (you did have a reason to be pissed though) with the whole main stream media fall out). There is a place for both blogs and the main stream media, and this may serve as a great reminder to why the two need remain seperate entities.
What's Martin's email address?
"possibly" blowing it, that is.
wcmartin@umich.edu
Serenity now, insanity later.
wcmartin@umich.edu
marysuec@umich.edu
wcmartin@umich.edu
Not sure, but I think BM's address might be wcmartin@umich.edu.
;-)
I have to agree. I am dissapointed at this latest post on here...based on the fact that two other blogs were cited...one being the blog that posted the original fake rumor hawkeyelounge...then the final link goes to the spartan tailgate. How can you even think for a second that this "annoucement" post is any different from the one started by iowahawkeyess.
Did anyone actually watch the LSU-Arkansas game? I'm not crazy about Ferentz at all, but you'd really rather have Miles? Really? Really?
If I find out Bill Martin hired Ferentz I will email him every day for the rest of his tenure as AD telling him to eff off. If he hits me with an autoresponse, I will autoresponse his ass back telling him to eff off for eternity. It is not going to happen. No way.
@ Steve
I don't want Ferentz, either, but your point that he has "no track record of success" is slightly off base.
Someone pointed this out earlier, I believe, but he finished in the top 10 for three straight years earlier this decade. He's been a winner. He just hasn't been able to do it consistently.
outbackbowl4ever@umich.edu
@ Magnus,
No way he is reading them...You know how many emails he is getting now. Emails from non-contacts are scanned by his secretary or go directly to the trash bin.
Dear UM Fans:
It has been brought to my attention by serveral members of the University of Michigan Athletic Department that a rumor has begun circulating on this web log (and others) that I have accepted the Head Coach position with the Michigan football program.
While we wanted to wait until tomorrow to make a formal announcement, the comments and speculation on this site has convinced me (along with Bill Martin and President Coleman) to address the rumors here first.
I have in fact been offered, and I have in fact accepted, the Head Coach position with the Michigan football program.
I am greatly honored by the offer and the trust that it entails. I do not take this position lightly, and I hope to prove to all Michigan fans -- including those of you on this board -- how determined I am to live up to the legacy that Lloyd Carr, Gary Moeller and Bo Schembechler have created at UM.
Please give me a chance to make you proud.
Best,
Kirk Ferentz
Oh No! Has Magnus already begun to apologize for Ferentz? AHHHHH!!!!!! This can't be true!!!!!
Miles is the coach in one of the toughest conferences and lets face it the Big 10 is not really that great of a conference from a competitive standpoint.
If he can pull out a 2 loss season in the SEC imagine what he can do in the Big 10. I think Les Miles would be a great addition to UofM football.
Dear Fake Coach Ferenz,
Please go jerk yourself off until your c*ck is raw.
Les Miles proved that he is not a great gameday coach by calling timeouts at the wrong times...specifically in the 4th quarter and overtime.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5...h?
v=5513mXmQbw4
AAB, I think you are confusing a bad game with a bad coach. We all have bad games. We all know that Miles is going to be good for a bonehead clock mismanagement fiasco every once in a while.
What you get with Miles is competitive fire, balls-to-the-wall top-notch recruiting, guts, crazy shit brass balls, a hatred of Ohio State, a guy who puts away 76-3 his 1-AA cake games, and success against arch-rivals. Especially with this Ferentz cloud hanging over my head, I will cut out my liver with a grapefruit spoon to have that coaching Michigan in September, 2008.
@ Not a Miles fan
It's not an apology. It's a statement of fact. Or are you opposed to those?
Les Miles= The Godfather
Kirk Ferentz= Harold and Kumar Go To White Castle (oh wait, I love that flick)
That Serenity Now clip was f-ing hilarious...
@ Magnus:
Yeah, you're right, he did have a few good years there. But 7-4, 6-7, 6-6 over the last three years does not fill me with a whole lot of respect for the man's record as a whole.
Meeeechigan Dan
"I think you are confusing a bad game with a bad coach. We all have bad games. We all know that Miles is going to be good for a bonehead clock mismanagement fiasco every once in a while."
Are you serious??? In such a HUGE game, you'd expect a good coach to make errors like that? I don't recall LC EVER making a bonehead call like that.
Hiring Ferentz would be terrible. You think Carr sucked? Look at Ferentz's record against Iowa State: 3-7!!! He'a lost 2 straight to Indiana! And isn't his B10 conference record the last 3 years is under .500?
This hire would infuriate A LOT of the program insiders that I know.
I don't care about fire. Like, at all. I just want a good Xs and Os coach. That's all I'm looking for.
Oh, and there's also this; that team has more talent than God, and it hasn't beaten up on anyone since the 3rd game of the season. Bad games happen, and close games happen, but a team with doucet, dorsey, flynn, perrilloux, holliday, lafell, dickson, beckwith, favorite, steltz, chevis jackson and highsmith should blow out 98% of their opposion, not be the cardiac kids.
Thank you folks. I'll be back after the Pats game.
Just a coincidence that the original "Serenity Now" guy is named Lloyd? Is he telling us to just accept the painful reality?
KF's HC record at Maine and Iowa is 85-91. Sweeeeeet!
I'm going to re-state that i like Chuck Martin to take over the Michigan head coaching position... if not Martin then Kelly bringing Martin in as Defensive coordinator, but i still would like to see Martin as HC.
First of all he is a winner, both on and off the field. He's a man of character who promotes community involvement with his team and also has had great success on the field. His Grand Valley State University football team holds the longest active winning streak in college football and is making a bid for his third NCAA Division 2 national championship as a head coach, and has been the defensive coordinator on two other national championship teams at GVSU (2002 and 2003). His record as a head coach is 48-3. He's a great up and coming young coach (38 years old) who has the potential to coach and win at Michigan for a long time.
What more do you want the guy to prove... 2 straight national titles, probably going to win another one this year... he was a defensive coordinator for two other national title teams at GVSU, since he came in as Defensive coordinator, the records for GVSU football:
(DC) 2000: 7-4 With a team full of sophomores who lost their first three games...
(DC) 2001: 13-1 Trip to the Title Game
(DC) 2002: 14-0 National Title
(DC) 2003: 14-1 National Title (AFTER 25 seniors from the 2002 team graduated)
(HC) 2004: 10-3 Regional Finalists
(HC) 2005: 13-0 National Title
(HC) 2006: 15-0 National Title
(HC) 2007: Sitting at 11-0 and making another National Title run.
let's take a look at GVSU's NC teams... 12.24 points allowed - 2005, 15.54 points allowed - 2006, 13.34 points allowed per game - 2003 (9 points allowed in all 3 rounds of the playoffs), 17.85 Points allowed per game. Solid defense has been the benchmark that brought GVSU their titles. Who led the defense? That's right... Martin in 2002, and 2003, then he was the Head Coach for the 2005 and 2006 national title teams... in his 4th year coaching, he's on his way to another National Championship (3 in 4 years). This kind of coach is a great prospect ans i think he'd be GREAT for Michigan Football.
@ Magnus,
Are you really already starting to apologize for a coach we haven't even hired yet and hopefully won't? You will rationalize anything. He is a .500 coach the past three years. I appreciate your attempt to see the positive, especially during this hard time for our program, but have some balls here. You already admitted you don't like Ferentz and don't want him as coach, so don't start defending him as a said "winner" just not "consistently." That is a wordsmith spin that translates to Mediocre.
@Wild Onion:
From reading the HLounge message boards it appears the guys saying that the rumor is a hoax are frequent bullshit posters. That doesn't appear to be the case with dghawk. Is my summary correct?
And, there are a few references on RCMB and elsewhere, I have forgotten specifically where, to mainstream media and particularly radio shows in Iowa. Has there been anything in Iowa at all from MSM, other than the AD saying that there will be no comment from Ferentz (which by itself seems a departure from past situations where he was offered/interviewed)?
I think Ferentz could be a great choice. If he can recruit to Iowa City, he'll clean up at Michigan. Two years ago he was a dream candidate and had the cache of Urban Meyer. What has changed? He's a known quantity to President Coleman and AD Martin and a proven winner who would be immediately available, thus not interrupting this year's recruiting efforts. Remember, Lloyd and his staff have been recruiting against him for some time and he must check out as extremely clean or Michigan wouldn't touch him. Remember also that Michigan will make him better than he was before us! That's what Michigan does for people, just like it did for Bo.
Miles is a buffoon. Much better than Carr and Ferentz but still a monkey. Martin won't hire us a monkey or someone worse than a monkey. All of this is just bullshit. Let it rest and watch Brady go to 11-0. How again was Brady just a decent QB at UM? Oh yeah, Carr and his cronies. The same guy who is not supposed to be involved in choosing his successor.
I just got a call from Kirk Ferentz. He wanted me to tell everyone not to worry...he's decided to stay on as coach in the middle of bumf***egypt Iowa and continue coaching .500 squads who lose to Iowa State.
Whew, that was close.
This has probably been posted before, but it's the first time I've looked at these numbers. From Wikipedia. The second row in the Iowa years is his Big Ten record.
1990 Maine 3-8
1991 Maine 3-8
1992 Maine 6-5
1999 Iowa 1-10 0-8 11th
2000 Iowa 3-9 3-5 8th
2001 Iowa 7-5 4-4 T-4th
2002 Iowa 11-2 8-0 T-1st
2003 Iowa 10-3 5-3 T-4th
2004 Iowa 10-2 7-1 T-1st
2005 Iowa 7-5 5-3 T-3rd
2006 Iowa 6-7 2-6 T-8th
2007 Iowa 6-6 4-4
TOTAL: 73-70 38-34
You don't care about fire? Only about Xs and Os? Well, Ferentz is your guy, then.
And anyone who thinks LSU is loaded with talent, you're nuts. An average QB, a slow RB, sure some studs on D, but spare me. You don't think people look at Hart, Henne, Manningham, Arrington, Long et al and shake their heads why WE didn't pour 50 points on people every game? LSU is playing a tough schedule and lost two OT games to decent opponents. Spare me the "should be blowing everyone out" cliche.
First of all he is a winner, both on and off the field. He's a man of character who promotes community involvement with his team and also has had great success on the field. His Grand Valley State University football team holds the longest active winning streak in college football and is making a bid for his third NCAA Division 2 national championship as a head coach, and has been the defensive coordinator on two other national championship teams at GVSU (2002 and 2003). His record as a head coach is 48-3. He's a great up and coming young coach (38 years old) who has the potential to coach and win at Michigan for a long time.
What more do you want the guy to prove... 2 straight national titles, probably going to win another one this year... he was a defensive coordinator for two other national title teams at GVSU, since he came in as Defensive coordinator, the records for GVSU football:
(DC) 2000: 7-4 With a team full of sophomores who lost their first three games...
(DC) 2001: 13-1 Trip to the Title Game
(DC) 2002: 14-0 National Title
(DC) 2003: 14-1 National Title (AFTER 25 seniors from the 2002 team graduated)
(HC) 2004: 10-3 Regional Finalists
(HC) 2005: 13-0 National Title
(HC) 2006: 15-0 National Title
(HC) 2007: Sitting at 11-0 and making another National Title run.
let's take a look at GVSU's NC teams... 12.24 points allowed - 2005, 15.54 points allowed - 2006, 13.34 points allowed per game - 2003 (9 points allowed in all 3 rounds of the playoffs), 17.85 Points allowed per game. Solid defense has been the benchmark that brought GVSU their titles. Who led the defense? That's right... Martin in 2002, and 2003, then he was the Head Coach for the 2005 and 2006 national title teams... in his 4th year coaching, he's on his way to another National Championship (3 in 4 years). This kind of coach is a great prospect ans i think he'd be GREAT for Michigan Football.
For the Record... Kelly before Martin:
1991: 9-3
1992: 8-3
1993: 6-3-2
1994: 8-4 Conference Title first round playoff loss (sound familiar?)
1995: 8-3
1996: 8-3
1997: 9-2 Conference title, first round playoff loss (sound familiar?)
1998: 9-2 Conference title, first round playoff loss (sound familiar?)
1999: 5-5 To be fair, the team was mostly freshmen
Also AFTER GVSU without Martin on his staff
CMU
2004: 4-7
2005: 6-5 (5-3 in the MAC)
2006: 10-4 (MAC Championship and a win over MIDDLE TENNESSEE in the Motor City Bowl)
...not all that impressive.
WITH MARTIN AS DC
(DC) 2000: 7-4 With a team full of sophomores who lost their first three games...
(DC) 2001: 13-1 Trip to the Title Game
(DC) 2002: 14-0 National Title
(DC) 2003: 14-1 National Title (AFTER 25 seniors from the 2002 team graduated)
(HC) 2004: 10-3 Regional Finalists
(HC) 2005: 13-0 National Title
(HC) 2006: 15-0 National Title
(HC) 2007: Sitting at 10-0 and making another National Title run.
Speaks volumes to me regarding Martin's Defensive mind, and he's proven that
@ Bend It Like Gingell
Get off my ass.
I clearly said I don't want Ferentz as a coach.
I said "he's been a winner. He just hasn't done it consistently." As in past tense. It was in response to someone saying that he "has no track record of success," which is a statement that can be argued, based on his top 10 finishes (at Iowa!) from 2000-2002.
Chill out.
what is ferentz' record vs sweatervest?
TJA,
I apprecite you are trying to be positive, but I don't remember KF ever being an Urban Meyer-like commodity. Regardless, his record recently in a terrible Big Ten is inexcusable. He's the guy building the program. Who can he blame? One way or another, it's on him (recruiting, game day coaching, etc.). And with Michigan fans wanting to see some dynamic offense, he seems to add nothing there. Nothing for the average Joe to get excited about.
God damn Pats will win another one. Do not like.
why don't you like the patriots to win??? tom brady?
Iowa is 1-6 vs. OSU since '98, with the one victory over Tressel in '05 33-7
This may be the deathblow to my Michigan fandom. I've never been less interested than I was in 2007, and I have zero enthusiasm for a Ferentz-led Michigan program. I wish I still had the enthusiasm - I miss it. But how can I get excited for more of the same old "run or die trying" crap? Why does Michigan football have to be so f***ing joyless?
Can't stand Bellicheck. The guy has zero class. Pats fans like him cause he wins, but if Carr is the best example of class, Coach B is the posterchild for being a Dick.
Also, Brady and his knocking up chicks ways don't thrill me either.
Honolulu Blue,
You do realize that Kelly took over a CMU program that never went better than 3-8 under Mike Debord? Oh wait, you didn't know that did you?
Belichek has no class? You mean because he doesn't smile at the handshake??? His job is to win games. And because Brady impregnated his girlfriend at the time...wow. you must be a saint.
@ Jay A:
If the information on this site - http://www.nationalchamps.net - is to be trusted, then it looks like Ferentz is 1-3 against Tressel. There were a few years where the two teams did not go head-to-head.
Alright, looks like the Pats are going to squeek out this one in Lloyd Carr fashion.
As I said earlier, KF would be a side move, at best. Now, if the season started tomorrow, I'd probably watch UM's first game like I watch Tulane-New Mexico State out of the corner of my eye while browsing internet porn. But we'd have months and month to absorb this and, yeah, get excited about this. I guess.
Seriously, I wouldn't expect the same logic that was applied to the basketball hire to be done at the football level. Football is "healthy", in this administration's view. Miami, Nebraska, it'll never happen to Michigan Football. Right.
i am much, much more alarmed at the prospect of keeping gittleson, debord, etc than the prospect of ferentz
@WolvieEric.
And I was starting to like you. Pity.
@ Bend It...
In Brian's defense, Carr's retirement was tagged as "actual news", and included resolute language that the announcement was for real.
Ferentz's could-be-hire post starts with "I have no idea how to judge the truthiness of this post...." and tagged as rumormongering.
Brian's credibility is unbroken, IMHO, regardless of how Ferentz news turns out. When Brian's sure, he says he's sure. When he's not, he's upfront about it. Seems fair enough to me...
JMan
Some pretty good info here. Quite useful.
http://football.stassen.com/reco...l-
opponent.html
Ferentz - Bea Arthur
Les Miles - Adrienne Barbeau
1. No I am no saint, but I don't knock chicks up and then not marry them. Gee, call me old fashioned, but I don't believe that being there as a parent is a choice. Once you father 'em, man up! The guy has zero excuses. If you aren't prepared to be the father, don't perform the act.
2. Only a Pats fan would defend Coach B. If Tressel behaved the way he does you would be KILLING him on this board. The guys is a miserable human being and no, winning is NOT the only thing that matters. If everyone in the world was a dick, but they were "successful" at their jobs, what would the point be to living? There is no excuse for not being polite. At least that's what my old-fashioned, backwards Midwest upbringing taught me.
This is awful.
keep all talk of morality for anywhere but here please
What we call "morals" is simply blind obedience to words of command.
wolvieric,
You are hilarious. First of all, he had broken up with Bridget Monayhan or whoever that was. THEN he found out she was pregnant. So do you go back and marry her LOL??? SO that is ONE girl he knocked up. He also was there for the pregnancy if that says something.
And I am a Pats fan because I think they put out their best effort every sunday for every game. You say Belichek is a "miserable human being." My god. Have you even met him? Have you talked to him? That is ridiculous. Would you rather have Belichek "fake a smile" at the handshake or would you rather that he be himself? You are ridiculous. Wow
Alright, alright. Let's not get so freaking DEEP pleeeeeeease.
I know a couple of friends who's ex got pregnant after they broke up. It's a chick (bitch) trick.
I think that this thread is imploding because of the negative energy of a potential Ferentz hire.
Now THAT'S deep. Hehe.
Dear lord, people... we're leaving out the most important part of the Brady equation. GISEE BUNDCHEN.
You don't leave Gisele Bundchen, even if Bridget Moynahan is having your baby.
It's just common sense.
great time for comcast to die...
anyway, I just wanted to remind everyone that this isn't Brian's scoop like with Lloyd. he's linking to something of interest with the appropriate disclaimers.
and for what it's worth, martin and mary sue knew we'd react like this. if they make this hire, they must have tremendous faith that he'll be successful...however they're defining it.
@mgobleu
Sorry, it's the Stella Artois talking.
Steve,
You couldn't be more correct.
