Repost in case you thought the Doc's earlier piece (three or four threads down) had run out of steam.
(It is on topic here too).
Yall might want to see what Chris Snowdon did to the new myth that is third hand smoke:
http://www.freedom2choose.info/n...fo/
n...ewer.php? id=879
I've said it before, and I'll say it again: the man is a bloody genius!
TC'ers, you might want to avoid reading this deconstruction.
You don't come off well at all.
Amazingly, the article has a bunch of comments already. The negative ones saying that cigarette smoke is cigarette smoke and none addressing--well--how MUCH there actually is.
I like the note about the "presents reek(ing) of cigarette smoke"--apparently, for this person, even when smokers try to do some thing nice, they don't do it right.
Small sample size, yes, but I'm reminded of how antismoker groups still say they need to change public perception of smokers.
Perhaps they do--just the opposite way they think.
I posted a comment. Here it is.
So, there is an honest journalist out there to question what Dr. Siegel and others call "science by press release" Thank you for pointing out the hypocrisy of this telephone survey to anti smokers asking if they believed that 3rd hand smoke was dangerous....a SURVEY, not a study. Interesting that this press release could lead the zealots to attempt to ban smoking in homes and even outside the home, resulting in prohibition...the goal of ASH and others. Good luck with that. Since you are a journalist rather than a copy and paste guy working in a newsroom, how about examining further how science is being destroyed for the political whims of highly-funded anti-smoking groups. Take a look at what happens to honest scientists when they question the findings of anti-smoker zealots. http://www.scientificintegrityin...rg/
defense.html
Read about the "denormalization" campaign http://tobaccocontrol.bmj.com/cg...nt/full/17/1/
25
Fraud abounds in the anti smoking movement, and the resulting lack of science to promote the PC smoking ban movement is far more dangerous than a wisp of smoke. Thank you again for your courage. You WILL be attacked and called a shill for big tobacco, but hey, it's worth it.
If you like "Third Hand Smoke",....you'll love this:
http://tinyurl.com/axjc7x
"Smoking mothers have higher risk of delivering aggressive baby."
Of course the general disposition of a child has nothing to do with the environment or upbringing at all.
First Hand Smoke - easy enough to understand.
Second Hand Smoke, - all too familiar by now.
Third Hand Smoke, - just too stupid to comment further.
Fourth Hand, - actually witnessing smoking from across the street, or god forbid, ...on the movie screen.
Fifth Hand Smoke?,....thats got to be someone telling you about a time that THEY witnessed someone smoking and it left them so traumatized, that just hearing the frightening tale of mental anguish that sight caused the story teller, that it has now left you traumatized as well.
Sixth Hand Smoke?,...
That would be people fainting at simply hearing the word "smoke"
O/T: a study on Tetris and PTSD, of all things.
There are lots of possibilities here. I can't be the only person who's gone on a Tetris bender or joked about it being addictive. But I thought back to how it helped me get over/put aside some nastiness, and I've read about how smoking alleviates symptoms in schizophrenics. And I remember how, about when a certain person was out of my life, I just didn't feel like playing Tetris any more. Not that I had anything close to PTSD. And standard disclaimers about false memories can apply too.
While it's a tenuous link, it certainly shows the very real possibility of smoking having benefits that people would laugh at, to go with the risks. And in fact if they are similar to Tetris, why then denormalization policies undo the good a cigarette may do, and then some.
Or maybe this study was funded by the pro-tetris and time-wasting lobby. The giant tetris, freecell etc industries and apologists and shills blab on about civil liberties but they really cost billions in lost productivity!
Mike,
Thanks for exposing and criticizing this crap. Unfortunately, it was the news media that did most of the misrepresentation, as Winickoff's quotes in the media had little or nothing to do with his survey or its findings, which appears to have been little more than a push poll.
Speaking of 3rd hand smoke - this is OT to it but rings true to Nanny-gone-wild:
http://www.freerepublic.com/focu...s/2161700/
posts
It's perhaps one of the biggest stories of 2008 that you haven't heard of although it could become one of the biggest stories of 2009 in just a few short weeks from now.
