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Well, I think it is great that you are subtitling your vlogs... it shows you are thinking of the audience and that you want us to understand you. I have see some people asking that the ASL vlogs to be subtitled and that they were rudely refused, saying that the people who asked for subtitling needed to learn ASL. Well, yeah, but... if you want to reach out to larger audience, subtitling would be a good solution...
Also, it shows me that deaf vloggers are aware that there is hearing audience out there, and that they want to include them, have them understand them, etc. Also, for oral deaf vloggers who want deaf ASLers to understand them, so they subtitle their vlogs. It is the thought that counts and I appreciate it.
Thanks Mike for subtitling your vlogs.
Hi Mike,
As a Deaf-Blind person, I truly appreciate subtitling in vlogs because I am legally blind now. It does help a lot to be still involved in the v/blogosphere with the subtitles. If there wasn't any, I wouldn't complain because I visit a lot of blogs.
I thank you for taking the time and effort to subtitle your vlogs.
Tactile smile,
Patty
Expatriate, that's the one sad thing about ASL vloggers (or any vloggers for that matter) on their refusal to add subtitles when they already have the means and software to do the job for their Deaf-Blind audience. These videos are not necessarily at first rate video clarity so I can understand that it could be hard to watch and understand fully what's being said. Adding subtitles do take effort and some time but it is certainly not an impossible endeavor. It just make more people appreciative of subtitles in vlogs.
There are blurring of motions, including any signing; and the lack of video definition which is not the same as watching a high definition TV sometimes make it hard to follow any signing! I would suspect it'd be harder to follow for some Deaf-Blind readers/watchers of vlogs? But these video definition and speed are certainly improving over time.
Thank you, TheExpatriate, for pointing that out. I am still trying to find the best font size and color for everyone. Subtitles are for everybody's benefit!
I think where ASL users are attaching captions there is wider appreciation of their view. Up until now they seem to take the approach of a select little club that suggests you have to acquire ASL or you are discriminating against them. This is the 'English' approach.
What we do in the UK is blatantly refuse to learn another languages, generally we shout at others ! thus forcing others to comply with learning English, it works damn well, two thirds of the world now uses English. Perhaps sign ASL/BSL users are trying the same approach ? it's doomed to fail sadly. Brits and English speakers will switch off...
You made a very good point. I saw one vlogger made a comment about "why should we subtitle when hearings don't subtitle for us?" Everyone agreed, nodded their heads in agreement. Such mindset is nothing but childishness, or rather, narrowmindness.
Now, Patty brings up something that hits home for me, she benefits from subtitling because she is deaf-blind.
In reality, deaf vloggers are now oppressing the deaf-blind by refusing to subtitle.
Sure, especially if you want to reach wider audience. As you know, it all depends on vlogger's desire targeting an audience.
For English speakers, it is much easier to add English subtitle with not much working on translation. For ASL vlogging, it is difficult to read ASL and English subtitle at the same time like reading two different stories.
It takes a longer while to make both subtitle and ASL vlogging tell a same story, often, not 100% same story.
I prefer to write a script below what ASL vlogging says in general as I did with my ASL vlogging once. That way it gives readers a choice. However, I still notice some differences in my vlogging and my script. It is tough to write exactly same thing. That's why it takes a long time to develop interpreting skills.
Some ASL flow of thoughts can be interferred by thinking on how to translate into English.
Just two cents.
Bob Rourke
Ok, Bob, from what you wrote, is that a justification/excuse not to add subtitles for Deaf-Blind readers/watchers of Deaf vlogs and say "too bad" to them? Is this a case of the Deaf oppressing the Deaf simply because one group of Deaf people has an additional disability such as blindness?
How would you respond to TheExpatriate's comment above who is a Deaf-Blind reader/watcher of blogs and vlogs?
Thanks to the technology. Deaf-blind people can access to read the v/blogs. If not for the technology, they will not use the v/blogs.
I prefer to read the blogs and scripts under the vlogs. I sometimes do not understand the vloggers and their sign language.
As for the international b/vloggers, they can welcome to the deafread, however, we wish we can use the "click" to press "english, spainsh, and so forth"....wouldn't be nice if they have it.
Most of the retailers have their own websites that include the foreign languages.
I would think transcripts would be easier for Deaf Blind? I would love to know that. Most of the blind I know use the technology that increases the size of the display, but official accessibility testing involves testing with a screen reader that cannot read the subtitles in a video.
I know for me, a hearing reader, A subtitled vlog is more like someone speaking to me, than is a transcript.
58 subtitled videos and counting....
I'm going to respond generally here.
When a vlog isn't subtitled, I admit I do feel I miss out a lot of what the person is signing. ASL is my language. I do rely on my DH to tactile to me what the vlogger signs.