But, even though Brian has cited this as rumormongering, he is still crediting a blog site as a source for Ferentz announcement. This is the same site that is openly bragging that they started a Ferentz to Michigan rumor just to rile Michigan fans up.Not to mention he also in the same post sites spartan tailgate as having a source an Iowa newspaper editor that Ferentz has an offer.
Anyone can say anything on the internet, to believe that this person might actually be an editor after the masses of other crap that was posted today....yeah and I'm having an affair with Les Miles and I can tell you for sure that he is coming to Michigan and leaving his wife and kids for me....come on...
Don't be sorry; I laughed.
@ JMan
I totally agree that this is not a shot to Brian's credibility, as he did preface the post saying it might be a rumor. What I am saying, is that it is a reminder of what a blog is, in that you can post rumors and innuendo and say, "maybe this will come to be." So because he can engage in such posts unlike the main stream media (except Fox News of course), he is more likely to "break" a story than the main stream media, even if they have the same info and sources. (Their protocol is much more strict and beurocratic before print) As I said before....Such is the blessing and curse of the blogosphere.
Hopefully, brady knocks up a dozen more...
and then sends all of his sons to QB at UM in an endless chain of descendants!
What's that about throwing the first stone? I'm not judging anyone, because I've certainly made plenty of mistakes myself. Frankly, same with Belicheck - he's getting paid to win, and he's doing it.
Wolvieric, ONE last thing.
I banged a girl a couple weeks ago. I told her I would call her. I didn't. Does that make me a miserable human being too?
I sent an email to BM an hour ago...haven't gotten a response yet. Mary Sue must have cracked the whip and told him to get his ass to bed. I have multiple sources placing her at Victoria's Secret in Briarwood, and buying a slinky little silk number for her Billy.
1. Imagine that. Going back and taking responsibility for something you have done. That's insane! I guess when you have money and fame you can just feed cash from your future kid from afar and see him twice a month.
2. Bellicheck. Watch his press conferences. Read articles about the man. He is abusive to everyone he works with. He's an admitted cheater who kept cheating after he was warned by the NFL not to. B4 Coach B I had no opinion of the Pats whatsoever. Now I do. Can't stand 'em. It's not envy. I respect the Colts because of the way they conduct themselves on and off the field (mainly Dungy). You can win with class. That is what we demand of our U-M coaches. Why don't you demand it from the Pats? Isn't that what this search has been all about? Winning with class?
name that coach:
hell yeah!
PZ,
I hope he does it every 4 years though...ya know to keep the talent flowing in.
it wouldn't be moral if he did it more often than every four years!
I realize this is the MSM I am writing about, but ESPN's Sunday version of Gameday still called Miles the number one choice, but did mention Ferentz as a serious candidate for the position.
I got laid a couple hours ago. Then I neglected her to watch football and surf the internets. I may be a bad person, but she's the dummy that married me.
You respect the colts? You do know they have been accused of piping in crowd noise right??? Several times. Also Tony Dungy is against gay marriage. Not that I give a F&ck, but does that make him a miserable human being?
Murphy: Can the robot be... a beautiful woman?
Sparks: ...Sure
Murphy: Then I shall be an Adrienne Barbeau Bot. The Queen of Mars from Olympus Mons to Tharsis!
/Approximated Sealab quotes
Hopefully Drew Henson isn't also reproducing at the same rate....
Then the kin of Lloyd will be left to debate how to ensure a 3 loss season by cycling qbs.
You know, I suffered as a Pats fan since the 80's, and since Belicheck has been around, they've won 3 Super Bowls and are this millennium's dynasty.
Now, I'd love the coach to be a great guy who reads to orphans every monday night and helps old ladies cross the street on their way to the church on bingo night, but god dammit, I'd rather have a coach who wins. And I feel the same about the next UM coach, if he's not KF.
Gingel,
LOLOLOL
and YOU KNOW a lloyd clone won't learn from the first time. right?
depends on who henson's banging. i'd say that right now brady has the advantage.
I pray this is not true.... Not Ferentz....
Take the non-football shit elsewhere.
The Colts are piping crowd noise. And their GM likes to assault opposing team's employees. He also gave Bush the intelligence report on Irak, for what it's worth.
@ namethatcoach,
Of course not, but we would definitely have "tremendous" character and class.
Serenity now,
EXACTLY. I don't watch football games because the head coach is a good person. I watch because I want to root for the team. And then they can just say the right things at the press conference or whatever.
seriously, enough already
I know nothing of Tom Brady's character, I do know that Bill Belechek is a cheater.
P.S: On the actual topic - I believe rumors when they come from a blog (eg. Brian on Lloyd's departure) I dont trust a fan board any more than I trust the random old person in our dorm who told me we accepted a bid to the Outback Bowl (is this true, by the way)?
Dennis Fifthian is going to talk anout it at Midnight on 1270
@ gingell
character and class > wins
hands down!! LOL
@namethatcoach.
Right on. There IS a line to be drawn on coach behavior, but let's not go Ned Flanders on people.
Also in retrospect the Patriots shit was unecessary and a little immature - disregard it
Then I'm left to conclude that U-M is right, and we DO need someone like Ferenz. Everyone gives lip service to saying Michigan should win the "right way" but what they really mean is win, cheat if you need to, but don't get caught. Also, be classy in public, but if you want to be a complete a**hole in private just don't get caught.
I for one rooted for the Fab Five but found myself not really liking it, cuz I knew what was going on. I kept asking myself "why do I root for these guys?". Call me crazy, but I like people to win the right way to set an example. No one is perfect, but there are simple things you can do and not do to demonstrate integrity and class.
I go to school out in Iowa (not at Iowa), and the local NBC affiliate just talked about Brian's report specifically as the main source of the 'rumor'. They even had a little screen shot of the Web site.
The Ferentz story actually led the 10 o'clock news out here.
A local NBC affiliate in Iowa? Really...in Iowa???
Hopefully it was his first post they cite with his personal sources and not the other "sources" in the second one.
WolvieEric,
Were you friends with Ed Martin? You say you knew what was going on with the Fab Five. You are a criminal then because you didn't report this to the authorities, and therefore YOU are a miserable human being.
Ned Flanders for next coach?? I hear he can recruit the religious circles VERY well.
I'M a miserable human being. Miserable reading this crap and sitting in my filth. I must shower and sleep.
Hey - we could have Colt McCoy x100 if we got all the zealots!
namethatcoach...you are definitely on to something.
How many players, after winning games, always give God all the credit? Losers never give God credit. Therefore the most religious teams always win. Ned Flanders would win every game, ever.
I gotta go bang another chick...I might call her back...but probably not. Unless she's preggers...but then again she's a hooker and we're meeting at a neutral site. Then I've got church tomorrow. Goodnight.
Once again....
The seperation between "Church (faith) and State (fact)" ---Blogs and Mainstream has been broken. This is the fault of the mainstream media, as Brian's blog can post whatever it wants, even conjecture. However, due to the MMM's irresponsible use of your post, you have been left vulnerable-- the random internet troll posts you are citing can not be held accountable, nor do they have the background or scope to ever be cited by MMM.
namethatcoach - you are a jackass.
@WolvieEric.
I, too, would like to win "the right way", whatever it is. But there is a fine line between winning with hard-nosed people and the Pacman Jones of this world. Last I checked, Belicheck hasn't killed, hurt or shoot anyone. And whatever tact he lacks in interviews, he sure as hell makes up for it when the games count. And I'd be glad to have a coach that can get that kind of performance on the field.
Ned Flanders > Kirk Ferentz
Bring back the endzone prayer!!!
That should be his motto.
Meeeeechigan Dan,
How am I a "jackass." Cause I'm not calling the hooker back? I didn't save her number dude! It's NOT my fault.
Wow...I am speechless. What a sad world when poeple have to defend *trying* to behave the right way. I'm not perfect. I make mistakes. But I recognize that I make mistakes, I try to improve, and I apologize for the wrongs I do. I certainly don't emulate people who openly do things in a classless manner and then don't try to improve themselves. I don't root for them. What darkness is inside you that the only thing that matters is winning?
BTW, morality is exclusive of religion. The morality that has bound society together existed long before any of the world's major religions. It's what I like to call having a conscience.
@ Bend it...
Agreed. And man, I hope that Brian's "sources" are wrong.
JMan
p.s. Seriously? A blog rumor made the 10 o'clock news? What, isn't there a car on fire to cover?
you guys know they were joking on hawkeyenation right?
Can anyone defend the hiring of Ferentz? Can anyone justify this move?
Please. Somebody? Anybody?
I'm dying to hear why this is good. In any way.
God damn Michigan i thought you were going to do us a favor and take Less Miles off our hands so we can go after Spurrier. And no i did not spell his first name wrong accidently
WolvieEric,
I am against winning at all costs. I am for winning with integrity...which is possible. There are good coaches that have class. They are out there, believe me. They are. For you to call Belichek a 'miserable human being' is just insane. All his players love him...reminds me of lloyd. And lloyd wasn't necessarily the nicest guy to the media. So does that make him a miserable human being?
Mgoblog, we go balls deep.
Also, on Ferentz, DO NOT WANT!
they have the 10 o'clock news in iowa??
Look, all I can say is that continuing to cheat when you are caught does not make me your fan. Nor do childish pranks like snubbing people after the game (like the Pistons walking off the court when they lost to the Bulls). Nor does treating front office personnel without respect, which has been repeatedly been reported in puff pieces on the guy. I suspect his players love him because he WINS, not because he's a great person. Perhaps that flys in the pros where the sole motive is to make money, but I wouldn't want that type of act near college kids. I don't know the man, but unless everything written is pure BS (which doens't mesh with what I can observe on TV), the man is not what I'd call a classy. And when I call him a miserable person, I basically mean he is one of the most unhappy people I have ever seen. If we accept the premise that living the good life leads to happiness, he must not be living the good life to be that miserable.
I'm at a crossroads.
Up to this point, I've argued to the death that Brian could not be wrong. I still believe this but pray that someone has kidnapped him and taken over his keyboard. I have high blood pressure. My heart cannot take ten years of the Kirk Ferentz regime in 2A.
I prefer people that are true to themselves, and if they happen to be assholes, I prefer they are honest about it than try to hide it. Belichek is an asshole, but he's honest about it. Donovan McNabb is also an asshole, but he's a sympathetic figure, not seen as the whiny baby he is.
I wonder if you would have the same opinion if your boss was an asshole, but at least he was honest about it. Or would you go look for another job?
Recruits are gonna run for the hills. Mallett will transfer. McGuffie, gone. Boubacar, gone. Future, gone.
daniel,
i agree. an asshole that is upfront is probably happier than an asshole that hides it with a fake smile.
my boss isn't an asshole. Maybe your boss is an asshole because you think he is one? Belichek's players love him and you think he's an asshole. Somethings gotta give right? Cause you can't like an asshole?
@WolvieEric
Lloyd Carr must've been one unhappy person, from your point of view.
Look, do you really know the man? I don't, and I've been a Pats fan for 20+ years and read everything I can every day about them. And frankly, I don't care. As long as he doesn't eat babies, he can coach the team to more Super Bowls. If wanting a coach who isn't the second coming of Jesus makes a bad person, then so be it. I know that the kids I buy christmas presents for at the shelter like me, and that's all that matters, not what people I work with who don't really know me think about me.
Enough of this morale talk. I'm not nominating belichek for the UM job. I want a classy guy who has fire and knows his x's and o's..and can represent the university well. I was just disturbed that you don't like the patriots because Tom Brady knocked up his girlfriend...only to find out after he broke up with her.
Anyhow...great conversation everyone. I'm off to bed. No offense intended to anyone. But I will say that we all (myself included) make way too many excuses for the teams we root for. We see behavior that is bad according to any definition and we excuse it because we are emotionally attached to the team. I rooted for the old Pistons. Enough said.
Good night.
Stealing signs is not cheating, the fact that they filmed it was. SUE EM & LYNCH EM! They are evil cheaters!
As a female, even I don't think what Brady did was wrong. It's not like he's not around the child or taking care of them ever, but if I was in his ex's situation, it would be impossible to fault the guy for not marrying you. Not to mention, why is everyone under the assmption SHE wanted to marry Brady? And, if all of the tabloids are right about their story, she wanted to have a child and he didn't want to settle down. Then, they broke up b/c they didn't see eye to eye on that issue. Then, they had a child. So what's morally wrong about how HE handled the situation that makes people look at him like an immoral d*ck? The opinion of the crowd of self-rightiousness is absolutely hilarious and annoyingly arrogant, considering all of the information we have regarding Brady is basically TABLOID speculation.
As for Belichik, as far as I'm concerned, he's done (almost) everything the right way. If he cheats on his wife, I think that's absolutely scumbaggish. However, his personal life is not his job and shouldn't effect his job. It's none of your business. And he's a head coach of NFL players, it's not the same thing as college where the guys are barely adults and easily impressionable. He's not supposed to be their role model, these are grown men (many with children born out of wedlock, believe it or not!). His job is to coach football, not mentor 22-42 year old men.
WDIV 4 in Detroit just said that "various websites" have said Ferentz is in the mix...
I fucking hope he doesn't have this fucking job.
@WolvieEric
I'd rather my boss be upfront that he's an asshole. That way I'm not wondering why the great analysis I came up with and made the presentation for was credited to someone else. It's the asshole that hides behind a smile that fools people.
Also, if my boss was an upfront asshole or a closet asshole, I'd still be looking for a new job.
By the way, I'm not a Pats fan (I'm a Lions fan YUP!), I just think when the media delves into the personal life of a sports figure, it shouldn't matter so much about how we view their professional lives. The fact that it does shows the sillyness of our society and how obsessed with celebrity we are.
http://www.hawkeyelounge.com/sho...ead.php?
t=17115
Sounds like from some of the posts that even the "credible" Iowa Hawkeye poster isn't all that credible.
Why is anyone referring to anything that is coming off of this board as plausible anymore??
@kgh
RIGHT ON!!
@WolvieEric.
Goodnight.
OK, Wolvie and namethatwhatever, thanks for the tangent.
If we look hard at this, it is obvious that this Ferentz rumor is untrue. What do we know?
1. Bill Martin, in an attempt really to deflect the "Hire Miles Now" contingent, publicly states that he is going to begin a thorough national search to find the "best coach."
2. If Michigan wants Ferentz, he can easily - let me stress this...EASILY - be fit into the framework of a pro forma thorough search. No one is scooping him up. IF he ever takes another job, it would only be Michigan (born here, MSC, daughter went to UofM, etc.). MICHIGAN HAS TIME.
3. Why would Bill Martin make himself a liar by moving unnecessarily quick on Ferentz?
4. Martin is smart enough to know this would be an unpopular hire. He also knows that, despite a few on this board who think Miles has an IQ of 39, Les Miles is the logical and fan-favorite choice. He knows a Ferentz hire is going to create a firestorm. So the need for the appearance of a thorough search - perhaps with time enough to take the bloom off the Mile rose (Arkansas, other dirty laundry a la those old internet rumors, a Tenn loss maybe, etc.) - would never be greater.
5. The University cannot afford - quite literally - a meltdown among the alumni. They want excitement. After ASU and the Lloyd Carr steady decline, with the renovation upcoming, the support and dollars of the Michigan faithful are not unimportant. To chuck all that away because MSC likes someone? With no Michigan ties?
I think the core of all this is that Ferentz is a candidate, an interview that may happen (if he wants) in the near future. To believe Brian's rumor would mean PR stupidity on a galactic scale. I don't think that is likely. The bottom line is that there are many ways to get KF if you want him and he wants us, and THIS way would do the most damage.
Ain't gonna happen.
Does it sound suspicious to anyone that this discussion was 'via email'? No way anyone with half a brain would leak information this way. I call the bluff....bludy idiots, almost gave me a heart attack!
MDan - right on.
@meechigan dan,
That actually sounds like it could be pretty accurate. It's kind of a stall technique in a way to see how things turn out, right?
LC retiring is not a sudden, unexpected development. So, you would think that any due diligence work that could be done was already, to a certain extent, done before the OSU game. Now, wether it would already warrant a job offer to a potential candidate is open for debate, but they must've already eliminated potential candidates at this point, and they may be closer than we think...
Dan
I agree Miles is the logical choice and what most of the fans (aka money) want
Big Boy Blue
Agreed. The fact that there is no solid evidence and the fact that they are now making fun of mgoblog for falling for the latest post at hawkeyelounge says to me that we all in some ways got duped today.
I want more than anything for this to be fake.
1) Having recently spent the last 2 years attending grad school at UIowa...there is considerable anti-Ferentz sentiment around campus after the last few years...and wouldn't be surprised that the message board punks are simply wishful thinking on this.
2) Why is the majority of Michigan faithful in love with Les Miles. To be honest, his in-game coaching is very suspect and watching his press conferences can be painful "Ar-Kansas". I jus see him as a more of a country bumpkin who shoots from the hip. We need thinkers who can compete with the likes of thinking-man coaches like Meyer and Tressel..not cowboys yelling yahoo! and hoping for the best.
wolvhawk,
i agree. many UM fans have been sick over the conservative style of LC for some time and see Les Miles as pretty much the opposite...and then they see it working at LSU...plus his love for michigan and they think he is the guy. I think we need to find someone like a tressel or meyer that can maintain class as well.
Guys, it's official..
Ron English is our next coach.
lol.enough with the rumors for today. Save the Ron English is head coach talk for tomorrow.
We already are the laughing stock of one board right now.
Source, please.
name, just that any sudden rush after a formal announcement that he will be taking his time (with a guy who has a recent track record of doing a thorough search) just doesn't make sense.
Serenity, it's not that they might not have done all their homework, but that they just SAID they were going to take their time. If we were in a bidding war for a hot coach, I could understand a quick strike, but we are bidding against no one for a coach no one wants - they can take the time to make the case and at least look thorough before pulling that trigger.
Wow, for the last time, ARE-Kansas is an accepted pronounciation in the midwest plains states. Also, consider this: It's a hell of a lot easier to teach Les Miles a little class than it is to teach Kirk Ferentz how to be a better coach and hire better coordinators.
00goblue00
Well, they should realise we are very sensitive these days..
Anyone think it could be Brian Kelly then...if LC did indeed contact GVSU??
NTC,
Unfortunately, we will have to hear bitching and moaning from those same fans when Big Blue possibly has a few down years (and I am not talking 7-5 here...try 5-7 or worse). Bottom line...just be careful what you wish for.
