"Fuck Jesse Helms, and may he rot in hell."
It's time like this I wish I could believe in Hell.
Dam you Robert Ingersoll!
I never get gleeful at someone being dead...This is an exception. Truely an evil, hateful being...There was nothing human abou him except his DNA.
jesse helms is the true face of the repiggie party.
it is precisely because of people like him that i will not vote for any repiggies, not even for local office.
to the stupidheads in the log cabinette movement,
helms is your party and your shame.
SING OUT LOUISE!!!!!!
Good.
Finally.
Collective sigh of relief here. There had better not be any memorializing or saintly reinterpretation of who this man was. I would push the media to acknowledge how controversial and venomous this man was.
When I read the news this morning I felt absolutley no sadness. I felt a sense of relief. It is a relief that many of the worst monsters are old and dying off one by one. I plan to organize in anyway possible to fight any younger versions of this type of monster. I would also encourage a boycott of any bleeding sympathy news groups that praise this evil being. I can't bring myself to call him a human. Just wait though, Fox News will probably just weep and sob over losing one of there like-minded sorts.
How could they tell? Did he start to smell better?
Amen and amen. I grew up in Alabama under the misrule of George Wallace. Jesse Helms was just another practioner of the vile racism and homophobia that was the American south. And it is amazing how the main-stream media can rehabilitate the legacy of these neaderthals (sorry, ancestors) turning race baiting into 'principled stands'. I don't care how many Bonos Mr. Helms snookered into dressing up his image, I'll never buy it. (BTW, I'll never buy another U2 CD either.)
Mike, what you said in New York, I said tonight on the San Francisco Channel 5, CBS News.
Jesse Helms deserves neither pity nor sympathy from anyone. Jesse Helms is reponsible for thousands who died of AIDS. He claims gay men are responsible for AIDS. NO! NO! NO!
History will show Jesse Helms aggressively blocked funding to fight AIDS research and education. His actions are responsible for the deaths of thousands.
He was a murderer, and we should never forget that.
Allen White
San Francisco, California
AMEN!!!
If, like me, you are weary of the toadying, softball obituaries in U.S. media, check out this from The Guardian: http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/...2008/jul/04/
usa
Sample: "To echo this newspaper's memorable comment on the death of William Randolph Hearst, it is hard even now to think of him with charity." And it's downhill from there.
This now makes Jesse Helms the number one VP pick for McCain!!! McNasty will look very youthful and energetic next to him, don't 'cha think?
Allen, you need to do some serious reading, ok? Because you are ignorant of HIV modes of transmission and prevalence rates in gay men who practice unsafe sex.
I do thank goodness Helms is gone, he was a hate filled moron who deserved a very painful death.
Ron, I can't allow your comments to go unchallenged. Might I suggest you do some real serious reading. First, I could care less about how he died.
Jesse Helms was not a moron. How trite to define him as a "hate filled moron." That is just too easy. I have too many friends who would be alive today if not for Jesse Helms.
Just as Adolph Hitler had goals...so did Jesse Helms. Jesse Helms' goal, his agenda, would have eliminated gay men. Gay men would be dead! Got that, Ron.
Now, Ron, you suggest I do some serious reading. You are clearly mistaken if you believe I'm not very clear on how HIV is transmitted. I very much understand the impact of HIV and AIDS on gay men.
Let us presume, as a point, you just did not have that information. Read a book, you might suggest. What if I told you there was no book?
What if I told you one man in the United States Senate,Jesse Helms decided no government funds could be used to print that book? What if you also learned that government funds would be cut from any organization which dared to print that book?
And, Ron, what if you became infected with HIV or AIDS because you didn't have access to that book, a book Jesse Helms made sure you couldn't see? And at that point, would you continue to blame the community of gay men for infecting you with this disease? If you did, you are the moron.
In fact, over and over again, Jesse Helms built barrier after barrier to block efforts to fund research, to educate the country about AIDS. And furthermore, Ron, this one Jesse Helms was joined by the likes of Jerry Falwell, James Dobson, Pat Robertson and Pat Buchannan to create a stigma, a tone of hate which continues to hang across this country like a never ending storm cloud.
No, Ron, Jesse Helms was much more than just a "hate filled moron." Jesse Helms led an organized effort to murder gay men. That AIDS has now spread to the African-American community might be seen as the next chaper in the effort fueled by Jesse Helms. For now, don't give Helms the benefit of the doubt.
Should you know a person with AIDS, if not for Jesse Helms they might be just a bit, maybe quite a bit healthier than they are today.
What drugs and regimens which keeps people alive with this disease, no question, would have been in use years earlier had it not been for Jesse Helms. And for every person in the United States and around the world, infected with AIDS or HIV, let them know their lives could have been better and it could have happened years earlier if there was no Jesse Helms in the United States Senate.
