Yeah, linking to Wilpert and VHeadline will boost your credibility, alright, the latter asking for monies and support from the venezuelan secretary of (dis)information and the former being a long-time chavez unconditional fan.
You're the chavista version of Jerry Seinfield, always providing a good laugh. You're a joke indeed.
thanks for your comments Boyd.
Yeah attacking the source will boost your credibility, add smack on how you are paid by something in the oposition yadda yadda yadda.
Insert comedian, you funny.
Steven Hunt, just for the record, I'm not Boyd.
And don't get me started at tha attack-the-messenger strategy. Leftists are masters at it.
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And don't get me started at tha attack-the-messenger strategy. Leftists are masters at it.
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So let me get this straight if leftists are masters at it (I won't deny it is commone) and you came here to teach us lefties a lesson, does that mean you are some sort of Gradnmaster at it? Will IBM build a machine specifically designed to best your ad hominem skills?
Inquiring minds must know
Actually, its hard to shoot opposition messengers. After all for there to be a messenger there first has to be a message. And that is something seldom found amongst the Venezuelan opposition including most who comment on this blog.
Ok, let's talk about venezuelan "land reform". I'll start up by saying there is none. Chavez promised land AND financial support to those who applied for a piece of land. On most cases, land has not been given, and on those that have, no financial support has come afterwards. If that wasn't enough, Wilpert stands for everything that's indefensible. He completely ignores the many times Chavez has violated his tailor-made constitution and spins the facts so fast that the anybody may lost his/her balance and fall on the floor while reading it.
The second article, while hosted on a gov't-sponsored website, says everything every more-than-seventy-IQ person would know: chavismo is filled with incompetents.
If you're the manager of a baseball team and you put a .180 batter as your clean-up hitter, who is to blame?
That second article, written by a leftist that seems to like living in the U.S., also states that Chavez is not to blame. This chavez-doesn't-know-and-he's-being-tricked script doesn't hold any water anymore. Hasta cuando van a seguir con eso de que a Chavez lo tienen engañado? Es que acaso son idiotas?
So long, gotta get back to work.
So 2 million hectares given to 130,000 families counts for "nothing"? I wouldn't agree with that assesment. And I think it is particulary good given how the Supreme Court obstaculized this whole project. But even with those obstacles 2 million hectares have been given out. As to the financing, it is admitted in the article that has been slow to get off the groung. Generally, Chavez tries going through the existing state bureaucracy only to find it won't work because it is packed with opposition workers who simply refuse to do anything (and can't be fired because of Venezuelan labor law). So then he does and end around be creating entirely new programs from scratch and that works. That will probably wind up being the case here too.
On the observations of the young Venezuelan who is outside the country attending a university (as if that were a crime - there is complete freedom of travel as you opposition types should know as many of you have availed yourselves of it). He is complaining about the Chavista mayors in his home city being defficient. And yes there are some. There are others who are fantastic. So there is good and bad within the same tendacy. Are you going to tell me that the opposition mayors were all good? If that is the case please give me a list of what Pena did for Caracas.
Now not to pre-empt future posts but what this points out is the need for primaries - supporters of the MVR need a mechanisim to vote in good administrators and vote out bad ones within their own party. So the MVR needs to go foward on this issue, not backwards as it is unfortunatly doing at the moment (although its still ahead of the opposition parties which will NEVER hold primaries).
As to overall performace and competance lets compare track records:
What does the opposition have to point to? A coup that lasted 48 hours. A strike that they said would bring down the government in two weeks that was a total failure at everything except trashing the economy. A referndum campeign that was so pathetic that not only did they not get Chavez out they made themselves look laughable in the process. "Leaders" who have to be replaced every year after they lose credibility even amongst their own followers. And that is only the past 6 years - I won't even get into your non-accomplishments over the past 40 years.
Now what does Chavez have to show? A revitalized economy growing at double digit rates. Every macroeconomic indicator improving (this in spite of a stikes and coups). A large increase in the standard of living for the lower half of the Venezuelan population. Social programs such as Barrio Adentro and Mercal which even the opposition politicians claim they would keep. And this is even leaving out the "little" details like revitalizing OPEC, re-starting the oil industry after all the escualido employees walk out, the above mentioned land reform, etc.,
Even from these little lists the its clear to me who is batting .500 and who is batting .180.
oops, sorry I did leave out one accoplishment of the opposition - they have good aim and are good at hitting people in the head with rocks as the pictures a couple of posts below showed.
ok. so taking account of that mabye they're are batting .190
The prohibition against selling titles acquired through the land reform is another issue that land reform critics find fault with because it can lead to a black market in land titles. And, just as with all black markets, because the trade in titles is not legal, the titles end up being traded below their true value and thus can lead to making poor farmers even poorer than they otherwise would be. The Chavez government insists, though, that land should not be a commodity to be bought and sold, and that a market in agricultural land inevitably leads to greater land concentration and inequality, and thus to rural poverty.
