This Is Not A Democracy, It's A Republic........
So if Hannity or O'Reilly called for more blackness at the Winter games you think they'd be blackened over an open fire?
That's ludicrous. People like you and me would, however, wonder why they were suddenly channelling Sharpton.
Oh, Madhatter.
It is often o.k. for a black commentator to bitch, and play the race card, but you know for a fact, that if Sean Hannity had said something like, "Hey, there sure aren't a bunch of blacks in the winter Olympics, looks like a GOP convention." Or, well, you know what I'm saying....
It would make Cheney-Gate look like a 5 year olds birthday party.
I disagree.
I will agree that, generally, white commentators are on much thinner ice discussing topics of race.
But if Hannity (an asshat floor model) ever said that he would like to see more black athletes in the winter games, that it reminded him of a gop convention out there, he would get props from the left and the right would ask him to please ditch the crackpipe.
If he were to say something like, "You know what the last thing the winter games needs is? A black figure-skater." Then, he would get nailed in a way that made Trent Lott's asswhoopin' seem like a Disney flick.
The phrasing matters, of course, but the gist is most important.
Gumbel is grumbling, and gets away with it, because he's black (sort of) and because what he's saying is both politically correct...and true.
Bryant Gumbel is an asshat. Personally, O'Reilly would be ready to take the flame. Unless some offended black person decided that there SHOULD be more blacks in the Olympics.
Ah publicity, it'll make anyone greedy.
BTW, nice site.
Politically Correct. Mad, you are mad, you've uttered the dirtiest phrase ever made up.
Gumbel can take his politically correct ass and kiss it.
It's complete bullshit to let blacks make comments as they do and anyone else who made the same comment be considered a racist, if they aren't black.
I mean what an assinine comment.
How about this.... "There are far too many black people in the summer Olympics, we need some more white people."
Now, I put that out there, how many people would call me a racist cracker? Many I'd guess.
It's bullshit.
It's complete bullshit to let blacks make comments as they do and anyone else who made the same comment be considered a racist, if they aren't black.
Again, if one of your guys said what Gumbel said, they would not be in trouble.
However, if they said what you just did, then -- I admit -- they would be screwed.
The difference, however, is that the summer olympic team is at least half white/half not. How many blacks are there on the winter team? one, two, none?
There are a few other levels upon which your point is damaged goods. No need to discuss them.
Look, Jenn, when you go all, "dude, I should be able to say whatever the fuck I want! It's a fuckin' double standard!" on me, I have to wonder why it's such an issue for you. Are you playing to a certain crowd? Or do you really think all is square between the races in America after two-hundred fifty years of slavery and another hundred of jim crow, segregation, and general out and out strategic marginalization of blacks all through this great land of ours?
Is Gumbel neglecting the Summer Olympics where many of the athletes are black and damn good ones at that!
If a person, A PERSON, is athletic, black, white, asian, or whatever, why do people have to throw the race card into it just because the season is wrong?
People of all colors have different interests in different sports, unless of course I'm missing something here, were black people just omitted from the selection process BECAUSE they're black?
Waaaaaah, what about the NBA or the NFL!!!!! I want more white people and asians out on the courts and the football fields
madgeneral, it is over. I hate the fact that people still think we owe them for what America's ancestors did. They want all these fucking privileges and as soon as someone has the balls (a republican) to say something, THEY play the race card on WHITE people. Just like an old chain letter I got way back when, they get JET magazine, BET, and other sorts of entertainment.. but as soon as someone wants WET or some form of magazine focused on white people, they pull up a lawsuit and call us prejudice.
Bullshit. It's time someone gets off their lazy asses, stops collecting welfare and actually working. Don't get me wrong, there are some people who need it... but welfare isn't meant to support for life - it's meant to help you get on your feet. Who was it made by? Republicans.
What does this have to do with the Olympics? Jenn made a very strong point as to how O'Reilly or Hannity would be grilled... and it's fucking true. They would both recieve lawsuits up the ass.
And don't act like you weren't trying to offend Jenn, madgeneral. Because you were.
Interesting point Matt brings up.
A long time ago, when I was still chatting on AOL, I found they had a "Latino Voices," and "Black Voices" room, but no rooms that said,"White Voices". I am sure a typical response would be to say that all the other rooms were "white voices",but we all know that's not true. I contacted them, and my response was something along the lines with, "just deal."
I truly beleive, that if we want an equal society, then all people must be treated as equals, and playing the race card every other day just demeans that, and makes the matter worse.
I myself love the winter Olympics, and really enjoy the snowboarding events, as well as the skating events. I never looked at color, not until Gumbels comment.
Oh, and Mad,as Matt said, it's time to let the past be that, the past. My ancestors did not own slaves, in fact many of my ancestors were indentured servents. At no point in my life have I thought that I was owed something for events that took place a couple of hundred years ago, it's time for personal responsibility.
madgeneral, it is over. I hate the fact that people still think we owe them for what America's ancestors did.