Ron, you do some reading and you will discover that Jesse Helms was a murderer and shame on you for ever blaming the community of gay men for causing the pandemic of AIDS in this world.
Our community deserves better. If you don't know that, then, Ron, you need to do some very serious reading before you ever again take such a position.
Allen White
I thought he died a long time ago. Can't say I feel too bad, the guy was an evil sonofabitch.
Thanks for keeping it real Mikey!
Thank you Allen, for eloquently stating and explaining how so many of us feel. It is beyond reproach of human integrity to commit what are essentially amounting to genocide of a people. There are fundamentally individuals who would prefer that the gay population was removed and eliminated. Allowing them carte blanche because they are 'ignorant' is ignorance itself.
Good riddance to another right-wing, hate-mongering, racist, homophobic, fundamentalist moron. He's joined Jerry Falwell, both deserving to rot in hell forever, although unfortunately that place existed only in their sadistic and morally depraved minds.
So many victim-based non sequiturs....so little time to respond. You place so much blame and responsibility on just one bigoted man (thereby giving him far more power than he ever really had in life or death).
Did Jesse Helms fight to keep the bath houses open and spreading the infection in the early days of the epidemic? No, I believe that was nihilistic members from our community that fought common sense, public health measures from slowing the infection rate. I have a close physician friend who treated those with HIV from the beginning until late 2001. You would not believe the frustration and sleepless nights many doctors had during that time.
Helms was an asshole, but he was only one man. One wonders when will activists ever decide to take even a small amount of personal responsibility for ill advised actions during the beginning of the epidemic?
For various reasons, there has been essentially no American, widespread, heterosexual HIV infection epidemic (when you take IV drug abusers and bisexuals out of the stats). There are multiple reasons for this.
Don't try to make me the bad guy in this...one individual seroconversion, regardless of the sexuality of the infected person, is heartbreaking!!! However, quit playing the victim role. There are many information sources in America. Are you really saying that Helms was a "murderer" because he blocked the FEDERAL GOVERNMENT (aka, the big tit)from jumping in with information. Early on, there was little true information from any source. Community groups did a great job by informing people with respect to behaviors to avoid...and physicians/drug companies were doing everything humanly possible to help.
I know what your vacuous retorts will be...and they will all be slathered in victimhood and expectations of more Big Brother solutions to all your problems. Grow up! Take responsibility for your individual actions. Ever larger, intrusive government is not now, nor has it ever been your savior.
He's burning in the pits of Hell.
Ron, yes, Helms was a murderer because he blocked funding. One can be complicit in the extinction of a people. One can be an accomplish. One can ingore a disease when so much can be done, and this does amount to a de facto genocide. Jesse Helms is not going to get off easy and nor are you.
Ron, I can see where you're coming from, but to defend Helms is just... I don't see why you would. Helms didn't block spending on HIV/AIDS because he was opposed to the expansion of federal government spending, far from it. He loved federal spending if it benefitted his state. He loved federal spending if it went to faith-based charities. No, he worked against funding for HIV/AIDS because he believed that AIDS was a gay disease and whoever had it deserved to die. This man was no true conservative, he was an authoritarian, statist theo-con who ran openly racist campaigns against his opponents.
A larger government is not the answer, in fact, it's a problem. But, when you have a disease like AIDS which, in the 80's when Helms was at the height of his power, was infecting and killing many people, to stand in the way of AIDS education efforts because of your fucked-up belief that teaching safe sex will encourage people to just have sex and because "those people" shouldn't be having sex, let them take their chances, is irresponsible and reckless, and definitely contributed to the spread of the disease.
ron defends the "big brother" approach of the repiggies uncritically. ron is the one who needs to get his ass in gear and do some serious reading and studying. stop listening to limbaugh and foxnews.
they have no use for sodomites like you, in spite of all your "patriotic" drivel.
My oh my. Such big words used and spelled incorrectly...with such drama. The asshole Helms is now seen by leftists as committed to "de facto genocide" and desiring the extinction of an entire people. Right.
Get a clue you perpetual victims, but most of all you need to realize that ever increasing government is not your friend.
If the federal government doesn't jump to take money away from the people to spend on a social or other programs you deem fit...they are committing genocide. To funny (if it weren't so tragic).
Just because Helms didn't agree with us (as is his right as an American) and didn't advocate pouring our tax money into HIV research does not mean that he is a monster, genocidal etc. He just disagreed and pushed for abstinence education. Why do leftists have such a problem with someone holding a different opinion? You are not owed loving acceptance by other Americans...only tolerance and the right to be who you are. You are especially not owed the people's money...unless you can make a case strong enough for your fellow straight citizens to agree to spent it.