Personally....I like a Tedford or Petrino.
Dude, who cares what the plains states say. Dude was born/raised in Ohio and went to school here. If he, in his time in Oklahoma, decided that is the correct way to say Arkansas, I'd say that's a bit strange.
Why do we so badly want a coach that has 100% class? Les Miles has class maybe not the same level as Lloyd but I think would represent this school nicely. Remember its about winning football games and titles, not about winning press conferences.
I'd rather have Les in a presser saying Fucking OSU than have Lloyd again saying "well we played our best we know what we have to do for next week" next week comes and we lose again.
Daniel,
But Ar-Kansas is offensive to Arkansas citizens and they made it officially arkansaw. Les Miles was probably trying to be funny or something but McFadden made a point after the game to tell the public how to pronounce it correctly.
Daniel, spot on!
Miles has so many positives, I don't understand the hate.
He is agressive.
He can recruit lights out.
He is a hard-core Michigan man.
He knows the South (recruits, anyone?)
He hates Ohio State with a burning passion.
He has won at a high level in a tough conference.
He has done well against rivals.
He has matured. He will mature more.
His has brass balls the size of the Epcot Center.
He hires good assistants.
He worships Bo.
I would much rather have bad clock management than horrific playcalling.
name - don't think so. I don't think we're hiring Kelly, as much as many of us, including myself, like him. I still think Les is going to be chosen (if he decides to accept, which also seems evident). I don't think we'd go terribly wrong with either Les or Kelly though, and if it's between them, I'll be satisfied (at least for a year or two).
Dear Miles-haters. Read Les' chapter in "What it Means to Be a Wolverine".
I said "dude" twice in one post. Shoot me now.
Fred, a little help. Would love to read that.
Running your mouth at a press conference and showing bravado doesn't necessarily equate to on-the-field success my friend.
kgh,
so maybe this is all for show...and we know it's les...but we want the whole country to think we got the best coach?
Yessir WolvHawk.
one question: what has Miles won??? He has no conference championships as head coach anywhere.
I don't think it's worked out yet, but I think that's what will end up happening. I'm just trying to be prophetic, I have no clue. But if I had to bet, I'd bet Miles is our guy. BTW Who does the country think is the "best coach"?
but he is competitive in a conference that is extremely difficult to win in...The Big 10 is a joke lately. I feel he would be able to do wonders with Michigan in the Big 10.
You may not agree, but that is the beauty of debating :)
WolvHawk, do you think he can learn? That he will understand - from MSC and Marting and others - that how he represents Michigan is of utmost importance. I bet, if he gets hired, that his press conferences turn into these bland, "we'll give it 100%" and "Ohio State is playing superb football" snooze-fests as he tries like a kid in an egg race to not make any messes. He can learn that shit. You don't learn to drop 5 successful fourth down conversions on Florida.
00goblue00 - please, please, please let that link be true and that this rumor is false! My faith in Bill Martin (and, by extension, humanity) will be restored if I learn this isn't happening.
If you wanna crown em...THEN CROWN HIS ASS!!
If Les comes to UM and tears it up and delivers Nat'l Championships and W's over tOSU..then woo hoo.
I just get frustrated with people who Les Miles is the 2nd coming of God. Have an open mind and some faith in Billy Martin and Co to do whats best in the end.
hat-
That link is from hawkeyelounge.com I didn't make it up...
They have been bragging since early this evening that the rumors they were spreading on michigan.rivals.com were just that made up rumors with no basis.
Since Brian has posted his update on Ferentz, they have now been ripping on him in the boards saying they can't believe they actually got him to buy into the crap they were posting...
isn't the part of the "big ten is a joke" because Michigan has sucked a bit? I mean, I know our other teams aren't top dogs, but it's not like Wisco/Iowa/Purdue/PSU are that much worse off than they were 10 years ago. So what does that have to do with us...we don't play us. (ignore this post if it doesn't make sense, even I'm confused).
Who gives a shit how Les pronounces "Arkansas"? I'd be perfectly fine if he butchered "Ohio." This is one of the dumbest criticisms ever.
I'm sure Kirk Ferentz knows how to pronounce every state's name, but guess what? He's still 3-6 against Iowa State.
WolvHawk
I don't think Miles is the second coming to God, but I do think he would be great for this program. The Michigan ties are an added bonus.
Les will win the SEC Championship this year, only his 3rd year as coach. And come on, you can't expect Okie State to win the Big 12.
Also, I find the people in Boston to be a general disgrace to the english language, it's really no different from Are-kansas/arkansas.
And as for Darren McFadden, all I can see is him yelling "WE GOT DAT WOOD".
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4...h?
v=4BxKNcsUZHI
WolvHawk, some of us have given it some thought. I was not a Mile supporter early on. But I do offer this justification of why I think it should be him. It's not all knee-jerk.
http://www.logictimes.com/Blue/W...y-Les-
Miles.htm
How did Les "learn" to make those conversions? He made a decision and his OC and players made it happen. I made those decisions on Tecmo Super Bowl all the time...does that make me a candidate?
here here, again, WolvHawk. It almost makes me not even like Miles with all of the "LET 'R RIP" and "NEW CARR WITH LES MILES teHEHEHE!" stuff... it's just rather annoying. I mean, I like the guy and wouldn't be dissapointed if he's chosen, and I still find myself being annoyed with the idea of him coaching here just because of all of the vigor people are bringing to defend him.
If Les Miles comes, he better bring in some good assistants. And he must get rid of gittleson, moeller, and deboard. Then I will be able to fall asleep at ease. Even if he mismanages the game clock, i will be fine.
WolvHawk...What? That's my point. You either the ball or you don't. He has 'em. I am not suggesting he suited up and ran the play himself.
Isn't Gittleson retiring?
That earlier post wasn't too cogent. Sorry! I meant: "You either have the balls or you don't. He has 'em. I am not suggesting he suited up and ran the play himself."
i haven't heard anything about gittleson retiring, but i hope so.
Well..we are all entitled to our opinions...that much I think we can ALL agree on. I am just not 100% sold on LM (a real test will be to see how his teams come back after this last loss). Bill Martin and Co are smart people...they will make the right choice in the end and not be swayed by the voices of the masses either way.
Whoever it is will get my support 100% and won't change my opinion bout Big Blue football my any means.
WolvHawk,
what if we hire Charlie Weis? Will that change your opinion?
In business like sports if you aren't doing things better you aren't getting better. Hiring Kirk Ferentz doesn't make Michigan's Football Program any better and it may even make it worse! I really don't want to believe this bullshit.
If Sparty passed on Brian Kelly a year ago, then UM is NOT going to take him now. Even if he is a quality candidate, no way is Martin going to appear to be taking LilBro's castoff.
Which leads me to an interesting scenario - if Dantonio was available now, would he be a candidate for UM's search? Just asking. . .
"This is obviously not the only element in college football success – sick talent (USC) and brilliant tactics (Kelly) can temporarily overwhelm the importance of football tradition – but it looms very large. The best chances for bringing the right players, the passionate team players, to your program year in and year out is for the program to be revered above all else."
Interesting MDan, after reading that, it just makes me think about how you said press conference behavior can be "learned." Bo didn't come to Michigan and immediately fall in love. He learned to love UM. He was a Woody diciple, lived and played football in Ohio. He came to Michigan and LEARNED what UM was about. And then he went on to create the title "Michigan Man." I just thought it was funny you said someone like Caroll and Kelly can "temporarily" overwhelm tradition, when Bo didn't even understand it until he got here.
@MDan - http://www.amazon.com/What-Means...s/dp/
1572436611
kgh, true. But each non-Michigan man runs the risk of being a Callahan as much as a Bo. If you have that already locked and loaded in a coach that is as reasonable a candidate as any others available, then I lean in that direction.
Odd you see it that way Toronto, b/c if Kelly got here and pwned Dantonio (and I think he would), Sparty would look even worse than they do now for hiring a guy who makes fun of a cfb player for being short.
Maybe I am just a pessimist...but I am a SHOW ME guy. Okie St and LSU...fine...but win at Michigan (that's all I care about). KGH hit it head on with the crazy defense of LM and whatnot and the annoyance of people who lobby like LM is the ONLY option. I jus think people are getting a lil bit TOO high before any decisions are actually made. If anything...hasn't UM football over the years taughy us to temper expectations somewhat if we are going to be honest with ourselves?
The fact that we have to wonder if our terrible, 65 year old S&C coach will retire is pathetic. Only 2 teams still use HIT (us and PSU), Belien heavily criticized Gittleson's program, and NFL Wolverines have weighed (no pun intended) in negatively as well.
This is shameful, either Michigan acts like a top 10 program and stops the bullshit "We are Michigan, we can do whatever we want and ignore what is really happening" or we cease being a relevant player in college football. It's asinine to think the academic side of the university should have ANY say on the football side. The money is separate already, and the UM AD likely funds general scholarships for education. In addition, the Michigan football program and publicity is one of the best recruiting tools the school has/ever had. I guarantee you USC applications have risen since they had a football revival.
Sorry for the rant, it just infuriates me to see how Michigan football can be run. If we aren't going to be serious about football, I want to know so I can disown one of my alumni programs in favor of one that knows its place, and that one is Duke. At least Duke football doesn't pretend to be something it's really not.
Fred, thanks. I will get it. What does Les say (in brief)?
Sure, but has that ever happened at Michigan? I don't know if you can come here, coach here, have any bit of success, and not fall in love with Ann Arbor and Michigan. I think it's impossible, and maybe I'm just being biased, but I cannot understand how you can coach here and not fall in love with the tradition. Once you get a chance to live something that is UM football, I don't see how you can have any other reaction than the reaction Bo had after coaching here for years.
WolvHawk-
UofM football has taught me to expect the unexpected. Usually they end up doing what you don't expect. Most expect that Miles will get hired. While I would love for this to happen, I see this getting screwed up and someone internally ends up being the new HC.
kgh, it happened with Cooper in Columbus. Now I know what kind of cracks that is going to invite, but the point holds true.
I have to agree with Daniel L that Michigan has to stop with the We are Michigan we can do what we want bullshit...this is 2007, not 1967. College football is going in a different direction and in some ways I feel like the higher ups don't want us to move into that direction.
But you can look at Weis. He LOVED ND, he went to ND, and cherished everything ND. He got there, and you wouldn't ever believe that. I mean, there's an anecdote for an alumnus screwing up (even here, at UM), and an anecdote for an outsider to screw up. So what gives? I don't think if you are here you are more likely to convey your "passion" for the school and be a better caretaker in its conquest.
Honestly....I think an internal hire would be a horrible idea. We need fresh ideas..and I am not sold on their credentials.
With the long overdue stadium renovation and this HC decision..Billy Martin will have cemented his legacy and I just don't see how they can stumble this one.
That direction for me is less conservative ballsy plays.
There is a time and a place to be conservative, and on the football field is not one of those places. That was the problem I had with Lloyd.
WolvHawk-
trust me, I don't want an internal hire I too think it is a horrible idea. I just wouldn't be surprised if that is the direction Martin ended up going in. He has the chance to do something big but I can see him blowing it in some ways.
I sense some polar opposites here. Many of you clamor for "new time" "this isnt 67 anymore" and that UM needs to get with it. But on the SAME hand..you want Miles so bad cuz he is a Michigan Man and a link to Bo and this and that...you can't have it all.
oops, I meant, "I don't think if you went here...".
The liklihood of Les appreciating UM tradition IS greater, but it's no guarantee, just as its no guarantee an outsider wouldn't take care of UM tradition with great effort. There are too many examples of this "i'm an alumnus" guarantee of passion for the university. It doesn't always pan out, and I still feel that way esp. when looking at Harbaugh.
kgh, good point about Weis, although despite his pedigree, I think it is all about him and not ND. Nothing to back that up, though.
Wolv, again, I'm with you. I don't understand why that separation isn't made, the "cut off the Bo lineage" protest does not coincide with the "Miles is a Michigan Man" protest.
I said the Michigan Man in an added bonus. Yeah he gets the Michigan tradition, but he is way more gutsy than Lloyd Carr ever was. He doesn't seem to run a conservative football program. That right there is completely different than what Carr was.
@WolvHawk:
The reason people want Miles is because he is a link to the past while still moving the program in a brand new direction. He hires great coordinators, realizes that playing to win is better than hoping to not lose, etc.
I will say, I share the similar feelings but am torn in between. I love Bo lineage, because of the point MDan makes, but I also want to steer away from that and get a guy who is not traditional in gameplan, but traditional in passion and respect for tradition. I think that is why I really like Miles, but still feel a bit empty when realizing he may be our next HC.
Thank you Daniel L. You said it better than I did lol.
kgh, after trying on Ferentz as our next head coach for a while, I not longer have that empty feeling when considering Miles.
However...(maybe this is just pessimism), I don't feel like Miles will be as "gutsy" when he gets here. He may feel like he wants to "fit in" with other UM alums. Maybe it's Michigan that does it to coaches, maybe it's our tradition that maintains complacency and keeps our playing style similar to how it always was. That is what I fear with Miles, whereas a coach with no ties won't feel obligated to oblige to the old guard. He'll be a bit more rebellious.
See MDan, I don't wanna be feared into liking Miles. I don't wanna be like "OMGZ we gotta get Miles b/c other candidates sound so much worse"! If that's the way we're doing it, than it's completely the wrong approach, IMO. I understand your feelings though, and that these feelings are the extreme, but not the logical reasoning behind liking Miles. However, it is a reason I hate.
We're so gung-ho about taking risks and being gutsy, but we are so easily taken back when someone mentions something out of the ordinary, something not as sure or solid. I don't get it. I just don't think we can have it both ways.
This is one of the biggest coaching searches in the country. If it is given to Ferentz just like that, call it cronyism and laziness. I hope it's not true.
I think it was on Michigan Sports Center that I saw this, but here goes. Some poster said that Lloyd wanted Ferentz in order to protect the jobs of his staff. If so, Lloyd has ended up hurting Michigan. It's a real shame if true, because I think so highly of Lloyd Carr and that he is a man of class and a great role model to his players. But I fear that he is being WAY too loyal to his mediocre coaching staff. Ron English is good, and I think that we overlooked Vance Bedford as a welcome return (look at how the secondary improved), but Mike Debord is a clown who should be canned. The same goes for Gittleson and Andy Moeller.
Truly great hires:
Jim Grobe
Tom O'Brien
Paul Johnson
Chuck Martin!!! Hire this guy now.
Brian Kelly
Kirk Ferentz? No! He's a good coach, and I think that he is better and smarter than Les Miles, but for chrissakes he's 3-6 against ISU!! That is inexcusable. If he is so bad against such a mediocre rival, then how can he possibly be successful against OSU???
KGH-
You make a good point about being obligated to coach a certain way.
I don't agree though that people are trying to fear people into liking Miles. I think just a lot of people really really like him and want him to be the new coach and are excited that we may potentially get him. It's not that other candidates are so much worse it's just that Miles excites a majority of UofM fans.
OK, I'm not reading all 293 comments...
Brian,
Your first post today scared the crap out of me. Still does, to tell you the truth. I honestly think Iowa, Michigan, and Ferentz lose if this deal goes down.
This post? From the morons at Hawkeye Lounge? This one doesn't worry me. Those morons can barely spell. Without a track record on the guy originating the post, I'll maintain my state of denial.
Jesus, don't make this happen (or make Brian Kelly the first call if it does)...
I sense that Feelin' Really Blue is our friend Honolulu Blue in drag.
Someone please tell me this is a absolute lie! Seriously, my stomach is hurting right now. This would be so sad. We need a powerful spread option offense and not a typical conservative pound it out offense. What is Kirk gonna give us seriously in the end that will allow us to run with the Pac 10 and Sec schools. Im so angry about this. IS there a number or something we can have to call the athletic department about this and harass them?? Seriously, does anyone have a number??
I sense the same thing MDan. lol
Jonathan, send an e-mail with the rest of us. Look above for the addresses.
Hawkeye, you reassure me.
to maybe ease your mind a bit go read the hawkeyelounge.com message boards. They are all laughing at us right now. Apparently this was all crap made up by a few of their posters.
00goblue00,
I agree...but what gets me riled up is that it is the majority of those fans who after 3 bad games are calling for his head. I guarantee the message boards light up with fans who question the sanity of ANY coach when those "ballsy" moves start to fail to payoff. People just like to bitch and moan and be part of the latest fad/bandwagon/etc...thats the bottom line and that's what aggrevates me
Good night, all. I don't think we need to worry about KF. Martin is not that foolish.
The last time two sides negotiated polite declines this way, Bart, Homer and Flanders ended up in a Krustyburger on an oil rig in the middle of the Atlantic.
Well...I enjoyed the back-and-forth. In the end...remember to keep some perspective (as well as a sense of humor)...these are just 18-19-20 year old KIDS out there.
GO BLUE!
WolvHawk-
Can't disagree with you that people like to bitch and moan and that it's aggravating. I am sure that some of the people who are excited will after 3 losses be calling for his head if he gets the job. That is unfortunate but that is how people work sometimes. I get where you are coming from.
Compulsively refreshing this thread over and over while my wife sits next to me...I feel like my grandfather died and someone just called to tell me at 2 am.
It sounds like most of you want to turn Schembechler Hall upside down and build a completely new football culture. People like you got Bill Callahan hired.
Meeeechigan Dan,
LOL. I am not Honolulu Blue, but I have also gone by Matt and Sad Michigan Fan. Yes, I have been depressed since last Saturday, and the Jim Delaney should extend the fucking Big 10 season if he wants to improve the teams' chances of being successful in bowl games.
I just agree with Honolulu Blue that Chuck Martin is a great candidate. IMO, Ohio St took a great chance with someone who is a proven winner, albeit in a lower division. To me, Chuck Martin and Paul Johnson (very successful at Georgia Southern) have these qualities.
Let's face it: we need someone who can beat Jim Tressel and return Michigan to the status of top dog of the Big 10. This will never happen with just some guy like Les Miles or Kirk Ferentz. Chuck Martin's 40-game winning streak or whatever the hell it is shows that he knows how to be successful. And by the looks of it the guy is a defensive genius.
*sigh* yes Korea, that's exactly what we want.
