Terrible decision to counter demonstrate by dissidents.
Chris, that picture you used, isn't that from the memorial in Galbally? Not many barstoolers about that part of the country!
My sentiments exactly Chris. One set of dicheads gives another set of dickheads exactly what they want. Excuses. This'll be milked for all it's mopery for months to come.
However, don't underestimate the intention of RSF to undermine SF's electoral prospects in th coming general election.
Ruairi will have a wry smile on his face at settling old scores.
'However, don't underestimate the intention of RSF to undermine SF's electoral prospects in th coming general election.
Ruairi will have a wry smile on his face at settling old scores'
EXACTLY!
I agree Pacman
Bunch of Reprobates!
At first glance I thought this thread was a link to Ireland Free 
Barstool Republicans, spot on, says it all.
Idiots, barstewards!
The problem Chris is that this was entirely predictable when RSF made clear their intention to picket this march. You would've thought that the Gardai would've had the foresight to deploy more forces to ensure this didn't happen but then a Republican riot in Dublin suits other political parties in the south also. If nothing else it takes the heat off the current Justice Minister indulging these bigots over the protestations of the families of the Dublin/Monaghan bombings.
Anyone smell a rat?
One set of tossers protesting against another set of tossers.
Would have to agree that RSF are trying to damage SF and used today to cause as much disruption and publicity as possible
I think Minister McDowell should be held responsible for today's debacle. How often has he assured people about the quality of his and the Gardai's intelligence gathering. But the were caught out today and a small group of thugs was able to run riot in Dublin stopping a legal march.
I think the Minister has to account for his management of the situation.
Indeed Henry94
Even though I don't agree with it, his offices have been damaged, so he'll be busy with the decorators, which will give him time to reflect.
Nothing like a choosing new wallpaper to get the auld head scratching
Henry- I didn't see McDowell out throwing stones or fireworks...
Chris, we know who was behind this disgraceful incident. Mainstream Republicanism needn't be tarred with the same brush as these guys. Sinn Féin needs to come out with a clear denunciation of this behaviour, after all it's in favour of an inclusive Ireland with freedom of expression for all. BU.
Good post Chris.
The counter protest played right into Frazer's hand.
So much for an Ireland of Equals.
PSF will be damaged by this although not directly involved.
.
Chris.
Spot on.
Willie's got something to whinge about and pretty soon RTE will drop the dissident tag when describing the rioters.
I wonder if any of these "Republicans" were ever in Ardoyne, Short Strand or Garvaghy Road, when these communities needed protection from Orange mobs and their PSNI friends, or do they restrict their "operations" to Dublin.
El Matador
"Henry- I didn't see McDowell out throwing stones or fireworks..."
Just to the left of the GPO, small crowd wearing suits, throwing stones at Charlie Bird, big guy with glasses ....
SCOTLAND BEAT ENGLAND
El Matador
He bears political responsibility for the fact that a legal march was prevented from going ahead.
He has confessed on RTE tonight that he had no idea what to expect today. In that case he should have prepared for the possibility of trouble.
We have often heard the Minister quoting intelligence sources to discredit political opponents. But when there's a riot organised in Dublin he is taken by surprise.
You can be sure he will face questions about his competence.
100 years from 1916 and 30 years of failed sectraian war and you guys still don't get it. Who is the greatest friend of the Union violent republicanism/SF RSF CIRA etc etc etc or Willie Fraser? What is the orange in the tricolour all about? Is the Union flag still flying over the six counties? What precisely has your sectianism achieved for a united ireland. Answers please! Violent Republicans appear to be only interested in failure, whingeing and self-pity.
i often thought that mi5 must have men in south armagh...im now convinced that you are one gaskin
...im now convinced that you are one gaskin
ROFLMAO!!!
How do you work that out?
p o'neill seems genuinely upset that Balrog has condemned todays events.
Maybe its you p o'neill who needs to get of your barstool, or is it stuck to your arse.
I think this goes to prove that Sinn Fein/IRA don’t want a PROD about the place.
A real own goal - hows Gerry and Martin going to explain this in Washington ?
Headlines on CNN “IRA supporters disrupt parade, attack police”
JC
I think of myself as more of a Cocktail Bar Republican, than the vulgar barstool variety - it's a matter of class!
