mentalblog.com comments:
i post this here for the historic interest, the content appears shallow and disappointing as per my previous post. In fact this would have been an "idiotic" candidate if not for the historical facts.
Introverts do not have "no" friends necessarily, nor do they lack the ability to be nice to people and care about them. Nor is it likely than any particular person is entirely a textbook introvert. This post is interesting, but it shows us nothing about the personality of the Rebbe.
P.S. Id the look at the comments to that post you will see that 770 bocher might have been a prophet or a timing virtuoso.
Eli, are you saying that the Rebbe asked your in-laws to get close to Barry and Mina Gourary?
What P. Avos you are referring to?
TA
I think he is teiching "HaRashus", the "government" as the Rebbe, according to an alternate interpretation. I heard this at a shiur once.
no rebeljew, it's Avos (2:13):
והוי מתחמם כנגד אורן של חכמים, והוי זהיר מגחלתן שמא תיכווה--שנשיכתן נשיכת שועל, ועקיצתן עקיצת עקרב, ולחישתן לחישת שרף, וכל דבריהם כגחלי אש
770
I understood this as meaning that one should learn the derech of the chachamim, according to their derech, IOW warm yourself by the fire that they make, but do not use their logic, reasoning or authority to extend your own derech away from theirs, IOW take the actual embers and make your own fire, because perhaps you will be burned. Interesting that you apply it to this case.
Its very interesting, but sheds little light on the rebbe's personality.
I recall reading in BETH CHAYAYNU magazine describing the dollar distribution, a Jew passed the rebbe for a dollar the rebbe gave him a dollar, the Jew said he was a Schneerson, the rebbe said live up to your great name. PERIOD. No interest in who he was , or how he was related to the rebbe.
I was told that Reb Eliahu Chaim Carlebach (son in law of Rabbi Zalman Schneersohn)said that the rebbe was not a "family man" ie he was not interested in familial matters.
Of course this does not mean he was not close to his niece etc or his brother.
He certainly was not close to Bere Gourary after 1951 or to the Rashag .
There were several years when Mrs. Gourary was "forced "to be in Montclair and Mrs Schneersohn was in Heaven , when the 2 brothers in law celebrated the sedorim alone rather than do it together.When I asked Barry Gourary about this , he replied that besides not being close the 2 brothers in law were totally different personalities who had no affinity for each other.
He also carefully explained his father's supposed "hiskashruth " to his brother in law. A subject I will talk about some other time.
Schneur,
Interesting that you mention a story of a Schneerso/hn passing by dollars. Though I don't know if there is any connection, I do know this:
There is a Schneersohn from Hong Kong who was r'l invloved and planning to marry a european gentile woman.
He was convinced by Chabad al assar to pass by the Rebbe for dollras.
When he passed by, the Rebbe simply looked at him and said "live up to your great name".
several weeks later the man broke his engagement.
this story does not have not a 'happily ever after' ending as sadly this man later married an upstanding Korean citizen.
Hiskashrus or not Rashag let his wife and son leave 770, but he stayed.
I once heard from a chassidshe rov from the old school that the one of the interesting things about chassidshe rebbeim is the visits that they visit each other for simchos or for nichum aveluim and the conversations they have with each other this above rov said that the rebbe in the last thirty years never visited anybody does anybody know why?
Kopuster, the question about why the Rebbe did so or why his Uriah moment has no answers. I attempted to interpret this becase of the extreme introvert character. In addition to the supra natural explanations his introversion is confirmed by his style even before he became a Rebbe.
Just may be if the Rebbe did not give the Schneerson a flippant answer he would not have ended up with a Korean.
Rebbe probably never had person at his table in his house during his entire stay in America. Witness that he even had to outsource the dinner with the only grandchild of his parents to some Manhattan family. If this is not bizarre, what is?
The point is that even though the Rebbe showed interests in some families and events, his style was that of remoteness from his very family and people around him.
When I say he was aloof, I am referring to my own experience. I am referring to how the Rebbe treated many people I saw around me. But we already spoke about this in the Kotzker parsha.
To add to my previous comment in the rebbe Rayatz letters you see that he when he wrote to his Chassidim he used the word ydidy or talmidi in Hebrew which translate (my friend) my talmid which is very common in letters written by all chasdishe rebbes to the best of my knowledge the rebbe never used this word in any letters
Tzemach,
You wrote:
"Witness that he even had to outsource the dinner with the only grandchild of his parents to some Manhattan family."
Dalya did indeed visit/eat at the Rebbe's and Rebbetzen’s home; in fact this was on several occasions. There is even a photo of the Rebbe spoon feeding some cereal to one of Dalya's children.
She also visited the Rebbe again a little while after the Rebbetzen passed away. This was a late night (11pm) visit to the Rebbe at his office in 770.
And of course she and her mother flew in for the Levaya.
MIB
are you sure that her mother flew to the levyao?
So I heard from someone who was with them on the flight from Tel Aviv.
She arrived on Friday and visited with the Rebbe several times.
The arrangements were made by the Rebbe.
Tzemach - you are way out of line with the "outsourcing remark". The professor published her father's/they're grandfather's work! There are photographs with the nephews on the Rebbe's lap.
Your points of the Rebbe's "aloofness" are well taken - although as you well know in Lubavitch circles this is an aspect of "malchus" in a degree unseen by the previous Rebbes. Even the "Farbrengen" was run differently. Very rarely did a chassid talk. Whereas by the Rebbe Rashab and the Frierdike Rebbe Chassidim would interject and ask questions etc.
There was this type of occurance at the Yomtov seudos in the Rayatz's apartment through 1970 but that will be a seperate discussion.
* * * ** ** ** ** * *
BTW Reb Yudel Keller a"h was once the Shabbos guest of the Rebbe.
It is quite common in chassidic courts that only family eats at the Rebbes personal table.
To MIB
On the flight from tel Aviv was Ms Roytman her mother who lived at the time in London I do not think she came but again please check it up
Thanks
Kopuster,
You are probably right, I wasn't on flight from Tel-Aviv.
I recall Regina passed away in 1997 (appr) Did she live in London up until then?
MIB
Thanks she lived in London and was niftar in London and her levayo passed through the Main Lubavich shul in London on the way to Eretz Yisroel where she is buried next to her husband in Tzfas
I heard that she was very upset that the Chassidim made from her husband a big thing for example giving names after him or going to his kever on his yahrzeit
Does anybody know more about this?
Her Yahrtzeit is is 21 Tevet 5797 (last day of 1996). Although she obviously didn't like people "making things (who does? - rhetorical, don't answer)she was honored that people named their children after him.
One of her grandsons is called Ariel - the final three letters (Yud Aleph Lamed)meke the acronym Y israel A rye L eib!
Tzfania,
You seem to have known Mrs. Regina Schneerson (Gurary).
Can you share some more information about her life etc...?
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