Tell me what you really think.
J, you are a smart, funny, compassionate, wonderful, wonderful person. *That's* what you are. Label defying in every way.
Now, about the Pearls. I remember first hearing them over at Jay's site and thinking, "no way". Maybe I'm just naive (or overly hopeful) but I can. not. believe that those people and their "philosophy" is for real. That being said, I find it incredibly sad that there are people who do fathom that it is real and choose to follow such a sadistic child rearing plan. Unbelievable, really.
It's real; click on the link and go check out their awful abuse handbook on Amazon and read the reviews.
Mamacita, you are what I think of "Common-sensical." We have a party name, now we just need a candidate!
And yikes for people with that attitude! Discipline and respect are one thing; beating is quite another matter.
I was reading your post and nodding in agreement, when suddenly I saw my name! 
Thanks for your support!
The strange thing is that (as I stated many times) I haven't even read the Pearls, so why Emily has chosen my blog as a place to defend them, I have no idea... I did however read the Ezzos... it's probably more of the same thing. Well, whatever Pearls are, Emily and that one other commenter did not do a good job advocating them... I for one am not convinced.
There is a group of people that have a difficult time separating discipline and punishment from abuse. The only two explanations I have for that behavior is they are either evil or stupid.
We're going through something like this in Cincinnati right now - a City Councilmember (former Golden Gloves boxer) beat his 14-year-old son with a belt not just across the bottom, but along the thighs, arms, and chest too. Welts were raised. Of course, many "Family Values" types are singing his praises now because "he's providing discipline."
People like the Pearls (and Mamacita, I hate to say it, but J. Dobson is heading down that path too, though he's not nearly as out there as the Pearls) should not only NOT have kids, they shouldn't be allowed in the same COUNTY as kids. Kids are not something you do to impress the neighbors with how "well-behaved" they are.
WF
And Mamacita, I just read your comments over at Goldie's place.
Folks, if you haven't, go read them. Between her own blog here and her comments there, it's easy to see why she's not only my favorite teacher of all time (and who I most strive to be like in the classroom, even for college kids), she's one of my best friends ever.
WF
I started to mangle some combination of liberal and conservative for you, but it just kept coming out sounding like "laxative", so, um... never mind.
I want my children to be humble but not humiliated. It may make me a bad parent to say so but there is a teensy-tiny bit of pride when my daughter gets defiant. It isn't encouraged, certainly, but when she hangs onto something like a dog with a bone or believes strongly enough to argue and declare me the "meanest mommy" with such righteous indignation, I know she is going to be ok. I want her to think for herself even though I know it will frustrate me daily. Its kind of like bumper bowling. I want her to have a wide lane to navigate but I'll be the bumpers on the side to guide her to the finish line and keep her out of the gutter 
Em, I agree! Like I read somewhere (I think it was Eda LeShan, but I'm not sure, and I don't have the exact quote either), "If your children cannot say no to you today, how will they say no to drugs, violence, etc. tomorrow?"
I've always thought it odd that some of the "Devout Christians" see nothing wrong with beating the crap out of their child. Last time I looked Jesus preached love.
Labels are for losers who've no other way of identifying themselves.
-G
You arem in the end, a real voice that has already made a difference.
No, we can't- and won't- sugar coat the reality- you are a distinct minority. While you can't change the world, there is no doubt that you have changed a small corner of it- and you have inspired others to actualy consider the import of the schools their kids attend. The truths you tell only highlight that line you straddle. If the issues of schooling and child-rearing were so easy, one side or the other would have all the answers. As is obvious, they've all been failures- because each side refuses to straddle the line as you do.
As I have said on more than one occasion, a pox on both their houses- because they don't give a damn about schools or kids- our future.
They send their kids to private schools, so they don;t have to deal with the messes they create in the name of politics.
Excellent post, Mamacita. Having grown up in NYC, I'm fairly progressive on various social issues. However, I would never come close to defining myself as a liberal. On the other hand, although I worked at a conservative think tank, I found myself disagreeing with many of my colleagues. I think part of the problem is that politics has become so partisan that, as in Congress, debates and discussions on controversial issues have been reduced to polarized viewpoints.
