Incredible, simply incredible.


Watching it live on EWTN - speaking in my capacity as a Cathedral organist, this is truly magnificent! Pope Benedict humbles me.


Gravatar Wow.

I had to be at work during this, but I was able to get it on web streaming off the USCCB website and follow along in my copy of Christin Prayer.

At times I felt close to tears at the experience of praying with the Church, word by word with our Holy Father.

Thanks for posting the pictures!


Gravatar He humbles all of us, Mick. Lets hope he humbles a few of the assembled Bishops while he's at it.

Regarding the incensasation of the altar, IMHO, this pope doesn't make idle liturgical gestures. I'm sure this issue was one of the "talking points" of his meeting with the Bishops, and he's illustrating if for them in person. They must begin the re-approach to "ad Orientem" liturgy. It's just a shame that this service didn't occur in the main church. Still, the fact that it has been televised makes up for it by bring before millions an office (new rite OR old), which inhabits something of a black hole in the conciousness of most American Catholics, Vespers. Deo Gratias!!

Roll on, BXVI!


Gravatar I have some questions that I hope someone can answer.

1. When the pope entered the crpt for holy vespers, was it protocal for the bishops etal...to clap, or should they have been genuflecting as he passed?

2. Why did the choir do all the work? Not once did they rise when the Gloria was sung and bow. Is this correct?

How is vespers supposed to be done? Is this normal?

bjr


Gravatar B. Rickman -

1. There is no official rubric for the gesture of the people as the Pope passes.

2. During the Gloria Patri, we bow seated. There is no protocol that we stand and rise.


Gravatar I have updated my explanation of the Pope's liturgical actions at the magnificant.

They seem quite clearly tied to the direction the corpus was facing on the cross, and this is relevant to what the Pope has been teaching.


Gravatar i love this pope. i pray that he lives until he's 100...even longer God willing.


Gravatar They did bow at the Gloria Patri.


Gravatar The celebration of Vespers has been splendid, and the address to the bishops very powerful. A great beginning of this Apostolic Visit.

Regarding the stole: This is only the second white Easter stole we see the pope wearing, and it bears the coat of arms of Leo XIII.


Gravatar it's funny that his holiness reminded the bishop that not only did the children of the diocesan schools learn to sing to him in german this morning, they also sang in latin.


Gravatar Absolutely beautiful.

My only comment is- who set up the altar in such an ignorant way?

You either have it at the nave edge with the corpus facing the apse, or at the apse edge with the corpus facing the nave.

This seems to have been a amateur mistake or done by someone afraid of really making a statement.


Gravatar The Latin quip was awesome from the Pope. As was the whole discourse really - the formation of a Catholic identity et al.


Gravatar No one has mentioned the music which is the best I have heard for any papal visit. I couldn't believe my hears before the vespers the choir sang John Taverner's setting of a responsory for Easter matins. Although I am a traditionalist, this occasion was no cause for shame for us still in active communion with the Holy See. The settings of the psalmody and antiphons were all tasteful and easy to follow. Then there was the polyphpny at the end of the Canticle. Can anyone identify what that was? Most impressive is that the trebles did not warble. I must admit I have been doubtful about Mr. Tribes and Jeffrey Tucker's project. But after today, I am less so even if I prefer the older rite, some good might come out of efforts to reform the reform.


Gravatar It was just astounding in every way, amazing.


Gravatar Jacques,

Thanks for your comments. I think they provide a good bridge-building moment as well.

I'd be curious what you see as Jeffrey and my project? I suppose our support of the reform of the reform?

You should know to that there is great support here for that, but there is likewise great support for the usus antiquior. I have an intense love of the ancient Roman liturgical tradition (as well as the Ambrosian, Dominican, etc.)

Really, the NLM doesn't see itself as being "reform of the reform" or being "old rite"; it sees itself as both.


Gravatar I was in the Crypt during the Vespers and it was definitely amazing.

As for clapping, as far as I could tell, a Bishop started it all.

The choir was the best I had heard them in a long time.

Lastly, Msgr. Marini had the opportunity to change the cross and he didn't move it, so I think that it couldn't have been too much of a mistake.


Gravatar Or even a mistake at all.


Gravatar That arrangement is one variant I have seen, but I think its pertinent that this was for vespers. I expect you'll sse the cross facing the other way for the Masses.


Gravatar Where can the video be found?


Gravatar You'll notice that the deacons' dalmatics match the chasuble the Holy Father wore at his inaugural Mass. Msgr. Rossi of the Shrine had a set of these vestments commissioned for the Shrine.

The cope is beautiful. There are some clearer photos on the Yahoo papal photos stream. For example, this one:
http://d.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ ..._us_dcsa106.jpg

I had to go someplace just as the Taverner piece was coming to an end, before the Holy Father entered the crypt, so I missed everything. What I did see was exceedingly beautiful. And it was moving to see the Holy Father praying in front of the Blessed Sacrament and mouthing a prayer to Our Lady in front of the Oratory of Altotting in the upper church.

It would be great if there were a transcript of the Holy Father's address online that includes his extemporaneous remarks on German/Latin, etc.

Right now Hillary and Obama are on TV. Bleh. The pope is much more interesting!


Gravatar Another good photo:
http://d.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ ...r3413068045.jpg


Gravatar The vestments the Pope wore were outstanding. Does anybody know who the other M.C. (not Msgr. Marini) is? I suspect he is an American.