I think special thanks are due to Dublin Corporation for leaving thousands of small paving stones from streetworks in the vicinity of the demonstrations to be convieniently used as missiles by the rioters - and to the Gardia for failing to ask them to remove said missiles for the day. Where else would you get it!
But yeah, massive own-goal by so-called 'Republicans.'
I was watching the news there and I find it strange the large number of 'foreign national' said to be involved
j collins
"I think this goes to prove that Sinn Fein/IRA don’t want a PROD about the place.
A real own goal - hows Gerry and Martin going to explain this in Washington ?"
Fortunately the people in Washington don't lump all fenians into a homogenous group, the way you clearly do.
It's attitudes like yours which allow these idiots to justify their actions.
Do you seriously think that Republicans have any interest in preventing Willie and his camp followers proclaiming their bigotry?
"i often thought that mi5 must have men in south armagh...im now convinced that you are one gaskin"
p o neill | 02.25.06 - 9:12 pm | #
I expected better grammar from P.O'Neill. Is there any possibility you may be another P.O'Neill?
Being there today, i believe the foreign national thing is noting but a rumor spun up by some of the scum that were involved in the riot. I was photographing events and was attacked for doing so by a number of "protesters".
I did not notice anyone who appeared to be foriegn taking part in the disturbances although some opertunistic looting may have taken place. The violence was primarily carried out by dubs.
Why is it that until they do something wrong they're republicans, but if something happens they become dissidents?
Sinn Fein was perfectly comfprtable with the rioters' support until it became bad in the public eye...
"Sinn Fein was perfectly comfprtable with the rioters' support until it became bad in the public eye"
It's boviously escaped your notice stranger that Sinn Fein wanted no protests to take place against this march, as the marchers themselves were always more liable to shoot themselves in the foot anyway.
All that's happened is that LU have for once had something positive go their way. The scum that rioted yesterday gave them exactly what they wanted. A chance to whinge even more than they normally do.
the only scum yesterday were the marchers and those that wanted them to march for their own political ends. these bastards should be attacked at every opportunity.
Your last comment is totally unacceptable, anymore and I will be dishing out yellow cards
You have been warned!!
Chris Gaskin
Edited By Siteowner
Stranger
"Sinn Fein was perfectly comfprtable with the rioters' support until it became bad in the public eye..."
What are you talking about???
p o niell
I think you are a unionist attempting to bring this site into disrepute. I suggest Chris examines your comments with a view to deleting them.
Chris
This guy cannot be for real.
I think the "P" in P. O'Neill stands for Pinocchio!
Wee Jeffrey (aka Daniel O'Donnell) said the riots prove some Republicans don't want a Unionist about the place... they obviously don't want Charlie Bird about the place either: RTE's chief reporter got a right beating from some rioters who called him an "orange bastard" - strange strange people.
Let me rephrase:
Party X is perfectly happy wth support from group Y. Group Y do something that is abhorrent in the public eye, and could cast Party Y into disrepute if their connection is seen, so Group Y now become dissidents, or a splinter group. Even though before this action, X and Y were bedfellows. It's every party, a la Liam Lawlor, not just Sinn Fein and the dissident republicans. Boviously...
Stranger
Do you have examples of when Sinn Fein were happy to receive support from these people?
Don't get me wrong, Love Ulster and FAIR are dicks, and they should have known better.
"... I want to commend the
commitment of all of those who took that decision and I want to appeal to every republican, the length and breadth of this island and beyond, to carry the struggle forward with new energy and enthusiasm. ..." http://www.sinnfein.ie/news/detail/11234
"
And as long as people like you and people like us stand together, we will achieve our goals and our freedom...."
http://www.may41970.com/May%
204,...ulySinnFein.htm
"
Comrades, let us stand together and move forward together as one. Ar aghaigh linn."
http://www.redaction.org/news/se...ws/
sept_01.html
Stranger
"Comrades, let us stand together and move forward together as one. Ar aghaigh linn."
http://www.redaction.org/news/se...ws/ sept_01.html
And in the same speech;
"I want to assure unionists that we will have no truck with sectarianism of any kind whether or from any source. Irish republicanism is against sectarianism. Everyone should have the right to live, to shop, to work, to travel, to be educated, or entertained wherever they wish free from sectarian harassment of any kind.
