How the hell is Kansas "Hawaii after a power mushroom"? Their defense and offense are ranked in the top 10 in almost all major categories, a feat accomplished by almost no one.
At least we beat our shitty teams.
Love Oregon #1, but.. whoa man, I know you don't look at past ballots, but that's a harsh drop for kansas. Nebraska is bad, but Kansas still obliterated them - only one week after that same Nebraska team almost beat Texas, I believe. Also seems a bit hubristic to have 8-2 Michigan above them - fear coulter/krugman!
So yeah, dubious or not, I would at least slide KU into the top 10. Other than that you have my support.
bar the doors, i hear jorel getting angry about osu dropping behind the ducks in one completely meaningless to real life poll ballot
Dropping Kansas six spots after their blowout of Nebraksa doesn't make any sense, regardless of what you think of their overall schedule. They certainly didn't do anything this week do warrant such a fall.
You are probably being a little harsh on Kansas. I can see your reasoning, but you are creating problems by only using that reasoning against them. Arizona St has beat nobody outside of Cal (we'll see how good they are the next couple of weeks), Boston College managed to beat Virginia Tech but thats about the extent of their good victories, and thats even assuming Virginia Tech is even that good themselves as they've lost all tough games outside of Clemson. Kansas is at least undefeated. Their are lots of teams with soft schedules high in the rankings this year, you can't just punish one of them.
also, i'm not really buying USF at this point. maybe 23ish. if at all. not very significant, but i'm bored.
obviously brian isn't dropping kansas because of what happened this week. he reevaluated them on the whole season after trying to figure out where to put them. sh**, he said that right in the post!
You keep saying that Cal loss is bad for Tenn, but they didn't face the reeling Cal that's playing now. Cal followed that with a Lloyd Carrish performance against Colorado State, but then victories over Arizona and AT OREGON, who you have at #1.
I can see the argument against Tennessee, but is it better than the argument...against, say, Cal itself? or Penn State or Clemson or Florida State? I don't think Tenn is an unworthy part of the last 5 picks.
Kansas at 14 is unfair. Illinois at 19 is......odd.
Illinois:
loss to Missouri looks better than originally expected, sure. Their wins over Penn State and Wisconsin at home are fine, though nothing great (and both could have gone either way). But they lost to a terrible Iowa team, and they lost to a Michigan team at home, when Michigan was out their 2 best players.
Kansas: victories AT Kansas State and Texas A&M are not exactly a joke. They played Colorado too close, but when Oklahoma had a bad game at Colorado, they ummmm....lost. I agree they're untested, but they'll have their chance to prove themselves a fraud in their last 2 pre-bowl games. I just can't see them over Connecticut, Michigan, or three loss USC. After all, who has USC beat? Their best win this year is against 5-4 (3-3) Oregon State, at home.
Well, Sagarin has Kansas 2/6/2 (elo-chess/pure-points/overall) whereas Hawaii is 43/32/40. Boston College (5/24/10) is way more of a pretender than Kansas is.
I do agree with dropping Tennessee out.
Thank you, Mr. Angry Anonymous guy.
1) Chill out.
2) I understand Brian's reasoning. We all think Brian's great... that's why we're here. But I would humbly submit that hanging 76 points on a BIG XII team (albeit a bad one) is probably enough reason to have them in the top ten.
but they also gave up 40.
...and their coach is a major league, embarrassing-to-the-university fatass.
...and for once I wasn't talking about Weis.
I think I'd raise Kansas and still drop Texas.
Oregon belongs nowhere but #1.
i know why we hate kansas.
dollar signs.
b-c-s.
/where's my danish
my favorite is still the headline from the Kansas paper over a picture of Mangino that said "the cupcakes served their purpose"
Um, Kansas behind UConn? The same team that got a ref-gifted win over Temple? TEMPLE! The one that's 70 spots behind Stanford and Appalachian State in the Sagarin Predictor!
Drop UConn. Put Kansas in the top 10. I don't care if UConn only has one official loss, we all know what really happened in that Temple game.
at least brian didn't go all dan shanoff on us and do something completely, totally, batshit insane like put uconn at #5.