BTW, safe sex and abstinence does prevent HIV. Get a clue.
Ron, fundamentally, stopping the spread of AIDS is a cause that doesn't benefit solely the gay community. It benefits the world. Africa is currently being ripped apart, socially and economically due to the disease.
To 1.) infer that we should take responsibility for the actions of the bathhouses is to say we deserve the disease. My former boyfriend was raped in the military and contracted HIV that way. Should he take responsibility for that? Should he not have access to government help in fighting his disease? Look him in the face and explain why he should die because he was raped while serving his country.
2. To support someone who fights against cures and health IS criminal. Why did Helms not support AIDS medical research? He ignorantly brushed it off as a gay disease which meant nothing to him. What did we find out and what did doctors warn? It was a disease that devestated the world.
3. This is not a partisan attack from my end. I'd attack anyone on either side who did not move to action to save the world, but let their personal prejudice and ignorance send us all sliding towards death.
4. Personal responsibility in our American government is voting for those you believe in, affecting change locally and speaking out against those who mean us harm. Anyone here speaking out against Jesse Helms does so in acknowledging that he meant us harm.
5. Since you bring up other users spelling things wrong, there are two forms of "to" and "too". You used the wrong one. My 8th grade students do the same.
why do you keep defending your oppressors?
I'm sure that the education major enjoyed correcting an inadvertent error. I stand corrected. God knows, 8th grade teachers are the Alpha and Omega of advanced thought. I'm also sure that your school board members enjoy your activity on gay websites.
BTW, true critical thinkers would be able to see that I was NOT DEFENDING Jesse Helmes, or his ilk. Good God, has anyone who blogs on this site ever taken a logic class? I was trying to prove to the closed minded leftists, who apparently now own what passes for L/G/B/T apologetics, that ever increasing governmental control of our lives is not desirable. You may get what you want, then they own you and your information.
Regarding the last entry by Barry. I was moved by the story about your boyfriend who was reportedly raped by a military member...then contracted HIV. In the unlikely event that it really did happen as you said, nothing could be more horrible. However, as someone with a military background, I know that people who are HIV positive are removed from active service as a health issue (since all active members must be able to give blood at any time).
As an additional aside, millions upon millions of dollars were spent in the early days by the government and private industry combating the HIV virus. You wanted more. It is your right as an American. What you really wanted was the warm fuzzy, positive "feeling tone" of acceptance by big brother.
Again, grow up, quit searching for more government tit, be responsible for your actions and the HIV rate will go down.
Ron sounds like Andy Sully in drag or something. Andy are you trolling Signorile's site?
Final word for me on this Ron.
1. It's insulting to insinuate it might not have happened to him. He was held down by two guys and raped by the third. Two were discharged, the other was given reprimands. They were unaware that the man who raped my ex and now my friend was HIV positive. He went through a period of not accussing them because of the shame he felt of being raped and also did not take the 3 day pill you can get to avoid HIV infection because he was so ashamed of going to the doctor.
HIV was a major issue in our relationship because of my youth and lack of knowledge of what it was. Go fuck yourself for insinuating that there's something false in that story, it was a fucking disaster and tragedy with which my friend still deals daily.
2. You're right. Educators are lacking in thought. I have three degrees and contribute weekly to the public good. I'm amazed you are willing to slam teachers. They fall within some of the most reasoned people I know who are willing to help the youth of our country. I teach in the lowest economic area of my city and have voluntarily been at SEVEN trials to testify on behalf of my students.
Go ahead Ron. Slam teachers. Hold up self haters. Defend the indefensible. However do not expect yourself to be popular, thought of as good or considered intelligent. Understand you will be considered the pariah or parasite.
My 1st response is that anyone with even a modicum of reasoning power (and ability to read english) should have been able to understand the many times I said that I was NOT DEFENDING Helms. Has anyone taken a logic class...anyone?
Second point. If the story happend as you said then I am truly sorry for you. However, it IS standard procedure to remove HIV infected individuals as soon as they are detected from active service to prevent just the sort of disaster you described. Sounds like a good plan doesn't it? Standard military procedure would have saved you and your boyfriend significant heartache, if it had been followed to the letter. The criminals who raped your ex-boyfriend should have been (and I asume were) prosecuted. Justice served.
Third point. I am too busy earning a seven figure income to be concerned with being popular. I prefer being needed and productive over being popular with anybody (except with my partner of course). I am providing a patriotic service for our country (i.e., getting more domestic oil out of the ground for us all). I have oil companies from all over the world offering me high six figure to low seven figure paychecks to act as their consultant.