As for Chuck Martin, yeah, he's cool. But if we can get Kelly, who has been a head coach for 16+ years and built GVSU from the ground up (basically), and then went on to other programs and made them better while he was there, I'll definitely have Kelly.
I disagree with Honolulu Blue's assumption that the main reason why Kelly was so great at GVSU was b/c of Martin. Just sayin, people already hate the idea of getting a guy w/o "the resume," but at least we know that Kelly has translated his GVSU success into D1-A success to some degree (and in a short time at that). I think that people are pimping Chuck Martin (and Paul Johnson to a degree), and pimping them so much so that they're willing to discredit Kelly. You do realize if you discredit Kelly, you discredit the other guys' success as well? If you want to take a chance with guy from the "underground", you go with Kelly, not Martin, because when all of the people who criticize Kelly et al for not having a lot of D1 success, at least we can go to CMU and Cinci. With Martin, you don't have as much when trying to please the haters of the "up-in-coming" type coach.
Basically, it's hard enough for people to buy into what Kelly or Petersen have done, nonetheless trying to get someone like Martin in here who inherited a pretty well-off program, even if he did help in the success as a coordinator.
Haven't read through the whole thread yet (I've been internet-less from Thanksgiving until now) so I'm not sure if this has been mentioned - but if Kirk is the new coach how are OSU fans going to add an "L" to his name, it was easy and oh so clever with "LLLLLLoyd" and I'm sure they were looking forward to "LLLLES" but I'm not so sure how KirkLLLL FerentzLLLL looks.
Maybe they'll make him Kirk "LLLLL" Ferentz?
Anyone else bothered that Nebraska has OPENLY interviewed Bo Pelini and has schedule Turner Gill? Not saying they are candidates for our position, but what is wrong with having an open search?
Then again, when Mary Sue Coleman got hired, the entire process was cloaked in secrecy until the eventual unanimous vote. Is this really the Michigan way, to make everything invisible?
If Michigan actually scheduled interviews with 3 coaches or so, and concluded Ferentz was the best man for the job, so be it, I'd accept it and cheer. It seems to me, however, that people are less upset over the Ferentz rumor, and more upset that if true, it means there never was an open, national search, unless other names on the list flat out said "not interested."
So Mgobleu posted a good website. I thought it was great.
http://football.stassen.com/cgi-...Michigan&
sort=a
Maybe most of you know of this already but it sorts records against teams for any given stretch of years. From my calculations, the third most defeats in the Lloyd Carr era came from.....
Northwestern.
Losses since 1995
OSU - 7
Notre Dame - 4
Northwestern - 3
The 8 - 2 penn state and 7-2 Wisconsin are pretty impressive.
We were 6-2 against Iowa so I can see why they want to hire thier coach. The one game in the big house must have left quite an impression.
I am a sucker for numbers, so I thought that this website is very useful to see trends and where Lloyd stood out and where he fell short.
Is this really the Michigan way, to make everything invisible?
Yes.
I see very little downside of a Lloyd clone, new OC, new OL coach, new S&C coach, new facilities.
Also, as to e-mailing Bill Martin: I'm not a huge fan of the guy, but during the SBC proposed-sponsorship fiasco, I had a fairly extensive e-mail correspondence with him. He also tracked down the work phone number of a friend of mine and called him at the office to discuss points he raised on the same issue. In my experience, Martin has been extremely responsive and gracious about replying to tough criticisms. Whether it influences his thinking, I'm skeptical.
Would anyone want him there if it did influence him?
I wasn't saying that it should influence him. Ultimately, I don't think the e-mails matter much. What I did value is that he obviously took the time to read what we said, digest it, and respond.
Michigan football is not a democracy, thank God.
Michigan football is not a democracy, thank God.
Almost nothing at Michigan is a democracy. Everything important happens behinds closed doors; that's why it was kind of a big deal when there was actual dissent from the regents over stadium expansion. In the 90s there were Open Meetings Act lawsuits because the school is so secretive. People might not like the results here, and I'm surprised at the absence of a formal search committee, but the process is more or less in line with how things operate.
Yeah, I hear what you're saying CrimeNotes. Stockholders would never email a CEO and expect a personal response. It's obvious Bill Martin understands and has great respect for the attachment alumni feel to the university and its athletic programs. I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt until he gives me reason to do otherwise.
This comment found regarding Martins search for a new Head Coach.
"I've been watching several folks very closely this last year," Martin said. "Not so much the wins and losses or their offensive and defensive strategy. I've been watching their press conferences. How do they present themselves after an emotional loss, what are they saying, how do they look? Those are the important things."
Meaning the search has been going on long before anyone thought. In fact I would suggest the search has been going on since last summer. Lloyd knew this was his last year. No? Lloyd, Martin, and Coleman have a set list, and have let their list audition for the job all year long. Oh and Feeling really blue is very close.
It's 4 am. The mgoblog after-hours drinking club is in session. As of this moment, there are 9 of us present.
11
why ferentz??? lets hope this is not true. The coach hasn't but together a quality progrm in years? How is this an upgrade??
You don't upgrade Michigan football; you pass on the tradition. BTW Bo was only 13-7 in his last two years at Miami.
I have a source in the athletic department who told me we are hiring Bill Callahan. Announcement tomorrow.
tradition only takes you so far, the recruiting and game has passed the program by. Get out of the big ten coaching circle. Holding on to tradition while reaching toward the future is a delicate, but necessary balance
Your all batshit insane, by the way.
As long as the new coach keeps us at 8-4 or above, those crowds of 100,000+ aren't going anywhere. Especially with an essentially brand new stadium to see. Ferentz will get the same recruits, or better, than we have now and he'll win. Enough, anyway. He won't say anything stupid. He won't do anything stupid. And he'll work his ass off- why wouldn't he?
And yeah, shock of shocks, the University President has a say in the decision. I don't get the Mary Sue hate, at all, but whatever. She's the President. And she is absolutely, positively, not ever, in a billion years, going to get "fired" for helping to hire a coach that the Michigan football fan internet community dislikes.
Football is just a piece of the puzzle at the University. The leadership isn't going to sell us out into a Alabama or (insert any other SEC school) to put football #1. Sure they want the team to do good, but they have other more pressing priorities in academics and such.
Bottom line, Ferentz fits the Michigan mold. Les Miles does not. Brian Kelly absolutely does not. This Chuck Martin guy the one poster with three identities has been pimping does not.
I still can't quite figure out why everyone is so down on KF. He is actually quite a reasonable choice, and imho, much less likely to lead to what we saw happen at ND and Nebraska. Those situations are where someone who has no idea how to coach at the collegiate level comes in; KF, in contrast, clearly knows how to coach college kids.
His biggest problem is likely what one might call "Iowa Fatigue"; after fighting hard to beat the big boys with lesser players, it wears on you. Eventually, your choice is to recruit players who are of more questionable character or just be happy with your position as the third/fourth/fifth-place big ten team as the best possible outcome.
KF has clearly proven he is a solid coach and an excellent teacher; many of his players (particularly on the lines and linebackers) have improved substantially under his coaching. Imagine him now with the much better players U of M will offer. Imagine getting back to the type of smash-mouth football that OSU laid down on us this year. Imagine a coach who by all measures is head-and-shoulders better than our current staff (if you don't think that is true, how many NFL teams have contacted Lloyd in the last few years?)
So there it is. After some initial disappointment, I have come around on KF. He will be an excellent choice, much better than Les Miles, whom I think everyone is excited about only because he seems to have "fire". Fire alone will not beat the Sweatervest. Old style smashmouth football can, and will.
I hope the rumors are true. Bring on KF, and bring back the days of true Bo Schembechler style football.
-BS
thats the problem, the "Michigan Mold" is stuck in the late 80's/early 90's. I'm not saying that the Univ. sell its soul for a good program, there is a balance between the two.
And yes, I've talked myself into the Ferentz hiring in record time. Drink the kool-aid, it's delicious.
Ignore the 30 typos in that previous post by the way. It's very early.
Ferentz to Michigan? HAHAHAHAHA. The University is 'leaking' out names that may seem plausible to the feeble minded, but they are simply false trails to keep the media spotlight off those who are actually under consideration. Don't be such a tool - you're being used because you'll swallow anything spouted hook, line, and sinker.
I have come to officially announce I have agreed to terms with the honorable University of Michigan to operate as head football coach and as a molder of fine, young Michigan Men. Remember, coaches are like bacteria.
This can't be happening, this can't be happening.
Michigan football has been betrayed.
I'll save the kool-aid for ND nation. I'm eating the vanilla ice cream, mmm, delicious. Who needs 31 flavors when vanilla is so clearly the leader and best?
People at Ohio State freaked out when they hired the I-AA Jim Tressel.
Just sayin'.
at least the sweater vest had won something!!!!
Personally, I think guys like Ferentz and Glenn Mason are sleepers. It's freaking hard to recruit to those places. What could guys like that do with the Michigan name?
Miles has worlds of talent at LSU, yet he finds a way to lose at least 2 games a year down there. What is worse, he is lucky to not have 4-5 losses this season--he has been playing on borrowed time with all those 4th down conversions in close games. UM doesn't want him, in my opinion.
I will eat my hat if Miles is hired at Michigan. No chance.
Ferentz won a lot of games with inferior talent. In the Big 10, it's tough to consistently finish in the Top 10 of the nation in the first place, and it's doubly tough to do so when your recruiting homebase is freakin' Iowa. But yet, he did it three times in a row.
So that leads to the argument he didn't build off that success. But isn't it the least bit possible that since he had that success, and since he has been linked with every job opening ever since then, that recruits ended up being a tad wary of going to Iowa? Plus, Chicago is the closest thing to a hotbed of talent around Iowa. Recruiting there, he has to compete with the rumors he is leaving, the Super Bowl rings of Weis, and the stuffed pockets and the pissing intensity of The Zooker. Put him in a stable situation as the coach at UM and I think he might have a little more leverage than his current position as the possibly-maybe departing head coach of the vaunted Iowa Hawkeyes.
So while the Hawkeyes have hit some tough times, I don't think you can discount talent. Maybe Ferentz hasn't had the players to really open it up. Give him our recruits and give him a fair chance if he is the guy. Do we really need to turn into the fans with a FireCoach.com up before he even hits the field?
Glad I could provide you a lead Brian with that latest hawkeye board. From my knowledge of that poster, he is usually in the ballpark of truth. He doesn't seem so sure that Ferentz has accepted, which makes me feel a little better.
That said, people are really taking your blog as gospel - EVEN when you are loading on the disclaimers that all this is rumormongering.
I hope this one doesn't neutralize the good newsbreak you had about Lloyd's retirement announcement.
My gut tells me that they have contacted Ferentz, but have not made an offer yet. I think Martin will be interviewig a few coaches before making an offer, and I don't think he has had a chance to do full interviews yet. Martin is a businessman, and knows how big a hire this is. He isn't going to let the President pull rank on him on this one, because it is his name that is attached to this hire. He would leave before getting tangled up in a bad hire. Not saying that Ferentz is a bad hire. He just isn't the direction UM football needs at this time.
Sepulkenny
Someone get us some airplane manifests, stat. And stick a GPS on Ferentz and his car. If we were SEC fans this would all be done already.
Ferentz Iowa vs. Iowa State = Iowa State wins.
As an Ohio State fan, I will accept him as Tressel's new Carr.
Michigan fans, however, may want more bang for their buck.
I'm an Ohio State student and this pisses me off! That's how bad this idea is! It is made of bad!
Good God, you have coaches lining up for this job, and you go with the Iowa guy? What is wrong with you?!
I respected Lloyd Carr a lot more before today. You know this is all his fault.
All well, bad for the rivalry, good for Ohio State. I guess I should just revel and learn to hate the Illini even more. After all, we are the second oldest trophy game...
Even if Martin was going to offer the job to Ferentz, it doesn't make any sense that he would do it so quickly. The athletic department certainly doesn't have to cater to the fanbase in making major decisions, but Martin has to be cognizant of the fact that 1) Ferentz isn't the sexiest choice out there (to put it mildly) and 2) hiring Ferentz without even the appearance of a more thorough coaching search will upset the fanbase immeasurably.
If Ferentz is the guy, what's the rush? It just seems illogical to me, and terrible from a PR perspective.
Have you seen my press conferences, Bill Martin? I am smooth as my playcalling. Check me out on Rome:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O...h? v=Oq2mi5Huu8s
If this was real, the last 24 hrs should have produced more information.
However, doesn't anyone think Ferentz, with our talent and recruiting, could be awesome? Maybe a little boring, maybe rock, vanilla, straight-edge... but really, he's a good coach and maybe we'll be really happy with this.
Now, having a Michigan guy with Michigan pride and OSU hate sounds better, but I don't know if I'm more let down about what could have been, or actually let down by having Ferentz, not sure. Regardless, doubt he'd leave Iowa for Mich.
I'll probably hate MSC no matter what if this turns out to be true.
this one works:
http://www.youtube.com/
watchv=Oq...chv=Oq2mi5Huu8s
http://espnradio.espn.go.com/esp...oose? id=3117567
http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/ne...tory? id=3122035
Chris Petersen - a rising star who doesn't drink & drive and pays his bills on time!
I am going to repost this because who the hell is going to read 350 e-mails to find the pearls of wisdom that my loser ass was posting in the middle of the night? Gnarls is absolutely correct:
If we look hard at this, it is obvious that this Ferentz rumor is untrue. What do we know?
1. Bill Martin, in an attempt really to deflect the "Hire Miles Now" contingent, publicly states that he is going to begin a thorough national search to find the "best coach."
2. If Michigan wants Ferentz, he can easily - let me stress this...EASILY - be fit into the framework of a pro forma thorough search. No one is scooping him up. IF he ever takes another job, it would only be Michigan (born here, MSC, daughter went to UofM, etc.). MICHIGAN HAS TIME.
3. Why would Bill Martin make himself a liar by moving unnecessarily quick on Ferentz?
4. Martin is smart enough to know this would be an unpopular hire. He also knows that, despite a few on this board who think Miles has an IQ of 39, Les Miles is the logical and fan-favorite choice. He knows a Ferentz hire is going to create a firestorm. So the need for the appearance of a thorough search - perhaps with time enough to take the bloom off the Mile rose (Arkansas, other dirty laundry a la those old internet rumors, a Tenn loss maybe, etc.) - would never be greater.
5. The University cannot afford - quite literally - a meltdown among the alumni. They want excitement. After ASU and the Lloyd Carr steady decline, with the renovation upcoming, the support and dollars of the Michigan faithful are not unimportant. To chuck all that away because MSC likes someone? With no Michigan ties?
I think the core of all this is that Ferentz is a candidate, an interview that may happen (if he wants) in the near future. To believe Brian's rumor would mean PR stupidity on a galactic scale. I don't think that is likely. The bottom line is that there are many ways to get KF if you want him and he wants us, and THIS way would do the most damage.
Ain't gonna happen.
I'm not thrilled with the idea of Ferentz, not by a long shot, but I don't think this is as miserable as some make it out to be. Clearly, Ferentz would have an easier time getting top-level talent to Michigan than he ever did to Iowa. As others have mentioned, the Hawkeye's primary source of talent is Chicago, where he's had to compete with Weis (who, whatever his coaching weaknesses are, has been a phenomenal recruiter) and lately, Zook, who is also a very good recruiter. Ferentz got his best talent from there when Willingham was in at ND and the Illini were a disaster.
Also, when a coach is as universally cited as being a phenomenal coach by all his peers (like Belein), it does give me some soothing.
That said, this would condemn us to more cro-magnon style boring-ass football.
Brian- an Iowa TV station sited you.
http://www.whotv.com/Global/cate...6&
nav=menu100_4
Its on their "I think" video. whatever that is.
I am one guy, and Honolulu Blue is another. We are not the same.
Maybe I just want to see something new instead of another Big 10 coach. Maybe I would be fine with Bo Pelini or Bobby Petrino. Just not someone from a mediocre Big 10 school.
Reasons not to be alarmed: Kirk Ferentz actually did do a good job with Iowa for the most part. If they had beaten Iowa State in 2002, then they could have found themselves in the Fiesta Bowl. How cool would that be? Two Big 10 teams in the Fiesta Bowl playing for the NC. Now I have to find Doc Brown...
Again, I just think that we should take a risk with someone like OSU did with Jim Tressel. It sucks that football is just a business at Michigan and that it seems like they just want someone who will keep Michigan at a minimum of 8-4. What the fuck happened to playing to win? And the fact that I heard a few days ago that Lloyd might want KF to protect the jobs of his coaching staff pisses me off even more, even if these are just rumors.
I'm sorry if I sound like a Michigan fan with overly high expectations, but this is Michigan. It's not Iowa, Wake Forest, or Texas Tech. (No offense to those fans.) Michigan is a big name and needs to be a yearly championship contender like Oklahoma, Nebraska, Miami, or Alabama. This is supposed to be an elite program. We need someone who will win Michigan a natl championship, not just keep its head above water. Yes yes I know this is why Michigan fans suck, but you all know that what I am saying has some truth to it.
Out of all this conspiracy theory nonsense, Jon is the only one that said something just a bit more different yet plausible. This may be a beta test leak for viability. Huh? who knows - if so, I think they get the hint by now!
So my question is, why the "Les Miles' wife was in town buying a house" rumor BEFORE Carr had even retired? Before the rumor of the pending retirement was even out there? But of course, long after Carr had told Martin he was done at the end of the season?
I'm still clinging to the remote possibility that Brian is wrong on this one. For the good of the Program, Brian has to be wrong.
In addition to Ferentz not being good, can you imagine what kind of money we'll have to burn to get him? This is insane and it will haunt us for a long time.
Ferentz is a betrayal to Michigan tradition, specifically, WINNING.
OC,
I doubt any of the validity to any of those reports.
cfaller,
It's not about Brian being right or wrong. He is just linking to other sources.
If it is any comfort, Kirk Ferentz is ranked #12 by Sporting News among all BCS coaches, even if the rankings ended up beingbullshit.
Take a risk with someone who can win. Oklahoma was Bob Stoops's first HC position. OSU was Tressel's first I-A HC stint. Tom Osborne started at Nebraska. Pete Carroll (as if NFL doesn't count). These were gambles that turned out well. Michigan should find its own guy, like it did with Bo.
