Unfortunately I had to be out of town for the Triduum, otherwise, I would have been at this wonderful Church which has helped re-invigorate my waning faith beaten down, but not extirpated, by 40 years of liturgical drivel. Father Phillip at St. John's is a true visionary. Even though I prefer the Latin, even the Novus Ordo in English at St. John's is splendid, reverant, and holy. Tom
Does anyone have pictures for their Palm Sunday procession? That was my first procession and it was amazing.
These photos of the vestments, and altar....WOW, WOW, and again WOW!
bjr
How wonderful. So what prevents the missa ordinaria from being celebrated with such reverence and splendour in the great majority of parishes?
Martial,
Will to do so.
There are many problematic views and liturgical principles that we are in need of correcting.
Looks like they are on the right track - beautiful setting and presumably well executed. But is that GLASS I see on top of the altar?
HORRORS OF HORRORS!!!!!!!!!!!
They have a GLASS TOP on the altar!
ON THE ALTAR!!!!!
Gads!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Stunning sights indeed, can you imagine this to be the norm "again" in all of our churches? Dominus Vobiscum
J Basil Damukaitis, that is quite disturbing indeed.
I know this isn't exactly on topic (my apologies). But did anyone notice the new "Benedictine arrangement" used in EWTNs Easter Mass?
Yeah, that glass does look weird! I wonder why it's there.
Very nice white chasuble with black orpherys
That glass is odd. What's that all about? Everything else seems to be so in keeping with tradition.
The glass has been placed over the right end of the mensa to prevent wine stains on the altar cloths. This is location on the altar where the wine is poured from the cruets into the chalice. There is great potential for spotting or spillage here.
Makes perfect sense to me; sometimes we have to take little precautions, though I am sure Dom Roulin would have a hissy fit. But then I'm not Dom Roulin.
I don't mean to be unduly picky, but those folks are very pristine about liturgy (much to their credit), and I just found it extremely odd that they would allow such a thing on the altar.
Without drawing ire from the crowd, I would like to recommend people DON'T do this. I understand wine stains and ash from candle wicks etc, but please note that it is a labor of love. I was our community's sacristan for several years, as well as teaching in the school,doing graduate work, etc..., and never had a problem keeping the altar cloths pristine and starched.
I don't consider this a minor point, and therefore a minor inconvenience. The symbolism of an altar vested is highly significant, since it is the second (of four) symbols of Christ himself. It would be like wearing a lobster bib over the chasuble so the precious blood doesn't spill.
I don't want to cause a major kerfuffle over this, but I think it is worth noting and in no way diminishes the great work the canons do in reviving a liturgical wasteland known as Chicago.
Man, we've sure come a long way when we can get exorcised over glass on the altar - oh, the horror, oh the humanity! This ranks right up there with Cardinal "Burlap" Mahony and his glass chalices and dancing girls. Fie! Tom
I agree with J Basil Damukaitis regarding both the admirable work of the canons and the unfortunateness of this glass covering. In addition to its detraction from the symbolic value of the altar cloth and its general indecorousness, it also defies part of the practical purpose of the (threefold, in the older usage) altar cloth. Because the Precious Blood cannot only be spilled in the middle but also on the epistel side at the purification/ablution. In this event the altar cloth is there to absorb the Precious Blood, so that it may then be reverently washed and the water poured into the sacrarium.
They have a GLASS TOP on the altar!
I find it quite common in Byzantine churches, both Catholic and Orthodox. In the US at least (I have no data from the old countries).
Tom (TJM), as much as I generally appreciate your comments, the above towards J Basil Damukaitis is unfair. He expressly said he did not intend to "cause a major kerfuffle", and he went out of his way to (justly) praise the work of the canons. If we cannot criticise a particular practice even with such a preface, we must desist from commenting at all. To bring up and discuss points like this is, at least IMHO, one of the purposes of these comment boxes.
Sounds like a bunch of old women gossiping about the neighbors...chancel prancing lately?
We've had this discussion before. I agree to not being partial to glass or plexiglass upon an altar, just like I am not partial to fake oil candles as compared to real ones -- though there can be reasons why compromises have to be made a times.
At any rate, let's refocus here. There is far more to praise than to critique and the critique has now been noted by those who wished to make it.
I have the impression that glass and other materials used to protect the altar cloth were fairly widespread.
However, as Gregor points out, this defeats the purpose of the altar cloth.
For one, if the wine (or Precious Blood) spills on the glass, it might just run off onto the floor. At least the (linen, not polyester) altar cloth would absorb it and prevent it from becoming an even greater catastrophe.
Second, it is my understanding that in the old Rite an altar was required to have a wax-coated cloth underneath the fair linen so as to avoid the wine or Precious Blood from absorbing into the marble or other porous material of the altar.
