Please don't feed the trolls!
Since when are 5 and/or 6 year olds in first grade? When I was in first grade we were all at least seven years old. Perhaps kids nowadays are smarter.
I also remember when I was in third grade public school, that we were all forced to sit and watch on television the selection of the new pope. There were hardly any catholics in our school as there was a private catholic school. Talk about hypocrisy and forcing children to watch something that has nothing to do with them or their culture. I recall most of the kids falling asleep during the pope selection broadcast.
If we allowed the fact that others might not like what we're doing to keep us from acting, we'd never move. The opponents to Prop 8 can use this event to show how benign the whole thing really is. I can tell you that not a single child went on that trip without written parental permission. They must have thought it was a good idea or their children would have stayed at home.
I have learned that it is the childbearing adults who present the "swing" vote on this issue. Older people have learned that love is all that really matters, and younger people wonder what the fuss is all about. Parents are of two camps: "Don't expose my child to that" or "Please let my child see inclusiveness."
Get those parents' opinions in the press.
I see you say that it was a private school, yet see no cite for this?
Where does this info come from?
I went to a dual immersion school in S.F. 0.5 mi. from where this wedding took place. My parents both wanted me there, and we took field trips relevant to curricula. It would've been an amazing treat to see a teacher I liked married. You can tell these kids were psyched.
The wingies ignore that this wasn't some *random gay wedding*, it was their own teacher's. It's being painted as if these kids were subject to some government experiment like Tuskegee syphilis.
Thirty years l8tr, I still remember my teacher's names. These kids knew and cared about the people involved; it wasn't about anything else for them. This is a critical point I would like to see raised.
"Since when are 5 and/or 6 year olds in first grade?"
That's how old I wAs there: maybe it's an S.F. thing.
How would these "yes on 8" folks respond to first graders attending and celebrating the marriage of a "heterosexual" teacher?
There are none so blind as those who will not see.
LIFEis nothing BUT "really shitty timing," Joe!
Forget about curriculums, since when can't schoolkids attend their teacher's wedding? It happens all the time.
When my uncle got married we saw the previous wedding party leave the church: kids the same age as these were holding up arches they had decorated themselves for their teacher to walk through. It was cute.
From NYT "The notion that gender roles are unimportant in raising children is “bunk,” added Mrs. Galloway. “It is not an accident that it takes a man and a woman coming together to create a child,” she said." (that IS what she said)
If only! Can you imagine the halt of overpopulation that'd come from a dual, if not simultaneous, orgasm requirement for conception? The head spins
Me: "...we took field trips relevant to curricula. It would've been an amazing treat to see a teacher I liked married. You can tell these kids were psyched.
Subtleknife "Forget about curriculums, since when can't schoolkids attend their teacher's wedding?"
My point being that it was an extracurricular treat. Kids love that most.
JMG, from looking at this school's site and the SF charter site, they are a public charter school not private.
http://www.creativeartscharter.org/
http://www.sfcsi.org/aboutus.html
JMG: You're right! I'll change the post, nice catch.
Really shitty timing? There is no such thing as good timing for a gay wedding in the Religious Wing-nut's book. If it were up to them not only would the lesbian teacher not be getting married, she wouldn't be a teacher either. (Really, if they had their way she'd be sent to a special gay concentration camp or burned at the stake.)
If they couldn't find a real event to smear and malign, they'd just make one up. They are against gay marriage. No loving, wholesome, well-balanced LBGT couple will ever be decent in their eyes. Let them froth and rage over these perfectly happy, adorable kids and their perfectly happy teacher (and her wife). It only makes them look like asses. After all, the children witnessed the wedding and they retained their sanity. Their eyes didn't melt from their sockets; Nor did their heads explode. They're just fine.
And guess what? A queer couple got married and the world goes on just as it always has.
Hey Joe, instead of blaming the school, maybe you should be defending them. That would be more responsible of you. The anti-gay propagandists are still telling lies about Proposition 8. Why don't you call them out on their latest lies?
How DARE these shelfish lesbians get married and all.
THINK OF THE CHILDREN!!!
I think they loose dyke points and MUST return the gay agenda toater they received when they decided to become gay and all.
After all...in a matter of weeks they will most likely be taken away from them constitutionally.
It's never going to be politically expedient for the freepers to grant us our basic civil rights.
Shitty timing indeed!
Fuck them.