My choices
Jim Grobe
Paul Johnson
Chuck Martin
Brian Kelly
Someone else who has shown the potential for great success at another level?
If Miles is hired, McGuffie splits. This was confirmed on the Rivals.com message boards this morning.
Is there a prayer in hell that Rich Rodriguez would bolt to UM after winning the national championship with WVU?
With all the outside the box thinking and name tossing, how come Mike Singletary hasn't come up?
First, I dont want Kirk any more than most on this board. I think he will only continue our current state of medicority and only usher in a mindset that will accept it.
But to say that Martin hasnt conducted due diligence is a little naive. This is not a financial transaction where we need to "find" hidden problems. This is football. Stats and records are plain to see. What coaches have done with talent is apparent. Have they met, exceeded, or failed expectations? This is easy shit. And since everyone has known Carr was to retire for months, there has been plenty of time to talk to a host of people connected to coaches. Due dilligence...please.
You have got to be kidding me! How is this happening? Bill Martin has to be smarter then this.
http://www.bighouseblog.com has more on this as well.
I'm sure Kirk Ferentz is a really nice guy, and could be a great coach here but im seriously going to die a little bit inside if they hire him
A few commenters have partially excused Ferentz's recent B10 struggles by stating how hard it is to recruit to Iowa. OK, fine, no doubt it's harder than trying to recruit to Ann Arbor.
But answer me this: are you saying it's harder to recruit to Iowa than to ISU? Or to Western Michigan, for that matter?
This all boils down to one thing: Ferentz would NOT be considered a viable candidate for 5 minutes if there wasn't the MSC connection. IF he does end up being the choice, it will be clear that personal relationships (again) end up driving critically important personnel decisions for the UM program.
I'm still very skeptical. I think (hope!) Martin is more savvy than this.
Kirk Ference = Lloyd Carr.
Thanks Lloyd and Mary Sue Coleman. Go away, and go back to Iowa.
Kirk Ference is about guy #15 on the list of coaches Michigan should be trying to get. A good point was made, whether Michigan can get these guys or not, they should be calling all the top coaches, because you never know who might be interested. Call Bob Stoops, Pete Carroll, Urban Meyer, Jim Tressel, etc... You never know who might be interested. And aside from that, guys that Michigan CAN get that are better than Ference... Les Miles, Brian Kelly, Jeff Tedford, etc.
ARGHH!!!!!!!
Constantine, it is a question of appearances, not real due diligence. This appears to be rushed cronyism, bad PR for a PR-sensitive university.
And interviews matter. Tressel got his job on the strength of his interview. Mason was leading and Tressel blew them away. Maybe Kelly blows them away. Maybe Miles scares them off. Actual interviews are the last remaining critical piece of the due diligence and those have not been done.
If Brian is wrong about something, I hope this is it, because I honestly cant take this. We could be the new Nebraska.
Andrew F.--
I seriously hope you are not implying that Tressel might leave OSU for UM.
Oh, just forget it. How is it possible that a coach who has gone 1-6 against his biggest rival is dictating who the next guy is gonna be? I thought Bill Martin knew what he was doing. Now I think he's just a fucking idiot.
According to a buddy of mine who reads the Rivals stuff, the recent and strong appearing Ferentz rumors were debunked as having been started by Iowa fans on their Rivals site. Brian "Scoop" Cook has put disclaimers on this. I put it on the same level as "Jeff Smoker to be charged with coke dealing in Lansing" until I see actual confirmation from the U of M.
i had coffee with bill martin this morning and he told me it was true.
scoop for me.
83tilinfinity, Brian previously posted his own story that Ferentz has been offered the job, but that he would decline. While his latest post is simply spreading a rumor that Ferentz has accepted the offer, I assume Brian still stands by his story that an offer has been made to Ferentz. Either way, it's bad news for the program if Martin has already offered the job to Ferentz.
Therefore, for the good of the Program I hope Brian is wrong about this. Offering the job to a mediocre B10 coach a mere week after Lloyd's retirement is bad bad bad on so many levels. Brian, please be wrong about this.
Anonymous-
No, of course not. I was implying that it's worth trying for. Who can say Tressel wouldn't leave for UM. Do I think he would? Absolutely not. Nor do I think Stoops or Carroll would... However, how do you know unless you try.
The fact that Ferentz was apparently offered the job about 3-4 days after the retirement of Carr, is absolutely frightening. Because that means Miles isn't even being considered for the job, nor are people like Urban Meyer, who clearly is at least interested based on the clause in his contract. And again, why aren't we trying to get Les Miles. I think Lloyd's input and influence on this decision is greater than we all thought it was going to be. But why we then aren't going for Tedford or Kelly, idk.
Again, I really haven't decided what to think about the KF rumors, but to say that he would most likely "continue the current state of mediocrity" is ridiculous.
Lloyd himself admitted that he didn't have some of the things necessary to continue as a head coach. He had lost a step, and the team showed it. I doubt Ferentz comes in to the job with any lack of passion. In fact, if Ferentz does accept the job, I would suspect we'd get his absolute best coaching efforts for at least a few years.
And if you recall his three straight 10+ win seasons, his max can be pretty damn good. Couple that with the talent he could attract, and you could end up with a very, very good program.
Ferentz is not a "sexy" choice, but I refuse to write him off as a bad coach just because he doesn't instill excitement amongst fans like a Spurrier, Carroll, or Meyer would.
Ian, I have to agree with you. Some people here are calling for a sexy hire like Jeff Tedford, who, let's not forget, has sank to 6-5 with a talented Cal team that's no worse (relatively speaking) than Iowa has been under Ferentz. People's memories are short, so hiring the flavor of the month (Kelly, Tedford, etc) often goes sour very quickly (Franchione, Weis, etc). All things considered, it could be a lot worse than Ferentz
Urban Meyer isn't walking through that door. Pete Carroll isn't walking through that door. Steve Spurrier isn't walking through that door.
Can we at least be rational about this?
Do you know what the biggest complaint from Iowa fans this year was with regards to KF? His playcalling was stone age predictable.
THIS is why most want to kill themseleves at the thought of KF coaching Michigan. For all the good of Lloyd Carr, last Monday the door to the jail cell for the football imagination swung open and we all stood breathless staring out at the potential of an offense with a pulse. Now some crony professor/administrator who doesn't know an out from a slant supposedly kicks the door closed.
It's not a matter of sexy. It's a matter of sanity.
I like exciting offense. It's very pleasing to the eye, it's easy to fall in love with it.
That said, what has been "sexy" about the USC offense during their run? Sure, Reggie had some damn exciting runs, but it wasn't like they did anything unconventional to get him the ball. They had a good line, a solid QB, and talented skill players. They handed it to him, and he did great things with great talent.
Even less sexy is Tressel and his OSU juggernaut. Say what you will about OSU, but I'd kill for their success the past few years.
I don't care what the offense looks like on ESPN if we score points and win games. If we end up with Ferentz and he gets us 10 wins consistently by beating the holy hell out of teams with the run, I don't see the problem.
Gutierrez, Lloyd Carr was 6-7 against his biggest rival. Time does not stop and start at the Buckeyes' convenience.
I don't care for sexy offense, I just want a return to a good offensive and defensive line, and slightly more aggressive play calling.
Plus, I'd like a coach that doesn't have a losing record against U-M.
MD:
1. Ferentz doesn't call plays.
2. Iowa runs an NFL offense. The combined offense, other than RBs, on Sept 1 had 14 games total experience starting. Then five guys went down. Two were arrested. Do you know what it's like at a school like Iowa when you are playing your 3rd and 4th string wideouts?
3. It's a predictable offense when the receivers don't realize they're not playing high school ball in Ohio anymore.
I work in the UM athletic department. Ferentz accepted the job on Sunday and it will be announced on Wednesday.
Maybe I missed this, but can someone explain why it is assumed that it would take an act of god for Ferentz to leave Iowa? Did they date in high school or something?
Ian, Dex and Desert Blue have it right. While Ferentz may not be the sexiest choice he is a good coach. His teams play tough defense, have excellent special teams, are strong and in shape, and are fundamentally sound. He coaches like Tressell. Guess what? That kind of style wins you Big 10 championships (which may land OSU in the BCS title game for the 3rd time in 7 years). After 3 straight Top 10 seasons, he couldn't maintain the momentum and keep Iowa at an OSU/Michigan type level. Is that really surprising? Nick Saban couldn't do that with Sparty and then he went to LSU and won a national title.
He's a good coach and if he gets the job he deserves our support.
Meeechigan Dan,
Your long post above makes perfect sense if BM is calling the shots. If this is an MSC call, then all of your logical points don't really matter. And, BTW, there seems to be some interest on the part of Nebraska for Ferentz which might explain the hastiness of MSC's offer to KF (if that's true).
Anyhow, it's Monday AM and this has been brewing for days without any action. If KF had accepted an offer, there would be a press conference scheduled by now. I buy the idea of the offer (if this was MSC's idea, not BM's), but the idea that he accepted already doesn't wash with me.
My personal belief...the offer DID happen, it WAS MSC's call, it might have been to help prop up KF at Iowa, and the high placed leak that Brian mentions is none other than BM trying to head this hasty decision off. By working the alumni into a frenzy, he probably has made KF reconsider any thoughts he might have of taking this offer.
Just my two cents.
Don't get me wrong. I would not want the spread here or a string of gimmicky plays. You are all correct about fundamentals.
My biggest gripe, well documented ( http://www.logictimes.com/Blue/C...s-A-
Spartan.htm ) is that within the framework of a sound, NFL style offense, you still attempt to be unpredictable and to create mismatches, two things which Lloyd and KF, I believe, do not try and do.
Jeremy,
What he did pre-Tressel is absolutely irrelevant to me. Sorry.
And, sadly enough, you are still citing a losing record. He should have zero - ZERO - say in this hiring process.
BTW, did anyone see the comments from Woodson on Detnews this AM?
http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs...1131/
SPORTS0201
Strong stuff for a former player to say. Yeah, he's pretty much right, but former players usually pull their punches somewhat.
Quotes:
"We got to get somebody in there who can lay down the law and tell these guys we have to start with the little things first to get better," he said. "We will get back to where we are supposed to be.
"It was time for him (Carr) to leave and that is how you want to do it. You want to leave on your own terms. He was a great coach for us. He is a guy I have a great amount of respect for and the sidelines of Michigan will miss him."
Hey what about me? Don't I deserve a chance?
Beano Cook has said that Kirk Ferentz is one of the best coaches in the country. I'm not sure if that is much of a comfort.
What about me? Brian, you just won that MAC title with my players you know. Everyone likes me. I am such a nice guy.
1.) I was a big fan of Ferentz until the last two seasons....something went awry as they underachieved last year, imo, and this year was a mixture of injuries, disciplne issues and vanilla play......impressed they rallied to get bowl eligible......unimpressed they went belly up vs a bad WMU team.....you can look it up, but Iowa under Ferentz had become the new Spurrier as far as blowing out and covering the spread vs cupcakes, especially at home.....so that WMU debacle raised my eyebrow and not in a good way.
2.) I have no idea why they cant beat ISU there......I do know that game is a lot like MSU-UM where it is more important, from a rivalry standpoint, to one school.....still ISU has been bad, maybe the worst in the Big 12, Baylor aside, for three years, but they still lost in '05 and '07. Major red flag as far as I am concerned....then again, when we dominated the OSU series, the only Big 10 school that consistently beat us was the Green and White....ask yourself, is that a good trade off? I am still pondering that.
3.) He has a rep of building great O-lines and D-lines......our O-line has been a problem for a few years now...Ferentz, combined with new S/C coach and strategies, would do wonders for our O-line and overall play....i miss our aggressive O-lines from the days of yore, Ferentz would bring that back with or without Moeller as O-line coach.
4.) He has a rep of recruiting Michigan and Detroit.......maybe the next Vernon Ghoulston comes here, rather than down south to Columbus....how different is the UM-OSU dynamic if Ghoulston was in Maize and Blue, for example.
5.) KF's base salary this year was twice that of Lloyd's.....either we are ponying up a lot of cash for him or he is taking a pay cut to come here.....me thinks, a lot remains to be said and done before this is a done deal.
6.) He has specific lagnuage in his contract that permission needs to be granted to him and the outside party if anyone wants to even talk about another job....I think that is the news, that we have asked permission tot talk to him.....from there, this has snowballed into an avalanche of speculation.....its going to be like this for a few weeks with other candidates.....this is going to be a wild and at times maddening ride.
A couple points i'd like to make...
If Mike Debord stays on as OC, i won't watch another Michigan game.
But, first, in the argument of getting rid of Debord regardless of the circumstances. This was the best offense that Michigan has ever had. Despite no right side of our offensive line, I guarantee a Tressel, or a Carrol or Brian Kelly team would have overcome that and been absolutely dominating offense using Kraus and Long to destroy teams and... good lord, just imagine it. But no, we couldn't even muster a single field goal on Ohio State. Pathetic. Please leave Mike, please.
Now arguing against Kirk Ferentz. I believe his record against Tressel is something like 1-3. Regardless of what it is, he can't beat sweater vest. Second, look at his record against in state rival Iowa State, and I think that says it all. Or look at the best team he's ever had, in '02. Crushed by USC.
Actually, after looking at all that, he should fit in perfectly. At least one loss per season that is unacceptable, an ass kicking if you play a good team in your bowl, never beating your big rival... and of course, a not so exciting team to watch. Yay, bring him in.
For those claiming that the answer is Chuck Martin, the answer is not Chuck Martin.
I'm very familiar with the Grand Valley program. I watched the genius who was Tom Beck, Grand Valley's coach in the early eighties, tutor Kelly. I watched him teach him the secrets of Kelly's two fortes - recruiting and offensive gameplanning. Then I watched Kelly take over and watched the team slowly transform. Kelly didn't win easily at first, the recruiting needed to come, but he stayed true to his plan and he built the program. He had four all D2 first-team American quarterbacks in a ROW (McKinnon, Fox, Anes, Finnerty) and his record got better and better until he established the plan for the juggernaut in Allendale today. He bolted for the next level and I was surprised how fast the winning came there too.
Martin is a plan follower, Kelly is a course setter. The genius is Kelly. I wouldn't mind him bringing Martin with him as a defensive positional coach, but the genius is Martin.
Kelly is my first choice, but that being said there are plenty of other qualified candidates who will bring Lloyd's integrity and rid the program of Lloyd's stale system and cronyism. Ferentz is not one of those candidates.
I will be extremely disappointed if Ferentz is it.
Edit to the previous post:
The genius is Kelly, the genius is NOT Martin.
Jeez, I need to proofread better.
As a Hawk fan, I hope Ferentz takes awful play caller OCordinator Ken O'Keefe with him.
FYI, Mary Sue Coleman rejected Bob Stoops who wanted to come coach at Iowa to hire Ferentz. Coleman's search committee said they wanted to interview other people, Stoops said no thanks and immediately took OU's offer. I am still bitter.
Ferentz is a good guy and parents will love sending their sons to play for him but that is about it.
I could cite you several million examples of how the game has passed him by and I really have no idea what he does on the sideline anymore. The Iowa program is on the decline, big time.
Clock Management is nonexistent, special teams have sucked, Ferentz never goes for it ever, offensive/defensive schemes are super vanilla and predictable, the Oline has been constantly rebuilding for 4 years running, and Ferentz would not bench the QB after he struggled to complete a 10 yard pass all season.
Good Times in Iowa City!
No one on his staff will EVER get fired or held accountable for anything either.
I still doubt this happens at all but after the Stoops debacle never say never with Mary Sue.
jeremyb: With all the speculation and nervousness (not to mention time lost at work) this rumor is causing me, thanks for the Big Lebowski reference in your post. It somehow, like always, makes everything easier to take in. The Dude abides.
SERENITY NOW!!!
I agree that he should have zero say, but it's OSU-fan-style historical revisionism to say that he was 1-6 against OSU.
Anytime, Craig. I'm calmer than you are, dude.
Is there a secret cabal of Grand Valley State supporters that infiltrate message boards and blogs in order to trumpet their own?
When David Kircus was on the verge of being cut from the Lions, the Grand Valley folks took over numerous outlets with their "you're cutting the next Jerry Rice" remarks.
Now Brian Kelly is a bit different. He's learned to crawl (Grand Valley), ride with training wheels (CMU), and ride a bike (Cincy).
But Martin? That guy would be going straight from the stroller to driving the team bus. Where is this coming from?
Tell Mary Sue she left her iPod at my place. XXOO.
I understand why some commenters want many of us to be patient and openminded with hiring Kirk Ferentz, but a few things bother me beyond his win-loss record:
1. Excessive Payroll: Yes yes, we were going to have to pay more for Lloyd's replacement than we paid Lloyd, but Jesus Christ! Ferentz already gets paid $3 mil at Iowa, and we would have to offer more to get him to move.
That seems insanely exorbitant. Even slowass Stewart Mandel has commented about how excessive Ferentz' pay is for the record he's producing. For $3M+ a year, we wouldn't have to settle for a career .500 coach- we could get a lot of head coaches AND give him the ability to assemble a fantastic staff with that kind of money.
2. Excessive Hurry: I don't believe that Michigan has already conducted interviews without anyone noticing. Thus, I'm left to conclude that (if this story is true) Bill Martin offered the job to Ferentz without doing any interviews, and without looking at the other 29 candidates he had on his list. That just smacks of sloppy cronyism, and that's no way to ensure improvement and/or continued success.
Rashly hiring a career .500 guy when there are more successful candidates available for less money seems catastrophically insane, IMO.
Either Brian is wrong or the athletic department has lost it's f--king mind.
I had a nightmare last night that KF was hired. I never remember my dreams so it must be a sign of things to come. I'm calling news outlets and Iowa bloggers right away.
Meanwhile, nothing but crickets on this news w/ the Freep or the News.
If this is really going down, our two major dailies are not on top of this at all......it was surreal reading all the posts yesterday while my Freep sports page on the coffee table appeared to be covered wall-to-wall w/ Les Miles talk.
By the way, our hockey team is ranked #2 in the nation behind a team in our own conference, has only one loss (a 4-3 OT defeat at the hands of Minnesota in St. Paul on the first weekend of the season), which was avenged with a 5-1 pasting this weekend. All this with 11 freshmen on the roster.
nothing on espn, cbs sportsline, tsn or cnnsi.com either.