I only spar with the entrenched victims who haunt this site to encourage them stand up for themselves and begin to engage in our marvelous capitalist system. You will go far if you can just stop trying to pick your neighbors pocket via confiscatory taxation and take responsibility for yourself, your sexuality and your actions. Enough of the collectivist, loser bullshit. Every loser has an explanation.
Ron:
The best concievable reason for a talented guy like you to be making all that money is so the government to take it and help the less fortunate. Doesn't the thought just tickle you pink !
What a piece of work this guy is!
Ron: I find your you interest here very curious and somewhat fascinating.
I have a few questions for you, if you don't mind.
Do you listen to the Signorile Show and why? What is your connection to this movement, to MS's politics and to the show?
Why do you come here when you are not going to get any support for these views? Again, what is your connection to those of use you claim to be trying to challenge?
Third, do you not believe politicians do damage to individual lives though their votes, through those they support, through the hatred they inspire? In that sense, do they put things in motion that are dangerous and deadly?
Couldn't agree with you more michaleangelo. He was equivalent to hitler. I don't care what anyone says. Sometimes you don't have to willfully exterminate people. the system does it for you if you just look the other way and pay no attention.
LOVE the comment, MS. Yes, may he rot in hell.
Mark, I reinvest almost all of what I make, so there is little to nothing the IRS can grab. But you say, you can't do that!!!! I say, yes, I can, I start a new company every year, having something to do with the oilfield, and a new company can break even for three years before it has to make a profit (buying more equipment takes a lot of money), then that profit goes to start a new company and so on. Also, donating to charities that I want to help is a good tax write off also, but the main thing is the money goes where I want it to, not where some politican can use it to buy votes.
As always, private donations add up to more than the feds give out to help the less fortunate in the US and abroad. Also, there are several places you can look up on the internet that show how much conservatives give privately and how much leftist give privately, the leftist look pretty sad, mainly because they back programs that use everyone elses money instead of their own, nice, huh?
Marion, I listen to Mike's show almost every hour that it's on, even replays on weekends. I'm part of the G/L/B/T community.
I guess I'm hoping that everyone will see just how badly the democrats use us when it's to their benefit, and dump us when it isn't. And this Marxist, Obama, will use everyone to a degree never before seen in the USA.
Your third point was a run on unreadable statement that didn't make sense as a question or a statement.
Basically, I hope everyone will understand they can do much better without government being in the way. Each person, can work hard, make damn good money in the US, and do much better than almost anyone in any other country. I love how our poverty line falls just above having two cars, two rooms per person in the household, and having two color TVs. Yeah, that's really poverty, NOT!
Barry, I have complete respect for teachers that teach the history of the US, real sciences, and challenge students in math.
I despise teachers who use left wing talking points to indoctrinate their students into the collectivism mindset, instead of educate, destort history, and let students slide through to the next grade.
I believe in failing students who can't or won't make the grades to move on to the next level of learning, their feelings be damned, put out the effort or stay back and do the year over.
There are good teachers and bad teachers, I know you've seen that. I was fortunate enough to attend a semi private rural school, not a christian school, that pushed science, math, and history to the point (at the time) I wanted to vomit, but it made a difference, and made me learn to work harder than the rest. Good enough is never good enough. Where I went to school, 80 was failing, and we were pushed to maitain a 95 or higher average. I maintained 96.8 throughout high school. I loved math and science, but my english and spelling classes I barely sqeaked by.
Teachers can be good or bad, it's up to them, I remember every teacher I had, and love them dearly.
Ron:
Whatever your politics, don't you think using the death of Jesse Helms as an opportunity to slam "leftists" and capitalist "losers" a bit over the top?
A loathsome and harmful man died. Period.
Give it a rest for a day.
It's good you are happily coupled with a "seven figure" income, because--no offense--you sound like a pompous crank.
Ron, you seem so educated but morally corrupt. You are apparently very proud of your earnings with the huge American Oil Companies. While I applaud your capatilistic venture, I do question your hypocrisy.
Interesting, albeit mostly petty/bitchy, posts. I have been accused of defending Jesse Helmes (when anyone capable of reading English could find multiple instances where I clearly stated that I was not), using Helm's death to make "mean spirited" attacks on leftists (when the 1st and subsequent posts to this thread were full of hatred for this dead man and Republicans in general), and suffered multiple attacks upon my person (i.e., "arrogant," "mean spirited," "hypocrite" etc.).
What I always try to do is show the closed minded leftists who think that they control the L/G/B/T "community" that we are a heterogenous bunch.