A suggestion if I may offer to any vlogger that wishes to help the Deaf-Blind community with subtitling. Yellow fonts with the black background is actually much better to read than the standard white fonts.
The white fonts is just too strong and some words can be missed out. Yellow is softer and words are easier to read.
Please keep in mind, the Deaf-Blind community is really at the bottom of the totem pole, struggling to be seen, heard and recognized. It does not really help that our peers, the Deaf community, responds in this manner whether they realise it or not.
Tactile smile with hugs,
Patty
Bill, the idea for a transcript can be said for television shows when they can give you a transcript instead of what was said on those shows. Not quite the same thing. You want to see the words and action together, not separately.
Patty, if black background font with yellow cannot be done, due to software limitation, what would be the next best color? Or would even font size make a bigger difference here?
Thanks.
Hi Patty, thanks for posting your concern.
I did only ASL vlogging once before so I am not sure how I can be very helpful. Frequent ASL vloggers are probably able to give more input.
Will it be all right if we write a blogging script below vlogging instead of subtitling as I did before? What do you prefer? Subtitle or script?
Is there a link to resources that can help ASL vloggers develop "Best Practice" vlogging for all Deaf-Blind to access?
I agree we need to work together on this to resolve the accessibility issue.
Thanks,
Bob
Hi Patty,
If you have a time, can you check out the link to my old ASL vlogging with the script below instead of subtitling? You read it ok?
http://bobrrr.blogspot.com/searc...0&max-
results=1
Thanks,
Bob
Hi Mike, if yellow font is not available, white would be fine in a bigger font size like 16-18 if it is possible. I truly thank you very much for your big help, Mike.
Bob, even if vloggers did not subtitle their vlogs, I still read their scripts.
I know Google Video has a CC button on videos you input subtitling. You can disenable the closed captioning if you don't wish to view it.
Hope it helps and I truly thank everyone for their help into this.
Other Deaf-Blind v/bloggers have made blog entries about this as well.
Patty, I added an additional update in my blog asking you a question about Carl's decision not to add subtitles in future vlogs. How do you feel about that?
One last question, Patty, sometimes white font text might mess in with the background like it did in my first vlog "Uncle Bob's House" where I had the bright sunlight reflecting off of houses and the white font disappeared with it. So, a white or yellow fon't might not be conducive in this instance would a colored one still work well but just increase the font size for better reading results?
Thanks.
Even though the question about Carl was directed to Patty, I'd like to comment on his decision. It shows that we who have talking/listening abilities, who have CI's, who feel more comfortable with cueing, etc. are not welcome. I know that some ASLers feel threatened by CI blogs, strong-minded bloggers like you and Paotie, etc. It seems to me that the human editors are taking a notice of this and are making an effort to satisfy the people's objects... as I get the impression that there was some agreement at DeafRead conference that DeafRead became a haven for "deaf-centered" bloggers/vloggers.
Well, the television stations are going far to caption the shows to reach out to deaf people, to people who are learning English as 2nd language, etc... they might as well as say no captioning to us so that we have to learn English, tough luck to us. But they acknowledge the diversity by providing captioning to us. So DeafRead could gently encourage the vloggers to accept the diversity by subtitling.
Hi Patty,
Also, I hate to bother you again. I know other Deaf-Blind readers should be asked too. However, what do you think of some ASL stories that are difficult to be translated into English and lost some ASL translation? Are there any other ways than add English subtitling to ASL vlogging? Making ASL vlogging bigger pictures?
Thanks for putting up with me again!
Bob
Karen Mayes, Exactly! They can do what they want, and they do have that right. However, there's consequences for everything....Karma is a B*T*H!
Right, Karen. And that is what I meant about reaching to a larger audience out there, like, for example, the Deaf-Blind vlog watchers out there where subtitled vlogs helps them out. Just as Patty has indicated. It's not just about the Deaf, but deaf, hh, and hearing people. We have the opportunity to rise above hearing people on setting an example when it comes to subtitling and promoting accessible vlogs.
But ironic thing is that everybody were saying "Kudos to Project ReadOn" when it took on the effort to caption television commercials or other videos on YouTube but no "Kudos" when it comes to Deaf vloggers who take the time and effort to add subtitles to their vlogs like Seek Geo. Irony of all ironies on accessibility issues. And from all people who value full communication access that the hearing community so enjoys.
You could use overstream.net, it's much easier to read the subtitles.
The other solution to Windows Movie Maker would be to use a thicker typeface like Arial Black or Helvetica Black rather than Arial Regular or Helvetica Regular.
Carl's decision not to subtitle his vlogs is his personal decision. I respect that. Just sad that he is choosing this way when he has such interesting vlogs that I have enjoyed before. Someone commented in his blog that Deaf-Blind people can translators and thus hiring more Deaf interpreters. Just shows ignorance, tsk.