Tennessee -- completely agree. Their defense is Michigan (Nov '06 thru Sept '07) soft. Gave up 145 points in their 3 losses.
Kansas -- way harsh. West Virginia's marquee wins are Rutgers (5-4) and Miss State (5-4), yet you have them all the way up at #5, despite a loss. Arizona State, UConn, and Missouri don't exactly have any big wins under their belts either... though they do have losses.
Texas -- ranked appropriately in mid-teens. They keep winning, but you just get the feeling they're going to do a Chad Henne face plant sooner or later.
What is the justification for dropping Ohio State in favor of Oregon this week?
Just the Arizona State win?
I always hate these because it's so damn hard to both systematically evaluate everyone's wins and losses, but also apply some discretion and allow for circumstances and such. I certainly don't do it and only would if I had to vote.
That said:
-UConn is too high
-Michigan is too high
-Kansas is too low
I assume by ranking UConn at 10, you're saying they could beat Michigan and Southern Cal 50%+1 of the time? And so on down the list? I don't buy it. If they were on the schedule, I wouldn't go "Oh Shit! UConn." That's requisite for the Top 10 isn't it?
We found out in the State game that we appear to no longer possess an offensive line and our DTs are struggling. Combine that with Hart and Henne and we're in danger of falling apart again. It also means, that we shouldn't be candidate for #11.
And if you're going to get into Kansas' resume, who exactly has Ohio State beaten? Penn State? Ryan Mallett beat Penn State. There are so many bad teams this year that pretty much everyone's resume looks like crap. Except the good PAC10 teams.
Yeah, I don't get the OSU drop either.
Arizona St has two wins against teams with winning records, 6-3 Cal (not bad) and 5-4 Oregon St (weak).
OSU beat Wisky at least as impressively as Oregon beat ASU.
And Oregon lost. To 6-3 Cal.
Accuses of bias?
Which team did Michigan score 70+ on this year?
You have your own two loss team whose best win is over either 3 loss Purdue(who has lost to every competent opponent) or Illinois ranked higher than an undefeated Kansas team who finally won me over... and you dropped them 6.
Dude, don't bitch about their schedule. Your game against Appalachian State did actually occur, as did your pantsing at home vs. Oregon.
One loss Oregon over Ohio State smells of homerism too.
Do you honestly believe that Michigan would handle Kansas? Florida? easily beat Tennessee?
No justification at all.
i'm w/ the general sentiment on Kansas. you dropped them too much. if you watch them i think you'll agree they're pretty impressive. if they lose you have all the reason you want to drop them. but at this point it just seems like posturing.
I think you might be overvaluing USC, UConn, and Virginia (have you actually watched them, ugh), and hitting Kansas a little harder than necessary. I'd say they are 9 or 10. I'm also a little suprised to see Florida State, it was a great win, but it's not been a good season overall.
On an unrelated note, I spent this afternoon looking at the blogs of other Big Ten teams and other major football schools and I have to really applaud this site. I didn't even know about it until halfway through the season and I'm glad it was sent to me (despite the unbelievable negativity of some commenters). It's also one of the few that actually stays updated on a regular basis and leaves me with a great read almost every day. Thanks and Go Blue!
Sort of with the majority of posters, Brian.
Yeah, Kansas doesn't have a really tough schedule. Best wins are 5-4 Kan State, 5-5 Colorado, and 6-4 AM. Throw in the 76 point beat down of Nebraska for style points I guess.
Michigan has 3 wins over 7-3 teams and not much else. Throw in the fact that we've never laid a beat down like Kansas did, and the fact that while Oregon would do the same to Kansas that they did to us, we still have 2 bad losses on our resume... I can't see much justification for Michigan over Kansas.
1. South Florida is awful- I would get them out of there.
2. I think Kansas deserves more respect. They should DEF be above Michigan
The BC fraud is finally exposed by unranked FSU and they only drop 3? Are you kidding me?
UConn is also too high given their resume, and Kansas is #9 or #10 at the very least.
Kansas belongs at least at #6. Seriously, their schedule is bad but not Hawaii-bad (or even close). I can see an argument for them being as high as #4 right now (behind LSU and Oregon, who are the only one-loss teams who have done enough to justify it).