When I was in the second grade (7 years old), our teacher — Miss Julie Houston — got engaged. She not only invited us all to the wedding, but practically made a teachable semester out of it. We had to write out our own invitations in longhand, copying the flowery words off the blackboard. The Honour of Your Presence Is Requested Saturday the Whateverth of Whatever at Half After Whatever O'Clock Blah Blah Blahbitty Blah Blah. We were driven down to Colorado Springs and sat through an Episcopalian service. From there we went to the reception at the very chichi Broadmoor. We ate those funny little drumsticks that turned out to be frogs' legs. We lined up in the reception line to wish Mrs. Julie Severin congratulations. We saw our teachers smoking cigarettes!
That was twenty-six years ago; obviously the memory stayed with me, but I digress. The point is as SubtleKnife says: it happens all the time. We certainly didn't think of it in terms of indoctrination or anything of the like, and in retrospect what I remember most about it is that Julie was a dimwit and a lousy teacher both before and after she got married. The same'll be true of those kids in the story. What frightens the yes-on-haters is that their bigotry won't outlast their own generation.
Can you imagine!? "Taking them away from their [first grade] studies!!!!" To indoctrinate them and teach them "that same-sex marriage is okay."
Regardless of timing, the truth is that this country for the most part is a f*cking cesspool of ignorant, intolerant, vindictive, and selfish people. I've got to f*cking get out of here -- I wish I'd been more diligent in my 20s and pre-hiv in figuring out a way to live overseas. If Prop 8 passes I am really going to be overwhelmed with destructive impulses, nasty depression and hopelessness. I've had it!
No one is gonna stop gay people from getting married, and luckily enough there is someone in this world that still teaches something actually usefull by letting this kind of trips.
And in the end... gee... the kids went to see their teacher getting married, what's wrong in that?
JAO...have heart. It ain't over til the lipsticked pig sings, and she's applying more lipstick on that ugly twisted filth spewing mouth.
We've lived through 8 years of fascism, we'll get through the next four.
They accuse us of using children, but here they are using children and telling lies to further their twisted principals and ass backwards morality.
Make a video with the parents opinions in the press now! Ask them why they decided to bring the kids to the wedding, that would shut them up in a second. This was done out of support of love no hate and we need a video showing the parents talking about why they decided to surprise the teacher on her wedding date!
If course we would understand. Of course we would support the kids being there. Of course it was a nice thing for them and for the teacher.
But to Joe's point... I agree, really lousy timing, and the right wing yahoos will make so much of this. Just like they are making so much of the lies about churches losing their tax-free status.
I am happy about Connecticut. I am worried about California.
Dorothy
really? "lousy timing", really? jesus. there's no reason for these women to plan their lives around the approval of narrow-minded bigots. instead of being all defeatist, where are the people making this out to be a beautiful thing? to show that the children were happy? that they LEARNED something and are the better for it? that they LOVE their teacher? "lousy timing". bah.
more than that, this was a wedding. 5 and year-olds go to straight weddings without damage. without detriment. there is not orgy immediately following those festivities; why do christians act as though there were one after this wedding? rhetorical questions, of course, we know the answers. too bad the christianists don't as well.
MSNBC just aired a TV show called "Caught on Camera". The show highlighted a guy catching people (all heterosexual) engaging in public sex in broad daylight. In some cases kids are playing just yards away. And they are doing it all over the place. The police look the other way. *We know that wouldn't happen if the perps were gay* "Caught on Camera" reruns at 11pm. If you can't catch the rerun go to johntv.com or visit the youtube page.
Today was the 10th Anniversary of the death of Matthew Shepard. His face, unfortunately, became the face of gay hate crimes. Today, as we continue to fight against hate, bigotry, and discrimination, as noted in the subject matter, very, very few gay bloggers have recognized this sad anniversary. I urge everone to read Judy Shepard's letter "TEN YEARS OF CHANGE - NO PROGRESS" @ http://www.matthewshepard.org/si...site/
PageServer
There are somethings WE NEED TO REMEMBER!!!
What is being missed here is the parents would have had to signed permission slips to go on a field trip outside of the school. If they had a problem with gay marriage they didn't have to sign the permission slip.
to indignant posters: hope you enjoy being right at this time because the bitter taste of defeat will make you wish San Francisco had used a little common sense.
The wingers are always going to cease on kids and our diabolical plans to make them into 'mos. I can imagine the SFers feeling they need to defy this and make this an example that will endear the cause to moderates, or possible be to navelgazing to think about it (sorry--i've known too many self-absorbed women from the Bay area).
Regardless, this the sort of thing that you approach with consequences in mind. Some have argued that it shouldn't matter, but matter it did and matter it will. This could be a teachable moment--but it wasn't.