We want to reach out to unionists. For republicans they are in the culture of everyday life, no less Irish than the rest of us. However if they or some of them, to one degree or another, do not choose to look at it in that way that is their entitlement."
Still haven't got anything that makes sense of your allegation.
"Don't get me wrong, Love Ulster and FAIR are dicks, and they should have known better."
I think they knew exactly what they were doing. They got a result.
Sorry, that was me.
The question that won't be asked in the media (but should be asked urgently) is: should the Minister for Justice, Michael McDowell, accept responsibility for his failure to maintain public order during a parade that he sanctioned and resign, or should be simply resign because he legitimized Willie Frazer (a man who supports the murder of the civil rights lawyer, Pat Finucane) by granting him the right to hold a sectarian march along the capital city's main thoroughfare?
It's not up to Michael McDowell to "grant" anyone the right to march. Those rights are enshrined in the European Convention of Human Rights.
Why was RSF protesting against the match, btw?
Those rights are enshrined in the European Convention of Human Rights.
They are however qualified rights
Obviously!
All rights are qualified!
(Why was RSF protesting? Why was PSF not?)
All rights are qualified!
Not true, some are absolute!
"It's not up to Michael McDowell to "grant" anyone the right to march. Those rights are enshrined in the European Convention of Human Rights."
You're confusing the right to public assembly and peaceful protest with a mass march, which has to be granted a licence with permission from the Gardai and the Irish Government i.e. The Department of Justice i.e Michael McDowell.
Wasn't that the argument that your ilk used to justify the murder of the marchers on Bloody Sunday: that the march was unlicenced?
C. Gaskin
Not true, some are absolute!
Like which ones?!
Dubliner
You're confusing the right to public assembly and peaceful protest with a mass march
I'm not.
... which has to be granted a licence with permission from the Gardai and the Irish [sic] Government i.e. The Department of Justice i.e Michael McDowell.
The Gardai and Southern government are bound by the Convention.
Wasn't that the argument that your ilk used to justify the murder of the marchers on Bloody Sunday: that the march was unlicenced? [sic]
I've no idea. I don't know who "my ilk" are, and I've never heard anyone justify the murder of marchers for any reason, including the fact that the march was "unlicensed".
What an odd comment.
"The Gardai and Southern government are bound by the Convention." - willowfield
Really? But the Parades Commission in the north isn't? Why then did it refuse permission for Orangemen to march down Garvaghy Road? Was it in breech of the European Convention of Human Rights? Why does the Orange Order lodge applications with the Parades Commission seeking permission to march if, as you allege, no permission is required? Could the answer me that you are more wrong than Bertie giving McDowell a blowjob on nationwide TV?
In the RoI's capital, if you wish to march, you must seek a licence from Dublin County Council and permission from the Gardai. In relation to Frazer's aborted march, it was the Minister for Justice, Michael McDowell, who personally sanctioned the parade. It is he who failed to ensure public order during the parade that he personally sanctioned; and it is he who must now accept responsibility for his failure and resign.
Really?
Er, yes! The ROI government is a signatory, you know!
But the Parades Commission in the north isn't?
Of course it is.
Why then did it refuse permission for Orangemen to march down Garvaghy Road?
Probably because it was expedient to do so due to the threat of violence from the "residents".
Was it in breech of the European Convention of Human Rights?
I don't know. No-one has challenged its decision in court, so there is no court ruling.
Why does the Orange Order lodge applications with the Parades Commission seeking permission to march if, as you allege, no permission is required?
Permission is required.
In the RoI's capital, if you wish to march, you must seek a licence from Dublin County Council and permission from the Gardai.
That's great - in NI it's the Parades Commission. But obviously all bodies are bound by the Convention rights.
In relation to Frazer's aborted march, it was the Minister for Justice, Michael McDowell, who personally sanctioned the parade.
Maybe he did, but he didn't grant anyone any rights! Those are enshrined in the Convention - they are not in Mr McDowell's gift.
It is he who failed to ensure public order during the parade that he personally sanctioned; and it is he who must now accept responsibility for his failure and resign.