Just like an old chain letter I got way back when, they get JET magazine, BET, and other sorts of entertainment.. but as soon as someone wants WET or some form of magazine focused on white people, they pull up a lawsuit and call us prejudice.
Incredible. You really don't understand why there might be a market for a black businessperson to create a magazine or a tv channel that speaks to black issues. You think that after slavery and a hundred years of institutionalized bigotry, that blacks can just show up and play the game: even score, level playing field, all of that. You have no idea what black history means to black people. How it goes beyond the personal, even the family history. How, to even think about the collective history can be excruciatingly painful and demoralizing. You don't understand that the fear and disgust -- the lack of opportunity -- will take a lot longer than forty years to diminish. Because it was brutally and skillfully ingrained in the essence of an entire race. It's their history. And what you probably see as a gross indignity -- their music, their politics, their culture -- is just their people struggling to regain and assert the dignity that was taken from away from them ever since they were shipped here.
Neither one of you seems to have any perspective. You don't recognize the negative repercussions of systematic racism. You think it's an accident, or worse, an example of the inferiority of blacks, that they happen to be crammed in ghettos all over this country. You can't empathize with their plight because you don't fucking care. Or you think it's all some liberal political scheme to get votes.
Really, you're just miserable and you don't have as good a reason why.
Matt -- I don't know who you are or why you would ever say that racism "is over." I would say it is going on wherever you're sitting. Good luck with WET, or a magazine for white people.
On topic/off topic:
Has anyone seen the new car commercial with all black actors.......Except the one dumb ass white guy?
I'm glad to see we've finally gotten to a point where we need "token whites"
madgeneral, when you stop assuming that "Incredible. You really don't understand why there might be a market for a black businessperson to create a magazine or a tv channel that speaks to black issues." Oh shit, black issues... did I once say anything demeaning the content of BET or JET? No. Read what I said, come up with a better retort which actually has any debate to my comment.
Oh, and I don't think you recognize the effects of systematic racism. Come to Fort Pierce and just WALK around. Why havn't you even touched on the millions of blacks predjudice against whites? Why havn't you touched on the fact that they are blaming US, MY GENERATION for slavery. It's complete bullshit, and you're naive if you don't see that.
Matt,
Your admission of personal experience as evidence to suggest that "racism is over" is as flimsy as tissuepaper. So what you got pushed around by some black people?
You know what the irony is?
Statistically speaking you will still have a better chance at landing a job, getting into a better school, and living a longer life than anyone in your neighbordhood.
Furthermore, your so-called "oppression" is not as widespread or as institutional as the 400 years of slavery and degredation than an entire RACE of people suffered.
Just get that through your head and maybe you'll understand.
One of the reasons this country became so powerful politically, economically, and militarily is not because of the so-called wonders of free-market capitalism. It is the result of the heartless and cruel exploitation of the poor, the weak, the powerless, and the enslaved. For over two hundred years slaves were a source of free labor that built up BOTH the Northern and Southern States.
Whether you want to accept it or not, a large portion of this country was built on the backs of black slaves who received nothing in compensation except cruel and unjust treatment. All because of the color of their skin.
Therefore....Matt and Jenn, because you and so many others enjoy the fruits of this country's success today, as a result of slavery's institution, I would argue that this country is overdue for reparations to the descendents of those who made it what it is.
Furthermore Jenn, your ignorance betrays you with your statement, "[m]any of my ancestors were indentured servents. At no point in my life have I thought that I was owed something."
What you're ignoring is that white European indentured servents at least HAD legal rights. They served for six to seven years and they were done. After that they became normal citizens.
The slave codes that were passed in the seventeenth and eighteenth centuries ensured that children born to a slave woman would also be a slave (even if the father was white). This guaranteed perpetual slavery of not only one generation, but countless generations to come.
Your ancestors never suffered such degredation. Your ancestors never had to suffer what slaves suffered, and your ancestors children were not cursed to a life of servitude that slave children were cursed with. And to a greater degree, your "people" (that is, your entire ethnic group)were not denied basic human rights, liberties, employment opportunities and education merely because of the color of their skin.
[And don't even try to retort with something like "My great-great-grandfather was Irish (just an example) and he blah blah blah" - The Irish/Italian Catholics never had it so good compared to blacks in this country. It's just a fact.]
Therefore you're comparing apples to avacados.
What I find particularly disgusting and hypocritical is the fact that the United States contributed money to help the victims of the Hol
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help the victims of the Holocaust, even though this country was not directly responsible for the atrocities committed by Germany.
On the other hand, this country has yet to spend one red cent on compensating those affected by one of the worst crimes against humany ever conceived in the history of all humankind. A crime which the original draft of the Constitution legally recognized.