To Matthew Thompson -- And in fact, all the parents of the class except for two families did sign permission slips, as reported in today's SF Chronicle. The two kids who did not accompany the rest of their class spent the time in another first-grade class at school.
Just want to clear up who supports Pepperdine University. In an earlier post, I commented that they are affiliated with the Church of Christ. Thomas posted afterward, defending the United Church of Christ as being inclusive and supportive of gay rights. That is correct, the United Church of Christ is wonderful, but the important word is "UNITED" in that organization's name. The Churches of Christ translate the bible as literally as possible, and they are not our friends. Pepperdine University was funded by the fellow who started the Western Auto Store chain. Google "Churches of Christ" and check their Wikipedia entry. These are the folks that think that the Baptists are too liberal.
I guess the "christians" that feel that 25 million spent on the YES on 8 is more important than funding our schools or feeding the poor should be asked "what is better, a gay christian or a gay non-christian?". At this rate I rather feel like not celebrating Christmas ever again...
Over on beliefnet:
We have to make our minds up here. Either we ARE going to allow, in the conduct of official government business, discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation (or anything else, for that matter) or we are not.
Which do we choose?
The New Spirituality has no room for discrimination on ANY basis whatsoever--and certainly not on the basis of what person an individual falls in love with...
Gay marriage should long ago have been made legal every place in America--the "Land of the Free." I look forward to the day when other states will follow Connecticut, whether it is done legislatively or judicially, in making gay marriage legal. What right does any government have to tell you who you can fall in love with and spend your life with in marriage? And, pray tell, what right does the State have in "regulating procreation"?
In Communist China they "regulate procreation" by telling you, by law, how many children you may have, and what gender. This is done under the guise of population control
see: http://blog.beliefnet.com/conver...people-
too.html
Doesn't a field trip means a signed permission from the legal guardian of the child? I hope they did this. If the guardians signed it, they knew what their children were going and gave their permission. If they didn't sign it, then the child was to remain supervised at school. Am I off on this one?
All right...all of you gay folks...BACK IN THE CLOSET....back to the back of the bus.....Sorry, but the time is just not right.
Because, you know, this is going to make a difference in the itty bitty teeny tiny brains of the freepers.
They've pumped millions of dollars into the state to feul their hate...and all indications are that it just may work.
But Joe's right....Get back in the closet. And "Shhhh!" SOMEONE MIGHT HERE YOU IN THERE1
Oh, and "Happy Coming Out Day" everyone!
"Since when are 5 and/or 6 year olds in first grade?"
Since at least the past two and a half decades. I was 5 in kindergarten, and 6 in first grade. That was pretty typical. My family moved around a lot and I was never the youngest kid in my class, everyone was usually the same age as me growing up. So yeah, it's pretty common.
Some "Christians" really DO need to be thrown to the LIONS!
The "timing" was fine, it's our opponents who are out of line.
Let's not blame the school or the happy couple. Instead let's work to show that the "yes on 8" group's handiwork is truly abusing these children by using the kids' puctures in their perverted campaign.
The right wingnuts will find fodder for their schemes regardless of whether we "provide it" for them -- they are totally capable of making things up out of whole cloth.
HET USA needs to get used to the idea of gays (esp. gay men) and children co-existing in public.
||: We will be VISIBLE :||
(repeat until all are out)
We exist. Boo.
If we scare you stay home.
As an early-childhood specialist, it is just annoying to hear what some idiociles in HET-LAND think of a gay man working with (gasp!) preschoolers.
I see parents of children who do NOT know me literally yank their child's arm to prevent the kiddies from seeing my husband and I hold hands.
Again, I propose to you...."Boo".
I am an agnostic who supports Propisition 8. I don't not condemn gay bashing whatsoever
The people of California should make its laws - not our judges. I’ve seen many rather silly arguments against gay marriage, many of which have indeed been homophobic. But I believe there are many good reasons to support Proposition 8. Space does not permit a full treatment, but please consider the following
First, any radical redefinition of marriage is very likely to result in a host of unintended consequences. For starters, how will future judges logically prohibit polygamy if gay marriage continues as the law of the land?
If two men or two women should have the “right” of marriage, why should such a “right” be withheld from one man and two women or two women and one man or any other number of combinations? What about the almost inevitable legal and social attacks against churches that refuse to perform gay marriages? Sure, gay activists tell us they won’t care what churches do so long as they can have a civil marriage ceremony.