So the glass in this case becomes something of a duplication, the sole purpose of which is to avoid having to clean the fair linen. But the sacristans already have to clean the wine and/or Precious Blood stains out of the purificators, and good sacristans can do this with a fair amount of ease. So it is not a whole lot more work to have to do the same with the fair linens, which should be changed with some regularlity anyway, and will require regular cleaning anyhow.
(I might add that I can certainly sympathize with the practice of using the glass -- it has been my experience that despite my best efforts, wine often splashes/splatters during the pouring at the preparation of the chalice.)
Gregor, I was using hyperbole and sarcasm to make a point. What bothers me is the lack of proportionality we sometimes encounter in some of the comments expressed here. On a scale of 1 to 10 (10 being liturgical perfection), I'd much rather have St. John Cantius in the 8/9 range rather than the 1 range, the Roger Mahony end of the spectrum. I'm not going to quibble if they're not always a 10. If I caused offense, I regret that. Tom
Glass altar top or no, this Mass is certainly more reverent than the Mass I attended for Easter.
We had a very poorly trained children's choir that bellowed, then whispered, then bellowed again, followed by just giving up on the songs altogether for what must have been a fifteen minute cantata prior to Mass.
The kids were seated, as our choir usually is, directly behind the priest, who himself is seated directly behind the altar table (and it's no more than a simple table), which is very distracting - especially during the consecration.
During Communion, our priest called for additional EMs, then simply walked out of the church during Communion, leaving only the EMs to distribute Communion.
After Mass, I greeted him at the door of the church and asked him if he was feeling any better, thinking that he must have taken ill during communion.
He told me that he was feeling perfectly fine and that he just wanted to allow the lay ministers to take a more active role - as if the presence of 7 EMs on thee altar wasn't enough of an active role in the Mass. Ughhh...
I'm not sure that you can "reform" this monstrosity of a Mass.
It is better to nuke it altogether. Either going back to the 1962 Missal, or start anew from scratch, but the Mass as it is "celebrated" in my parish is so far removed from Catholic teaching as to be little more than a Pentecostal tent revival. It's a disgrace!
AGREED!!!!
Everyone,
My understanding of this eminent blog is that it is a place where very, very intelligent and informed people come together to critique, praise, throw out ideas. What I love about this blog is the "nit-pick"yness of it!
Because what seems like a small issue can may, or may not, have extenuating ramifications. A glass plate will not win anyone's salvation, or damn anyone to hell. But the fun of this site is to throw something out and see what others think, to reveal what was a deeper tradition, or what implications it might have one may not have thought of!
Thank you to those who defended me, and understood my observation in the manner it was intended.
I repeat, to the canons, keep up the great work!! I know many of people who go there and are enriched by it immeasurably, and I am jealous of them, but I still disagree with the glass top on the altar!!!!!!!!!!!
I do enjoy the use of the American word 'critique' for criticize! I used it at a community recreation recently and it elicited expostulations all round.
As for the use of glass on the mensa to protect the altar cloth from being soiled, I have known this practice for many years, long before Vatican II, though not quite so prominently. I would rather that than the offence of stained altar linen.
Fr. Symondson:
You are unpredictable! Yes, Americans I guess find, criticize more offensive than perhaps "critique"!
I must say though, many liturgical abuses existed before the Council but does not make them correct, would you agree?
With today's modern conveniences, and the relatively inexpensive cost of linen and laundering, I would see no reason for glass, and there is no provision for it in the rubrics.
Father, given your previous posts regarding the Oratory of Ss. Augustine & Gregory, one would think you more of a purist on this.
I think that the pictures are lovely and the Canons clearly are doing a wonderful job of fulfilling their mission to 'restore the sacred'.
"Fr. Symondson:
You are unpredictable!"
I have to agree there 
(Please don't by offended, Father, I appreciate you and your comments very much.) Oh, and isn't your spelling "criticiZe" itself an Americanism?
Gregor
According to my Oxford English Dictionary criticize and criticise are co-terminus in English usage.
As for critique, Fowler's Modern English Usage, 1937 ed, says: 'critique is in less common use than it was, &, with review, criticism, & notice, ready at need, there is some hope of its dying out'. Presumably its use in America is an anachronism from the c18?
Mr Damakaitis
Wouldn't you rather a spotless altar cloth than a stained one? I suspect that it is perfectionism and reverence for the Most Holy that prompts the use of a glass panel at St John Cantius!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!(to (to follow your usual punctuation)!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
What a truly wonderful CATHOLIC parish. I would love to live in Chicago for this very reason alone. WHY can't this liturgy be expoerted to very parish in America and beyond?. I would be very curious to know what OTHER Catholic churches in Chicago think of St. John Cantius???
Fr. Symondson:
Ehhh, no, Father, I would not. Not if it meant putting a glass top on an altar as if it were a restaurant. Liturgy is liturgy, sometimes impractical.