That doesn't mean he granted anyone any human rights!
I agree Chris but you’re a republican and from your site I get the jist your found of beer guzzle-ing and fond of barstools too, whats the difference, the contrast is slight, I mean do you fight for freedom when your hungover?
just because they dont share your partys 'grand plan'/methodology of dealing with these things dont mean automatically your right, Sinn Fein advocated a just ignore stance, rightly so it is the love Ulster supporters capital too, but they were marching on Dublin as if Queen Victoria was still in reign, a peaceful counter demonstration would of been a good policy, this Sinn Fein lets not just look, almost appeasement of a sectarian bias parade is as just as scary as the counter protest that did occur at the weekend! bit two faced calling them barstool republicans, theyre actions where stupid and as irritating to all right minded people as Willowfield's constant support of Unioinism/Orangeism as a moral ideology/militia!lol
Willie Frazer is a sectarian fool.
But in the space of six months he has been responsible for the discrediting of "an sagart" Fr Alec Reid who in an effort to build unionist confidence by witnessing the COMPLETE AND TOTAL destruction of the IRA arsenal, was snarled into a public (televised) slagging match and ends up calling th unionist community NAZIS.
He then organises an event in Dublin and the place is wrecked by RSF yahoos wreck.
Willie Frazer is a sectarian idiot but has outplayed us bigtime (twice).
.
but you’re a republican
You are sharp!
I get the jist your found of beer guzzle-ing
No, I don't like Beer
and fond of barstools too
I wouldn't say I am fond of them, I have no dislike for them.
I would say I am indifferent.
whats the difference
I don't attack other Republicans who are working for a UI, barstoolers do!
They sit around all year long and do absolutley nothing and when Easter comes describe themselves as Republicans.
They are a bunch of reprobates!
bit two faced calling them barstool republicans
How so?
Glen, who is "us"? Are you suggesting that every person in Ireland rioted? If you're not, your claim is unfounded.
Willow, here is the relevant article from the European Convention on Human Rights:
ARTICLE 11
Everyone has the right to freedom of peaceful assembly and to freedom of association with others, including the right to form and to join trade unions for the protection of his interests.
No restrictions shall be placed on the exercise of these rights other than such as are prescribed by law and are necessary in a democratic society in the interests of national security or public safety, for the prevention of disorder or crime, for the protection of health or morals or for the protection of the rights and freedoms of others. this article shall not prevent the imposition of lawful restrictions on the exercise of these rights by members of the armed forces, of the police or of the administration of the State.
And, Willow, just in case you by-pass the import of the above: the right of free assembly is subject to local law.
Willowfield
"Why was RSF protesting against the match, btw?"
Because they didn't want Willie and his bunch of sectarian loonies strutting down O'Connell St.
Personally, I would have let them.
The more people in Dublin who see this stuff, the more understanding of the shit nationalists have had to live with for years.
"The more people in Dublin who see this stuff, the more understanding of the shit nationalists have had to live with for years."
Don't count on it. The more of this they see up close, the more they want the source of it kept as far away as possible. The south has always been a fair-weathered friend of the north, alas.
Dubliner
Unfortunately, true.
Us = Irish Nationalism
Willie Frazer is a sectarian idiot but has outplayed us bigtime (twice).
Did we look for the different party allegiences after Whiterock ? I blamed Loyalism/Unionism generically.
By the same token pan nationalism/republicanism will be blamed for Saturday.
.
'I wouldn't say I am fond of them, I have no dislike for them.'
It is not the drinking habit that makes one a barstool republican and I doubt very much Chris can be described as such.
BTW I appreciate the change in heading picture Chris.
BTW I appreciate the change in heading picture Chris
No problem Sean
The place in which I found the photograph had it down as a dissident commeration. Today however a Tyrone comrade assured me that it wasn't.
I hope no Tyrone comrades took offence, that was not my intention.
cost benefit analysis suggests that the only losers from saturdays games in town would be SF's electoral candidates in the south, particularly in Dublin. cant see 40 000 southsiders voting for mary lou or kilian or whichever nice middle class social democrat is offered up next time round. in the heat of an election i think the 'dissident' bit will evaporate and people will only recall the carnival of reaction which will likely run and run.