So please, put down your forks and stop eating that slice of mythology called dreamy American idealism.
This country is not the bastion of freedom and tolerance that you, and others who perpetuate this myth, think.
Though I won't argue that things are better today than they were sixty, eighty, ninety, or even one-hundred fifty years ago, there is still much to be done.
The United States owes a substantial debt to the descendents of slaves, and all African Americans who at one point or another have suffered because of institutionalized racism. You cannot sweep this under the rug. You cannot ignore it, hoping that this issue will just go away. It won't. The United States must pay for its crimes, and until that day, this issue will be an open wound which will never heal.
Cheers,
[BoP]
One question BOP, have you once contributed to the welfare of the black community? Have you once gone to a ghetto and apologized for what atrocities were commited?
I didn't fucking think so. Go to Iraq and tell me that this country isn't the bastion of freedom and tolerance.
And another thing, when you come to realize that different people were in power after and during the holocaust than those of the slavery era then you might realize that America isn't one person. Different congressmen, different legislators, different presidents. Understand that the WWII era politicians might be a bit more tolerant than your pre-Civil War politicians.
Hahaha, you think Iraqi elections are a sign of democracy in the Middle East? Please brother. Please.
Voting for your local Mullah and their respective militia is not democracy.
Writing legal codes that enslave women according to Islamic laws is not democracy.
Just keep watching. When Iraq becomes an elected Theocratic dictatorship you're gonna wish Saddamn Hussein were still running the place.
And yes, I have contributed to Black Communities, I work in a black community, and I have worked with black people, and I identify with black people and their struggles. I myself am not black, but I am able to recognize that they have been given a lousy hand.
There is no statute of limitations on murder and crimes against humanity. So again, for you to say "what's in the past is past".. is just an excuse to sweep this under the rug, and deny millions of people the justice that they deserve.
I'm not your brother, and don't try and pull that cynical "please, brother. please." bullshit. Your attempt to make me feel/look inferior was in vain. Please, pull the trigger that you should have pointed to your head.
Once again, I don't think you understood me. What I said about Iraq was just a hint of sarcasm.
And trust me, I don't deny that slavery is horrible and so is racism and any prejudice whatsoever. But to say blacks in the 21st century were dealt a shitty hand is just a bit over the top. If anything, they have more than a chance I've ever had. They have a better chance at education than I will ever have; given all the programs and help-centered groups focused towards the black community, welfare, low-rent housing. Shit.. I remember not being able to buy noteboook paper because the school lunch was so expensive. But reduced lunch was only for black-welfare families.
Yes, I admit that there is still racism, and I hate the fuckers who treat blacks like shit. But like I said, don't tell me they (the blacks of our generation) deserve reparation(sp?) for something they may never experience. If anything, people like you who want to stir the dirt and dust up are the cause of racism and the extreme prejudice focused on whites nowadays.
Personally, my opinion doesn't come from being a right-wing conservative. It comes from personal experience that no matter how hard I try (and I still am) to gain a miniscule amount of respect from the black community, I get none. It comes from the experience of opening the door for them (not because I feel I have to, but because that's proper to any human) and being told "You owe me more than no door cracker." Jesus it's like they are all afraid that we are being nice to them because we have to. I'm sure that when they let their guard down, reparations will probably be paid.
I hear you Matt. I have a few black friends. One of them,her daughter caught the bouquet at my wedding, and as dear as she is, she is a prime example of what is wrong with much of the black culture in this country.
Long story short:
My friend, she got a job. She didn't want to work.After only 5 days on the job, she claimed that the chair she was sitting in was so bad, it has caused her back to be so damaged, she may never be able to work again.
She filed a lawsuit, she is on disability, and she eats hearty handfuls of government cheese each month.
It's typical. She see's nothing wrong with what she is doing. She see's nothing wrong with the fact, that people like me are paying for her "vacation". She can go to Sea World, clubs, out to dinner, but she can't sit at a desk and work for the money. She even said once,"I figure this is 'my reparation' payment."
I watched a few episodes of Cops yesterday. Guess what? 95% of those they caught were black? Why is that?
Where I live, there are a couple of black families. Why is it, that their children are the only ones unsupervised for hours? Why do the parents seem to think it's o.k. for a little 4 year old to be wandering around a property right next to a busy road, at all hours of the day, with no supervision? Poor kid, he's so desperate for normal, he actually sits on my patio waiting for me to come home. He know's I'll read to him, because his momma can't read. Jesus, this is East La Jolla, not the ghetto.
My people are Scottish, they were subjected to the worst cruelties imaginable by the Brits. I got over it, sh*t, I married one.
Personal responsibility, stop blaming the past. Look towards the future, get on with your lives.
No need to make sweeping generalizations, it's just a fact. A vast majority of blacks in this country have major issues, and until they address themselves, and leave whitey out of it, they will get nowhere, really slowly.
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