Many of us do not fit into the Republican banner (due to our gender/sexual status), but we certainly do NOT fit into the pro-globalization, confiscatory taxation, collectivist, perpetual victim status left-Democrat camp either.
Just to let you know, I have personally been more accepted by straight Republicans (knowing my T status) than by many leftist gays. There is no all-encompassing L/G/B/T community!!! It is a community of left-leaning, pro-big brother, mewling victims. Quit trying to state that you and your fellow envious, non-capitalists represent me, or many other successful L/G/B/T's.
You do not.
This Ron has a point. Sometimes we rag on the Repubs and Log Cabinites too much. We need to try to show our community and everyone that our ideas are better.
There are political differences among us. If we are really for diversity, what do we do with Ron and all the other openly different L/G/B/T's?
Out here in Wyoming we took notice of Jesse Helms' death by celebrating wityh a Parade and shootin' off some fireworks!
And how did y'all celebrate?
Well, hey, the NEA outlasted Jesse Helms. How about that?
You know, there IS an online condolence site. I certainly sent mine
"I know it is a great comfort to thousands of Americans to know that Jesse Helms has gone to his final reward..."
I'd elaborate on what I think that "final reward" entails, but I'm afraid I'd be hauled away for Preventive Detention.
Ron,
Your "logic" is fairly typical of the self-described "winner." And good for you that you feel that way about yourself. But, as with so many "winners" or folks who see the world in terms of "winners' and "losers" your logic is, most of the time, rather self-serving.
Myself, I don't see drilling for oil as so much an exercise in patriotism, as an exercise in delaying the inevitable and it's an exercise in what passes for free enterprise in our gamed, monopoly controlled "economy."
It's the type of free enterprise that is heavily subsidized by government handouts and tax loopholes that folks like you use enthusiastically while decrying Food Stamps and Social Security. Now, the rest of us are financing all three, so while you're availing yourself of one brand of collective largesse, it might be nice not to be resentful of others who are also getting help.
Now, perhaps you weren't "defending" Jesse Helms, but what you were doing was taking a big, stinky, self-righteous, crap all over anyone who dare to criticize a man who wielded his considerable lawmaking power to stymie Civil Rights for Black Americans, research into AIDS, prevention efforts, including a Human Sexuality curriculum that would have armed kids with the knowledge to keep themselves out of harm's way. All the while, he was also securing enormous subsidies for tobacco farmers, protecting tobacco companies from interference, and doing the same for textile mills and cotton growers.
In short, his "opinion" and the way he "expressed" it, had far-reaching effects on many if not all Americans.
Meaning I'll criticize that big, fat bag of shit anytime I want and frankly, I think his home state should be forced to pay reparations for inflicting him on the rest of the country.
By your logic, even voting is a waste of time because hey, the people we send to Washington, allegedy to work for us - are just "people with different opinions."
Now, no one has to approve of me or my "lifestyle," what I object to is folks who assume that I'm interested in what they think about it, shove their opinions down my throat and make (or maintain) laws that restrict my ability to pursue Life, Liberty and Happiness. That's what I fight.
And of course, you would prefer to keep all of your money and even decide which people (if any) you would like to help with it. Understandable as it's so much more satisfying to have everyone in need approach you personally, hat in hand, ready to hear any all lectures you may have to offer. And in some case, those lectures are warranted. And in other cases, you wouldn't know what the hell you're talking about and that's why some of us like to accomplish things collectively, because we can't be experts on everything.
Collective action can be very efficient. If you don't think so, then instead of using that federal freeway system, next time you need to travel, off-road it! Don't forget to get permission from
Re: The late Helms; as Oscar Wilde said about the death of Dickens' Little Nell: It would take a heart of stone not to laugh out loud.
I would be hard pressed to come up with a single contemporary politician whose influence was so baleful, and whose words and actions so hateful. Strom Thurmond, at least had a few human weaknesses and hypocrisies to make him amusing and interesting. Thurmond was also smart enough (if not decent enough) to put aside that anti-nigrah stuff (though not gay-baiting), when he finally saw it as a liability.
Ol' Jesse, by contrast, never had to change his ways to keep up with the times. Unless there was a deathbed apology from him like from the late George Wallace (which I've not heard any evidence of) then he managed to leave the world the same vicious cracker he always was, and without a single ennobling moment. Except for tobacco company executives, he never did a damned thing for North Carolinians, white or black--except play to their worst hates and fears, and the country's as well.
That this miserable sack of excrement supported, at the last, some crumbs of aid for Africans hard hit by HIV does not mitigate his atrociousness in the slightest. After all, Jesse fought with unmatched skill and single-minded zeal to hamstring any public funding for AIDS research, treatment, education, or client services. If not for the work of creatures like him (and of course, it wasn't just him blocking whatever he could and sabotaging anything else), perhaps we would have had a safe and effective vaccine years ago.