Gravatar He is an American priest from the Diocese of Bridgeport who came as part of the Papal Entourage from Rome. In Rome he also acts as an assistant MC.


Gravatar Msgr. William Millea. He works in the Holy See's Secretariat of State.


Gravatar The psalm-tones for the first two psalms were from Saint Meinrad's Archabbey and were composed, I think, by Dom Columba (Kelly?).

There are eight, corresponding to the eight Gregorian modes, and we used them in the monastery I used to be in, wedded to antiphons by Father Chrysogonus Waddell, O.C.S.O. of Gethsemani Abbey in Kentucky. This combination permitted us to maintain an Office that was very chant-like, though in English, and not all "modern" (i.e. avoiding the extremes of folksy and bombastic).

Each tone is basically in four phrases, corresponding to the four lines of the standard Grail psalm translation, with two additional phrases for Grail psalm verses that go to six lines.

Perhaps I am prejudiced because we used them every day for every Office, but I thought that of all the psalm tones composed for English psalmody that I have ever heard, these were the most authentically "modal" and closest to the Gregorian tradition. Moreover, they were simple to sing, simple to "point" the text for, and - as chant musicians will understand - were "self-effacing" - they served the sacred text which they accompanied rather than call attention to themselves.


Gravatar Gavin,

According to the EWTN program schedule, there will be an encore presentation of the vespers in 30 minutes. I hope that's correct, because I missed the original broadcast.


Gravatar The second psalm was set to a setting by Fr Laurence Bevenot, not a Meinrad tone.


Gravatar Peregrinus,

This is not a direct criticism of the Meinrad tones, which are, indeed, very good, but I do wish someone would produce a set of modal tones, for use with English Psalms, that had two lines each.

The British (and Latin) Breviaries both have the asterisk so that the strophes can be broken up for two line singing. One of the grave defects of the American Breviary is that it does not do this. Indeed the strophes of the Grail in that version vary from 7 lines to 1 line. Impossible to sing consistantly. So most houses I know have produced their own typed up Psalters with standard length strophes of 2 or 4 lines.

The reason I prefer the two line tones is not mere nostalgia. There is a certain rhythmic breathing that the proper singing of the psalms induces. It produces a particular passive, contemplative state in the singer. The execution of a 4 or 6 line tone, prevents this measured breathing because the singers have to take too many breaths. Often with varying or weird spacing.

The Cistercian antiphons that you mention, however, are very, very good. I wish the American Dominicans would adopt them. We are still generally stuck recto toning the antiphons or just having the cantor sing them to the psalm tone. And this after 40 years of vernacular Office!


Gravatar That is an interesting mitre with what looks like a nice embroidery, Shawn; is a close-up possible?


Gravatar Fr. Thompson: this mitre was worn by the Holy Father most recently at the Easter Vigil:
http://thenewliturgicalmovement....om- vatican.html

Also, if I am not mistaken, the white Easter stole that he wore during the address to the bishops is the same stole that he wore at the recent celebration of the Community of St. Egidio:
http://thenewliturgicalmovement....gy-of- word.html

More great photos:
http://d.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/...ult- 320x512.jpg
http://d.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ ...r1549028175.jpg
http://d.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ ...us_pope_usa.jpg

Off to the papal Mass!


Gravatar Transitional Deacon,

as I pointed out in a comment above, this was a different papal stole. I will include this in my next post.


Gravatar I wasn't able to watch the Vespers celebration. Just a tiny, trivial question: how long did this Vespers last? Somebody told me it was nearly an hour.


Gravatar Very classy, and very un-Piero Marini in style. Now who said things are not getting better liturgically? Tom


Gravatar Musty old copes and turning backwards is better? You folks are NOT in a majority in the church in the US!


Gravatar Neither are you, non-traditionalist.
So, why don't we stop excommunicating each other, right?


Gravatar The copes look pretty clean to me. Are we turning backwards or turning towards the Lord?

No offense, non-traditionalist, just a question. Hey, we're all in this together! A person could do worse!

God love you!


Gravatar I apologize for the comment I made earlier. I meant no offense, and it was very out of line for me. Please pardon me, Shawn and non-traditionalist. Definitely, I should have thought better. I am sorry.


Gravatar As far as dust, that cope was perfectly clean...the nuns did a wonderful job preparing.

It was amazing to touch the cope (eh, don't tell anyone) and to see our continuity with the past. That cope is from the beginning of the basilica and shows how wonderful the Catholic Tradition really is.


The Vespers were a little less than an hour.


As for pictures, some of the servers had their cameras and I think I can beg for their pictures for you guys.


Gravatar Non-traditionalist,

You are demonstrating a number of the problems created by the hermeneutic of rupture.

Why, for example, would you characterize a beautiful cope as "musty". Simply because it is older? Does old equate to bad? That is a problematic way of thinking.

Second, the idea of "turning backward" is clearly out of line with Catholic liturgical history, theology and so forth, and also does a disservice to the Eastern Churches who have almost universally retain this.

Finally, numbers are ultimately inconsequent because ultimately these matters are not subject to democracy.


Gravatar Does anyone know if the music for vespers is going to be published! Never heard anything like it! BEAUTIFUL


Gravatar Jacques deV,

The polyphony at the end of the Gospel Canticle was Tomas Luis de Victoria. I'm not sure, however, which composition of his it was taken from.


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