So you're saying there's a chance...
Georgia Tech will be holding a press conference today to announce Chan Gailey has been fired.
So there's another reasonably-sized program with (some kind of) tradition in a favorable market as far as standard of living is concerned where a head coaching vacancy will open up...and one that probably comes with Jon Tenuta, assuming he won't be named head coach.
My opinion...
This is rumor, pure and simple. I think Brian may have wasted some of the cred he built up with the Carr retirement scoop. Even with the disclaimers, this is getting too much time on mgoblog.
To me, it seems like this goes back to the feature rivals did on Ferentz as a possible replacement last week, then gained steam with an Iowa fan who has already admitted making up a story about it. Finally Brian's own "sources" from this weekend just launched this rumor into the stratosphere.
I don't believe it. Not for a minute. (Sorry to quote REO)
Seems that no one in the MSM can confirm this at all. Given that this would be the Detroit sports scoop of the decade, it makes sense that they are looking under every rock and shaking every tree for info. It seems CERTAIN that no offer was accepted. Was one offered? I still think yes. But not for the reasons we think. This has MSC's fingerprints all over it and whatever may have happened was her call. BM doesn't operate like this. He's going to be remembered for this hire for 20 years. Anyone think he would hand this over to KF without interviewing anyone? (And I agree there's no way interveiws could be kept quiet.)
How come Pederson from Boise State has never, ever, been mentioned? Now he's on Nebraska's list...
The more I read these comments the more I am amused.
1. Who are MSC's constituents? You guys? Try the Regents and the faculty. Do they want someone who doesn't know when to say "fewer" instead of "Less"?
2. Ferentz wants too much money? He made a lot of money, dudes, because he worked without a contract for the first 18 months. Then he raised the dough to completely renovate the stadium by, among other things, beating UM 34-9 at UM Homecoming, worst loss at home since 1967. That was the year Iowa sent several walkons to the NFL. I'm sure it was an accident.
I hope he works for $1.00 this year. He'll be at $5mm per by 09.
3. Everyone at Iowa hated him when he started, too.
4. He was Bo's choice. You are upsetting Bo.
5. While it's great and all to polish those old pitchforks, I think you want to remember one thing: the peasants don't own the cathedral, the vatican does.
Anyhow, from my vantage all I can tell you is -- it is very effing quiet in Iowa City. This isn't like the time the Jaguars tried to hire him, before hiring DelRio.
@ Jamie Mac: John Niyo has a link to Brian's "Say Hello..." post in the Detroit News Big 10 blog. For the most part though, you're correct. I do know a lot more about Alaska than I ever have before...
Not only the Freep/Det News, but ESPN College Football Live last night barely mentioned Ferentz in their piece on the search, instead concentrating on Miles like always. BTW, when asked, Desmond said he would take the job if offered Saban-type money. Should I post that rumor somewhere? and for Jeremyb: if Debord were to be hired, that would certainly be an example of what happens when you ---- a stranger -- --_ ---...
aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhH!!!
Find a stranger in the alps?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5...h?
v=5YHXdnWLvH4
As for the $$ factor, Lloyd Carr's income from coaching the football team may have been significantly lower than Ferentz, but when you add in the media package received compared to what is available in Iowa, I'm sure the delta shrinks quite a bit.
Fact Checker,
MSC doesn't have to care what Joe Sixpack fan thinks, but she does have to care what the big money boosters think. And nothing I have seen suggests that those big money boosters (who paid for some of Beilein's salary AND for a big part of the stadium upgrade) would be happy with a Ferentz hiring. Those boosters have been biding their time for the last 5 years waiting for this moment when U-M football would get exciting. No way they would be happy about this. Which means funds dry up. Which IS MSC's problem.
This is why Bill Martin and ONLY Bill Martin should make the decision when it comes to who the next coach should be. When too many hands get into the pot it gets chaotic opinionated, and ridiculous and that is EXACTLY what is happening right now.
The fact that Martin said he has a list of 30 candidates is ridiculous. Why do you need 30?? We need to focus in on 5 GREAT candidates as opposed to friends and favors for Mary Sue, Lloyd Carr, the rest of the Michigan coaching staff, boosters etc. Pretty soon the guy who takes tickets at section 30 will be a nominee on the list if it keeps up this way.
I need an update or I'm going to go insane.
BTW, I don't see the boosters' opinion of this being much different than the fans who have posted here. The boosters are just fans with more money. They want to see a dynamic team with a dynamic offense as well. They are just as unhappy with the 3-4 loss seasons the last few years.
Urban Meyer isn't walking through that door. Pete Carroll isn't walking through that door. Steve Spurrier isn't walking through that door.
Can we at least be rational about this?
dex | Homepage | 11.26.07 - 10:55 am | #
But Les Miles, Jeff Tedford, or Brian Kelly might be. All of them are preferable to Ferentz. Ferentz is what, 3-7 against Iowa State? Hayden Fry didn't lose 7 games against ISU in 20 years. 42% attrition rate? One quarter of the team in some sort of legal trouble? These are not characteristics we want in a coach.
Hey, Ken O'Keefe won a national title! (in 1990, Div. III, with Allegheny College) :). If Ferentz came, I hope he would hire a brand new OC.
I'm not that keen on Ferentz. His main strength is his limited downside potential. Just remember, it could be worse. We could be Notre Dame. That was a hire that was all about upside potential, and for now it's blown up in the Domers' faces.
We all have a major case of Tressel envy, with a minor case of Urban lust. Tressel's never coming to Michigan, and it's doubtful Meyer ever will. Kelly might be the Tressel for U-M. Or maybe there *is* no Tressel for U-M, and you have to take what's out there.
Ahh, forget it. I'm a Sox fan, and I'm reminding myself of how I tried myself into thinking that Matt Clement was a good signing...
Joseph, keep your hands off my woman you Leftist pig! MSC is mine!
jeremyb--that might be the funniest thing I have seen since I rewatched the original movie for the 500th time this past weekend. Can't believe I missed that one. gracias, you are the walrus.
So... when is some new shit gonna come to light on this?
I'm not privy to this new shit, but I want to be.
@ brian kelley:
How do you know Pederson from Boise State is not being considered? Because the sages of print like Teddy Greenstein and Drew Sharp haven't written his name down? If Bill Martin has a list of 30 coaches as he claims, I'd bet that Pederson is on the list.
The fact is, none of us know for sure what is happening. To assume that President Coleman and Bill Martin would hand the keys over to Ferentz before the end of November just flys in the face of logic. This program is too important to their respective jobs and legacies to jump so quickly.
Soulja Slim,
Thank you for your insights on GVSU football. That's good to know about Chuck Martin. But what is it that Chuck Martin is doing to have a 40-game winning streak? If what you say is really true, then the UM AD should really talk to Brian Kelly.
I still think that this is just a rumor, albeit a strong one based on some fact, like maybe KF was interviewed. Maybe I'm just nervous about Michigan's future. Maybe Charles Woodson could play a role in the coach search!
Whatever happens, Mike Debord should not return.
To the people saying that Carroll and Meyer aren't available:
How do you know? Have you asked them personally?
Carroll has accomplished all he can at USC. Maybe he wants something new.
Meyer is at least interested in Ohio State, Notre Dame, and Michigan.
\I'm a Sox fan, and I'm reminding myself of how I tried myself into thinking that Matt Clement was a good signing...//
Clement gets a World Series ring this year...he was on the roster.
w00t Chan Gailey is available now!
KF is bad for several reasons...
1. Runs the same style of offense we've suffered with for years.
2. VERY loyal to his hires. Rumor is much of this talk will be used by KF as leverage to protect members on his staff - including his OC - that people want fired. More Carr-esque crony protection.
3. Would probably retain many of the Carr people we don't want around as a condition of hire (two-year contracts, remember?).
4. Overpriced.
So, please, KF apologists, spare me that he will somehow bring something missing to Michigan. Maybe a better S&C program, that's about it.
Also, why would Meyer be interested in OSU, Michigan, or ND? Florida right now is as strong a football program as there is in the country. All it lacks is tradition dating back 100 years, which I doubt he really cares about. Plus, it never snows on him in FL. I'd be amazed if he was even remotely interested in any of those jobs. None are a step up for him.
No no no to even the thought of Urban Cryer at UM! Have all of you forgotten that smarmy bastard last year after it was announced they would play Sweatervest in the championship game? I don't like the image he would bring to A2, not at all. Winning isn't everything.
@ Michigan Fan
You, along with several others on this blog are on BM's list of 30, which he probably wrote up back in Sept. That list is probably down to five by now (and we've all done our homework and can pretty much guess which five they are), and no one in media have mentioned Pederson's name until Nebraska job opened up.
But our helmets are really cool.
All the Ferentz, Miles, Kelly talk serves as a smoke screen. Ultimately, Lloyd is manipulating his superiors into hiring Mike DeBord.
Lloyd will succeed Martin as the AD in two to three years, and Lloyd wants to have someone he can trust managing the top revenue sport on campus. It will be DeBord unless he gets drunk at the Excalibur.
cocain's a hell of a drug.
and to post for the 600 millionth time...
I doubt very highly this Ferentz thing is a done deal and this is why...
At Laguardia Airport on Saturday I was waiting to come back to Detroit. At the gate I was waiting at, a man stepped off of a plane that had just come from Detroit he came off relatively soon so I imagine he was in first class..Anyway, he was speaking on his cell phone rather loudly and said "They asked me to represent Les and I said back to them okay but what does Lloyd think of all of this?" Granted he could be talking about another Les and Lloyd but I highly doubt it. Bill Martin may be doing the right think and doing the interviews...again this was Saturday so I highly doubt the decision was then made to screw the rest and go with Ferentz by Sunday...
Having taken long pulls at both flagons of Kool Aid, it is my considered (read: over-sugared) opinion that:
(1) There's no way they've extended an offer to Ferentz. Martin said he'd have it done by the end of December, not November. Getting fixated early on a candidate is Matt Millen, not Bill Martin.
(2) If Ferentz is offered the job he'll jump at it like Britney Spears at a triple latte frappucino.
(3) Ferentz wouldn't be the worst choice out there. But it's going to take a lot of selling to convince people that he's the best.
Are you kidding me?! Ferentz is terrible and should be fired from Iowa. I cannot... no I will not believe Michigan 'wants' this guy.
If this is true then its about 4 years of no bowl games for UM and 4 more losses to OSU until hes fired.
I'm confused how Brian has gone from having some inside "sources" confirm that Ferentz was offered the job to linking to an Iowa messabe board for "confirmation" that the offer may have been accepted. Are all of his "sources" just random internet message boards? I certainly didn't think so, not with the good scoop on the Carr retirement. So, I sort of think he should have kept quiet a bit longer or gone with one of his "sources." Something doesn't quite add up here.
Wolver.. in SF:
Clearly you misunderestimate MSC.
Iowa Nice is not the same as Iowa Weak.
MSC stood up to a) your legislature; b) Bush; and c) the Supreme Court (on AA).
Something tells me you are mistaken that she's going to wilt in the face of a few jock sniffers with big jets and checkbooks.
All I can tell you is, when a woman executive starts getting Iowa Nice on you, it might be a good time to be quiet or take a potty break.
It's still preternaturally quiet in Iowa City. You all wouldn't know this, but after 5 years of annual "Wooing Kirk" sashaying two-steps, this is not normal.
I hope he doesn't turn you down. Would be embarrassing, and you'd probably take it out on us in '09.
-Facts, and Just the Facts
Fact Checker,
MSC doesn't have to care what Joe Sixpack fan thinks, but she does have to care what the big money boosters think. And nothing I have seen suggests that those big money boosters (who paid for some of Beilein's salary AND for a big part of the stadium upgrade) would be happy with a Ferentz hiring. Those boosters have been biding their time for the last 5 years waiting for this moment when U-M football would get exciting. No way they would be happy about this. Which means funds dry up. Which IS MSC's problem.
I refuse to get caught up in this hoopla until I hear from Bill Martin that Ferentz has the job.
If I hear that, then I'll get caught up in this hoopla.
Oh, and a question:
Can someone tell me why everyone on this board seems to think Tressel is a good coach?
Just curious.
Would Tressel win 34-9 at Stadium & Main with a bunch of caucasion walk-ons from East-Goose-Lake-BGM-Consolidated-Gravel-Road High?
--drew
DC, I agree with you. The only reason I am nervous here is that Brian is unlikely to have posted what he posted unless he had some good intel. Especially after the Carr storm.
Still, he hedges and I think that means Ferentz is a serious candidate, but it makes no sense he has been offered anything. Interviews are about to start with a vengeance.
fact checker - he is a good coach because he wins a lot of games.
Back to give you guys the LSU slant on things right now, and oh what a difference a week makes. Last week it was keep your hands off Miles, now it's please take him. And get Pelini to Nebraska as fast as you can.
And while winning the SEC and a third straight BCS bowl is great, it could have been so much more. If you guys want Miles, (and come on, 6 losses in 3 years is good) now is the time to make the move. LSU won't be throwing money at him any time soon. And he didn't go 6-6 in a down year for the conference (Ferentz is on the hot seat.. you really giving him the job?)
Agreed with fact checker re: MSC.
She ain't no joke.
The only thing that was posted with good sources was that KF had an offer. The "reports" that he accepted were from the Iowa message board. I have no trouble beleiving KF has an offer. However, I do not believe KF has accepted and don't think he will.
We don't know if there's an offer.
What there isn't, however, are the teasing non-denial denials that KF has practiced the last 5 years.
So:
a. He is not in touch with MI AT ALL, NADA.
b. This is serious.
Iowa City is deathly still.
The Fact Checker
welcome back Tigerfan. me thinks this roller coaster ride is far from over and the weekly perspective will morph many more times in the coming days and weeks.
If I was Ferentz, I would not take this job. He is a Hayden Fry guy with a long history there. He has a young team who would only get better, with his one stellar recruiting class (Christensen, King, Moeaki, etc...) about to hit their 4th year on campus.
I suspect that Brian is right about Ferentz having an offer on the table. I also think that he is mulling over it now and doesn't have a decision yet. He is trying to avoid a public backlash a la Billy Donovan and the Orlando Magic. Ultimately, my money is on him rejecting that offer and concentrate on getting an NFL gig after next season.
Meech etc.:
If Tressel is so good, given that he has 40 players better than Iowa's *best* player, year after year, wtf was Akron?
Akron was a hiccup. And they won.
Where have people gotten the idea that good teams always win every single game without any sort of adversity? If OSU had, you know, lost to Akron maybe I'd look at that as some sort of indictment against Tressel. But they didn't.
Sometimes a team has a bad day. When they win in spite of that, it points to good coaching and superior talent.
This is really quite amazing. Still, last refresh, 192 visitors (and alot of them it seems, by quick glance over, were online all night & through the morning) over analyzing, ad-nauseum, an unsubstantiated (besides some fruit on a hawkeye blog) and somewhat silly rumor.
Hehe. Kinda makes me giggle.
fact, ?.
He wins. You don't get negative points for winning with great talent. He wins.
mgobleu,
Hope you keep giggling and don't start vomiting in the near future. Oh man how I wish this is a rumor.
Oh, I'll vomit, alright. I'm eating a hot pocket.
Isn't this exciting!
I can't wait until the Spring Game to see how the team looks with a new coach - whoever it is!
I hope this drags out for another month so I can waste a bunch watching this process and reading all these comments.
Meeech etc.,
Okay, he wins. So did the 82nd Airborne, in Grenada. Your point?
Just the facts.
***
fact, ?.
He wins. You don't get negative points for winning with great talent. He wins.
Meeechigan Dan
Silly rumor or not, debating this situation is a hell of a lot more fun than doing my job.
I wonder if FireFerentz.com is open.
Les Miles would have at least injected some optimism into the Michigan faithful. Ferentz will only serve to inject more mediocrity.
\Can someone tell me why everyone on this board seems to think Tressel is a good coach?//
Because Ohio State wins games against Michigan at a rate that Woody Hayes couldn't manage since Tressel got there.
And he has the flexibility to coach around the attributes of his players, regardless of what those attributes are; he doesn't recruit players that best fit his system...he recruits the best players he can sign and builds around them.
@Meechigan Dan: Geez, man.....hardly a KF apolgist here......all this talk about setting UM back decades, giving up tickets, never watching them again BS that some are posting is a little ridiculous, dont you think? Just looking for rational discussion, of which you always provide a lot of......I'll be posting Devil Advocate pro and con arguments throughout this process.....UM means a lot to me, and I wont dismiss or accept blindly any candidate...there are negatives, but there are positives too.....If Lloyd walked away after 2005 and KF was being interviewed, I would have been totally on board.....not so much now, but am I paying to close attention to a small sample size....i dont know......my biggest beef with this is that I want a true national search....as opposed to a quick hire or even just handing the keys over to Les.....Les is considered a poor coach, by the way, down in SEC country. I am not sure why, but it bugs me enough that I hope UM scours the country before deciding on anybody.
Did anybody notice what went on Yost over the weekend? Pretty good stuff! Alaska was a bust, however....yuck!
Ferentz really?
If you were hiring a coach in 2005 he's your guy coming off a 10-2 season and a mircle finish win over LSU. But in '05 he's 7-5, then 6-7 in '06, and now 6-6 this year. He's not getting NFL offers anymore, he's not a hot coach he's on the hot seat. He's making 3 million a year and winning 6 games.
Funny thing of note. The the five highest paid coaches.. 1) Saban 6-6, 2) Weis 3-9, 5) Ferentz 6-6, 4)Stoops and 3) Carrol hey at least somebody is almost getting their money's worth.
@dex: Yes it is.....especially since work is a big drag after a four-day weekend.....this is much better, even if it is a bogus rumor.
We should be debating every possible candidate.....We can only hope the leaders of the school are doing the same rather than a quick hire this week!
FWIW, Carty thinks the Ferentz stuff is BS.
http://blog.mlive.com/jim_carty/
...er_26.html#more
GVSU AD denies contact from UM:
http://www.mlive.com/wolverines/
...d_no_conta.html
This was posted as rumor and it appears to be just that. Unless their AD is a lying liar that lies.
I am a diehard alum with season tickets, and there is very little they can do for me to give up my seats. Keeping DeBord in any capacity is one of them.