Increasing the font size significantly improves reading.
Hi Bob, the beauty of ASL cannot be lost in english translation because both are separate languages. I am still able to appreciate both languages. I thoroughly enjoyed your beach story by making the video bigger.
I do click on the maximize button and make the vlog bigger, this way I am able to still catch on signs.
Hope this answered your questions.
I posted a new blog entry, an open letter to the DeafRead community.
Tactile smile!
Patty
Patty --
I do not like what Carl said in his vlog.
He said, "lipreading causes sore eyes" That statement is uncalled for and very insensitive language.
I understand what Carl meant for the deaf people who do not want to deal with the lipreading situation, however, I am thinking of the late deafened people who went through so much.
I have a huge respect for deaf and blind people. I am grateful to have the technology that provides everything they need. So we can share our views from disagree to agree and agree to disagree.
You know there is a huge deaf-blind community in Washington State. That is where Carl now lives.
If Deaf-Blind want subtitles and need accessible.. That's fine as long we can respect Deaf-Blind provide needs.. Will bring subtitles whoever willing do transcript... but not for other hearing people who advantage use Deaf-Blind's needs.
That's my concern!
I know person Patty, as long I do respect her well.. someone who willing do anything for her add subtitles and accessible needs.. That's wonderful!
Mike, Why you trying to point finger directly to Patty and making you look shown off and speak it out behalf for other peoples.. Really not necessary!
Get your own speaking out.. not for other behalf..
She can speak it out herself and whoever want speak it out their own can do it.. Why you care behalf for someone.. really not necessary!
Ok
Throw 2c!
Terri, I am not speaking on behalf of Deaf-Blind...only Patty is doing that. What I am doing is on behalf of those who desire to see accessible vlogs that have subtitles/captions. Please note the differences here. I advocate on closing the communication gap between hearing and deaf. Let's not get ourselves into a knot, here.
I agreed with Mike on subtitling all the vlogs. It's important to reach a broad audience, including the curious or browsing hearing users and the deaf-blind users. It would be foolish for the few who refuse to subtitle their vlogs just because the hearing world don't caption or subtitle their TV series, movies or vlogs as well?
That should be all the reason that is needed to add subtitles!
Carl is having either dyslexia or flip and flop?
He just posted his blog, Captioning must be unbiased.
I still don't agree with Carl's philosophies.
I'll make a comment on that very....soon.
eh, the politics behind the "causes and effects" of simply subtitling are deep and profound.
My 2 cents? Thank you for encouraging vloggers to caption their videos. What you do provides equal access; and builds bridges with the hearing community as well as for those who benefit from reading what is said on Vlogs.
Carl can go have fun in his exclusive club for all i care.
I agree with you, Mike, in that we d/Deaf can set an example by opening access to communication ourselves to all deaf, from the deaf-blind to culturally Deaf to oral deaf to late-deafened. What better way to put the hearing world to shame for their mediocre and half-hearted attempts at communication access for the deaf?
Please realize i am in hospital and it's hard to tpy. I'm not wanting sympathy, just expaingin. i would like to address Bob Rourke's comment about how he prefers to transcribe and he thinks a "blind person would benefit more by that. . .blah, blah, blah."
Bob-- wouldn't you just hate it if you asked for an interpreter for an event and thye suggested you should be happeier with CART? You aren't blind Bob. How would you know what Patty needs? It's not up to you to determine.
This is an accommodation request. Yes-- it's YOUR VLOG and you don't have to accommodate. But she's asking that you accommodat her in a specific way beaes she blin.
I have aske to be accommodated because i am late-deaf an new to ASl. it's up to you whether you want to accommodate us.
But when someof yoiu purposely refuse to accommodate us it hurts.
The excuses you use are now different from the exuses Hearing people use. Your unwillingnes toaccomodate us causes disunity., Again apologie for me tping it hard tonight.,
Terri;
You're being silly. To paraphrase your recent comment, it seems like you're saying that the Deaf-blind should have their Vlogs captioned.
Yet you're going off on a conspiracy over some hearing people who may "use" deaf-blind access...
Seems to me that they just want to be able to read the content as efficient as we do.
Kim, what are you doing typing away at a laptop keyboard in the hospital when you should be taking it easy?!
hi ann-- than god for the laptops! i am so sick of bedreast andjello. I am glad the nurses listen to waht i ask them for accommodations, instead of teeling me whta they think i should like. they took my gall bladder out last weekend this time my liver tings are high so i had to come back for two more nights until they know why. eric knows the liver date means. im sad paula left. its because i couldn't eat. sorry if ell asleep.
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