I assume that if Kansas beats Missouri and then Oklahoma in the Big XII championship game, this will change drastically ... as in "Kansas in the top 2" drastically.
Other arguments: I don't buy Oregon over OSU just yet. UConn ... what were you smoking when you decided that one? Michigan and Texas seem a little high but not *way* out of line; ditto USF (who has now lost three straight).
Kansas does seem a bit low. If you're going to rag on their schedule, you have to rag on other teams' (Arizona State, specifically) schedules as well.
Texas does look too high. Too much reward for barely coming back to beat Okie State.
That said, trying to compile a reasonable poll this year is an exercise in futility. I do like Oregon at #1 and the continuing lack of Hawaii.
So... if Tennessee gets heavily penalized for losing to Cal, why doesn't Oregon?
Don't get me wrong, Tennessee's defense is awful and I agree with the Vols being unranked. However, is losing at home (!) to Cal on the last play really that much better than losing on the road to Kentucky on the last play in triple OT? Or losing on the road to Colorado on a last-second kick? Or going undefeated so far in the Big Ten or Big 12?
Yeah, Oregon's good, but at this point anyone anointing a #1 needs to give a good solid explanation. Just putting someone on top isn't good enough this season, especially if you're dropping your previous #1 without that team losing.
"So... if Tennessee gets heavily penalized for losing to Cal, why doesn't Oregon? "
i don't remember all the circumstances of all the games, but didn't Oregon out gain & generally out perform Cal, whereas Tenn got shellacked in most phases?
No problem with dropping Tennessee, but with Georgia at #9? UGA's beatdown of Florida was at least as aberrant as Tennessee's beating of Georgia.
The only reason Georgia doesn't have three losses like UT does is because they didn't play anybody as good as Cal in the non-conference.
I know they have Knowshon (and Knowshon is half the battle), but they're not #9.
Kansas too low, U Conn too high, S. Florida too high, BC too high.
Teams going down after a win is just plain oddity. And shouldn't be justified by 'I just got around to considering how suck their schedule is.'
You could have Kansas that low if you run a casino, but they are undefeated in a major conference. Kind of demands Top 10 consideration in this season.
I agree, as much as I think Oregon would beat the Buckeyes head to head, you have to give Ohio State #1 until we take it away from them on November 17th.
LSU -- I don't like at 3, they haven't shown much in an alternative universe with very slight changes they could have 3 or 4 losses easy. Yes top 5, but no to #3.
BC - is a poser and I definitely know we'd beat them. They can't be that high... if they are it is only based on previous ranking etc., which means you should also leave Ohio State and Kansas high.
UConn has to go as well. I would put them higher than 15.
Michigan - enough already, we've done our time for the loss to App State and Oregon and all we've done for the last 8 weeks is win football games. 4th longest DI win streak. 10-12 is a logical ranking, our D-fense is playing outstanding ball now and our offense hasn't changed from the preseason hype.
!!!Kansas -- they are more deserving of UCONN gotta be in top 10. why is Texas moving 11??? Did they destroy a highly ranked team last weekend... I missed it.
Good God, man. You're killing Kansas for running through a weak Big 12...who the hell has #6 Mizzou beaten? And who has #12 Michigan beaten that's any better than Kansas's opponents? I know all of you Michigan fans want to pretend that the first 2 weeks of the schedule didn't happen, but you're being silly.
Michigan can earn its spot in the Top 25 next year, but for this season, they don't belong anywhere near it.
I'm a pretty big hater of the Big East. I see no way that USF should be on a poll after losing to Rutgers, UCONN, and Cincy - none of who really inspire any awe. If we want to accuse Kansas of playing cupcakes, one should only look at UCONN's schedule - I can only hope that after they get slaughtered by WVU at the end of the year, people realize the depth of their fakeness.
SEC bias is nothing if not mindless. Wait, let me read that again. Okay, never mind.
But really, being in control of the SEC East must be worth something. At least let us get embarrassed by McArkansas this week before trashing us completely.