But isn’t that what they also said about domestic partner rights - that marriage wouldn’t be needed if those laws were passed?
What, in the long run, will be best for our society? The preservation of traditional marriage, which encourages a man and a woman to wed and raise children together, thereby preserving social stability, or radical re-definitions that completely re-shape the family unit? Of course there are some gay couples who are better equipped to raise children than some heterosexual couples. But laws should not be based on exceptions.
"The people of California should make its laws - not our judges."
The judiciary is a perfectly good branch of government and has its own prerogatives -- the judges did not overstep. In 1948, the CA Supreme Court struck down all CA state laws that forbade interracial marriage -- way ahead of the cultural curve. The bigots (who, of course, did not recognize that they were bigots) screamed that the end of all things was nigh -- but you Yes on 8 people would not really want to get back to that world, would you?
Sadly, you conservatives are always with us. And your fundamental problem is that you don't recognize that you're bigots. Your children will, though.
Apparently, the Yes on 8 folks have been told to remove the Chronicle's photo from their site. Instead of those field trip kids, it's now a stock photo of a little girl in a classroom. Those damn liberals - demanding their copyrighted photos not be used without permission!
And the article's a joke, too. The main quotes against the kids going to the wedding come from - their own fucking press secretary!! Hilarious.
conservatives? conserve your energy and stay home on election day.
More phony Christian hypocrasy. Fuck those people.
I am an agnostic who supports Propisition 8. I don't not condemn gay bashing whatsoever
Yes on 8 | 10.13.08 - 4:25 am |
Your use of a double negative in that sentence must be a Freudian slip?
Dear Yes on 8 idiot, the family unit is already being radically reshaped, with or without laws. The choice before you is discrimination and bigotry against those in same-gender headed families or fairness and justice. Your choice. Claim to be taking the high road all you want; you're standing with the haters.
Nah. The more First Graders we see at Gay Weddings the more vanilla and everyday the entire affair will seem.
Since when are 5 and/or 6 year olds in first grade?
Huh? 6 by the deadline (usually sometime in Sept or Oct, though it's being moved earlier) is the standard age for first grade in most states. I have a September birthday so I actually started school at 5, and turned 6 right after, but most in my class were already 6 and turned 7 later in the year when their birthday fell.
Joe was only predicting that the freepers were sure to latch onto this story and milk it. If gay marriage isn't controversial enough, when you put children into the mix it pushes some people way over the top. Take gay adoption for example. Even the so called open-minded and liberal countries that have gay unions have some very restrictive laws about adoption.
None the less, I hope the lesbian couple and the students had a wonderful day.
Thanks, SwiftTiger, for putting it well. The most dismaying part of Prop. 8 isn't the attempt to strip away marriage equality per se; rather, it's that this will be, I believe, the first time in American history that a right will be voted away after having been recognized. Scary.
Perhaps if I'd had the opportunity to witness a gay wedding when I was 7 years old, I would not have had to wait until I was 53 to marry the man I love.
I hope these children are luckier than I was.
Why even waste your time with Yes0nHate comments. This person has made up their mind to eliminate rights from fellow Californians. I just hope someday Agnostics don't have their rights taken away because they don't fully accept jesus as their lord and savior.
I was 5 and turned 6 two months later in first grade.
The ones born after November turned 7.
Now that we are up to 8........ I think the No on 8 people have screwed this up.
This despicable red-herring issue is just the sort of thing the right-wing ideologues love to do. They are managing to hijack the issue, and have turned this around to a variation of "think of the children, let's protect the children," etc. Meanwhile, the No on Prop 8 campaign has gone dormant, and in the last two weeks, I can only recall 4 commercial spots from the No on 8 campaign broadcast on LA television. The Yes on 8 campaign is literally blanketing the media with at least 5-6 commercials each day (not counting radio)- many in primetime.
The No on 8 people may feel they have a safe margin in LA county (which will have a record 4 million plus registrants for the election) and is bound to vote for Obama overwhelmingly. They may be concentrating their efforts on other parts of CA where 'yes' votes are ahead.
Please encourage your readers to send in contributions to the campaign- any amount will help. It's crunch time as we're headed into the last weeks before the election. Over 11,000 gay couples have successfully married thus far.
Contributions to the No on 8 campaign can be sent to:
No On 8, Equality For All
c/o ML Associates, 8581 Santa Monica Blvd., #504
West Hollywood, CA 90069
Website is Noonprop8.com.
Ugh. File under "Not Helping."
all u people go get a life ok, and please go read your Bible...."don't touch if you ain't prayed"
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