Ferentz, Miles, Kelly... they all will be good hires as long as they end DeBord's association with Michigan.
hahahahahahahhahahahahahahahahahhahahahahaahahahah
ahahahahahahahahahahahaahahahaha
let the domination continue,
my empire lives in perpetuity
Feelin' Really Blue,
Chuck Martin is coloring-by-numbers - he's also a great coach in his own right. Not a genius, just a great. There's a difference.
Football is being run by football scientists right now, not by old men in licensed apparel who "motivate" guys.
Kelly is a football scientist.
The 10 Kelly Commandments (as Martin is following, not creating):
1.) Massive speed on both sides of the ball. Strong is good, but fast is better.
2.) Spread the field vertically and horizontally.
3.) The short pass is as good as the short run.
4.) By thinking on three axises (short pass, long pass, run) as opposed to two, you can create big plays on all three by mixing it up.
5.) Problem kids can be reformed. Lots of kids need father figures.
6.) Problem kids that turn into problem adults need to be removed from the team until they can be helped/help themselves.
7.) Kids that have been left behind or underrecruited by their number one destination school can be wooed and motivated and turned into weapons.
8.) Defenses that are extemely aggressive create more turnovers, make more tackles for loss, and keep fans excited at the expense of a few big plays, but the result is that you come out ahead.
9.) No player on the defense should be unable to sack the quarterback/stuff the running back. Players without speed are neutered athletes.
10.) Tradition does not exist without excellence. Excellence IS the tradition.
Like any great coach, Martin follows the steps to the letter.
Like any genius, Kelly wrote the steps himself.
You want Kelly for this team. Ferentz may be great, but he's no genius either.
MRG,
That link is a great find.
We'll see, one way or another.
I kinda like Kelly, but those 10 Commandments don't really constitute genius. I had HS coaches who said the same stuff. The genius, if it is there, comes through on the play calling and the game planning, not a cookie cutter template for success that boils down to "Recruit fast players, stay positive, score more points than the other team".
This rumor is starting to come apart. GVSU hasn't been contacted.
http://www.bighouseblog.com
Soulja...SOLD!
fact, you asked the question: "what makes people think Tressel is a good coach." I answered. That's my point.
Guys, you could do worse than Ferentz. Martin could be interviewing John L Smith, Bill Calahan and Coach Fran.
Jamie, sorry a little strong. Just not a Ferentz fan.
Okay, I’ll bite – I’m moderately excited by the idea of having KF as a coach, and here’s why:
First off, let me state my assumptions:
1) Picking a new coach is a little like stock-picking – yes, past performance matters, but you’re also trying to look at the fundamentals of that person to determine whether that coach is undervalued or overvalued. And, in a place like Michigan, you’re also trying to pick a coach based on consistent performance relative to high Beta/high return choices.
2) For some of us, character matters (a lot). Bill Martin isn’t the only one who cares about how the coach comports himself at a press conference, and whether this person has some perspective on life that extends beyond football.
3) Offensive innovation (in general) is an overplayed topic – so much of this has to do with talent, and certain coaches appear conservative or wide open based on the year. Tressel is one such example: his offenses are actually pretty boring (except during the Troy Smith years). Callahan, on the other hand, was an offensive genius (for awhile), as was Nick Saban, as was Spurrier until they were dealing with crappy talent.
From what I can tell, the most serious candidates on the table currently are Miles and Ferentz, and I first want to look at Miles:
1) I don’t like his demeanor. In press conferences, he consistently puts himself above the university, he’s talked trash about other programs (USC and the whole Pac Ten, and, later Alabama), and he’s mispronounced a state (Ar-kansas). I, for one, want our coach to be closer positioned to the Virginias and the Cals of the world than the LSUs when it comes to posturing, respect for the opposition, and so on. I don’t mean to suggest that that’s all he’s done, but I put him in a grouping of Spurrier, Urban Meyer and Saban – all guys who seem to have larger-than-life egos and little perspective outside of football. And I’d comfortably trade a half-loss per year to have a coach that will pronounce a state correctly.
2) I’ve watched 6-7 LSU games this year, and I can comfortably say that Miles is not a coaching genius. There’s nothing particularly innovative about his schemes. And he mismanages clock situations. You can’t say that, given the experience and talent on his team, that he’s outcoached anyone, that he’s dramatically advanced a program from where it should be, or that his game-time decisions put his teams in better situations to win. At best, you could say that Miles is a great recruiter and a decent motivator. But I don’t see how those strengths are enough to outweigh his weaknesses: that he seems slightly dull and egotistical and not a particularly great representative of the institution’s larger mission.
3) Miles, in short, is the paradigmatic “over-valued” stock. He has a reasonably good record with reasonably good talent, and it’s easy to say that he’d advance the program. And yet, he doesn’t seem to be a good cultural fit for the University, n
@Fat Checker
There is no doubt in my mind that Tressel is one of the top 5 coaches in college football. I don't really think there is an argument against that to be honest, look at what he's done. 5 BCS games in 6 years (counting this year), his 6-1 record against Michigan, the way he's developed talent, and the fact that in what is supposed to be Ohio State's down year, he is a Missouri/West Virginia loss away from his third trip to the national championship in six years. I'm not by any means an Ohio State lover, I'm a die hard Michigan fan. But I know good coaching when I see it. Sweater vest Tressel is a great coach.
3) Miles, in short, is the paradigmatic “over-valued” stock. He has a reasonably good record with reasonably good talent, and it’s easy to say that he’d advance the program. And yet, he doesn’t seem to be a good cultural fit for the University, nor does he seem to be particularly “innovative.”
Now let’s look at Ferentz:
1) Culturally, he’s a good fit. He has a humble demeanor. Like Lloyd, he was once a high school teacher, and he has the modesty of someone who is an educator as well as a coach.
2) It seems to me like his recent record is blown way out of proportion. He was 6-6 this year with a team that had a ton of injuries, and which started 7 sophomores and freshman on offense (including four on the offensive line). Look at Notre Dame … look at our own struggles when we had Mallett playing – and then ask yourself, what would a reasonable record be for a team filled with 2-star and 3-star guys who were all young? I’d argue that this team could easily have had (and probably should have had) a losing record. We were 8-4 with more experience at every position on offense, and Notre Dame was 3-9 with young, 4-star and 5-star guys playing.
3) Like Tressel, it’s not particularly the case that Ferentz runs a stone-age conservative offense WHEN HE HAS TALENT. Brad Banks led the nation in passing efficiency (something a Michigan QB has never done, and from what I remember, he was throwing to 2-star and 3-star guys. And I don’t particularly think that Iowa has been conservative under Ferentz when it’s had talented Junior and Senior classes. It seems to me that Ferentz is conditionally conservative (again, like Tressel).
4) Market-signaling matters, and Ferentz was at least considered/interviewed for a number of NFL jobs 2-3 years ago. This (to me) seems like a very strong sign that Ferentz is doing reasonably sophisticated schemes on both sides of the ball. And it’s also a signal that, when he coached in the NFL, that the people around him, especially Belichek, liked and respected him. I don’t believe that anyone thinks that Miles would get interviews for HC jobs in the NFL.
5) Another signal to me is how a program should perform historically relative to its actual performance. I don’t think that you can hold the first two years of his performance against Ferentz – as Hayden left that program in the dust. So, if I look at his Iowa years, I’d start in 2001, and his record during that time has been 57-30 overall, and 35-21 in the Big Ten. That roughly nets out to 5-3 in the Big Ten, and a 8-4 season overall. Now, how should Iowa (historically) perform? It seems to me that OSU, Michigan, Penn State and Wisconsin should all have better records. But Iowa has outperformed PSU during this stretch (49-35), which clearly had better recruiting classes, and wasn’t far off from Alvarez/Bielema (60-29). And during this time Purdue, a program with roughly equal recruiting abilities, was 40-34. Again, during this stretch, Michigan/tOSU were the only programs that did much better than Ferentz, and both schools were getting top 5-15 classes every year compared to Ferentz’s 25-50th ranked classes.
So, my Ferentz assumptions are:
1) He performs above his talent expectations based on his record.
2) He’s innovative when his talent allows him to be, and that there’s very little that can be done with a bunch of 2-star Froshes and Sophs.
3) He’s a good cultural fit for the institution.
My major question about him is whether he can recruit. Most of his classes have been filled with 2-star and 3-star guys, with occasional 4-star guys mixed in. How much of this is Ferentz and how much of this is trying to get kids to Iowa City? Or, put differently, is there any reason to believe that Ferentz couldn’t get top 10 talent to come to Michigan, and if he DID get top 10 talent, is there any reason to believe that, suddenly, he’d start coaching below expectations? That he’d embarrass the university? That he’d no longer be considered an innovative NFL-type mind?
I understand that we want sparkle, we want change and we don’t want to be bored – but why wouldn’t we be excited to at least be interviewing this guy? I understand if you want the program to take greater risk and go after a Brian Kelly, or if you think that we should gun for an NFL coach like Gruden – but, to me, weighing Miles versus Ferentz (the two clear choices we’ve had so far) is an easy-ish decision to make in Ferentz’s favor, and I’m a little surprised that we’re not more enthusiastic about a guy who fits the qualities of the program so well.
(Sorry for the multiple posts -- I wanted to get my thoughts consolidated.)
The more i read on HL website, the less i believe the rumor to be true. The guy who started the rumor is on that site 24/7 trying to backup his comments but sounds less-sure of himself every post.
Tigerfan, good to hear from you. Speaking for myself, I still want Les Miles to come to Michigan. Yes he lost his chance at a national title, but ten wins and two losses and at least .500 with big rivals is a significant improvement over Lloyd Carr. Besides, as some others have pointed out, 10-2 in the SEC might be 11-1 in the Big 10. I'm convinced Les could win lots of games and would reestablish parity with Ohio State.
Also, there's very little quantitative difference between a 10-11 win season and a national championship- IMO, it usually comes down to landing just 2-3 more players and some luck during the season. If your coach is consistently producing at the 10-11 level, then eventually there will be a confluence of just the right players and just the right luck to get a national title.
Given his consistent excellence, I believe Les would be constantly giving Michigan the opportunity at conference and national titles. So yes, I still want Les to come home (but I'd be open to Kelly or Grobe if Les said no).
Now if you'll excuse me, I need to continue to freak out over this bulls--t Ferentz rumor...
More from Carty on Ferentz, digging up some dirt and whatnot:
http://blog.mlive.com/jim_carty/
...acter.html#more
"To the people saying that Carroll and Meyer aren't available: How do you know? Have you asked them personally?"
So does that mean that Bill Belicheck and Tony Dungy are available because I haven't asked them personally?
"Carroll has accomplished all he can at USC. Maybe he wants something new."
I can say "maybe George Bush is an alien replicant" but my saying so doesn't make it plausible.
"Meyer is at least interested in Ohio State, Notre Dame, and Michigan."
Really? Has he made a statement to that effect? Or are you basing it on the buyout provisions he had in his Utah contract?
C'mon. There's an external reality out there. Urban Meyer may be a snake-oil salesman, but he's not so dumb as to dump Tim Tebow's final two years for Ryan Mallett.
1. Count me in with the panic-stricken, pitch-fork readying masses if this is true;
2. That said, I'm reserving said pitch-fork readying until Bill Martin announces it (panic has already set in, unfortunately).
3. I would bet that Brian's sources, if they are within the Ath. Dept. may be privy to some contact with the Iowa AD, perhaps, as has been suggested above, to obtain initial permission to talk with Ferentz, as per the apparent terms of his contract.
I would be very, very surprised if this whole process was finished this quickly, and can't believe that interviews would not even be scheduled with other candidates, including Miles, Kelly, & English...
Anyway, FWIW, my $0.02 is that there are rumblings on message boards which have been seemingly corroborated with *some* kind of contact from our ath. dept. and that of Iowa, but that it is merely an attempt to set up official contact, and not a back-channel, secret, quick hire that usurps everyone's expectations and installs a new (read: old) regime with little or no debate. (please be right... please be right... please be right...)
Sorry Brian, but I really hope that your sources have jumped the gun a bit, and may perhaps be caught up in some speculation of their own wrt contact with the iowa program...
if you're right, kudos to you on yet another huge scoop, and I'll see you all at the hoover dam while I prepare for a non-bungee, non-parachute BASE jump...
What we all want is the best coach we can get, yes?
I'm not saying it's likely that Urban Meyer would even consider coming up. I doubt Pete Carrol would want to leave USC. Obviously Tressel wouldn't leave Ohio State, or Stoops at Oklahoma. But if you don't at least pick up the phone and call those guys, then you aren't trying to get the best coach possible. The worst that happens is they turn it down. But you never know who might be interested, and I think its stupid to look past some of those guys without at least trying for them. Because there are about 10-15 coaches currently in College Football that I'd rather have than Kirk Ference, and i'm willing to bet that at least one of them is interested in the Michigan job.
so how about in the complete absence of any news on this situation, we move the hysteria level from DEFCON-1 back down to DEFCON-2 and entertain the possibility it isn't gonna happen?
I so hope Michigan hires Les Miles. He is a complete doofus who will embarrass the University and lose to Tressel just as much as Carr did. The only thing that Les brings to the table is a love for Michigan and a rabid hate for Ohio State and that will not equate to wins. Like it or not folks- Jim Tressel is the best all around coach in college football and will be for quite some time.
@ Chuckeye
Get off your Jim Tressel high horse. We all know he is good. But saying he is the best all around coach in college football? please. He had his team so well prepared for Florida last year didn't he? I'd take Urban Meyer, Pete Carroll and Bob Stoops any day before I'd want Tressel.
"I’m a little surprised that we’re not more enthusiastic about a guy who fits the qualities of the program so well."
Precisely the problem. As much as we all love Michigan, there are things about the program that we do not love--most of which will no doubt be enthusiastically embraced by Ferentz.
If you don't think Ferentz is vanilla as they come, then you weren't watching Drew Tate and Albert Young struggle last year after being picked by many as a dark horse for the Big Ten title.
As for his compatibility with Michigan's culture, I suggest reading Carty's post today.
http://blog.mlive.com/jim_carty/
..._character.html
I disagree on Miles. To repost:
He is agressive.
He can recruit lights out.
He is a hard-core Michigan man.
He knows the South (recruits, anyone?)
He hates Ohio State with a burning passion.
He has won at a high level in a tough conference.
He has done well against rivals.
He has matured. He will mature more.
His has brass balls the size of the Epcot Center.
He hires good assistants.
He worships Bo.
I would much rather have bad clock management than horrific playcalling.
KF is defending his version of Mike Debord to the death and a condition of his hire would be (you know this to be true) to honor the 2 year contracts of the current assistants. His offenses are painful to watch.
Not buying it. KF would do OK. We want better than OK.
Carty's article is a reach. 11 players arrested is NOT Ferentz's fault. Just like when UM has players' arrested, it is not LC's fault.
Andrew, we were responding to fact, who said: "What makes you think Tressel is a good coach." That's all.
dex, you have to wonder what Brian is doing. I honestly say I am waiting for his next post like a kid on Christmas.
On thing I can not understand....
I am very much against the hiring of Kirk Ferentz as our most fans who were calling for Lloyd to resign over the past few years...
But why are the Lloyd apologists so against a Kirk Ferentz hiring. He would be "Lloyd cloned" in Bill Martin's words. He will play conservative and get mediocrity out of his players. He will be classy and upright and we won't see scandals. Michigan will continue to recruit itself, and will probably go 9-4 or 10-3 on average. He is a good man, who will not shake things up, but the program probably won't collapse under him. I am not sure why the Lloyd lovers would be against this hire, as he seems to fit their mold.
MDan,
Miles is NOT a good coach. And his love for michigan, love for bo, brass balls, etc. will NOT make up for it.
This Ferentz BS is really bringing the search into focus for me. I was trying to figure out which would be the very best coach we could get. After this, which I'm going to call The Terror Part Deux, I'll be happy to get any of Miles, Kelly, Martin, Davis...don't care who. You don't have to nail this search Martin...just don't F it up.
dan- yes, i too wonder what brian is up to. must be getting a sandwich with MSC and bill, debating the next move. i need content right now almost as bad as i need a smoke break.
newcarr, why? Please give me examples BESIDES his clock problems. I know about those.
@ Fact Checker:
Who wrote:
===============================
We don't know if there's an offer.
What there isn't, however, are the teasing non-denial denials that KF has practiced the last 5 years.
So:
a. He is not in touch with MI AT ALL, NADA.
b. This is serious.
Iowa City is deathly still.
================================
Not so. We know Iowa and Ferentz have been contacted because very early in the process, the Iowa AD specifically said that Ferentz will have no comment regarding his identification by media as a candidate. That is the opposite of every other Ferentz rumor the last several years.
The attitudes on these boards changes like people change their underwear...
Last week Les Miles was basically the hands down #1 option for Michingan, now because of "poor clock management" and "two losses" his head is already on the chopping block. Give me a break. I'd take a two loss season over going 7-5 which is probably what we are going to do considering we can't win a bowl game anymore.
If LSU wins the SECCG I bet the mood on this board will change and Miles will again become the guy we need to save Michigan football.
Not all of us Lloyd supporters are terribly against this hire. I don't loooove Ferentz, but I'd prefer him Miles.
But to your broader point, Carr apologists like me don't suggest that everything was perfect with Lloyd Carr. Lack if in-game adjustments is a valid criticism. The problem is that the criticisms are wildly overblown. Lloyd Carr was never a "horrible coach" as suggested by some. He's a good coach with flaws. Miles strikes me as a bad coach with flaws. Brian Kelly would be fine, I'd love Jon Tenuta or Tedford, Peterson would be good. I'm not wild about Ferentz, but I can live with Ferentz.
But it is the coach's fault, to some extent. Who you bring in and how they behave reflects on the program, whether or not the coach is out there buying them drinks or suggesting they go cruise for tranny hookers.
MDan,
I don't need any other examples besides the clock problems. That is such a huge part of coaching. Mismanaging a game clock can cost you games. Who cares if he is the best playcaller in the nation and then the score is tied and he uses timeouts at unnecessary times...thus possibly costing his team the game. It should be obvious.
hey now, what is the problem with tranny hookers?
Would somebody please give me a concrete example of why Miles is a bad coach? If his occassional brain fart about the clock is all you have, that is not enough. I can name dozens of good coaches that fumble the clock from time to time. Give facts.