I find your sarcasm, which has been prevalent in many of your posts un-necessary and un-Christian. Your attitude which conveys arrogance is off-putting. If you think of yourself as better than everyone else then do so and keep quiet and stay on topic.
Your attitude isn't terribly priestly much less Christian. How tragic.
Mr Damukaitis
Oh dear! I think this represents the chasm between English and American humour. It is irreconcilable.
Surely, when a corporal is used, the pain of glass on the altar at St John Cantius is mitigated, isn't it? True, it is surprising to find one so large.
Handicapped in my response to the glass-top debate by the time-difference between the Americas and Australia, I want to support the responses by J Basil Damukaitis who also recognised the unfortunate use of glass on top of the altar.
The fact that it prevents stains on the altar-cloth is not a sufficient justification. Altar cloths should be washed when dirty. The vessels etc. placed on the altar should be clean underneath so as to leave no marks. The purificator should be properly deployed so as to catch any droplets. If you can justify putting glass over the altar-cloth then you can also justify plastic flowers. If you can justify plastic plowers then you can justify particoured polyester vestments. If you can justify particoloured polyester vestments then you can justify ad libitum "improvements" to the Mass; and if you can justify ad libitum "improvements" to the Mass then you can justify twirling nuns with bowls of incense. Now it seems to me that the Canons are doing good things, and in circumstances so vastly different to mine that I can hardly begin to imagine. But the use of glass on altar-tops is to be vigorously discouraged. There is also something very unpleasant about the clack-clack sound of cruets & things being put down on glass, which can happen in the Ordinary Form when glass is present - I've seen it on credence tables for instance. One final point: from glass, it is but a short step to plastic, and if you ever visit Malta you will see lovely churches with their magnificent altars topped with acres of clear plastic. Not to be encouraged. Christ is risen! Alleluia! Happy Easter to all NLM readers!
What a sadness it is to note that these wonderful photos of St John Cantius church Holy Week and Easter Liturgies descended into a series of gripes and snipes about glass on an altar.
Congratulations to this Parish and to the Society for their beautiful and reverent presentation of the Holy Week Rites in the Ordinary Form. Certainly a great inspiration to any who, like the society, would like to restore the holy in Catholic worship.
When it comes to nit picking over a thing like a glass cover on an altar I wonder who there is in the entire Catholic liturgical world whio has not sinned similarly in some similar way or another at some time or another. Let us affirm what is positive rather than dwell on our mutual shortcomings.
May God bless you, St John Cantius Parish Chicago.
The gripes, unfortunately, have developed from those who persist in deriding, mocking and harassing those who clearly want to make a minor point, without being hung up on it.
It seems that people are more hung up on the fact that there was a small criticizm than those who made the actual criticism.
And sarcasm is polemical and intentionally rude.
Much can be learnt from constructive criticizm. Nothing much, to be honest, can be learnt from fuzzy feel good comments about how 'wonderful the liturgy looks.' I think the fact that it looks awesome is obvious. If that is all we are ever allowed to say I couldn't help be as bored to tears as listening to a priest who said God loves you over and over every Sunday.
Give us something meaty to discuss and talk about I say.
The amount of Gregorian Chant sung during the Triduum at St John Cantius was incredible and the schola of religious brothers and laymen impressed me greatly. Their style of singing is robust and full-throated and full of vigor.
How fitting that Bishop Perry celebrated the Vigil of Vigils, both baptizing and confirming candidates and giving them their 1st Holy Communion.
After all the Masses on Easter the Canons sang solemn Vespers, the chaplet of Divine Mercy and then had solemn Benediction. WOW! I wish my home parish could pull that off. God bless the Canons Regular of St John Cantius. I hope lots of seminarians will go to their training workshop in the Extraordinary Form of the Mass in May (5-19 to 5-23 at Mundelein).
http://sanctamissa.org/en/worksh...shop-
index.html
Did you see they have put out a DVD of the Traditional Latin Mass. http://www.cantius.org/go/websto...latin_mass_dvd/
Traditional Latin Mass DVD
Ordo Missae Privatae in Festo Ssmae. Trinitatis - 1962 Missale Romanum
Canons Regular of St. John Cantius
This is a DVD of the Traditional Latin Mass (Low Mass of Trinity Sunday), as celebrated according to the 1962 Missale Romanum at St. John Cantius Church in Chicago.
Special Features of this DVD:
Video of the Low Mass from the perspective of the Priest
Video of the Low Mass from the perspective of the Altar Boy
Multiple Menu Selection
Slide Show of every ceremony of the Mass
Awesome!
Fr. Symondson:
I would like to shorten that chasm between English and American humor as I've researched you and respect your positions very much. I do appreciate witty and clever humor and apologize if I was caught between a rock and a hard (piece of glass) place. Perhaps now I understand how to appreciate your sense of humor.
Mr. Hill
Thank you for your perspective. I appreciate how you put our desire to praise and criticize constructively! That's the fun and education available on this fine website.
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