More than anything else, I'm so glad to have conversations with people who actuall yhave their own opinions on a subject and aren't afraid to rationalize or discuss their thinking. Choose whatever you want. Just think for yourself and make your own decisions. Labels aren't important. Independent thinking is. Wish we could have less of the former and more of the latter.
Again, great post!
You are right. As in correct. Anyone over the age of 2 who thinks hitting is a good way to express disagreement is a moron. It is easier than nagging and example, though, which is what works.
excellent post, as always, and know that you are not alone in walking the line. be ever so glad that you're NOT a prof at calvin college, where W will deliver the speech at S1's graduation tomorrow. a little less than half the faculty have signed their names to a full page ad condemning the action iraq as an unjust war. it's rapidly degenerating into a truly ugly thing. don't they know that THE important thing is that we've gotten another one through the first four years and OFF the national bank of mom and dad rolls?
Thank you for such a wonderful post. I, too, believe as you do and it is great to see those beliefs put into words in such an effective way.
I bought a magnet when my boys were very young that says "Children are not things to be molded but people to be unfolded." As a grandmother, it is still on my refrigerator.
I'm glad my boys read it every time they got something to drink or eat. They asked me what it meant the first time they read it. I told them what it meant to me. I never heard them say another word about that simple little magnet again until they became parents. They have both asked for one for their homes. I've been happy to oblige.
OMG! I had no idea that such literature existed, let alone people who would follow what it teaches.
I'm not yet a parent myself but I hope to be so one day. I hope I can be the kind of parent that will be able to bring her kids up without ever having to smack but if a light paddling is in order then so be it.
I find it quite frightening that there are children who cry abuse when their parents administer a light spanking, who are then taken away from their 'abusive' parents, and yet there are children who's parents follow the methods in this book, who's kids are too frightened to cry abuse and so remain in the hands of the abusers.
And if Emily comes here and takes exception to my referring to her, and anyone else who follows those methods, an abuser, so be it. I'm not afraid of bullies.
The whole Calvin College thing is interesting, because it's a religious school, and a conservative school to boot (Dutch Reformed).
It gets more interesting every day, to be sure.
WF
Labels don't amount for much. A morale compass and voting DO count. Thanx for a stimulating post! 
Your entrys are always so interesting, have a great weekend
I had never heard of this book before. Absolutely disgusting.
It reminds me of a case where a child died because his parents spanked him for hours. They had been told to spank until he "surrendered" - and then continued even after he fell into a coma from internal bleeding (this was with their hands only, people).
I'm also reminded of a case where a man tried to abduct 3 little girls walking home from school. 2 girls got in the car when he said that their father had sent him and they had to "come at once." The third girl ran away. She said, "my mommy and daddy always told me to think, and I thinked that we had 3 different fathers, so he must be lying." Smart parents, those!
No wonder we click. We are alike I swear!
I am neither conservative or liberal. Well I am depending on the subject. (even related to politics)
My first child is my first attempt at parenting. We did spank her a little and we expected her to behave BUT we never beat her NOR did we cause welts, bleeding...etc. She never drank Drano or ran out in traffic either!
Now with our second child...he's a piece of work. I find that I don't have the same expectations that I did of our first. May be that is because I was a new bee at the parenting thing and had 5 years of practice before he came along.
Disciplining with love is the only way to do it. Common sense and a kind heart is the answer.
Smooch hon. You said it right.
When parents want tough, disciplined kids "spare the rod and spoil the child" seems to be invoked a lot. What is it that they say about good intentions paving a road?
(Michele sent me today)
Why is it when an adult beats a child with a belt across the extremities and body it's "discipline" but when an adult does the exact same thing to another adult it's assault and battery?
Hmmmm.
My response to Goldie's post is on my blog. I started typing and couldn't stop.
I've never been an advocate of book-burning...but I fear I'm about to start.
And I haven't even read the damn thing...only the reviews.
Sick, twisted, and completely outrageous.
I'll bet Mr. Pearl has put his "she'd jump out the window of a moving car if I told her to" to the test.
Now I must go vomit.
I haven't ever heard of this book, but I'm not sure I want to see it.
I have rarely had to spank my kids, and at ages of 10 and 7 I no longer think that a spanking would be effective (Shhh--don't tell them that).
Followthrough is the key. Both in discipline and in hugs.
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