Mdan,
When has LC ever 'fumbled the clock?'
Erik Barmack, I think you're giving far too much weight to whether Ferentz is "outperforming" the program's historical performance. While I agree that certain programs have a gravitational center and a coach can't possibly stay above or drag down the program for very long, I do think that a coach also has his own gravitational center.
In other words, while Kirk Ferentz may have outperformed Iowa's historical record, I also think that he is, deep down inside, a 6-6 or 7-5 guy. If you put him in charge of Michigan, which I believe is a perennial 10-2 program, then he'll probably produce somewhere in between- an 8-4 or 9-3 record every year.
That's NOT an improvement over Lloyd Carr. It's just more of the same, and that's probably why some people (myself included) are panicking about this. Michigan is a program that doesn't change coaches willy-nilly, and whoever is hired now will be in charge for at least 5 but probably 8-10 years. Speaking for myself, I don't want 10 more years of Lloyd Carr's 9-3 seasons with a chance at a national title gone before the damn leaves turn.
Also, to answer your one question about Ferentz's recruiting- now that Weis and Zook are snagging the Chicago recruits, the quality of Ferentz's classes have gone downhill. That's not a coincidence- Ferentz won lots of games when he was able to get a pipeline into Chicago, but those days are gone now. So no, I don't think he has shown the ability to recruit, especially against Weis, Zook, Tressel, et al.
Ferentz is not "undervalued," IMO, and when you consider the salary he gets for his .500 record, he is quite literally overpriced.
Do. Not. Want.
I have a feeling the clock management criticism of Miles would sound very different today if Darren McFadden and Felix Jones weren't Tecmo Bo Jackson clones.
Mdan-his defense has more talent than any team in the country, almost all of it is consisted of upperclassmen, and yet they can't stop a fullback dive to save their lives.
have to agree with Meeechigan Dan...if this is the worst people can come up with then bring on Les Miles.
Lloyd fumbled the clock in the Rose Bowl against Texas, when they let it run down and made the FG the final play, instead of giving Breaston one more chance to set us up for a miracle toss to the endzone. Some chance is better than no chance.
00goblue00,
I for one have never been certain about Les Miles and I still wonder if there's more hype to the man than substance. After the last LSU loss, I realized that LSU losing was the best thing for the U-M coaching search. Why? Because the "Les is the savior" talk is now quieted. Now Les can be evaluated as a candidate just like everyone else. I for one like Brian Kelly, who's done nothing but win at every level, kind of like Tressel. I wonder if the Les Miles contingent would be so hot if he had no U-M ties at all. Just wondering...
I am not saying that Les is NOT the fit for Michigan, but I think he should interview just like anyone else and be conisdered on his merits. Lloyd Carr isn't perfect, but he seems a pretty decent judge of character to me and he definitely doesn't perfer Miles.
What has Miles won?
Wolv in S. FLA--
Would I prefer to see him as our next head coach? Yes...but I think he should interview like everyone else as well...
I'm just saying its very interesting how the mood shifts...wasn't specifically stating you.
We've gone like 2 hours without a message from the Committee to Elect Chuck Martin...is there something wrong in the campaign office? Or is Mr. Martin at practice and unavailable to pimp himself?
What a day. We need content. Or busier jobs.
Please tell me this is not true. Can you imagine a Ferentz arrival? I can tell you right now he would not be warmly received. The Michigan job is one of the most prestigious coaching jobs in sports and in searching for Carr's replacement Michigan should start with none other than absolute coaching elite. No exceptions. Handing it off to a middle of the road Big Ten coach with no immediate ties to the program who's name is generally unheard of on this campus is far from what is needed. This program is now in the midst of an opportunity for some much needed change and revitalization. This would be a horrible decision and would greatly increase the possibility of mediocrity. A Ferentz Tressel rivalry sounds to me like it would continue to be a one sided affair with blue on the receiving end of buckeye domination. What Michigan needs is a high profile guy like Les Miles. A guy who will intensify our rivalry with ohio and push this program in the only direction it needs to go: the absolute top.
and @ Wolv in S. Fla-
regarding Lloyd Carr being a good judge of character...that may be, however I think the only person who should be making the hiring decision is Bill Martin.
When people start doing favors for others it can turn into a bad thing. Like I said before too many hands in the pot never leads to anything good.
newcarr, it's not obvious. For all reasons cited, this man brings a LOT to the table, with some rough edges. You don't like him. But he has coached the pants off of Carr and Ferentz and most others these past couple years. And kicked ass in recruiting, too.
I am afraid that the longer the "search" drags on; the more "negative information" will surface on the each candidate. As a result, BM and LC default to the one guy they know: DeBord.
We need to decide on a coach ASAP to avoid hiring DeBord.
What has Ferentz won?
Ferentz has won 2 big ten titles.
I am a Lloyd fan. However, I seriously question his choice of "football acumen", especially on offense. If he is as good at evaluating football coaches as he thinks he is, why did he give Mike DeBord chance after chance? Why did he run off Stan Parrish, the only true passing game guru on his staff the last 13 years?
hey NOmiles,
What if Miles beats Tennessee on Saturday to win the SEC title. That's a conference championship in only 3 years.
Also of note. Of Miles 6 losses in his 3 years at LSU, 3 came in overtime. Without the overtime system he's only lost 3 games.. 10-0-2 this year.
I do not live and die with Les Miles. I prefer him over Ferentz and slightly over Kelly because of his roots. But someone with this track record cannot be tossed out as a bad coach:
In his first season as coach LSU won the 2005 SEC Western Division title with a 10-1 regular season record -- including wins over #15 Arizona State (9/10/05), #11 Florida (10/15/05), #16 Auburn (10/22/05) and #4 Alabama (11/12/05). LSU's only regular season loss was an upset at home to #10 Tennessee (9/26/05). In the Tennessee game, after building a 21-0 lead at halftime, the Tigers failed to score another touchdown and lost to UT 30-27 in overtime. In the SEC Championship Game in Atlanta, Georgia, the #3-ranked LSU Tigers, though favored, lost to #13 Georgia 34-14. LSU recovered to win the 2005 Peach Bowl with a 40-3 romp of the #9-ranked Miami Hurricanes. Miles finished his first season at LSU with an 11-2 record, a #6 ranking in the USA Today Coaches Poll, and a #5 ranking in the AP Poll.
In 2006, LSU finished the regular season with ten wins (10-2), and ended the season with six straight wins. 2006 marked the first time in LSU history that the Tigers finished with back-to-back 10-win seasons. Miles was able to do this in spite of his team playing its four toughest games on the road. All four games were against teams ranked in the top eight when the game took place, with three of the teams in the top five (Auburn, Florida, Arkansas). LSU split those four games, losing to Auburn and Florida, but beating Tennessee and Arkansas. LSU did not win the SEC West title, finishing one game behind Arkansas. However, the Tigers were ranked ahead of Arkansas at the end of the regular season, and were rewarded with an invitation to face Notre Dame in the Sugar Bowl where they defeated the Irish 41-14. LSU finished the 2006 season ranked #3 overall in both the AP and ESPN polls.
In 2007, Miles gained national attention due to numerous unconventional play calls during nationally televised games. LSU won the 2007 SEC Western Division title and was ranked #1 twice during the regular season. LSU lost its final regular season game at home to unranked Arkansas 50-48 in triple-overtime and lost its #1 ranking.
You may not like him, but those accomplishments and victories dward Ferentz's accomplishments.
My point regarding Lloyd's preference is this...Lloyd doesn't seem that influenced by the football aspect re: Miles. It's more of a character issue with him, it appears. That makes me a little concerned, that's all. Great if he is a winner, but do we turn into USC?
Six losses over three years in arguably the most difficult conference does not make you a bad coach. I don't think Miles is great, but he isn't bad by any standard at all.
Also, winning a DIII title does not automatically make you a great coach. If Miles wins the SEC on Saturday, it doesn't all of a sudden make him a Weisian ubergenius, nor does the lack of title make him a dolt.
Les Miles did not call that timeout in overtime against Arkansas. Rewatch the tape, he wasn't the one that called it. So get off the clock mismanagement stuff.
How about the t.o.'s in the 4th quarter. They were lucky they made it to overtime.
Dammit Brian, don't be a tease.
KF?
Sure he'll get the recruits, he'll get the 8-4 and up records and he won't say anything stupid....but why was Lloyd on the hot seat to begin with?
Cause recently he couldn't beat our biggest rival and couldn't win the bowl game.
Is Ferentz any different? He can't beat Iowa State (how will he do against Ohio State?), I recall a damn good Hawkeye team owned by Carson and Co. in the Rose Bowl and watched Texas sneak away with a win last year. And I've seen the Hawkeyes lose to inferior opponents consistently every year.
To me he's basically the same coach as Llyod
Is the problem he left some time on the clock for Arkansas? I'm confused what the issue is in the 4th.
To me, the Arkansas time out call is a moot point. Throwing the ball into the ez on the last play of the game when all you need is 3--I can NOT get off that type of clock mismanagement. If that had happened when he was at UM I would have burnt my house down.
http://www.mlive.com/wolverines/
...granted_to.html
Not that it necessarily means anything...
I suspect Brian is sitting on a huge bomb, and would not post anymore without confirmation.
NO MORE DEBORD...
Meeechigan Dan-
Les Miles stats sound terrible to me....since we are online I will kindly point out the sarcastic tone I wrote this in lol.
Let's not forget that Martin said he wanted a clone of Carr; sounds like Ferentz fits that bill.
However this was just posted:
Iowa: No permission granted to talk with Ferentz
by John Heuser | Ann Arbor News
Monday November 26, 2007, 1:51 PM
Rumors are flying today that Iowa football coach Kirk Ferentz has been offered the job at the University of Michigan, where he is considered a candidate to replace the retiring Lloyd Carr.
If so, that's news to Iowa sports information director Phil Haddy. According to Haddy, Michigan has not even requested permission from Iowa athletic director Gary Barta to speak with Ferentz.
Ferentz, who was born in Michigan, has a 61-49 overall record in nine seasons at Iowa, inc
The share price of Ann Arbor Torch & Pitchfork (AATP on NYSE) has gone through the roof, now trading at 34.75. I have it on reliable authority that Brian owns a substantial stake in the company, and along with other investors was very disappointed in the earnings performance this year. Insiders tell me that this Ferentz talk was started by Brian as a means of goosing up the price so he can dump it at the high point and walk away with a handsome profit before the rumor is revealed to be just that, leaving the johnny-come-lately speculators owning more pitchforks than a 19th-century corn farmer and Frankenstein-chaser would be able to use in ten seasons.
Don....
I'm pretty sure the Ann Arbor Torch & Pitchfork stock has been going strong for the past several years given our recent records against OSU and Bowl opponents
The TD toss was brilliant. There was plenty of time. Absolutely amazing that anyone could find fault with how he played that out. The only quibble is that the QB waiting about 2 seconds too long. Amazing.
Don....
Given the our recent record against OSU and in Bowl Games, I'm pretty sure that the share price of Ann Arbor Torch & Pitchfork Co. has been doing just fine
http://www.mlive.com/wolverines/
...granted_to.html
If this story is correct, and up to date, it seems contrary to an earlier statement that Ferentz would have no comment.
I believe Martin that he would go the high road. But, as between Martin and Wangler and Miles; perhaps the "informal" conversation is between Mary Sue, a friend, and Ferentz to gauge whether he would take the job.
But, with this quote I find it HIGHLY UNLIKELY that any offer has been made. Martin wouldn't go over the a.d.'s head. I am assuming that Barta's quote in mlive is from today, not last week.
and im an idiot....but you get the drift
I dont know much about football...but this is doesn't seem like rocket science.
Just go out on the road with a trunk full of money and dont come back untill you come back with the best coach you can get.
Brian Kelley...Does anyone know what type of a recruiter he is? Granted we all think that Michigan sells itself, but what type of recruiting experience does he have? I can't say that recruiting the athletes who go to GVSU/CMU is comparible to the type of guys you get at a school like U-M. Whole different level of ego, family involvment, groveling, etc.
Athletic director Gary Barta indicated today that the only conversation he has had with his coach is on the future of the Hawkeye program — not anyone’s future at another program.
The name of Ferentz has swirled in talks about the open Michigan job, but no reports last week or weekend attributed any information to named sources.
“Any discussions I've had with or about Kirk have been focused on improving the Hawks in 2008,” Barta responded today.
Barta said last week that he expects notification from his peers if Ferentz becomes a serious candidate for another head coaching position.
When asked if Michigan or any other school had contacted him about Ferentz, Barta responded: “No.”
http://desmoinesregister.com/app...024/1003/
SPORTS
on the recruiting front, I want to make it clear it is not that hard to recruit Louisiana. LA is like recruiting the other LA...stockpiled. And when you are winning, it's even easier to continue to recruit well.
I guess that does it. No way an offer was issued. Not by a school that believes it does things "the right way". But something happened. Perhaps this whole thing was floated by someone who wanted to kill KF's candidacy by getting the peasants up in arms. I've heard the arguments that MSC doesn't have to listen to anyone but the board, however, if the money dries up in the athletic program, she will be finished. It'd be like a president pissing off his/her biggest campaign donors and then expecting to get re-elected. Gust this rumor alone I think has really put a HUGE damper on any KF candidacy.
Re Miles recruiting:
Miles has a history of excellent recruiting going back to his days with Colorado, U Mich, OSU, etc. Don't think that just because there is a lot of talent in Louisiana that Miles isn't a good recruiter. His success in this area is well documented.
That's kind of like saying Tressel isn't a good coach; he just gets good talent that makes him look good. How does that explain his success at Youngstown St.?
I'm not sold yet on Miles, but he is a great recruiter.
Wolv S.FLA - People say he's "owning" Dantonio on the recruiting front, but I think that's exaggerated. Like you said, it's really different when you're recruiting for CMU or Cinci, but I wanna say he's a decent-good recruiter. Remember our Brendan Kay QB guy that we were thinking we would offer as a understudy to Mallett (prior to landing Weinke)? Well, he committed to Cinci. He also got that Sean Hooey guy MSU was looking at, and Dominic Britt, a mobile QB out of Ohio (Brandon Moore's QB out of Trotwood-Mason). Other than that, I don't recognize a lot of the names, but I don't know if that's any indication of how good/bad he is at recruiting.
mea culpa on the LSU recruiting assumption, I cannot tell you a lot about recruiting at smaller name schools like Okie St., but none of those classes he brought in there were impressive. That can have every bit to do with the fact that it's Okie St., so I can't say much about that.
One of the 20 Freep articles this weekend was about what a tenacious recruiter in California he was for Bill McCartney at Colorado. McCartney couldn't say enough about his efforts there. I also remember that he brought in some very big names for U-M. Granted, it helps to have a big name school behind you, but you can still have that clout and be a lousy recruiter (ND, Nebraska, etc.). So I think it is safe to assume with Miles at Mich we'd see on average a top 10 class each year, perhaps better.
More info:
http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.d...6/71125008/
1054
http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.d.../711250609/
1054
BTW, his OSU classes weren't that bad. One of his classes was ranked 15th, which is pretty good for an Oklahoma school that is NOT OU.
Can an offer have been made to Ferentz without the Iowa AD having any knowledge of another school contacting Ferentz?
I don't see how, unless the Iowa AD is willing to lie to a jawdropping extent for his departing head coach (and the Big 10 program that snagged him). Brian got this wrong, and we can all breathe a sigh of relief, I think.
The torrent of postings is slowing. Could it be that we all actually have some work to do?
:-)
Or are we all just satsified that this rumor has been nipped in the bud?
Interesting blog...
http://community.foxsports.com/
b...coaching_search
I think we sometimes forget about Chris Petersen. The guy should at least be considered as an equal to Brian Kelly. And I think both of these guys are better X's and O's people than Miles. Of course, there's more to the job than just that.
Been reading these threads cause I'm a Cincinnati alum, and I can say that if UM interviews Brian Kelly, he'll get the job. He's that good.
He sold college football in CINCINNATI. God only knows what he could do in Ann Arbor.
Is it true that BK has 2 duis? If so, he's not going to be invited here.
Yes, an offer could have been made and accepted without Iowa's AD knowing.
UM talks to Ferentz's agent. The agent talks to KF. Agent works a deal with UM. Once the deal is done UM calls Barta and asks permission to speak to KF. PErmission granted and psuedo interview conducted and KF hired.
I'm not going to talk about Ferentz, acknowledging it only makes it seem more real. I'll instead put a dent in this Chuck Martin thing...
Tressel was an assistant at Ohio State, he was an assistant under a former Bo guy at Syracuse... he was part of the tradition, a branch on Woody's coaching tree. Without that going for him he would've be coaching the the MAC right now.
Answer this question for me Kelly supporters: Do you trust a man who hops from job to job like he does? GVSU to Central, ok that's great. Central to Cinci? Ok it's a step up to a BCS conference. From that to Michigan after 1 year? He's not a Midwest guy, either. He's only here because after GVSU only midwestern schools have seen him. How do we know he wouldn't bolt if, say, the Buffalo Bills called him?
As early as yesterday KF has not talked with his AD about a job at Michigan.
http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.d...6040/0/
SPORTS06
He has to discuss it with the AD before accepting another position.
The other thing you have to consider is I don't think they'd announce it this quickly. Michigan is still waiting to find out what bowl they will be in, OSU's still trying to find out if it will sneak into the National title game and Iowa is holding out hope that they will get a bowl bid.
While I have more faith in KF's coaching then apparently most of you guys do, I don't think that Michigan would ever offer to pay him more then he's earning right now. That being said though, even if they cut his pay by half it would still be a big opprotunity for him.
The way I figure it the man already has enough money and figures he's making enough money. But Iowa just doesn't have the recruiting base or ability that Michigan does. As much as I don't want to see him leave Iowa. (We just want to say goodbye to our offensive coordinator really) I couldn't blame him for taking the job if it was offered to him.
If Michigan did hire Ferentz it would strike me as an awefully "safe" pick. I would think they would go with a coordinator from another big school or a head coach at a smaller school first. But if they have a conservative Athletic department they might go with someone who's coached at that level before rather then shooting for someone unknown.
But again, this seems awefully early for them to be offering a job to ANYONE including Ferentz.
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