That isn't OT in the least, Anonymous that idiocy is a direct result of the the slippery slope cause by the anti-smoker cartel and their mind-numbed zombies that they have perpetuated (and that we encounter so often on this blog.)
Just like the bogus claim that smoking bans don't hurt business the claims that this new law isn't going to harm small business is just as much Bravo Sierra.
Just like smoking bans are designed and promoted by the major chain restaurants to knock out their competition, so is this new set of product "safety" laws.
No matter what anyone thinks of Phillip Morris, I respectfully ask that you click on their link and send an email opposing the federal cigarette tax increase to your congressmen.
www.stopthefetincrease.com
Philadelphia Inquirer editorial calls for an end to exemptions in the smoking ban that is only 4 months old.
http://www.philly.com/inquirer/
o...l__Smoking.html
They cite the Pueblo study and 8 others that prove that bans reduce hospital admissions.
"But a new study by the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention linked a smoking ban in Pueblo, Colo., to a 41 percent drop in heart-attack hospitalizations there. At least eight earlier studies found similar results."
Comments are running 11 to 2 against the editorial point of view.
Taking a break from the 3rd hand insanity and getting back to 2nd hand smoke is just a breath of fresh air.
Advocate for CASH
It's the smoke you can't smell that is the most dangerous.
I know my little vice is vile and may be the death of me. All I ask is that the scientists stop pretending I'm a baby murderer, too
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debat...rderer-
too.html
Great article Mr. Beam. About time someone wrote about the lunacy in the world.
Off topic but thought Bill would like this. Arlington, Texas just laid off 5 of their 7 health inspectors, due to NO revenue to pay them. Only 2 will remain to inspect restaurants, bars, childcare centers, pools, etc. Want to go out to lunch there? Yep, Arlington has a smoking ban but now can't afford to inspect them! Gotta love you jerks! You can read it at www.wfaa.com.
Stephen, your link isn't working.
Thanks for posting the Philly Inquirer editorial. Other than its sentence citing last week's CDC report that misrepresented the scientific evidence on smokefree laws and heart attacks, the Inquirer editorial was spot on.
As we've been done every session since 1993, Smokefree Pennsylvania will be urging the legislture to enact Senatore Greenleaf's legislation, and our primary goal is to have the legislature simply repeal the local preemption clause in the current law, which prohibits local governments from enacting local ordinances that protect all workers from tobacco smoke pollution.
Gabz wrote:
"That isn't OT in the least, Anonymous that idiocy is a direct result of the the slippery slope cause by the anti-smoker cartel and their mind-numbed zombies that they have perpetuated (and that we encounter so often on this blog.)"
The federal child safety law cited in http://www.freerepublic.com/focu...s/2161700/
posts is clearly overkill (but not to the extent that commentary claimed) and at least two news articles in the past few weeks exposed the absurdity of this zero tolerance law for trace levels of lead and phthalates. Congress should amend that provision in the law.
But it is incorrect, absurd and insulting to claim that smokefree advocates were responsible for that new consumer product law, and that we are "mind-numbed zombies".
"Arlington, Texas just laid off 5 of their 7 health inspectors, due to NO revenue to pay them. Only 2 will remain to inspect restaurants, bars, childcare centers, pools, etc. Want to go out to lunch there? Yep, Arlington has a smoking ban but now can't afford to inspect them!"
There are 88 counties in the state of Ohio. There are two state inspectors to investigate violations for the entire state. Over 30 of the 88 counties have given up local enforcement and handed it back to the two state inspectors. Ohio has MANY smokeasies, places where it would be hard to guess that Ohio has a smoking ban. My 20 year old daughter attended a concert last week in Cleveland. When it was over, she called to tell me that they were on their way home. She left the arena with a bad headache due to clouds of marijuana smoke inside the concert arena. I asked if people were also smoking cigarettes, but she couldn't tell. The smell of the MJ was overpowering. I wonder why the many security cops did not attempt to stop it since Ohio is supposed to have a smoking ban. I guess they didn't care, much like the "enforcers" of the ban.
