Share your thoughts...or, in the case of moonbats, your unintelligble grunts!
Every one of those homeless advocacy groups in DC has been getting money from the DC local govt and charities for YEARS!
You'd think they would have solved the problem by now.
I hope that story doesn't presage what we are getting into with the massive federal assumption of responsiblity in New Orleans. Wards of the government for LIFE!
You really homelessness is a matter of choice?
Here in my town, a good neighborhood in a community that takes assisting the homeless seriously, there is a meal program and a shelter, both within 4 or 5 blocks. Every day, by virtue of no parking restrictions, the connecting street is full of people - many families with children in the back seat - sleeping in their cars, unable to get into the shelter because it's full. You really think they're there by choice?
Yes, Frank...I think the overwhelming majority of homeless people remain homeless as a result of choice.
That's a distinction I think needs to be made. Winding up homeless can be a result of nothing more than sheer bad luck, and can happen to nearly anyone. Remaining homeless, however, is most certainly a choice...no question.
People wind up in their good OR bad situations most of the time as a sum total of the result of choices made in life: choosing to get or not to get educated, choosing to work in the right or wrong line of work, choosing to marry and procreate at the right time or too early, choosing a lifestyle within or beyond one's means, choosing to partake or ignore addictive substances, etc. This applies to everyone.
Like I said, it may appear as insensitive, but it's reality...and reality is rarely politically correct or warm-and-fuzzy.
Throwing the word "remain" in there may be technically accurate, at least for those homeless without serious mental or drug problems.
But it's changing the topic to terms you find more agreeable.
Frank, I don't see how it's changing the topic at all. To think that the overwhelming majority of homeless people are NOT there by choice is grossly naive.
Drug problems are problems of choice, sir. These people chose to use drugs that are known to be addictive. Surely you don't think that most of the drug addict homeless didn't know that drugs were addictive, do you?
Mental problems are a completely different matter. Mental deficiencies are clearly NOT choices, and I would not posit that the homeless who have mental disorders are responsible for their plot in life.
However, I am of the belief that the vast majority of homeless people are not mentally handicapped (or "challenged", or whatever term helps you sleep at night). My experiences with the homeless were relegated to panhandlers looking not for food, but for drinks or money...likely to support their drug habits.
And thanks for throwing me a bone with the "technically accurate" part...what other kind of "accurate" is there?
Homelessness is by and large a problem of choices. I made that clear to anyone with a cursory grasp of the English language in my aforementioned comments. There are obviously exceptions, and probably a great many of them. Those are, by definition, exceptions...not the rule.
Perhaps your view is that most of the homeless have mental disorders. I disagree. We'll have to agree to disagree, if that's your contention. If your view is that most of the homeless have drug problems, you may be closer to accurate than the former contention. If true, then that would bolster my point, not yours.
Thanks for weighing in, Frank. You've kept it civil, and I can respect that.
Hello Jonathan,
I came upon this site through a trackback that didn't have the decency to allow comments. I appreciate that you are open to discussion.
However, the original article quoted homeless advocates feeling a certain hypocrisy of altruism. Certainly, there's something going on when we give freely to those in a state of extreme, immediate need, but ignore those perpetually in need.
As you stated, there are people who are homeless by choice. What's the point of arguing about that? We've all seen them.
At the same time, mental illness is not an apparition. Nor is drug addiction, which contrary to the simple view, is a public health issue as well as a personal choice. In addition, its treatable.
But when I say you're changing the point, the issue is really about those who end up homeless irregardless of personal choice. Shit happens. As you acknowledged, some people end up homeless beyond their own will. I've seen it, and I'm sure you have as well.
The real question is not "do they deserve it," but are we human enough to smooth out the inequities by providing for those displaced - In the same way we give to those displaced by natural disasters?
Homeless advocates probably do see a hypocrisy...but the rest of us don't. Like I said, I think personal choice factors into America's generosity, in that people are giving en masse to Katrina victims as opposed to homeless.
I agree with you that mental illness is not an apparition...I just don't think it makes up the majority of the homeless. Sure, I could be wrong, but I don't think I am.
Also, drug addiction is also not an apparition. I've had family members who've suffered from it, so it's not as if I'm unsympathetic to it. However, it's treatable, as you said...if the person wants treatment. Again, choices.
Where I think I deviate from you, though, isn't on the compassion side of things...as much as it is on the personal responsibility side of things. You stated that humans should "smooth out the inequities" by providing for the displaced...regardless of how they were displaced. I think there is no reason to "smooth out" these perceived "inequities."
Whether one uses the words "deserve to be homeless" or "deserve to remain homeless", maybe it's just semantics. True enough. But if you want to know why people feel the way they do about the homeless, it usually (not always) comes down to a matter of individual responsibility and choices...or a perception thereof.
The "personal choice" issue is one we will never make any headway on, because we're both emphasizing different things. You, those who are homeless through bad choices, me, those who are not.
But 15% of homeless are mentally ill. These are the people we see at the same street corner every day, providing a drain on our police departments and our emergency rooms. Many chould live productive lives if they received proper medical care, possibly even producing a net gain to our economy. But this concept of a "hand out" has become such a loaded idea in our society, we totally lose sight of the societal costs of this problem... and it's not just homeless, it's poverty in general.
Frank,
You're right, we're approaching this from different mindsets. We'll have to agree on some aspects of homelessness (mental illness not being a choice in homelessness), and disagree on others.
However, I do appreciate your rational dialogue. A lot of liberals come in here that are paranoid raving moonbats. Others are more thoughtful and rational like yourself. I can respect that.
Anyway, thanks again for the dialogue, and feel free to post here anytime on any topic! 
Commenting by HaloScan