This is a point Ive been trying to explain to “our friends” but not quite as saliently as Mr. Wilpert. Allowing for title of land and the use of the land as commodity or collateral leads the holder, in times of economic hardship to consider the sale of all or part of this land. This will lead to the large holding companies offering to purchase the lands from any who feel the need to and thus concentrate large parcels of lands under single ownership. The use of land as a commodity by the land reform recipients, in this case, would lead to a reversion of agricultural dominance by the wealthy, in the cycle of land transfers. The Government by retaining the rights to the land will ensure that the cycle is broken and the lands remain available to peasants who will use it.
Pulpo
Yes, that is an important point I would add that by not allowing the land to be sold it can't serve as collateral for loans. Now some would say that is a problem in that the new small landholders can't therefore get credit very easily to expand or start business or whatever. In a narrow sense they have a point.
But if you look at how this has always played out in the past the credits are given at extrememly high interest rates and with no business plan required - so the land that is collateral (in this case the land) just gets repossessed and you are right back where you started. So having the provision against re-selling is vitally important.
Venezuela to seek legal action against Robertson
Sun Aug 28, 2005 10:35 PM ET
By Matthew Robinson
CARACAS, Venezuela, Aug 28 (Reuters) - Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez said on Sunday his government would take legal action against Pat Robertson and potentially seek his extradition after the U.S. evangelist called for Washington to assassinate the South American leader.
Robertson, who later apologized for the remark, said he was expressing his frustration with Chavez's constant accusations against the administration of President George W. Bush.
"I announce that my government is going to take legal action in the United States ... to call for the assassination of a head of state is an act of terrorism." Chavez said in a televised speech.
The fiery left-wing critic of Bush's foreign policy who frequently charges the U.S. government is plotting to kill him, called Robertson "crazy" and a "public menace."
He said Venezuela could seek Robertson's extradition under international treaties and take its claim to the United Nations if the Bush administration did not act.
http://today.reuters.com/news/ne...TRS&
srch=chavez
Can you imagine? Good god it would be worth a million dollars to see Robertson stand trial for terrorism.
Pulpo--I would settle for sueing Robertson.
This devoteee of "Jesus" is worth literally tens of millions of dollars, if not hundreds of millions.
He works tightly with the Bush whitehouse, and his whacked-out far right, mostly white organization (ie cult) is a major force in the Republican party.
How pathetic is it when mainstream 'liberals' (read: US adecos that don't do Spanish) try to deny the clout that Robertson has in helping shape US policy.
These people give palpable meaning to the word 'hypocrisy'--they set the standard.
The question that we should be asking is why our US social culture allows these types of statements to be spoken in such a non chalant fashion. The disease of imperialism means never having to think about the hundreds of thousands of people harmed by your mendacity, hypocrisy, and fanaticism.
70% of the US population believe that their is really a Satan with horns and a tail that makes them think 'bad' thoughts. They are schizophrenic about sexuality. These freaks think that God has ordained them to rule the world, to 'take-out' leaders, kidnap, lie, and wage wars under phoney pretenses.
When you realize the terrorism that is perpetrated by the US government, the irony is very evident: the religious terrorists are in the mirror every morning.
Disclaimer--I doubt that most US citizens really relect on their erroneous, and fanatical beliefs, and when they do, they can be shamed by the revelations.
However, there is a rapacious, hardcore 30% that are every bit as fanatical as the most rabid Jihadist.
But the difference is that these out of shape slugs are too chicken shit for fight for their 'values' (because, deep-down they know that their values are against the 'life-force' that sustains the world--these values are actually 'anti-values', formed in fear, deep despair and cynicism).
Tiberon--your turn. The onus is on you to point out the flaws in Comandante Pulpo and OW's rebuttal. More, this needs to be done in a fashion that is 'compelling'. Convince us--or go wack-off with your buddies in the blogs that ban.
The land reform sounds like it is really starting to ramp up. No wonder the opposition has been so desperate to get Chavez out. Once something like this takes hold and benefits a lot of people it is really hard to turn back the clock. That is one of the opposition's problems. Even if they come back to power people are going to expect social programs like they are getting now.
yeah, Molly--I love it when these upper class parasitical snobs start in with their "they think that Venezuela is a rich country" bit.
Miguel Octavio talks about Venezuela's 'easy wealth' disease--tell that to the 60% of the population that has for decades worked their asses off for slave wages without minimal education or health care, or if they did get some decent quality attention, they paid through the nose for it.