The man's worst evil? His willingness to try to choke-off any action that might be seen as helping gays in any fashion was accompanied by some of the most preternaturally vicious gloating at their sufferings this side of the Reverend Fred Phelps. To be fair, Jesse could not quite match Phelps' psychotic level of vituperation, but that was only due to a lack of imagination on Helms' part--not to any dignity or decency.
I would repeat any or all of the above verbally to the faces of any of his surviving family, were I called upon to do so.
What a Copperhead wrote of Lincoln after his assassination serves as a just epitaph for Jesse Helms: "The shameless tyrant, his body justly felled... rots in his grave; while his soul is consumed in eternal fire at the bottom of the blackest pit in Hell!"
He gloated over the deaths of loved one and friends; don't anyone expect me to shed tears for him. Perhaps he will get to service Slobodan Milosevic for eternity; a fitting end indeed!--pun definitely intended.
Wow mcQ, what a load of total horse shit. You know, if you are getting taxpayer money, then yes, you should have to look a tax payer in the eye before you could get your check. If I had my way, single mothers would have to get depoprevera shots before they could get their checks.
Interstates, buddy, I pay more in road taxes per year for my companies than you will ever pay in income taxes in your life. By the way, I drive OFF ROAD more than on pavement each and every day.
You are correct in one thing, I wasn't defending Helms, as I said before, he was a moron and deserved a painful death.
Yep, collectivism worked so well under Stallin, Chavez, and Saddam. In each case, there was a very select "rich" class, and the rest (no middle class, only dirt poor) lived hand to mouth.
Next
Hey Ron. . . how are things in that log cabin? Got some time off from work?
Hugs & kisses
xoxoxoxoxoxox
No chuck, no time off for me. We are drilling new oil wells as fast as we can move the rigs. Thank goodness for aircards and sat. internet. The companies furnish me tornado homes but I rarely use them except for the sat. hookups.
I wouldn't know about a log cabin, since my home is a 5400 sq.ft. concrete and brick built in 1937. I prefer the old style homes, built with pride by Americans who took pride in what they built with their two hands for a honest days pay. If you were talking about the log cabin group, I wouldn't know about them either since I've never corresponded with them. But they sound like a good group.
McQ,
It has been a long time since I have read such agressively ignorant, pseudo-intellectual bullshit. Jesse Helms was a sick joke, largely ignored (even by many of those in his own party). Now you are suggesting "reparations" from Helm's home state for inflicting Helms upon us. Spoken like a true "gubmint cheese" eating, socialist parasite.
Don't debate ideas in a free intellectual arena...shout them down. Extinguish them for their "thoughtcrimes" (the elegant descriptor used by Orwell). Demand "reparations" where none is due. It would be funny, if it were not so tragic.
The L/G/B/T community will remain locked in victim status if some factions of our "community" continue to give people like Helm's such a high position (via their histrionic rhetoric). He was never as important during his life as people on this blog have made him since his death. Take a reality check, look toward the future...not your bitter, petty past.
For me, commenting on Jesse Helms has only one goal...history must not be distorted to diminish what he did. Yes, he was very important. He worked hard to block AIDS research and education. Because of that people died. That is neither a liberal or conservative position. That is fact.
I believe if Jesse Helms had cared about all Americans, AIDS would not have killed so many.
That is my opinion.
I saw Jesse Helms in action. He fought a war which killed many of my friends.
His death is not a time for me to celebrate. It is a time for me to remember my friends who I wish were alive today.
Here, in San Francisco, I believe many others feel the same way.
Gee Ron, I mean Southwest Tori, or whatever your name is, and whoever you are,
"Gubmint cheese-eating, socialist parasite" that's how you preface "debating ideas in a free intellectual arena"?
"Collectivism under Stalin, Chavez and Saddam" ? That's kind of like "Capitalism" under Hitler, Reagan and Pinochet, huh?
Or cartoons under Bugs, Scooby Doo, and Barbarella...
In short, I can't decide which of your multiple personalities is more fatuous and shallow, but I see no reason to honor either of them with any more of my time or energy, as I prefer to save those commodities for myself, my equals or my betters.
Thanks for playing.
Keep dreaming mcQ.
You lack of reasoning ability is only outdone by your willingness to insult someone who is of far superior intelect. Careful, don't hurt yourself.
McQ, or what ever type of Loony Tunes, America hating character you are...Ron in TX and Southwest Tori (me) are two different persons.
I am a member of the community. From what I've read, Ron in TX has some "easy lifting" to best some of the trolls on this site. By your answers, you are somehow an anti-capitalist American.