I don't underestimate O Bradaigh's nose for political oppurtunity but RSF would be in a far healthier position if they had the ability to sabotage SF as well as the riots did on saturday. i think that their involvement was fortuitous and incidental to the bigger picture of pissed off youth who hate the cops having a go. not disimilar to what went on in Ardoyne on the 12th when cira tosssed a few blast bombs at the cops while kids from all over town worked off their alienation.
unbelievable that mcdowell is getting an absolutely free ride in the mainstream press. this has got to be one of the most memorable fuck ups ever by the DOJ. And this guy ruined frank connolly through leaking garda files and publicly accused mcg/adams of being behind the ulster bank job. he knows everything, right? whatever about being let down by drunk republicans and risen proles dubliners are definitely getting it in the neck from europes worst media.
Good gosh chaps Sackville Street was ruined.What will Mr. Redmond say? I met one young blonde lady from Kerry who was absolutely unable to get her nails done for almost three hours.
"Us = Irish Nationalism
Willie Frazer is a sectarian idiot but has outplayed us bigtime (twice)." - Glen
I don't agree. You can't claim that all Irish nationalists rioted last Saturday, no more than you can claim that every English person is a football hooligan. Those who rioted are responsible for their own actions, and no-one else. It seems that there were a small number of agitators (probably RSP members) who triggered mindless thugs and louts into violent group dynamics. They are certainly not representative of the complexity and diversity of the broad church of Irish nationalism. However, there is no doubt that the agitators who instigated the riot scored an own-goal in the propaganda department - not that it matters one bit in the grand scheme of things, but it gives the chattering classes something to chatter about whist awaiting something more chatter-worthy, like tips on the Cheltenham Gold Cup.
Unfortunately, the political reality - due to the coalition status - is that the Minister for Justice, Michael McDowell, is not accountable to the head of the government for his actions. Ergo, we have a de facto situation that allows him to behave like a little tin-pot fascist dictator, knowing that he can act with impunity from political sanction and with impunity from media sanction, due to his pro-Unionist/anti-Nationalist political agenda being in full accordance with the pro-Unionist/anti-Nationalist political agenda of The Independent Newspapers Group. So, the Minister for Justice can personally authorize a provocative march by loyalist terrorism masquerading as a victims support group despite objections and grave concerns about public safety but can fail to ensure public safety and still refuse to accept responsibility for his failure by honourably resigning.
But then, only the fatally naive would think that Sinn Fein is the only political party that has been infiltrated by British intelligence.
Willow (thou who hast vanished), one other point: the European Convention on Human Rights hasn’t been ratified by the Republic of Ireland, so you can’t cite the right of free assembly in a jurisdiction where it does not apply. The UK, however, has ratified the convention.
Good post Dubliner but you are not really disagreeing with me.
"You can't claim that all Irish nationalists rioted last Saturday" don't think i ever did what i was trying to say was that all nstionalism suffered last Saturday.
Good Luck
.
Dubliner
Totally agree.
McDowell is as responsible for creating the setting event for a riot in Dublin and then ensuring that it could not be controlled when it started.
It's also a bloody disgrace that he was preparing to meet these charlatans whose only purpose was to display their bigotry in the heart of Dublin.
The morons who took part in the riot were only part of the jigsaw which came together last Saturday.
The Dubliner
Thanks for quoting the relevant convention right to disprove your claim that Michael McDowell granted people the right!
Weird.
And, Willow, just in case you by-pass the import of the above: the right of free assembly is subject to local law.
Only if the local law complies with the Convention right!
Observer
Because they didn't want Willie and his bunch of sectarian loonies strutting down O'Connell St.
Why?
Willow
"Why?"
I don't think they like them, Willow.
Why not?
Willow
Probably because they are hateful shites.
Incisive and informed comment by Observer.
Zzzzzzzzzz
Willowfield!
The z key on your keyboard is stuck!
i live in ardoyne and what i saw today 12/07/06 on ardoyne rd was fxxking shit why do u need psni when u got s.f . why money they held us us in like shit sold us drown the river ask about the 10,000 pound they got for himing there own people in on the tour of the north? they,ll get no f******* vote from the people of ARDOYNE
10,000 pound ?
Outrageous - they must have put their prices up!
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