Easy for Miguel Octavio to wax intellectual about the 'easy wealth' disease--this form a guy that has never endured a day in his life where he couldn't obtain ample food and adequate shelter.
This land reform has to be done right. I know it has gotten off to a slow start with many glitches--but i believe that Chavez et al are engaging a sound program that should become a model for how it can be done in other countries.
We don't know how long Venezuela's oil reserves will last, really. This makes it vital and substantial, deep reforms be initiated now.
Venezuelans should be the best educated people in all of the Americas two decades hence.
But imperialism needs to be soundly defeated if this is to come to fruition.
"Chavez spent a large part of his Sunday talk show discussing new healthcare plans for Venezuela. Part of this discussion also involved the provision of free eye operations to people in all of the American continents, north and south. The operations Cuba would provide the bulk of the operations, with Venezuela providing the transportation.
Chavez said that of the six million operations that Cuba and Venezuela would want to organize over the next ten years, there would be slots for 150,000 U.S.-Americans per year. Each country will receive a quota. Chavez gave some examples, explaining that there would be 100,000 for Brazilians, 60,000 for Colombians, 12,000 for Panamanians, 30,000 for Ecuadorians, 20,000 for Bolivians, and 20,000 for inhabitants of the Caribbean. Chavez said that those interested in the eye operations should turn to the Venezuelan embassies in their respective countries.
The plan to provide free eye operations is part of the “Mission Miracle,” which is one of the many new social programs that Chavez government has instituted in the past two years in Venezuela. By the end of December, 150,000 Venezuelans will have received eye operations. These operations involved operations for cataracts, myopia, pigmentary retinosis, and many others. "
This is a nice idea but there is a problem. Our highly democratic government doesn't allow us to travel to Cuba. So US citizens will not be able to participate.
Slave: "This land reform has to be done right. I know it has gotten off to a slow start with many glitches--but i believe that Chavez et al are engaging a sound program that should become a model for how it can be done in other countries."
You are absolutely right Slave. You see (and I hate to repeat but it bears mentioning) the opposition general strike has affected the social fabric of Venezuela in ways that only now we are seeing its effects on society. In the report of the National Institute of Statistics entitled “Reporte Social” covering the years from 97’ - 03’, specifically in the graph on the bottom of page 5, one can track and easily see the degradation of social standing as it pertains to poverty, directly tied to the time period correlating to the strike and the coup. The effects of such are not linear such that they can be calculated and adjusted for, it takes time to see how the Doppler effect reaches the most poor. All of this has an effect on implementation of programs, and the fact that even some lands have been redistributed is a boon for the government given the crippling effects of the strike.
It would be interesting to see how this model takes hold in other countries. Venezuela is blessed with an abundance of Natural resources. Bolivia has natural gas 2nd largest in all of LA, but they don’t have the means to extract it. Now where Ven comes into play is lending technical expertise so that they too can be fruitful of their resources so that they will be liberated from contracts from foreign countries whose only goal is to subjugate the population and control the economy. This I see as the future of LA – Ven helping its neighbors become semi-industrialized – enough to extract their own resources without foreign interests sticking their noses where they are not wanted. It can be done, and the journey has begun.
I wonder what Tiburon would have to say about this:
http://www.noticierodigital.com/...pic.php?
t=23822
A little shooting the messanger by our friend, Gustavo Coronel.
And notice the last comment - all of Chavez's allies are "blacks and gays"
Translation of the G. Coronel’s article
Interesting how you picked that up OW. There is no room in society for such bigotry. Shame on him.
I'll never forget when I first became involved in commenting on Vheadline, a couple of years ago.
Gustavo Coronel was a contributor, and I distinctly remember some troglodyte statements on how Chavez was squandering Venezuelan treasure on schooling the underclass. He did not put this thought in that stark of terms, but that was the gist.
What a reactionary person, real Hitler shit.
Thanks for the translation Commandante.
Email me soon.
Linking a comment made on Gustavo article to Gustavo character is unfair. You did twist that thing. I had to read twice Gustavo article where I could not find a thing on him being racist or anti gay (he even uses the word afro venezuelan!). And then I saw that it was some jerk comment that you were mentioning.
I started reading this blog recently and I was thinking it was a little bit more serious than other chavista pages. But maybe I was wrong. Maybe blogs are not the best way to learn about Venezuela.
petra:
sorry for the ambigious comment. I did not mean to say that Coronel said that, rather that a poster on that thread said that. But I don see that my comment was unclear and does make it look like Coronel was saying it. So thats my fault.
On Coronel's views - I've been reading him for quite some time. The most common word I've seen him use for Chavez supporters are barbarians and "ignorant". So I don't know if he is a racist - but I certainly think he is a "clacist".
http://users.pandora.be/eforum/e...scene/
eck05.gif
No prob Wakeen
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