I wonder how long you and your sophomoric comments (not to mention sexuality) would last under communist dictators, much less the fascist Pinochet government you mentioned.
Yeah, Pinochet and Hitler were the same as Reagan. Sure they were. How long have you been off your medication?
The supposed anonymity of the net lures some people into a false sense of security. You know nothing of my medical training, my intellect, my military history, my martial arts training, or any other training I may possess...yet you feel free to answer someone you don't even know in that manner.
Don't worry, I pose no substantive threat to you (unless you were to ever personally say some of the things you have typed...in front of my husband). That action would necessitate a new, personal meaning to the term "double jeopardy."
My original point to you, to Mike and others remains the same L/G/B/T's should not remain obligate victims!!!
All the left can offer one is collective poverty and easy victimization. Take a martial arts class, or follow the lead of the organization Jews For the Preservation of Firearms Ownership. Above all...take some personal responsibility for yourself and your loved ones.
Tori,
What's with the veiled threats?
Pissed because you've run across someone who can run circles around you in a debate, and when that fact becomes unavoidable, you start in with "I was in the miltary. I know martial arts. MY HUSBAND AND I CAN BEAT YOU UP!"
Is that all you have? The ability to beat people up when they disagree with you? The ability to beat people up when they call you on a complete (and very unoriginal, btw) mischaracterization of their views? Can't keep up with the debate? Turn the table over, call hubby and together you'll beat me up...Is that how it works for you? (and your husband).
Well, it's easy to see why you're so happy about the way things are, because it's exactly how this country has been run for the past eight years. Can't get the world to dance to our tune? Beat it up. Little country in South America wants to take control of its oil? Beat 'em up. Little A-rab country in the middle east isn't doing what we want? Beat 'em up and try to steal the oil before the citizenry gets wise to the ruse.
Oh, yeah and don't worry about the countries from which the threat actually emanates - they're our friends. Because the President says so.
Except nobody's buying anymore and it really pisses you off that you might have to re-think some things and maybe see it from another point of view.
You might have to do that scary thing and actually get intellectually honest with yourself. It's tough. I know.
Six weeks ago, I reluctantly climbed on the Barrack Bandwagon, and then, I thought it wasn't so bad for a brief spell. And now, I'm appalled. I had to go from "He's okay" to "He's showing signs of true greatness and leadership" to "He is the same ol' same ol' in a new designer color. And here I am again. facing a choice in November between a dried-up, demented turd with no grasp on reality and a slightly fresher, more fragrant turd trying to act like he's not the Same Old Shit."
(note to self: remove Obama bumper sticker from SUV)
But I did it, Tori. And you can, too. You can stop all that ridiculous spouting off about "freedom" and "spreading democracy" as if you cared. You can face the fact that you're not any more interested in spreading Democracy than Mao Tse Tung was. You can be honest with yourself: you like Democracy for you, but not for anyone else.
And then, you can face the fact that what you like isn't Democracy at all - it's called a monarchy, or maybe fascism. And that's what you like, Tori!
And then, you can figure out why you entered the military because it clearly wasn't to defend this country - which is actually distinguished by the principles it supposedly represents, not its land mass.
Sit down and read that Constitution and see how much it actually kind of sickens you. Then read the Bill of Rights and see if you can get through it without running for the toilet to heave up dinner.
It all makes you sick, doesn't it? Because it'
It all makes you sick, doesn't it? Because it's not how you see things at all. It should be "Survival of the Fittest," right? Except that our principles leave a lot of wiggle room when it comes to defining "fitness," because it recognizes the value of the individual as well the value in creating a society where the individual is afforded the best chance possible at making the most of his or herself.
It disgusts you to think that someone you see as weak could actually do well, doesn't it? It makes you angry that in return for all those benefits you say you love, you are actually handed a bill once a year and expected to pay it. It annoys you that some people see success as a combination of hard work and luck, rather than just hard work and innate virtue or hard evidence of God's favor.
You really deserve recognition for making yourself what you are today, don't you, Tori. Screw the parasites, you deserve a medal just for being you.
You can't understand why us homos aren't hanging onto your every word, when you're here to help us see things differently.
Here's the thing, though, Tori. You don't know me. You don't know where I've been, what I've done, what I've lived with. You don't know how I've arrived at some of my conclusions. You don't know what kind of money I make. You don't know what I do for a living. You don't know what strata of society I come from. You don't understand how anyone could arrive at conclusions that differ from yours because you don't bother trying to find out who they are.