I say Tennessee remains ranked based solely on the sexual prowess of their center.
chitownblue:
Couldn't agree more regarding the Big East this year. They have several fraudulent teams flying under the radar. The ACC is suffering from the same problem, but no one's talking about them either.
Nope, all the media hype machine wants to talk about this year is how great the SEC is and how awful the Big 10 is.
you really can't single out Kansas in a year like this where no one stands out, and call them out for a weak schedule.
I'd agree with the general opinion that while Kansas has played no one, they don't deserve to be below USC (whose best case for being so high is playing close vs Oregon). ASU, similarly, has beaten no one and really didn't impress against Oregon.
Few teams have quality wins to brag about this season, even OSU. Kansas should be above ASU, wherever you're going to put them... Its reasonable to not ding ASU for losing to Oregon, but they were too high in the first place.
Beyond Oregon crushing Michigan there is scant evidence to indicate that the Pac10 is a good conference and a mountain of bad losses to indicate they are pretty bad (notre dame, tcu, new mexico, utah, etc). The lower half of the Pac10 was an embarrassment in the non-conference and now are defeating cal, ucla, and even usc.
UCLA is lower-half of the Pac-10 in quality if not in aberrant win numbers.
Kansas should be higher.
UConn doesn't belong in the top 20, unless you are making a combined poll of hoops and football teams. Not only is their schedule significantly worse than Kansas', you have them ranked 10 spots ahead of Virginia, who beat them and has the same record. Finally, they have not one, but two ref-aided wins against Temple and Louisville, who couldn't beat a top ten team if you combined them.
I don't see how you can rank Florida, Georgia, and TEnnessee that far apart. Maybe none of them are top ten, maybe none of them are top 25, but if one is #14, the other two are 13 and 15.
>>> Michigan can earn its spot in the Top 25 next year, but for this season, they don't belong anywhere near it.
Even I don't agree with that, and I'm looking for every excuse to drop them. Yes, they lost to App State and got smoked by Oregon. UConn lost to Temple (to hell with what the refs say). Virginia lost to NC State (!) and Wyoming (!!!) and has exactly two wins by more than 5 points. Illinois and PSU lost to Michigan and have more losses overall. USF has dropped three ugly ones in a row, as has Cal.
#11 is too high, but they belong somewhere in the poll. Probably around the 15-17 range.
Brian,
Totally don't agree with the Kansas ranking. At all. How can a one-loss Okla. team, who lost a game Kansas won (@ COL) not put them ahead? I know Nebraska has fallen off, but 76 points? They had 69 with 6 minutes left in the 3rd quarter! They also beat Texas A&M on the road as well, which is never an easy place to play. They have a solid offense along with a great run defense and would hold their own against anybody.
I don't think you can drop Kansas. If you want to have them low, fine, but you should have had them there the entire time. You can't drop a team 6 spots for putting up 76 on Nebraska (even if Nebraska is down). Kansas isn't 6 spots "worse" than they were last week. If anything, they're "better".
Cal beat Oregon beat Michigan beat ND beat UCLA beat Cal.
I know you have to do your best to rationalize a ranking system but what more can one even aspire to than a gut feeling about who is better than who? If it feels right, go with it. Don't think about it too much.
This might not make any logical sense, or even seem counter-intuitive, but you might try throwing out a team's best and worst games. Treat them like the statistical outliers they are. Just toss two games and you'll still have a reasonable pool of data and might make some of the close class more comfortable even if the list as a whole wouldn't change a lot.
But they are not statistical outliars. These games should not be weighted equally.
Wow, just about anybody can run a blog, huh?
Kansas at 14 is laughable. Top ranked D and O. Beat TAM in College Station, Beat KSU at Bill Snyder Field, Won in CO. All good tests. Who has Ohio State played, who has Missouri played, who has Boston College played? Shut this blog down before someone think your information is useful.
Your assertion that Mississippi State is not decent based on one game is beyond foolish. I expected better of you. Lets apply that theory to Michigan shall we? Is Michigan decent? Oregon 39-7, or better yet, App. St. 34-32. No, just no. Thus by your standards Michigan is officially garbage.
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