Although she is a non-smoker, cigarette smoke has never bothered her, but MJ gives her a headache. I am thankful for that because it stops her from wanting to get high. At 20, it is doubtful that she will start smoking cigs even though her mother does.
Well Sheri, I now know that LighteningBoy's restaurant in Ohio is the only place I will frequent! Planning a trip to that area this summer and it looks like I might go hungry.
But it is incorrect, absurd and insulting to claim that smokefree advocates were responsible for that new consumer product law, and that we are "mind-numbed zombies".
Hmm...okay, but that doesn't affect the logic that a bit too much "for the children" results in bad things and safety overkill.
As for the zombie thing, she didn't say you were, only that you perpetuated it. A bit strong, perhaps, but when it comes to a whiff of tobacco smoke, too many people do let go of their reason. You do expect people to go along like zombies with appropriating your latest inflammatory terminology(tobacco smoke pollution etc.) even if it is not as outrageous as third hand smoke, etc. Or else why would you repeat it yourself?
Where are you headed for in Ohio?
Cleveland for business then on to New York, upstate, so to visit family, friends and check out all the new places that are now flaunting the law! From there it is on to smokefree CT, an oxymoron in itself and will enjoy a few laughs and smokes with some friends there. Then it is back home to plan my next vacation to a smoker friendly casino in Las Vegas. These places are the only ones who gets my money.
I am 70 miles from Cleveland and don't go often, so I am unaware of places allowing smoking there. Do you have names of smoke easies there? You might check the violator's database LOL
Here's an entry for Cleveland from www.smokechoke.com
"in Cleveland ignores the smoking ban, and has done so since Day One. Everybody smokes, knowing that the City of Cleveland, Cuyahoga County, and the State of Ohio will do NOTHING! This smoking "ban" is turning out to be a joke."
"I went into the restaurant for dinner with some friends and there were a few men at the bar that started smoking. When we said something to the bartender she said that we needed to get out of the bar/restaurant if that was the attitude that we were going to have. This was extremely disappointing because we were in the miniority and we were NOT the ones that were breaking the LAW."
SmokeChoke is a good way to find smoke easies although their purpose is surely not that.
Here is the state database of smoking violations reported in Cleveland (Cuyahoga County) http://tinyurl.com/8ov7ph
SmokeChoke is a good way to find smoke easies although their purpose is surely not that. - Sheri
lol - Now that is funny. Talk about unintended consequences.
Ann,
Actually, the state database is a great way also. I'm hoping never to see my favorite places on that list though. It needs to remain top secret. Note, especially the places with multiple, recent violations.
If thats true
That seems a very similar attitude to regarding "protection money" as one of the unavoidable financial costs of continuing to trade.
Considering the thousands of dollars made because of allowing smoking, the fine is inconsequential. Unfortunately, I just saw one of my places listed after two full years of no warnings or no fines.
Dave Hitt on third hand smoke:
http://www.davehitt.com/blog2/
But it is incorrect, absurd and insulting to claim that smokefree advocates were responsible for that new consumer product law, and that we are "mind-numbed zombies".
Bill Godshall | 01.09.09 - 5:19 pm | #
Nope, not incorrect, absurd, or insulting. What the anti-smoker cartel has bred into the rest of society is what is incorrect, absurd, and insulting. Your entire movement is insulting in that you have falsely declared incorrect information as fact and then absurdly exaggerated those falsehoods based on some egomaniacal idea that you know what is best for everyone else.
That you found my comments to be insulting makes no never mind to me, as I find the existence of your entire movement, and the leaders of it such as yourself to be perpetually insulting to the all who believe in the basic concepts of what this nation was founded upon. That the likes of you and Dr. Siegel can live in places that helped create this great nation of ours, yet insult the rest of us who believe in the foundations on which the nation was based is the ultimate insult.
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