If you knew me, Tori, you'd know that the last thing I am is an obligate victim. You see us as a bunch of disempowered, whiny cocksuckers. Fine. What we feel we're saying is "Uh, I breathe the same air, pay the same taxes, work the same jobs (when I'm allowed to) as anyone else and while it seems that I fufill all the responsibilities of citizenship, I appear to be coming up very short in the rights department and I think it's time we addressed that."
And if you think that Jesse Helms was such a marginalized joke (longest-serving Senator in history, with six years as chairman of Agriculture Committee and then six years as chairman of Foreign Relations) I suggest you take a look at the eulogy our President delivered on him and then, you tell me if you were gay or black or anything that wasn't white, heterosexual and Christian that you wouldn't be furious.
I'll leave you with this: take another look at the examples I gave of Capitalist "leaders" and compare them with the examples Ron gave of Collectivists. Skip the cartoon characters, you'll never get that unless you're a hardcore cartoon buff, but if you apply yourself, you might actually get the point you missed in the comparison.
Start now...
THE DEATH OF JESSE HELMS IS A DEFINING MOMENT.
Too many have died because of his aggressive efforts to fight those working to keep alive those infected with HIV and AIDS.
Jesse Helms could have made a difference. Instead, he used his power as a United States Senator to advocate for positions which caused people to die. These past 48 hours we have seen hate used on this forum from people who appear unable to understand what Helms both did and stood for. Rather, we see pathetic and petty comments emerging from behind anonymous internet generated facades.
Now is the time to hear real stories from real people who have knowledge of how Jesse Helms actions caused death.
And, as a point, contrary to what is stated here several times:
PEOPLE WITH AIDS ARE NOT VICTIMS.
Few people in history have stood more courageously and acted more forcefully than those infected in the United States with HIV and AIDS.
Now is not the time and this is not the place for a pissing match. Now is the time to find comfort hearing from those who were part of the battle against Jesse Helms.
Jesse Helms, Jerry Falwell and Ronald Reagan are gone. History must not carry only the viewpoint of those who think they were wonderful human beings.
For those who care, now is the time to hear your story. To those who do, many will join me in saying Thank You.
Allen White
San Francisco, California
.
McQ, Blah, blah blah...two posts chock-full of rank drivel.
You are a verbose collectivist, anti-capitalist, stuck in your own victimization little homo (your description) aren't you?
I am perfectly fine with free speech. The perpetual mewling left-gay movement are the ones who shout down speakers they do not agree with all across America. You may share a gender identity, or sexuality with me, but you obviously do not speak for me. What arrogant hubris.
Just because people may share an L/G/B/T gender identity and/or sexual drive does not necessarily make them prone to collectivist politics. There are millions of us who are actually embarrassed by all the anti-Americanism, pro-confiscatory taxation, pro-victimization bullshit that you seem to embody.
I've personally found that the L/G/B/T's who eschew the leftist political part of "the movement" are usually better educated, more financially successful, less bitter...and they are almost universally better able to protect themselves!!!
You do not have to be an obligate gay victim intellectually or physically. Follow the lead of Jews for the Preservation of Firearms Ownership (jpfo.org).
Possibly, if you are less fearful...your reasoning power may expand.
Who said I speak for you, Tori? I couldn't begin to fathom your reptilian mind.
You and I definitely agree on one thing though: firearms must be obtainable by the general population.
The more I tangle with people like you and observe your reactions to anyone who disagrees, the more I appreciate knowing that I can obtain a firearm if need be.
McQ, That is precisely what is so great about America...even collectivist assholes (like yourself) can exercise their 1st and 2nd amendment rights.
Is this a great, free country, or what?
BTW, I am a physician who has compassionately treated many HIV infected individuals. I have thoroughly enjoyed tweaking you and others on this blog (despite the verbal abuse I've incurred). I subsequently completed residency training in psychiatry several years ago...which makes this all the more amusing.
Make no mistake, approximately 80 percent of what I have written are my personal, fervently held, core beliefs.
Hopefully, L/G/B/T's will reject the seductive notion of being "cared for" by some poll-i-tician. Cradle to grave control by "Big Brother" is never the answer. Our capitalist society with all its faults is still the greatest beacon of hope and compassion in the entire world. Please celebrate all your individual rights...and don't listen to the leftists who would actually see you enslaved or victimized.
All this has been amusing, but I have other things to do and see no reason to continue this blog.
"collectivist assholes"?? Still continuing that respectful debate, huh?
So, you're a physician and with a subpractice in psychiatry with lots of compassion for HIV-infected individuals.
That's great! I'm a runway model and in my spare time, I'm trying to create a way to harness nuclear fusion to solve our energy problems...when I'm not working for Habitat for Humanity helping undeserving working people get a roof over their heads.
Yeah, me and my wife...Morgan Fairchild...
Commenting by HaloScan
